Cruising Out Of Your Comfort Zone | Cruise Cast Ep.9 With Special Guest Paul C Thornton

Ready to step outside your cruising comfort zone? Join us as we sit down with Paul C Thornton, the mastermind behind the Joy of Cruising series and podcast, who has been navigating the seas since 1988. Paul brings his wealth of knowledge and personal anecdotes, highlighting the unique appeal of Virgin Voyages' adult-only atmosphere and superb dining. Relive Paul's family adventures on Carnival and witness how his tastes have matured over the years, offering a fresh perspective on why it's worth exploring new cruise lines.

Ever been frustrated by limited dining choices on a cruise? You're not alone. We tackle the thorny issue of complimentary dining, particularly with MSC Cruises, sharing our own trials and tribulations aboard the MSC Meraviglia. From overcrowded buffets to scarce options, we shed light on how these limitations can sour the experience for seasoned cruisers. But it's not all doom and gloom—tune in for our suggestions on how MSC could easily elevate their game and turn first-time guests into loyal fans.

Finally, we debunk some cruising myths and bring you up to speed on the latest industry buzz. Think Cunard requires formal attire 24/7? Think again. We'll clarify those dress code misconceptions and even touch on tuxedo rentals aboard. Plus, learn about NCLs  cost-cutting strategies and the introduction of premium liquors on Princess Cruises. As a cherry on top, discover the latest celebrity branding initiatives on the Sun Princess and Royal Caribbean's new loyalty program extension. This episode is packed with insights, surprises, and plenty of reasons to rethink your next cruise adventure.

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

Welcome to episode 9 of the Sweet Nature Cruisecast. Hi, I'm Linz from Sweet Nature. There's always some time left, hello, hello. And today we're talking about cruising out of your comfort zone and we're joined by a very, very special guest.

Speaker 2: 0:24

But first, a little mood music Maybe. Well, as you said, Linz today we are joined by a very special guest. We are. For those of you that are watching it you will already be able to see our special guest. Those of you listening to the audio version maybe not quite yes, yes, but today we're joined by Dr Paul Thornton, the author of the Triad Cruising series of books and the very popular Triad Cruising podcast. Welcome to the CruiseCast, paul.

Speaker 3: 0:57

Thank you, I am glad to be here. You know, there's nothing I like more than cruising, than talking about cruising. I said that wrong. There's nothing I like more than cruising, than talking about cruising. I said that wrong. There's nothing I you understand what I mean. I can talk cruising all day long.

Speaker 2: 1:17

I said a little bit in the intro and a little bit in my. Do you want to tell people a little bit about yourself and the drive of cruising?

Speaker 3: 1:28

Okay, so, yes, I've been cruising for a long time, since 1988. But in what was it? Late Around 2019, I wrote a book on cruising called the Joy of Cruising. I loved it and I love the people who I interacted with. It was sort of a compilation of cruising stories, fascinating stories and passionate cruisers, and so it was an easy decision to write a second one, which I did, called Cruising Interrupted.

Speaker 3: 2:07

And then we had the pandemic, and I was one of those that was concerned. Cruising may never come back. But when it did, I wrote a book same format, anthology or compilation of fun cruising stories and I titled this one the Joy of Cruising Again, and it sort of was in celebration of the return of cruising, and so I loved writing the books, but I can't write cruising books for the rest of my life, but I can't walk away from my passion of talking about cruising, and so I started a podcast, the Joy of Cruising podcast, and it really is essentially the same format as the books. You know, I find interesting cruise personalities like yourselves and I interview personalities like yourselves and I interview you, and it's very likely if I was writing, you know, a fourth cruise book, I probably would have asked you to be in it.

Speaker 2: 3:12

It's just a denouement. Well, if you ever decide to, you know where we are. Well, today we are going to be, talking about cruising. Obviously that's what we do. We're going to be talking about something. Obviously that's what we're doing. Yeah, we're going to be talking about something a little bit different, which is cruising out of your comfort zone. Mm-hmm, Because a lot of us, when we get into cruising, we were the same. Yes, we stuck with the same cruise line for a long time.

Speaker 2: 3:37

We did, you know, we had sort of dalliances, you know whatever little thing with Disney on one sort of dalliances you know, whatever a little thing with Disney on one and we jumped on NCL for another one, but we kept going back to World of Caridin because we were comfortable with it. Yes, we knew that we would like that, yeah, and therefore why risk it? We'll take a fucking lot going outside of that, and I know Paul's just been on a cruise recently on Virgin Forges for the first time. I'm sure we'll get to hear a little bit about that as well. Paul, can I start off by saying what is your go-to holiday, your go-to cruise date that you feel most comfortable with? And I'll throw that over to Paul to start with, what's your one that you feel most comfortable with, paul, given you've been cruising since the 80s?

Speaker 3: 4:23

Well, you know I could simply answer Virgin Voyages, but you know that would make for a very short response to your question and I've only been on Virgin Voyages once for the audience. It was my last cruise. I just got off about a few weeks ago. But you know, I kind of flippantly say Virgin Voyages but that's kind of an easy go-to because of, you know, some very obvious, conspicuous reasons that most of your listeners, most of your viewers understand, of course, and that is no, kids, I don't dislike kids. Most of my cruising has been inexpensive cruises on Carnival. They seem to be more affordable than others with my daughters and then, you know, with my grandkids, you know, later on. So you know I'm not one that totally disdains kids on a cruise. But for where I am in my life right now, you know Virgin is perfect. For that, you know, probably other than the act of cruising itself, probably the second reason for I cruise, I enjoy cruising, is the food, and not only is Virgin food included but it is, you know, almost all of specialty quality. So you know there's something happening on the cruise, you know, all the time. So, to answer your question, my generic perfect cruise is one with a few kids great food longer than seven days.

Speaker 3: 6:30

I grew up pretty much with short cruises three, four and five days, mainly because in the 80s and 90s my wife and I owned a chain of small businesses video stores. Remember them? Did you have those in the UK? I'm sure you did, of course. But yeah, we had a chain of video stores and, as small business owners know, you're there like seven days a week, which we were owners know, you're there like seven days a week, which we weren't, and so we couldn't take longer cruises in three, four and five days. And then, once I got older and I could afford a longer cruise and the video stores, the businesses were no longer in our lives we started taking, you know, regularly seven days. But now, in the last few years, we've become accustomed to, you know, cruises between nine and 16 days and so, answering your question of the ideal cruise, we need longer rather than shorter.

Speaker 3: 7:39

So those are a few things that I look for Now. You notice I haven't even mentioned destinations that I look for. Now. You notice I haven't even mentioned destinations Up until the last couple of years I was one of those guys where the ship was more important than the destinations. But now I am in the active process of trying to check off bucket list items. So destinations are important, as important as a ship, but they used to not be as important. So, anyway, that was a long answer to what I was going for.

Speaker 2: 8:16

I'll bounce it on to you now. Then, linz, what's the Yoko Tsu cruise type order that you've been most comfortable with Before Dungy, and?

Speaker 1: 8:23

I feel Virgin are going to get two cruise type order that you feel most comfortable with Before Virgin and I feel Virgin are going to get a lot of love today Before Virgin. I was very happy with Royal Caribbean as it was a little bit in my heart the one from Royal Caribbean.

Speaker 2: 8:40

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 8:42

And everything else out of Royal Caribbean then became out of Royal Camerby, then became out of my comfort zone because I knew where the drinks were.

Speaker 2: 8:53

You knew where the drinks were.

Speaker 1: 8:55

Yeah, but I knew which drinks at which bars when we had our, so he was always happy. But, like so, as you get older your sort of priorities change. So yeah, I'm going to say adults only on. Something like Virgin is very much my comfort zone now. Yeah, the thought of going on a ship with lots of children is now outside of me.

Speaker 2: 9:27

It's interesting because that's what we're talking about. We're getting out of it. So we'll come back to that a little bit later on, and I'm probably going to end up just repeating what everyone said to you to a degree which the one that I'm most comfortable with. Now, like yourself, as you get older and your children have grown up, you don't necessarily want to be around thousands of other people's children, and there tends to be noisier cruise ships, which is bad when you've got a young child, and it would be perfect when you have someone growing up. Yes, but now I want to work and relax a little bit more, not feel that I have to do anything, but be able to do anything. Yes, sir, being able to do both of those is so important for me, and obviously I know what you're on. I don't need a lead shock if you were something like that. Do you want to ask about Cruise? No Well, let's flick it. The other way then, and you? Why it's not a cruise?

Speaker 2: 10:26

No Well, let's flick it the other way, then, and I'll bounce it, I'll sit back to you first, then we'll go to Paul, Okay. Okay, is there a cruise type that really doesn't appeal to any kind of sailing with kids.

Speaker 1: 10:32

Okay, no, I wasn't going to say that. I wasn't going to say that that's fine, I was going to say it's not necessarily a cruise, it's a cruise line. But everyone we know that goes on it really enjoys it. But this skews older, older and it's it's fred olsen, which is a cruise line in the uk and we see it. It does some lovely itineraries. They depart like an hour and a half from our house, paul, an hour and a half, and we go to final was two hours and five hours away.

Speaker 1: 11:03

Or get in a and we go to five hours to Southampton and we still haven't been on it because we feel it's too much out of our comfort zone.

Speaker 2: 11:13

What do you think? Is it that you think is to our comfort zone? What has it done to appeal to you about that?

Speaker 1: 11:19

I think it's the activities, I think it's the general fact I'm in the ship. I think it's the general vibe in the ship. I think it's older.

Speaker 2: 11:29

Is that your mid-preference, or is that what you've seen?

Speaker 1: 11:35

Well, I know Jane, our friend Jane. She went on with her mum and Jane, who was in her 50s, was the spring chicken of the cruise. So you see, but you know, maybe in the school holidays it's slightly different, I don't know. That to me would be cruising out of our comfort zone. Okay, the similar pricing to the likes of Celebrity and Such a Revolcany.

Speaker 2: 12:03

Yeah, well, that's always been the issue to me with thread. I've had the same concerns you are. This isn't my answer. I'm just kind of following up from you. Yeah, I don't necessarily think things to my cruise line. I might go on it and think it's amazing. Well, that's the thing. But if it's at a fairly similar price to going on celebrity or Virgin or one of the ones that we've done many times before and you're in your comfort zone again, then I'd rather give them all that amount of money than this. Well, it's not an insignificant amount of ownership that I might not like. So, yeah, I completely get where you're coming from. What about you, paul? What's the cruise type that doesn't appeal to you? Is it not necessarily a cruise line or a cruise ship Anything?

Speaker 3: 12:48

Yeah, it's sort of the opposite of what I said earlier. But besides those things, no, kids, you know and I don't want to sound what's the right word, I don't know a cruise snob or anything, but I'm not particularly into old ships, you know. Probably because, probably because, as I was, you know, as I alluded to earlier growing up not growing up, I was an adult but with young kids and and because we could only go on shorter cruises for the reasons I mentioned and because you know I was financially limited, you know we would choose a lot of small, older. You know these were sort of the ships that tended to go on three and four day cruises and they were almost all well at the time. They were all Carnival. So again, no knock against Carnival, but I don't like older ships, you know, with some exceptions, I should say I have a really big exception to that.

Speaker 3: 13:53

But one thing that I really hate, especially in these days and times. It wasn't an issue back, you know, when I was cruising with my kids on Carnival, but in these days and times it is totally unacceptable for a cruise ship or cruise line to lack an abundance of complimentary food choices, and you know not to pick on them. But that's you know. That's my issue with MSC. You know at least the MSC ship I went on. You know all they had to choose from to eat complimentary was the buffet and the main dining room. And so the consequence of that is that the buffet was a madhouse all the time because no one had any place else to go.

Speaker 3: 14:54

And for a lot of experienced cruisers like yourself I'll speak for myself like me, as beautiful as the ships are at least you know again, I'm totally on one ship, meraviglia, but as beautiful as it was, as nice as the, you know the venues were and the events and the activities and all that good stuff, for me it's a once and done because of you know, if you're coming from Carnival with Guy's Burgers or Royal, you know with the Park Cafe or whatever they have now on Icon and NCL where you could get up at, you know three, four in the morning and go get a Reuben. Three, four in the morning and go get a Reuben MSC. For me and for many like me who are used to those other lines, it's a once and done. Their management needs to fix that Now again, maybe it's better on other MSC ships, but anyway, that's an answer to your question.

Speaker 3: 16:02

What doesn't appeal to me is a lack of choice in the complementary food. So that's it. Older ships, again the opposite of what I said earlier. So that would be short cruises a lot of kids, you know, non-virgin, that's it.

Speaker 2: 16:28

I think the follow-up question to that, to both of you, would be what will it take to get you on one of those cruises? We're talking about Paul first, I think. Probably for Paul it's a relatively quick answer, which is more speciality, complementary dining, more options on there and speaking on the MSC trips we've been on beside the bigger ones, the newer ones, virtual which is Mary Viglia's sister. Yeah, there's quite a lot of tourists within there.

Speaker 1: 17:01

Well, is that because we were in Yacht Club, though, that we had those choices?

Speaker 2: 17:06

Perhaps. Well, is that because we were?

Speaker 1: 17:08

in York Club that we had those choices Perhaps?

Speaker 3: 17:10

Yeah, I suspect that had something to do with it.

Speaker 2: 17:16

As I was defending MSC, then trying to answer Paul's question for him very rudely, how? Then, it's like with me. I'm thinking of speciality dining. I don't remember that much complimentary, but, as you say, when you go on things like Waddle, you've got the hot dog shacks, you've got things all over. You can go to E130 and there's a pizza that's up until 2 or 3 in the morning. So there's, you know, I think in the galley the breakfast one was pretty much 24. Yeah, and there's always something again.

Speaker 3: 17:50

Yeah, we went on Virgin's. We went up to the galley on Virgin some odd times because, first of all, on the transatlantic, as you explained to me when I had you guys on to talk about transatlantics, the time changes and so by the end we were like six hours difference than our normal time zone and we're big, big basketball fans, so the NBA playoffs were on. So if we wanted to watch a game on the US West Coast, you know we were watching the game at, like you know, 6 in the morning, 5, 6 in the morning, and so we would go to the galley and get us one of those charcuterie boxes or bento boxes and stop at the bar and get a drink, and so we're eating that kind of food at five and six in the morning because we're watching the games. So that was nice on version, nothing like that on most other lines, but especially on MSC.

Speaker 2: 19:15

So MSC would need to have more choices for you in order for you to be able to consider it again.

Speaker 3: 19:18

Yes, not a lot, Not a lot. That's why I said in my I did a sort of a reflections podcast and I simply said you know, I know, I know Maravilia is coming up on a dry dock. You know, what would it take for them to add a place that you can, a complimentary food place during dry dock? I think that would like I told you. There's a lot of people who like to use the term once and done. That, I think, would be the difference between being once and done or not, because you know, I thought MSC was solidly. You know, I think I gave them a B minus because there were a lot of things they did well. But it's too bad that that's what I remember and I won't go back on it.

Speaker 2: 20:08

Yeah, I mean we'll flip the same question back to you then. So talk to me about Fells and what we take for you through one of those cruises.

Speaker 1: 20:17

A price that I felt comfortable with.

Speaker 2: 20:20

What was that price for you then?

Speaker 1: 20:22

Well, it can't be two and a half thousand pounds per person for a balcony. It has to be somewhere around maybe £1,500 per person for a balcony.

Speaker 2: 20:32

So if Fred were to turn out to £3,000 for the tour of Australia, that would be enough for you to take your chance.

Speaker 1: 20:40

Yeah, it has to be cheaper than Disney.

Speaker 2: 20:44

It's better to do it on a date well, I mean, that's one of the things we looked at. We were looking at September for this year and we were looking at Disney's British Isles cruise and Fred Olsen. Fred Olsen was more expensive, which is crazy. How can that be that it's that much more so, is it? Just as simple as you just need to see it a little bit cheaper.

Speaker 1: 21:04

I need to not feel that if I say to you come on, let's cruise out of Newcastle, which I say is an hour and a half from our house, and do the fjords, because we love the fjords.

Speaker 2: 21:18

Yeah, we do.

Speaker 1: 21:19

But get on this shit. But it has to be. I don't because, if we hate it, I can't have it that we pay so much money for it because of the guilt we're carrying.

Speaker 3: 21:29

Yeah, you'll be thinking about that. The whole cruise, the whole cruise.

Speaker 2: 21:34

I mean one of the things that Fred did well and we just touched on sort of complimentary dining there and that builds to me. I am concerned about, you know, is the demographic right for us on this time of the lobby board etc. I've had that thought on other cruise lines. Is the specialty dining only £10 each? Yeah, compare that to celebrity and you're almost at the virgin level where it's included £10 per person.

Speaker 1: 22:01

That's a no-brainer for you to try it, yes, and it's about the fragments that I could.

Speaker 2: 22:05

Well, they are quite an incredibly complicated drinks package, which gives them a negative in my book. I just want to know that Go to a bar and order something if you've got a drinks package.

Speaker 1: 22:14

And what they do as well, Paul, is that when you book the spa to go, you go as a couple to the spa and you just pay for you. You just book it and the whole spa is for you, all of it. Nobody else is in there, so you get it all to yourselves for two hours.

Speaker 2: 22:29

Which is really appealing to how into French styles went on it. I love that Like.

Speaker 1: 22:33

Kendall's Cruising yeah.

Speaker 2: 22:35

So you know there is an appeal to that.

Speaker 1: 22:37

Yes.

Speaker 2: 22:37

But he just needs to lower the risk of guilt to you. That's all there is. That's fair enough then. So let's look at it a different way then. Oh so and I'll go back to Paul first with this one which proof were you not expecting? Or were you not really expecting 20? Or was it how you come from?

Speaker 3: 23:00

But in the end of it, absolutely looked at um, you know, when I, when I pick a cruise ship, you know I research it to death and so I can't imagine imagine going on one that I wasn't expecting to like and I liked it, I guess the closest. Now here I am. You know I've been kind of hitting hard on MSC, but now I'm going to give credit to MSC Because if I had to answer one ship, I would say on MSC Miraville, because the reviews that I read prior to the cruise, often on the podcast, I'd say they were mixed. What I wouldn't say, because I was booked booked on it is they were sometimes brutal, yeah, absolutely brutal. And and especially about the food. You know now I already talked about the lack of complimentary food in the daytime. But you know I went to the main dining rooms and they were okay, there was, they were on par. To me the main dining room was on par with its direct competitors, and to me, direct competitors for them would be Royal Carnival, ncl, sort of mid-tier lines. So their main dining room was about on par. Their specialty restaurants were on par or better. So there was much to enjoy about the ship. I mean, I gave it a B minus. I didn't give it like a, c or a D, you know. And plus you know it was a Christmas cruise with my family. You can't really go wrong with that. So maybe that helped to make MSC palatable acceptable.

Speaker 3: 25:18

You know, I had heard, I had heard crazy stories about and I mean crazy stories about their customer service, and so I finally had a chance to test that out Not intentionally, but you know I couldn't. It had to do with my connectivity, internet connectivity and you know, I finally went to customer service. And you know, I finally went to customer service and they tried to give me the same kind of service that I have read so much about. And I went into my crazy consumer mode and every person I talked to they were like scripted, their responses were scripted. And every person I talked to I basically said let me talk to your boss. And then finally I got a person who had a uniform on I don't know how to read ranks. She was an officer and we had a long discussion. But at the end of the discussion I said let me speak to your boss, and I suspect her boss was Captain and I suspect her boss was captain. So all I know is she made a phone call to the internet department. She walked away from me so I don't know what she said, but then she came back and told me to go to them. They fixed the issue and I didn't pay any money because for the issue to be fixed they were telling me I would have to buy another.

Speaker 3: 26:41

While you know it's a long story. So you know even what I dreaded most their famed or infamous customer service. It came through. You know, a little bit of scaring people because you know I got into my act. I got into my act and I will say late that night I got a phone call and it was customer service. And so as much as I have heard about customer service and as much as I have never had a customer service on any line call me hours later to gauge my satisfaction, so even though I knocked them earlier in the discussion, now I'm saying that was a line that was better than I was prepared for, even though I'm calling it once and done, is it?

Speaker 2: 27:43

I'll flick over to you then with the same questions. So what creature were you most expecting to not enjoy? Or, it's not a new comfort song, but ended up loving it.

Speaker 1: 27:54

Cunard's Queen Elizabeth, our first Cunard.

Speaker 2: 27:57

That would have probably been mine.

Speaker 1: 27:59

Yeah, because I thought it was going to be too formal. I thought the people were going to be stuffy.

Speaker 2: 28:04

Did you think it was going to be too informal for you, or were you worried that it would be too formal for me and therefore I wouldn't enjoy it enough and you wouldn't enjoy it? Did you trust a lot, Whereas I'd rather be in a t-shirt and jeans?

Speaker 1: 28:19

And shorts, maybe. I just thought people might be a little bit stuffy, a bit snooty Everybody was lovely. Everybody liked dressing up. It was great. It was great.

Speaker 2: 28:35

Yeah, I'll go along with you on that. I have got a slightly different answer to different cruise liners, which I'll give in a second, but I was so apprehensive about it I know Q nod and you've been talking to me for years about trying it and for me it was just like it's too formal, it's going to be too stuffy. This is not my idea of a holiday being in a shirt and tie all the time.

Speaker 1: 28:57

No.

Speaker 2: 28:58

It's not that that's the misconceptions now, but now I can put it in their mind. With what people know about us now and what we've already talked about in this will seem somewhat I like. But the one that I really didn't expect to enjoy and we've been doing such with some of their cruise loggers to check for us beforehand was Virgin. Yeah, because how Virgin was initially advertised, if you have to bear in mind when I'm talking about this, we went on Virgin's second ever cruise because technically they had a press cruise before the pandemic here and then the world closed. No, so the only people that had been on it and we didn't have the channel, we haven't been on that, so didn't have the channel.

Speaker 2: 29:40

No, we haven't been on that. No, so it's supposed to be One of the people. You know what was this, what was this? And they've only been Like for a day, so they haven't Only got any idea. But Virgin Advertising Essentially has been for the 18 to 30 Fowl In the like, aimed at the young people, and I was like this is so not me, I am not.

Speaker 1: 29:59

Even after not having the beds made. Look, it was the sofas. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 30:04

I spent thousands of pounds to sleep on the qualified sofa bed. But that's how they were emphasised and that was that initial pitch. And I think then over the pandemic period where cruising shut down globally their chance to rethink about how the passage works, yes, and the feedback they've got yeah and they had a very unique option in that they're a brand new cruise line. They've got all this feedback without a passenger ever sitting on board paying passenger, and they have a year and a bit to fix it.

Speaker 1: 30:35

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 30:36

So by the time we got on there, the things that were my concern weren't a thing I don't know why in my head and from the advertising that he advertised as an 18th or 30th turn on any 18 year old who could have faltered on anyway. Maybe some of the really good YouTubers were 18, but he was just how he portrayed. Obviously, we've been on it. We've been on every show. We've been on Truth, soul, dish, love, panama. Yes, he's our go-to one and won it again in August, just for the full night one. I would prefer a longer one, but instead of Uncorded Weekend Cruise, it's better than nothing.

Speaker 2: 31:20

Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.

Speaker 3: 31:27

The 18 to 30 thing. That's funny because, you know I ended up. I was talking to this guy that I became buddies with on the cruise and, you know, told him I was writing a kind of reflections podcast, and so one of the things that I wanted to chat about on the podcast was the average age, and so I had a number in mind, but I wanted to ask him what he thought to see how close my number was to his.

Speaker 3: 32:01

So I surmised that the average age was 55. And without telling him that his response to me was between 55 and 60. Wow.

Speaker 1: 32:17

Yes.

Speaker 3: 32:19

So yeah, 18 to 30-year olds would have been, uh, very obvious on that cruise.

Speaker 3: 32:24

They would have stood out you know like like seeing kids on a on a, on a on a, really really. You know like the young kids on a really really uh uh long, uh uh cruise. In fact I was just. I just interviewed someone yesterday who's on that Royal Caribbean Ultimate World Cruise and I was shocked because she told me there was like 20 kids on board. Good grief, yeah, I couldn't believe it. I said what are they homeschooled? And she said a lot are actually. Well, she didn't say a lot. She said some are and then some are younger than school age. But I was very surprised. But anyway, that's. You know, 18 to 30-year-olds would have stood out like that on the Virgin cruise I was on.

Speaker 2: 33:11

Yeah, and it's been similar to every one we've been on. Well, not only the ones we've been on. Friends of ours have been on exactly the same, and there was a comment the Virgin themselves put out the other day that the average age of their cruises is 55.

Speaker 3: 33:25

Oh, okay, I hope I hadn't seen that when I said that to the guy and was somehow subconsciously influenced by that, but I just guessed 55.

Speaker 2: 33:37

No, that's only the last couple of days, Paul. Oh, okay, so you can imagine if it's listened to you.

Speaker 3: 33:45

Saved themselves the money they spent some marketing research company. Yeah, Now let me ask you a question. When you went on Lesion very early on, did Version kind of use the diva as a brand? Uh, was the diva very prominent in their advertising?

Speaker 2: 34:06

no, no, no. The stars much more so now and obviously you just to the podcast with um, one of the divas, um, but no, there weren't prominent, that's all that part. By the second cruise there were more so, yeah, and by the time we went on resilient last year had really prominent. They were essentially the co-host on the. They were trying to doing a lot of the major things. Yeah, that's definitely a position that they'd be massively over that problem. So, just talking about the topic on them and we've kind of covered off these a little bit but are there any sort of common cruise misconceptions that you think people have that are stopping them from out of the comfort zone or that are keeping them in the comfort zone? I'll pass that to. Let's pass that off to us.

Speaker 3: 35:03

Clearly. Well, I don't know if this is a misconception. There is a perception. I have it, even though it's on my bucket list you alluded to it earlier that Cunard is too formal, that CUNOD is too formal. So you know I don't know that that's a misconception because I haven't been on it I still kind of strongly believe that, even though the response I get from people like yourselves and, you know, mostly from people from UK is they don't deny that it's formal. They just kind of say it's oh, it's not that bad or something like that. You know. So maybe I'm just looking for excuses, even though it's on my bucket. Know, I brought a tux and it's been I don't know eight years. You know, I think I bought it for my daughter's wedding and so I know I ain't getting in that excuse my bad grammar.

Speaker 3: 36:17

And then at work, you know, towards the end before I retired, you know we were casual, so much. You know I used to have a lot of suits. You know I worked either corporate or higher ed you know big, big higher ed. So I had a lot of suits and I went to a lot of meetings and all that stuff that people who wear suits do. So I still have my suits, but now it's been about four years since I wore them and again, I think maybe what I'm saying about Cunard is because I don't want to have to buy stuff because I don't think I'll be able to get in anything that I have that I would need to wear on Cunard. So yeah, that's definitely not a misconception thing that I had that I would need to wear on Cunard.

Speaker 2: 37:00

So yeah, that's definitely not a misconception and I think it is, as I said, for myself as well. It was the reason I didn't want to go on the X. I thought you had to wear a suit to look at Memphis and you know, I didn't think you had to wear a bottle of Tyler. I genuinely am a bit hurt. You have to put a jacket on if you went into the main dining room. That's true on certain nights, on the gala nights, but if you're on a seven-night cruise, you'll have two gala nights and it means you've got a jacket and a shirt on. You don't have to wear a tie. You do have to wear a tie On gala night. No, you do have to. Really just slow them down.

Speaker 1: 37:37

Oh no, no, I don't need to invite them to be next.

Speaker 2: 37:39

So See just a little more shirt During the day up until that evening period. It's exactly the same as that of the cruise ship.

Speaker 1: 37:46

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 37:47

You know people are exactly the same, going about life in exactly the same. You know, drinking in the bars, talking about in trivia, doing all bits and pieces that you do on any of the cruise lines.

Speaker 3: 37:57

Yes, so during the day, wearing shorts and flip-flops is okay. Yes, perfect, because that's my typical cruise uniform shorts and flip-flops.

Speaker 2: 38:13

And it's only in the evening when it changes Six o'clock, six o'clock onwards, there's normally a couple of bar areas where something on galanite if you're not in the appropriate time, you can't go into them until most of them in the event, um, and some of the restaurants. But things like the buffet, uh, king's front buffet, even on galanite you can go in there and you know all the time you don't have to get restaurants if you don't have to get dressed up. So if you don't want a tech part, you don't have to. But Cunard probably has a much higher percentage of people who take part in the 419s in the high 90%, yes, compared to, say, vogue Caribbean, when it might have a 419 or Celebrity. You might be down at 40-50% tech part, yeah, so I to 50% part. So I suspect that's in there, and they do hire tuxedos on board as well.

Speaker 1: 39:00

They do, I don't know how much they are.

Speaker 2: 39:05

I'm sure I'll do what will help you.

Speaker 3: 39:08

Let me ask a question. Let's say that you go on Cunard and Gala Night comes and you really just are not feeling dressing up. Can you go eat?

Speaker 2: 39:22

somewhere. Yeah, to the buffet. You go to King's Cone, to the buffet, okay, okay. So if you don't want to get dressed up, you're absolutely not.

Speaker 3: 39:33

So then I literally can do a week's cruise on Cunard without bringing a suit, yeah absolutely.

Speaker 1: 39:44

I'm just trying to think who recorded that album on Cunard? Ed Sheeran, ed Sheeran and his producer, because his producer doesn't fly, but they do have tuxedos, so they just were either in the buffet or the suite.

Speaker 3: 39:57

Yeah, yeah okay, see, I'm an Ed Sheeran kind of guy. Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 2: 40:04

And room service is included.

Speaker 1: 40:06

Yeah, room service is included, so you don't want to go out, yeah.

Speaker 3: 40:12

Okay, so you just moved Cunard up the bucket list. So yeah, that was a misconception on my part then.

Speaker 2: 40:24

But it's a very common one for Cunard. People believe that, and I think that marketing lends itself to that as well.

Speaker 1: 40:33

It sure does.

Speaker 2: 40:34

When you see butlers there with the white gloves on when you get on and a band as you get on and stuff everyone on the show is always immaculately dressed In the evening gown. They never show people like me, or maybe Paul, in shorts and flip-flops and a T-shirt.

Speaker 1: 40:48

Yeah, not at night.

Speaker 2: 40:49

No, not at night Not at all, but yeah, it is how they do it. Yeah, excuse me, let's move on to the news stories. Okay, move on to, uh, the news stories. Okay, so, um, we have three news stories, so it'll be really interesting to get both your takes on these right. The first one and a little bit different to the sort of ones we normally talk about on here.

Speaker 2: 41:09

So norwegian cruise line yes we've talked around a little bit in this already it's there. Their new chief financial officer, mart Martin Kamper, has just announced in the last couple of days that the cruise line needs to make $300 million worth of cost-corrings Wow, and it's going to make $300 million of savings over the next three years, with two-thirds of it, they've said, are going to come from operating costs and the rest from marketing, sales and admin, and the rest from marketing, sales and admin. So, in other words, 200 million of that has got to come from operating costs, which just seems like a staggering amount of money. And I'm just curious about both your take in terms of one, what you think about that and two, where would they save those sort of things from operating? Good grief.

Speaker 3: 42:04

Without it really affecting the passenger experience. Well, you know, I am I hadn't heard that and very disappointed to hear that, mainly because I have a NCL cruise boat. So it's on Prima, which I understand is a very nice ship. I can't imagine how well. I guess I can't imagine it. I don't know what that's going to come out of. Haven't they already cut down the number of times the person cleans your room?

Speaker 2: 42:42

down the number of times uh the person uh, cleans your room. Yeah then, done a couple of things over the last couple of years. Went to around um, sort of optimizing, sort of staff time and costs attached to that. So I think, that when he said from opera we all know you know you've run your own chain of businesses. There's always ways that you can save little bits of money without impacting customer experience. We're saving $200 million over the next couple of years.

Speaker 2: 43:07

That's a lot to save without getting rid of staff or getting rid of the mercs or reducing quality of food. And I'm not saying they're going to do any of that, because they haven't said it. All they've said is it's going to come from operating costs.

Speaker 3: 43:21

That's cutting into the bone.

Speaker 1: 43:23

I mean oh goodness, yeah, for me, the way that, one way they could do it and everybody will be super cross if they do is in that if you book the haven and you book and you have haven dining, you've just got one menu with one selection for the entire cruise can we announce what we've all hidden? Yes, in the haven. Does that mean they're going to introduce that into the main dining room? Well, it just sounds signature items in the main dining room. So there's not the choice anymore. Because, because, why would you?

Speaker 2: 44:00

Wow, that would be amazing if they had a single menu for the entire cruise. Yeah, like, swing my head, they'd essentially do it for the people that are paying even more than that. Wow, I've never even driven that. Oh, that would be. Yeah, that's then. You just save them the money, right? You can, martin, can pay us our commission line and just present each other. I'll be fine.

Speaker 3: 44:26

But don't they already nickel and dime you a lot? I mean, I've been on several NCL ships, but this is the first ship that I'm going on that has like the go-karts and they already charge you for that right.

Speaker 2: 44:43

but this is the first ship that I'm going on. It has like the go-karts Um, and they already charge you for that, right?

Speaker 3: 44:46

Yeah, I mean, it's not trade. No, yeah, and I hear they charge for, uh, mini golf and dog boards, uh, so this is all before this, this, this $300 million edict. I mean, I know those things that they've done are revenue generating things, but you know, it doesn't. I don't, I'm not happy to hear that, only because I know that I have a cruise coming up with them and it's probably going to impact that cruise.

Speaker 2: 45:15

It'll be really interesting to keep an eye on that. As I said, that's not normally the sort of thing we collect, as we tend to cover the more lighter news, but when I saw it I was like I feel like I want to talk about that. Anyway, let's move on to something that I know we will all enjoy talking about more. New story two and this impacts both of us, because we're going on them in just a few days' time. Paul's going on them shortly.

Speaker 2: 45:40

Princess Cruises, yes, so they've just announced that they're launching a series of Loveline, because Princess is the Loveline. Premium liquors, and if you've got the premium drinks package, you get them. But these are from celebrities such as Romero Brito and his Coseco band, big Bull, big Bull, big Bull, and he's vodka, okay. Jason Aldean, who I'm after a bit, wasn't familiar with, but he's a country singer Okay. About the, I think, really. The wines, okay, and they're now doing that. That's on Sun Princess now already. Wow. So I know Paul's's on Sun Princess now already. So I know Paul's on Sun Princess, I think next year, and we're going on Rubik's Princess in three days' time.

Speaker 2: 46:26

So I don't know if they'll be on there by the time we get there. No, I hope so. What I've said is it'll be across the entire fleet by summer. It's nearly summer, so maybe we get something a little more convincingly. I'd'm interested to know your thoughts on this, because we obviously came back from some Princess Re-Sight and one of the things that we didn't say was they need more drinks and more cocktails. Having just launched 200 new cocktails and we didn't get halfway through the menu in the time they were on there, do you think that that's good enough to be needed?

Speaker 1: 47:02

I don't think the needles aren't. So, princess, if I'm honest, I could see maybe a fancy Prosecco in the Love Piper restaurant, but all the no. Well, I mean the thing is, if it was on, I would try it. I would try Pitbull's vodka.

Speaker 2: 47:18

Let's go back oh, does Pitbull's vodka being available on Princess, drive that needle off for you to go on them even more. No. Well, let me ask Paul oh, does Peter Paul's vodka meaning a fellow or own princess? Drive that needle off you to go on them even more. No.

Speaker 3: 47:29

No Of the spirits that you mentioned I could imagine me on. My cruise on sun is 14 days long and I do't. And I do have the premier package. I wouldn't miss any. I mean I don't plan to try any of them.

Speaker 2: 47:53

Well, they're included when you do get on there. So maybe, Kevin, you've got the package. You better go. We've not managed to try it. There's always one to try.

Speaker 3: 48:05

Yeah, nothing, I heard nothing compelling. Now one thing I've noticed, a little off topic, but it's still about Sun Princess. So in your photo and then in a couple of other photos that I've gotten from people who have been on Sun Princess, they have the Aperol Spritz stand right, yes, yeah, so that was something that I would try. Yeah, what was special about that little stand? Was that always there?

Speaker 2: 48:39

No, Most of the time when it wasn't in use and it was kept down the back of the seat terrace. This is the other side, where the door was strapped open and away and then the wheelie out when the weather's nice or when it's a sea day.

Speaker 3: 48:52

Oh, okay, okay.

Speaker 2: 48:54

And you got them serving from there.

Speaker 3: 48:55

I didn't look at it.

Speaker 2: 48:57

We did have an apple as well as having our pictures we did. I think what Princess of Dums selling with some princess and for me this is where it leads into it is they're trying to get that celebrity branding down along. What they've done you've got Stolban by Magic Castle you know they're looked by Grit. They've got the Kaisushi by Metallica. You've got all these various sort of celebrity brands attached and I think this is just end of the video.

Speaker 1: 49:25

They're just sprinkling some stardust.

Speaker 2: 49:27

Yeah, and I think that's all.

Speaker 3: 49:29

Yeah, I'm very much into celebrity branding with food. Alcohol, you can just kind of buy a line out of a distillery and put your name on it. Food it's more I don't know seems more meaningful, like on Carnival's Excel class they have the I don't know if you've been on Mardi Gras, you know they have the I don't know if you've been on Mardi Gras or okay, but anyway they have a really nice setup by what's the guy?

Speaker 3: 50:14

Lagasse, emeril Lagasse, and so you know you're eating. I'm eating at his places, at a couple of his places in New Orleans, and when I eat there I feel like I'm eating at one of his spots in New Orleans, so that's a little more meaningful to me. In terms of celebrity branding, it's more with food than it is with alcohol. Alcohol just kind of seems opportunistic for celebrities.

Speaker 2: 50:42

I'm sure that the sororities died until the agreement said they've had bad dream, look bad. This, or?

Speaker 1: 50:50

that Real stop line for sector?

Speaker 2: 50:53

Yeah, we will use mine if I'm going to get in the people, but that's quite random.

Speaker 3: 51:01

You've mentioned Love by Brito a couple of times. When you were on son, was that open?

Speaker 1: 51:06

yet no.

Speaker 3: 51:08

I didn't think so. Okay, because I'm in conversation now with Rudy Soderman to come back on to talk specifically about Love by Brito. So I think that's going to happen soon, but I didn't remember you guys mentioning it when I had you on the podcast and I wanted to see oh, I didn't know you were there. How was it?

Speaker 2: 51:37

We were waiting on the art arriving and it was coming via ship and because of the troubles in sort of the Red Sea and the canal coming via shipping, and because of the troubles in sort of the Red Sea and the canal, it had to reroute. So rather than getting there when it expected to, by shipping, it would learn and therefore they couldn't open the restaurant without all the art installation.

Speaker 3: 51:56

So that's why it wasn't a one way, road man, but again, that's celebrity branding and I am looking forward to trying that Now. Is that going to be one of those super, super pricey places?

Speaker 2: 52:08

Yeah, yeah, that's the most Along with Stelbound. It's most expensive, I think it's $149.

Speaker 1: 52:17

I think that's about right.

Speaker 3: 52:18

Okay, $149 a person.

Speaker 1: 52:20

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 52:21

Well, that's well, I mean, that's doable. It's better than Empire Summer Club on iCarb.

Speaker 1: 52:29

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 52:30

Yeah, that's nearly double that, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3: 52:31

Yeah, yeah so yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 52:34

Personally, it's good yeah yeah. The final news story. Okay, during Bats this one you mentioned already and the other one, the Touch your Heart World Caribbean rig oh, they've just announced that they are extending and doing loyalty match across all of their brands again. In the past they used to do this. I remember they used to do it. That was as Mara was part of the brand.

Speaker 3: 53:00

No, who's the son? I'm the son leader.

Speaker 2: 53:03

This is Royal Caribbean. Okay, if you've got, for instance, diamond status with Royal Caribbean, they can automatically move you to that same status, equivalent level with Silver Seas and with Celebrity affected, from June the 5th, in just four days' time. Yeah, they're automatically doing it. So, from June the 5th, which is four days' time, they're automatically doing it. So if you're matched into any one, if you're enrolled in any one of them, they will create you the other one.

Speaker 1: 53:30

So have they packed that then?

Speaker 2: 53:34

Yeah, they're not being on there, so there's a new announcement and what they'll give you is whichever. If you've been with all three, whatever you've got the highest tier at they'll map that across.

Speaker 1: 53:42

If you've been with all three, whatever you've got the highest tier at the matrakos which should seem sensible yeah, yeah, they don't do it with carnival, they don't get it for P&O and princess no, and well, that's where my question was going to be.

Speaker 2: 53:57

On this there's not really anything in common, because nobody's going to say, well, that's a terrible idea, but it was. Do you think that other cruise family groups such as MSC because it's MSC, and now Explorer?

Speaker 1: 54:12

Well, MSC matches Carnival.

Speaker 2: 54:14

Carnival, carnival group need to do it. Shouldn't they do it as well?

Speaker 1: 54:19

Yes.

Speaker 2: 54:21

That's a very short answer to that question.

Speaker 3: 54:25

Rowing profile and response. Yes, that's a very short answer to that question, rowing profile and response.

Speaker 2: 54:28

Yes, I'm just finding it weird that they don't do this already. They already do. You've just mentioned there were the Carnival groups and probably I want to say an example of really diverse ships. So you've got Carnival, you've got Costa, you've got Princess, you've got P&O, you've got Cunard I can't think of a group that I mean. I think also within there, you've got Seabourn or Regent, you've got such a massive spectrum Dove Torres' phone, the more entry-brand, if we can call that with Costa, open to the ultra luxury seven star cruising. You've got HAL in there. Yes, hal, of course. So why would you not want to keep people in the green? I said as much. We spent a lot of time cruising in Royal Caribbean and then with Diamond status, yeah, but then that got transferred to something different, which is great, yeah.

Speaker 1: 55:27

So we're all in, we're fixing everything today.

Speaker 2: 55:29

We've fixed everything. We've fixed the operations on Norwegian just single menu in the dining room. That'll be an incredibly popular one and say well done. People can come back and thank you for that later. Oh yeah, and we just started everything out.

Speaker 2: 55:44

Well, that's bringing us up towards the end of the podcast which we'll come on to in an hour. That's absolutely flown by Paul. We'll just wrap things up a bit. Is there anything you'd like to say that you've got coming up? What's the next podcast that we can all be excited about listening to? What's the next podcast that we can all be excited about listening to.

Speaker 3: 56:05

So I have a couple of podcasts kind of all related to river cruising coming up. Well, actually, some have already taken place and then a couple more coming up, and that's kind of selfish on my part because our next cruise is a river cruise, because our next cruise is a river cruise, so I can't get enough of river cruise content right now. So, yeah, a lot of that. I'm trying to think has anyone told you that they're working on? Rudy again Got an interesting podcast coming up with a woman who I'm sure I think I mentioned it earlier this Ultimate World Cruise that Royal Caribbean has done.

Speaker 3: 56:57

So there's sort of a subculture building of content creators, influencers, whatever you want to call it, some, but not all, who are on that cruise and they've become very popular. And so I've got probably the most prominent of those and she's on the cruise. I mean, she's been on the Today Show, she's been in USA, she's been like every top media outlet has contacted her, but you know, but they usually ask her one question or something very superficial. She mentioned this after our interview because the interview was very in-depth. So that's going to be fun to listen to Someone who went on the cruise ship with maybe not even triple digits in followers on Instagram I'm sorry, not Instagram TikTok and now she has 179,000 followers. And again, you know she's only been on the cruise for six months, so all of that growth has happened in six months.

Speaker 3: 58:03

So that's going to be in six months, yeah, so that's, that's got to be kind of fun.

Speaker 2: 58:06

Yes, that'll be really interesting to listen to. Yeah, the old sort of ultimate query said is also very this silt culture and we we've listened to several people and watched several videos on that. Yeah, we will definitely be tuning in. Yeah, that sounds like an absolutely fascinating one, but that brings us to.

Speaker 3: 58:26

I was just going to say, you know, going back to a question that you asked us kind of what we don't like in a cruise, and I kind of said you know an old ship, a small ship, and then a later question you had was what would it take to get you on one of those ships? Well, this would be an example. You know, this Royal Cruise is on Serenade of the Seas. I don't know exactly its age, but I know it's not a new ship and it's a very small ship as Royal Caribbean ships go. So both of those are kind of in my no category, but I would have loved to have been on this ultimate world cruise.

Speaker 2: 59:06

My, my wife would not have but, as you said, for you now, it's also about the destination, not just the ship, and an ultimate world cruise is a pretty hard one to pass up on. Yeah, if it's something that becomes available to you, yep, yep yeah, I went on.

Speaker 3: 59:22

The oldest ship in NCL's fleet is the NCL Spirit and again, you know I said I don't like to go on old ships. I went on that ship but it had the best itinerary of any cruise I ever took and that was from Hawaii to Alaska. So there's another example of what would it take to get you on one of those ships that you don't particularly care for. And plus, even though it's their oldest ship in the fleet, it just had a $150 million refurbishment, so inside the ship everything looks brand new.

Speaker 2: 59:59

You can make a lot of good stuff with $150 million. Yeah, I think you can Gotcha Well. That think you can Gotcha Well. That brings us up to the end of the podcast. It just reminds us to say cheers, paul, thank you for joining us. Thank you for joining us.

Speaker 1: 1:00:11

Cheers, darling Cheers friends. And thank you for listening and have a lovely day.

Speaker 3: 1:00:16

Thank you very much. Thank you audience for listening.