Ali Shapiro [00:00:04]:
Welcome to Insatiable. I am really excited about today's episode because I will be answering your questions directly. But before we dive in, especially if you're a regular Insatiable listener, please consider rating and reviewing the show on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen. My goal is to reach 200 reviews on Apple Podcasts in the US in the next couple of months, but a big shout out to all my listeners around the world. I see you Canada, Australia, UK, South Africa, and Japan to get to 200 reviews. I will need your help. If you're stuck on what to write, you can simply say that what you like about the show or the episode that made you a regular listener, or if you have a favorite guest or episode. A lot of work goes into putting out a podcast, and this is a free way for you to support my show.
Ali Shapiro [00:00:59]:
And all it takes is about 30 seconds of your time. It's really simple too. All you have to do to leave a rating and review on Apple Podcasts is scroll down the Insatiable Show page, select a star rating, and tap write a review. These reviews really do help others find the show, and they mean more to me than you know. I wanted to give a shout out to some recent listener reviews. 1 POV wrote, Complexity Fitness. Ally is that rare person who can not only see and explain the nuances and complexity of big topics, like how we eat and make meaning around food, but she also helps you find ways through that complexity and restores your inner compass. Her work is both wise and practical.
Ali Shapiro [00:01:43]:
Thank you, 1 POV. AJ Bend wrote, I walk away with more knowledge and more choice. When I tune into the Insatiable World podcast, I walk away with a new expanded view of thinking and a reminder about the power of building a relationship with myself and my body and discernment on how to best support myself in my health journey. Quirky Katie G wrote, trust and believe Every time I listen to an episode of Ali's podcast, I feel well informed and better prepared to be an advocate for myself on complex health health topics and issues. In this crazy, polarized world of wellness, I trust Allie because not only does she do the research, she also experiments on herself in many cases. She has her own testimony, and she leaves room for others' varying experiences. Thank you, Ali, for always helping me to gain perspective and insight. I wanted to personally thank these listeners and others who have already taken the time to review the show.
Ali Shapiro [00:02:40]:
I'll be sure to take a look and share some more of the recent reviews and upcoming episodes. Also, one last note before we move on to the meat of today's episode. So many food puns. If you haven't already done. So please follow the show on apple podcasts or Spotify or whatever your favorite podcast app. I see you overcast. We hope to go to weekly episodes in the near future, and this will ensure you never miss a show. Thanks to all of you in advance.
Ali Shapiro [00:03:11]:
So on to today's episode. As I mentioned in the intro to the last episode, I've been getting a lot of questions and comments from listeners to the show since setting up the insatiable hotline. The eighties are back, baby. We've got hotlines. These have come in over voice mail and text messages. Please do keep them coming as I love connecting with you and guiding you along your path. The voice mails are especially great as they allow us to pen potentially replay them on upcoming episodes. With your permission, we'll always reach out.
Ali Shapiro [00:03:43]:
But I also know that some of you may prefer the convenience of sending a text message. So I wanna take a minute now to explain a new feature called fan mail that just rolled out from my podcast host, Buzzsprout, that makes it super easy to text insatiable while retaining your privacy. All you have to do to text in Sageable is click on the send us a text message link in the show notes, and this will automatically open your text messaging app on your phone. Once you do that, you'll see a string of numbers and a message in parentheses that says, do not remove. It's important that you do not remove these numbers as they identify that you are texting the Insatiable podcast specifically. If you remove these numbers, I will not receive your message. Once you've typed out your message, just hit send. What I see on my end is only the last four digits of your phone number and where you are calling from.
Ali Shapiro [00:04:35]:
No other personal information is captured, so please leave your name on your question or comment if you want us to give you a personal shout out in an upcoming episode. One last thing to note is there is no way for me to text you back. This is done by design to protect your privacy. If you are texting the show, the only way for me to acknowledge your message is on a future episode of Insatiable. So be sure to listen as I'm going to be addressing as many of these questions as possible. In today's episode, I'll be addressing 3 of the questions that have come in. There are many more that I'll tackle in future episodes, so stay tuned. On to the first question that came in from Bettina.
Bettina [00:05:16]:
Hi, Ali. Thanks so much for your, yeah, everything you do. It's been really helpful. I was a vegetarian and found out that to balance my blood sugar, I really need to eat meat. But I've been a vegetarian since I was a teenager, and I still have conflicted feelings about eating meat, but I see that I have to eat meat if, I want to turn back my prediabetes, diagnosis. So I started out eating things like deli meat on sandwiches because, you know, I can buy it. I don't have to cook it. It's, you know, kind of removed from meat.
Bettina [00:06:14]:
I guess it really is steak meat, but then I realized how unhealthy the deli meats are. So now I eat, tuna fish. Like, you know, I just pop up when I can and add it to, like, a Greek salad. And so I so the question is, as an ex vegetarian who still have conflicted feelings about meat, What are some easy ways to incorporate more meat in my diet? And I eat a lot of eggs already, probably way too much. Yeah. So any ideas, tips would be helpful. Thanks so much.
Ali Shapiro [00:07:03]:
Okay. First off, Bettina, I'm really proud of you for being open minded about this. I've seen a few people I know refuse to entertain eating meat, and their health has continued to decline. And your conflict, this makes so much sense. In today's world, how we eat has become an identity. So if all of a sudden we lose that identity, there can be a sense of loss, but also that we're doing something wrong. I can totally relate. I remember when I started working with my sleep coach, Kelly Murray, and she had me do some functional testing.
Ali Shapiro [00:07:37]:
When the results came back, it seemed I wasn't gluten sensitive anymore. I might still be because I hadn't eaten gluten in 15 years, but that if I wanted, I can try and see what happened. I remember those first couple of bites in feeling like I was doing something forbidden. I was genuinely scared of what might happen. That fear and doing something bad was based on my identity of being gluten free for 15 years, not necessarily what was true. However, it's important to address this identity piece because it can cause a lot of stress, especially when something more and especially with something more intense than adding gluten back in like Bettina's conflicted feelings about adding animal meat back in. And the more stressed we are in eating, the less effectively we digest. So this identity or emotional piece is really important, especially as you slowly come into this new identity.
Ali Shapiro [00:08:34]:
So Bettina I'd ask, what do you think it means about you to be a vegetarian? And what do you think it means about you to eat meat? Answering these questions for yourself may help to start unpack the meaning you've ascribed to being a vegetarian. A really good book on this topic for people who need to eat meat for their health but struggle with eating meat is The Vegetarian Myth, Food, Justice, and Sustainability by Leah Keith. Leah was a vegan for, I believe, over 20 years. And even as her health declined, she unpacks how her vegan identity kept her from understanding a more true complex reality of how soil regenerates, what's great for the planet, etcetera. There's a lot to this book, and in essence, she beautifully shares that for her, it came down to a deep philosophical truth she had to surrender to, that life takes death to continue on. This is big and can feel heavy. I know. Right? There's so much to there's so much meaning in how we eat.
Ali Shapiro [00:09:43]:
I remember trying to be a vegetarian in college and feeling horribly physically. I had lots of hunger and cravings, but I thought that was normal at the time. Yet, emotionally, I felt like I wasn't contributing to animals dying. I felt like I was more aligned with my values of peace. And then I learned about factory farming and how so many animals were treated in horrific ways that we definitely need to address and change collectively. So I felt like I was making the, quote, right choice, only to find out that what's good for ourselves, the environment, and sustainability is far more complicated. It's that complexity fitness and could be a lot to work through. And yet I would start to unpack this part with what do you think it means about you being a vegetarian and now eating meat and fish.
Ali Shapiro [00:10:30]:
So that's the first step in the emotional or identity piece. And we get into this identity piece of how and what we eat in modules 3 and 4 in my why am I eating this now program, and the live version of this program begins in September, which, believe it or not, will be here before we know it. So if you're interested in that program, you can check out the link in the show notes or email me directly with any questions about the program at ali@alishapiro.com. And that's aliatalishapiro, s h a p I r o, dotcom. Now on a physical level, first off, I'd make sure you're slowly introducing animal protein. If you haven't eaten it for decades, it can take your body a bit to reacclimate. The body loves slow and steady. Okay? Very contrary to how most of us approach nutritional changes.
Ali Shapiro [00:11:27]:
You'll know you need to go slowly if you're having bloating, gas, potentially some reflux, and or constipation. You can add some raw apple cider vinegar before you eat, about one table mixed in water to help support the digestive enzymes needed to break down meat if you're experiencing any of those symptoms. You may also be fine. Everyone's different based on, you know, their overall health of their gut. I love that you're doing tuna fish salad. That's a great gateway as you work through this change. I'd also recommend salmon salad too, and you could do sardine salad or some people really like pan fried sardines. Sardines are an excellent source of protein and very environmentally sustainable because they reproduce so quickly.
Ali Shapiro [00:12:11]:
Cod is also a great protein source and doesn't taste nearly as fishy as salmon, sardines, or tuna. And you can bread cod easily too. We use gluten free panko or cornmeal depending on what's in the house. You can also easily add different spices to the cornmeal to give it a kick or a flavor profile you like more. I like cooking without recipes. So I'll take any gluten free flour we have and coat that with the cod. Then I'll dip each cod piece in an egg white, One egg white total usually lasts for about 4 pieces of cod, and that egg white serves to then serve, as a stickiness for the cod that I bread in panko or cornmeal. And then I air fry it in our air fryer.
Ali Shapiro [00:12:55]:
As far as beyond fish, I recommend sourcing from a regenerative or small farm so you can still feel more in alignment with your values of treating animals well. I know people are vegetarian for many reasons, and one hot one right now is environmentally sustainability. Small farms that raise livestock are actually really critical to environmental sustainability and regeneration. Despite the media's current obsession with veganism, so much of what is being promoted is only half the story on environmentally sustainability. So sourcing from those places can enable you to still live in alignment with that sustainable, environmental, and animal friendly value. And deli meats aren't all bad. I myself sometimes eat turkey deli meat, especially before I go workout in the morning as a snack. But I pick ones that are organic, aren't coated in any industrial oil, or are nitrate free.
Ali Shapiro [00:13:48]:
Applegate is a great brand, and even Costco has organic deets and Watson turkey breast on and off. It's not always there. Sometimes they're out of it. And I looked at the Costco Kirkland brand, and it had some industrial seed oil. I was like, what the fuck? Right? So hard pass for me on that. And I would recommend, you know, stay away from the industrial seed oils. So like most labels, look for less ingredients, the better, and ideally, organic. And probably best to stay away from the pepperoni salamis on an everyday basis.
Ali Shapiro [00:14:19]:
You know? Okay. If you're you're out at a picnic coming up, I would probably have it. Or on the occasional pizza, I would do it. But we all have to figure out what's right for us. If you are postmenopause, you do have to start paying attention to saturated fat as loss of estrogen means fat builds up in our arteries more. So I would start there. And then, of course, after you acclimate to all of that, you could buy meat premade before you're ready to cook it yourself. And you could put chicken and chicken salad like you're doing with tuna salad.
Ali Shapiro [00:14:49]:
It's okay to take it slow. You can also work on increasing your walking and strength training, which will help your prediabetes markers so you don't rush yourself faster than you're ready. And great and getting good sleep is also gonna help your blood sugar. So many other things, levers to pull so that you can go at the pace that works for you. Thanks again for your question, Bettina. I hope that hope get you to your next step, and feel free to reach out reach back out if you need more guidance. Alright. Question number 2.
Ali Shapiro [00:15:23]:
I know quite a few of you regular insatiable listeners are also coaches and other health practitioners, and I've received several variations of the next question over the past couple of weeks. This latest one came in via text from Whitney in Los Angeles. I've checked out your truce coaching certification, which moving forward, I'm just gonna refer to as TCC. And I'm really interested, But there are so many trainings and certification programs out here, especially in the coaching world. What makes your training different? Love this question. But I'm gonna take a step back and give you some things to think about with your career and how to choose a training program because there are a lot out here. I've looked as I wanted to craft mine to fit a niche, fill a niche that wasn't being addressed. So here's some things I think are really important to look for or to think about.
Ali Shapiro [00:16:19]:
First off, where are you in your career and what are you hoping a training program will do for you? It's important to be strategic when you're investing in yourself and your business. For example, many of the people in my training program have coached people at least a little bit and don't feel equipped to go deeper or really address the root issues of why clients struggle with knowing what to do but aren't doing it, whether it's food, exercise, business building, self care. Because the truth coaching TCC is really about stubborn change across the board, whether it's food, money, building a business. So, we have people who aren't just in health and food, take it. I've had clients who are dietitians or health coaches, and they get frustrated or bored that they don't have anything to offer clients when they've had success at first, but inevitably will face a stressful period when they they'll lose all their progress. Or clients who realize they need more skills than what a beginning trade training program will teach them. This is a great time to invest in a certification period because mastery, while it's not talked about, especially in the on line coaching world, is the foundation to a sustainable, fun business. But if you've just taken a coaching program, coach some people first.
Ali Shapiro [00:17:40]:
You will get so much invaluable experience doing this, and then you can bring that to your next training program so you get even more out of it. Even if you have to barter, even if it's with family, I did all of both of those things in the beginning. Just get used to the role of being a coach. Get a feel for your own style and what aspects of coaching are interesting to you. For example, when I started, I found the deep, deep emotional work the most interesting. Recipes at the time, so many people of my peers were creating recipe books and growing their following. And I was like, nah. I would have like, trying to do a cookbook, I would have, like, killed myself.
Ali Shapiro [00:18:19]:
So it's important to follow your curiosities, and you figure that out by actually coaching. 2nd, I think it's really critical that especially if you're working with food or bodies, you have a trauma informed lens. We include that in TCC because as coaches, we aren't trained in coaching someone when they are activated in their trauma, if that ever happens in a session. It's just not responsible to do that. We can refer out, and in TCC, we show you how to identify when someone might be in a traumatized place to refer them out, or if they are in what we call their survival self, which means they aren't in a coachable place. Doesn't mean they're in their trauma, but it means they're not coachable. This protects a client from being traumatized, the survival self. You learn how to bring the survival self back to the healthy adult self, which is coachable.
Ali Shapiro [00:19:11]:
So understanding how to do this to me is great ethics, it's great client care, and ultimately good for business. Being trained to manage trauma requires a lot of education, practice, etcetera. So if you see a training telling you how you can manage trauma, that's a big red flag for me. I see some people out here offering trauma coaching with very little credentials, and it makes me do the emoji with wide eyes. Yes. I think I think in emojis now. What's happening to me? Okay. Lastly, I think if you're working with food in the body or any stubborn change, you need a training that goes beyond traditional coaching.
Ali Shapiro [00:19:52]:
This is a big one. Reframing thoughts will only take you and your clients so far. Most coaching comes from cognitive behavioral therapy or positive psychology. And these are all useful theories and accompanying tools. TCC actually uses positive psychology, but it's one part of a bigger change process, not the entire change process. But stubborn change is more emotionally based, and it's about meaning making. It's about addressing people's underlying stories who have a strong need, and these stories create a strong need to address sensations, physiology, and how people make meaning. This is all much more somatic than psychologically driven.
Ali Shapiro [00:20:37]:
In my opinion, you need both. We always not need both. We need to address the physiological and psychology. TCC does both of these, because these two components aren't separate. They're always informing each other. As doctor Robert Keegan, one of the leading developmental psychologists whose work is highly integrated into TCC says, to change, we need to feel our way into new thinking and think our way into new feeling. This means, yes, we need to reflect on our emotions and feelings and see if they're telling us an accurate story of what's happening. But we also need to experiment and figure things out as we go with new experiences that will radically change our thinking.
Ali Shapiro [00:21:22]:
What he's getting at is a head and heart approach. So I'd want to make sure that the coaching program I'm going to study is integrative in that way. Otherwise, you're missing half the story, which means you're missing, really, in my opinion, the transformational results. My TCC program originally was going to launch in July as I've shared on this podcast and with my list. And for a couple of reasons, it will now be launching in April 2025, and they're all good reasons, by the way. But there will be free trainings and a smaller training offer to help you to have the tools of where the coaching industry is headed, which is much more around flexibility, helping people be their own authority, and what we call in developmental psychology, developing complexity fitness in the fall. Because if you haven't noticed, the world is changing at such a fast rate. Trying to stick to a traditional coaching plan just doesn't work for most people.
Ali Shapiro [00:22:15]:
So email me at alie@alishapirodot com. Again, that's ali@a alishapiro.com, and I'll make sure you're notified of when the trainings will be. These trainings also are not disguised as sales calls. Rather, I understand that this is an investment in your career, and I want to ensure it's a good fit for you or not. Okay. The final question. This last question came in from Philly. Oh, I was just there 2 years ago.
Ali Shapiro [00:22:48]:
Philly, I love you. I love you. I love you. We took Esa, and he said he wanted to stay there forever. I know, bud. I know. It's such an amazing place. Okay.
Ali Shapiro [00:22:57]:
Back from my tangent. The last four digits of the phone number are 3932. A name was not provided, but I've been getting similar questions recently. I've seen you've recently done a few episodes on Ozempic and the other peptides in this class of drugs with your Oprah Ozempic and our outrage and Liz Wolf's episode on over the over 40 metabolism. I'm on the fence about taking them. It seems everyone is on them, and yet just because something is popular doesn't mean it's healthy. I'd love to know what I should consider before making a decision. Yes.
Ali Shapiro [00:23:32]:
Popularity does not equal the way. Okay. So first of all, I am not a doctor. You need to work with your doctor if you're gonna move forward. It's irresponsible for me to ever give a specific opinion without knowing anything about you. And in my work, I never tell my clients what to do. I teach them how to think about these things so they can discern what is right for them. Okay.
Ali Shapiro [00:23:59]:
Legal disclaimers aside. First off, no. You aren't alone. I can't tell you how many people have reached out because I'm open minded about these peptides known in the mainstream media as weight loss drugs. And I know so many people on them and yet aren't telling anyone. And I've had former clients contact me about how much they've helped them not just lose weight, but also help their joint pain, allergies, asthma, and irritable bowel syndrome. And I think we'll he be hearing a lot more about peptides as a class of tools in the coming years, not just for weight loss, but also pain management, tissue regeneration, etcetera. I have one client who mainly went on them for hamstring pain and muscles hurting, and she feels like she she's 28 again.
Ali Shapiro [00:24:45]:
This woman is 43. So in terms of going on them, I'm going to give you 3 things to consider in your decision. First of all, realize these drugs aren't the answer, and I have imagine I'm saying the answer in all caps, but they can be a tool. If you haven't noticed, our cultural conversation talks in extremes or binaries. In other words, these drug peptides aren't a magic bullet. They work best when you're doing, quote, all the things as they say. But what we hear instead is from the media who wants your attention or big pharma who wants your money is messaging that makes it feel like it is the answer or the devil. And the whole meaning behind truce with food is to stop battling yourself with first your judgments of yourself about what is good and bad and of others too.
Ali Shapiro [00:25:38]:
Right? Because whatever we're judging about ourselves, we then project that onto other people and to take a time out, hit a truce, a pause, a learned and learn to discern for yourself what it is that works and how you're even defining works. In this case, sure, these peptides can work for weight loss, but sustainable weight loss involves a more nuanced conversation. But what we get instead in the media's headlines like blockbuster drugs or Ozempic, devil, or lifesaving magic. All of this framing builds up the perception that this is the answer instead of a tool and a larger toolkit. And for some people, I'm sure it can be miraculous, and I don't wanna discount that. But most people are going to have to use this as a tool inside a larger approach to health, like doing all the boring things that the media or drug companies can't get your attention or money from. Eating mostly whole foods, not turning to food when you're stressed, movement, sunlight, and sleep. So I think it's just important to right size this choice as, okay, it might give you hope, momentum, health, and weight loss, and you're going to have to pair it with other things to lose the weight and keep it off.
Ali Shapiro [00:26:54]:
Or if you're using it for prediabetes or type 2 diabetes, this alone can't sustain regulated blood sugar levels. Your body needs you to do your part. Second thing to consider is dosing. In general, there's a medicinal understanding that the dose determines the poison. In other words, the same thing that can be helpful when dosed correctly can heal when given in too high a dose can cause harm. Right? Think about this with the antibiotics. You don't wanna take 5 times the antibiotics to that would destroy your gut microbiome when maybe you can use just a dose. Right? Or I know I have a lot of psychiatrists and psychologists, clients.
Ali Shapiro [00:27:37]:
Right? And they will tell you if they can prescribe drugs that antidepressant, you always have to work on the dose. You gotta get the right drug, the right dose, go up or down. Right? That's why they call it a practice. Right? I've heard from integrative or naturopathic doctors that a big reason for side effects and having to stay on these drugs forever is the dosing and that it's way too high for sustainability. Remember, the standard dosing strategy, from what I understand, was really set for a clinical trial to prove they worked in a short period of time. And so at these drugs at the highest doses, it's basically like putting someone on an 800 calorie diet. And this is where you're getting the extreme muscle loss, unpleasant side effects like nausea from plummeting blood sugar. Or remember, your fat stores toxins, so your body needs to have the right nutrition to process these toxins.
Ali Shapiro [00:28:31]:
And if you're not even getting your basic nutrition needs met on 800, even 1200 calories a day, you're gonna have a really hard time. Now most doctors will trial and learn from their patients and potentially change the dosing, especially if a client is getting their medication from a compounding pharmacy where you have more ability to adjust the dose for the person. Right? We talked about this with hormone replacement therapy in Esther Blum's episode. Right? If you go to a compounding pharmacy, you have more flexibility on the dosing, same with these peptides. But to me, it's it seems dosing the drugs and peptides for a smaller caloric deficit seems like a more sustainable strategy. I read in Parent Data, which is a publication started by Emily Oster. She has a doctor doing menopause content, doctor Jillian Godard, that she and she shared. It came up in the, do these peptides work for menopause or, you know, column that she writes about perimenopause and menopause.
Ali Shapiro [00:29:30]:
And she said that she doses for her patients so that they're losing 1 to 2 pounds a week. That seems much more sustainable and healthy than just going up to a dose that may have you not want to eat at all and barely get in the nutrition you need to process your weight loss or be sustainable without these drugs. So really consider doing your research around how to dose, and I would find a doctor or, you know, a nurse practitioner or a physic a physician's assistant, someone who can prescribe these drugs that can also work with you on dosing, for sustainability and just your experience with them and to preserve muscle mass. Because at the end of the day, you gotta preserve the muscle mass. All weight loss will cause some muscle loss, but we want to lose as little as possible. Lastly, you are still going to have to do the inner work around why you turn to food, get in restriction cycles, and or have you your weight tied to your worth. Remember what Liz and I were discussing in episode 271? We talked about these being tools, not a silver bullet. An interesting yet not surprising reality is that many people taking these drugs report they are no longer emotional eating.
Ali Shapiro [00:30:41]:
However, they're now struggling with anxiety and depression. And in some rare cases, having suicidal thoughts, which is really serious. So this is another thing to consider. If you've had struggles with suicide in the past, I probably would not recommend these. Right? I don't recommend at all, but I would give it a really, really, really, really, really hard look. When you stop emotionally eating, you have to deal with all the reasons you turn to food. It is not just your weight that is causing all your difficult emotions. I promise.
Ali Shapiro [00:31:13]:
I don't think I would have believed that when I was 23 years old, but most of you listening are at midlife and have more wisdom. It's not just our weight that causes us to turn to food. Why am I eating this now? And choose with food is so transformative for clients because once they stop emotionally eating, they now have a practice to manage all the emotions that come up in a freeing way. And because we get to the root of these reasons, eventually, you know, you don't have such big emotions. So if you I mean, you do, but they're not as frequent. So you have a lot more breathing room in between stress. So if you haven't done the internal battle work with something like choose with food or why am I eating this now, you have to make sure you're prepared to work through those emotions in some way. And in general, when considering these medications, remember there's always pros and cons, like with everything.
Ali Shapiro [00:32:03]:
An import and it's important not to judge yourself or others for these highly individualized decisions about our bodies. And please work with your doctor to make sure you come up with a solution that matches your needs, including where your body's at. Right? We all come into health decisions, with unique backgrounds. And the older we get, the more unique our background is because we've had unique health experiences. And so you really ideally wanna work with someone who will honor that or at least be curious enough to work with you to help figure it out with you. So that's it for today. I want to end by encouraging you to reach out with your own question or comment. I love answering these.
Ali Shapiro [00:32:44]:
Remember, you can leave a voice mail by calling the insatiable hotline at 412-475-8006. Or if you prefer text, just click the second text message link in the show notes. Super easy. And please, please take the 30 seconds to follow the show and rate on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to podcasts. Keep the questions coming. And thanks for listening.
