Roots to Revenue

Double the Risk, Double the Reward? This Business Opens a Second Location // The 160-Mile Gamble

• Robbie Lynn • Season 1 • Episode 14

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Imagine risking 15 years of hard work on a dream. That's exactly what Darren, owner of Rain or Shine Garden and Ground Services, is doing. He's relocating his thriving business 160 miles away, leaving his trusted team in charge while he manages from afar.

In this episode of Roots to Revenue, Darren reveals the personal reasons behind this daring move and the challenges he faces:

  • Staff Management: How will he train and motivate his team from a distance?
  • Customer Relationships: Will his clients stay loyal when he's no longer a local presence?
  • Logistical Hurdles: Can he effectively manage a 4-hour commute and the demands of a growing business?

Discover the strategies Darren is using to ensure his company not only survives but thrives during this massive transition. From staff empowerment to customer communication, he shares valuable insights for any business owner considering a relocation.

Don't miss this inspiring story of courage, risk, and the pursuit of a dream. Watch now and find out if Darren's 160-mile gamble pays off!

#businessrelocation #smallbusiness #entrepreneur #gardeningbusiness #remotework #staffmanagement #customerrelationships #jobber

Try out Jobber for FREE with a 14-day trial and then 40% off for your first 3 months; use this link https://go.getjobber.com/premierlawns

Robbie:

How have you told your staff that you're going to be moving your business? Well, there's going to be a lot of different issues with the staff. Number one, whenever coach comes through, does your current staff, can they go out and do coach for you? Or is that something that you would have to drive back and do? How do you think you'll be able to motivate your staff from afar? If you're, as your name applies, rain and shine. Do you think that the guys will slack off a bit on a wet day whereas before they might not? How do you keep them, how do you plan to keep them motivated? Have you started to tell your customers that you're looking to move?

Darren:

And sometimes customers think that you're the only one that can do things.

Robbie:

What about you? And welcome to the Roots to Revenue podcast. This is the podcast Where we hear from small business owners about the challenges that they had to overcome to become a successful business. I'm Robbie.

Jason:

I'm Jason. And in today's show, we're going to be talking about relocating your business.

Robbie:

Before we do that, let me tell you about today's sponsor. The channel is sponsored by Jobber. Jobber is scheduling and invoicing and quoting software that I've used for the last 10 years to run my business. Not only does it get me paid faster, but best of all, my customers love it. Just before we begin folks, I want to say that the tips that we're talking about today can be applied to any small business, even though today we'll be talking about gardening. Today we have Darren. Hi Darren

Darren:

Hello boys, you okay?

Robbie:

My name's Darren Walters Darren,

Darren:

my business is called Rain or Shine Garden and Ground Services And whereabouts are you based? We're based in the West Midlands but We are expanding into Norfolk.

Robbie:

And how many staff do you have?

Darren:

I've got five staff, two full timers, three part time.

Robbie:

How did you get into gardening to start with?

Darren:

I fell into it after getting made redundant. Didn't plan it at all, just started, I was watering my father in law's plants while he was on holiday, and the neighbour come over and asked me to do something for him, and then it kind of went on from there, and I thought, well, I better go to college and learn a bit. So I went to Pershaw college for a couple of years and it kind of just grew organically from there. Really excuse the pun.

Robbie:

What were your biggest challenges at the start?

Darren:

All of them. I didn't go into it with a business head on. I just went into it with doing whatever I could, but there was lots of things to learn and there's always lots of things to learn along the way. Finance was probably the biggest, Obstacle because I hadn't got a lot of money to go out and buy a new kit So I had to start off with second hand kit and you quickly learn that Cheap kit is not so good and you need to buy a good kit. So if you can buy a second hand good kit, that's better than buying cheap kit. So it kind of started from there really.

Robbie:

Your company's called Rain or Shine. This has been an extremely wet winter. Does that, do you find at times that can work against you?

Darren:

Well, I wanted to use Rain or Shine because of the implications of being independent and reliable. We do have some customers who say, Oh no, it's too wet to cut the grass today and all that. But we normally. let them know that we've got professional equipment and it's good to cope with the wet weather. So we all geared up for it. It's just, we don't necessarily enjoy when it's lashing down.

Robbie:

And how did most of your customers work? Are they on a contract basis or would you go like pay as you go with people or do your, how long have your customers generally been with you?

Darren:

We've got quite good customer retention. So some of our customers are probably 12, 13 years. Most of them are on a monthly contract where they pay the same amount every month and we look after their garden, basically. And then we've got separate people that just have lawn cuts done, so they're more on a pay as you go kind of thing. But I, I don't know. Generally invoice at the end of the month.

Robbie:

Do you use any software to manage your business?

Darren:

Like you, I use Jobber and have been for since it'd be 10 years now actually. 10 years, yeah, so I couldn't run it without Jobber. Initially I used to use Word and Excel, but quite quickly when you get busy you start to miss things and you forget to invoice people and they don't always remind you like you think they would. So once Jobber, I started to use Jobber and got my head around it, then it kind of just works for me now. So I couldn't work without it and I'm not being sponsored. And so

Robbie:

what are your reasons for wanting to move your business?

Darren:

The reason for moving the business is the fact that, my wife and I have always liked the thought of living somewhere more rural to where we live and preferably by the sea. We've been going to Norfolk for on holiday for about seven years now. We just last time we went back in September. We just felt like the time was right for us. So we Everything's lining up for us. My daughter's finishing her master's degree This year so she could end up working anywhere in the country So we haven't got the ties that we've had previously to keep us in the midlands. So that's that's what we're gonna do

Robbie:

What are your plans for your business currently

Darren:

business currently what we will do is because we've got a core group of of good regular customers we're going to keep those customers and my guys are going to look after the, the, the business from production end in Stourbridge. I can still invoice and quote remotely, obviously I can't go out and see, the job's so easy, but I am going to come back every couple of weeks anyway, but basically I can still run the business from Norfolk, and then I will set up another business. The same business in Norfolk and expand from there.

Robbie:

Your business has been established for 15 years Darren. A lot of people will be asking why the move? Why, why now?

Darren:

Well it's not a business decision, it's a personal decision. My wife and I have always wanted to live somewhere more rural so the time is right for us and we need to move and then make the business work.

Robbie:

How far away is the new house compared to where you were? 160 miles. And how far is that in drive time? About 4 hours. It's all lanes really, so it's not an easy drive to be honest. How many times a week do you foresee yourself going back to look after your own business? I'm probably

Darren:

going to come back fortnightly and stay for a couple of three days. it may, I haven't decided which days work best. It might vary to be honest. I can't sort of set it in stone. So you've got to be flexible so you can adapt. But yeah, every couple of weeks really. And obviously I can FaceTime the guys or whatever I need to or they ring me.

Robbie:

And there's going to, I suppose there's going to be a lot of different issues with the staff. Yeah. Number one, whenever quotes come through, does your current staff, can they go out and do quotes for you? Or is that something that you would have to drive back to do?

Darren:

No, we're just starting to, traditionally I've always done the quotes. We're starting to get the guys to go out more, more often. I might need to do some, some forms in Jabber or something to prompt them with some of the questions. Cause sometimes you go and look at a job, you don't always think to ask all the right questions. If they go and have a look at it, they can, see what they think about it. They're the guys that are going to be doing the work. So all I really need to know is how long they think it's going to take. And then, and obviously the details of the quotes and I can produce a quote.

Robbie:

had another guest in Jack Chapman and he said something to me that's really stuck with me out of all the podcasts we've recorded. How long can your business survive without you in it? And Yours can obviously survive for a lot longer.

Darren:

It can. I think we need to put some more measures in place. But the guys tend to use the jobber app and obviously the schedules are normally just done up front anyway. So, but, uh, there are things we need to work on. It's not all, it's not all sorted out yet.

Robbie:

And how much training do you think it's going to take to get the staff up to the level that you're going to be comfortable leaving them with it?

Darren:

happy with the work that they do now on the guardians and that I'm happy with now. But there's just stuff that perhaps I've done that I've never really shown them because I've always done it. So it's just making me think about all the things I do. So I'm starting to try and come up with tools more now so that any potential problems pop up before I actually do leave and we can kind of iron out any creases before it happens.

Robbie:

And how do you think you'll be able to motivate your staff from afar? If you're, if, as your name applies, rain and shine, whenever it's teeming down with rain, Do you think that the guys will slag off a bit on a, on a wet day, whereas before they might not? How do you keep them, how do you plan to keep them motivated?

Darren:

don't think they will because they know the score. we've got a set schedule to stick to and those jobs have got to be done. And we just have to do what we have to do. sometimes we'll get through two or three coats in a day each. But, obviously I need to make sure we've got some good waterproofs.

Robbie:

there's no such thing as the wrong type of well, I believe, the wrong type of waterproof.

Darren:

yeah, I mean, it's a difficult one in our game, isn't it? Because you could have really expensive waterproofs and then go and snag them on a rose or a hawthorn or something like that the first day you wear them. But then obviously cheap stuff doesn't last either, so it's trying to find the balance all the time. Which is why our coats are probably good for half a day if it's lashing it down, so that's why we keep plenty of coats in the vans.

Robbie:

I've always been a, back from my greenkeeping days, I always had at least two sets of wet gear. One for the morning and one for the afternoon, regardless of how good the waterproofs are when it comes to really wet welly.

Jason:

a, looking at it as an employee, How do you reckon it would affect their day to day running? Like, if it was me, I was told that, obviously, you're moving, and, like, how would it affect my day to day?

Darren:

I'm hoping it won't be, have too much of an impact on them. I mean, obviously, we had a meeting and I told them what my plans were. A couple of the guys weren't too surprised, and a couple of the guys were surprised. And I've since had a chat to, Several of them to make sure that they're not worried to the extent that they're going to go and start up on their own. Obviously being employed and then starting up on your own are two different Things and you lose that security of being employed. So we're just aiming to work everything out really. And I'm trying to talk to the guys as much as I can to make sure they're happy. And if any concerns they raise, we will work it out between them. I'm not kind of telling them this is what's happening and this is how it's happening. I'm saying, you need to help me work this out. What age are you?

Robbie:

your employees or predominantly all over 50 apart a couple of guys i think having more mature employees that there's going to be probably a better chance that they're going to understand the situation and

Darren:

i think so yeah i mean the the younger guys understand as well but i think when you get to my my kind of age you're you do try to take things on board a bit more

Jason:

it probably ties in with the question about the day to day but how will their responsibilities going to change in the future Within the business,

Darren:

there will be things that they need to do that I've done previously. even simple things like filling up the fuel cans or filling up the vans. I've always done that and that's not because I didn't trust them or anything. It's just obviously because I started on my own and the business grew. I've kind of always done it and never really stood back and thought, why am I still doing this? So we're going to, we're probably going to look at the fuel cards. if somebody notices that needs filling up, they can fill it up and the same with the fuel cans. we keep our fuel cans in a line and we face them out when they're full and face them in when they're empty. So at a glance, you can see how the fuel cans are doing and whether we're starting to run low on

Robbie:

I think as well, something else that would probably help you out would be a company credit card. that the guys can use if something crops up and you're not available, that that could be paid for.

Darren:

Yeah, I think that's probably a good idea, to be honest. I've never had a company credit card because I haven't really needed one because we tend to push pay with a debit card, but it is good to have

Robbie:

something in reserve. We had another guy on, David Miller, and he suffered a traumatic, a very traumatic injury. And he talked a lot about how whenever he was unconscious in hospital, Suppliers, I take it, have you had a chat with your suppliers to let them know that you're leaving and

Darren:

I haven't yet. I mean, we don't buy that many materials to be honest, because our core business is guarding maintenance. So really, it's just fuel and we've got a local firm that do the repairs. I mean, we do some repairs in house, but sometimes we either don't have the time or the skills or the knowledge, but they're literally down the road. So I might try and set up some sort of maintenance contract with them where we perhaps, you know, we can drop stuff off at short notice and they'll Bump us up the queue or something like that. And, on our trading estate, there's a garage as well. And I'm going to set up a similar thing with the van. So perhaps get each van checked over every couple of weeks, check the tyre pressures, just have a look over it and just keep an eye on the vans as well.

Robbie:

How have you told your staff that

Darren:

you're going to be moving your business, Darren? I called a meeting. I just basically told them how I was feeling and the reasons behind what was happening and the fact that we were going to be moving. But I did want to reassure them that their jobs were safe. Okay. and it was never an option to sort of close the business down in the Midlands because it's got too much value in it really to just sort of walk away from it. So we had a chat and we're trying to keep chatting as much as we can to make sure everyone's as happy as they can be.

Robbie:

I'm sure a lot of the staff had questions for you.

Darren:

More sort of day to day type questions like, how are we going to do this or how are we going to, what's going to happen with, you know, are you going to, how are we going to fill the vans up or whatever. So we're kind of trying to sort of overcome those. Those things will go along.

Robbie:

How long did you have it in the works before you decided to tell the customer or before you decided to tell your your staff and how long has it been since you told them?

Darren:

I think it was September when we saw the house that we wanted to buy and I told them, I think I told them before Christmas, I didn't want to, but we needed to put our house on the market and one of my guys is my next door neighbor. So I had to, so I told them before Christmas, but I didn't want them to worry over Christmas, obviously, so it was sometime in December, I think.

Robbie:

And when do you see the move happening? When do you see the move sort of starting?

Darren:

I think it's going to be August before we physically move.

Robbie:

house agreed and bought?

Darren:

Yeah, we've sold our house and the house is, we've actually got the surveyor coming to my house tomorrow and the surveyor going into the house that we're buying on Friday.

Robbie:

that'll

Darren:

be the make or break really.

Robbie:

So what do you think then? And when do you foresee the big move happening?

Darren:

I think it's going to move, we've got to be out of our house by August. That's what the buyers have specified. So that will be kind of the big move, but we may end up staying in the Midlands a little bit longer, depending on the work that's got to be done on the house. So I don't think it's going to be a clean cut. I think I'll be bobbing back and forwards for a while, and it'll be a slower transition.

Robbie:

And if push comes to shove, and something happens with one of the house seals, do you have any contingencies in place?

Darren:

Not really. I mean, there are other properties out there, but this one's, we kind of set our heart on it really. It's a, it's probably a heart ruling our head situation, but you know, we'd only regret it if we didn't try.

Robbie:

Life's for living and if you want to give something a go, a hundred percent. Take my hat off to you. How have you, have you started to tell your customers

Darren:

that you're? Looking to move? recently, yes, recently. So I've started to email or write to them and tell them there's some changes happening because one of my guys is reducing his days down this year. Another guy retired before Christmas anyway. So we're just starting to tell them there's some changes, but from a customer point of view, it shouldn't make a great deal of difference to them because I'll still be managing the business. They'll still have the guys coming to them as they would normally. So it shouldn't have too much of an impact.

Robbie:

I think a lot of times, especially with a smaller business, customers get used to seeing you in their garden Whenever you stop appearing, it's just the staff members, some people.

Darren:

Yeah, I've had that in the past, and I have got it with a couple at the moment, but I have tried to be stepping back more and more over the last couple of years, really. Not because we knew we were going to move, but more because I needed to be working on the business more, and I wanted to sort of get customers used to sort of the guys without me there, because they're more than capable. And sometimes customers think that you're the only one that can do things.

Robbie:

I've had that plenty of times in the past. And I think, as you grow your business, you have to understand customers have to understand, but some customers just want somebody self employed and that's fine. And they don't necessarily want all the stuff. But as you grow your business, you have to.

Darren:

Unfortunately, some customers think they're the only customer, So you have to kind of educate them, really.

Robbie:

This podcast goes out on all the usual audio channels, such as Apple, Amazon and Spotify, or alternatively, you can watch it on

Jason:

YouTube. If you know anybody that you think could benefit from this podcast, please send it to them, either text them with the link or email them, or if not, if you could leave us a review, it would really help the show.

Darren:

If there's anyone out there that's done a similar thing or had to move locations, had to or wanted to, and you've got some advice that you can give to me, then I'd be happy to hear it.

Jason:

So, with the move coming up, are you already looking into planning on how to get new customers, or are you waiting until you actually move?

Darren:

No, I am starting to plan ahead. Our Rain or Shine Midlands number is a virtual landline. So, we've got now a Norfolk virtual landline set up as well, both of which come through to my phone. So, I've had some business cards done already. I've already handed some out while I was on holiday recently. I've started to talk to all the gardeners in the area, because I think you can't, you know, I can't stress how important it is to get to know other gardeners and, and whether you're passing work on to them or they're passing work on to you, it's good to have a network of people to. to do that with a little Facebook group where I am of gardeners, local gardeners, and we kind of pass jobs on and things like that. So I want to do the same in Norfolk.

Robbie:

I think as well, no matter where you are and even whatever business you're in, but gardening especially, you can do all the research you want, but a lot of time you'll find that there might be two or three gardeners running about that aren't really on social media, but have an awful lot of customers locally to them. So just to make sure that that hopefully that doesn't happen. So local Facebook groups. Yeah, buy and sell Facebook groups are especially good for pretty much free advertising to find people, although it takes time to.

Darren:

Yeah, well, I've joined some of the local groups in Norfolk already under the business name. And also sometimes if you do a search for gardeners in the local group, you'll see recommendations for other gardeners. And then obviously you can pick up their contact details from there, because as you say, they might not necessarily be on any other social media. They might not be on Google. So it's another way to pick up people.

Robbie:

another way that would be really good for you to market yourself would be the likes of a BNI group because you're very experienced in what you do and there'd be a lot of other business owners that you might be able to find. You get a lot of work from. Have you done anything like that in the past? I've done networking groups in the past.

Darren:

The groups that I were in were more kind of full of startup people and the connections they made probably wouldn't be, weren't the kind of customers we were looking for now. Obviously as the business grows your, your customer base changes. So I kind of know what we're looking for now, really. So VNI might be a possibility.

Robbie:

Also, I'd maybe try and start networking with guys on LinkedIn. Other business owners on LinkedIn. And find some potential customers. Although do you think you're going to be looking for domestic customers or commercial customers or a mix?

Darren:

a mix to begin with, certainly with domestic customers, you tend to get that word of mouth recommendation more often than you do a commercial. But if as a business expands and we take on more people, then we might look to go down the commercial route as well.

Robbie:

Do you do much work for estate agents? Do you think that would be a good option to get into the local area?

Darren:

I've been into a couple of letting agents in, in one of the villages already and left some details, so it's a good starting point really. And somebody also said to me that if you can get to know cleaners, because often cleaners are chatting to their, their, their clients like, and they might say, well, you know, my

Robbie:

auntie needs a gardener or whatever,

Darren:

whatever.

Robbie:

I call that the circle of trust. I think it's always really good to have a circle of, always to try and find a circle of tradesmen that you can recommend work to. And then the other side of the coin, hopefully at some point they'll recommend work back. So it's just finding those where, where do you, where do you find those people if you're new to an area?

Darren:

Well, I think for me, obviously the, the, the property we're buying needs some work, so I should be employing some tradesmen anyway. So that's a starting point to get to know them straight away, but just putting yourself out there, and just making phone calls and just keeping an eye on what's going on in the villages and that, and

Robbie:

have you set

Darren:

aside a marketing budget. I haven't if I'm honest because we've never really had to advertise that much in the past and because the density of where we're moving is much lower than where I am now it may be that I do need to advertise but I kind of, I've got to kind of feel my way with it really and see how the other networking and other sort of options work out.

Robbie:

Have you checked out to see if there, what local ad for free magazines are in the area?

Darren:

got a collection in my bedside cabinet already.

Robbie:

Do you think? You'll be advertising the likes of those to drum up some new business?

Darren:

Maybe. I think it did. Obviously, when I begin, it'll just be me. So it's finding enough work just for me. So I don't envisage that being too much of a problem, if I'm perfectly honest. But then obviously, if I then start to employ someone, then I've got to sort of invest a bit more time or maybe money into that

Robbie:

and what size of business would you like to have the same size of business that you currently enjoy at the minute in the new location or do you see it being a smaller business where you are because you're a bit older now

Darren:

i think we could probably go to two or three guys Having like a fleet of vans would be quite hard to manage, I think, especially with a location, 160 miles away as well. So I think it's just going to, I'm just going to have to see how it grows and at what point feels the right point.

Robbie:

Lastly, do you have any exit plans? when do you see yourself retiring?

Darren:

I think until I've built things up in Norfolk, I can't kind of think that far ahead at the moment. No problem.

Robbie:

Well, Darren, just lastly for the audience, do you want to tell them how far you've travelled to today?

Darren:

I've travelled from just outside Birmingham to here, which is, I don't know how many more cities

Robbie:

actually. I'm going to, so I'm going to say you're actually the last podcast that we've recorded. We've recorded 18 in total this year. And just a little, just a stat for you. People have travelled as the crow flies, just under 5, 000 miles to come and take part in the podcast, which is pretty, which is pretty mental, isn't it? Yeah. So listen, thank you very much for coming. You're welcome. Thank you for having me.

Cheers.