Your Work Friends

The Layoff Playbook - Part 2: What to Do (and Not) if Layoffs Happen

December 12, 2023 • Mel Plett & Francesca Ranieri • Season 1 • Episode 5

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Hi Friend!

We’re back, with Part 2 of  The Layoff Playbook. It’s THICK.

What you should do if…
This episode, is packed full of critical insights and practical advice of what you should do if: 

  • You’ve been laid off - and want to come through it as whole as possible
  • You’re leading a team through layoffs - and want to really take care of your team and yourself 
  • You’re a remaining team member - and want to process the change and be a good work friend. 

We’re also back with Roast and Toast where we:

  • Roast: Elon Musk’s handling of Twitter employees in 2022
  • Toast: AirBnB and Hubspot’s humane approach to saying goodbye to teammates.

This is a meaty one. Stay with us, while we empower you with the essential strategies to tackle layoffs.

Show notes references for your viewing pleasure: 


Disclaimer: This podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be considered professional advice. We are not responsible for any losses, damages, or liabilities that may arise from the use of this podcast. The views expressed in this podcast may not be those of the host or the management.

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Mel:

Hey, Francesca, what's that golden rule you?

Francesca :

always tell me Listen, you should always ask, because if you don't ask, the answer's always no. That's right, hey friends, welcome to your work. Friends, I'm Francesca and I'm Mel, and this is part two of Layoffs Mel. What are we talking about in this part two series?

Mel:

Yeah, today it's all about people. So what do you do if you find yourself in this situation? We're going to equip you with some really good resources and you'll find stuff in the show notes to support you. And then what do you do if you're a team leader or a member of the team remaining after a layoff Things that can support you as well. Wow.

Francesca :

Also excited to bring back roast and toast, where we roast some folks that need to roast their handling of layoffs and toasting some folks that really took a human-centered approach to saying goodbye to some of their peers Sound good Mel.

Mel:

Yeah, that sounds great. Let's do this. All right, let's get into it.

Francesca :

What do you do if you are laid off?

Mel:

Yeah. So if you are laid off, I'm going to give folks a headline here. If you remember just one thing take care of yourself, Don't say shit, Don't sign shit. Know what's negotiable and network. And I'm thinking don't say shit, Don't sign shit. Needs to be a mug in my future. Yeah, I'm thinking mugs t-shirts, bumper stickers tote bag.

Francesca :

Toe bag, that's just always good advice as a former paralegal.

Mel:

But okay. So, first and foremost, take care of yourself If you have been laid off. Number one take care of yourself. Being laid off is traumatic I don't think we talk about this enough, but it's traumatic and acknowledge that. It's okay to acknowledge that you have experienced a psychological injury here and need to heal from it. So do what you need to do, rest, grieve. It is a roller coaster of emotions that someone will go through and, depending on their personal circumstances and what this means for them, it will vary. It will run the gamut of what they're going through, and so take care of yourself. You've got to put on that oxygen mask and do whatever you need to do to take care of yourself.

Mel:

Number two don't say shit, and what I mean by that is these meetings are not long usually five to 15 minutes and I can assure you, although it might not feel that way, hr is there to help you in the room. The leader that has to deliver that message does wanna help you through this transition in the best way possible. They hate that. They have to deliver that message too. And look, emotions are running high. You might wanna give everyone the middle finger when you're in that conversation, just to be honest, but don't Don't.

Mel:

It will get really awkward if that HR rep is the person you need to continue to communicate with over the next few weeks around things with your severance package and they really do wanna help. So it can be hard to see that in the moment. I get it, but you don't wanna say something that you'll regret later. Know that the folks in the room are really there to help you through this transition. The third thing don't sign shit. If you can. If you can and it's not always possible so if you can speak to a lawyer and have them review anything that you're being asked to sign before you sign it, a lot of the times you might get either a non-disclosure agreement or a non-compete or things of this nature in order to In non-disparement, or yeah.

Mel:

Yeah, all of these things in order to get your severance, and state by state may vary as well in whether that's even required to sign before you get your severance. So know your rights in your state. You might wanna consult with an employment lawyer. You could also reach out to the Bar Association. Sometimes they have pro bono workers who will consult with you on these things. But you'll want someone to review it for you with a really fine eye for detail and what's outlined there so that you can ask the questions that you have around what's in there, what are you're signing, what that means for you, et cetera. So don't feel pressure. I've seen TikTok stories where people are saying they're getting pressured to sign something. Don't.

Francesca :

You should have like 21 days, right, you should have. Like you should have yeah, there's Legally.

Mel:

Yeah, legally, there's usually a good amount of time for you. You know you need to be able to review what you're given, so don't buy into that. If someone's pressuring you to sign something within 24 hours, take your time, take the time you need, all right. Number four negotiate. Everything is negotiable, everything.

Francesca :

Yeah, absolutely.

Mel:

Just putting it out there. The worst thing that anyone can say is no, but if you don't ask, it's always going to be a no. So ask. It's okay if they say no, but ask If you have financial circumstances that require more severance, ask your HR rep. If you have medical needs that require additional medical coverage, talk to them about it. Do you need resume writing support? A coach? Ask your HR rep. Bottom line everything is on the table here. Talk to your HR rep about it. They're there to work with you on it. Francesca, what do you think about that?

Francesca :

Yeah, I've seen everything. I mean, I literally have seen everything get negotiated and sometimes we can do it, sometimes we can't, right, but for the most part I've seen I need two more weeks of severance, I need my Cobra extended, you know, ask for it. They're negotiable and at Tamelle's point the worst thing they can say is no. But that's one of the reasons why you don't want to chew out your HR representative, right, because they're the person that you need to ask that to right. They're going to be your conduit for these negotiations. So it's one of the reasons why we're trying to protect you from yourself, because you might need to go back. You might want to go back and ask If you're totally cool with whatever they're giving you great, amazing, lovely but if you're not, ask.

Mel:

Yep, yep, ask away. Those are my main points for the headline I gave, but I do have a couple of other things I want to talk about Immediately. File for unemployment.

Francesca :

Absolutely, it might not be day one.

Mel:

But states are slow guys. People are often surprised at how long it can take for unemployment to actually kick in. If you, especially if you didn't get a generous severance, as you mentioned like some organizations might not be able to offer something that's super generous and you have limited savings, this can add to your anxiety and stress. So day two, day three, but I would say within the first week of being let go, file for unemployment number one action, can I just?

Francesca :

I just want to really chime in here with Mel because, quite honestly, please don't have, don't get up in your feelings about filing for unemployment. That is your money, that you've paid for it.

Mel:

Yeah, get it absolutely, get it 100%, get that unemployment. And then I want to leave folks and I'm going to throw this in the show notes a resource link. So bookmark this for the future and I'm sure you could do your own Google searches. But we're going to throw out a quick link of questions that you should ask. Whether it's you know, sometimes you get a meeting invite and you know what's coming, especially if an organization's been transparent about what's happening, and sometimes you don't have any clue and you might need to think about what you want to ask and follow up, and that's fine. But here are the questions that you should be asking.

Mel:

If you're laid off, you want to ask one when is your official last day? When you're going to receive your last paycheck? Fyi, some states require that you're paid on your actual last day, not two weeks later yeah, california, we love you Not two weeks later. You want to ask if you're going to get paid for any of your unused vacation time, pto, sick days, things like that. If it's close to bonus time, mid-year year end you're going to want to ask if they're, are they going to honor that Bonus? If you're two weeks out, will they honor it?

Mel:

What's included in your full severance. Get that in writing, the outline of everything that's included, how long you're going to receive your health care, what your 401k options are, if you've been contributing to a 401k and if you will be considered eligible for rehire at a later date. This is important because if you're interviewing for a new company and they do background checks or someone is checking for references, they can ask if you're eligible for rehire and legally they can say no if that's noted. You do want to make sure yes, you are eligible for rehire, so that's not a ding on your employment record. And also, lastly, if it's okay, if they'd be willing to be a reference for future employment opportunities. All good things. Any other questions? You can answer that list.

Francesca :

Just who your main contact will be, that you need to communicate with right. Ideally, get the name of a person in HR that will be to my Chicago accent in HR. Get the name of your contact in HR that you will be connecting with to ask these great questions or any other questions you might have. Get a name.

Mel:

Yeah, get that name. These are all good things for people who are laid off, but they're not the only ones who are impacted by this. So what if someone's a team leader? What if they're still on the team after this happens?

Francesca :

Francesca, what would you like to add. Yeah, if you're leading a team through a layoff, let me tell you I've been in this role many times. It's awful, it really is. It's awful for the person being laid off, it's awful for the team, it's awful for the leader, right? Yes, we will all be absolutely professional about this. It's still somewhat awful, quite honestly. However, as a team leader, you're there to lead your team through this and I think taking this kind of mindset of ownership around, owning that relationship from start to when we say goodbye, is really key. What do I mean by that? One is if you're a team leader with your HR representative, ideally you should be the one having these discussions around laying people off. Okay, giving people the dignity of that and taking them through. That, I think, is a really big deal and something that you should be doing.

Mel:

Absolutely.

Francesca :

You know, like I just think that's yours, that's your relationship to own full stop.

Mel:

Yeah, I mean, being a people leader is a privilege, so treating people with dignity and respect is showing up in this moment, when they're in their most vulnerable moment.

Francesca :

Yeah, absolutely, absolutely right. I think it's also showing up for the team that remains in this moment as well. So, pulling your team together immediately after this has stopped and letting them know what's happened, who we've had to say goodbye to and what the next few weeks will look like, okay, so, in order to get through this as a collective team, that is big. Recognizing that this happened, recognizing and giving people permission to feel their feelings, I think is a very, very big deal. And being able to share with people what they can expect from you as a leader, from your leadership team as well, in order to navigate this together as big. Can I say more? Yeah, I see a lot of.

Francesca :

This is where I see a lot of team leaders falling down because they're relying on the organizational messaging to set all of these, to set the kind of continuation of business as usual, and if you, as a team leader, don't say anything, it's going to feel very unpersonal and very inhumane to your team. Yep, they will make up their own stories and, quite honestly, it's going to be a hit on how they trust you as a leader and you don't want that right. You don't want that. I think a lot of people assuming positive intent, want to do the right thing here as a leader. The right thing here is to get in the conversation is to hit it face on. The wrong thing is to not say shit.

Mel:

Yeah, and I would also tack on to that it's not just one conversation when it happens, but a continuing conversation for however long your team needs to have that conversation. Yes, 1,000%.

Francesca :

Last thing on, if you're a team leader, similarly, put your oxygen mask on. This is tough. It will be tough. It will be tough. Most likely, you have known about this for some time. You've had to make some very tough decisions. You're going to have to shackle tin your team through this, not only through today, but for the next, quite honestly, few months probably.

Francesca :

Put your oxygen mask on. Take care of yourself, because you're the one that's going to need to be the rock through this thing. So take care of yourself. It's not easy. We can put on our professional pants and say, oh, we're just going to get back to business as normal, but this is rough and if you have feelings about it, that's natural. Take care of yourself, yeah, yeah. And if we're somebody that's remaining on the team, I think this is a role we don't talk about a lot, but it can be pretty traumatic if you're left on the team and some of your most beloved people that you've worked with are no longer with us. And I think the thing here for me is to check in with your fellow teammates to see how they're doing to also take care of yourself as well.

Francesca :

And the last thing that I think we don't talk about a lot is just because someone's not with an organization anymore doesn't mean that that relationship needs to end. And I can tell you week three or four of being laid off it didn't get real lonely. Yeah, you know, if you feel inclined and I hope you do continue that relationship reach out to people, check in on them, say, hey, ask them what they need if it moves you. Just because they're no longer with the organization doesn't mean, a their relationship needs to end or, b that they're off limits. They are not.

Mel:

They're not. No, yeah, they're your work, friends.

Francesca :

They're your work, friends.

Mel:

You know how would you help out a regular friend in your life? They're your work friend, right? So reach out, see how they're doing, check in on them. I don't know. Help them network. If you know where there are opportunities, do what you can. Leverage your network. Absolutely, help them out, absolutely, absolutely. There are folks who have really biffed this. I'm going to use your terminology. Yeah, I love that. Yeah, they've really biffed it.

Mel:

They've really biffed it and those who have hit it out of the park, and in really great ways, and are setting new gold standards for how this is done and I hope to continue to see this trend. So, moving on to our segment of roast in toast, who are we roasting today?

Francesca :

Francesca, we are roasting Elon Musk today his handling of when he acquired Twitter. So in 2022, elon Musk fired roughly one half of Twitter's workforce. And listen, I'm not going to go off on Elon Musk at this point, but I will go off on Elon Musk about how this was done, because the roast is really on how employees were treated at Twitter during this 2022 firing, because it was sloppy and it was shitty.

Mel:

So there's like that one photo that made its rounds all over. Well, wasn't there a tweet that was like farewell everyone, or something like that from the Twitter account? And then there was one photo in particular that really stood out to me during this time, where it was Elon making this big announcement about it and just their leadership team staring at him with daggers in their eyes. So just bad, bad stuff.

Francesca :

Yeah, you knew this was going to get the Elon Musk treatment when he was walking into headquarters with a sink. It's just again sloppy and shitty. So let's talk about the sloppiness of this. First off, most people who were laid off were notified via email. There were absolutely no in-person announcements in one-on-one meetings about this. It was via email. Some people actually found out even worse because they were locked out of their laptops, so they didn't even get the email. They were locked out of their laptops messaging apps, so just impersonal sloppy got even more sloppy because some of those people that they laid off were asked to come back. But could you imagine that you got laid off in the most impersonal way and then you like?

Mel:

oh yeah, I might say in this department maybe that deserves a little finger if you're asked to come back.

Francesca :

Yeah, yeah, I think that is kind of contributing to the sloppy nature of this is that they were told that allegedly allegedly told that they were going to get three months of severance, and my understanding, based on reporting, was that they not only had to wait for their severance and for talking about months here, but when they did receive it, they only got a month. So sloppy, right, sloppy in terms of just even how it's handled, to even the operationalizing of a layoff. It was just beyond sloppy. The other thing I want to make mention is the kind of the shittiness of this, because you have Elon Musk out there having all of these social posts that were honestly, almost making fun of employees as he's taking out a hard work for us. It's gross, so gross. Folks like Vice reporting on the fact that he even even in one of his former heads of Twitter's trust and safety team accusing him of being a pedophile, which was absolutely not the case, and, yeah, like why are you doing?

Francesca :

dude, yeah, why, why, yeah? So just the absolute abomination to me of how you handle laying off a ginormous part of your workforce, let alone one part of your workforce. But I'm hosting you today, elon Musk, for your sloppy and your shitty handling of the layoffs of Twitter.

Mel:

I have two toasts, but they piggyback off of each other, so one I'm going to talk. It happened a few years ago, but it really kind of set the tone for how things have improved in this space. Airbnb, back in 2020, had to lay off 25% of their workforce, which that's huge, but at the time, the CEO there did three things really really well. One provided transparency and honesty. They sent a very heartfelt letter to the entire organization letting them know about what was going to happen, when it was going to happen and why. They provided severance packages and out-placement services to all of those impacted, and they did face-to-face, one-on-one communication with each person that was impacted. So, again in 2020, this was seen as the gold standard, and we continue to see others follow suit when they're faced with this.

Mel:

And that leads me to HubSpot, which, in January of this year 2023, they had to lay off 7% of their workforce, and they also provided transparent communications to the full workforce, including the principles that they were adhering to to guide them through the process of their decision-making on who was being selected and why, and all of that. So not just why was this happening, but here's what we're going to do and how we're going to decide who's laid off, who stays all of that. They were very transparent. What they provided was incredible. It's been unheard of and I hope that this continues to be the norm going forward, because they really set a bar here.

Mel:

They paid a five-month severance and an additional week An additional week for every year that you've spent at the company up to a seventh month of total severance package for folks who were impacted by the layoff. That's one. They also paid out management bonuses following their standard bonus structure, so they gave everyone their standard bonus that was impacted. They extended medical benefits for up to five months, including employment assistance program and their modern health program, to all employees to provide them with mental health support and career coaching. They focused on equity HubSpot, accelerated their vesting through April of 2023 and removed the vesting cliff for anyone who had been with the company for under six months.

Francesca :

That's unheard of Unheard, of Unheard of.

Mel:

Unbelievable there's more.

Francesca :

Got to know that there's more, there's more, there's more.

Mel:

They allowed people to keep their laptops and any of the equipment that they got. They provided one-on-one conversations with management and offered help with coaching job search resume building. Unbelievable how you do it.

Mel:

When we say human approach. This is a human approach. Five-month severance and then an extra week for every year Incredible. What we hear in the news consistently is the average American doesn't have $500 in their savings or their one paycheck away from potentially being unhoused. You know, thinking of that would keep me up at night if you were not offering something like this, which helps people keep the lights on Just an incredible package.

Francesca :

Yeah, I mean the thoughtfulness of what do people need? To have cash on hand through the severance, through the vestings, options are huge, even something as Health care nuts, right? I mean, here's my name. It might not seem like a big deal, even keeping your equipment. Go shop for a laptop with 16 gigs of RAM, which is a typical corporate laptop. Yeah, that's $1,500.

Mel:

Right off the bat.

Francesca :

Yeah, right off the bat.

Mel:

Yeah, it's getting that laptop keeping your equipment. It allows you to do other things, yeah, amazing.

Francesca :

This was huge, yeah.

Mel:

So I'm going to use a nice little segue here, because part of the article that I read and we'll link to the article that outlined these use cases for folks to see but what they referenced, funny enough, was that, in contrast to Twitter, twitter's 20. I know, I didn't know you were going to cover Twitter, so I love that there's this connection. Twitter's 2022 revenue was 88.5% bigger than HubSpot. So what they referenced in the article is Twitter had $4.4 billion versus HubSpot's 1.7 billion. Yet HubSpot was the one that gave this package and out-facements services, while Twitter employees, as you mentioned, waited several months to get their severance and then what they received was drastically different from what they were promised. And this is what we mean by oh, that matters, this matters, and people are going to pay attention to that and treating people with dignity and respect, yeah, so HubSpot cheers to you, your BNB Cheers to you for how you handled your layoffs and hopefully, this will continue to be the gold standard we see HubSpot yeah, damn, damn, all right.

Mel:

Well, I don't know about you, but I think I need to go for a walk after this talk, so it's a meaty one. It was a good one. Hopefully, folks got some really good information out of this. Send us a message on Instagram, get in touch with us if you want to share a story or any other tips that we can share out with others. Francesca, how?

Francesca :

about you. Yeah, yeah, I think I might be putting in a bulk order for some don't say shit, don't sign shit heads. So if you want one, let me know. Let me know. Wish nobody would 2024.

Mel:

Anthem yeah, 2020.

Francesca :

Hashtag 2024. Hashtag no Awesome, all right. Well, thanks for joining us. Friends, take good care, hit us up on Instagram and we'll see you next week.