Hold My Cutter
Big League Ball Talk with John Wehner (Part 2)
The Rock is back for another great conversation. From the roar of the crowd at Three Rivers Stadium to the echoing crack of the bat, the memories still linger like the scent of fresh ballpark peanuts.
Imagine stepping into the box to face down Major League pitching, or rounding the bases to the cheers of thousands after a clutch home run. We capture these electrifying moments in John's career, discussing the psychological maze athletes navigate and the bittersweet symphony of a player's final game. Wehner's transition into a broadcasting role and his 35-year bond with the team color our conversation, as he shares insights on the transformation from playing to analyzing the game he loves.
There's a lighter side to the dugout life that we dive into as well. Laughter echoes as we recount the strategic chess game of baseball and the inside jokes that players share. From Jim Leyland's influence to the quirky bets that somehow predict the outcome of a game, we reveal the camaraderie that stitches a team together. Whether you're a die-hard baseball aficionado or someone who just loves a good story, this chat isn't one to miss.
CHAPTERS
0:05 John Wainer's Rookie Success
12:19 Rocky Road to the Big Leagues
25:42 Surreal Baseball Moment
33:29 Memorable Last Game and Transition
37:22 From Player to Broadcaster
46:55 Hall of Famer's Baseball Influence
55:16 Baseball Insights and Inside Jokes
THANK YOU FOR LISTENING!!!!
www.holdmycutter.com
The Rock is back for another great conversation. From the roar of the crowd at Three Rivers Stadium to the echoing crack of the bat, the memories still linger like the scent of fresh ballpark peanuts.
Imagine stepping into the box to face down Major League pitching, or rounding the bases to the cheers of thousands after a clutch home run. We capture these electrifying moments in John's career, discussing the psychological maze athletes navigate and the bittersweet symphony of a player's final game. Wehner's transition into a broadcasting role and his 35-year bond with the team color our conversation, as he shares insights on the transformation from playing to analyzing the game he loves.
There's a lighter side to the dugout life that we dive into as well. Laughter echoes as we recount the strategic chess game of baseball and the inside jokes that players share. From Jim Leyland's influence to the quirky bets that somehow predict the outcome of a game, we reveal the camaraderie that stitches a team together. Whether you're a die-hard baseball aficionado or someone who just loves a good story, this chat isn't one to miss.
CHAPTERS
0:05 John Wainer's Rookie Success
12:19 Rocky Road to the Big Leagues
25:42 Surreal Baseball Moment
33:29 Memorable Last Game and Transition
37:22 From Player to Broadcaster
46:55 Hall of Famer's Baseball Influence
55:16 Baseball Insights and Inside Jokes
THANK YOU FOR LISTENING!!!!
www.holdmycutter.com
This episode of Hold my Cutter coming away from Burn by Rocky Patel, just a few blocks from PNC Park on the North Shore, and we are enjoying the Rocky Rocky we emphasize ROCK because John Wainer is our guest on this episode. The Rocky Patel 55,. Michael McHenry calls it the McHenry, the former Pirates Catcher, here with us for number 55. Little buttery sweetness, notes of earthiness and peppery, medium bodied cigar. Ending notes of espresso. It's really good. Leonard Lee, our producer, another episode of Hold my Cutter, john the Rock Wainer here with us. And John, we've talked about your incredible career growing up in Carrick, pittsburgh, guy, how you got here, going to Indiana, your major league debut, which just had to be incredible, through River Stadium, all your buddies on hand, and you played that first week. Jim Leland walked in in the clubhouse in Cincinnati and had an episode where the team charter had to, I guess, make an emergency landing in Columbus before reaching Cincinnati.
Speaker 2:Which is right next to Cincinnati, yeah he had hard issues man.
Speaker 1:You told us that he walked up to you at one point and said what Did?
Speaker 2:you hear that Wainer, wainer, great baby.
Speaker 1:Lee Leland will hear that. The Hall of Famer will hear that. No question about that. Take that. But he made reference to the fact that he almost had a heart attack when he found out that you were coming to the Big Leagues. But you had that great relationship over the years with Wainer and Leland had that great relationship. He often talks about some of his favorite players of his now Hall of Fame career and without fail he'll talk about Wainer. But he puts you first of all as a double switch. In your Major League debut at Thriver Stadium, the first at bat is a ground out. You get your first big league hit when you got your first hit, which was a line shot into left field, as we understand it right, or a grounder, whatever, it doesn't really matter.
Speaker 1:What did you do? Is the baseball still around somewhere?
Speaker 3:Oh, yeah, I got it. Where is it? Yeah, it's in the basement.
Speaker 1:Oh, you got it. It's in the basement.
Speaker 2:In the man room or just in the basement.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I got a shelf. It's on a shelf.
Speaker 1:But you had all these people on hand. You talk about how nervous you were in your debut. How much of a relief is it when you get that and you did it early Like you don't go for an 0, for 6, 7, 10 streak, you get that out of the way. Is that a huge relief? Big time, yeah.
Speaker 3:It was nice for one, because I started that game and I want to say it was my first at bat of that game. I remember Bobby Bonilla coming up to me before that game as we were talking about Tom Browning, and Browning threw a perfect game, I believe the year before. And so you're thinking, oh my gosh, tom Browning, and he's like, you won't believe it, you won't even believe it. This guy got nothing, and he did. I mean, he threw like 89 miles an hour.
Speaker 3:It's like what is this Change ups and this? And that I mean he was just throwing like softballs up there, and so it helps, because you don't feel like you got to gear up or do anything extra. When you think in the minor leagues, when you think of going to the big leagues, you think that they are so much better, you think that they are so much more talented, you think that the fastball is harder, the breaking ball is sharper, and in some cases it is, but generally it's the same stuff you saw in the minor leagues, they just have better command.
Speaker 1:When did you find out that you were actually in the starting lineup, though? Because you were a double switch the first time your debut but when did you find out you're actually starting?
Speaker 3:I believe when I walked in the call-out that day. I don't think I've ever been told. I think maybe one time I was told by Jim Leland that get your rest. You're probably starting tomorrow.
Speaker 2:Did you like that, though? Did you like to know?
Speaker 3:No, it didn't matter. I didn't get my rest the night before I faced out lighter in New York either.
Speaker 4:I had very little rest, maybe like three hours.
Speaker 1:Why would Leland tell you that I don't know?
Speaker 4:I have no idea. He told you what that was when I was at the Marlins in 98.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh, who cares? That's hilarious. I think that was the only time.
Speaker 3:Now you can't sleep because you know your plan, that's another whole story too, because Leland was like oh, you can't feel his position. He's telling me, we're going to bun on him. We're going to bun on him, just bun him. He can't feel his position, bun on him. So first at bat, naturally, I try to bun. His cutter jammed me and I hit a one hopper back at him. So I'm like in the dugout In front of Leland, I'm going to bun on him.
Speaker 1:What are you talking about? Leland, but yeah.
Speaker 3:I ended up going one for three that day. I remember that, but it was a 12-30 game at Shea and I think I got in at four.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh that was a bad thing Wow.
Speaker 3:That's a hit the ball in the middle, but I still won for three.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a good day, oh my gosh. Yeah, make a career out of that.
Speaker 3:But I don't ever think. I don't ever remember in my career other than that day being told hey, you're going. Oh no, there was a second day, and that's another story. Oh my gosh, this showed me on forever McClellan. Lloyd McClellan, in 2001 told me like four days in advance that I was facing Shane Reynolds against Houston, that's just evil Four days.
Speaker 3:Well, and the reason being I think he was and I know this is well, I didn't confirm this was Lloyd, but I knew at the time just by reading the writing on the wall. That was my last year and he told me like two or three or four days earlier, starting Friday against Shane Reynolds. So I called all my family and friends and said, hey, my last game is going to be Friday against the Astros. If you want to come, because I knew then that was my last game.
Speaker 3:Because I mean Lloyd was yeah, Lloyd gave me a heads up and without saying it, and I knew that that was going to be my last game, but I honestly think in my career I've been told twice that I was starting beforehand, at least the day before.
Speaker 1:How about the streak that you went on as a rookie, by the way, in fact against Charlie Lee Brandt, that first week, the call up July 23rd against Atlanta, again through a stadium, you go five for five, five for five.
Speaker 2:Five for five game.
Speaker 1:The first pirate rookie to go five for five since Richie's disc in 1973.
Speaker 2:I need a dab for that. Hey, come on Five for five.
Speaker 3:So my first start was against Browning. I think my second start was on Sunday Night Baseball. Randy Tomlin threw a shutout, and that was cool too, because now I'm thinking like now, if I screw up, everybody's going to see it Sunday.
Speaker 3:Night Baseball and I had like the craziest defensive game ever. And then so the next day I think it was my third start was against the Braves and Charlie Lee Brandt, and if you ask Jim Leland about that five hit game, because he remembers it and he'll tell you you line them up, they don't reach the warning track. I can't do my Leland right now. I'm really struggling with it.
Speaker 3:But like, yeah, I had like a little flare off the end of the bat up the middle I hit like a little swinging bunt. The third I had a one hopper and Lemke kind of got handcuffed. The second I had a little blooper down the right field line.
Speaker 4:It's a beautiful day.
Speaker 3:I literally didn't hit a single. The only ball I hit hard was the one hopper to Lemke and he couldn't get out of his glove. And yeah so like it might, yeah, and so another story with that is that so I might. It was my fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh and eighth hit, cause I remember they put on the scoreboard Paul Paul wayner like whatever 3000 hits, and Lloyd Wainer whatever all that, and then John Wainer eight.
Speaker 3:So, you're right behind them. Oh, the great story about that is like. As soon as that went up on the board, I found out Leland got on the phone with the press box and said good shit.
Speaker 4:Really, he was so mad. He called Jimmy team. He was so mad, so I know that was like my eighth hit because of that.
Speaker 1:Oh, my God, that's hilarious, that's absolutely unbelievable. Oh my God.
Speaker 2:I love that he got on the phone and called up there Get that off there.
Speaker 1:So you get six straight hits, you eight for 15.
Speaker 2:after your first week in the big leagues, your first home run comes in a couple years later, six years later, but anyway, he's hit a couple years later.
Speaker 1:It's April, the fourth it's at Florida, but you were just talking about out lighter, your first home run is Florida.
Speaker 2:That's a big part too.
Speaker 1:Or Francisco Cordova, the Pirates pitcher against out lighter.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and so don't think that I didn't know that I hadn't had a home run in the big leagues, because I had some power. I mean, I hit first some power in the minor leagues and so I pinch, hit. I don't know, was that what was?
Speaker 1:the date, that was April, april 4th, early 1996.
Speaker 3:It was either it might have been opening day or I think it was, and so when I pinched it I knew lighter through cutters, and so he came in with a cutter and you know I had it was a line drive that just barely got out. I didn't think it was going to go, and we were down like three or four nothing I want to say four nothing and so it was probably the most unprofessional thing I've ever done as a baseball player.
Speaker 4:What was that? I came back and the dog got so happy. It was like the eighth inning and I was like I'm going to go down four or one and I'm like screw you, you finally got it. Yeah, I knew the guys were going to give me crap and stuff like that.
Speaker 2:None of them, I think, knew that I had never had a home run and I'm like I can't believe.
Speaker 4:you're looking at me like I'm a freaking fool. Oh my gosh, that means something.
Speaker 2:Oh, that was a big deal.
Speaker 3:I think it was my 376th at bat, so something like that. And so the greatest thing about that not the greatest thing, but one of the weird things about that is so I pinched it, hit a home run and I don't know if I played for another week or two because we went back home like the first, the full, first home stand. They would show the team leaders on the scoreboard like pregame and I was leading the team and like OPS and average like slugging percentage.
Speaker 4:I was one for one, like two weeks into the season with the home.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I was like get that off the scoreboard. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 4:If you'd look it up I guarantee you I didn't get another bat for two weeks after that.
Speaker 2:But you're the lead. You're a team leader. That's all that matters. That's great. Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1:Well, you got to tell the story, speaking of home runs, because it's my favorite story. I know I've talked to you. I don't know if I've told you about it, michael.
Speaker 2:It's one of my favorites. There's a play by play guy.
Speaker 1:You get asked the questions about what's your favorite moment in sports. You know what's your favorite call, and so my favorite call is John Wainers last home run in the major leagues.
Speaker 2:And I didn't know, is his last home in the majors. Yeah, yes.
Speaker 1:It's the last home run ever hit in the history of three.
Speaker 2:I knew that part.
Speaker 1:Wow, I also didn't really know the whole backstory behind the journey which he had. Basically, you tell the story, you're here.
Speaker 3:Well, if we have five minutes, I'm going to even go back further than that.
Speaker 2:I'm going to go back to, please. I've heard parts of the story. It's one of my favorites.
Speaker 3:I'm going to go back to 99. Okay, Because after I was at the Marlins 97 with one World Series with Jim Leland and Dave Dombrovsky brought me back for 98, you know, and I got released and after 98, I was out of baseball. So I had no offers and I'm calling everyone I know called Terry Collins, called Ray Miller, called Leland, called Kanbanife, call everybody I know trying to get a job in baseball and I got nothing and I was supposed to go to Colorado with Jim Leland. He was like asking me about it and he couldn't get things to work out. So I was done playing.
Speaker 3:I was basically you know, done, retired, as some would say, but I felt like I was at that time I was only 31 that I had more left in me. So I stayed in shape but just did lessons. Early June of 99, again, no spring training, no baseball, playing slow pitch softball with my brothers right here in Maori Park and Pleasant Hills, among other places, and it was cool because all three of my brothers were in town and we're playing softball, slow pitch. Paul Tennell, the Pirate Scouting Director at the time, gives me a call it's like June 4th or 5th and says do you want to come back and play? I'm like no, I'm done. He goes, we need somebody to go to double A? No, I'm not doing. And they offered me a lot of money. It's probably one of the best minor league contracts I got as far as monthly now he's negotiating, so now he's.
Speaker 3:Playing hardball now yeah believe it or not, the 12-5. I said I sent a sign for an 88. I Think he offered me 12,000 a month to play in double. I thought that, and now I was doing lessons. I wasn't making much. I wasn't making that, and so I agreed to it, and so it took me a couple days to get the Altoona and I go.
Speaker 1:I'd interrupt you. Why do you think? Why did they do that at that time?
Speaker 3:They had some injuries and they were just short looking for depth.
Speaker 4:Yeah, they were looking for depth.
Speaker 3:So figure, okay, I'll get on literally hit a slow pitch softball the night before when I go to Altoona and they throw me in the lineup and I was only there for five or six days, I think I had ten or eleven, maybe twelve, I don't know ten or eleven at bats, a couple hits and now they're telling me I got to go to Nashville, the triple A. And I'm kind of pissed Because I'm like I'm playing slow pitch softball. Now they're gonna make me go to Nashville triple A and I and I know who's there and I'm not gonna play. I didn't come here to not play, I signed to play, yeah. And so I go to Nashville and I'm sitting there.
Speaker 3:Trent Jewett, again, was the manager and Good friends of mine there. Dale Swain, everybody else. Kevin Polkovich was the shortstop. Well, polkovich strains a calf, so Swain was the backup shortstop and I get four or five days in. I think I had maybe one or two at bats and, and, and the one at bat was in Arizona, I think, tucson, around my left side. No better than that. This is, this is the most amazing thing about my career. My gosh, am I stinking, feeling like a selfish fool, right?
Speaker 4:now.
Speaker 3:The Nashville sounds have won 12 straight games. So I'm up there two or three games and I'm not playing yet. So in the ninth inning of game number 13, they Trent tells me to go I have to go up and pinch it and I, like I said, I have, like I, 12 at bats in double a, maybe one in Triple a, I go to pinch it. In the ninth inning, down five to I had a three-round home. Yeah, it's kids, a tie it.
Speaker 2:You know what it was a softball. It's a long table change.
Speaker 3:So we time it, we tie it and then we win 12 to win 13 straight on the next day straight. Email Brown did something weird, so I started in right field that game. I think polkovich and Swain got hurt Okay, and so now I have to play short. It's the one position I haven't played. I played a lot of center, left, right, a lot of first, second, third, caught a few times but never played short. So I went from this light hitting for utility guy. So now I'm playing short every day and in triple a for Trent Jewett, nashville.
Speaker 3:So we go up to Seattle or Tacoma. I hit a homer in the first game and a homer in the second game, hit a homer in the third game. Now we're at the end of June, going into July. We go back to Nashville. I hit a homer in the next game. We have a double double header on July 4th. So my dates are obvious. You could figure out the dates. The first game of the home double header I hit a home run. The second game of the double header I had a home run. All playing short stock. I went from a light hitting third baseman. I had a home run in six straight games that is unbelievable.
Speaker 1:Now, this is.
Speaker 3:July 5th, I get called up to the big leagues. Well, no, actually it's well July 4th. I got called up to the big leagues because we just played it was 100 degrees on that Guitar clock and Nashville. Oh yeah, after that game I'm in there, we're just in there hanging out. Whatever. I just hit two home, two more home runs to have six straight games. I'm literally cramping every. I can't like your hamstrings cramping straight.
Speaker 4:I'm laying on the ground like Like swammer and lake.
Speaker 3:Give me a beer, I'm just sitting there.
Speaker 3:And so literally everybody leaves, everybody leaves the clubhouse, except Sandy Crumb. Trent's gone, sandy Crumb's a trainer. Sandy Crumb says, hey, you got a phone call. I'm like, oh, you got all right. So I get up. There is before I had a cell phone, like before anybody had a cell phone I guess a 99. So I go back to the in Cambona phase. On the phone he goes rock. I'm like, yeah, and this is literally how he said it. We got to call you up the general manager, we got it.
Speaker 1:We gotta call you Like disappointed.
Speaker 3:You gotta call you up, I'm sorry, I was playing slope and softball or whatever it was. So now it's obviously a long answer to your question. So now I'm back in the big leagues and then, yeah, I backed in my old self, you know, playing off the bench or whatever. But that got me another year in 2000. So now I go and spent the whole year in triple a in 2000. Now this is the last year. Three were saved.
Speaker 1:Jean Lamont is the manager in 99, by the way, the pirates manager so I Get.
Speaker 3:I start off in 2000. Didn't go to big league camp, only Mairley camp. They didn't invite me to big league camp.
Speaker 2:I didn't get the big league camp the next year.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I didn't get the big league camp. So I start Mairley camp. They tell me they don't have a spot for me. I had a typical bad spring training even in Mairley camp. And Trent Jewett again the manager says we got no spot for you, so where they're gonna release? Sure, you start on the Phantom DL. So I'm like, all right, I'll do the Phantom P DL thing. You know, spent the entire year in that and I had a decent year. I actually had some homers that year not consecutively, but I think I had the highest I ever had. I think I had 16 or so.
Speaker 3:And the end of August, the seasons winding down, they told the guys who were gonna get called up who was getting called up. So I'm like, well, this is my first year not in the big league since 91. So I'm done, I'm retired, I'm literally finished. I spent the whole year in triple a. I'm done. The last week of August up here in Pittsburgh, aramis Ramirez separates his shoulder, his backup, mike Benjamin has absorbed back and Keith Osick did something to his shoulder all in the last week of August. So on September 1st I get a call in Nashville saying we got to call you, we got to call you up again. We got to call you up. So not only am I getting called up, we're on the West Coast. I walked into the clubhouse September 1st or was 1st or 2nd in San Diego and I had friends with all those guys that were all hey, yeah, and they weren't a very good team, and I just said something stupid, like I'm going to write this ship. I'm going to write this ship.
Speaker 1:I'm here to write this ship I'm going to hear to rock this ship.
Speaker 3:I'm in the lineup. That day I go three for five with a couple RBIs. We swept the West.
Speaker 4:Coast, so you write the ship.
Speaker 2:I'm in the big leagues.
Speaker 4:now I'm playing every day in the big leagues again. I'm like what the hell Rock writes the ship.
Speaker 3:So anyhow it got normal. You know, like that, benjamin Benjio, I got 50 at Batson that month of September, which was a lot for me, but I played a lot, which led up to the last game of three rips.
Speaker 1:He hits 300, by the way, just to point that out. In that month In that month.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but so obviously because of all that stuff that happened in 99 and 2000, I get an opportunity to play the last game at three River Stadium, which for me obviously is a thrill. So there was a third time that I was told beforehand that I was starting, because Jean Lamont I'll never forget this told me several days before you're starting that last game.
Speaker 3:And I couldn't have been more thrilled, and I had never, ever in my life, felt more comfortable To me. I was a defensive guy. I took so much pride in my defense and Jim Leland kept me around because he trusted me wherever he threw me to catch the ball In that game. I've never felt less confident on defense than I did. All I thought about for three days is I just can't screw up on defense. I don't care what happens on off.
Speaker 1:I wonder why you felt that way.
Speaker 3:The second batter of that game, a one hopper right at the bag, the easiest play ever. It kind of took me away from a play. At second, I threw a change up the first base, kevin Young, in the dirt error. It was my first error at third base since 1992.
Speaker 1:Yeah, John Wainer had the National League record. Think about that the record for errorless games at third base.
Speaker 3:And I knew I hadn't made an error since 1992, but I didn't know how many games and I didn't know it was a record, anything like that. All I thought about for three days was you can't screw up on defense, which is the worst thing you can do In the second batter, like the third pitch of the game, I threw the ball away at first base, but offensively I've never felt more calm and cool.
Speaker 4:And I thought this is the greatest ever.
Speaker 3:I was like, oh my gosh, who's pitch? It was John Lieber, former teammate, and I've never felt more locked in at the play. I've never felt worse on defense and never felt that locked in on offense. It was the weirdest thing up.
Speaker 1:Well, so I'm going to pick up the story because of having known John.
Speaker 2:For a while now, for a while.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I never do this, never. I don't have any memorabilia. I don't keep anything over the years, I just don't. I don't have any hand full of it. But I decided that day I'm going to get one of Steve Blass's. Steve would have a big flip scorecard with the lineup he put down and the diagram of the field and I thought I'm going to go into the clubhouse, I'm just going to have each player sign his position. I don't know why. So I'm walking out. Of course I don't know who's playing. I have to look on the lineup card and I look and I see Wainers in the starting lineup. I thought this is so cool. I love Jean Lamont for that reason.
Speaker 1:I want to touch a class to understand the whole magnitude of this Pirates and Cubs meaningless game. But last game ever, three over stadium. What a nice touch that is to have John. So I go around each position and I sit there at John's locker and I hate we signed this. Yeah, understated humble. You know it's really cool. I'm really fired up. These guys are talking Maybe I should hit a home run. Kind of chuckles about that and we share a laugh.
Speaker 2:So it was kind of a running joke.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'll call you if I'm playing, but they did want me to hit a home run here last game through. So I go upstairs and I'm having now dinner in the press box press room with Bob Walk, who's, of course, former teammate, known John just as long longer, and I tell him the story and we're talking about how cool is it that Wayne is playing. Now Bob is doing the game on radio with Lanny for Terry, which is on the third level at Three River Stadium, but it just is one flight of steps behind home plate in the press box area to get up to the TV booths. I'm doing TV that night with Steve Blass and they brought Nellie King in, the former Pirate pitcher and longtime broadcaster so that Nellie and Steve would just throughout the game they'd spin tails about Three River Stadium and they're perfect that those guys would talk about the great years of Three River Stadium. And now John, they're talking 60,000 people just rocking the place just so emotional. And for me it's emotional because that's where I grew up as a fan.
Speaker 1:And now John comes to the plate and we have talked about this on a podcast. I've asked you guys about what it's like to be in the zone and you guys have talked about how things slow down and slow motion. For me, when the ball hits the bat, I can remember all the sudden silence in my ear. I don't hear any crowd on here, nellie or Steve talking. I just am watching. What I believe is an incredible I think is this ball going to leave the ballpark. And so now, john, now you hit the ball. What's it like?
Speaker 2:What a bat is this?
Speaker 3:Like my third at bat. I know I had a first. My first at bat I had a base hit. My second at bat, lieber threw me a breaking ball like down and away that I was. He was working me away all day. I had a base hit, I think up the middle. And my second at bat, I don't remember what pitch, but he threw me a breaking ball down in a way that I smothered. I got to it a little bit off the end of the bat and they caught it at the wall and I remember it.
Speaker 2:You're feeling sexy. Thank you, Sam.
Speaker 3:I mean, ed Roppelwant was at the young part, third base, and he looked at me and I was like we were chatting all day because it was a cool thing and I put my fingers up like this close, this close. So I thought I might have, but I didn't get enough of it and they caught it at the wall and so the third at bat I'm thinking he's been working me away. First pitch was down and away. Second pitch was away, so it was 2-0. And I'm like it's 2-0 or 2-1. I don't remember the exact count. I said he's coming in here.
Speaker 3:I knew I knew he was coming in. I probably saw eight or 10 pitches and everything was away and I'm like this pitch he's coming in and he'd come in with a fast ball and it was just like the most effortless swing I've ever had. I caught it pure. I wish I would have hit it higher. It was more of a line drive, but it was like maybe the hard it was definitely the hardest ball I've ever hit in the major leagues by far. And all I kept thinking about is, after I made contact, it was I've never pimped a home run. I've never. I don't know how people can stop after they take a swing and hit a home run, but as soon as I hit that, my first reaction was slow down. I'm like just thinking slow down, like the year before when I was in Nashville and AAA hitting a couple of homers.
Speaker 3:I used to like race around the bases.
Speaker 2:It was a contest.
Speaker 3:I would yell at Laker. I'm like I bet I can get around faster than you. I got all the guys sprinting around the bases.
Speaker 3:And so now I hit a home run at three or a stand in the last game, and all I keep thinking. Going to first, I see Tommy Sant, who was the first base coach, corner my eye and I just see his face and I'm like just slow down, Just slow down. Me and him just kind of look and share a stare and I'm like just slow down, I'm going. All I kept thinking about I hear the crowd, but it's so surreal and I'm just like just slow down, I couldn't slow down. I'm just like please slow down, he's good to do it, Please slow down.
Speaker 3:And now I come around third. Who's there? It's Trent Jewett. Now he's the big league third base coach who I played with, I'm great friends with, and now he's the big league coach of third. And I just see him and like now a tear's coming out of my eye. I've never cried in sport, never. I've never cried for losses, wins. I've never cried because of failure or six. And now I see him. And so I'm around third and I shake Trent's hand. And then I come around and I haven't even recognized the fans yet, but I see my teammates are all out of the club, all out of the dugout.
Speaker 3:They're all like between home plate and the dugout and it's just like holy crap. And I'm like you know, and it's just like the whole surreal moment and it wasn't anything about anything other than the reaction I got from my teammates, my coaches. And then I recognize the fans and I'm just like, oh nuts, I don't know what to do. Everybody's high five and I go and I got a cup of water and I normally just sit down and I hear the crowd and I'm like holy crap, it's like my only curtain call ever.
Speaker 4:And now I'm like, oh, and I just throw my hands in here. I don't know what to do.
Speaker 3:And the next thing I remember I'm back out at third base and the crowd's going crazy again. I look at Ed Roppelano and he has his arms crossed and he's just smiling with his head, and now tears are just coming.
Speaker 1:I mean, it's just like.
Speaker 3:Unbelievable. It was the most surreal thing ever. I mean, it was just. You know I hate to sit there and say it was meant to be, but the only thing more meant to be than that was me going up to the plate with second and third two outs in the bottom of ninth inning, in me getting a hit instead of grounding out the third, which would have won the game. Yeah, it would have been. I came up, either it was 11-10 or 11-9. Well, 10-9, 11-10.
Speaker 4:Here is a chance to win the game now and I'm three for four now with a homer and I'm like you're feeling good. And then they changed the pitchers and I'm like oh, look at the shape. No, no, mclennan is telling me who's coming in and who's going to be down?
Speaker 2:I'm like I don't care.
Speaker 4:No, I was like the only time I was on the show was my day. Hey, that's a little block off. Hit Grounder to third.
Speaker 2:The baseball comes back right, oh wow.
Speaker 3:And one of the most. Every time I talk about it, the thing that comes to my head somebody took a snapshot and I know David Arrigo, who's great best ever photographer.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and he got a picture of the swing of the homer and I don't know who got this picture and I never asked. I don't know, but like my career. In a nutshell, was that the capture of the extension on the home run ball and the dejection on my face walking back to the dugout after I made the last hour, the three River Stadium, with the Cubs team celebrating in the background, like those, like those two images to me are like my career.
Speaker 3:In a nutshell, I was like you know, I had so many ups, so many great ups, and so fortunate and grateful, and I had so many downs. And, like to me, I don't have them side by side, but I should those two. I don't know if I have either of the pictures hung in my house, but they should be, because it basically we got to make that happen, yeah.
Speaker 3:It encapsulates my career in a nutshell, but it was just like the most. And then I'll add one last thing, because all the rigor, rigor and everything going on, like our guys are in, and by the time I get into the club I'm like the last one down the tunnel to the clubhouse. And who walks by me is Willie Stargill. Wow, and the last time I saw him, the last time many saw him, because he obviously passed my God Right, it was an opening day, yeah. And he walks by me and he says I hit the last or first one, you hit the last one.
Speaker 4:And like how about that? Yeah, now that passes, willie Stargill.
Speaker 1:Willie says I hit the first one as a pirate at three of us. You hit the last one.
Speaker 2:How cool was that for you in that moment.
Speaker 3:Did it just put you in all like just 100%? I mean I saw Willie Stargill at three or stadium as a fan in those seats In fact I was at the celebration where you were probably there his last game where he went around in the convertible. I mean I saw Willie so many great moments of Willie Stargill at three or a stadium and like he was the guy for me growing up and I loved all those guys, especially from the 79 team. But like when he walked by me, no one, he was sick but like just giving me like a nod of affirmation Like I hit the first one, like you, did something big.
Speaker 3:That's really cool.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'll never forget that. Wow, I'll never forget that.
Speaker 4:Oh yeah 2001.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, when was it when, so Lloyd?
Speaker 3:McLennan. So 2001's first year PNC.
Speaker 2:Yeah, first year PNC.
Speaker 3:And so I scuffle, didn't play a whole lot, but I love Lloyd and I appreciate Lloyd, for you know he stuck his neck out for me to make that team out of spring training. So that was another year. I got Geez, you know, because of 2000, in the last home run and Lloyd went to bat for me and put me on a team and I scuffled and I didn't play a whole lot and he told me a few days before that day you're going to start Friday against the Astra. Shane Reynolds, I like the matchup or I like the numbers or something. Like Shane Reynolds, like I like the nasty sinker. And so you told a bunch of people.
Speaker 3:I called everybody and it's funny because that was like one of the first years they had walkup music and I was a big Genesis fan and I remember driving to the ballpark that day thinking I never had walkup music and I was going to call Jimmy T and say there's a song Genesis. I can't believe it's true. Are you really doing the things you do? I can't believe it's true.
Speaker 4:Like how was your walkup?
Speaker 3:I was going to call them and say play this because I know I'm getting released right now and you didn't do it, you didn't call them, I didn't. My other walkup song would have been I Missed Again by Genesis oh, I missed again.
Speaker 4:That was the only two songs I ever thought of.
Speaker 2:Yeah this real thing.
Speaker 3:But anyhow, yeah, I started, I don't remember. Yeah, it was my last at bat and because it was Shane Reynolds sinker baller, he threw me a sinker down and away, rolled over to short. So I'm out of the box and I don't know. I never saw the replay and I'm assuming a shortstop dogged it because I didn't run as good in no no 2001 as I did 91, but I beat it out. It was a grounder to short. I don't think he even had to go to his backhand, it was a tapper to short and I beat it out in the only thing. And so I remember that vividly. But oddly enough, you know, the last out was made. I started at first base that night and then McClendon took me out of the game for defense my entire life.
Speaker 3:I've never been taken out of the game You've always gone in for defense.
Speaker 3:So we were leading, kevin Young came out for defense. I was starting at first, which I hated, but I didn't like playing first, but like it was odd to have a start at first. But yeah, ky came in for defense and I'm like thinking that's the weirdest thing ever. So then after the game, I know I'm done. Nobody else knows I'm done. I'm sure some people might see the writing on the wall, but I knew I think it was Adam Heisdew was coming off the DL and so I'm like told my friends and family, wait, we'll go out and celebrate. And I got showered real quick and I'm sitting in my locker and I'm waiting, and I'm waiting, and I'm waiting, and I'm waiting, and I'm like, well, screw this, I'm leaving. You know, I start walking out. And then finally Donnelly comes up and says, hey, mack, what's the topic?
Speaker 2:You're trying to do that, my favorite.
Speaker 4:Oh man, let's go.
Speaker 3:And so I always kid Dave. I was always kidding Dave Littlefield about it because, like he was just brought on, I said GM. I'm like, yeah, it's his first order of business with the release the previous GM had called him and said gotta call you up, Gotta call you up.
Speaker 2:Yeah, wow.
Speaker 1:How about then? How many years later did you get the call from the Pirates about broadcasting?
Speaker 2:Oh gosh, I even forgot about this, okay, so so what would you do so?
Speaker 3:that was your last swammer. Dale Swain was my best friend in baseball, was coaching the manager in double A so he talked me into coming down as a player coach. So I was thinking about getting in as a player coach. So I took a few days off and then I went to Altoona to coach where everybody got hurt.
Speaker 1:So now I'm playing shortstop in double A but now I can't hit the ball Every time he tries to walk away they pull him back.
Speaker 3:Well, now I can't hit the ball. I didn't feel I'm done.
Speaker 4:I had two old fastball 88.
Speaker 3:I couldn't get the bad head out so I was done. The last week I think I pitched three times because our bullpen was shot. I got a loss as a pitcher. I pitched like the. I had to come in like in the ninth. I got I. I, you know I. I got through the ninth. I think I got the loss in the 10th but I was a pitcher of record arms falling apart, so I did that 2002. I took the year off. Swammer was still in Altoona managing, so I started coaching in Altoona and 03 went back in 04 with Tony Beasley and I was going to stay.
Speaker 4:I wanted to man human.
Speaker 1:He is one of the best ever.
Speaker 3:And so I wanted to manage and and um, and I beg Brian Graham, who was our minor league director at the time, because Beasley moved on, and I want I think Beasley got called up to coach here at Pittsburgh and so I begged him to be the manager in Altoona and he's like, no, you have to start in rookie ball or a ball. I'm like, well, I'm not going to do that, I'm not going that far for my family. If I'm going to manage, it's going to be here two hours away from home, so he wouldn't do it. Now, in the off season, I'm reading that they're looking for another announcer, cause blast. Steve blast is only going to do home games. And I'm like, shoot, I wish I'd have heard about that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and so I called Patty Paytas, who was the, the director, vice president, whatever it was the communications, and she goes no, we're done interviewing, we're not going to interview anymore. I'm like, ah, it stinks. So the next day I go to giant eagle to go shopping and I bump into Tommy walk who worked in the clubhouse Bob walk, son, tommy. And I'm like, man, tommy, what's up? Hey, how are you doing? Man, I said I wish I'd have known about this opening out of death. He's been interested. He goes oh, my dad said you'd never get out of coaching. And so Tommy goes home, tells his dad, bob, who tells her boss, mark Garda, that I'm interested, and so Mark Garda brings me in to get auditioned. And then I got the job.
Speaker 2:They had to call you up again.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:That's right.
Speaker 3:I'll hear you up my butt.
Speaker 4:I got so many things.
Speaker 1:It's so crazy 19 years now. Can you believe that? 19?
Speaker 2:years Wow, 10 years Wow Did you feel that? Long.
Speaker 3:No, it doesn't, but I literally talked about this with somebody last night. Somebody was talking and asking me how long I signed with the Pirates in 1988. It's 2024. I mean, I'm pushing 35 years with this team that I used to literally get on a bus by myself and dropped off at the post-Kazette slash press building. Walk across the bridge, come in, get a dollar. Sometimes there were bread wrappers. Town talk bread. You get eight wrappers, you get in for free. I'd come in with my wrappers and come in here and you know, it's amazing.
Speaker 3:I can't write that story. It's amazing. It is unbelievable. I've been so blessed and lucky and that's why you say humble. I mean, how can you not be humble? I'm the luckiest man ever. It's so freaking incredible.
Speaker 1:What's the? A lot of people were surprised kind of like Bob actually when Bob walked out the call from Mark Driscoll about broadcasting after he had retired, blasting the rule, he thought. And then those of us that knew Bob and maybe to a degree knew John Wayne or wouldn't have thought that you two guys would end up with the broadcast boot, lo and behold and I'm not saying this because you're here, I'd say it's other people that I think that you and Bob are two of the best color broadcasters by far Without question.
Speaker 1:Because I listened to all of them, and without disrespecting anybody else, but you guys are incredible what you bring to the broadcast booth. So is this something that you've worked at, thought about over the years? What is it?
Speaker 3:Oh, I've definitely worked at it and you know it's funny because I obviously it's incredible being it's a joke I guess Like the only thing I think more farfetched than coming out of Carrick and being a Major League Baseball player is to come out of Carrick and be a Major League broadcaster. You know, I mean I was still circling verbs as a senior in high school and then putting underlines around the nouns and underneath all that and if you go and look at like an interview, it was an interview. I think CBS did 91, my rookie year, and if you'd sort of heard what I was saying in that, and you were just trying to help the team out and that you know the think that I could be a Major League broadcaster.
Speaker 2:It was something that I don't care Well here's the thing. I think you're great.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it doesn't work outside of Pittsburgh. I think it only works here just because of my roots and everything else like that. And you know I obviously wasn't schooled for it. But what I will say is I know the game, I'm very confident in my knowledge of the game. I mean I don't think I could talk hitting like you could talk hitting.
Speaker 3:I can't talk pitching like Bob or Matt Caps can talk about pitching, but I think I can talk about the game. I mean I'm not an expert on hitting but I do feel like I can sit there and I can watch a game, see the game, talk about what I'm watching and not only explain it like I know it but explain it like fans can. Fans can understand it. And then I think that's the thing I probably like greatest compliment from fans is that you know I explain it the way that they can understand it and learn from it. And I think the more fans can learn about the game you know, the more interest they're going to have, the more understanding and hopefully, the more kids will play it Amen.
Speaker 1:Do you still love doing it?
Speaker 3:Oh, I love it. It's the greatest. I mean it's just so lucky, it's like the greatest they ever.
Speaker 4:And plus I only do half of them. I don't know if I'd love it if I had to do all of them.
Speaker 2:I'll say this like because you know, getting into the business, you know, and going around and I was heard a couple of different times and was asked to do it while it was heard. It's a different breed here and I would say your even bigger gifts may be that you know you were a utility guy. You watched a ton of games and I think that was a gift I got too. Being a bench guy, you get to see things that most guys don't see and you're watching in a different way and that competitive edge comes out. But the one gift you have that blows me away is your timing.
Speaker 2:You have some of the best timing in the plays you pick because you know the last couple of years I did it in 2020 and 2021 quite a bit, and it was a little overwhelming for me because you see so much. It's like what do you pick? What do I choose to do? And then I really started watching you and walkie does a great job too, but you, I would say you're the timing expert. It's amazing watching you pick the right plays and you bring it to life. He really does.
Speaker 4:What's so funny? Is that what you?
Speaker 3:said, I've never thought about timing ever.
Speaker 2:Probably not, but like you play.
Speaker 3:Well, I think that is the other thing about it that I think I've just kind of stumbled upon or got lucky with is that you can't talk about every play, especially on radio, but on TV.
Speaker 3:I crave that play to talk about.
Speaker 3:You know, a lot of the routine stuff I don't want to talk over, you know, and I let the play by play guys do their job, but I crave that opportunity to talk about the game, and so when I find something worth talking about, I get passionate about it. And there are times where that play doesn't show up and that's where I feel like it's forced and the timing is bad, because I feel like that I'm kind of overcooking something that shouldn't be overcooked, and so you know. And so I guess that would be the thing for me, because one I don't want to be the guy that says the same thing over and over again, you know. So I feel that I'm probably more patient and I guess for some boring, because I won't talk. If there's nothing to talk about, he'll tell you I won't talk unless we talk about something on the side. You know, make up some story, which I'm not good at, but if the game doesn't present itself something worthy of talking about. I don't talk, and so that's when you'll hear me.
Speaker 1:Crickets.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I get, I get in the crickets.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but that that is also, I think, something that good color analysts learn is when to be quiet. There's the if seem like guys oftentimes feel the need just to talk. That doesn't do any good. You don't need that, especially on TV when the pictures are there. So yeah, I just wondered if you still enjoyed it as much as you did.
Speaker 3:I love it.
Speaker 1:How about the, the Leland stories, that and managers that you've played for? You've mentioned a couple of them, but Leland, of course, stands out. In your relationship with him, you become a really good golfer. That's not true, that is true, I've heard different. Yeah, really good, and Leland is a really good golfer. So he tells me I don't know, I've not had that opportunity, but I understand from him that he is really good. What's it like to be golfing buddies with the Hall of Famer?
Speaker 3:What's interesting is that I've always been intimidated by the man. I mean he was my boss in the same sense. You know, reflecting back, he's done so much for me to the point where he was like my sponsor. But he also I realized he trusted me and he always found value in that utility knife, that guy that can, you know, fill a role kind of in the background to where he trusts you to go to right field or left field or second or third or wherever, and so I knew my role. But I also never wanted to cross the boss. So I kept my mouth shut and just worked hard and made sure I was prepared for when I did get to play, and so I didn't have much of a relationship with him away from the field ever. Marlins was a little different. The Marlins was cool because I got to spend a little more time with him, you know, in his office after the games, kind of rehashing what we did.
Speaker 2:You're more a veteran then too.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah yeah, so that was, that was decent. And like in the last, you know, since he moved on and I moved on, I just, you know, if it wasn't at the ballpark I didn't have much conversation. But again, bring it back, tommy. So now I gotta hear this, tommy.
Speaker 1:Oh, we gotta tell Tommy story.
Speaker 3:Tommy and in skip Became very close. They both belong to the same club, you know they spent a lot of time together and so because of that relationship and Tommy's one of my dear friends, like he went to IU also, he's one of my best friends. We, you know it was his dad that did the Legion thing and it's weird how that all circled back. And so I get to play with with with Jim Leland Few times a year golf and I get to run into him up the club and so I got to know him better this last couple years and had normal conversations to where I didn't feel like the yeah you know the employee you know, and so, yeah, and it's so much easier talking to him and I don't know why I was so scared of him for so many years.
Speaker 3:Because he's such we've seen it on here. I mean, he's such a loving guy and he has. He's so emotional and passionate about baseball and so many different things. But I'm getting inducted in the Hall of Fame obviously is incredible and well deserved and and I made sure that I can get off to go up there and spend that time with him. But golfing aside, you know, golfing is not that much fun, other than the fact I get the rip on them.
Speaker 3:And be more comfortable Without repercussion, and so you know it's become more like a friendship than it. Yeah, then, then you know my boss type of thing, and so it's been really cool in that sense. And he can golf man, he's almost, he's 79 years old. That dude doesn't miss a fairway ever. It's incredible, wow. And so you know that that bonding the last couple years has been really cool, really neat, and and I have taught me to thank for that, obviously. But, like you know, the dude is Jim Leland is just was so intense, a competitor but so good at his craft. And you talked about like being a utility guy and not playing every day, seeing the game from a different lens. I've always felt that I've had that Different lens of dissecting a game, but I got to think along with him.
Speaker 3:That's awesome, and so I. For many, many eight years I got to think along with him and got to question him at the end with the Marlins about why he was thinking what he was thinking, and that was invaluable as far as, like you know, not that I had doubts of my beliefs or thoughts of how the game should be, player, what you should do. You know a lot of guys have a lot of different opinions about a different player Change or pitching change or whatever, and none of them are wrong, right. They all could be right, you know.
Speaker 3:They're all different opinions, but they all could be right. They all could be wrong too, but that's the great thing about baseball is that All these different scenarios and baseball, five different managers could be in the Hall of Fame and they could have made five different decisions on the same play. You know, some work, some didn't, maybe they all work, none of them work. But that's the great thing about baseball is, just because you have an opinion doesn't mean you're wrong, you know, but that's a you know. You sit there and that's what I think is missing in baseball these conversations after a game with your teammates, among coaches and with the manager. It's like, hey, why do we do this? Why didn't we do this? Well, blah, blah, blah. Well, I think you should have done this, or I think and so that's okay.
Speaker 4:It doesn't mean you're wrong.
Speaker 3:That's the greatest thing about baseball and that's the talk about it. I cherish the most of all I cherish most of all was sitting down after a game having a beer and Talking about the game and arguing about the game.
Speaker 3:I could be passionate, saying no, this is the way you do it, and I could be wrong. And you could be passionate, blah, blah, blah. And what you said was right, it doesn't matter, that's how you did. You wake up the next day and you think I see how that could work. Yeah, I could see. You know what you know and that's what I think needs to be done in baseball, among teammates, amongst coaches. And you know it shouldn't be all science. I think there's still the human element, and you know it isn't the probability 65%. I don't care about the probability, right? You know what I mean. I care about. You know what's going on at that time. I mean, today might be different than tomorrow with that same decision, you know. And so that that to me is the beauty of baseball, like nobody's always right, nobody's always wrong, and Discussing baseball only makes you learn it and know it better.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I loved when Tommy's saying at the late, first base coach of the Pirates would allow me back there, the back of the bus, you and, and Walkie and the before of us, because he would let me get involved in these, this true passionate arguments. Yeah, and and this is a former big league player in his own right Tommy sent a long-time coach and like you're, as you said it and accepting that. You know it's just a different opinion, but man.
Speaker 2:Mission to get people talking Mission yeah, I think that's why this has come about and yeah, I think it's so cool that he brought up the human element. And, browning, you've watched Thousands of baseball games, so your perspective is different. Like you're a utility guy, I was a backup catcher. Our perspective is so different depending on how we're seeing the game in that certain moment, but it all has weight. Like you said, and I think what you said, it doesn't matter about the probability, and Jimmy Leland is known for having that knack, that gut feeling and that human element that most guys kind of wash away. Now Can you speak a little bit on that? Like cuz I, I think that's the most mind-blowing thing and what makes the best coaches. We just watched the World Series and bocce is known for that as well, and he stepped up in a way that was different. He managed the team, he didn't manage the numbers.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't think Leland ever after a game was asked, or if he what he'd dismiss it about. You know why did you do something? He would never say well, this guy hit 300 against left. No, he'd have legit and he owned it. That's not legitimate, but he'd have really good Reasons behind it. I love that from just those numbers.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean again, the numbers will tell you a lot and I wish I had those numbers in the player.
Speaker 3:I mean, as I wish I knew what this guy threw, with a 2-1 pick right 80% of the time, because then I could look for that pitch. But there are times where a hitter is a hot and it doesn't matter who's pitching lefty, righty, it doesn't matter if I'm hitting righty, lefty, I don't need to match up that way and I think the really good managers recognize, you know, okay, maybe he's a lifetime 180 hitter against lefties, but against this lefty he's not gonna face the wicked slider, or I can go with a million examples that way.
Speaker 3:But there's also a feel you know, how's that pitcher throwing, how's that hitter hitting? But there's also a Trust in guys you know. Yeah, there's a trust in such where you know why we pinch hit and that guy, when this guy does this or that guy does that, well, well, that was the other thing that I thought was great about jibberlain and some other managers. It's like, oh good, this is a no-brainer that you got to pinch hit this guy for this guy. Well, this guy should get a chance to be a hero once in a while too.
Speaker 3:You know what I mean, what that does for your confidence Absolutely that's another thing that you got to show your faith in that player every now and again. And the other thing about the arguing and or not, I won't call it argument that the discussion of debate, it shouldn't never be Like personal, it shouldn't be like you're wrong, I'm right. It should be like well, this is why I would do that and that's why, you know, I think we should have done it differently, you know. And so At the end of like the Marlin thing, I remember going into his office one time like well, after a game, and as soon as I walked into his office, it was actually a compliment for me he's like well, what are you gonna second guess me about tonight? Because, well, that's my whole point is.
Speaker 4:I want to learn and I want to know why. Why didn't you do?
Speaker 2:this discussion. And so and he was learning to right, and that's the coolest part is like you're not trying to one-up the guy, you're trying to come to the best outcome possible because you're gonna be in that situation again. Right, something similar to and it gives you more, I guess, at your disposal make a better decision.
Speaker 3:I've talked about this on the air and I hate bringing it up again, you know, but it was just one play, one game 30 years ago that, like to me, was kind of like epitomized, my Mind working, and so I guess I'm patting myself on the back here. Yeah, you are, but we had a. We had a. I was On third with nobody out, and the infield was like kind of halfway enriched on. Lee came up to me and said see the ball through the infield. And and there was a ground ball to the left of the second baseman that he caught and I went home and scored and, and, like to me, this is where I go as far as, like, not all managers have played, or you know.
Speaker 3:Or certain things. But like I scored and and as soon as I sat down, jim Leland came up to me and said, didn't he tell you to see it through? And I'm like, yeah, he told me see when he goes. Oh, why, why'd you go? I'm like, well, there's no way.
Speaker 3:And again, this was my mind working all the times in batting practice. I thinking mentally, every ball hit, what I would do on a situation Well, there's no way a second baseman can go to his left, catch it, turn and throw home and throw me out. So that went through my mind. Even this was only my, I think, my second year in the big leagues, third year in the big leagues but I went through that play in my mind almost every day during batting practice and so I felt that I taught him something, you know, early in my career. Like he asked me, he goes well, why'd you go? And I'm like, well, there's no way you can throw me out going to his left, like that. And he said okay and walked away and I never talked to him about that ever again and he probably don't remember it, but like to me. You know, that's part of baseball and part of learning.
Speaker 1:I mean, if I could you know, I don't know how long guys do it, but I wasn't trying to.
Speaker 3:I just that's what I experienced. It's like that's what you. You know how you think about winning games.
Speaker 1:It makes no sense in the world too, and maybe just something that nobody had thought, or he hadn't thought about, or you know, so that's what's so cool about it.
Speaker 2:That's a competitive edge because you're looking for that win.
Speaker 3:Looking away to win games. Yeah, that's beautiful.
Speaker 1:Finally, just want to go back to the Tommy story because it's hilarious.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I got to hear about Tommy. It's his buddy.
Speaker 1:Tommy. Now he's put down a little friendly bet with a buddy right. Yes, I don't know what year this was 20.
Speaker 3:Yeah, over under and wins. It might have been 20. It might have been the.
Speaker 1:COVID year. I'm in 2020, okay.
Speaker 3:If it wasn't, yeah, it was 20, because there was nobody in the stance, I'm pretty sure it was 2020. Okay, so what? Oh, you want me to share it, yeah? Okay, so we're down the last week of the season or whatever, and I forget what the over maybe it was 21. I don't remember. But I don't remember what the over under was and wins, but we're just sitting here again making stuff up because the game's kind of just going along or whatever, and it's like the ninth inning.
Speaker 1:Well, now during the game, though, however, the pirates are winning, and it seems like they're going to reach this number, whatever it was, of wins not necessarily important to me or the audience, because I'm unaware of this bet that his buddy, tommy has placed with another friend, but apparently I'm like glowing about the pirates, and, as you know, the superstitious span they crush me when I start to, you know yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:So, later between innings he's got his phone out and he's like kept texting back and forth with somebody. And finally, between innings, about the seventh inning, he shows me the text from Tommy. He was saying Tommy says shut up, because if they win this game, I win this bet. And this whole past like 10 days, 11 days. It seemed. The pirates are short to win this number, but they had just kind of fallen apart Stuff one yeah.
Speaker 1:So it looks like he's going to lose the bet without finally. So, lo and behold, the other team was ties it up. Yeah, and he shows me up there, yeah.
Speaker 4:Blankety brown yeah, get it again.
Speaker 1:That's right. So now, who was it? Kevin Newman? No, jacob Stallings. Jacob Stallings gets up. Oh, the Cheetahs got up, cheetah gets up. At like the bottom of the 10th.
Speaker 3:Bottom. Yeah, it's the last. There's a bottom half at home and you know, and again Tommy's pins and needles, and we only have like one or two games left. I forget what it was. And so as soon as Stallings made contact, I don't interrupt these guys, especially in that moment. Yeah, and it was such a bad year. There wasn't many moments. And as soon as the ball is off the bat, I yell Tommy.
Speaker 4:And he yells Tommy.
Speaker 1:So the call and our, our boss at the pirates is going like you, idiot, brown and wainter, like we don't have enough call, like we want to hear and highlight videos. Yeah, you want to have good talk, but you drop it and that's really that's the best moment of the season and you screw it up because nobody knows who Tommy is and you go back and you can watch it on YouTube. The Stallings home run. Stallings asked us later like who's Tommy? By the way, we're going Tommy, so anyway.
Speaker 2:It's the best inside joke. Oh, that's outstanding, the stuff that goes on, tommy.
Speaker 1:Well, uh, rock, this is, hold my cutter, so hold your cut.
Speaker 2:Now that we know he has pitching experience. Yeah, hold your cutter.
Speaker 1:I'll I'll hold the cigar cutter. You hold the baseball cutter. How would you hold your cutter Rock?
Speaker 4:I would, I would guess, like right around there.
Speaker 1:Pretty good.
Speaker 4:Look at those big hands, yeah, oh yeah, I think you can do a nasty cut you throw a good nasty, cutter Nasty.
Speaker 1:Let's do it again sometime, rock.
Speaker 3:Absolutely 100%. I look forward to it. You know who else would like this.
Speaker 1:What fast A lot this podcast, tommy, tommy, tommy.
Speaker 3:Oh wait, a minute Before, before we came, I went and saw Tommy.
Speaker 4:His warehouse is right down the street.
Speaker 3:And on my way here he said what's the name of the cost?
Speaker 4:of the podcast Podcast. So good chance that Tommy Hold my cutter.
Speaker 1:Join us on our next episode. Hold my cutter.