Welcome to The LFG Show, where we dive deep into the transformative world of business and innovation! 🎙 In this episode, join us as we sit down with Boris Shvarts, CEO of Pitch Perfect Solutions, who has revolutionized the call center industry with his innovative revshare model. Discover the secrets behind his approach of charging per billable call rather than per hour, which has proven to outperform traditional onshore and offshore centers. Gain insights into the benefits of this performance-based strategy and the pivotal role of high level industry connections.
We also delve into the high-stakes realm of data-driven marketing, where Boris shares his expertise on compliance, trust, and strategic partnerships. From ensuring buyer engagement to optimizing data costs, he discusses the stringent standards necessary for building and maintaining client trust.
Stay tuned for personal reflections on the contrasts between life in Miami and Toronto, highlighting Miami's vibrant community and business-friendly environment.
Don't miss this episode filled with invaluable wisdom for aspiring entrepreneurs in call centers or anyone fascinated by compelling business stories! 🌟
This episode is proudly sponsored by Ringba. Revolutionize your call center operations with Ringba's cutting-edge solutions. Visit Ringba.com to learn more!
Subscribe to The LFG Show for more insightful episodes on business triumphs and challenges. 🎧
Welcome to The LFG Show, where we dive deep into the transformative world of business and innovation! 🎙 In this episode, join us as we sit down with Boris Shvarts, CEO of Pitch Perfect Solutions, who has revolutionized the call center industry with his innovative revshare model. Discover the secrets behind his approach of charging per billable call rather than per hour, which has proven to outperform traditional onshore and offshore centers. Gain insights into the benefits of this performance-based strategy and the pivotal role of high level industry connections.
We also delve into the high-stakes realm of data-driven marketing, where Boris shares his expertise on compliance, trust, and strategic partnerships. From ensuring buyer engagement to optimizing data costs, he discusses the stringent standards necessary for building and maintaining client trust.
Stay tuned for personal reflections on the contrasts between life in Miami and Toronto, highlighting Miami's vibrant community and business-friendly environment.
Don't miss this episode filled with invaluable wisdom for aspiring entrepreneurs in call centers or anyone fascinated by compelling business stories! 🌟
This episode is proudly sponsored by Ringba. Revolutionize your call center operations with Ringba's cutting-edge solutions. Visit Ringba.com to learn more!
Subscribe to The LFG Show for more insightful episodes on business triumphs and challenges. 🎧
Guys, it's Boris. I'm on the LFG show. Don't forget, we have contactio coming up, the biggest and best show for call centers. If you're going to be in Denver, you need to use promo code LFG.
Speaker 2:Let's fucking go, baby. Save 200 bucks, put that promo code in, get there and make a lot of money. See, boris and I, let's fucking make this happen. We'll be there. Lfg fam. We just shot a fucking banger. Right now, I can't wait till you hear this shit. It's like next level. No one's talking about this. Shout out to our sponsors, because without them, this shit wouldn't be possible. Shout out to Ringba. Shout out to Adam Young the paper call revolution. There's big, big money in paper call. Whether you're someone who's a novice looking to get into it, whether you're someone who's already doing it, putting up big numbers, let's fucking do this. Guys. Get the fucking book on Amazon. We're going to drop a link here. Take your shit to the next level. Let's fucking go. We're back, baby.
Speaker 2:Another episode of the LFG Show. This is episode I got my man, boris Schwartz, over here, ceo of Pitch Perfect Solution. I've known you for a long time, man. Well, it feels a lot longer than it's been, because we've become really especially as I move down here it's been a little closer, you know. But knowing you for many years, I think first time I ever met you was in Dubai, at Affiliate World. Yes, it was Dubai. And one thing I can say, man, is that, bro, you've always been doing well, but I feel like the last, probably last year in particular, you've just blown up man. Yeah, knock on wood, man, knock on wood. Got to say that in business, right. So, first and foremost, congratulations on that. And another thing you know he's getting his hair cut over here Time is money.
Speaker 1:Right Time is money. I'm always well, you know. First off, thank you for everything. I do know you, you know a while in the industry. I feel like you've been, you know one of my closest friends, you know, here since we started and you know we moved down, you know, to Miami together and I'm very grateful for you, bro. And yeah, this year has been amazing and it's just all about you know. You know sticking to it. It took a while for my, you know, like my model, you know, to get like accepted by everybody. Um, but you know it's, it's definitely taken off, yep so let's talk.
Speaker 2:Let's talk about the model and, first and foremost, you know, I'm assuming everyone knows who you are, but there's gonna be people that don't know what you're doing. So can you tell everyone exactly what you do?
Speaker 1:yeah, um, I'm bor Boris Schwartz. You know I own, you know, pitch Perfect Solutions. We're an onshore call center. You know we're based, you know, one of the few, the few, the few remaining. Yeah, we're. We're probably, you know, one of the biggest onshore call centers now. You know we have around 500 agents.
Speaker 1:You know, currently, and our model is very different in terms of, you know, like a BPO, because you know we don't charge per hour. You know you give us data, we dial your data, we transfer to your partner. We have skin in the game because we only charge you per billable call, $20 for a billable call, when my payout is only $40 and I got to still pay for data and I'm paying for your dialer. Well, you know, when you go to one of these offshore call centers, right, when you do the metrics and why I've been able to grow from, you know, one to two to seven to eight to 10 partners. Now is that my biggest. You know, plus is what I do with that lead. So your, your offshore, you know call center will will give you one transfer per hour and they will make you $40 an hour. You know, like in revenue, because you got paid for that. Oh, sorry Even less. You know your offshore call center will give you, you know, you know, 1.5 transfers per hour and the billable conversion is going to be 60%.
Speaker 1:But if an onshore call center like me, who's paid on performance, who has their agents in line every day, at work, every single day, we're doing three an hour and we're converting at 75%, huge, your revenue per hour is now $120.
Speaker 1:So why not pay somebody 60? Yeah, you're making 50% margins and you know, first of all, everything I have in my life and my business is owed to Fluent. Fluent was the first company that gave me a shot at a at big scale, because I don't want to alienate anybody, because you got to shout out to mike valente, because mike valente, a lot of guys know beast and aca beast in medicare, uh, mike valente was actually the first buyer I ever had. A lot of guys know mike valente I forget the name of his company now, um, what you put it like in the edit, um, but mike valente was the biggest, you know, a guy I had at the time until I met fluent, and they really, you know, gave me the ability to scale and get myself to where I am now. So they believe in that model. It worked very well for them, it worked very well for me and now more and more people have adapted that model and I truly feel that sky's the limit.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and speaking of Fluent publicly traded company, I mean I think at one point their market valuation was half a billion dollars, something crazy. So I think what you're trying to say that you got the opportunity, Mike Valenti right, Did well with him, Then it opened up doors with Fluent, right.
Speaker 1:And then you have more doors open up for you is what it comes out to, right? Yeah, the.
Speaker 1:The biggest thing with fluent at the time was and you have- to understand, right, fluence is a massively publicly traded company, right, the call center that I, I was, you know like I had with them. Um, we were only you know 10 of their business, right? So when it comes to like stock prices and all that stuff like that, you know fluent's like, you know like a data company. Yeah, I'm sure, the call center you know like it does well, but you know they're, you know like you go to a meeting there and, like you're, going like to where the world trade center was oh yeah, that beautiful office man.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they're like top floor like you need security to bring you up right. So it's like, um, when it comes in the grand scheme of things, I was just a little part, but what fluent did was my biggest thing is you have to give me data, right? So I was working for a publicly traded company. Like, what do you mean? You're not going to give me, like you're worried to give me data. A publicly traded company was giving me data. Yeah, because that's the biggest thing.
Speaker 1:Like I'm giving this random guy from this random company I never heard about. I'm giving them my data, my precious data, which all dupes out anyway. It's all the same data anyway, but I'm giving them my precious data. Oh, wow, like you know, he's been working with fluent for two years and they're doing very well with him. You know I'm sure he's legit, because he never, because fluent is public. You know they have a lawyer in their office, so they would have got rid of me in one second. So Fluent is the most integral part of my business, other than my Toronto friends. That helped me out more in the beginning to bring me to this side from where I started off with, which wasn't in the affiliate space. I was just like a local call center in Toronto not really, you know in the States.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So what prompted you? So you started off in Canada, right, yeah, with a call center there. Yeah, what prompted you to come to America to set up operations here? And my hat's off to you because obviously there's a. You know it's expensive in America, right. So you got to hire people, hire you gotta incentivize them. So I find, like, what you do it's amazing because I've run calls, I have a call center myself, I know there's a lot of fucking moving parts, especially with 500 agents, man. So you know, hats off to you for that. But like what, what was he? Well, like what prompted you? I mean, that was like an log moment. I gotta get fucking moving, I gotta move somewhere, get, go back to us, get shit moving. Like what, what was that moment? What prompted that, that decision?
Speaker 1:Everything that's ever happened to me in my career and my life, it's all relationships. Yeah, my entire model is based on relationships. Now, and the biggest thing for me at the time was to get into this space, you know, was stan at retriever. You know, I went to high school with stan. I went to middle school with stan, I didn't know that man.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I know, bro, I know, stan I thought you guys knew each other from the industry. Nah bro, I I know stan and uh, the president of inboundscom. I know them since stan and david I. I know them since I was uh, since we were kids in toronto all, we're back.
Speaker 2:We had some. We had a little technical difficulties with the haircut.
Speaker 1:You're looking sharp though by the way, thank you. Thank you so much. Sorry about that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're going to drop the if anyone's in Miami local area. You want someone to come to your office, come to your house, cut you your kids, your mom, your grandma, whatever.
Speaker 1:We're going to a barber shop and sitting there and waiting like, yeah, efficiency, I need somebody in my office every friday morning in my office and we're cutting hair. So I'm sorry about that. But the buzzing, no, it's all good.
Speaker 2:But um, so the question or else we're we're starting to talk about is you move from toronto to the states? Right, you're in miami right now. We move around the same time together. Like what was that? What? What? What was the what prompted you to do that and go from, like you know, vertical you knew nothing about, to get into something like medicare and insurance, like talk about that more, because I feel like that was like an lfg moment for you, like I gotta get the out of here, and then that caused your to start to move in the right direction.
Speaker 1:It uh, it was everything, bro um covid toronto's done, yeah, finished, like worse than anywhere else in the world, yeah we had strict as fuck right, dude, we had I think we had longer lockdowns in china. Wow, uh, we were locked down for like fucking three years, yeah, and my wife's pregnant and the call center is not doing well.
Speaker 1:That I had out there and you know I never asked for the help but I think it naturally came and like my biggest thing and the way I grew up was my mom. You know, God rest her soul. She never let me not like be friends with somebody just because of like how they are Right. Like I was, I'm like I'm friends with the garbage man, like my best friend in miami, like before you moved here, one of my best friends in miami was my valet guy like how I've never seen that.
Speaker 2:The first time I can see you. Yeah, you guy, they all seem to like you a lot. Yeah, the valet guy was like one of my best friends.
Speaker 1:Um, I just, I'm friends with everybody and you know, the biggest moment for me was you know stan, uh, you know stan at retriever man. You know, shout out to stan at retriever. Everyone knows stan, right, but I went to high school with stan yeah, I didn't know that man.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I thought you guys were met through the industry.
Speaker 1:No, I went to. I went to middle school with stan I know, stan since I was, you know, 10, 11 years old, right stan. He was the coolest guy and one of the coolest volleyball players in school, you know, but volleyball- I can't imagine.
Speaker 2:Yeah, kick your ass too as a toy boy tight.
Speaker 1:Now he does jujitsu. Back then he was like a weirdo volleyball guy, um, but you know but the thing about but the thing about stan is and and I said that about my mom to say this that like you know, stan's like a techie nerdy guy, like he's into tech and like naruto and like dragon ball z and like that stuff and like I'm into like basketball and and I'm into you know, you know I like to pop bottles.
Speaker 1:My friends like I like to, you know, like party and he's like, like he likes to watch Dragon Ball Z, but that doesn't matter, like I was still friends with everybody. And and you know people would say it's like, like, it's like an opportunist, it's opportunistic. But like, why is it bad to be an opportunist? You know people would say it's like, like, it's like an opportunist, it's opportunistic. But like, why is it bad to be an opportunist? You know why is it bad to be an opportunist? It shouldn't be bad to be an opportunist. It's it's as long as it's done in like a positive way. And circling back, like, yeah, you know I was friends with Stan and you know he came into my office one day because we randomly see each other and he, you know, he's like, oh, you know, why don't you know, why don't I introduce you to a guy I know in in florida, who also has a call center, who's looking for more agents? You already have these agents here. And you know david brooke, the ceo of inbounds uh, sorry, he's the president of inboundscom. He, uh, you know he's also my childhood friend. Yeah, we all grew up in the same neighborhood, so you know he was already in the states doing it and I was like, yeah, like you know what you know, maybe it's right.
Speaker 1:So, you know I met, you know I'm my old partner, like eric. You know who at the time, you know he was, he was a shark he was. He was the man he taught me I don't know, I don't know medicare. Was I have free health care in canada, right? So, like I don't. I now I know what part a and b is, but like, how I grew up I didn't know that. Yeah, and you know, stan put us together. He was that glue and I owe him everything. I owe stan, my stan and dave and and my early you know guys that helped me, um, eric, I owe them everything. And, um, you know, me and eric didn't work out right, um, but nothing because of business. It was more like his personal he's older a bit and he ended up giving me all his agents for free which, yeah, he gave me all his agents for free and I and then I kept all the americans and we hired up.
Speaker 1:now we're at 500 employees and everything is already done, but, yeah, relationship-based. If it wasn't for me being friends with Stan in middle school, I would never be where I'm at now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I think if you ask him why he agreed to do that with you is because you obviously did something right. It's like those little things that add up. Your story reminds me of me, because that's how I cracked to solar. I had a buddy of mine and who actually I was his supervisor in the call center. I didn't own this call center. It's like fuck, I was 25, 28. This was a big club promoter in New Jersey. I was like I really went above and beyond for the guy. He became one of the best reps. He became a supervisor and a manager. Like six years later he got an opportunity to grow a call center in solar and I was helping them every step of the way. He'd call me at midnight. I'm like, hey, this is what you do. Then I started selling them leads. Eight years later, I'm still selling that company leads right, he's not there anymore. But he blew that call center up. They went from doing $14 million in revenue to $500 million a year and I was their top lead provider. I've probably done eight figures with this group, right.
Speaker 2:But that guy's name is Adam Gug Stan. I know, I know I had known Adam for a long time, but he'd always say Dave was, he spoke really highly of me. Dave's the man, he's going to do the right thing. All these other lead vendors, you know they're ripping you off. He won't do that. And I didn't. I didn't, I did exactly what he said. I treated them right and boom, one thing led to another. So it's kind of like the same story, just different vertical, different country, you know.
Speaker 1:but same shit. Yeah, but I literally think that that's how everyone should start. Yeah, um. And also like circling back to like fluent and mike valenti, like, yeah, I didn't make money for six months. I had a call with everybody in the industry, everybody. I spoke to brandon bowski before he was, you know, the big guy at minerva. I spoke to er Eric from QuoteStorm Six months of just calls Jonathan Akeem owe a lot to him.
Speaker 1:He used to be like a North Star. He's at ISI, now Calls mentoring. I can't do anything for you now, but go to Dubai, you'll meet somebody there. I can't do anything for you right now, but you should go to Vegas because you'll meet people at these shows. Yeah, right, and you know that's how it happened. I did not make a penny for six months and I wanted to quit a lot.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because I came from a whole different world where, you know, I, I didn't come here like I, I didn't start in the industry, you know, with a job, I came with a mortgage. Yeah, I already had a mortgage and a pregnant wife. I had to do things quick. Yeah, um, and I threw up. My whole motto is I literally threw everything on the wall and one thing stuck and that was fluent, and if it wasn't for fluent again, I wouldn't be where I'm at now, but I had to take those calls.
Speaker 1:I used to take calls at, you know, seven o'clock at night, eight o'clock at night. Right, I remember, um, you know, I remember being on the phone with, with, with, with, with people that I see at shows now and like I don't even know if they remember, like I don't know if Eric from quote storm he's he's elsewhere now but I don't know if Eric from quote storm would remember that he said I used to be on the phone with him at eight o'clock at night. I don't know if he'll, if he'll remember that, like I know bowski does right, because he's still my friend, I still talk to bowski all the time. Um, but these guys remember and a lot of them like remember, you know how it was because I was a pest, I'm not, I'm not, I'm not, like I might act like a cool guy at the conference now no you're on top of your shit, yeah but I'm
Speaker 1:if I need the business, I'm there. I'm flying to north carolina, I'm walking right in your office. If I have to right um, and yeah it. It took a lot of that to prove the model out and for people to give me a chance, and there's a lot of people that are have sold now and are out of the industry. You know whether it's you know, anthony or these guys that all sold. But you know, you know, stan, stan put me in contact with these guys and he's like, hey, hey, listen, you know he has a good call center, because the call center was good. Stan wasn't just introducing me to people for no reason.
Speaker 2:I had a reputation in the line too. Yeah, if you're not delivering, they're not going to like fuck you. You know a hundred percent I had a good time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I I had. I had a hard time. It turned to a good time, but it I think it's needed to bring me to where I'm at now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly, that's a great story and you told me some stuff. I know a lot about your history. I didn't know about the very beginning of that, about those six months of not getting paid. I mean, that's what happened to me and I think it's a parallel to a lot of entrepreneurs You're not going to make. Everyone sees what's going on now. They'll look at you, watch you're wearing or whatever, but they don't see those fucking six months. They don't see that struggle. You talk to your wife like, oh fuck, you might have to go back to work. I was in the same position myself, right, you have to go through that crap, man, to get to where you're at, man, and it takes time, and that's when most people give up. For the 90%, people give up and then that's where they get fucked. So hats off to you for that I stress a lot.
Speaker 1:I have a lot of employees. I tell my employees all the time I have like 10 senior staff that I deal with on a daily basis. Obviously I can't talk to every agent I have, but I have, like I have like the 10 that like you know, that you know they run my company, basically as far as, like the agent. I tell them all the time I say you know Brandon agencies, now my cto, right, if the company went under tomorrow, right, you would hate me because you lost your paycheck, your hundred, you know, your couple hundred thousand dollar your salary.
Speaker 1:You lost it. Boris is a loser. He fucked up. I'd have a paycheck. But brandon, I gotta go to sleep that night. And those 500 agents I have, they have families, they have kids. There's 1,500 to 2,000 people that depend on me every single day to wake up and make sure that partner A is buying calls. That's my job. So if I freak out in the morning meeting and I say something that I shouldn't say, I have a lot on my plate too. Yeah, right, so it's all about how you use the stress, right? The stress is supposed to motivate you. This isn't for everybody. Managing people is a very hard thing to do, right? So you need to be able to take the blessings that you've been given, but you still got to work your way around a lot of shit. Me and David share offices. I don't know if you guys know we're in the same building. If I'm not yelling on my side, david's yelling on his side. So you need to stress to make money. That's how I feel.
Speaker 2:It's because you care. And I got to tell you. We ran some campaigns together and I referred some people like heavy hitters to you and they say the same thing. I mean, I saw that when I worked with you and that's probably one of the reasons why I made that referral, because I know these were so heavy. You know big time people.
Speaker 2:I'm like, listen, this guy's not gonna let you down, he's on top of this shit. It's like the old school stuff. It's stuff that people forget nowadays, especially the younger generation. Pick up the phone you would call hey, how are we doing? Hey, this is what's going on. You were updating all the time and apparently that's what you're doing with this group too, and they love it. They're I love it, he's on top of his stuff, right? So when you said about pestering, I laughed because I remember that when I, when I, we were running campaigns together, that you but it was good, I love that you did that, because that's what I do. It shows that you care, because if you didn't give a fuck, I mean then you, you're not. Listen, those 500 employees, there's a chance they lose their job. The more that you care, the more you stress it's you're stressing because you. It's for a bigger good. It's for your family, it's for your sons, it's for their future, your future, our future, everyone's future, right, so it's all connected at the end of the day.
Speaker 1:Yeah 100 and, uh, you know you have to stress and you have to stay on top of your shit, bro, what do you mean? Like, um, people are giving me data, right, they're giving me data that they paid for. Like they need these calls done. It's like I, you know they don't want to hear that the internet's down. So what, like it's, it's my problem.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so, like all this stuff, like I got you know, and for my rep share model, dave, like it's, it has to be the perfect storm. You understand, like, for this to work, I need data. The call center has to be open, the agents need to be at work, retriever needs to work right, the buyers need to pick up the phone. Yeah, for this to work, we all need to be in synergy and I'm glad you mentioned that, because me and you did work together in the beginning, right, and we mean you fought like we didn't fist fight, but we fought on the phone and we're friends and it was messed up for like a week until we see each other, we hugged it out and we laughed.
Speaker 1:But there's a lot of pressure. You're giving me expensive data. Why aren't I dialing on the data? I'm telling you that the buyer's not answering the phone. You're in Dubai, you're calling me at six in the morning. I'm already. I'm still sleeping. Right, you had, you know you had a few drinks, I had a few drinks and we're perfect storm. And the account manager that's running my account. If it's a big company right that I'm working with the account manager needs to be on my, on the same pages as my team, and if it's a smaller company, the data needs to be there at all times.
Speaker 3:Age data. There's only a few months left of this. A lot of different ways to monetize data. Data is a very broad term. There's a lot more money in it. You already spent the money. Let's just say it costs you $10 for a Medicare. You make a million dollars in sales. You really only made a hundred thousand bucks and you might not get paid by your advertiser. What if I can get an extra 50 cents dollar, $2, $3 per lead in perpetuity? What does that do to my marketing campaign? What does that do for the stress of the profits of my company? A percentage or two at those kind of numbers are huge as moving the needle. So for us, what I love about age data, the hard part's already been done. Now it's just the revenue left for your company. What would the extra $10,000, $20,000, $30,000 a week do for your business? Absolutely All of our big partners are making hundreds of thousands, if not millions, a year with us they're never going to have this gold rush again.
Speaker 2:Yep, 100%. I'm glad you mentioned that too, because if you were going to watch this show, you're going to get hit up for requests or whoever on your team is going to hit up requests, but I want them to know what are their. You tell them what's their criteria. If someone to work percent qualify or it's a right storm like you're talking about, so for you, what is it? The perfect client?
Speaker 1:for me has a lot of data. Okay, the perfect client for me needs to have a lot of data. They need to have a buyer that has a demand, right, because first of all, these calls get transferred on a rev share. So if the buyers aren't answering the phone, I'll turn you off in like 10 seconds Because you're losing money. I'm losing money. It's on a rev share.
Speaker 1:If I can't make that transfer, I pay my agents on gross transfers. I don't pay my agents on billables. How do I tell a call center agent from Nebraska that he's not making money? Because the buyer denies the phone stuff. He doesn't give a fuck about the buyer. He doesn't know what the fuck a buyer is. He knows he gets paid hourly plus commission, right? So I gotta pay on raw transfers. Yeah, it doesn't matter. So the the billable rate better be high, right? So I have some of the best billable rates in aca history.
Speaker 1:Somebody will come to my, come to my office or have a meeting with me and say, yeah, we, we start. You know we're right at 30 billable. I'm like, dude, it's not gonna work out. You have to pay me 30 an hour. Yeah, he's like why? I'm like because your bill breaks 30. I pay on raw tranches. My bill rate 60. One proof here's retriever go look at it. Yeah, right. Well, how is it? Oh, because we do warm transfers, right.
Speaker 1:The biggest hurdle I've had in this business, uh dave, is inbound revolution. Remember the inbound revolution? Yeah, scared a lot of guys that mean you right, the inbound revolution two years ago was, was bad. Oh, boris man, I don't know, you're not gonna get needed in two years. Now there's fucking lawsuits and everyone's begging me for warm transfers because the inbound revolution turns out that the, that the inbounds weren't compliant, right? Yeah, um, because transfers weren't compliant, but now the inbounds aren't compliant, right. So it's a perfect storm. So you need to have data, you need to have a buyer, you need to have an account rep on it at all times, because somebody needs to be watching the buyer side. I don't need to speak to your buyer. I have partners that I've had since I started. I don't talk to their account rep at Slack, well, but Aragon's on that shit all day. I have a whole team in my Slack channel that are on their shit all day. Shout out to Alec, my man.
Speaker 1:Aragon's the greatest right, but if it's not like that it's, it's a problem. We need somebody on their side watching it all day, because they're giving me expensive data and if I can't for it, they don't make money. Yeah, that's why it's a true partnership. A rev share is a true partnership. You want to give shit data to somebody and pay per hour? You know you should just go offshore or go to a different bpo that charges hourly for me. You want performance, you're paying more, but you're making more, so it's a no-brainer. Yeah, and that's why publicly traded companies use me, because it's not just them looking at their books, it it's people. It's you know. They have like teams that look at their books and they see what's more profitable.
Speaker 3:I don't got to tell it to you, I'm sure you know.
Speaker 1:Zeta, you know, has people there that see, you know what's more profitable uh, offshore BPO or pitch perfect solutions. And they choose pitch perfect all the time.
Speaker 2:Well, yeah, the proof's in the pudding. Obviously, you mentioned, mentioned big names and again, I made some referrals to you and they know they're. I told you they're really apt and I make, and that makes me feel good because I'm like they know that if I'm bringing something to the table, they're gonna, they're gonna listen to me. It's like another notch under my belt, right. So every everybody, at the end of the day, everybody wins. So and and I'd say another thing about the a lot of people are scared especially the cost of world to do a pay for for performance model. So I show I think it shows confidence in what you do that you know your shit is tight and it's not like you came out of nowhere.
Speaker 2:You've been doing this for years and years and years, right To get to this point. You got systems in place. You show me your dashboards. You show me your quality insurance. You show me I remember we were in the beach a couple of years ago with our wives, right before New Year's, and you were showing me all this stuff. I'm like I love that. You showed me that you didn't have to show that to me, but you showed it to me. You can't fake that you go right to the URLs. It's not bullshit and I saw it firsthand. So the proof's in the pudding. There's a lot of the big saying in New York money talks, bullshit walks, but you were showing me everything. We went on a hoot and I saw it with you. And the fact that you can do it onshore pay for performance versus you know everyone that's doing this hourly thing. I think it says a lot about what you're doing.
Speaker 1:No for sure, and you know you know like what if, for example, right, you know you're, you're very close with them and you know they're one of my biggest. You know, like you know, partners now and it's the same thing me have your personal data. You have to know that I'm not using your data anywhere else. You have to see my agent performance and and, um, you know, like. You know talking about what if, because you know I'm thinking about it now but, like you know, it's not always easy because they're used to working with with bpos hourly. But then you have me and my team slack. No agent, no agent, no agent, no agent, no agent. I don't get paid for no agent, yeah, and if I do get paid for no agent on a duration, my CPA is going to be high the next day and you're not going to want me. I need to have a low CPA. I dream about CPA. That's awesome. I dream about CPA. I have nightmares about CPA. A nightmare for me is like I had a $400 CPA and somebody wants to turn me off about it.
Speaker 1:My model if I'm doing Medicare, if I'm doing ACA, for example, right, my call center agents know I have quality assurance If you transfer somebody over without double or triple confirming no Medicare and no Medicaid and no work insurance, you're going to get fired. There's no like if ands or maybes these are subcontracts. You're done like if answer maybe these are subcontracts. You're done because every bad call is a note from the agents to you know synergies agent saying that we transferred over. I'll refund you that call. Yeah, because I'm supposed to do my job. So I put a lot of pressure on myself from the beginning to make sure that the partnership works and you know, sometimes it doesn't work. You know me and you were talking about it. You know off the air. You know the biggest how i't work. You know me and you were talking about it. You know off the air. You know the biggest how I got, how I grew so much in a year right, yeah, cause I was saying you feel like you.
Speaker 2:you exploded the last year, year and a half, right?
Speaker 1:That's when you were like so when I got fluent I was like exclusive with fluent.
Speaker 1:We never had the partnership agreement like signed, but like I was exclusive with them right, like so grateful to them, like you know, I have people in my ear at the time, like, oh, but like I don't want to hurt, you know, anybody affluent, because it's true, like, if we're doing because, because we're at scale, right, so if you're, if you're selling 3 000 calls a day, you know, to a medicare buyer, right, and then you start dialing somebody else's data and you're and, and it's going to dupe out, because you know, because, because data is all the same, right, and you start selling to a different buyer, you're going to start teetering cpas, right, and the buyer is going to start knowing. So the biggest thing for me and the worst thing for me was when fluent turned me off. So fluent term like but turn me off, why fluent went through their issue, right, you know, they had an issue and they didn't generate enough data to give me anymore because I do need a lot of data. Right, they never like turned me off. They said, hey, man, you know, when we finish ap a couple years ago, when we finish AP, you know we're not going to be able to go into OEP, we're just going to focus on growing our internal.
Speaker 1:And at the time, bro, like you remember this, yeah, I was done. I told my wife she might have to go back to work, literally and we just had a second kid, or she was already pregnant with the second kid. It was the worst thing ever because I had all my eggs in one basket, everything. I was just them and I don't know how or how it happened, bro, but it made me so much better losing them because I was able to come out. I came out of the closet. Right, I'm out of the closet. Everyone knows that I'm a free agent now and it was crazy, because now it's like people like want me, yeah, like I was wanted again, like I was like wow, like everybody wants to work with me now, like, oh, that's a fluent that had a fluent call center and I went from one partner to eight.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and eight good partners too, and not just like eight, whatever a mediocre, whatever, eight good partners yeah, and I and my team knows very well, every single partner gets a good morning message happy, happy Friday.
Speaker 3:Let's kill it today?
Speaker 1:Yeah, where I have, I treat the same partners the same. Whether it's you know a couple hundred thousand dollars a month invoice or you're paying me a million dollars a month, everyone gets treated the same. And if I'm if I'm if I'm in Jersey, I'll always reach out to whoever I know is in Jersey to grab lunch, and if I'm at a show and we have a table, it'd be like you know. You know how like me and my friends like to do it from Toronto, right, Um, everyone's going to get the invite?
Speaker 2:No one's going to.
Speaker 1:I like to bring people together.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love it, man. So you mentioned right, and then you mentioned your buddies from Toronto, right, and you have a very interesting, very unique and unorthodox way of hiring people, I guess like the C-level right, that's what you would call it and you see that we talk about partying, popping bottles, or we party a lot of places all over the country, all over the world, but that C level, those people in your inner circle, they're all your friends, which is kind of contrary to what people tell you to do. Most people are like, oh, don't hire your friends because it's going to lead to this or lead to that, but in your case it's only helped you out. So I want to talk about that because I find that very fascinating. It's almost like fucking entourage man. You bring your whole crew and everyone's making money. I modeled my whole life after entourage. We all grew up. It's our generation.
Speaker 1:We, um, you know, we grew up, listen, toronto is a small city. It's major, it's a metropolis, right, but you know, it's a small city. Everyone that I'm friends with right now, these days, um, the small, the circle gets smaller. You know how it gets. When you're older, you start, you start, you know, but I have to have my people beside me at all times. Right, I'm not a rapper, right, I'm not a, you know, kingpin of some sort that. But I model, I modeled my company in the same way, and let me explain to you why.
Speaker 1:You go to a show, right, and you see whatever. You see a random CTO at a show, right, and they worked at one company, but now they're at a different company. Now they're at a different company. That stuff's crazy. You see a lot of that. Yeah, to me that's crazy. Like, what do you mean? You're going to leave my company and go tell the other company how to make money the way I make money? That's nuts to me. Right, if Amr leaves my company? Right, my CMO, if he leaves my company, we're never speaking again. Bro, what do you mean? We're childhood friends. You're going to leave my company? I put you on this whole thing. Like, how are you going to leave my company? So, as much as it looks weird to see Boris you know Amr, you know Brandon, you know amr, you know brandon, you know jp right to stand to seem to see the guys I roll with, to see my actual team pitch perfect solutions, my c-level team, as much as it's weird to like yeah, that guy's wearing like chains and like he looks like he's maybe shouldn't be here, I think people like me for it. It's authentic man. You see, you're my competition travis is chilling with us. He's wearing amherst chains and everyone's like loving and he's doing great. Yeah, he's doing incredible.
Speaker 1:Because what is a cto? Right, what is a cto? It's a guy. That's your cto, it's your cmo, it's your marketing officer, what is it? It's a guy that worked somewhere that learned how to do something and he was promoted. But why not teach your friend that you trust? Right, I have $2 million a month in payroll. $2 million a month. I have to pay out every single month to my agents. Right, I'm a Canadian call center, us call center. My employees are split down the middle. I get paid in the us. Right, I got to bring that money sometimes. Well, I gotta bring half that money to canada, pay taxes in canada on it, but then somebody in canada has to take that money and bring it to payworks and pay my employees. I'm going to trust somebody off the street to handle a million dollars my money. No way. It's my cousin, alex alex's. Alex pays all my employees because if alex, if alex, steals from me, then at that point I deserve it because it's my actual cousin that's stealing from me.
Speaker 1:Maybe it's entourage, maybe it's you know, you know, maybe it's it's my the way I have. I'm thinking, but the best thing you can do in life I was taught as a kid is put somebody in the position to make money. I'm going to be flying with these guys on private jets and I'm not going to bring my childhood friends Are you kidding me.
Speaker 2:I'm glad you mentioned that because you do a lot of that, man. We follow each other online and I see a lot of that.
Speaker 1:Guys, don't believe the private jet hype. Let me explain to you how the private jet works. Sorry for all my friends who are going to look like cheapos right now. All right, look, you got a private jet. The private jet costs 40 grand, right, you put 20 guys on the jet. How much that jet cost? Two grand two grand each, right. A flight from miami to vegas is 1400 in business class, right? You're not going to pay 600 extra to take a private jet, of course, yeah and then it's a great experience.
Speaker 1:And then we're all fighting for the invoice to write it off anyway, yeah, right. So yeah, we're on, we're flying private, but we're paying a couple thousand bucks each. Let's not blow it out of proportion that we spent that. No one's spending 40k for that jet. You know up and down. Now, look, that's how my circle does it, that's how my team does it, but I'm sure there's other companies that do it themselves. They get the whole jet themselves, right, shout out to ring, but they get a jet. They invite me, you know shout, know, shout out to, you know, to other companies that invite me. But I think the whole thing like, sometimes you go and you'll go oh, there's the rich kids that came on a jet, bro.
Speaker 1:It paid two grand. Like, leave me alone, bro. Like you flew to Boca and paid 1400, paid 600 more. I'm on a jet.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you want to do it, you do it. No, I know, but you know it's good for morale too. They do that. It makes them feel good, that makes them more loyal to you. Everybody wins at the end of the day, 100 and then you're on with other people you can do business with. I was on one of these flights with a freaking way under the radar, uh, media buyer. No one would have known this guy I'm. He's on the jet boom. Now we're doing business together. So it's also that proximity that you get that you wouldn't get anywhere else yeah, you meet, you meet, yeah, you get.
Speaker 1:First of all, you're five hours with somebody, you're on a jet, you're really you know, you're really close to them. You're gonna, you're gonna start talking about business. And it goes back to the same thing like how can I be posting Instagram pictures on a private jet when I have friends in Canada that I could actually help and bring them to a new industry? I could actually help them, change their life and change their life. How can I not do that when somebody did it for me?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's great, and that goes to show you and the thing about business, man, there's really, there's no set rules, right? Most people would say, oh, don't ever hire friends, don't hire this person, that person my wife has been instrumental to the growth of our company. Be like, don't hire your wife because maybe it doesn't work. And they said but every scenario is different to what it comes down to. So maybe for 90% of people who are hiring friends won't work, maybe 95%, 98%, but you're one of those exceptions. You're one of those one to five percent exceptions where it does work. And I think, because you have this, create this interesting dynamic where it's a tight circle in toronto, right, and you're just really tight with these guys, always did the right thing. You're a people, person. All these things add up to make that circumstance work.
Speaker 2:So just because someone says, oh, don't ever hire friends, I mean you have that gut feeling. I would say give it a shot. If it doesn't work, it didn't fucking work. And what if it does work though? Right, and that's how. That's what business is. We're always trying new ideas out, right. We're trying to figure out is this going to work? Most times it's not going to work, but when it does work.
Speaker 1:My god you just hit a fucking gold mine but you know you can't help everybody. Yeah right, you can't like go by and get your whole, your whole childhood circle right. People are going to fall off. You know people have families, people have lives right. But but you know, you it's something. First of all, this whole thing is like I didn't, I didn't pick up amr or brandon or jp and I don't like the floor and like come into a new industry and like teach them and like now these guys brought something to the table right, yeah, I'm glad you mentioned that you know.
Speaker 1:So what are you going to bring to the table? All right, so do you know somebody? Yeah, bro, I know, I know. I actually know this buyer. He's buying a shit. Ton of aca calls word. All right, this is how you do, like inbounds. Go talk to this guy. We'll start a new company together. Boom, you're my cmo. That's how you do. He brought something to the table.
Speaker 1:I didn't just bring anybody in you, alex went to school for marketing. Right, alex went to school for marketing. He is just my friend, but instead of working for you know, procter and gamble and make 60k a year, I'll give you 100k. Come work with me and I trust you.
Speaker 1:Right, jp was bro my, because you haven't met jp yet, but my like, like, uh, like, chief revenue officer, right, he was the manager of the td bank. Wow, that I would go to every day and like I would go there with my payroll and I'm supposed to do it there in front of them. When I just started, I had like 30, 40 employees, so I would just I would go and do payroll at the bank. Like can you imagine? Because in Canada it's different, you can't have wires on the computer, wow, so you have to go to the bank and fund payroll and JP used to grab. You know he used to grab the paper and be like, oh, I'll do it, bro, you can go. And I was like, wow, bro, and I used to always tell him, if you ever need anything, if you ever want to leave the bank, he's a manager of the bank, he's a TD bank manager.
Speaker 1:It's not the craziest job, but you know you call him gp. It's emergency. Please, please, please, please, please. Uh, you know someone's gonna come bring you a check. You need to cash it because I need to pay my staff in vegas. I'm black out in vegas. It's 4 pm. I don't know what the fuck is going on. You know, you know how it gets in vegas the chandelier, market spot man.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and then he called me one day yeah, he's like yo, I'm on a leave, I want to come work with you. Yeah, at the time I was like fuck dude, another guy, I got a babysit, but it's been the best thing I ever did in my life. Yeah, that's amazing. Yeah, because I think you get good karma from it. I truly believe it. There's gonna be. There's gonna come a time in my life, though, for sure, where it can't be perfect. Right, there's always a story someone's gonna fuck me and something bad's gonna happen. It's something and somebody's gonna leave me, but it'll just be a lesson. At that time, I'm and I'm ready for it. If one of my best friends fucking me over and and, and you know, take data and rob me or do whatever the hell they do, it's my, it's it's it's on my, it's me on the chin, because random people rob people all the time.
Speaker 2:So it wasn't meant to be. You move on, right, that's the thing. We just keep moving on, great stuff, man. Now let's get back to the, the call center in particular. Right, everyone likes numbers. What's the? I know we talked about this in vegas. Here we did you're. I think you were the first interview I did for the show, actually like we did one of those short interviews here, it's so funny on that for sure you have to be standing right.
Speaker 2:Let's do a freaking interview, but I know you're talking about thousands per day. What, what's? What's the most volume you've ever done in a day in terms of transfers?
Speaker 1:um, I did. Probably the most I did in a day was a couple of weeks ago. I did 10,000 billable calls in one day.
Speaker 2:That's crazy. That's a huge, huge number man.
Speaker 1:ACA, aca, um transfers kind of, you know, changed a lot for me because because Medicare, you know I'm an insurance guy. I don't do much out of insurance. I do a little stuff here and there, but, um, medicare, you know I do a little stuff here and there, but Medicare, you know I do a lot of Medicare, always. Medicare is always my number one. But ACA, you know, has gotten me to a bigger level where I can employ a lot more people because there's a huge demand for.
Speaker 3:ACA transfers Massive.
Speaker 1:And that's my biggest day ever was 10,000 billable calls.
Speaker 2:Wow, and I was just thinking about, as you were talking, one of the issues we were both at Geek Out right A few weeks I don't know when, that was a month ago in New York a lot of nervousness in the air about ACA. People owed a lot of money for it and people were like what the fuck? That's what I did. They had all their eggs in one basket one basket, like you did at one point, like I did at one point. Right, like what are we? What am I supposed to do? So now you're going to see, you know what happens, who who adopts, who shifts properly, right.
Speaker 2:But as I was thinking, as you spoke, I think one of the one of the issues happening these crazy ads and whatever people were trying to create volume, uh, and what happened was they started doing some dumb shit. So the point is that when you're doing with a transfer, you weed out, you sift through all that the garbage shit, right, someone's not really not interested or pissed off. You get rid of that stuff and then you're delivering someone that, listen, it's not going to be perfect now, all those 10 000 were perfect, but the percentages are going to add up for the buyer at the end of the day because you're doing all that stuff. So that's really where the value comes in. That you were talking about saving time with the barber coming here whatever.
Speaker 1:You're saving a lot of time from having to do all that fucking heavy lifting yeah, which, like imagine you owned a Medicare agency, right, and the calls weren't like or that weren't being like you know, probably done. These people are clicking ads Like they're not like bro, like you're a media buyer Everyone knows obviously there's huge lawsuits right now for it Right Inbound. You know media buyers not everybody was running what they were supposed to be running facebook every day that really actually want medicare advantage plans or really want to go into the marketplace for aca right.
Speaker 1:At the end of the day, bro, a lot of these guys that everything that went to shit, a lot of these ads weren't compliant ads and people were calling in and asking about shit that has nothing to do for medicare advantage, right, it has nothing to do about. And just because it's inbound, it's compliant. Yeah, how does that make sense? What about what they clicked right? So I don't care about how anyone makes their money I wish everybody makes the most money ever but regulations coming down on inbound calls and and creatives in general, you know, is probably better, you know, for the market and the grand scheme of things.
Speaker 1:I believe that. I believe that this all could all be done. You know like it could be done, like a right way. So could inbound calls? Inbound calls is never going to die and, in my opinion, what I believe it could be different than what you know a guy like adam young would believe, or a guy like you know, like trauma, would believe. I believe personally that there will always be, you know, outbound dialing. Yeah, I personally believe that, and if it's different I'll adapt to, I'll figure out what I have to do. But my business is is mostly dialing outbound on leads, right, the. You know the regulations are probably going to change this year. It's going to be hard to dial on cold reg but we'll do one-to-one consent. It'll cost more leads.
Speaker 1:You know buyers need to call us. We'll pay more.
Speaker 2:I was going to ask you about the how are you going to adapt? And going back to you know, I was a federal DNC. List got passed in 2003 or 2004. I was a bond broker and I remember getting out of college I went to NYU and I started to make some money and I'm like what the fuck, man, I just get out of college, finally start to make money. They pass this federal DNC. People were freaking out but, bro, it kept. 20 years later it's still going on. You're right, there's always going to be a form of outbound dialing, what one way or the other, whether it's a single consent or whatever it is. But the fact is that you got a good name in the industry. You're making it work the way it is now. You're not gonna you're gonna stop making it work. Maybe. Maybe it becomes more expensive to generate that lead, but whatever, as long as you're still making money profitably, everyone's people are going to do it. They have to adapt.
Speaker 1:That's what it comes down to yeah, and, like you know, first of all there's no rules out yet, so everyone's just just like nothing's been decided.
Speaker 1:There's lawsuits going on, there's a lot going on, right? So I think everybody should just wait and like, just like last year, when the rules do come out, how are you going to adapt? Yep, there's always going to be people that fall off it's life. People are going to fall off, people are going to, you know, change. And hey, just because you were a great aca media buyer, it doesn't mean that you should stop working just because ACA might not work for you anymore. Go sell, you know, ozempic or something you know. Go sell Ozempic ads, go do Ozempic ads. Or or or go do debt. You know there's always new verticals coming out and I can't wait. You know I'm, I'm really. It's so cool how, like this industry is like normally, like understands it, like you know, you go, you go to dinner. Like you can't tell people what you do, because I don't even know what I do. I don't know what it's called. Is it medicare marketing? Is it am I?
Speaker 2:a call, I say digital marketing. Man, that's what I say. It's like a legion digital marketing. Yeah, people don't even know what the fuck that is. Yeah, you're like legion.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, miami, legion. Um, there's always something new coming out, you know, and there's always products coming out to help my very good friend, david and Leo at Inbounds, they're working on some revolutionary stuff.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I just interviewed Leo for the show. It was amazing, true call.
Speaker 1:That's only going to make me better. It's going to hurt people. It's going to hurt people.
Speaker 1:The ones that are doing bullshit, exactly, but it's going to police the industry. You need that. You need somebody to come into police because, if not, they come in in one day, the feds, and they don't give a fuck who makes this the right way. They shut it all down. So wouldn't you rather do it the right way? And when it comes to one, uh, the one-to-one consent and all that stuff that's changing. Everyone that I've spoken to, as far as my partners currently, and the big aggregators out there, they're all working towards the one-to-one consent and I honestly feel and I truly believe not being like a positive guy, because I'm not really that positive, to be honest with you, um, I'm a realist, yeah, I'm a realist. I truly believe in my heart that, um, this will be better for that, for me, and it'll be better for you, and it'll be better for data as a whole yeah, yeah, I agree.
Speaker 2:I'm glad you brought up another thing. So you got this regulation everyone's preparing. We're waiting to see what happens. What's your thoughts about ai stuff going on and how would it affect your industry?
Speaker 1:ai. Yeah, it's funny ai. Um, a lot of my friends are in ai right, rand and bowski has a great ai company right now. Um, you know, a lot of the guys are in ai. There's a lot of good stuff to come from ai, in my opinion, without alienating anybody. And people are going to message me and say, oh, you talk shit about my company. No, let me ask you, david, all right, when you order a pizza you love, david loves pizza. Everyone knows that when you order a pizza right and the girl and the ai comes on from domino's, you press zero to talk to a real person.
Speaker 2:But first I want to call Domino's, which I don't fucking know. You go to New York and Jersey. I want to say why is there so many fucking Domino's there and Papa John's Like who the fuck's ordering? That's got to be people that just moved to the country. They don't know shit, right. You know what fuck the domino, fuck the pizza, because david's like, uh, yeah, I'm getting pissed off, he's the dave, he's the dave portnoy of the industry guy enjoy the roll band too, exactly so let's just say you're calling, you know ups to you know to track a package.
Speaker 1:Actually, though, like answer, really do you really? Do you listen to that avatar, the ai, or do you press zero to speak to?
Speaker 2:a real person. I always I most of the time, 80, 90 percent of time I press zero yeah all right.
Speaker 1:So imagine you're literally switching your medicare benefits. Are you going to speak to ai? Um, no, I'd rather talk to a live person. So that, to me, that's my opinion. Maybe, though, it'll become one-to-one and you'll never know, and maybe maybe it'll help me. Then I'll just, I'll develop my own ai company, or I'll partner with brandon, I'll use his ai agents, right, yeah, but as of right now, where the market is, I personally feel that my business is better with humans, right? That's how I feel without alienating anybody because it could work.
Speaker 1:maybe it'll work, who knows? But in my personal business, the way I feed my family is with real people, and I like to talk to real people.
Speaker 2:And I think it's not only that You're a performance model, it's more a sales model, right? I feel like the AI works very well for customer service, right? That's where it has more value than it does with sales. Sales is emotion Retention. Yeah, that emotion is what draws a person to say, yeah, we fall in love with our, with wise voices, whatever the hell you want to call it because of emotion, right? So I feel like that. That emotion is what you get from a live person on the phone and you're getting. Maybe they do change that. I think that's going to take a while, so that's why I think that, at the end of the day, I think that you're fine, people like me are fine, but who knows, who knows where it's going to go with this sort of thing. But, yeah, I agree that that's a good example.
Speaker 1:And look if if, if it changes in 10 years, do you want to be working in 10 years like? That's true we're getting old, so like yeah, let the next generation deal with it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, listen, does it?
Speaker 1:does it keep you up at night a little bit the ai not really doesn't.
Speaker 2:No, it doesn't at all. Yeah, it keeps. I mean, it's good to know I know what I what's going on. I'm always on top of stuff or what's happening and anything. We adapt. At the end of the day, that's what we're talking about People going from one vertical to another. Once you know how to sell, once you know how to media buy, you don't just got to be stuck in one box. There's other boxes you can get into and then most of the boxes aren't going going to work when you flip them over. But when you find the one that works, you press the gas on and hopefully get two or three that work.
Speaker 2:I did this shit years ago. I started seeing direct marketing. I merged with Ed Payne connecting the dots. We got all this different stuff going on. I'm still doing that shit to this day. I was talking offline about some stuff that's fucking working for me right now, thank God, because solar started going the other way. It doesn't look like it's getting better Now. I got a whole new vertical popping all the fucking sudden out of nowhere. I got a buyer ready to do a million dollars a month for me right now. I was just talking to him earlier. I'm freaking pumped but you got to try other boxes, right. But once you have that skill set, you're always going to be okay. So I feel like people like us hopefully everyone watching this show just work on your skills. You always were a good people person no-transcript.
Speaker 1:Never know. You never know what you'll find there. Yeah, you never know what you'll find there, because the guys that, the guys that started marketing aca first, all those guys are retired now. Yeah, the first ones are the ones that really kill it, right. And then you know, there's there's probably guys that came into aca two years ago, two months ago, and dumped a lot of money and didn't even get paid on their invoice.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they yeah, they caught, they caught, they caught. The top is what it is and I catch the wave yeah, you gotta catch the wave.
Speaker 2:Speaking of shows, that's what we last year we were in. Uh, was it barcelona a year ago? Exactly, you were. It's funny because one of my buddies said I don't know, I'm not going to go out, and blah, blah, he wound up going out. Then I saw you and I connected you guys. It was at a party. Whatever you guys connect. Now you guys are making a lot of money together, right, and that's that's the beauty. That's why you got to show up, man, and that's why I'm always. I'm always out there, I'm always traveling, because I know that 90% of the time when I travel I make a fucking connection that moves the needle Right. And it may not happen right away, it might take fucking a couple of months, it might take a year, it might take three years, but it fucking happens eventually. You keep in touch. So I'm glad you brought that up.
Speaker 1:That's a good example.
Speaker 1:It's a great example, and to furthermore that connection that I made with my big one partners right now is that you're not even gonna. I didn't, that wasn't at the show. Yeah, that was at the club. Yeah, that was at the club. Exactly that was at the club, right? So, yeah, listen, I go to the shows, I walk the floor. Yeah, do I wear a suit? Dude, sometimes I'm so banged up on those shows or I barely even make it out because vegas, the time difference.
Speaker 1:You know me, I'm up at 6 am every single day in vegas because I got to be in my meeting. Why do you go to your morning meeting? Because I need to be there for my team. It doesn't matter. Will you be C-level? Let them do it. No, no, no, no. If I'm not there, I have a bad feeling that something goes wrong, and it usually goes wrong when I'm at conferences because I'm not in my office and that's just my. That's the way I.
Speaker 1:I personally believe that the best connections are made in a nightclub, you know, in the food court, you know, outside the conference. The conference is, you know it's. There's a lot of employees there, right, it's hard to pick out who runs, who runs the company, where you got to get the CMO Right. So when you walk the floor, my advice to a lot of people that me and my friends always talk about is never actually talk to the suits, always look at the guy. That's like wearing a hoodie that's beside the suits, cause there's more, there's probably a higher chance that the guy in the hoodie actually you know, you know makes the, you know the. You know the, the you know choices and decisions. That's like what we always laugh about, yeah.
Speaker 2:Great advice. Yeah, trade shows, working the trade shows properly is a must. A lot of people don't know how to do it, they just don't know. But I think, being that people, person and identifying, I feel like one thing we have in common we smell the opportunity right, and that's why you can spot out that guy, that guy in a sweatshirt or whatever that's the guy like. You'll know that right, and that's what I'm trying to get my team to do. It's hard, man, it's something that's like an instinct.
Speaker 1:you just get it yeah, and like, and also, you have to also like, understand to yourself and and always believe that it's it's. It's hard to even believe, but you know, I'm 30, uh, I'm 34 years old, right, I was born in 1990, right, in my, you know, in your head, you're always young, like me, like you know, like you always feel that way, like you're always young, yeah, but, bro, you walk that floor, all right. And the people you meet, like, for example, cody yeah, right, cody's like one of my best friends now right, but we met in the industry.
Speaker 3:You know, I I don't even think he's 26, 27 yeah, he's young or not, a size like he was at that time.
Speaker 2:He's younger than me though.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he maybe just turned 30, maybe he's 29, whatever it is right. He's four years younger than me, bro. Yeah, he gives me advice every single day. I love it and I listen to him. You know why I listen to him? Because he has three partners and he has 500 agents and he has a massive, massive business. So just because he's young, just because somebody's younger than you yeah it's you cannot think that your, your years, gave you wisdom. That's not real, because there's kids out here streaming online and they make a million dollars a day yeah, and they don't and they're 22 years old and they don't even know what the hell medicare is.
Speaker 1:Yeah, right, so you gotta like you gotta open up in this industry. You gotta be adaptable. The whole model of this podcast I feel like we've been talking about a lot is it is being adaptable.
Speaker 2:You gotta got to adapt to your circumstances 100% Fucking great advice Amazing stuff you're talking about. Last thing I want to talk to you about is Miami. You moved from Toronto to Miami, right, I moved here. How has Miami treated you?
Speaker 1:So Miami is incredible. I love Miami. I miss home, right, miss toronto. At the end of the day, right, you grew up there. You always feel it, um, but miami happened because, uh, david brooke, um, david brooke came down here, um in like 2021, 2022, whatever it was, and he's in sunny isles and he's like bro, he's like I love it here I'm like I'm coming to miami it'll help my business.
Speaker 1:Fuck it, I'm coming to Miami, packed everything up, we went to Miami, we got a condo and then I seen you at the beach yeah, we had a meeting at the beach, you came for vacation, yeah, and I feel like the way I was, I think I helped you kind of make that final push here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, for.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because I don't know, bro, you only live once. Why not live on the beach? It's humid in the summer. All right, go to Hoboken bro.
Speaker 3:Go to.
Speaker 1:Jersey in the summer. Right, my wife and the kids and me are going to go to Toronto in a couple of weeks. You know my kids are in school now. Yeah, you know I made it home. I'm not a big like, you know, like political guy I don't care about that stuff, but I do feel a difference here, just the way of life. You know I was born Jewish. You know I practiced myself Jewish. I practice. You know I don't practice being Jewish, I don't do like, but I try to be a good person. I met a day.
Speaker 1:You know, but you know Toronto, there's a lot of racism going on these days. It's crazy. It's hard to believe that, right, it's hard to believe right, yeah, there's a lot going on.
Speaker 1:It's like posters and shit on the wall and, um, you know, I was living downtown and I was I lived in St Regis. So I was like, oh, there's like protests going on. I'm like, because we all grew up together, we, we all love each other, no matter what it just I just feel like miami. I feel like miami, you don't. It feels like back in the day. Yeah, you get that feeling when you walk through aventura mall. Oh, you ever get that feeling like you're like.
Speaker 1:This reminds me of like my local mall when I was a kid right, yeah, and there's a.
Speaker 2:There's a. You know what I feel like and there's a lot of. It's easier to penetrate networks here, like I love New York, I love Jersey, that's my home, but it's hard like people, it's more like it's harder to penetrate. These circles are tighter Over here. Man, I'm like downstairs yesterday I see a big influencer down there. I've been trying to get with this guy. I got his number. He's texting me. It's easier to get in those circles and that entrepreneurship and I feel like this is where this is like. The next New York is what it is Like. New York is always going to be around, don't get me wrong, but this is going to be. This is where it's all flocking to. For that reason, because it's more you know, first of all, the tax climate, the political climate, like you talked about the weather, all this stuff. So it makes a lot of sense. I especially with this show. I mean the number of freaking podcasting going on here. We're about to open a podcast studio. I mean it's freaking great yeah.
Speaker 1:So, and you have to understand too, like, bro, we're, it's like 2024, bro, like, if you want to go to New York, or you go to New York a couple of times a week, I'm in New York once a month, minimum and a half hours you're there, you want to leave, you can leave anytime you want. You walked into the airport, you buy a ticket to the airport if you want, or your app, you're in and out. Right, I, I think, being based in miami, no, it's probably the best place you could be based nowadays I agree, other than like a dallas, that was kind of slow for me.
Speaker 1:I'm like I'm, you know, toronto and new york are very similar, you know, I'm sure you know that. Um, so like I need to have quick, quick, quick, quick, quick, and I feel like Miami gives you that as well. It's quick here, traffic's kind of slow.
Speaker 2:Just the drivers, though that left lane fucking drives me nuts, they know how to drive here People go slow in the left lane. Are you kidding me, man? They don't know how to drive here. That's the issue.
Speaker 1:They don't know the rules yet. But crazy. But if you get into road rage, you literally just get shot if you guys watch the news, bro. People get shot here in road rage because everybody has a gun, yeah, so that's one thing that I'm kind of getting used to like. Okay, you can't freak out on the thing. You can't throw a coffee in somebody's car.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it will shoot you yeah, yeah, you can do that in new york and whatever worst thing you get into a fist fight over here like you might lose your life, bro. Lose your life over that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but I love miami. It's uh, it's home now. Um, and this past month I went to toronto and it was the first time I landed in toronto and I didn't have that feeling. We're like I'm home, yeah, wow, when I land in miami now I get that feeling yeah, home, get in the car, I'm going, my family, my kids are there, you know, yeah, I like that, I like it happened to me recently too.
Speaker 2:That's funny, man. I thought I didn't think about that, like where did you land? I landed in fort lauderdale, you know, to drive home. I'm home, you know, and for the first few months it was like kind of weird man.
Speaker 1:Yeah anyone lives in miami, I'll give you the rules, right, that's what you gotta do right because we live in the same neighborhood. If you live in like our neighborhood, uh, in like north miami, let's just say if you're driving to the airport and you're parking there, you got to fly out of Fort Lauderdale Because you could get valet there for four hours oh yeah, it's great, right, and you get in your car and leave, if you're taking an Uber to the airport.
Speaker 1:You got to fly out of Miami, because if you fly out of Fort Lauderdale and you land home and you try to get an Uber, it's taking 30 minutes. You keep going on that loop. So the rule is Uber to Miami International If you want to valet Fort Lauderdale. And the best part is about Sunny Isles is they're both the same distance, they're both 25 minutes away the best.
Speaker 2:It's great. That was a great location, good stuff. Anything else that we didn't touch upon, yeah?
Speaker 1:You know pitchperfectsolutionscom. You know I take every call. It doesn't matter if you're. You know, if you come with any pitch perfect. I meant to ask you that, uh, pitch, perfect solutions. You know call center, we're pitching, it's perfect. I think stan did it.
Speaker 2:I mean, that's a good name.
Speaker 1:That's a good name, right? Uh, people get confused with the movie. There's like seven of those movies now. Um, so pitch perfect solutionscom. Bigger client, I don't mind. Little client, I don't mind. You need data, you need a buyer and you need to believe in the partnership and you need, you need, you need, you need. You need to have the right to dial your data. Do not call me if you do not have opt-ins to dial data. Everyone I work with indemnifies me fully. If I call your lead a hundred times a day and I get a TCPA complaint, that's on me. I get that I'm doing something wrong, but I need to have consent to dial that lead because any lawsuit that comes from me dialing that lead has nothing to do with me.
Speaker 2:I'm glad you mentioned that and I meant to touch upon that earlier, because there's a lot of freaking cowboys out there. They try to do that shit with me too, or they'll try to sell me bullshit data, bullshit data. We have a whole compliance department. We audit stuff. We turn away a lot of people because of that, especially on LinkedIn. I get so many damn requests, man 99% of people. We work with a lot of people. We order them. Then we get in trouble. We lose clients. It's a reputation business. I'm glad you mentioned that. Guys, I wouldn't put anyone on the show if I couldn't vouch for them and they weren't the real deal. Boris is the real deal. I've known you for many, many years. I've worked with you. I've sent you referrals. They all love you, man, and you run a tight ship. Man, appreciate your loss.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much for everything. Thank you so much. Let's go baby, let's fucking go, let's go man.
Speaker 2:Good shit.