Embarking on an emotional pilgrimage through the deep-rooted civil rights history of Alabama, I found myself confronting the very essence of our nation's struggle for equality. From the enduring shadows of Birmingham's segregated past to Selma's iconic marches, and the legislative halls of Montgomery, my birthday sharing a date with the Selma to Montgomery march has become a personal emblem of advocacy for justice. Our conversation unfolds to reveal how these historic echoes resonate in contemporary battles for equal education and environmental fairness.
Joining the dialogue is an esteemed beacon of knowledge, whose life's work orbits the transformative power of education in forging black identity. We delve into his upbringing under the guidance of barrier-breaking parents, his pursuit of academic excellence, and his unwavering devotion to equity and community engagement. His story is a testament to the importance of mentorship and the strength found in cultural bonds, as we examine the profound impact of nurturing networks in personal and professional growth.
As we traverse the intersections of personal finance, fatherhood, and the expanse of community influence, the episode becomes a celebration of the trust and positive energy that unite us. We share tales of mentorship's role in shaping identities, the critical nature of cross-cultural dialogues, and the empowering effect of knowledge-seeking within the embrace of our communities. Our guest's insights, coupled with our own reflections, offer a tapestry of lessons to inspire you toward your goals, reminding you of the indelible imprint you have on the world.
Embarking on an emotional pilgrimage through the deep-rooted civil rights history of Alabama, I found myself confronting the very essence of our nation's struggle for equality. From the enduring shadows of Birmingham's segregated past to Selma's iconic marches, and the legislative halls of Montgomery, my birthday sharing a date with the Selma to Montgomery march has become a personal emblem of advocacy for justice. Our conversation unfolds to reveal how these historic echoes resonate in contemporary battles for equal education and environmental fairness.
Joining the dialogue is an esteemed beacon of knowledge, whose life's work orbits the transformative power of education in forging black identity. We delve into his upbringing under the guidance of barrier-breaking parents, his pursuit of academic excellence, and his unwavering devotion to equity and community engagement. His story is a testament to the importance of mentorship and the strength found in cultural bonds, as we examine the profound impact of nurturing networks in personal and professional growth.
As we traverse the intersections of personal finance, fatherhood, and the expanse of community influence, the episode becomes a celebration of the trust and positive energy that unite us. We share tales of mentorship's role in shaping identities, the critical nature of cross-cultural dialogues, and the empowering effect of knowledge-seeking within the embrace of our communities. Our guest's insights, coupled with our own reflections, offer a tapestry of lessons to inspire you toward your goals, reminding you of the indelible imprint you have on the world.
All right, welcome to just another episode or edition of the Journey to Freedom podcast, and I'm just excited about the possibilities of things that we're going to be able to do on this show. I just returned from Alabama this week, omar, and it was an eye-opening just. I guess me coming back from there going this is more important now than it has ever been. You know, I felt like I went back in time. I felt like I went back to the 60s or 70s that's how it felt because they haven't been able to progress, and a lot of the reason they haven't been able to progress is because there's laws that are still written in place, like, for instance, the minimum wage.
Speaker 1:We had this tour by just an amazing man that is just kind of disgruntled because he says we can't do anything. You know, birmingham tried to raise the minimum wage last year. There is no minimum wage in Alabama, so they're going off of the federal minimum wage, which is like $7.25 an hour, which is super low. He was saying that the state says no, even though Birmingham as a city tried to raise it. They're not allowed to because the state of Alabama says no, because the state rolls there's like 900 pages in their legislation, of laws and things that they have to go through.
Speaker 1:It was just, you know the Black high school we went from. You know, back in the 60s, right before they had you know the you know the fire hose day and everything else there's. You know you could see where the segregation was. Where you go from one street which is nicer to another street which was project housing and that kind of stuff, the Black high school sits on that street. Black high school, they said the first year that they had a white student graduate from that high school was 2002. Wow, was 2002. And right now, currently there are only five white students at that high school.
Speaker 2:Now what about the high school that's probably designated in a different area? How many Black people do you have at that school?
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's a great question, because he did. I did not even ask that and he didn't know, but you could tell the. You know, we went into areas where you know, where there's train tracks, where there's food deserts, where there's you know, they said the soil is so bad in that area that the EPA won't even measure the soil. It's that toxic and that bad and it's the Black neighborhoods that are all around that that are doing stuff, and so it was just that part. So that's Birmingham.
Speaker 1:Then we go to Selma, which was great. We got to go to, you know, walk over the Bettis Bridge and you know, you think of the why couldn't they change it? They wanted to change the name of the Bettis, you know, bettis Bridge to the John Lewis Bridge, but of course the state of they call it a monument or something, and it's impossible to change the name of a state monument unless they change the law. So that's not going to get changed. Then we go to Montgomery, the next, you know, and we actually go down the path where they were walking and you know the three, four, five. So what I did find out is when they were marching. My birthday, the actual day I was born, was when they were marching from Selma to Montgomery, so I was like I kept pretty slow, so wait a minute, so let me get this right.
Speaker 2:I want, I want to breathe, please, please.
Speaker 2:So you're a person who I know that has always advocated for underserved populations, whether especially our cofax corridor, working with our unhoused community, and I think it's special for you to be born on that day because to me you have been an advocate for communities that, for whatever reason, the justice system, our political system, our economic system haven't been able to serve them well and you've been an advocate for those individuals. So I think it is amazing to find out that you were born on that day, but guess what? I'm not surprised.
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah, it was just. Yeah. I'm with you there, 100%. So.
Speaker 2:I'm supposed to be interviewed, but I got to share those flowers.
Speaker 1:I love it and we have time together today. So this is this is a organic opportunity for us to really talk you. We will get to the interview with you. I just wanted to share some of those thoughts as of this recording and as of you and I talking about this today. You know the Legacy Museum and I don't know have you ever had the opportunity? Have you been there?
Speaker 2:I haven't been to the Legacy Museum.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh. So so, brian Stevenson, if you ever get an opportunity to watch the things that he's put Just Mercy was the movie that he put together that, that spirit that spirit.
Speaker 2:That was a good movie.
Speaker 1:Yes, it was an amazing movie. And then there's a whole special about Brian Stevenson that I would implore you to watch if you haven't. That just talks about this Legacy Museum, and so that was. You know that was a hard reality to kind of walk through to see. You know, from the lynching side of it to slavery, they have this one, this one exhibit that shows from like 1500. And it shows these dots of from Africa, of how many slave journeys like 30,000 slave ship. You know the slave, you know the. What is that? The trade route that the, you know the slave ships went on and then so it goes through slavery. Then it jumps into, you know the segregation and then jumps into lynching and then jumps into mass incarceration. You know, goes into voting, where you're seeing like the laws, in order to vote. How many jelly beans are in this jar?
Speaker 1:You know, you start seeing some of that oh man, the voting laws.
Speaker 2:The voting laws were ridiculous, but, by the way, the people who enforced the laws couldn't pass can pass those tests, yeah, so, which is why nobody, nobody can pass those tests. Which is why in some cases, they had to go with the grandfather clause. If your grandfather voted, you're able to vote, because many of them were illiterate.
Speaker 1:So of course they were illiterate, they couldn't talk oh my gosh, yeah. So we really got to. You know, I was immersed in a lot of stuff that I read in books, but to really see the sites and to see people living in those those places. You know, one of the things, and the reason I even brought a lot of this up, is the NAACP was stopped from operating in 1957. Like, they were not allowed to be an organization in the state of Alabama in 1957. And I don't know at what time they were able to come back, but it was a state law. You are not allowed. The other one that really that really got me was the like interracial marriages. And you know, up until in Mississippi in 1987, if you were in an interracial marriage a white you know white counterpart there's a man or a female in an interracial in 1987, it was punishable by life in prison.
Speaker 1:Life in prison Life in prison, not like two years in a fine life in prison, if you, if you were married in the state of Mississippi to a.
Speaker 2:Was that just black and white in the racial relationship?
Speaker 1:Black and white, white and white, the Native American, white and Hispanic.
Speaker 2:All three. Now what about if you were black and married someone that was Asian or indigenous?
Speaker 1:Oh, asian, both Asian and Asian indigenous. Both were part of that. Well, asian, I don't know, mississippi, if that was life in prison, but it was. That one might have been a fine if it was Asian, and yeah, so, and that was in 1987. You know, there was, it was, I think it was Alabama that had in 1998, but it was only a two year, two years possible, two years in jail and a fine, but it wasn't life in prison, but it was still 1998, which is 1998, which is go, are you? This is unreal that this was happening back then, and so you know, just to be able to talk about it. So, omar, thank you for being on today. I sure appreciate you.
Speaker 1:I'm gonna give you a chance to introduce yourself. Omar is the, you know, the president of the local chapter here of the NAACP here in Aurora, colorado and Hills from California. You know, I knew he grew up in Southern California. I'm gonna let him tell his story a little bit here in a second, as we've been talking about this journey to freedom and how are we going to make sure that we are spending time talking about trust? You know, and you know I think we solve everything with trust and I think I've told people several times on this podcast. You know, I went to this trust seminar and I learned all these wonderful things about how you lead with trust and how we trust people and you know, thinking about the black community. And how do we trust ourselves, how do we trust our spouses, how do we trust, you know, where we walk into.
Speaker 1:That was when we were in Selma. We was at nighttime. We actually walked the bridge at nighttime. Then we decided to walk the church to the church, right, and so I was even a little bit uneasy because it's, you know, eight and nine o'clock at night is totally black outside. We actually stopped down one of those roads that you know didn't have all the lighting and stuff and just turned off the lights and said what would it have been like for somebody escaping from slavery in these backwoods to be able and not knowing where they're going? And so I was a little bit uneasy in how we show up and our idea, you know, and then we talk about identity and how, who we are as folks and what we're able to obtain, whether it's education or those other things, and then, you know, the health was a big thing. I think I've explained this a few times we're. A few weeks ago somebody took out a tape measure you'll appreciate this and they had me hold it at zero.
Speaker 1:Then we went to you know, 72 inches, and then he said, okay, let's lock it in at 72, let's go down to. You know I'm 59 now. So I went to 59. And he said, okay, let the rest of the go. So from 59 to 72, that's how long you got left. If you're the typical African-American male, the life expectancy is 72. And I looked at that and go wait, that's only. I'm gonna live way longer than 22, but that's only 13 years from now, and I'm thinking about my last 13 years and all the things I've done.
Speaker 2:You know I'm not I think about the same thing, brian. I think about not waiting and living life now and also doing everything I can to beat that expectation so that we can increase that number. And we have to understand that there's a lot of reasons for that number to be in place, but I personally I'm a dual I can't to supersede that number.
Speaker 1:Absolutely Well, one of the things that my last podcast I talked to a guy named John L Moody and he's like an expert in emotional, emotional quotient EQ. You know, like instead of IQ it's EQ, so it's emotional quotient, I guess, is the word, and he really he kind of talked about all the stress as black men that shortens our lifestyle, not even just the food or exercise or help, just all the things that had happened and the things you know what's in our DNA, from all the way from slavery, from taking, you know families, you know dads out of homes in the, you know the 70s and late 60s and you know, the segregation and the mass incarceration and you know it was like one in three people they said that in those Southern states was expected to spend some time in prison.
Speaker 1:One out of three black men, and that's you start thinking about that. Yeah, that's a major stress that we live with, that we have to work through and get through.
Speaker 2:I would also say that during that time where we were focused on the one in three, we didn't think about why the three. We didn't put together too many models thinking why the three was able to beat the odds. We spent a lot of time talking about the one which we need to put a lot of resources into the one, but the best support the one. What about a model that talk about why the other three were able to address that adversity and be able to live productive lives? Yeah, just a thought.
Speaker 1:Oh no, I agree with that. We definitely should come back to. That is one of some of the things we can do. So, omar, you know why we have the time. Go ahead and introduce yourself. Go ahead and you know, yeah, tell us about your background, what you've done with your life and where you're at now, and why some of these things are so important to you.
Speaker 2:First, brian, I just want to say thank you for having me on the show. I love Journey to Freedom and I love that title and I think that title embraces many of the things that black America has had to face, not just men, but just black America. How you see yourself in black America and some people may say, hey, I'm not black, I'm African American, I'm this, I'm that. I'm gonna own the term black because that identity part is also to me, part of the freedom. And so I grew up in Los Angeles, california. My father was a college instructor out of Cal State, long Beach, and also an activist in the community. My mother they were in two separate households so I there was a co-parenting thing going on which I have no issues with because I know they both love me, continue to love me immensely, but love me as I was growing up.
Speaker 2:My mother was a bus driver and during the time when women, you know that that wasn't a popular profession for a woman. So she had to really just go through a lot, a lot of adversity just to get the job and then, once she had the job, many people would question her qualifications Can she handle this, Can she handle that? And ended up making a career out of being the bus driver and able was to provide for me between her and my father, co-parenting. So I always got a chance to see what hard work was like my father man. He was a college instructor, he taught high school, he taught at community college, all at one time while being an activist in the community, taking care of his brothers and sisters as much as he could. He's one of 12 brothers and sisters and my mother is one of I believe she has four. So in the fact that's the side of I know the best, I can't even get the number, but it's one of four daughters.
Speaker 2:And so, with just being in that dynamic where my father, I have a bunch of uncles, I have a bunch of aunts and where on my mother's side it was predominantly women, it was my grandmother, it was my aunts and it was my mother, and so you got a chance to see what the world looked like on both sides. And because I was able to travel to different parts of Southern California a lot of people don't have that opportunity, although it may just be a free way away I was able to be on the college campus when I was eight, nine years old, I participated. My father had me participating in the protest the Ron Suttles case when I was eight, nine years old, so. And my mother had me in church every Sunday. So, although she couldn't take me because she was a bus driver, we had the church bus. For those who remember back in those days, I do.
Speaker 2:I do the church bus. I went to Sunday school. I did go to private school the majority of my life, until my senior year in high school and they ended up graduating from Cal State, Long Beach with a degree in black studies and a second degree in criminal justice. A master's in public policy administration from Cal State, Long Beach and they, master's in education from national university, Started a doctoral program. I didn't finish but hopefully one day I'll go back and finish. But you know that's where I'm at. I currently the director of equity culture, community engagement for Cherry Creek School District and president of the Aurora Branch of the NAACP. Tottenhire Ed at Cal State, Long Beach, Metro and the University, Colorado, Denver and national university. Adding all that up, I taught in higher ed for over 20 years. So that's my background.
Speaker 1:Wow, and you start thinking about that and why, how important this is going to education? Because you have education. I'm sure there's some counterparts that were in the schools that you attended when you were growing up that you can now look back. After however many years 20 years of teaching in higher education how has education enabled you to move around and to achieve some of the things you've had? You know, compared to somebody who doesn't have that you know some of that education.
Speaker 2:I'm a look at education from two, please, different. There's the academic education and then there's the education that you learned through life and through life experiences, and I have been fortunate to benefit from both. I wasn't the brightest kid I would say that I would own, that my father did all he could to get me accepted in the Cal State Long Beach let's just say it that way Because I know my credentials probably wasn't the best going in. And what I learned was when I was at Cal State Lone Beach I surrounded myself with some people. My father said always surround yourself with people smarter than you. So I found the smartest kids that looked like me at Cal State Lone Beach. We were all freshmen and we took care of each other. If we didn't have enough money to park, because you know you had to pay for parking, one of us will park on the outside. We're all caravan and do what we could to pay for parking together.
Speaker 2:Tuesday night tacos at Taco Bell. When Tuesday night was 25, set tacos. We tried to find all the changes in the car. Yes, yes, so we could feed each other. Before. Cell phones we would call each other two, three o'clock in the morning, yes, waking up parents and all that stuff to make sure you got your paper done, to make sure you study. I worked at UPS and worked at Cal State, lone Beach, and I had a graveyard shift. So when I go home, either I was going straight to school, I was going home and my friends would be like did you get your paper done? Did you get your school? Did you get your homework done? No, bro, you can't go to sleep, we gotta go to the library. That education was about the academic part. But also, how do we navigate life so that we could be successful? I say we because all of us graduated and all of us got advanced degrees, because that was our goal.
Speaker 1:That is so and I love what you're saying there because there is the education that you get. That has nothing to do with what's in a textbook or what the professor is saying, and I liken it to. If we look at our identity piece and the identity that folks have because they went through some of those things to be able to get it and there's so many people, I look at some of the trades and stuff that are out there. If I'm a master welder, I think I might.
Speaker 1:My grandpa and he's had a eighth grade education, but he owned his own dairy. He was one of the leading farmers up in the Central Valley. Everybody went to him because he was so intelligent. He read a ton. He was, yeah, the education at the end of his and then whatever the 1930s or whatever it was when everybody else was going to school I guess it was actually the 1920s he was out in the field and making sure that the family had money to live on. There was nobody going to school then. But that identity piece and what I want people to hear is we want your identity is a lot about where you come from.
Speaker 1:The place things that you've done. It's not necessarily the education you have. I'm not saying the education doesn't help, because the second thing you said was the associations and who you hang out with. I think even to me builds way more than just the classroom you went or the degree you got, because I know a lot of people with degrees that you can't hardly have a conversation with because the associations of the people that they're around have brought them to a point where they're frozen in time, frozen in some of the things they've done. What would you say to that identity piece of education and the different ways we learn?
Speaker 2:Well, I'm gonna say this when you're going back to your grandparents, the people who didn't have the degrees that was around me were some of the most intelligent people around. My grandmother only had the eighth grade education, but read the newspaper every single day from beginning to end. My mother, who graduated from high school, only had a couple of years of college, has read more books than I could ever dream of. Super intelligent. My father yes, master's degree, college athlete, this, that and the other, but he was able to combine 12 brothers and sisters and you're the big brother in some cases and everybody's trying to eat and the different ways he had to navigate life to help his father and to help his mother provide for the family. And it was all hands on deck, not just him, it was the other brothers and sisters doing their part, but it was all hands on deck.
Speaker 2:Those are things you can't teach. Those are things you have to experience. You have to see people get up and work hard. My mother got up at four o'clock in the morning and then she had to wake me up to take me to my aunt's house. So for me to get up early in the morning because something gotta get done is nothing. It's what you do at that time when you get up in the morning. That my mother taught me yeah, yeah, so, yeah. So education is more than just getting the degree. Getting a degree is great, but for me and I'll end it on this note it's about how you get the degree, how you take your life experience and become a bridge builder for those around you and those that you have embraced in your life.
Speaker 1:Gotcha, Now being a professor and working at the school district and we have these opportunities where we've had a lot of black men being able to go to college and get degrees and then they graduate and they have a whole bunch of student debt and we're kind of moving into finances now, right, and we're moving into you know, whether that. You know, maybe they got a little bit of a scholarship, but it wasn't enough and now they're graduating with a lot of student debt and they're having trouble finding positions that they went to school for. What would you say? And part of that starts eroding at our identity, right, and it arose at. You know, is this me?
Speaker 1:What did I do wrong? What have I not done to be? Did I go get the wrong degree? Did I not, you know, study hard enough? Did I not get the best grade? Do you know the grade that I needed to grade? What would you say to those young men or to those folks that are struggling after they've gone and got the education but it just hasn't worked out the way that they wanted it to?
Speaker 2:First, I'm gonna say I am still paying off college debt, so let's just put that out there. But I haven't let it stop me from doing anything I want to do. That debt gonna probably be with me as much as I have. It's probably gonna be with me until when I, just in time, I just own it. I just say, hey, you know what, I'm not complaining about it. I'm still an entrepreneur. I still got my own business. I'm still able to get the jobs I need. I own not flat out, I'm still paying the mortgage, but I own the house. I have a car. I have halfway decent credit not the best, but halfway decent credit and I'm sure this with you, brian, that I wouldn't take my college experience with some of the best years of my life. I don't have. I probably only have one high school friend I stay in contact with. I probably got more middle school friends I stay in contact with than I do, but my college friends.
Speaker 2:When you talk about trust within our community, my one of my big brothers, william Gideon, taught me how to be a professional, taught me how to yes, my father was a college professor this, that and the other, but some things I had to learn when to wear a shirt and tie, when not to wear a shirt and tie, making sure you have certain suits on deck. My father get out and go get the suits and will say hey, bro, this how you walk. In the meeting A good friend of mine named Vicky did my first resume, taught me how, when you step into a job, this is what your resume should look like. My friend Mark taught me how to advocate in written form. You know I was able to write, but he was able to write in the school newspaper, went to Preparation School of Law and passed one of the most difficult bars in the country, the California bar, the first time.
Speaker 2:So these were the people struggling just like me my friend Gerald met. Gerald was like the most humble brother I ever met and he taught me about friendship. He taught me about what does it truly mean to be a friend? And, of course, I'm a member of Omega-Side Fire fraternity incorporated. That. All those different experiences is what made me who I am. So I don't I go in trusting my people. I don't have to be convinced. I go in trusting black people. I go in believing that the black people that are around me or has my best interests in my eye and I have their best interests in my eye. As a matter of fact, the outlier is the one that you got to keep your eye on. That's the outlier. That's not the norm for me, absolutely. How?
Speaker 1:And I love you brought up the fraternity because that, as I've seen and been able to watch and seeing the identity of folks I was, when I was just here in Alabama, there was the alphas were having a, they were having a meeting on finances and it was the room was becoming full. There are so many people who, for whatever, like the college I went to, didn't have any fraternities or that opportunity. The I see people who maybe have not gone to you know, maybe not gone to college and work. What is the opportunity for people to help create? You made me talk a little bit about how you know you did, a little bit about how it shaped your identity by being in a group of people that look like you, that you had examples of who had, you know, been older and had been through college and then were, are still working through what. How do people experience that or how that had shaped your identity, I guess.
Speaker 2:I guess it shaped my identity. I have to be honest, when I was growing up, how did that identity was? Watching how street gangs navigate communities, and not all of them, you know. You hear street gangs automatically think the negative are the worst One. Watching my family, how they stick together. Yeah, at times we probably didn't get along, probably wasn't on the same page, but in the end we're together. So anytime I fly to California I'm seeing my father side, the family. I'm seeing my mother side, the family. Let's fast forward. Then I see how street gangs stick together, no matter what People can say what they want.
Speaker 2:Yes, we can talk about the crime element, but this, that and the other. But if my gang members wife need diapers, I'm gonna go get those diapers. If that gang member mom need to get to the doctor, they're gonna take that person to the doctor. So you begin to see the advantage of being a part of people who you love and trust. And when I went to college I was a part of the Black Law Association, the Black Business Student Association, I was president of our Black Student Union. And you begin to see how each of those experiences prepare you for the next stage.
Speaker 2:Because now keep broadening your horizon. If people say, omar, did you only hang out with Black people? No, I hung out with anybody who wanted to hang out with me. If they were about progression, if they were about upliftment, hey, red. If you were white, black, hispanic, jewish, wherever, hey, I was down to hang with you and talk. But guess what? We're also gonna have some courageous and difficult conversations, because sometimes there are some racial elements that we have to discuss in order for that bond to be strong. You just can't walk around that. No, there are some things we have to discuss. And so I got friends from all different ethnicities, races and religion, because I because, yes, I love my people, but at the same time, we stand a global society and you have to know about the world as a Black man, and not just your community.
Speaker 1:Let's talk about a little bit. So when and I'm 100% in agreement. So when we walk into rooms, we walk into rooms that we may be the only person in that room that looks like us, or there's only a few that look like us and we have to, whether it's code switching or we just have to fit in into those areas. How do we teach that? How do we make sure that when we walk in because I find so many men that are older, that say their job, something happened in their job and then they go right to because I was Black, or and in many cases that is absolutely true but as we walk in and we say, how do I navigate this room so that I can be the person who is giving input, not the person that sometimes they're saying well, what do you think?
Speaker 1:Because you're this, you know you don't want to speak for your whole people. You know in every single one of those rooms what, since it happens many times. But how do you grow that relationship and things that you've done to grow those relationships? So you are an equal contributor in those rooms and I've been in some of those rooms with you and so I know you're a master at it in doing it. So, but what are some of those things that you do to be able to make that happen?
Speaker 2:Believing that I belong in the room, even if I'm the only one.
Speaker 1:Okay, so back to identity again.
Speaker 2:I'm stepping into the room. I'm stepping into the room as a person that believes I belong there, so I'm not going in with a deficit mindset. Oh, I'm the only black person in the room. I'm going in and I don't mind having that backpack of carrying in my community. I'm going in because I believe I personally represent what is good about black culture. Oh, I love it, love it. So if I'm walking in believing I represent what is good about black culture, then I'm going there, just as I guarantee you.
Speaker 2:Let's just give an example. If the Denver Broncos is going to Raider Stadium in Las Vegas, do you think they going in with a deficit mindset? Oh, man, we in here with all these Raider fans and man, this is gonna be a tough guy. They going in saying we're going in there to kick butt. We're going in there because we're the Denver Broncos, we that bad and, by the way, we're gonna take you right here on your own stage.
Speaker 2:I go in with that kind of confidence because my father said you don't come second to nowhere. My mother said whenever you walk in the space, you walk in with confidence. Like many of my friends say oh my, why do you wear a shirt and tie Just about everywhere you go. And, brian, you've been around. I wear a shirt and tie just about everywhere I go, because every space I go in, for me, I want them to know one I'm in the room, I'm here for business, we're gonna take care of business, and for me, I want you to know, for Omar Montgomery, you're getting the best of me at all times, and that includes my black culture.
Speaker 1:Oh man, that's so good and I love how you're putting that in. When you think of developing communities and places where we go, how important that community is to be able to be part of it, whether it's a an all black community or it's a black, that's a mixed community, that identity is so big. And so how do you do you start out with trust? When we talk about trust and you know, when you go places and interact with people, do you trust automatically until they give you a reason not to trust. You go in cautiously and they have to earn trust. What is it in your world where you're moving into spaces and you can talk about different spaces as you want? That you can because of who you are, you know, and your identity. Does that automatically demand trust? What does trust look like for you?
Speaker 2:I trust that I'm gonna make the best decision in the situation that I'm in. Okay, okay, that's what I trust. I trust that I'm gonna walk in, believing that if we're meeting and we're making time, that you have my best interest, I have your best interest and, by the way, there's always gonna be that caution, that caution thing, you're gonna have to be cautious and the reason why you have to be cautious is because there are people who don't have your best interest. But I probably go in 80% believing we're on the same page, and 10% with a little bit of a cautious eye, and another 10% saying, okay, you said some things, so I really have to figure out where this is going. But I do it through inquiry and not making assumptions, and I'm gonna tell you the difference. The assumption is, if you say something and I don't use inquiry to find out your intent, I could be making a bad assumption and then I'm judging you in a way that's unfair. But if you say something and then I began to question it a little bit and find out your intent and see that, although it came out a little different for me, and find out your intent is in a good place, I'm okay with that we just sometimes, I think we go from zero to 100 in society.
Speaker 2:I think social media sometimes has conditioned us to judge and then do the inquiry, and then you wanna apologize at the end. Guess what? You don't have to apologize if you do the inquiry in the beginning. Then you possibly can save a relationship or do business with this person or open up other doors of opportunity, and it's okay to say can you expand on that a little bit? Can you share with me what you meant by that? Just in case I may have perceived this a little differently, can you give me a little bit insight on your thoughts behind that idea?
Speaker 2:Those are the type of inquiry questions that we need, in my personal opinion. I'm not gonna say need. I would suggest that we do, because if someone says something and I just automatically judge them without finding out the intent, I could be causing harm to that person as well, unintentional. So for me, the inquiry part is where the trust begins, is where you ask those questions, one to make sure you've validated in the decision you're about to make and also do your homework. Trust is about homework too. Before I meet with a person, I'm scrubbing any type of media I can find about that. I wanna know what other people have said about them.
Speaker 2:So I know they're doing the same thing about me when I sit down. I may bring up a fact that let you know. I did some research. Oh, I heard you went to this college and did this research project. Can you tell me about it? Oh, you did your research. Yeah, I need to know who I'm meeting with. I'm sure you've done your research on me and people. Let me know. Oh, I heard you ran for this political office. What was that experience like? Oh, you did your homework and I'm okay with that.
Speaker 1:And even if I think of me and my identity in this whole thing, called trust right and trying to build that, I harken to the event that I went to that was done. Trust, that was all about trust and the powerful people that were in the room, and I think about power and I think and 400 folks in the room, 25 of us were black men, if even that and a couple of the black men spoke on stage, and what I found myself after because I feel pretty solid with the relationships that I had but I was able to go up to those black men and start a conversation and trust that what I was getting from them was legit, whether it was or not. I mean, you know, it was a Super Bowl champion that was in there. There was a Naval commander that was in there. There was a CEO of a big major corporation I had no apprehension with their power and their status for me to run up to. And then I think about some of the other men that were there, the white men that were there that maybe had been running. It were in the same status situation, like there was another admiral, there was a general that was there.
Speaker 1:I actually had some apprehension. I mean I went and talked to them. I mean I talked to them anyways, but the trust wall was a little bit there and my ability, my own identity, didn't allow me to just believe the same on the other side and I was thinking about what can I do? And part of what Journey to Freedom is about is what do we do in those situations so that we put ourselves in those positions enough times where that trust can be there? Because everything has to start with, or solve with trust In your mind, as you've been in some very powerful positions, and some people that have that are these whether they're wealthy folks that have own companies or they're just the top of a governor or somebody that has that political clout. How do you interact in those spaces?
Speaker 2:I think I go in one wanting to learn because I feel like I can learn from anyone. And when I go back to those inquiry questions, it's not just to figure out if I can trust you, it's also figuring out what can I learn from you? I know you're gonna learn from me. I know that, Whether you say it or not, you're gonna learn something from me.
Speaker 1:You're gonna learn something from me. I love it.
Speaker 2:And I want to learn from you, and I go in with the mindset of what am I gonna learn? How am I gonna grow? How would I leave this meeting or leave this experience a better person or a more knowledgeable person To me? Sometimes, men and let's bring the gender identity into this as well Sometimes we are afraid to learn from other men. I embrace learning from other men, why?
Speaker 2:Because my father, I had to learn from my mentor. I had a mentor named Gilbert. I'm gonna drop their names, they know it because I love them. Gilbert was my neighbor. So when me and my mom when you talk about being tight me and my mom stayed in a one bedroom one of them back home, I forget what they call them, but there's a particular name for them, so it was a one bedroom. So my mom was like my dorm mate, let's say it that way From the age of 12 to about 17. Actually, I was younger than that, from eight to 17. So my neighbor in the front was in the Air Force but worked for the gas company. He was in the Air Force Reserve, so he was like that father figure when my father not so much he wasn't there, it's just my father didn't live with me. Gilbert taught me how to shave. Gilbert taught me about traveling globally because he was in the Air Force and had to go to these different countries. He was married. His unfortunately, his wife died a couple of years ago. But he taught me about family, and the only way you allow someone to teach you about those things is that you have to have a certain element of trust.
Speaker 2:Was any of these individuals perfect? No, I'm not perfect. I made so many mistakes and have done so many crazy things, but I was able to learn at an early age to say I love you to another brother and it didn't mean nothing. I got your back. What do we need to do? My good friend, patrick. Patrick was the BSU president before me. Patrick and I will argue all the time, but when they came down to stand firm with each other I mean that's like my partner we stood up for each other and we ended up graduating together from Cal State.
Speaker 2:So I think about the fact that I've been surrounded by people who's given examples of trust and, last but not least, my good friend, darrell Darrell. So I'm going to tell you how things come back in full circle. Remember I was telling you about the gentleman named William who taught me how to be a professional. His younger blood brother name is Darrell. I am best friends with both of them, and so his younger brother looks up to me, although we're close in age, as like a big brother. So everything I learned from Will him and I engage in, and it's like I'm just surrounded by some amazing people. So Darrell and the reciprocal matter has taught me how to be a more giving person. He has two daughters that he would give the world for, so he taught me how to be a father. He taught me how to be a better man, and so when you have that type of trust, you can't measure the amount of knowledge, the amount of experience and the amount of education that you receive when you let those walls down.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh, and I hope, if you're listening to this particular podcast, that you're hearing association and relationship and you're hearing that probably at every podcast that we do is the people that you are around and if you find some really good associations and then create that community. You know, what I didn't hear you say is, for you know, I had a dad, but for all the kids who didn't have a dad growing up that somehow they don't have those, they can't have those experience. Because you said one of the things that taught one of the people who helped you become a great parent wasn't I know, and your dad had probably lots of influence in you, but somebody else helped you as well. It was a community, right, they say it takes a community to raise a child, right, and the same for me. It wasn't necessarily my dad and my mom who taught me how to be a great parent. It was watching other people that I believe their kids were great kids and I wanted my kids to be like their kids eventually, someday, and it was the whole community of people.
Speaker 1:And so with that, you know, what do you say to that that man who says, well, I didn't have a father growing up, I don't know how to do things and then, like what you said before, is we're so afraid to talk to other people. How do they get out of that and get into these communities? What are some things that you could suggest for somebody?
Speaker 2:If that person told me they were a plumber, if that person told me they're an attorney, if that person tells me, hey, you know, I have a particular skill set I learned, then you have to have that same will to learn about manhood and fatherhood. That's a will, that's something you go out and say, okay, let me search and find some mentors. And so if you were able to find the institution to teach you how to be a plumber, if you were able to find the institution to teach you how to be an attorney, then find that community to help you grow as a man. And don't put it off and say, well, nobody embraced me, and this, that and the other, Nobody embraced you to be an attorney. That was something you went out there and found indeed. So if you want to be a better man, then you put yourself in circumstances to be a better man Period and you don't go out and say I'm a bad person because I wasn't around good men. Well, put yourself around good men, put yourself around good women that helped shape good men. Put yourself around a community that will embrace you and let you know your flaws, but you have to be open to listening to them. So let me say this my son.
Speaker 2:I came into my son's life and he was 12 years old and I'm going to share about two of these, three of these quick stories. My son I like to say Darrell was teaching me about fatherhood because, you know, I'm a little older and my son coming into my life and I didn't know what I was doing. You know, he's 12 years old. How do you shape that relationship? How do you build that trust? And one day I was just going off on him for something he did and he says something very simple. He says all you got to do is talk to me. Wow, and I thought about it. I said I don't talk to my students this way. I don't talk to anybody else in my life this way. He said all you have to do is talk to me. Basically, the way I'm communicating with him right now wasn't reaching him. He says all you have to do is talk to me.
Speaker 2:Wow, let's back up when I was teaching at Long Beach Unified School District and young man who I love so much one day came to me and said what is it like to have a father? I can't explain that because I've always had male influences in my father in my life and before I can get the words out, he says you're my father. We have been in each other's life since I was about 25, 26 years old and so I'm 52 now and we have a bond, we have a relationship. And, last but not least, when I was teaching college, another young man who didn't grow up with his father I don't know him he and I became close he told me this. He said you know, you got me for life. I've watched them battle addiction. I've watched them battle homelessness. And this young man now is a counselor, just completed his master's degree, has his licenses and just opened up a particular home for people who are facing different types of adversity.
Speaker 2:I ain't saying I did all that. What I'm saying is I was a part of that journey, because it's my responsibility. If someone comes to me and say, hey, I want to learn what you know, I don't close the book. I open this book as far wide as I can so that that brother would do it for the next brother, that brother do it for the next brother. We talking about going viral. That's how you go viral in real life.
Speaker 1:Speaking about viral and thinking about. You know our associations are your closest friends, our community, our group. We also learned by you know the books that we read, the. You know the YouTube videos that we watch, the. You know the. If I want to find, like you were saying, you know parenting I could probably go to YouTube and find a whole bunch of really good ones.
Speaker 1:Now we spend so much of our time watching nonsense. I think you know, and I get entertainment and I get you know. But sometimes I hear you know folks that are just you know cats and dogs, right, that are running around, that are not going to help me grow my life, if I'm trying to create a different sphere of influence and you're probably most like the people that you hang around with, and so how do you, how do you up that game? You know, if I thinking whether it's finances or whether it's in my faith or whether it's in my you know my identity or whether it's in the way that I trust people, I got to find people that are not, that are doing it better than I'm doing it. How do you go about that? Cause I can tell you've done that. You said that you do that. You found those people? For somebody who's just watching this, how do they get into those other circles?
Speaker 2:Well, you know, the internet has opened up those doors. Are you watching people trying to figure out? They swap phones to trust each other. Or are you watching someone who says, hey, I had a bunch of Nike shoes and I turned it into a hundred thousand dollar business before I left high school? Who are you watching? Who are you in Brazil?
Speaker 2:I was fortunate enough to grow up, to grow up watching good times when James Amos was the father, and he was a strong father. He didn't have a lot of money, he didn't have this, he didn't have that, but he was a strong model. Shit except that woman with her Belt Prince and his Rubik's Respiration. Then I watched the Cosby Show and I know people questioned the legal aspect take away the legal before we even knew about that. I'm talking about the Cosby Show. I'm talking about different worlds I'm talking about. These were shows that also helped shape my identity, along with the people out around me I think about now, with social media.
Speaker 2:I know people say talk about phone addiction, this, that and the other. I want to know what you addicted to on your phone. If I can't take your phone away from you because you got addicted to it, then show me what you're looking at, Show me how you're learning. This could be a tool that can help you make millions and millions of dollars and help you learn and grow with valuable information. You can get a PhD from this. You can get a BA, a PhD, master's degree studies everything on this phone. So are you going to the free classes that are offered by Howard University, Harvard, these different master classes that you can take? You don't have to wait for someone to come into your life. You can invite good knowledge to your life. You can invite good people to your life. I may not know all the people I listen to on social media, but I'm going to read a good article. I'm going to read a good book.
Speaker 2:There was a book I read when I was getting my master's. It was called Getting to yes. Getting to yes. Getting to yes was about how do you create win-win situations. What are you able to do and share and present to make a person believe in what you're saying? Not to manipulate, but believe that this journey that you're all about to go on is going to be beneficial to you both. One thing reading the autobiography of Malcolm X, you learned about resiliency. Here's a man who didn't even have a college degree but yet was teaching Ivy League students about life and social justice. The Reverend Dr Martin Luther King Jr, when you read this autobiography, graduated from college at the age of 18, had his PhD before he was like 24, 25 years old. Had a family. People don't know. He had his family when he went through the Montgomery boycott. He was a preacher just trying to live his life. Matter of fact, he wasn't even trying to get in all that stuff. They came and got him.
Speaker 1:They came and got him. He said I don't know if I'm the right guy. I just moved in here. I'm 26 years old and they said but we want you to be right.
Speaker 2:The question becomes how do you want to invite this knowledge into your life, whether it's real people, whether it's on your phone, whether it's on your computer? How do you embrace the opportunities that are in front of you? Yes, there are always going to be barriers. Yes, there's going to be racism. Yes, there's going to be this, there's going to be that. Hey, I was raised in the hood this, that and the other. I was in a one-bedroom house with my mom. My mom was in this twin bed. I was in this twin bed, one bathroom, my kitchen and a living room Didn't have my own TV. We had to watch what we watched together until we got a separate, smaller TV, but she controlled what was on them. Five channels we were able to watch back in the day.
Speaker 2:So, I say that to say that, yes, we have some horrible circumstances that we may have had to go through to get to where we're at, but that doesn't mean you shut the door on positive knowledge and positive energy coming into your life because unfortunately you may have had some circumstances that caused you harm and that backpack may be a little heavy. Lighten that load and bring some positive energy in your life.
Speaker 1:Oh man, I love it. We are already at an hour. It doesn't seem like it.
Speaker 2:It doesn't seem like we're at the right time. First of all, whenever I'm talking to you, I can talk forever, but I'm going to talk about trust in one other way. I'm going to talk about trust with you. You and I barely knew each other, bro, and somehow we just gained a friendship, although it just happened organically, but you just did. My family was talking about doing the family trust. I didn't call somebody outside the community, I called Brian, and Brian did a whole PowerPoint presentation that my family still amazed at and said this is trust. This is what this trust looked like here y'all may want to think about. And everyone on the call had an advanced degree. Everyone had it. So they're able to comprehend the knowledge, this, that and the other, but they were open to learn. I'm not going to bring somebody in front of my family I don't trust, but I think you and I came in saying, yeah, it's like okay, who's this guy, who's that guy, but we were open to learning and growing from each other.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and so that's what I mean by you have to allow that positive energy to come, because if you keep shutting doors because you're angry, you're upset and you don't trust brother, that's a hard life to live. And you talk about that mortality rate for black men. We got to release it, brother. I don't have time to walk around life not trust in folk.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:That's a hard life to live.
Speaker 1:It's a very hard life to live. It is and it is, it is will be. The thing that ultimately is part of your demise is because the stress that comes, you know, if you can't walk through life and have some people that you can walk through that journey with. You know, and so that's what that's what I'm talking about. That's what this journey is all about. The journey of freedom is is an initiative, it is a program that we walk through these different things.
Speaker 1:We're going to walk through the eight pillars of trust with you. We're going to walk through you know your identity, the things that we've just been talking about. We're going to walk through. You know integration in your faith and how your faith plays a part in the things you do. Your health, you know we're going to talk about not only your physical health but your mental health. And how do we stop that and how do we make sure we're living into our eighties, in our nineties, because we're not stressed as we're going into rooms? We're going to definitely talk about money. You know, you and I we didn't jump into money, but we're going to.
Speaker 2:We're going to actually talk about everything we talked about was about money burn.
Speaker 1:It was. You're right. You were so right Because it intersects everything. You know, if somebody comes up and tells you that money's not important, they run because it's up there with oxygen, because this allows you to move through this world in ways that you wish to move through this world, and so it's a way that we exchange for things that we want and love and want to have. And so, you know, if I could say anything is you know, make sure you subscribe.
Speaker 1:You know, the more subscriptions I get, the better. You know, the, the more I guess I can do with these, the the folks that I'm going to bring on are just going to be just incredible as a result of it. You know. So subscribe to this. I have a daily, you know, seven minute mindset that I'd love for you to subscribe to as well. I'm going to talk about these things, you know, five days a week. You know. For you know, for the next 52 weeks and beyond, you know I'm going to do a. You know there's going to be a 12 week intensive class that's going to be coming up, that those are interest, that we're going to get you through this. You know, in a quick amount of time we're going to end this with, you know, like a ropes course or something that's really going to allow you to trust.
Speaker 2:So this journey, I got bad knees.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's all right.
Speaker 1:You can do a ropes course with bad knees. It's like you in a harness in a room yeah, we can talk about that, you know but just the ability to be able to move through life with some of these foundational skills. Because my goal is that when we do year two or do year three with you, that you are starting your own businesses, that you have residual income, that you have passive income, that you have the ability to be able to walk through the way you want to walk through, and right now there's just some things that hold people back. So, like again, omar, thank you so much for being on today. Thank you, I'm going to have you back on.
Speaker 2:I appreciate it. And if you allow me to just say one more thing, I was going to ask you for closing thoughts.
Speaker 1:That's what. That's exactly what I was going to do.
Speaker 2:You know I can't neglect my wife and we talk about what makes us what trust is. The partner that you live with is where that trust should be the strongest. I don't have time, you know, brothers, be calling me, talking about, I think, my wife cheating on me, I think, my girlfriend. I don't have time to go through anybody's phone, find out where they at and what they doing. What I do know is that my wife makes me a better man Period. So, along with all the men I've talked about, including, and my mother, who's a part of this, my grandmother, my aunt and my wife play just as much as an important role in me being the man that I am. My students play a very important role in that.
Speaker 2:So I just want to say, for me it's not just about where I access information and I'm also making myself accessible for what I've learned and be able to share and disseminate. Now, use this term earlier. If we can make being a bridge builder go viral, where you're able to share the knowledge that you have, I believe Black America is already great. We can be even more phenomenal if we just adopt that mentality in just about every single thing that we do. Brian, love you, brother, thank you for having me and looking forward to the success of your podcast. Sorry, I was interrupting your closing statements After one. I was like, oh, those are just closing remarks. Sorry about that.
Speaker 1:Oh no, you didn't interrupt him at all because I was going to ask you what those were. So no, and I was actually at the end of it. So, yeah, you are perfect. This has been an amazing time that we've been able to spend together. I'm glad you brought up the women in our life.
Speaker 1:The hope and the goal is, through this journey to freedom, that we make those relationships stronger, that we do marriage, whether they're retreats or they're just talking about it or the things that we have to do that Because when I see our counterparts and we try to do this stuff all on our own, we try to put all this burden on our back and we try to make sure that we're carrying the load ourselves 100%, when we know that that, like for my wife, that carries just as much of the burden that I do, and then we're able to interact and we're able to do the things together so that we can go on this journey together.
Speaker 1:And so I don't want to neglect that at all because it's super important. I just know, until we get our identities, where we love ourselves, then it's hard to love other folks in a way that we need to. I'm not saying it's impossible and we can't. But if we can't look in the mirror and say I love that person that I'm looking at and that person is going somewhere and that person is phenomenal and that person needs to be in community, then it's really hard to pass that on. If I don't like that person that I see in the mirror, I agree.
Speaker 2:Michael Jackson talks about his whole song. I'm looking at the man in the mirror. I'm looking for him to make a change, absolutely, absolutely. And I love that song because it is talking about. When you look in the mirror, what do you see? Yeah, do you like that reflection? Do you love that reflection? I can tell you this Every morning I look in the mirror. I know that reflection is not perfect, I know behind the mirror is not perfect, but I do know we do the best we can every single day and I love that person. Every single day I look in the mirror.
Speaker 1:I do too, I do too, and then I think some of that transfer and sometimes when people who don't, they look for another man to live their life through, and then that man always disappoints them. When we think of, like, some of the athletes and the people who put, you know, we put their name on our back and then they don't live up to some of the standards because they're just men, right, but we got to start with ourselves. So, absolutely so you can say what we're thinking of you.
Speaker 2:I'm just saying I think it's okay to be a cheerleader or to admire a team, to admire someone else, but put 90% into yourself first. Admire that person you talk about when they wear the jersey and they wear the name this, that and the other. If that person is getting more of your energy, then you. You got to flip that because, as far as I'm concerned, I have to be able to be, I have to be able to believe in the person I am looking in the mirror at. My wife depends on it, my son depends on it, my family depends on it and people who I engage depend on it and I depend on them to love the person that they look at in the mirror as well.
Speaker 2:Amen, Amen Well thank you, all right.
Speaker 1:You know we do got to go, but it's a, like I said, we're going to do this again and I hope that all of you who are listening will, you know, continue to listen to these podcasts, will continue to take this. You know, I'm sure that if you look up on Martin, you try to find him. You have absolutely no trouble trying to find him and look at those examples, because that's what we're going to show on this, day in and day out, because you can do this. You know you deserve this and let the community help you get to where you want. So you guys have a wonderful, just awesome, incredible day. Hey, you're God's greatest gift and we will talk with you soon.
Speaker 2:Thank you, brother, enjoy God bless.