Rekindling connections from our high school track days, I recently sat down with Wayne, an exemplary figure in both the legal realm and on the track, who continues to leave his mark through coaching and community service. Our shared love for the sport opened the door to an enlightening discussion about the influence of family, the essence of identity, and the intertwining of faith and health in crafting a life of purpose and impact. Wayne's story is a testament to the power of staying grounded in one's values and the extraordinary outcomes that can stem from such a foundation.
Mentorship stands as a cornerstone of the conversation, as Wayne and I reflect on the pivotal roles that figures like my track coach, Marcus Walker, played in setting high standards and guiding us toward our aspirations. The narrative widens to encompass the broader implications of mentorship in shaping the futures of black men, addressing the importance of fostering a sense of identity and the confidence required to surmount societal hurdles. It's a heartfelt exploration of the ways in which guidance and expectations from mentors can permeate every aspect of life, from personal finance to mental fortitude.
Closing the dialogue, we traverse through the challenges and triumphs of pursuing success, touching on the systemic barriers in legal education, the democratizing force of technology, and the practical wisdom necessary for entrepreneurship. This episode also delves into the significance of financial literacy, real estate legacies, and nutrition on the path to longevity. It's a rich and motivating discourse that not only celebrates the community impact but also encourages listeners to take concrete steps toward their dreams, ensuring a lasting legacy for themselves and the generations to follow.
Rekindling connections from our high school track days, I recently sat down with Wayne, an exemplary figure in both the legal realm and on the track, who continues to leave his mark through coaching and community service. Our shared love for the sport opened the door to an enlightening discussion about the influence of family, the essence of identity, and the intertwining of faith and health in crafting a life of purpose and impact. Wayne's story is a testament to the power of staying grounded in one's values and the extraordinary outcomes that can stem from such a foundation.
Mentorship stands as a cornerstone of the conversation, as Wayne and I reflect on the pivotal roles that figures like my track coach, Marcus Walker, played in setting high standards and guiding us toward our aspirations. The narrative widens to encompass the broader implications of mentorship in shaping the futures of black men, addressing the importance of fostering a sense of identity and the confidence required to surmount societal hurdles. It's a heartfelt exploration of the ways in which guidance and expectations from mentors can permeate every aspect of life, from personal finance to mental fortitude.
Closing the dialogue, we traverse through the challenges and triumphs of pursuing success, touching on the systemic barriers in legal education, the democratizing force of technology, and the practical wisdom necessary for entrepreneurship. This episode also delves into the significance of financial literacy, real estate legacies, and nutrition on the path to longevity. It's a rich and motivating discourse that not only celebrates the community impact but also encourages listeners to take concrete steps toward their dreams, ensuring a lasting legacy for themselves and the generations to follow.
All right, welcome, welcome, welcome to another edition of the Journey to Freedom podcast. Hey, I love this podcast because it allows us to spotlight folks in the community who are doing stuff, people in the community who are making life happen, people in the community that are giving back not just what's given to them, but just being an inspiration in the entire community. And today I have an age old friend not that either one of us are old, but I know we're exactly the same age because we graduated high school at the same time, opposing high schools, but we did. We ran on a track club together. We were able to do just as kids, just learning what life was going to be like. You know, and you know, he ended up journeying to Texas to go to school, and I went to California to go to school, but we both ended up back here in Colorado.
Speaker 1:And so, wayne, I'm so excited to have you on the call today, and I don't want to be laboring. Just talk about a whole bunch of stuff. We're going to talk about trust, we're going to talk about identity, we're going to talk about faith, we're going to talk about health, you know, and, more importantly, we'll probably talk about identity. Wayne is an attorney in town. I'm going to let him tell his story, but here's what I do know I was at a. You know we both, at this point still continue to coach track. That has been a love of our lives for, you know, our entire lives.
Speaker 1:And so Wayne just got back and I haven't told you this yet, but I got back from when you went to Arcadia and some of the team that I coach with you, knowadia, and some of the team that I coach with you, know, and some of the kids that you coach, and I got back and the coaches were just telling me how good of a guy you were, like they didn't know. He's like, I just love him. He's such an amazing guy. I've been telling you that for four years, because sometimes we have this like club competition where you know there's different track clubs that are in town and you know some of the coaches are worried that what if you take my kid and you coach him a little bit different or you don't give him the best skills? And I and wayne, I've never been about that. It's always been about the kid, it's always been about the athlete, whatever we can do to make that athlete shine the best that he can, and so it was really cool to have those coaches come back and just rave about.
Speaker 1:You know, I don't know if you picked people up from the airport. You took people to the airport, whatever it is that you did. They are now Wayne Baden fans. That is cool, so that's really cool. So thank you for being on, thank you for being part of this podcast today. I couldn't wait to do this with you. I even love you got Baden way over there. I need to get an Arnold way, my office and stuff. And so why don't you kind of just talk about you know your upbringing, you know kind of your life and how you got to where you're at right now and kind of about your family? And we'll just kind of start there and then we'll just move forward as we get to talk.
Speaker 2:My family is several, several generations from Colorado. Back in the late 1800s my father's family went through Oklahoma with the Choctaw Indians, the Trail of Tears from the south to Oklahoma and then through into Colorado. My mother's family came from Kansas into Pueblo, and so they were really steeped in the Pueblo tradition. Mom's family, early history, both of her great, both of her aunts and her mom, my great, my great aunts and my grandmother went to HBCUs back in the early 1900s and two were. One was an educator, one was a nurse and one was a podiatrist, you know. And so I grew up steeped in education.
Speaker 2:My family, they grew up in the Five Points, you know way back when. They grew up in the Five Points, you know way back when. And so we were raised as old school Denver, okay, me and my cousins grew up around City Park Golf Course, went to East High School and enjoyed all of the privileges of the golf course, the park, the museum, the zoo and everything else that we had. Got bussed around the city and county of Denver, went to multiple schools, got to know everybody in the city, and so it was really a different I'm learning a different education as to our right to enjoy the America than other places that I've seen as I got older. There was really a lot of things that happened locally and in the state of Colorado that gave us some advantages that other people have not had as far as education, as far as athletics, as far as being spiritually minded. You know, denver was a very, very cool place to grow up in. I'm finding out I wouldn't have been the same person I am had I not been elsewhere. Case in point you know the neighborhood we grew up in. There are several doctors, lawyers, businessmen. You know, when it comes to identity in that part of this program, it seemed that the neighborhood I grew up in, which was full of just boys and girls I mean we probably had 30 deep boys and girls all really did well for themselves. One of those is my cousin, robert F Smith, the wealthiest black man in America, went from East High School, went on to Cornell and then went into the software to build a software empire. It's my first cousin. His father was my eldest uncle, who was also an educator, a principal. So our family has been really, really steeped in education, has been steeped in philanthropy and giving back to the community. Yeah, that's how I was raised.
Speaker 2:I went to University of Texas, el Paso, as you know. Track scholarship finished at CU, went to law school at ASU, got my master's of law from DU and been practicing law now for over 30 years. And been practicing law now for over 30 years think 32, 33 years in Denver helping people with their finances, trust estates, civil litigation, some criminal litigation don't handle domestic anymore but really involved in people's families and in their lives. At the same time, the same year I graduated from track I'm sorry, from law school. I started coaching track. So I've been coaching for as long as I've been practicing law currently at Northfield High School.
Speaker 2:And then I have a private club, angel Flight Track Club. So always trying to give back to those kids, like you said, you know it's all about those kids. Kids, like you said, you know it's all about those kids, trying to give back. I call my coaching is with regard to faith. That is my, that's my tithes, that's how I give back. I give back with my time and my treasure every day, pouring into those kids and trying to give back so that they can have some of the knowledge that I've gained over the past 60 years.
Speaker 1:I can't believe. You just said 60 years.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh? No, we are not. We are not that old, you know. One thing I just learned about you is that my grandma grew up on the Choctaw Reservation in Oklahoma, so that is really cool to know something. Over all these years we didn't know about each other, which is really cool, wow, when you think about it. We'll just kind of start here with identity, and I love the fact that the people in your community were people that you could see. And I love the fact that the people in your community were people that you could see, because one of the things that becomes a common theme as we're talking is having folks that look like you, that are successful, that are doing well, kind of shapes who we are, and for a lot of kids in our communities they don't get to see that. How do you think that that shaped you? And then, how are you trying to make sure that folks get placed or get to see some of that, not only just through you, but through the community?
Speaker 2:I had several mentors in my life but just to put my home life into context, my parents were not together. My father was in and out of prison. So although I was surrounded by a ton of family, it was always driven towards education and success. I did not have that dual income family lifestyle. My mom was a reservationist for United Airlines, which gave us the privilege of traveling around the country and literally around the world. We traveled a lot because of my mom's benefits.
Speaker 2:But to have a father in the household when you come into identity, you really got to look at the man who's in the household. Now I'm not saying my father was a bad man and he was never in the household, because although he was not there, he was always present. He was our first football coach, he was our first track coach, he taught us how to play basketball box and all the other things. But was he there constantly and consistently? I can say no, you know, you didn't have that household where you came home to mom and dad all the time. Was he a man about town who was always there with us? Yes, and then. So that's really where that identity plays in the household, Outside of the household.
Speaker 2:I mean, you really got to look at other people and then, when I talk about my family whether it's my uncle, who was a principal, or my aunt, who was a principal, or my other surrounding families, my cousins, that you know that's really where you start seeing. You know what I can do, that Even with the other friends I had in the neighborhood whether it was music or science or athletics they opened the door and opened your mind to doing things that you never really thought that you could do, but you had to do it because you were trying to keep up with the people around you. And then, when it came to you know, always having somebody a generation ahead of you or two or three generations ahead of you who look like you and who have gone through the same experiences, I've learned that that is imperative, especially for young people, and I know that when I was young and I'm talking, you know 20s I was not talking to people in my 30s and 40s, but as I got into my 30s and I was talking to people in my 40s and 50s, it became very, very clear that that's what I've always needed. So for a black man, you really need somebody a generation ahead of you and then two generations ahead of you to tell you what's going on and that touches upon a couple of things that you know are on your list. That touches upon identity, faith, finances and health. I mean, if you don't know what's coming and it is going to come some people aren't aware of it because they haven't tapped in to how this life cycle works it will come. I mean just simply knowing how your young marriage is going to work. Tap into somebody who's 10 years older than you and find out the issues that are going on there. How does this children thing work? Yes, yes, you know, you talk to somebody 10 and 20 years and they tell you hey, man, I went through that and this is what you got to look for and this is how you do it. So that's going into the older ages.
Speaker 2:But identity as a child as a child, I'd also say, in addition to family, friends, loved ones, you know, probably the most impactful was Marcus Walker, track coach right, had a passion for running. I always wanted to run, I wanted to hurdle. I go to East High School and there's this dude named Marcus Walker who is a world-class hurdler and probably by far the coolest black man I've ever met in my life, you know, and he was serving as athletic director, track coach, basketball coach wore a 70s afro and just was a cool brother. You know to everybody and you know you just sort of take a mentor like that and you're like that's how I want to be to kids. I want to inspire kids to do what's right. And he wasn't the type of track coach that would yell at you, scream at you. Never had profanity coming out of his mouth.
Speaker 2:It was really all right what you going to do now. It was really self-motivation. You know, hey, wayne, if you want this, you got to run this fast and you got to work this hard, so you got to pay to play. Are you going to pay the price? And to have somebody set that out there for you and then to tell you you can pay the price because I see it in you, right, that's all you need. That's really all you need is that motivation for somebody to open the door, set out a game plan for you to open the door, set out a game plan for you. See you, I see you, and then you know you just take it from there and I think a lot of our kids they don't have those expectations set, they don't have high expectations set and there's nobody there to say hey, if you do this, this and this in retrospect, I've done all that.
Speaker 2:Trust me, it ain't that difficult, but I tell you what it takes consistent game plan day after day after day, there's going to be some up and downs, but guess what young man and young girl You're going to make it?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. Well, I guess when you start thinking about you know and I was going to ask you about athletics and you know how in my life I can think of a couple of coaches that made that kind of difference. You know, and I always remember Marcus Walker. You know conversations I had with my coach, but he still was willing to have those conversations with me and inspire me to greatness and say you can do this.
Speaker 1:And you know all those things that you know sometimes folks in our family don't do because we're so close to them and then, but just to have those relationships and I think of, like kids today you know, who are so isolated, who are getting their identity from somebody that they see on the internet, somebody they see on social media and not realizing that you only see the best of people online, right? You don't see the day-to-day, like you said, the goods and the bads, you just see what they want to put up, which makes you think that every day is a great day. But to be able to see some of these coaches and go wait a minute, every day isn't a good day, Every day isn't where it says. How do you think? Athletics, you know, played a part in your discipline and your ability to think about your dreams and achieving and that kind of stuff. How big of a deal was that?
Speaker 2:Well, as you know, athletics is real, it's objective. You know, there's no video game there. Yeah, it's real life. You know, and I know that there's a terminology now IRL. You know I have friends but they're not IRL and I'm like what the heck?
Speaker 2:is that that's like in real life. Wow, does that exist? You know, that was a new terminology for me, which was interesting, and so the way I start thinking about track and coaching, track man, it is in real life, it's, it's locked. You know, from practice, from day one Can you do the warm up? Can you run two laps? Oh, you can't run two laps. Oh, my gosh. You know, our goal is to just finish warm up. Can you skip? Can you jump? Can you? It's real life.
Speaker 2:It is all about you and your head, your spirituality, everything about you. There is no hiding behind mama daddy, there's no hiding behind your friends. I see you. I see you in your rarest form, right, see you in your rarest form, right. And so I think that when you're focusing on that and you're looking at people in real life and you're recognizing them for their skills or their lack thereof, I think that breaks some of that. I think it's really like, oh man, this dude really, really sees me. Now, does he value me if I'm not unskilled, right? Does he only value me if I'm skilled? You know, brian, and you've seen me, I laugh at the kids. I'm like, wow, what was that?
Speaker 1:You know, and we just start laughing.
Speaker 2:You know, that was the goofiest run I've ever seen. And they just learn to laugh at themselves in real life.
Speaker 1:Real life and real time Wow.
Speaker 2:You know in real time Well, coach, I'm going to get better. Well, no, I know you're going to get better because I'm going to make you better. And they do, you know. And then you're setting expectations in real life, in real time, you know. So when somebody comes to them with some hype, you're hoping. You're hoping that they look back at those experiences in real life, in real time, whether it's grades or track, because it's all transferable and they have the courage enough to say that's not me.
Speaker 2:You don't get to define me by media, they don't even know me. Matter of fact, you know I really like it for girls, because there are studies out there that show that girls athletes are higher achievers when it comes to the workforce, because they just don't put up with bullshit. They can be in the boardroom, they can compete, nobody's going to put anything over them, because they're like come on, man, I know right now I can do more push-ups than you do. I love it. I can outthink you, I can outwork you, I can outrun you, and all you've been doing is thinking that you're smart. You're really not that smart, yeah, you know. And so when you give somebody that kind of confidence, that self-awareness is really what it is and they know what they can and can't do and they know what they aspire to. I think that's the only way you get kids out of this social media spin that I see some kids getting into. I don't see, you know the ones around me. They're not in it.
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah, I see them on there. You know they'll be playing video games amongst themselves, but when it comes down to the work it's. You know that ain't going to help you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1:Well, I think we're fortunate because we have the kids who are coming out, that are doing the work that are you know, they realize, hey, I would rather be here than sitting at home on a video game, isolated by myself, with you know.
Speaker 1:Pivot over to the trust, because one of the things that is also a common theme is all the things that have happened in our histories, whether it's our Native American histories, where you know, like you said, the Trail of Tears and all the things that happened there, or the African-American history, and sometimes I think we get stuck, as black men, into what happened in the past and we haven't figured out who to trust.
Speaker 1:Like, where do we show up when we go to the grocery store? How do we trust we go to the boardrooms if we're the only person of color that's in that boardroom, If we go to different areas in our life and being able to trust people in order to move forward because in this world, trust is everything right If you don't trust your spouse, if you don't trust the people you're working with, if you don't trust the people that are around you, you don't trust this environment that you're in, you kind of walk around scared, how have you been able to develop trust in your life where you know you get to almost start out with trust and not think about all the things that you know we get bombarded with as we're growing up and as we're interacting with folks?
Speaker 2:That's an interesting question, because I've never thought of it that way.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:I've never really thought of it and if I can summarize what you just said and if I'm wrong, correct me, okay, I think that, to summarize it, the Correct me. Okay, I think that, to summarize it, the statement was given the history of America and the history of some of the people in America, you know, whether it's discrimination, racism or shutting doors on other people, how have you developed a sense of trust that have allowed you to succeed? Yeah, okay, that's an interesting question and that goes back. I think that goes back to identity, one of the things that I mean. You can imagine some of the stuff that Robert sees at the level he is, you know, oh, my gosh yeah.
Speaker 2:He is, you know, $8 billion in, you know, multi, 30,000 employees worldwide and just travels and does all the things. And just travels and does all the things. I think one of the things that we were allowed to do as kids was an elimination of that fearfulness. You know, with that fear comes distrust, and there may be anybody watching this and say oh wow, you know, maybe he didn't have any fear because he was never the only person in the classroom that was a black man. No, always, always.
Speaker 1:I didn't care. There we go, there we go. I love it, I love it, I love it.
Speaker 2:You know, I tell this story to my kids. In high school I was that dude who, from a very young age and I remember this from junior high school I went to this junior high school. I went to math and they put me into this remedial math class that was doing addition and subtraction, and I sat I always sit in front of the classroom, sort of was my way of telling the teacher do your job, teach me. And so you can imagine this young, what had to be 12 yearold black dude sitting in front of this remedial class and this cat hands me a worksheet with addition and subtraction and I said I'm not supposed to be in this class. He said well, let me see what you do on this. I finished that damn thing in like five minutes and I put it on his desk. I said I'm not supposed to be in this class and I stood there and looked at him and he went through it. He said hi, mr Vane, you need to go to the counselor's office. I ain't that dude, I ain't that dude.
Speaker 2:So they took me out of that, put me in algebra and you know, you hear these horror stories of these kids that are thrown into remedial math or remedial reading and they're going to sleep and they're sitting in the back going to sleep and I'm like that's a freaking waste of time, yeah, so I don't care. I learned I don't care, I don't care who's in front, I don't care who's in back. You know I'm here to get mine. I don't care what race you are, I could give a shit. So there was not this fearfulness in walking into new spaces, in walking into a courtroom and seeing the. You know the entire courtroom is white and you know you walk up to the bar and the sheriff looks at you like are you supposed to be here? And you just walk on in and look at him. I love it. Yes, what's your issue? What's your issue? So it's also about how you carry yourself. You know, if you think you're not supposed to be there, you ain't supposed to be there. Yeah, I've never done that. I've never asked permission.
Speaker 1:That's for forgiveness right. Yes, for forgiveness.
Speaker 2:I've never been denied access, you know. Nobody has said who are you Really, who are you?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So I think it's about getting that fearfulness out, so I don't have a mistrust. You know the way I look at everything coming from the civil rights era to where it is now. I always give people the benefit of the doubt. Okay, so if you look at the history of civil rights and you look at the people who gave their lives up for black rights, for anybody rights and I'm not going to even say black rights, I'm going to say the rights of people, rights of human beings, you know that's of all, all colors.
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2:You know. So when I walk into a room I'm like, oh, these are cool people.
Speaker 1:Yes, I know, I love it.
Speaker 2:They're going to love me. You know they're going to love me because I'm just going to talk to them and we're going to see. You know what we have. I don't give a shit, I don't care.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, and I see, you know, I just got back from Alabama and I don't know how many times you've been to Alabama, but it was my first time, you know, this year, and I felt like I was, I was so grateful for growing up here, because of the definite segregation that still exists in the definite thought process that goes through folks mind, you know, and I and I think of, like, where did that come from? Where, first, you're willing to advocate for yourself in every place, that confidence that you just talked about. Hey, I'm going to advocate for myself, I am not supposed to be here and you're going to do something about that. I don't know if that comes as common or a thought process, but it sounds like because of your associations growing up and the folks that you were around, they probably didn't put up with stuff either.
Speaker 1:You know, and I think of you know, how that transforms into every aspect of your life. Because if you start that at 12 years old, developing that confidence, that means that 18, you know you're really not taking any stuff. And then now you may go to law school and they're like well, how would you deny me from going to law school or getting there? It's not even a it's not even an issue that goes on. How do we teach that way? How do we help our young?
Speaker 2:It's very simple, brian. It's very simple In the diversity of our community and you know this for a fact when you grew up and you sit next to somebody that was either white or brown or Asian in your group of friends, you must have learned that there's nothing that they're doing that I can't do. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely Matter of fact, you probably had an Asian friend or a white friend who you were like you know what. Let me explain this to you, because you're not quite getting it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and I went to. I went to Cherry Creek High School. You know so there was 35 of us in the whole high school out of 3000. And so so here's here's.
Speaker 2:Here's where you know, when you look at the people around you and how America is structured, and you're driving through Parker, colorado, and you see these million dollar houses and you say, wow, you know, I bet you I can see about 200, 300 million-dollar houses and I bet you in those houses are probably a lot of white families that are just average.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're right, you're right. Yes, there's nothing special about them?
Speaker 2:It's just a whole bunch of mediocre, average people. And wow, you know I've known average people my whole life. And so what Am I supposed to ask for? Less? Or am I supposed to be getting what it is that I deserve? Or can I at least have an average lifestyle? Or I mean, I guess when you start seeing it, it's like well, my color's not stopping me from being smart or spiritually enabled, it's not doing anything to my identity, it's not damaging my health, so why couldn't I get the goodness of life as well? And so that's where that fairness comes away from, because when I walk into a room or a courtroom, I'm like how, for these lawyers? They're just average.
Speaker 2:And then when you hear him talk, you're like oh, that dude don't know what he's talking about. Or that judge, I wonder where they went to law school. And sometimes they'll be like I went to Harvard. It's like dude, you know. Or that judge, that judge, I wonder where they went to law school. And sometimes they'll be like I went to Harvard. It's like dude, you're an idiot. So I guess it's. I guess it's seeing how the world works, trying to figure out your place in the world as a black man and not saying that I'm relegated to lesser than because I'm an African-American man and I say black man, because I say that as a world, planetary terminology.
Speaker 2:And if you go to Africa and you see, okay, what is a black man in the world, in Ethiopia, what does a successful black man in Ethiopia do? Oh, he owns businesses. Yeah, yeah, this is not about race. What does a wealthy black man in Nigeria do? What does a wealthy black man in Europe do? Or England? And it's like this has nothing to do with my skin color. Man Right, it really doesn't have anything to do with it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you were so right, so so right. And that's what's hard when you start, when you start having conversations and you start going well, why, you know, you're trying to find out the you know systemic issues that are there, but I don't even think that's the reason. You know, I I've been following a guy who talks about contributing factors versus deciding factors and we let these contributing factors that have nothing to do with our success hinder us in being able to be successful. You know, and you try to start it, especially the older we get. You just go these people there's nothing special about, like you said, the folks that are in the million dollar homes, other than maybe just their identity, their beliefs and the possibility that it happened, compared to where we have another set of folks in our communities that don't believe it can happen.
Speaker 2:Well, there can be some barriers. Yeah, you know that there are secondary barriers to everything.
Speaker 1:Oh, absolutely.
Speaker 2:You know, I've started businesses after businesses. And then you go into the bank and you're denied a bank loan, but a lot of what a lot of people don see. Or you're given the black bank loan. Oh, we're going to give you a bank loan, but it's at 10% interest instead of the 5%. And you're like, oh okay, no, I want the bank loan. Know that number one? There's thousands of banks. That bank is not controlling my destiny. There's thousands of banks. So you really got to go in there with that attitude. If my business qualifies, I'm going to find the right loan, right, I don't want the black loan, right, but there is that barrier. Can I get to that next step, you know? And how do I get there?
Speaker 1:Because I know that there are some people who will place barriers in front of me and it is incumbent upon me to figure out how to get around. Yeah well, man, that's so true because, like you said, there are definitely barriers there, you know, to try to deny that there isn't, systems that have been put in place. But how do we navigate through those systems? Because we're starting to get more and more to get examples of how to do it. When you talk about education, you know, and identity, how much does education play in our ability to succeed or to have these better lives? Or you know, I know you went to law school and just go ahead and just kind of your belief on education.
Speaker 2:Education used to be a tremendous barrier. As you know, it used to be PSAT, LSAT, ACT. You know those were all barriers to getting into school and I can say that I'm lucky because, coming out of CU, I said I want to go to law school. So they said, okay, you have to take the LSAT, the law school exam. And I said, okay, you know how do you do this. And they were like, well, you need to take the class over here, it costs $1,000.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:Yes, and I'm like I don't have $1,000. How am I going to afford that? And they're like, well, if you don't have $1,000, you probably shouldn't go to law school. Oh my gosh, Just one girl told me Wow, Wow, Okay.
Speaker 2:So what I did was went and bought the LSAT prep book. I took the LSAT test. I got a horrible score because the LSAT was literally a puzzle. It was literally a crossword puzzle, along with some trick questions that have nothing to do with being in law school Nothing you know. And really what the LSAT class was about was to teach you what these puzzles were, how to get through these puzzles and, in fact, if you took the Kaplan class, you'd get a good LSAT score because they taught you. They literally gave you the answers yeah, taught you how to take the test. Wow, so I take the test. They say you know, based on your LSAT score, you're going to fill out law school. And I kept school and I kept going. Asu accepted me, gave me scholarship, went to ASU, graduated from college, went to take the bar, got into a top law firm in Denver. You talk about the easiest test I've ever taken in my life, Brian.
Speaker 1:Really Okay. The bar exam.
Speaker 2:So here's what happened you got, you get accepted. It was the largest law firm in Colorado. They pay your salary and they pay for your bar exam and they pay for your prep class. So I got to see behind the scenes and you go into these prep classes and they'd say you know, if you encounter a question like this, the answer is number one. If you encounter a question like this, oh my gosh.
Speaker 2:This answer If you encounter and I was like this is freaking amazing, brian, it was amazing. So I studied for that for what? Two months and I smoked the bar exam, you know. And so when you look at how the LSAT was set up in the bar exam, I said, oh, this is all just fiction and fantasy. It was absolutely ridiculous how easy that test was, wow.
Speaker 1:When you had all the tools in place to be able to take it.
Speaker 2:They literally just spoon-fed you the answers. Wow, and again, the bar had nothing to do with practicing law, because after I passed the bar, you don't even know where the courtroom is.
Speaker 1:Gotcha, gotcha.
Speaker 2:You don't know how to file a motion. You don't know, so education on some levels was a barrier. Here's what's going on now, which is amazing. Every kid in America that I coach, they've got a freaking computer in their hands.
Speaker 1:Yes, they do.
Speaker 2:Now imagine what we would have done in track and field if, right now, we got Ronaldo Nehemiah's YouTube video showing us how to hurdle Greg Foster's YouTube video. You know all the college coaches talking about the things that we can or can't do. How do you get into Harvard? How do you get into Yale? How do you get into Yale? What is college about? Any question in the world, brian. What does the practice of law look like? What does this anything that you're passionate about? How do you play the piano? How do you play the guitar? It's all right here. So when you start talking about being fearful about doing something new, being fearful of new journeys or new thoughts or ideas or even access to financing around the world I mean, the world is literally open. Now, what is there to be scared of? Yeah, what it is. When you log in, it don't say are you a black man?
Speaker 1:It does not. If it does know, it ain't asking Because it probably has figured it out. Oh, you're right.
Speaker 2:Oh well, master, don't want you to know that information Exactly. I think maybe that's why there's book bans now, of course, of course, because we have access to everything. And they're saying and maybe the people who are banning books are saying, oh shit, you know, there was a time when these people weren't supposed to know anything. Yeah, there was a time when these people weren't supposed to know anything. The reasons why all the Jews were lawyers was because they were the only ones who were in the industry of doing transactions. They were relegated to what was back then thought of as crap work. So they went to law school and they went into transactions.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:But we were totally excluded from it, and the only way a young black attorney back in the 50s, 60s, 40s could learn anything was by having a mentor so you can just come out of law school and go into tax law. There's no way, yeah, no. So now that we have industry-wide, worldwide access to how things get done, figure it out, get it done.
Speaker 1:I love that you're saying that, because one of the things that I've really been working on as I'm doing coaching on the business level, not just on the athletic level is this transition from knowing to doing, because I think a lot of us know what to do, we know how to do it, we have access right here to anything we want to know how to do. But now how do we help people understand? Okay, just knowing isn't enough. You've got to actually start doing stuff. How do you help the folks that you work with and people you're there kind of transition that, because there's a lot of smart people that know a whole lot of stuff that ain't doing a thing they got to take a risk.
Speaker 2:And I think a lot of people are filled with taking that first risk and maybe they don't know how easy it is to incorporate. Go to the Secretary of State's website, file an LLC paperwork, get your EIN number set, up a bank account, get your website, get some cards and say you know what? I know HVAC. I am now Denver HVAC Services and I can do HVAC air conditioning for anybody. Set up a company and go yeah, why not?
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I know that it's always.
Speaker 2:It's usually because they're comfortable in what they're doing. They're probably working for an HVAC company that's paying them a good salary and the boss is making a ton of money. What they're doing, they're probably working for an HVAC company that's paying them a good salary and the boss is making a ton of money. And they're saying you know what? I think I'd rather just stay here instead of going out on my own. But you know that's a personal choice. You can't have it both ways. You can't say you know, I wish I didn't work under the man, and then you're not doing anything to make sure that you're outside of it. And the thing that gets me lately is anybody who's publishing that I'm the first. I think that's embarrassing to me. Now, brian, yeah, I'm the first black HVAC company in Denver.
Speaker 1:So what? Great, super duper, amazing, yeah, great, great, for you.
Speaker 2:What did that take? Oh, I just set up my business and I took my HVAC skills and started a company. Okay, wow, Was there any barriers to getting into the industry? It's not like black people don't hire HVAC. Oh, and it's not black people. It's not like people don't hire HVAC folks. Are you good at what you do? Yeah, hello, people. It's not like people don't hire HVAC folks. Are you good at what you do? Yeah, hello, congratulations, I'm sure you're going to get a lot of business.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, there are millions of different ways to control your destiny. It's really just starting with what you're passionate about taking that first step. I advise clients daily on how to do that first step, whether it's I'm looking at cars, a tire store, an automobile store, a restaurant, title companies, real estate companies go, go, go. And the sooner you go a lot of people don't realize that the sooner they incorporate. You know that one, barry, I told you about financing when I started my law firm. You know it was interesting, because you start learning this when you're young. In my 20s I started the law firm and you go to a bank and they say we don't talk to anybody unless the LLC is more than two years old, old.
Speaker 1:Yeah, of course. Right that that next barrier. Right, you got to wait two years before we're going to have a conversation with you.
Speaker 2:And that's just the filing. So imagine with that knowledge, I'm like, well, hell, I'm just going to start a bunch of LLCs. You got to because you got to wait two years, right, wow, you know it only takes ten dollars. So if you're thinking of doing something, at least incorporate now.
Speaker 1:At least incorporate and get started.
Speaker 2:You know, because two years from now, when you start asking for that SBA loan or something and they ask you, well, how old is your company? And they look on the Secretary of State website and they're like, oh yeah, it was incorporated in 2024. You're good and you're like, well, that's such a fallacy, I didn't do shit for two years.
Speaker 1:It's a hoot right. I signed up two years ago and, yes, my business has been in business for two years.
Speaker 2:I've literally done nothing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, one of the things I love to do as we transition a little bit here is talking about finances and talking about money, and you know, one of the things that you know I see in our community is being big consumers. And also, you know, this thing like homeownership and this thing, like you know, owning businesses and this thing like investing is something that either we're just not knowledgeable about because we have access to the information. What's stopping us from finding the right places to invest and finding the right businesses to get into? And even embarking in home ownership is maybe a first step into understanding finances. What's happening?
Speaker 2:I see something different in my community. You know I'm northeast Denver, park Hill, high Points area. It's a different question for my clients and for my family Because what has happened and you know this is the housing prices in and around the city and county of Denver, in the downtown Denver area, have tenfold.
Speaker 2:My mom bought her house for $27,000, and now it's worth half a million dollars Just a basic two-bedroom, two-bathroom house in the middle of by a city park. So my clients are coming in. Brian and grandma literally had $2 million worth of real estate and died without an estate plan or trust or anything. And so you're having these families that are literally millionaires that are like we have no freaking clue what to do. Yeah, how do we maintain this real estate wealth and how do we transition it so that there's some reoccurring wealth or legacy for our family? So I set up a lot of trust and family trust. We're throwing all of that real estate into family trust and teaching them how that family trust is literally a business that they can grow, that they can leverage, that they can buy other property off of.
Speaker 2:So my experience isn't with those people who are saying I don't have anything. It's really those people who have something and because of the tradition, the redlining, the fact that we weren't getting GI bills, the fact that we were prohibited from owning property in certain areas, and if we're talking in different areas of the country, I'm sure that their home values aren't like our home values. They are probably not having the experiences that my clients in Park Hill and Montbello and Green Valley Ranch are having, where their moms and dads are passing away and leaving them. You know whole apartment buildings and duplexes and they're like oh my gosh duplexes. And they're like, oh my gosh, dad bought this duplex for 50 grand back in the 80s. It's worth a million dollars. What do I do?
Speaker 2:So what I'm finding out is we've never participated at that level. So it's incumbent upon us to learn what do we do with this real estate, holding wealth once we have it, and some of the things around that are. It's not investments. It's about how do we manage and maintain paid taxes, put it in a secure place, put it in an LLC, make sure that there's operating agreements around it, make sure that there's operating agreements around it and that our kids know how do we maintain this property, collect rents, become property managers. That's really where that wealth is going to be and not just say, hey, we're going to sell it, we're going to sell it, divide it up and go buy. You know, alexis?
Speaker 1:I know, I know, oh gosh.
Speaker 2:You know, alexis, I know, I know oh gosh, you know, but I'm seeing it more and more and more in our community that families are getting a hold of it and figuring it out when it comes to investing in the market. Of course that's risky. Real estate has always got to be part of part of the portfolio, and then the other aspect of it is insurance. You know, our grandparents also were precluded from the insurance market. So it's incumbent upon us to get to our people, our peers, and say hey, you need a million-dollar insurance policy.
Speaker 2:Absolutely it's better than it is way better than playing the lottery because you're going to die, you're going to, and that insurance policy, that million dollars, should be going to your family trust along with your primary real estate. It's going to pay off or pay down the mortgage. Now you got a family homestead and they got, you know, half a million dollars to work with. They can go out and buy other property, to leverage or pay for other insurance. Then, when your wife dies, that other million dollars goes in there. And now you've got stuff that will allow you to have that million dollar house in Parker right there you go Exactly, that's how they're sitting up there.
Speaker 2:You know just average people. They got nice real estate holdings and you're like how are you able to do that? Oh, you know, granddad, grandma, great granddad grandma. They were able to accumulate some wealth and pass it down. And that's what we're doing. We're trying to figure out how to handle that wealth and distribute it down. Right now we're in that. How do you handle it?
Speaker 1:And then at a certain point.
Speaker 2:It's going to be distributed down.
Speaker 1:Because my grandma didn't have it. My parents didn't have it.
Speaker 2:This is probably the first generation that's going to be able to say all right, here's how you handle it and here's how you pass it down. Don't mess it up.
Speaker 1:And you think now, even with some of the opportunities that folks have, with some of these down payment assistance, you know, like the Deerfield program, $40,000. They're saying, hey, we're going to give you because you grew up in the red line or the Metro DPA, people aren't realizing, hey, this can start a family legacy. You know where the government is saying, well, I'm waiting for reparations. What do you mean? There's a $40,000 that somebody's going to give you to get it to a home, get it, do something now. It's so important.
Speaker 1:There's just you know and then setting it up, and I hope that you know, as you're doing stuff and you're you're the workshops that you're doing, that we can get people that are going to see this kind of stuff. Because you know, yes, you can look it up online, but if you don't know the keywords to even look up, right, you're just kind of stuck and floundering around because you're looking up or you're seeing TikTok, that you know about all this entertainment stuff and you're not realizing this. That's not the videos I should be looking at every day. You know, I don't care if a dog can spit around or a cat can jump over the moon or whatever it is. I got to really start investing in that type of stuff, gotcha.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:All right, we got about six or seven minutes left and, as we're doing this, I really want to transition to health. I was reading a statistic that said African-American men or black men, the average life expectancy is 73. And you know, throughout all the things, what, what are we doing or what can we do? I don't plan on dying in 12 or 13 years, whatever that is, and I'm sure you don't either. You know we can't stop it, but what are some of the things that we can do to make sure that we're taking care of ourselves?
Speaker 2:I think the number one problem in our community is nutrition. Okay, you know, just eat too damn much. We just eat too damn much and really got to get a hold and that causes, you know, the high blood pressure, the diabetes, the overweight, the heart attack. You know, we have to, as individuals, figure out what is our caloric intake and how are we working out. You know, I see men doing some incredible things as far as keeping themselves in shape. I mean, for me what I do is before track practice, I jog a mile, do my pushups and sit-ups. That's really my excuse for going to track practice.
Speaker 2:The wife's like oh, you're out there coaching those kids. I'm like baby. It's either that or I'd be at the gym. I need to do something every day after sitting behind this desk. We've got to be more active so you have the health. The health piece is basically nutrition and activity, and the worst thing in our community, I think, is probably also going to add to that the alcohol. There was a time where and I bet you this was amongst your friends, the druggies in our community, the alcoholics that were in our high school. You got to tell the kids they all died in their 40s. Yes, we went to their funerals 20 years ago.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we did.
Speaker 2:You can see the impact of that. And then any of the older ones that are dying now it's usually with regard to being overweight ones that are dying now it's usually with regard to being overweight and then, of course, you have cancer and things of that sort. Of course, there's the disposition to prostate cancer. So, making sure that gets checked up. And then also, you know, one of the things that I talked about earlier is communicating with people who are a generation or so ahead of you. Yeah, asking them. You know, what should I expect? You know, I don't feel the same right, and one of the things that I learned, which in the past five years, which was very helpful, is have you gotten a blood test? What are you deficient in?
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Oh, I don't know, I'm taking all these vitamins. You're taking vitamins and you don't know what you're deficient in. Yes, oh, I don't know, I'm taking all these vitamins. You're taking vitamins and you don't know what you're deficient in. Yeah, you know, you need to take a blood test. They will tell you if you're deficient in vitamin d, they'll tell you if you're low in testosterone, they'll tell you if your blood palates are wrong and they will customize something for your body. Don't just go out and take a multivitamin and say oh cool, yes, yes, oh, my gosh, you know. With that knowledge, you're like what do you mean? There might be something specifically wrong with me. Uh-huh, oh, dude, you just don't have any vitamin d. That causes depression, yeah, which makes you eat too much. Oh man, I started taking vitamin D and I feel amazing. Now I can go out and work out and I can exercise. Really, it's just because you live in Colorado and you're not getting enough sunlight.
Speaker 1:Come on man. You're like six minutes from the sun. How is that not?
Speaker 2:possible. You're right, this is not difficult. So do a blood test. Figure out your deficiencies and focus on those deficiencies and then get your weight down. Figure out what you need to do to avoid the high blood pressure, the diabetes, of course, sugar. Cut out the sugar. Cut out the breads. You know you can have a cheat day.
Speaker 2:I think we need to adopt a cheat day as our own. Everybody should have a cheat day, Otherwise you're eating clean, You're drinking water. I don't mean you can't have a bourbon an old-fashioned on the weekend, you know. I don't mean you can't have a cigar on the weekend, but if you're looking for longevity and health, you know it's a pretty simple equation. All the information's out there.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Take a walk, do something.
Speaker 1:No, you're so right. This isn't like rocket science. This isn't like you have to go to a school to get a master's in exercise, kinesiology or anything like that. It's like get your butt up and walk around the block right and drink some water. You know, on a daily basis I've been doing the intermittent fasting. You know where I'll go like on Sunday night. I don't eat until Tuesday and then I just do, you know, eat at night, stop eating and then don't eat again until noon. Breakfast is the number one meal of the day. That was Kellogg's.
Speaker 2:Doing some marketing there's no, I don't eat till noon yeah exactly.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it makes a huge difference in how you feel and how you're able to interact. And, like you said, when you feel better, you do better, and then you, then you're able to. You're not depressed, you're not. It's just that cycle that continues to go on and it keeps us alive, and if you have dreams and goals of places you want to go and places you want to be, then those are, those, become your passion, why they keep you alive. I think so. Is there anything that you would love to just share that we didn't talk about? That we didn't go through any closing thoughts that you have as we wind down this time? This has been so amazing, wayne, that we were able to get together and spend this hour just talking about how we can improve our lives.
Speaker 2:And one thing that you didn't touch upon was faith. Okay, and one of the things that I found out about faith, okay, and one of the things that I found out about faith whether it was a Christian faith or a Muslim faith or any faith that you being thrown at them and thrown down their forced and forced into politics, that they're sort of thinking of faith as this whole thing that they don't mess with. And I really want to make sure that men know that calling upon a higher power in some way, shape or form in prayer and meditation and actually thinking about something greater than themselves, especially when impacting our kids, and talking about praying over our families and blessing our wives and blessing our children, and knowing some of the things that are within those religious doctrine that make you a good man, there's nothing wrong with that. There's nothing wrong with the provisions around love and hope.
Speaker 2:You know the concept of hope. Are you giving somebody hope? You know in faith and are you truly loving somebody? Those are concepts that you know are historical, that we need to know and we need to incorporate in our daily lives and teach to our kids so that we can build stronger communities, and I hate the fact that religion has been infiltrated to the extent it has and has turned off a lot of people, a lot of men, a lot of black men, but it's really not. The faith that I think we're talking about is a different kind of faith. It's based in love and kindness and it's based in the respect for all human beings.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, absolutely. Religion has hijacked the spiritual world that, like you said, calling upon a higher power, calling upon you, know there's this invisible world that's out there, you know that functions so well and is designed to be able to help us move through this world, and I think we have, like you said, hijacked it. We've taken it away. We've decided, for whatever reason, in order for God to love you, that you have to do this, this and this and in this way. That's not how God intended it and, yes, there's got to be a way for us to be able to rekindle that, to bring that back. It's part of our heritage, it's part of who we are, it's part of how God wants it to be, and we need to encourage folks to be able to find it. So thank you for bringing that up.
Speaker 1:We talk so much and we get through so many and I forget to sometimes talk about some of the most important aspects of who we are and what we do. So I appreciate you bringing it back. So again, thank you, Wayne, for coming on today. Thank you for being part of this. I hope we get to do some more of it again. I would love to whatever workshops and broadcast out anything that you're doing in the community that can edify others, that can bring people more clarity, that can help people move forward in their lives, that we want to invite them to, that we want to get to. I want to, you know, I want to have some specific things for Black men that we put together, that we can, you know. I say because it's about the community, it's about us getting together, it's about us being able to share.
Speaker 1:We try to do so much stuff in our relation and realize, you know, this is not, this is not my guy. I love the fact that I have this and I have all the information, but I need other men. I need other people. I need other people that I can look towards this generation, next generation and beyond to be able to do stuff. So thank you for for being part of that for those of you who are watching another episode of journey of freedom I hope you're watching most of them subscribe at the button. Whatever we do on YouTube to make sure that it happens, make sure you do that what happens, and we'll have some other great episodes for you to be able to participate in. Thank you very much. Have a wonderful, incredible day today.