Can language transform the way we experience the world? On this episode of "Travels with Jim and Rita," we explore our summer adventures, from cat-sitting in Carmel, Indiana to preparing for an epic European journey. We discuss the surprising joys and challenges of spending summer in the US, and the invaluable gift of reconnecting with our nine grandchildren. Our travel plans take us to Oklahoma, Georgia, and beyond, but the real magic happens when we delve into the compelling reasons why learning foreign languages, like Spanish, French, and Italian, has been a game-changer for us.
Join us as we share heartfelt and humorous stories that highlight the profound impact language learning can have on cultural integration. From funny moments with furniture movers in West Virginia to connecting with locals in the markets of Ecuador, these anecdotes illustrate how even a basic grasp of a local language can bridge gaps and create unforgettable experiences. We reflect on memorable interactions, such as conversing with an Uber driver from the Dominican Republic and helping Spanish-speaking friends order breakfast, showcasing the transformative power of language in fostering meaningful connections and enriching our travel experiences.
Can language transform the way we experience the world? On this episode of "Travels with Jim and Rita," we explore our summer adventures, from cat-sitting in Carmel, Indiana to preparing for an epic European journey. We discuss the surprising joys and challenges of spending summer in the US, and the invaluable gift of reconnecting with our nine grandchildren. Our travel plans take us to Oklahoma, Georgia, and beyond, but the real magic happens when we delve into the compelling reasons why learning foreign languages, like Spanish, French, and Italian, has been a game-changer for us.
Join us as we share heartfelt and humorous stories that highlight the profound impact language learning can have on cultural integration. From funny moments with furniture movers in West Virginia to connecting with locals in the markets of Ecuador, these anecdotes illustrate how even a basic grasp of a local language can bridge gaps and create unforgettable experiences. We reflect on memorable interactions, such as conversing with an Uber driver from the Dominican Republic and helping Spanish-speaking friends order breakfast, showcasing the transformative power of language in fostering meaningful connections and enriching our travel experiences.
Welcome to Travels with Jim and Rita. To Travels with Jim and Rita, I'm your host, jim Santos, and in this podcast series you can follow along as my wife Rita and I work out our crazy plan to outfox the real estate market in the US and actually increase our retirement nest egg by spending the next three years or so living abroad and exploring the world. Are we bold, forward-thinking pioneers or just plain nuts? Let's find out together, shall we? Welcome everybody to Travels with Jim and Rita.
Jim Santos:
We're still in Carmel, indiana, cat sitting until mid-July. Now, naturally, we've been experiencing another heat wave, which has kind of been the story of our life this year. Now from here we go on to Oklahoma and then to Georgia visiting friends and family. Then we're off to Europe for a new 70-day adventure. Well, more on that later. But I know some listeners have wondered why we are spending so much time in the US, particularly when it's fairly expensive. Well, there are a few reasons. First of all, the cat sitting is to help out one of our sons who's in Japan for a month. Secondly, with nine grandchildren, the summer months are the best times to try and see them, since they are out of school. Lastly, we found that the summer months are probably the worst times to try slow travel, so many people are taking vacations. It seems like every possible destination is crowded, incredibly hot and charging top dollar for accommodations. We're pushing it a bit by starting in early August, but fear not, we have a plan and we'll be sharing it with you in future episodes.
Jim Santos:
What I wanted to talk about today is something that comes up all the time, and we experienced it again during our five weeks in Mexico and earlier this year when we spent 10 weeks in Panama. It's the question of whether you need to learn a foreign language in order to travel the world, while technically, it is true that it's possible to live in or travel to a foreign land without learning the language. Let's think about this for a moment. As you probably know, many Americans are critical of immigrants who don't learn our language. Isn't it polite to try to learn at least the kindergarten words? You know words like please. Thank you, you're welcome, hello, goodbye. Where's the bathroom?
Jim Santos:
For myself, I speak and read a fair amount of French, learned a smidgen of Italian before our three-week trip there and have now managed to become moderately proficient in Spanish Far from fluent, but certainly functional. Now I'll be the first to agree that it's not easy, especially if, like me, you're over 60 and we're into trendy chemical amusement aids in the 60s or 70s. However, I'll also point out that there are some pretty good reasons for putting in the effort. I often hear people cite they speak a different language there as a reason not to live in a foreign country or for some even as an excuse not to visit Harita, and I have also met expats who, when moving to another country, absolutely refused to learn any of the local language. In fact, some were even proud of their refusal to give up English as their sole means of communication. Now, to each his own, certainly, but it seems to me being proud of your ignorance is an unusual and, unfortunately, distinctly American thing to brag about. There are lots of arguments for why it's good for your brain to learn new languages, especially if you are 50 or older. Some studies show it may reduce the risk of Alzheimer's, but really those are pretty preliminary findings. I don't know if it's helping my brain in any long-term way, but I do know that it has affected the way I think and the way I feel about myself. I find communicating in a different tongue to be empowering in an odd sort of way.
Jim Santos:
Now, studies show that about 80% of people hear a voice in their heads when they're reading. Some can hear music as well, and sometimes these voices and sounds seem to operate on their own, popping up almost randomly. Not everyone has these auditory thoughts or personal soundtracks, and the ones who do not think the rest of us are crazy. I recall when I first saw the movie Amadeus, my first wife remarked that it was interesting that they portrayed Mozart as hearing all of the music in his head when composing. When I told her I heard music too, as well as voices, and that I wasn't always aware of any conscious control over them, she was ready to get the men in white coats to take me away. And you know what I mean by no conscious control, if you've ever got a song stuck in your head that you absolutely hate, like if I were to say oh Mickey, you're so fine.
Jim Santos:
But as far as can be told, we don't think in a language, at least not the same language we speak. Our thoughts are concepts that rapidly evolve, interact, combine and resolve into a kind of symbolic language. The art of speaking is to take those concepts and attach vocalizations to them that others can then translate into their own symbols. How often have you known something but been unable to express it in words, or had a feeling that you were unable to describe? Maybe you have a sudden burst of understanding, without knowing how you got there. That's the gap that language leaps between concept and expression.
Jim Santos:
When you learn to speak English, growing up, you learn to map the sounds you are hearing to those inner symbols. Then you learn to make those sounds yourself, to make your thoughts and feelings known. You do it so routinely. Now you don't think about it, but you are mapping concepts to sounds. And here's where it gets interesting, because, as Alfred Korzybski famously said, the map is not the territory. In other words, no one has direct access to the territory, in this case your thoughts. All we have is the map. So the best we can manage is to be one remove from reality.
Jim Santos:
Now, as an adult, if you go to learn Spanish, for example, you've got to start all over and make a new map. Instead of linking words directly to concepts, you start out by matching Spanish words to English words. When you begin learning, you first take your concept, express it to yourself in English, search your memory for the closest corresponding words in Spanish, then say it out loud Coming the other way, you hear Spanish words, map them over to English words and then map them to the concepts. Now, hours of study and lots of memorization is involved in this step, but now, as the good Dr K would point out, you are at two removes from reality. Fluency comes when you eliminate the middle steps, when you can go directly from concept to Spanish and Spanish to concept. And this part is important because now you have two maps that you can use, just like a roadmap and a topological map. Taken together can give you a better idea of the territory. The more languages you learn, the closer you can get to full expression of what's going on in your noggin or understand someone else's.
Jim Santos:
I first became personally aware of that stage almost 20 years ago after spending a week in France. I had three years of French in school and was a finalist in the National French Competition in my senior year, but I was still mostly in the translation mode of thought. However, after a week of immersion in France, having to listen and speak with an intensity I'd never experienced before, something happened in my brain. The first thing I noticed was I had a dream or two in French. Now, was it real French or a dream French? I'm not sure, but it was still interesting. Something was going on up there, although it did seem to get easier and easier to communicate as the trip went on. What really brought it to my conscious mind that something was different in my head was an event that happened after the vacation was over.
Jim Santos:
We had arrived back in the US late, so we spent the night at a hotel near the airport. I was in the morning buffet breakfast line, still a little groggy, no coffee yet, and the guy behind the serving table asked me if I wanted bacon or sausage. I told him. I got a blank stare from him and I slowly realized I had just answered him in French. I didn't think it in French. I just knew, in that wordless symbolic language thingy, that I wanted both. So, without thinking about it, the concept just happened to bubble up in French instead of in English. I've seen the same phenomena now in children of bilingual parents who will rattle off sentences that slip in and out of two different languages completely unnoticed by the speaker.
Jim Santos:
Now, my Spanish is admittedly flawed, but I have reached the point where I'm starting to move into that stage and it feels weirdly cool. It doesn't happen often, but in Mexico recently, I sometimes had a phrase pop out without having to run it through the internal translator, or I responded to a Spanish question in the same language automatically, without any conscious translation going on. In fact, sometimes I'll respond to a question asked in English with Spanish. In fact, sometimes I'll respond to a question asked in English with Spanish. Now this is where it starts to become empowering. It's a very interesting feeling to be able to express those concepts in more than one way. It's what people are doing when they play a musical instrument or paint or dance or write poetry. Learning another language is learning a new mode of expression. It opens up your brain to new concepts and new ideas and can literally change the way you think. Hearing a Spanish phrase and understanding without translating also gives you a richer feeling for what the speaker is saying, because every language encapsulates concepts in a slightly different way.
Jim Santos:
I have a long, long way to go with my Spanish, but it is nice to look back to around 2013, when we first arrived in Ecuador and my Spanish consisted mostly of Chile con carne and hasta la vista. But within a very short time we made considerable progress. For example, we earned our driver's licenses and rented a car when exploring Ecuador with little or no expat presence or assistance. Ecuador with little or no expat presence or assistance. But perhaps most importantly, I won an argument with a bank teller over whether or not they could accept the signature on a check I was depositing. This was especially huge because we used to call the bank teller signature Nazis. Now it may not sound like much, but when we first arrived we would have had to hire an interpreter and or a driver to help us with all of that. So that's what I mean by empowered. I can feel confident to rent a car and drive around in Ecuador. I can jump on a bus to La Libertad or even to the big city of Guayaquil, find what I want or ask for help finding it and discuss the purchase and price. In San Miguel, we could jump into cabs and head off to a location we never visited before without any worries.
Jim Santos:
It's a really powerful way to become integrated with the local culture. Whenever you travel, and that's particularly true because it's not a one-way street. If you're trying to talk to someone and neither of you has a firm grasp of the other one's language, you're both engaged in communication at a much more involved and intimate level than when you talk in your native tongue. You study each other more closely, looking for cues in body language, nuances of facial expressions and gestures. You concentrate more on what you're trying to say and you listen more closely to the reply. If you start to talk to someone in a foreign language, no matter how badly you speak it, you can't help but grow a little closer to them and their culture. It's built into the process and it's a beautiful thing. Communication is the gateway to understanding, acceptance and appreciation of other cultures.
Jim Santos:
I encourage you to help yourself and, in some small way, make the world a better place by studying a new language, whether you ever go to that country or not, because when you learn a little bit of a new language, new experiences and opportunities also open up. For example, we were having some furniture moved out of a home in West Virginia in the spring of 2018, and I heard one of the workers complain as he went to move a section of huge solid wood entertainment center. I laughed out loud and he grinned sheepishly when he realized that I knew he had just called a piece of furniture a heavy whore. By the way, while I advocate learning any foreign language or even just some words in a few languages. There's a reason why having at least a working knowledge of Spanish may be a good idea, especially if you're going to be traveling. Besides the obvious benefit of learning new swear words, spanish has the third largest number of native speakers in the world. It ranks only below Mandarin and Hindi. The third largest number of native speakers in the world. It ranks only below Mandarin and Hindi. That means if you can speak Spanish and English, you can communicate with about a billion people Not too shabby.
Jim Santos:
Another interesting language thing happened to me once while shopping in a grocery store in Ecuador. I was in a spice aisle trying desperately to remember the Spanish word for time when another shopper asked me a question, lo siento no entiendo, I said automatically, as I didn't understand what she had asked. When she repeated the question, I suddenly realized the source of our communication problem. She was speaking English and I was trying to hear Spanish. In our years of living in and traveling to Spanish-speaking countries, this is not the first time something like this has happened to me, and certainly not the last. I've had tourists come up to me and ask do you speak English? And I automatically reply si claro, meaning yes, of course. And also when we visit the states, it takes me a long time before I stop automatically greeting people with hola or buenos dias.
Jim Santos:
You'll find that when you spend time in another country, every once in a while something happens that makes you stop for a moment and realize how much you've been changed by the experience, particularly if you attempt to learn some of the language. Take, for example, another experience on a fairly normal day back when we lived in Ecuador, I was on my way out to La Libertad, the commercial district of the peninsula, to run a few errands. Mostly I had to pick up some medication for our dog, but I always loved an excuse to visit the La Libertad Open Air Mercado area. I went out the back of our condo building and walked down a block to wait for one of the several buses that would take me to my first stop. I saw a number 7 approaching and held up my arm to flag it as I watched it slow down and gauge my move to board. You see, if they're picking up or dropping off just one person, they don't always stop so much as just slow down a bit Keeps it interesting. Anyway, I saw these three older men hurrying across the street calling out Caballero Caballero Now, since this means gentlemen, or sometimes locally used for young gentlemen, they had my polite attention. Esto va a la libertad. They asked, wanting to know if this bus would take them to la libertad. Si cerca de aventura? I replied without thinking, telling them it would take them close to the aventura, which is a wild sort of mall right in the heart of the district. They thanked me and we all got on the bus.
Jim Santos:
I really didn't think much about it as soon as I was in the middle of the hustle and bustle of la libertad in the busy early morning, dodging my way between the fruit and juice vending carts, passing people selling everything from rat poison to electronics to handmade leather belts, and I made my way to the first shop I knew of that sold veterinary medicines, standing next to a cage full of chirping baby chicks. I asked for the two items that I needed. I was told they had one of them, but the second one was people medicine, so I'd have to go to a regular pharmacia. Undaunted. I continued on to a pharmacy only to find that they were out of that particular product. Not a big deal, as in La Libertad, finding a pharmacy is like looking for hay in a haystack. Sure enough, across the street and just a block up I found what I needed.
Jim Santos:
Since now I was close to the fresh food Mercado area my favorite place in the world I took advantage of the lower prices downtown to pick up a fresh pineapple Only 75 cents downtown for a small one, a dollar for large. Over at the coast, where we lived, we have to pay an outrageous buck fifty for pineapples. Anyway, I also got some carrots, as we'd just run out, and here the lower prices were a bit of a pain. The smallest bag of fresh carrots I could find weighed two pounds. However, since it was only 50 cents, I couldn't complain too much.
Jim Santos:
Anyway, with everything snug in my small backpack, I walked back down the hill again, weaving in and out of barkers of all types, occasionally having to do the low hand wave that means no gracias. I was walking in the streets with the cars, of course, since in that part of town the sidewalks sometimes drop or rise two or three feet with no warning and besides are covered with goods for sale anyway. So soon I made my way to the closest bus stop that I knew would get me back home, as the bus pulled in a number 11 this time and I waited for the folks getting off to clear the door, a young Ecuadorian asked me about the bus's route. He was a bit more succinct than the men that morning, just catching my eye, tilting his head at the bus and asking Santa Rosa. I nodded and replied si, al paseo y Santa Rosa, telling him I knew the bus would go to the mall first and then stop in the neighborhood of Santa Rosa.
Jim Santos:
Now, as I sat on the bus as we headed back to Salinas, it finally dawned on me how unusual both of my bus route inquiries had been. Now, it's true that I was dressed pretty much like all the guys on the bus, wearing loose-fitting shorts, a t-shirt, sandals, sunglasses and small packs long over one shoulder, and also, really, we'd been there for a couple of years in the equatorial sun. At this point, really, I no longer looked tan. That sort of reddish tint was gone and I was more brown than bronze. It's like my skin finally gave up at some point and said okay, you're a brown guy now, but still there's no way a local would look at me and not know that the fat six foot tall guy is a gringo.
Jim Santos:
And yet, before I got on each bus, different locals in different age groups made two interesting assumptions First, that I would understand them and second, that I might actually have the information they needed and be able to reply. As I thought about it, I took it as a very good sign that we were fitting into the local culture. Thanks to the language, things had become very familiar to us. So as I waited for the bus, I was no doubt unconsciously acting just like a local relaxed, slightly bored and a little detached. I think that's what they're responding to, and I felt pretty good about that at the time.
Jim Santos:
As I reflected on the morning, I also realized that I had been by myself, going from shop to shop, communicating in Spanish and not really thinking about it much. And again, I'm not fluent by any measure, and no one would confuse me for a native speaker. In fact, since I learned French first, my Spanish-speaking friends always tease me relentlessly about my funny accent. But after living in another country for a while, or even visiting, you can pick up enough basic phrases and languages so that things like do you have this, do you know where they sell this? How much for the carrots? And so on, have all become second nature. It's a great feeling to know you can make your way in a different country while speaking a little bit of their language.
Jim Santos:
Now, while I certainly don't regret my decision to start learning Spanish, I have to confess that in the spring of 2018, I was looking forward to an Atlanta trip to speak at an international living conference. For one guilty pleasure, I'd get a break from speaking Spanish every day for a while. I really couldn't wait to be able to talk to everyone around me and not have my mind racing to translate and formulate a reply. I could jump in a cab, order in a restaurant whatever I wanted, turn on a TV or call the desk on the phone, and all in English. That was the plan. However, as a famous Prussian field marshal once observed, no battle plan survives first contact. I was reminded of those words of wisdom before I even managed to get out of the busy Atlanta airport.
Jim Santos:
I picked up my bags and, via my trusty iPhone, having switched to my US SIM card, requested an Uber to get me to the hotel. When the driver arrived, he hopped out of the car, came around to open the trunk, offered his hand and introduced himself as Enrique. Now, habit took over and as I shook his hand I automatically replied mucho gusto. Enrique's eyes lit up and he exclaimed ah, habla espanol. And we were off and running All the way to the hotel.
Jim Santos:
We carried on a conversation in Spanish. I understood maybe a third of what I was hearing, but it was enough to keep the thread of the conversation alive. He and his family had come over from the Dominican Republic and he absolutely loved that I lived in Ecuador. He told me he knew people from Guayaquil and he'd always wanted to visit. I told him how much we liked Guayaquil, much to his delight. When we arrived he actually gave me a hug, along with his card. He told me to just call if I ever needed to get anywhere during my stay, and since during our talk I had mentioned how much I loved the Ecuadorian food, he insisted that if I wanted to try a real Dominican meal I should give him a call and he take me to his grandmother's restaurant.
Jim Santos:
The very next morning I was at the Peachtree Center in line for breakfast and I noticed two women in front of me were having trouble placing their order. They both spoke very little English and the cashier had no Spanish, so I found myself in the unusual position of acting as interpreter. I told the cashier they wanted their eggs scrambled revueltos which is one of my favorite things to say in Spanish, by the way and they wanted their coffee with milk or con leche. Now, the señoras were very appreciative and they smiled a lot as they thanked me, and it felt good to be able to help. And it didn't stop there. The next day during lunch break I found a nice Cuban restaurant at the center. As I was placing my order, I noticed that they had yuca fries as a side dish option. I told the Cubano waitress in Espanol that I lived in Ecuador and loved yucca fries. We chatted a bit and when my meal came I noticed she'd given me a double serving of the yucca. So score.
Jim Santos:
Later that fall, at another US conference, this time in New Mexico, I ran into the same sort of experience. I had returned to my room with a to-go salad for a quiet lunch and arrived just as the maid showed up. She was obviously Hispanic, and I know what are the odds of a Hispanic maid in New Mexico. So anyway, automatically buenos tardes popped out. She smiled and returned the greeting. Now, this kind of open and immediate bond is really a beautiful thing to see. I love the look on the face of someone who hears his or her native tongue from an unexpected source. Even as badly mangled as our attempts may be, they still have a noticeable effect on our interactions, regardless of what country we may be in at the time. Using someone's language allows us to at least put a few cracks in the wall that separates people into us and them, and when that wall starts to crumble, good things happen. In this case, the good things happened for me. I had arrived late the previous night and had to be down at the conference floor early to set up, so the room was still pretty clean. I'd barely been in it. I only needed new towels, maybe replacements for the two complimentary water bottles, and refilled the coffee service. No se preocupe por la cama Darme toalas nuevas, por favor, y posible poco de agua y café. Probably not grammatically correct and with a hideous accent, but she clearly understood and smiled even bigger, nodding and talking brightly, most of which I missed, but I got the gist that she could do that. I continued with my lunch salad while I caught up on emails and a few minutes later returned her cheerful farewell with a gracias and a wave as I packed up my computer and prepared to leave, I found, to my delight, that she had left me four bottles of water and enough coffee creamer and sweetener to open my own cafe. So the bottom line is the language skills that we've picked up have enriched our lives both in Ecuador and when we travel to other destinations abroad. Over the past 10 years, we were in Panama, peru, uruguay, argentina and Mexico. It's no surprise to say that the Spanish we knew provided the extra social lubrication that made our visits go more smoothly and ultimately made them more relaxed and enjoyable. The same thing when we traveled to Greece, turkey, vienna, prague. We didn't understand the language at all, but still just learning. Please, thank you. Being able to say good morning, good evening, good night, those things really make a big difference wherever you travel. So if you're considering a move, or even just travel to another country, if you're asking yourself do I have to learn another language, the answer is no, you do not have to learn another language. But if you don't, you're missing out on an incredible opportunity to get the most out of your life as a traveler and to enrich your life as a citizen of the world. Thanks for joining us. This has been Travels with Jim and Rita, now with listeners in 35 countries. Thanks for your support and please continue to like and follow and promote on social media as you are able and, of course, while not required, subscriptions are always appreciated. Before we go, a reminder that Rita and I will be at the exhibit hall for the International Living Ultimate Go Overseas Boot Camp in Las Vegas, nevada, october 26th through the 28th. You can get more information or sign up at intliving. com slash events. That's intlivingcom slash events, but do it soon because it's filling up quickly. Also, I've just been told that International Living is having another test drive your retirement contest. The first prize is a one-month trip to beautiful Costa Rica. Il will pay for your airplane tickets, accommodations and even give you a generous expense allowance so you can see what it would be like to live and retire in one of the more popular expat destinations around the world. The deadline for entry is July 1st, so be sure to get to intlivingcom slash Costa Rica pod that's intliving. com / Costa Rica pod P-O-D to get your name in the hat and I'll put a link for that in the show notes. Now, while we're plugging websites, you can see where we've been on our blog at jimsantosbooks. com, and you can access my books, audiobooks and short stories at jimsantos. net. We always love to hear from our listeners as well, so if you have a question or a topic you'd like us to cover, or you want to tell your own travel story, email us at jim at jimsantosbookscom. That's all for now. Until next time, remember we travel not to escape life, but so that life does not escape us.