Served with Andy Roddick
Roland Garros Recap with Kim Clijsters and Jon Wertheim - 2024 French Open
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Hey and welcome to another episode of Served, a special recap edition In real time. I just finished watching the phenomenal final with Carlos Alcaraz beating Sasha Zverev in five sets. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that this soccer-ass kid is going to have quite the career in tennis. Coming up right now we have my good friend, kim Kleisters. Then later in the show, john Wertheim is going to drop some knowledge on us. Any fan who consumes media has to check out John Wertheim's 50 Parting Thoughts from every Grand Slam the ins and outs. So we'll get the full two-week macro view with John Wertheim's 50 parting thoughts from every Grand Slam the ins and outs. So we'll get the full two-week macro view with John Wertheim coming up. Always has some interesting points. But since it's finals weekend, let's bring in someone who has played in finals and been a champion on many of these weekends. Friend of the show and friend of mine, kim Kleisters, is with us. How's it going, kim? Where are you?
Speaker 2:Thanks for having me again. I am in a meeting room in a hotel in Antwerp. Was in Paris for a few days and going to visit my family and my friends and have a wedding my cousin's getting married so good time to be back.
Speaker 1:I was about to say I thought you were already married.
Speaker 2:Yes, a long time ago.
Speaker 1:Not your wedding. Uh, apparently, um, talk to me a little bit. Let's get right into to Roland Garros and let's start with uh, iga's fiance and and kind of what we're seeing and she is quickly going from, um, you know, wins her first tournament ever. Uh, in the 2020 edition of of Roland Garros, and it's one of those kind of Guga Quirten moments where someone breaks through on such a grand stage is going okay, is this someone who is going to be a top 10 player, like, let's say, like an Ostapenko when she broke through, or is she going to be a top five? And now the conversation is is she going to be one of the best players of all time? You know, you're looking at where she stands, with career slams now at five, tied with Sharapova, passing great champions like Lindsay Davenport, like yourself, kind of on the way to the history books now with her fourth Roland Garros title, tying your countrywoman, justine Enna. But just give me your quick thoughts on on her dominance and what you see.
Speaker 2:I mean, it doesn't seem like there's anything that can stop her, especially on this surface right now no, um, I also think her mindset is definitely one of um, where she wants to be one of the greatest you know players out there and she wants to win every grand slam she plays and and she thinks she can.
Speaker 2:I think grass is going to be her toughest surface because of her a little bit more of an extreme grip.
Speaker 2:But, um, just her like a few years ago I think I met her for the first time at Wimbledon and had a like a chance to chat like with her, and she has such an open mind to learn, like she wants to improve.
Speaker 2:She takes, like she talks to everybody right like past players, past champions, like doesn't matter, like generations, like from way before, like you know previous, from the last one, and she is such an observer, like she wants to learn and um, it's yeah, she's improving all the time and and so her mindset is that she, you know, wants to be one of the great ones and and I think everybody kind of penciled her in to win the tournament, uh, before the draw was even made, and, um, I think that little little second round there, the big matchup against osaka, was to me one of the best matches of the tournament.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, she came close to losing that one, which is, you know, for Osaka, a great kind of the first kind of big moment for her since she came back from having her daughter and where she could test herself a little bit, and so it was good to see that matchup. And but yeah, iga is very impressive and she reminds me a lot of Justine as well when she's playing. She has that determination Maybe not her playing style or her technique, but there's that determination the way she walks out there, maybe the hat, that whole kind of vibe. It feels like Justine out there.
Speaker 1:Well, their Roland Garros records certainly match up together now and let's get back to. I want to kind of take a glimpse forward for Osaka here in a second. But I'm glad you kind of mentioned the student side of Iga last year. So she had already had success, already won Roland Garros a couple of times, and when she first won Roland Garros it was largely by virtue of movement, a big spin mechanism on the forehand side. But it wasn't like this smothering aggression that we're seeing now, right when she steps, just kind of sets herself up two feet inside the court on second serves and then doesn't let anyone up for air. It just feels like you're smothered and she is inside the court. It's not a traditional clay court specialist where they need space and they kind of drop back. Even Carlos Alcaraz in the final was four feet further back than he normally is, which is maybe just in front of where Rafa has been for the last 20 years.
Speaker 1:But someone asked her about it and she said oh well, I just know to play well more consistently. She wasn't happy with just being a slam winner. To be dominant I have to be aggressive and it's like man, from where I sit I'm going. Okay, that's a really nice thing to be able to do, to just decide that you're going to be aggressive and have it work pretty quickly, but kind of explain to everyone as you're going through the process and as you went through through your career. You were someone who obviously had a ton of success from a very young age, right you, you kind of went on the tour and there wasn't much of an adjustment period. You were, you know, pretty good right away, um, but what have you seen as far as Iga goes with the adjustments, how is her game better now than it was three years ago when she was already, um, you know, a two-time, uh, grand Slam champion?
Speaker 2:yeah, I think you mentioned it all. I think, just watching her play live even, it's so impressive the way that she just stands, if not on top of the baseline, like inside the court, right with the backhand too, like she hits those, those backhand returns where she, you know, likes to go for the down the line. Surprise the opponent. Like she takes the balls so early now, which is something that I hadn't maybe not noticed as much in the past, especially here on this surface. So definitely, definitely put a lot of work in, like she. She's always been a good mover, but now she's kind of not giving her opponents the time to kind of work their way into the point right to try and be dominant first, and she's the one that's really trying to take on their opponents early on, and that's a big change. I think that she's the one that's really trying to take on their opponents early on, and that's a big change.
Speaker 2:I think that she's made and I'm sure it's taken some time to kind of get used to that, but it's, I think, especially with you know, unless you have a game like, let's say, a Sabalenka or Rybakina, where you can kind of hit like through her with a lot of power. No saga with a lot of power, no saga. Um, yeah, I think she's going to, you know, have a fairly easy. She has no weakness like she, she, her matches are all pretty, you know, straightforward. Nobody really troubles her. So it's, it's, um, unless you can like kind of hit her off the court, I think, um, yeah, she's not going to have any any problems with anybody.
Speaker 1:Really, yeah, I think there are similarities to rafa in that regard, where you didn't see rafa lose a lot of matches when someone didn't have something to kind of take control to make him react to right. Like I would play him on hard and I knew I could come in on the first server at least. It wouldn't work all the time and you know, I was kind of 50 50 on hard courts but at least I had something that he couldn't control. Right, it feels like the rhythm off too right like you, yeah, like that's such a.
Speaker 2:Is that that routine and trying to stay in charge of the points, and it's, it's, it's. It's such a mental thing too right for her to step in inside of the baseline for the return. It starts with the mindset, like it starts with your mind to try and be, you know, aggressive and and you know attack as soon as you can and um, but yeah, it's, it's, um's, it's um. Yeah, you did it. I mean, of course it's it's. You know, if you can have a big serve, you need the big weapons. Now you know to be players like that.
Speaker 1:The other thing that is non-negotiable. As I'm watching, uh, tennis these days and I was someone who was kind of a clunky foot mover Like I was. I was physical and I was big and I would kind of hustle my way, but I wasn't like a fluent mover. You were obviously a great mover and kind of invented this split situation that we see every player capable of doing now. But two things that I see as an adjustment and it's weird and I have so much admiration for it and you mentioned it is that two things that Iga is doing even better, and I don't know if they work in lockstep. I suspect they might.
Speaker 1:A couple of years ago she would kind of drift and try to get those forehands and really kind of try to control it. Now she's taking the backhand straight on and able to create an angle cross court even when she's pretty much middle right. So it's kind of similar to Andre later in his career where he would set up shop and he would take the ball on whatever side it came and distribute. But what it's done is it's taken away the ability to expose ego line even more right If she's not giving up the space, and then she hits one a little spinny and then someone takes her line. She used to kind of have to recover from that. She's shrinking the court even more by virtue of her backhand getting better and she's able to create like I watched her a million times in this tournament where someone would hit it basically straight onto the backhand. It's hard to create angles when you're not presented with an angle generally, for for kind of those tennis fans out there, she's taking it maybe a foot left of the hash mark and the next ball that her opponent is hitting is outside of the, the sideline right.
Speaker 1:Her, her ability to shrink the court that way, and also when she moves, moving is is she's not like I don't think she would win a sprinting contest against everyone on tour, but I think the way that she is kind of efficient with her movement, she is sliding, she is hitting and then at the end of the slide she's already a foot back towards the center Right and it's all done in this one fluid motion which which makes me want to vomit with jealousy, like it just is, is it's just this insane thing. And also I of vomit with jealousy, like it just is. It's just this insane thing. And also I'm not going to deal from a place of being hyperbolic. I think she has some of the best footwork from the middle of the court I've ever seen in my life work is incredible.
Speaker 2:Hearing it on the clay too, like hearing it live, was so impressive. Like you can hear. You know, when you're playing on a hard could you can hear the squeaking right of like alcarez at the us open. Like it's super impressive to hear him like run around the forehand and then run to the drop shot and run back and stop and and slide at times. But egon, clay, it's like, yeah, it's, it's like all the little small steps and then you, you hear the power when she pushes off. Like it's, it's a. It was really really impressive to see and watch.
Speaker 2:And what I also think is is makes it really hard for the opponents against her that her grip and her technique is a little bit more like unconventional and hard to read. But she has, you know, her backhand is harder to read, like I just find it like she's just able to change directions, like without, you know, with a lot of players you know how you can anticipate kind of, yeah, like that's going to go cross court or this one. Like with her it's so hard to read, um, whether it is the, the more extreme grip at the forehand or the backhand, that's a little bit closer to her body, like it's a. It's a tough like tough technique to read is that?
Speaker 1:is that, especially on clay, just because she has enough time to kind of like I always say the great ones they're able to like kind of hold you in position.
Speaker 2:They can almost wait like a quarter of a second longer to where you're stuck, and then all of a sudden they've got you to where you're in a neutral position and then they can kind of distribute either way yeah, because our sport, like a lot of times I feel like with me too, like there's a lot of anticipation, right, and kind of patterns that your opponents, kind of that you can read after a while and and um, I feel like with her, yeah, it's um, on clay, it's it's the directions that she is able to, even last second, like hit that backhand, you know, return down the line, or like like a short cross court, when it's the variety like there's no, yeah, there's so much variety that gives, yeah, she doesn't give her opponents any rhythm either. So really impressive, like the way that she's grown and and you know, as an, as a, as a player, she hasn't changed much tech, like technique wise, but just tactically, like she's really adjusted her, her game tremendously.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and she I mean I the way that she's like, she's taken like bits and pieces from it feels like different players, right.
Speaker 3:I mentioned.
Speaker 1:I mentioned the Andre comparison. The way she kind of sits on second serves now and just I feel like her opponents are just picking that first ball up off their feet from the middle of the court, like she has that Novak thing where Novak's the master of putting a second serve on your shoe, tops right to where you don't have an angle. You have to play back up to him and then all of a sudden he can distribute the way that he wants. Uh, the movement kind of that, that, that kind of circle c movement where you're you're not kind of moving around that half court from the middle of the court looks a lot like someone like a Rafa. You mentioned the intensity of Justine and I. It's just, it's just fun to see when someone has success and they get to kind of the pinnacle of being a grand slam champion, being number one in the world, and then it's like okay, that just means I need to find other ways to improve, right, and I just give her so much credit for that.
Speaker 2:We're seeing the result right.
Speaker 2:Of that open mindset of like work, starting years ago right, where she absorbs from everybody. When she talks to whoever, it is like it's she, yeah, male, female, everybody. She talks to everybody and learns from the mental side of the sport, the tactical side of it, everything. And there's, and there's, you know. You know too, like there's.
Speaker 2:So many players are so stuck in their, in their normal routines and like changes scare them, like they don't, they don't want to have an open mind to like you know, try to take on a new coach who says this, or try to like no, let's just stick to the same same kind of practice patterns all the time and same routines and um, but with ego, it's, you know, it's trial and error and um, and you know, and you, you always take some good things in your backpack and you use it on the court and you, you, yeah, I mean that's, you know, that's how you improve all the time I would imagine those trials are easier to jump into when they normally work out for you like you just decide you're going to be aggressive and win uh more, yeah, um, I have an hour hit on the on the red clay.
Speaker 2:I was kind of inspired. I haven't played on red clay in like forever so I was like, okay, let's you know, it's nice out here in belgium today. So we kind of booked a court in like a local club here in antwerp and my first 10 minutes on clay they were horrendous. I couldn't move, I was sliding everywhere and then it kind of felt like, okay, this is getting better, but it was, yeah, it's very, very tough.
Speaker 1:I love that you're telling that story because inevitably anytime there's like you watch a great match I remember like watching Alcaraz Djokovic last year and then you're driving around town like an hour later and public court is full right, like everyone's like oh I want to go play. This is so cool, and I just imagine kim doing the same thing, uh we did it before the match, but no, but it's.
Speaker 2:I was at the french open and I saw like the perfect clay courts. Oh man, it would be nice to play some dingles or something you know I'm telling you I'm waiting.
Speaker 1:I got a dingles game ready for I'm like, by the way, those.
Speaker 2:You have belgian beers like cans sitting behind you, or what is uh what? What is that there?
Speaker 4:oh gosh well you know what?
Speaker 1:I'm glad you asked. This is actually an olipop kim. I don't know if you've. I don't know if you've had them before oh yeah, prebiotics the low sugar.
Speaker 2:the whole situation likes those. Yeah, your daughter likes them. Great, wow, I think we get them at Costco. I think we buy the.
Speaker 1:They're available in most places.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You're like a sponsor's dream right now, Kim. Fantastic Way to go with that one. A little bonus coverage for Olipop, okay. So all praise to Iga. That's it. Let's talk about a couple of other names, and I specifically want to get your opinion on the golf.
Speaker 1:Sviatik situation I went on about at length in our last show, just about how I feel, like I'm watching it and can relate, because I spent, you know, the better part of a decade not losing to a lot of people, except for Roger Um, you know, and I felt like I was obsessed with that matchup and trying to figure it out, and often at the expense of the rest of my game. Um, so I want to kind of ask you about that. But let's just talk quickly, uh, about uh Perlini and Drava and anyone else that stood out to you. Uh, this, this tournament. I didn't see uh Perlini making this final coming in. She was kind of. She didn't have great results on clay, which was surprising because she had played so well early in the year, winning a masters 1000 in Dubai, getting to a career high ranking. Uh, what impressed you about her? And then also, uh in Draven, what do you see for her going forward?
Speaker 2:I met Paulini um a few years ago I think it was about three years ago and to me, her energy, like she has, like she's like Alcaraz in a sense, where she loves being out there, like she plays, she's smiling, she's working hard, she's in the gym, she's having fun and, you know, I almost feel like that kind of mindset will eventually get you to, you know, to I don't know if it's to have a little bit of luck with the draw have you know, like, like, grow as a, as an athlete, like it's. So I feel like the energy that she brought out there. She has gotten more and more confidence. Obviously, winning in Dubai was huge for her, but she's a very short player, not the most powerful one, but her energy is something that really stood out for me. She walks around almost like remember Sibulkova back in the day.
Speaker 2:You know like on her toes, kind of like jumping around like high energy and a lot of players are, yeah, they it, I don't know. They feel that on the, on the other side of the net at times too, and it like, kind of like pushes their energy down a little bit. I feel like, or, um, and so that's something that I really like noticed and um, and even at the french, like okay, the final wasn't was, it wasn't a close match, but she, like, was just enjoying every second that she was out there and and smiling and laughing to her like her team and during the games, and it's something alcaraz has too like it's a enjoying their moment that they're out there and um, I mean, andrea, that's fun to watch. To me I'm. I'm telling you like the best tennis that I saw was maybe unexpected, but coming from Naomi Osaka's racket Just being able to, you know, shows really good tennis on clay, which you know I think she's been pretty open about that not being her favorite surface, but really, really good tennis.
Speaker 2:And she's playing in Rosemarlin this week, playing against Elise Burns tomorrow, so another kind of tough first round for both. So, yeah, just interesting to see how she'll be preparing for the grass courts.
Speaker 1:It's interesting because I mean you said it. It's not like we have low expectations for her on clay because it's your least favorite service and she's coming back. She wasn't great on clay when she was the best player in the world.
Speaker 2:No, no, and she expressed it too right that she didn't like like the surface and the movement.
Speaker 2:I had decent results on clay but I was not like, I didn't feel my best, like it wasn't the way that I like to play, it wasn't my natural kind of movement and um. So, yeah, I remember back in the day thinking like, oh, maria won the french open. Like she's not a natural clay quarter, right, she's not a. So so you can learn from those kind of situations and players and ostapenko and the harder hitters these days, like we've seen the players complain about um, today too, like alcarez was complaining about, you know, the courts feeling like a hard court, like it was was, yeah, it's definitely. The courts are not as heavy as they used to be, I think, when we used to play back in the day.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I always explain it, I think and I'm curious to hear your take on this, and if it's just me trying to find an excuse for my lack of relevance at Roland Garros but I felt like the clay there is finer. It's kind of softer Like when you rub most clay it feels like salt. When you rub Roland Garros it feels like baking powder a little bit like a powder yeah.
Speaker 1:I feel like it exposes not fluent movers more than any other other tournament. Like you can made the semis of Rome a couple of times like oh, this is it, I can play. Like let's, you know, let's make a run. Then you get there and I felt like I was just kind of slip sliding everywhere. I think it was especially prominent, uh, during this Roland Garros, because of the rain and having to water it a certain way when you go indoors and then all of a sudden it got really sunny and there wasn't really like much back and forth, it was like rain, rain, rain, rain, rain, sunshine, which I think, to give at least a little bit of a break to the grounds crew, which is the best on earth. It's not as if they don't know how to prepare a court at Roland Garros. I think that switch, along with having to prepare a court for indoor play versus all outdoors, I think that actually makes a massive difference.
Speaker 1:As we talk about Osaka moving forward, when I saw her in Indian Wells, Miami, and it's not as if she made final or had some massive run, but just the way that the ball was coming off the racket she was making more errors than she did in her prime, but her winners were again kind of turning people into mannequins, right, she used to have this ability where when she would kind of get on her front foot and really take control of a rally, people wouldn't move, they would get winners hit and it was like they were standing still.
Speaker 1:And I saw that and play a little bit in Miami and Indian Wells again and I went on uh, tc live and said I think she wins a major again and she hasn't won three matches in a row. But I just, with the way that she, the amount that she's playing, if she gets the reps in, I love how much she's committing to her schedule. She's playing more than she ever has. Like it's, it's, it's, it's crazy, but am I nuts for thinking that she could be on the short list of favorites already for when the hardcore season comes around?
Speaker 2:No, I agree, Especially after that last match against Iga. Um, I feel like that's where I was like, okay, this is the best that I've seen her play. I was in the stands when she lost to Elise Mertens from Belgium in Indian Wells. There was a lot of on first errors. They were mostly still kind of on the wider side of the court, right, the movement being able to come back Like there was a little late at times, but when she was behind the ball it was so good there was, you know, the serve at times was incredible. So, yeah, yeah, and at the fringe I feel like she was really, you know, she had, okay, in a situation she had nothing to lose to lose. Iga's the big favorite. So she's, she was, um, yeah, just going, going for it and and but I I do think that she even on wimbledon, I think like she can, you know, with that serve and and with that first kind of you know, the first two shots of the rally are going to be so important there and she's so good at that, right, the return, the serve is very good. So, yeah, I'm interested to see how she will.
Speaker 2:She went to train in Mallorca to, you know, on the grass courts to prepare. So she was there already, like since she lost and at the French. So definitely committed, focused to, yeah, to try to get that slam and I think, why not Wimbledon? You know, like, I think she can. Definitely she has the, definitely has the weapons and if she's fit enough, which she is like after coming back from from having a baby, it takes time to get your body back and to get physically strong enough to recover matches. You know to have a few matches in a row and she um, yeah, she's definitely um close to to her her best again.
Speaker 1:We still have to. One of the things that the only pushback I would have is we still haven't seen her play like five matches in a row. Right, she looked amazing in the second round at Roland Garros, but she didn't have that log jam of matches, and you obviously, better than anyone else here, knows what it's like to come back, especially, you know, after kind of giving birth and being a mother. So I think that's something to look out for. Is we're talking about winning slams, but that's seven matches. We haven't seen her get through four yet, right, but I do feel like the build is in place and, if nothing else, she showed us that that top level tennis is still in there somewhere, right, like she still possesses the, the osaka that we remember, where she can just be dominant and kind of take, take the racket out of someone's hands, do you do, you watch soccer?
Speaker 1:what you mean football or or soccer.
Speaker 2:Soccer. The real football. I'm sorry there's an.
Speaker 1:American audience there, Kim, Not to the point of where I feel confident saying yes. And then have you ask me something obscure about soccer.
Speaker 2:So we had the Champions League finals recently, right? So a friend of mine is the goalie of Real Madrid, thibaut Courtois. We've known each other since we were little. He had a huge, huge, huge knee injury. Um surgeries like took him a while, like came back, have to have another surgery and then he ended up like he didn't play the whole season, ended up playing the champion's league final and played incredible, right. So he like, so we were like kind of at times like texting and and he, he's like, yeah, I'm gonna see like how I'm going to see how I feel when I get back out there and I'm like you'll be fine, you'll remember it. Like this.
Speaker 2:And I feel like that's the same with Osaka. Yes, it's taken her a little bit of time, but it's also physically when you have had to put the time in the habits and the routines, like she hasn't been away from the game long enough to say like, oh, yeah, this is going to take a long time for her to recover. Like I feel like those habits and the mindset of like, um, remember, when she like came, like played incredible against kvitova and the australian open final, like to step it up in those moments, like when you're down in the third and come back like she that's there and I, I feel like you know it could be one set, one match. That will just ignite that and and then she will be on that role of like okay, let's go. And so I feel like, yeah, I think at our age, you know, muscle memory is not maybe it's more like it's more like at my, at our age.
Speaker 1:it's like more like muscle forfeiture. Um, uh, one thing I want while I, while I have you, uh, this dynamic between um Coco and Iga, where it's like Coco is two in the world right now, first time. She's gotten to two in the world, obviously as a grand slam champion, obviously one of the most the best and most consistent performers, week in and week out. She has so many great things about her game. I think she's an unbelievable and I say this in the most flattering way possible, so digest it that way. But when she is off, I think she is one of the best problem solvers. Having less than her best, uh, that that's out there. You know she does. She can double fault 15 times and still get through matches. She can. Her forehand can be shaky, she still gets through matches. But this matchup against Iga we're lying If we say that she's closer now than she was two years ago.
Speaker 1:Um and I, I harp on matchups on this podcast where it's like someone's playing well, this person's playing well and they're like well, cocos look great for the matchup. If they're both playing, fine, the matchup dictates everything, and I say that from the viewpoint of knowing what a terrible matchup looks like. I was 3-21 against Roger and pretty close to neutral against everyone else at worst. Was there someone that you struggled with just purely on balls and strikes and then it eventually balls and strikes becomes kind of a mental issue and what would you do? How do you analyze this Coco-Iga matchup?
Speaker 2:For me it was Justine. For the longest time, I think I lost four Grand Slam finals before I won my first one, and three of those were against Justine. And I feel like knowing now that I'm a little bit older, and like I already lost those matches before I even started them, because I didn't believe that I was, or I didn't fully believe there was always that that if I play great and I knew that I had to play great, and then you know yeah yeah, hope that that I would play great and that she, her level would maybe drop at times.
Speaker 2:But once you start thinking about those things, it's, it's finished. But yeah, it's definitely become um, you know there's nothing more frustrating stepping out, you know, onto the court against the player that you've lost to so many times and after a while there's, you know, you're you feel kind of hopeless, right, like what, what, what is there that I can do? And so you know, coco has definitely developed a lot, like she's improved, but Iga has improved so much as well, whereas I think Iga just does not have a weakness and she doesn't give you any point. If she gives you a point, it's like 15 all, like she doesn't give you easy, easy mistakes. You know it's, it's yeah, mentally.
Speaker 2:She's just so strong out there and and um keeps her bad moments like really short, you know, whereas a lot of other players, like a sabalenka or like rubaki, not even even coco at times, like when they're off, like it can be for a little bit of a longer time, whereas Iga keeps that amount of time really short and yeah, it'll be tough. I mean, you know there's only so much you can do, right, to try and change or adjust your game a little bit to try and beat an opponent. But yeah, it's a tough one and an interesting one that we'll always be watching right Like what, how can she do it? And maybe on, on on on the grass court. Is there a different technique? Maybe more certain volley or whatever?
Speaker 1:I mean any, any, any, any surface that is quicker to where Coco's backhand can get through the court and maybe you know she can become first serve dominant. I think the the only way around this matchup consistently and I've seen with my own eyes in practice Coco go through a hopper of balls serving 125 consistently second serves, not missing any. I think she has the ability to become a dominant server. I think, you know, struggled at times and I think it kind of goes in waves right when she can be streaky, like in Australia this year, even the tournament before and then going into Australia, she was hitting 12 aces a match with two. You know she was winning 90% of her first serve points, not double faulting, and I think the the the thing that she has to solve for is obviously traffic going through her forehand side is a problem. People saying she needs to step up and flatten out that forehand. That's just not her shot shape, like she doesn't have such a big swing too like it's. It's a I just I hate.
Speaker 2:I hate the solutions that aren't based in the reality of someone's. On her game. Yeah, yeah, you can say like oh, step in and like lean forward, that's not her. Her heavy forehand is great, like it's you know on the clay court. It causes a lot of trouble, like yeah, I, I used to like pull.
Speaker 1:I used to go crazy to be like step inside the court and draw. I'm like do you know how badly I hit the ball? Like I can't step on like a foot inside the court and take backhands and dry like I. My body doesn't actually work that way. My grip like I'm not going to change a grip when I'm 26. So the solutions that I hear analysts and people coming up with for this scenario, where it's like she needs to step in and flatten out her forehand at the line, I'm like that's. I don't think that. That's like telling Iga to serve and volley Like I don't think that's a realistic.
Speaker 2:No, but I see from the point of like, what could damage Iga a little bit more is like, if you can attack her forehand, like not just like once, twice, do it like keep going like three, four times, like in a row, like to really try and put a lot of pressure on that side, because I do feel at times, and on the on the faster surfaces, that's the shot that a lot of times does break down. And so, yeah, like you know, if you look at it just from that side, like what would be a good tactic for for coco, I do think it's attacking the forehand and like, really like, almost like, with a lot of stubbornness, right, like I'm just gonna keep going and I'm gonna try to break it down and I'm gonna try to kind of, yeah, make it, make her, her doubt that shot and um, because it's happened I mean surfaces.
Speaker 1:Surfaces matter too like yeah it's on clay.
Speaker 1:It's a different. Like you're saying it's tough to run traffic through iga's forehand side on clay, whereas it's gettable. It's a different. Like you're saying it's tough to run traffic through Egas forehand side on clay, whereas it's gettable on on grass on a fast hard court. You see her take kind of more random losses and like around a 16 or quarters, you know. So it is a little bit different. I understand Coco going after it more on something that's giving her a little bit of help, um, but I it honestly.
Speaker 2:I just I don't think it's going to be. I think she can.
Speaker 1:I think she can be a dominant server. I think her top line serving is fantastic. It's just creating the continuity in those fields and the ability to kind of let it go and let it rip on the serve.
Speaker 2:So what is it, in your opinion, that like with her serve, maybe at times being like it's definitely improved a lot, but like at times still being inconsistent, like what is it like? Like? What is it that creates that? Is it I?
Speaker 1:think it's. I think it's, I think it's purely toss based. And she, we worked, you know, two days only. So there's no, you know how much work, how much can you get done in two days, but but it's, it's toss based, right, Like basically, if you have a serve and you're reaching for it, like you're reaching forward for it, you can't create a spin mechanism that gives you consistent margin. You just can't.
Speaker 1:And I feel like I especially like American centric coaches. They're like get forward on everything, hit forward, take it early, Like you. I don't know that it's always that way, but a serve has to be somewhat above your head, Cause you have to be able to hit the bottom of the ball and create that spin mechanism. With Coco, her right foot comes over to the side, so she's already tweaked a little bit forward, right. So you're already kind of leaning. And then on the second serve, it's all just margin. The toss has to come back over, almost like directly above your head, as opposed if you're reaching forward for a second serve, it's going to be inconsistent, right? Zverev used to do it and he's. He's fixed it, he's fixed his toss. He's brought it down almost a foot and a half on average from where it was in 2020.
Speaker 1:I think that matters and I also think that she's been so good throughout her entire life with being able to retrieve and play great defense and, on her worst days, be scrappy that I think too quickly she gives up on hitting big first serves and goes to like kind of protect the double fault and kind of protect the first serve, and I think she's going to have to go through the tough moments of like okay, I had a bad serving day, but I need to stick with it. I'm similar to EGA deciding she was going to be more aggressive. She just did it Like she committed to it and was kind of head down. But I think, especially in that matchup, she has to up her risk profile on her serve. She has to be able to get through service games without being challenged consistently.
Speaker 1:On that second serve she can go big. She maybe take more risks where it's placed in the box, maybe take more risks on a higher MPH into the body. I've seen it with my own eyes to where after 20 minutes of serving, there wasn't a ball in the net. You know. So she, she can do it. Um, getting texts before Australia from hitting partners saying like she's serving, like you know, like one of the one of the top guys out here in practice, like it's. It's absurd, so it is in there. I just think she has to get used to that more aggressive mindset I think her default mindset, as it would be for me and everyone else if we could play defense.
Speaker 2:The way that she would is more of like kind of a defense, react to what's coming at you, and I'd like her to kind of take the ball and and kind of control, control the pitching a little bit I heard that from my coach back in the day too is like make sure you finish your service motion and like hit and already kind of fall back into like oh, the the tough returns coming. Like I gotta be ready for that. Like yeah, it's a good, I'm glad to hear that you can like that you're on the team a little bit and help out, and no, I'm not, I'm not like that's.
Speaker 1:That's the thing, that's like.
Speaker 2:No, maybe not like but that you're, that you're a go-to kind of person.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think, I think, I think I just I think I'm just more of an exhaust mechanism so she doesn't have to take all of brad's opinions. He can spare some on me instead. But, uh, okay, so, okay, so, let's get to that. Let's get to the guys quickly before, uh, before we let you go, um, as, as we're talking, it's probably 45 minutes from when, um, the men's final uh finished. We walked straight into studio um Alcaraz. So here's here.
Speaker 1:Here's kind of what I I'm gonna everyone when I'm wrong, post big three sitting there in 2021, it kind of looks like Rodgers hurt Rafa, I think lasted longer than any of us maybe thought he would when we saw him the way he played. At 2021 years old Novak obviously still look dominant. But there was this wonder of I'm in Arthur Stadium night session. Are we going to have the stars in the vacuum post-Serena, post-roger, post-rafa, so on and so forth, post-venus, that can fill this stadium with the brand of tennis and with the star power? And I honestly feared, and would have bet significant money, that there was going to be a little bit of a lull in the interest of tennis, in the product that was being put out there in the. I thought it was going to take more years to kind of have to build and market superstars.
Speaker 1:And was I ever completely wrong? I mean, this kid steps in. He's my favorite player to watch, he can hit every shot and it's like he's this mix of kind of perfect because he can hit every shot and play a certain way and move a certain way, but also vulnerable, cause you don't feel like he even he, three grand slam wins later, has full. I don't know how you can harness all of the options that he has at a given moment. So it does lead to the sense of vulnerability at times. Also, what's your take on Carlos? And I don't know the way he's just kind of taken the world by storm and kind of post big three.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and also the way he's doing it right.
Speaker 2:It's like with a, with an enjoyment it's still you see the kid in him Like it's, it's, it's, it's it's with a lot of excitement and and at times too, like you can see the nerve still, you know, creeping in there and and the doubt at times, but he's so fun to watch.
Speaker 2:And then, um, you know, at the us open last year too, like you know, when, when you're talking to people kind of in the stadium and stuff, like, I would always say, like at times, just close your eyes and just listen for a second, like like that's something that I love to do, like you know I did it with Rafa back in the day like it's so interesting to just listen to a player's movement like, and especially when they're not, you know, about to hit the ball, like what they're doing in between and how. So that's the same with him. And and I love, yeah, he's surrounded by good people, he has a good team, he you know I mean juan carlos ferrer what he's done with this kid from such a young age like there's so many as you're saying it so many coaches, they hop from one player to the other and then, yeah, they have great results, great job.
Speaker 2:But this is, like the you know, a great story of, like a past player who's done well and, yeah, took a young kid under his wing and really developed them to. You know, a grand slam champion, multiple grand slams, and who knows where it's going to end. So, if he can stay healthy and we've seen him, you know, I saw juan carlos ferrer in the semi-final against sinner like a lot of times. Like he was doing this, like calm down, like stay, keep your, don't get too much adrenaline, like up up from what happened last year where he was having almost like full body cramps against Novak. So I think it's a lot of that right, like learning to deal with the adrenaline. Now it's, yeah, keeping his emotions under control, like and because he's so explosive and feisty and and like in a positive way. So it's um, yeah, it's also like he's learning so much and he is absorbing things and and he's getting better all the time.
Speaker 2:So, again, like I think you know what you mentioned about rafa, you know, when he was younger, is a little bit not a concern, but, like I, you know, there's so many more um, physical. You know I say like there's so many more physical. You know I say like like there's so much more focus on recovery than when we were younger Right, like there's so much more people like the details are so much more important. And so if he can stay healthy I mean we saw the elbow injury but if he can stay healthy, it's going to be a really really impressive to. You know, I think the most important thing for him is going to be able to kind of schedule his season out really well and you know make.
Speaker 1:If, if, if anything I've the last couple of years I've seen him go and play on the heels of massive wins, go and play like smaller events, and I'm going so I think, from just but I was smaller events and I'm going so, I think, from just, but I was. I was someone who had to feel good and and have matches going into slams. Otherwise I just felt like I was. I dealt from a place of insecurity. I obviously didn't have the skills, the skillset of, of of Alcarez, but I think this tournament, specifically for the point you're making, is like I was undercooked coming in, didn't play much on clay and now there's like that that uh, and I think Rafa needs matches also I think he operates that same way, but fed and Novak, specifically, and Serena got Serena's probably the biggest master of this is like I'm undercooked and I can still go in and win a grand slam and until this one, I think this is going to do wonders for the ability to schedule confidently, like you're saying, and maybe protect the body with scheduling, while also not worrying about kind of having those feels going into a grand slam.
Speaker 1:And I'm really happy that you brought up Ferrero because as you were talking, I was writing here. I'm like, okay, so the coaching part and you mentioned people working with different players. I'm like, okay, so the coaching part and you mentioned people working with different players. Most of like the quote unquote celebrity coaches are brought on, like I brought on Jimmy Connors when I was already an established player to play to multiple grand slam finals I think three or four at that point and I needed someone who just understood those moments. And you know a lot of the coaches I had. I love to death. But I could look at them and say I feel this like let's talk, let's get through it and it was.
Speaker 2:they don't understand?
Speaker 1:No, it was something they had to, something you kind of have to experience to understand, sometimes not for everyone.
Speaker 1:So that came from you, like, like, like you getting Jimmy on board with like, that's something that came from inside of you or you had people around you that were like, oh no, I was I made that I say early on, it was probably like all of us right, we're 18, 19 where it's probably dictated. It's more of like a democracy of opinion, whereas, you know, when you get to 25, 26, 24, 25, 26, and you've been on tour for six, seven years, I think it becomes a little bit more of a decision-making dictatorship, especially when it comes to to coaches. Um, I asked I had I had gone through two, two people. Um, uh, jim Currier turned me down and then I I was like I wonder what Connors is doing, like he, he wasn't even around tennis, but I just needed someone. I think the American thing and the expectation, and.
Speaker 1:But, all that being said, we've seen coaches come in where it's like, you know, edberg with, with, with Roger or Lubitsch with Roger or Becker, with Novak, and I'm going, you know, yes, I get that because they need someone who is, you know, at least close to their level to like, actually feel like they're having a conversation and also in the prime of those guys' career, I think my cat could have coached them pretty well, Like I, just you know it, just, it was already established. So Ferrero too often gets lumped into this celebrity coaching thing. I, right now, as I stand. I don't think I could see a 14 year old on earth where I would give up my life as it currently stands to go work with a 14 year old to develop them into a champion. That is not the same as someone coming in with a 21, 22 year old who's already kind of established, or?
Speaker 1:one slams, or yeah he has developed a grand slam champion as a as a celebrity coach. That is extremely different. And there's stuff I don't know, like there's the technical part which he's never not prepared, like his technique is phenomenal and he's developing a slice that looked a little weird two years ago and they kind of can see that that's a continuation. The strategic part of it uh, how to deliver a strategic message and also how to articulate that message. Connors could tell me something that was the exact same as someone else you know who wasn't Connors but he would say it with an intensity and he would say it in a way that I immediately understood, right, like I'm like intensity, and he would say it in a way that I immediately understood, right, like I'm like I get. I understand what you're saying, what he's done to kind of develop a technical part at a young age, to develop the relationship part of there's no breakage, they don't yell at each other during matches, like there's no it could just be like a look right or like like yeah.
Speaker 1:So all of these things are not something that I don't think I think I can know what's happening. I can tell you what I think is happening, but then to go, I'm going, I'm having insecurity. Whenever I talk to anyone, I'm like am I giving too much information? When do I pull back? When do I keep going? To have kind of mastered all of those things you know and also teach someone to play completely different than you did, I think takes a certain amount of like a lack of ego, and I don't think Ferrero, as much credit as he gets for the job he's done, I still don't think it's enough.
Speaker 2:No, no, I agree. And what I love today, like after the final, like when he ran into the, into the stands, to see his, like, his, his, like his team Juan Carlos Ferrero, his coach, his coach that he had on tour, was there too and like hugging. So there's, you know, there's, I'm sure he's getting mentored by him too, right, and he's learning from his coach, and it's it's generations that have gone through, you know, to where he is right now as a coach and, um, I agree, like to be able to, to have a coach or that knows what it's like. Like, my biggest frustrations with my coaches in the past was where I'm explaining to them that I'm really not feeling my forehand. They're saying, yeah, but it looks fine from the stance, like you know, like I can't imagine, like I'm like dude, like all right, whatever, like you don't get it.
Speaker 1:Like there's those like, and it's, you know, players understand that, like that, you and conversely when I have, conversely when I haven't missed a forehand in two weeks. Don't talk to me about it yeah, exactly, just leave, just leave it alone leave it be like like I had a rule with my sir, like talk to me about everything, don't talk to me about anything technical ever on a serve, because that's the only shot I actually know inside out, know how to fix uh on a on a pretty consistent.
Speaker 2:It's unbelievable, like you know, worked with like a little bit with some players here and there like nothing like official. But like how many times like I've worked with the player that wants to change something about their technique every time they they lose a match and I'm like how can you become a confident player, like if that's your go, you know, like it's just so, yeah, um yeah, I, I.
Speaker 1:I just can't wait to see more of this and also this rivalry with with center Sinner. It's such a gift. Just a quick thought on him Obviously getting to number one come Monday. We do need to talk about he will be number one in the world I think the 28th man on the WTA tour man on the ATB tour to get that ranking. What did you feel like the first time that you got that ranking and was it tough to kind of wrestle with the next time you walked out on court?
Speaker 2:I almost felt like not worthy.
Speaker 2:I feel like my first time, because I had never, like I hadn't, won a grand slam. You know, and like in the media too, like the press conference, that's all they were asking Like, do you feel like you're worthy of like being number one? Because you know, especially Serena at the time, because you know especially Serena at the time, like she wasn't playing much but when she played like the big tournament, she would almost win everything right. So, like I agreed like she was definitely the better player the year that I became number one, but okay, like I played more and I was more consistent in those tournaments. But it is, you know. So that does you know, some of the comments from the media do get into your head. So it became a motivation to really like try to like get it done right, like to get that first grand slam under my belt and um.
Speaker 2:So I think for sinner like to be able to um, you know he's won a slam, like I think as a kid you know, winning a grand slam and becoming number one is like what you kind of dream for and and hope for and um, and then what he's able to kind of check those boxes already is is cool, and then you kind of just keep pushing the bar and and hope for and um, and then when he's able to kind of check those boxes already is is cool, and then you kind of just keep pushing the bar and and keep pushing it forward. But um, he's um so fun to watch grown um. I was doing commentary in paris and it's funny, like how the guys were still talking about how, yeah, he needs to physically get stronger and he's too skinny and um, but I'm like, listen, he's, he's improved and developed so much that, yeah, he's so fun to watch and it's also like just a different body type than it was.
Speaker 1:We all like to kind of project forward from what it was when we first got on tour and make that like the the baseline now, like what's too skinny, is medvedev too skinny? Yes, very skinny is sinner too skinny, if you can move and create speed.
Speaker 2:I don't care what you look like, I have friends that come to the tournaments and they talk about I didn't know Federer was skinny, I didn't know Novak was skinny, I don't think when they watch it on TV and they're big tennis fans, but then when they see them in real life, that's what they talk about. They don't say that about me, but us, but no, but it's like. But then when they see them in real life, that's what they talk about. They don't say that about me, but Us, but no, but it's like. But there's a different build. You do feel like the physical kind of description of players have definitely changed, and then probably a little bit more on the men's side than on the women's side.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and props to Zverev. Obviously coming in with the whole hype mechanism around around Nadal dealing with a million off court issues and the ability to compartmentalize, and we won't get on our high horses about that. I'm sure John Wertheim will have an opinion one way or the other, um later on in the show. But to come in as a favorite in a grand slam and deliver, um being one set away, you said you lost your first handful of major finals before you broke through. Talk about the mental hurdle that Zverev is kind of feeling going through, where he's basically accomplished kind of everything in tennis as far as outside of majors.
Speaker 1:One year in championships has won, I think, six Masters 1000. Twitter fingers stay away from me if he's won seven 1000. You know, twitter fingers stay away from me if he's 17. I get it. Um, but uh, just kind of talk about your process and where is he? And is there extra scar tissue considering the way he lost in 2020 um, where it was on his racket a little bit, and having a lead now in this one also, uh, up two sets. Uh, where where does he stand on on monday, looking back, is it pride? And what you put out there is it desperation to get over the hump, or is it some mixture of of both?
Speaker 2:um, I would think desperation is probably the, the feeling that is number one at the moment. Um, frustration, um is, um, yeah, I mean it's. It's. You know the like. I've talked to Simona Halep in the past.
Speaker 2:Like you know, I was close to Darren like, and going through moments I own Strabur as well like it's, it's, you feel like you create a bigger, you put focus on winning that Grand Slam becomes so much, that becomes so much more important than than anything else. Really, like, at times, you like don't even think about like, oh, you know what should my, how can I improve my game? Like it's just basically that focus on like I need to win that grand slam. And, and so I think for him too, like, even like in that fifth set, like just like his whole his facial expression changed. There was a panic at times or like a yeah, like, what can I do? Like this is gonna happen again. Like you can almost read it off his like face and it's um, and it's unfortunate. But you know from me, like how I kind of took it.
Speaker 2:Like, yeah, I was probably not a pleasant person to be around for the first two, three days after I would lose those matches, and what I hated the most was the fact that I never was able to play my best tennis in those finals that I lost to Justine, right, like there's a different feeling If you like feel like, okay, I like went all out, I played great, like it was a great final, but I just felt like, yeah, I was always like just more tense and tight and more in my head and and yeah, and so my kind of thought process that I tried to really tell myself over and over again was okay, like, put yourself in that position.
Speaker 2:It's not something you can train in practice, right, like Zverev can't say, oh, let me go and try to relive that moment in practice. Like, like, it's not something you can do, like that you can train for. So you have to, yeah, give yourself, like, be patient and keep putting in the work and give yourself those moments again where you can, you know, play the quarter semifinals against these players, finals, and and really, yeah, confidence is what you need in those moments and and you can only create it on, you know, at the big stage and those big in those big matches.
Speaker 1:It's a. It's a tough spot to be in when it's win or bust Right. So it's like it's win or bust right. So it's like I got to a point in my career at Wimbledon where you lose a final. It's basically like it's either euphoria and it's gonna happen, and it's gonna feel like your tennis heart is complete right, or it's like a complete failure and I was the opposite of you, whereas I would play the slam finals and I didn't feel like I didn't play well. I never played kind of subpar in a slam final You're better than I am but I didn't feel like it was the moment that got to me. It was the fact that I just couldn't get over the hump of kind of a talent divider ability and it's just for me.
Speaker 1:I have a little bit of sympathy for where he's going to go, because it's basically going to turn into this conversation where he can make the finals of a slam. What an accomplishment that is To go through two weeks of your life, 25 hours on court, and it's going to get digested the same by people who don't know and don't understand the same as if he lost third round and I hate that for him. I think it sucks Um, credit to him for kind of getting through and keep putting himself, uh, in that position. Certainly not easy, but I think I also they. It only gets tougher, um, the longer it kind of sits out there.
Speaker 2:It was a camera angle at one point where you could see him look at his box.
Speaker 2:But at the same time, like in the president's box, you saw the trophy and I think it was like four, two in the fifth, and it's like, oh, like you know, like you could see that he was feeling, like he felt that it was slipping away and, yeah, it's, it's really tough and and like it gets to me like I was sitting here with my friend, like watching it on the, on the screen, and we were both like, oh, like this is terrible, like, but it's, it's part of the sport and you can only hope that he, you know, it makes him even more hungry to, yeah, to work, to keep working hard.
Speaker 2:It's not that he doesn't work hard to keep that up and give himself another opportunity, right to do it, to do it again and then try to, yeah, change some little things here and there and and, but it's, um, it is definitely a great effort. Like you know, people around me would always say that, but there's so much kind of black and white thinking too, Like, oh, I lost, like, who cares? Like, if you know, if it was a fight, like, yeah, even the trophy, like the runner up trophy.
Speaker 1:I was like oh man there's no other sport, by the way, that you have to stay out there. Like, think of, like, imagine an NBA finals, like you having to stay out there where they have a team celebrates we're the only dumb sport that does that. Like you can leave, like another sport you can leave, and then you know you have to do press and you're disappointed, but you don't have to stay out there in the worst moments of your professional.
Speaker 1:Oh my God, give a speech, the biggest achievement of my entire life, or my entire career, I think, is speaking after Grand Slam losses, when all you want to do is curl up in a ball and suck your thumb for about a month. But anyways, listen, I think it's just not that we needed another proof point of tennis being in an amazing spot, I think from a crossover mainstream pop culture perspective, with, you know, getting everyone has a documentary on some sort of major streaming platform, I think, interest level ticket sales you can't get tickets for the U S open right now and it's, however, many weeks away. I you know email Wimbledon and it's just like the demand for to consume tennis in person on TV. Uh, in moments where there's not live content, I think is at an all-time high and it's not something I saw coming. I'm thankful to the athleticists and the athletes that are out there. Our podcast is in great shape because Kim Kleisters comes on every once in a while.
Speaker 2:It's all you. No, no, no, no, no. The wins keep on coming, you have no idea how many people I'm telling you how many people like talk to me about it, like random, and are like I don't know, andy was like this and you guys are great. I'm like okay, thanks, like it's. You know it's like it's crazy. Yeah, it's, it's really cool um so I'm happy. You guys are um well. Well, you're great, you do a great job.
Speaker 1:So you were. I think you were one of the first people who said yes to coming on and exploring the way we do things here, without asking questions. You said yes and then I think it started a little bit of a downhill snowball. We are thankful and we're appreciative every time you choose to join us. I look forward to the next one and enjoy some home cooking in Belgium and enjoy your family. Enjoy the wedding. Tell your cousin we said happy marriage or condolences, depending on how it goes.
Speaker 2:I don't know. I'm actually going to be a granddaughter Like I'm. We said happy marriage or condolences, depending on how it goes. I don't know, I'm actually going to be a granddaughter. Like I'm going to stay with my grandma for a few nights, Like it's like my grandma yeah, Like I'll you know she's going to cook for me and all that stuff. So I'm really looking forward to that.
Speaker 1:I love it. We'll appreciate it and we'll talk soon. Let us know when you get back stateside I will and we'll talk to you soon. Thanks, kimmy. All right, bye guys. Thanks, always a pleasure, uh, having friend of the show, kim kleister's on um it's, I find myself going into like fan mode and asking questions to her. Uh, I've lived experience but I like hearing the different takes on them and the different takes on the players and the scar tissues and what might be going through and the mental gymnastics. It makes me feel, uh, like I'm a little less crazy sometimes when there's a similar view. But fresh still in Paris, says he talked to Carlos Alcaraz like 15 minutes ago when he was doing his victory lap. Third major, roland Garros has won US Open Wimbledon. Roland Garros, youngest player to ever win on three different surfaces in a grand slam. Uh, from that fancy hotel room in paris. John wertheim, how you doing it's been a long two weeks for you uh, good, two weeks though.
Speaker 3:Uh, no complaints doing well, good to uh. Good to see you. Yeah, I wish, uh, you know you. You wouldn't know it from my surroundings, but uh, I'm about 15 minutes off the court from Roland Garros, so another major in the books and Carlos Reign Supreme. That was quite a match today.
Speaker 1:Talk to me. We're on our group text and John obviously has a day job, you know, kind of calling the shots and doing the desk work and then doing the post-match interviews, which I think are awesome. I think you do a great job with that, but you were at the benefit of being in the stadium, right? So there's only so much atmosphere that we can digest while watching on TV. You sent a text saying like this match it's a little weird. I think Zverev was up two sets to one at that point and there were a lot of ebbs and flows. It looked like the wind was a significant factor, at least from one side. It seemed like the strategies were changing every time they switched ends. What was it like in the arena today? Kind of start, middle and then obviously the home stretch.
Speaker 3:Yeah, this was a weird one. These are knowledgeable tennis fans, so you've got a little bit of the CNBC crowd. But I think everyone sort of came in. They remembered what happened to Carlos last year when great five rounds, great first couple hours against Novak and then the cramps. They knew about the controversy we don't have to get into now, but they know about the context of Zverev and the complications with him making the final. They were still recovering, I think, a little bit from Rafa, from Novak.
Speaker 3:It's been a bit of a weird tournament. And then you have this final and on the one hand it's great entertainment. There's some shot-making. It's very hard to sink your teeth into this match, right, I mean Carlos, there were 18 breaks overall. Carlos won the first set, looks good. Then here comes Zverev, takes the second set, carlos is up 5-2 in the third. Okay, it looks like we're going to have a four-set match. And then he disappears. Zverev steals that third set and then Carlos wins the fourth 6-1. So it was very hard. Just as the players had a hard time finding rhythm, so did the fans. As you say, it was a little bit windy, it was patchy, we had a line call dispute. In the end, great value, good entertainment. It was box office. Carlos wins in five sets. We get our storyline.
Speaker 3:Nadal may have played it for the last time, but the new Spaniard comes. And not only that, the guy who beat Nadal in round one is the final opponent on the final Sunday. It was a weird. Four hours though in between, and you know, sometimes you get absolute classics. Sometimes you have, yesterday, just two players on different planes. Today was a weird one, but I don't think anyone's asking for a refund and I think, ultimately, tennis has its new champion. Tennis has its new steward. We're all going to be fine, carlos.
Speaker 3:I'll tell you about that interview. He comes in a Michael Jordan T-shirt. I'll tell you about that interview. He comes in a Michael Jordan t-shirt. His English is, I said, as much as his tennis has improved, his English has improved just as much. And the guy wants to talk about Michael Jordan Every question. So he sort of went back to Michael Jordan and the words of wisdom and have I seen the last dance? And he's better. You never got to see him play, but he watches YouTube. A little weird that you win a major and you walk off the court after a five-cent win and the bowls of the 1990s are what you want to talk about, but no good way to wrap this tournament. Bit of a weird tournament, bit of a weird day, but that's how it goes sometimes. And another major in the books.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it just feels like start to finish. This tournament was dealing with elements, right, and I say this uh, we talked about I went on a quick reaction show like basically walk into the studio five minutes after it finishes and basically just read my notes from the entire match out loud on air, which is either, uh, annoying to whoever's listening or, hopefully, informative on some way. Shape performance it's kind of getting into the nerd version of tennis. But going from basically an indoor tournament for week one to a sunny outdoor tournament and trying to maintain a similar playing condition, similar style, challenges all around. Right, adjustments in this final uh, I went through down the rabbit hole of the way Carlos started. The adjustments that were made by Zverev, uh, how the wind plays into it.
Speaker 1:You throw nerves and execution into it and it's somehow, you know, masterpieces can start out ugly sometimes, and sometimes, you know, andre Agassi said the smartest thing maybe I've ever heard in this simplistic thing is you only have to beat one person per day as a tennis player, and so it doesn't have to be a classic. But Carlos, we were questioning his problem solving earlier this year, right, does he need Ferrero there? This was a pretty good example of being spotty. First set was one of the best I've seen him play. It was just start to finish a slacking. I mean the ball flight on his backhand side, the variety he was showing Zverev didn't know what was coming, didn't know where it was going to be hit, didn't know what ball flight was was coming through, figured it out, started pounding forehand, attacking the strength which is something you never hear junior coaches talk about. And then Carlos just kind of stuck it out, kind of choked away.
Speaker 1:Frankly, the, the third set, and then recovered. And here we are talking about center. For the last six months, carlos winning a slam third year in a row, third different slam, um, and being a good citizen. Uh, along the way, um, I admitted, uh, basically, I was pessimistic about where tennis was going to lay post big three, serena, venus at the top of her game, and I couldn't be happier to be wrong about it. I think this, the, the, the game's in great hands totally agree.
Speaker 3:I mean, I think that's one thing that uh came through and, as much as we will mourn and miss the big three and Serena, they're still going to play these events, they're still going to hand out trophies, players still are going to develop. Um, you know, we don't have to get into it now, but I would say right now, as a group, you've got a lot of players who are well worth rooting for. There are a lot of sort of very, very worthy stars. I mean it's not Coco Iga, you've got sort of different for different personalities. You can go down the list and it's young and it's old and I think you know, I think at some level and I include yourself in this I think the last generation set the tone right. I mean, I think sort of yourself, roger Rafa Novak, I think sort of the Andy Murray, the sportsman of the last generation. I think there's some trickle down effect on that. I think the sport's going to do just fine and yeah, I mean you know it's, it's fluid. This is why we love sports. Plots change, people change.
Speaker 3:You know, a year ago and you were totally honest a year ago Carlos made a bit of a mess of his match against Novak and there was cramping. We talked about his hydration, his maturity, how he was processing. He was at one point sort of conceding games in hopes the cramps would go away. It was a little sloppy. A year later, completely buttoned up, he didn't panic. He needed treatment, but he knew exactly what he was doing. There were no, he said there were nerves, but he kept them under wraps. He wouldn't have known it. He, as you say, pretty much gagged away that third set and then he reset and only lost one game of the fourth. So I think we're seeing a maturing player as well. We're going to be fine here, folks, and that was sort of one of my takeaways.
Speaker 3:It's crazy tennis, you said it. It's rain, delays, it's controversies about crowds. We can talk. There was a bad call on the fifth set, I think stained this match a little bit. I don't know if you want to take the baton there, but you know I think bottom line is they're gonna play these events. Inside tennis we quibble about little thing. The average fan that went there had a great time today. They'll come back next year. They'll give her out a trophy next year.
Speaker 1:We're gonna be okay, okay, this, uh, this movie continues yeah, and one of the things and you mentioned alcaraz learning from last year, as, as I'm watching it and he's, he knows what he's asking for now. Right, like his body, he can feel it. Listen, you're never fresher at hour four. Even if you're in great shape, you're never fresher at hour four than you are in hour two. It just doesn't work that way. Even him knowing the cadence of when to ask for this pickle juice, when to ask for treatment, what to ask for when he's getting treatment, those are all learned behaviors that don't exist in practice. I've said it before in this podcast never once in my life did I cramp in practice and I would practice for six hours and early on in my career, nerves involved, different conditions, yada, yada, yada, I would cramp. You learn how to fix. What you want from a young player is not to make the same mistake again and it seems like with his team and obviously uh, I, we can't say enough great things about uh, juan Carlos um in the job he's done, taking not just a formed player but a junior, 14, 15 year old and forming him into the champion uh that we've seen. Um, just give me.
Speaker 1:And obviously we we want to talk about the Alcaraz Varev match because it's top of mind and it was dramatic. Right, they were. It was interesting watching the commentary Alcaraz rolls the first set, it's like one all in the second set and McEnroe and Carillo go. Uh. Well, this is the uh, this is the amount of time that Ego's on court yesterday, um, and the match was over. So let's give attention and respect to dominance. Even though it was straightforward, even though it's not going to be the final that we remember going to a fifth set with all this drama, we still need to pay it the same respect, if not more. Talk about IGA, this tournament and kind of the progression you've seen, you know, over the last four years, since we've gotten to know her, since she burst onto the scene in winning Roland Garros in that, uh, I think, uh, the October version in 2020 um, yeah, I mean, first of all, I don't don't you like this that we have these sort of different expressions of excellence.
Speaker 3:Yes, I don't want these tours to be mirror images of each other. I love the fact that you know, we can watch and admire Serena as she rolls over the competition and then the next day we can admire the latest chapter in a rivalry. I don't mind that these tours and these players are at different places and these finals play out differently. I mean.
Speaker 3:I think, they're both enjoyable in their way and I think it would be actually really boring if this was just a completely overlapping Venn diagram. Iga is just dominating, especially on this surface. You know she's lost one match in the last four. You know last five times she's played this. She lost one match.
Speaker 3:This was her fourth title, that naomi asaka match. I mean I it sounds sort of a it's a lame twittery thing to say, but I do feel like naomi asaka was a big winner here if she shouldn't have gotten the runner-up trophy. You know, producer michael know this there's ufc bonuses. Na, naomi Osaka should have gotten some cash bonus for what she did in this tournament. Yeah, exactly, fight of the night bonus. Dana White comes and gives Naomi Osaka a bag of cash and says don't declare it on your taxes. But no, I think after that scare, I think we see also what a great player she is mentally. So, naomi Osaka, she's down match point. She figures out a way she gets herself out of trouble these, these powers, these ability to escape, and then for the next five rounds she absolutely rolls. I mean she. At one point she won like 20 straight games. She had three love sets in a row. The final could have gotten complicated. You've got this underdog nothing to lose. The crowd loves or even physically diminutive. It sort of has every stupid david and goliath trope and ego and another sort of expression of mental toughness just said yeah, not so much. And it's mental toughness to stave off match points and be great champion. Naomi osaka is seven five in the third set. It's also mental toughness to come out to a final and say, okay, we're gonna make quick business here today and she lost two of the first three games. She lost one game the rest of the afternoon and here she is. You look at who has won five majors and she's into Justine Ennin territory, two away from Venus Williams at her age. And I think we've had this pivot from. She went from a good player to a great player, to a generationally great player, and Chris Everett very graciously said look, I've got the record, I've won seven of these. She's going to win more than me. So yeah, I think we're looking at something.
Speaker 3:She does not have this, particularly by choice. She's not someone who's interested in being a celebrity. She's not someone in having the world know her, and that's fine. She sort of wears the cloak of celebrity. She wears it awkwardly and uncomfortably, and that's fine. She wants to be a really good tennis player. She is, and she's on her path to double digit majors. Carlos Rivera completely different vibe, completely different kind of final. Carlos is, I think, much more um extroverted, and that's. That's fine too. So two, two very different champions. So there's a lot of overlap, but there's a lot of sort of distinction as well yeah, and just proven champions at this point.
Speaker 1:Like eager breaks through wins. Her first tournament at roland garros was like okay, you know what is she. Is she ostapenko or is she hennon? And I got in trouble the other day because I compared I tried to compare the number of slams versus French Open titles. Hennon's won seven. Someone on Twitter beat me up about that. So she's creeping up, obviously tied with Sharapova. These days these are all-time great. She's already an all-time great. Now it's about padding the stats and the resume.
Speaker 1:And I'll tell you, dominance like that doesn't happen because you find form and it doesn't happen because you survive a match. It happens because you're committed to random Tuesdays, right. You're committed to doing the right things when no one's watching. And then, by virtue of a lifetime of discipline, a lifetime of grit, a lifetime of work, a lifetime of X, y and Z, all of a sudden you go out and you make the second week of Roland Garros look easy. It's not by accident. It doesn't happen by accident, but we've covered the finals. Props to the champions. You were there for two weeks. The tournament wasn't played over the last three days Only. Give us some tidbits. Your, your, your kind of 50 parting thoughts. Uh, in your mailbag is must read for any tennis fan. Can you give us a little sneak peek, a couple of things that, uh, you found interesting over the course of the last two weeks?
Speaker 3:cut me off when these get boring or weigh in. This was the last year, it seems, for NBC, so we've had a bit. You know I'm a little bit conflicted here, but the NBA TV negotiations, I think, had big bearings and NBC doesn't necessarily have the spare cash or else the bandwidth now that it has the NBA. Who didn't get the NBA? Well, it looks like this Discovery, Warner Brothers did not get it and they reportedly have now sunk $650 million over 10 years into broadcasting this event. So this was the last year, foreseeably anyway that NBC, which was here since the 70s, last year of NBC TV coverage, what else? Last year of NBC TV coverage, what else? There were 20 players fined this tournament, which is actually pretty low for these events. Only three of them were women. So make of that what you will Remember the player who should have been disqualified for the French wild card, who hit the ball into the stands and actually hit someone and mysteriously was not disqualified.
Speaker 1:Yeah, see, let me interrupt you when it, when you leave, when you leave, judgment calls up to umpires, and it's the same thing with different results. That's when people get pissed. When novak hits someone at the us open and gets defaulted immediately because it's an umpire on the court, like if you accidentally hit a ball and it hits an umpire or the person in the third row, it's the same because it's an umpire on the court, like if you accidentally hit a ball and it hits an umpire or the person in the third row. It's the same action, it's an accident, you don't mean to hit someone, but it's the same result. This bullshit thing where, like last year, someone gets thrown out of the tournament for the exact same thing and then this year. That's what causes confusion and that's why players get pissed sometimes. Sorry, rant done go.
Speaker 3:No, you're totally right, and this applies beyond tennis. We want consistency. Why did Angel Hernandez get fired?
Speaker 3:Why do certain legal decisions really stick in our crop. All right, we want consistency. We didn't get it Very strange that a Japanese doubles player gets dinged for sort of tapping the ball inadvertently. You know, defaulted Shane last year. Last year, defaulted Shane last year. Last year you caught to the doubles player. This year a tennis player from France rifles the ball, hits a spectator and they basically he got a $25,000 fine. Interestingly, on this fine list, 17 men fined and five of the 17 were Sitsipat's brothers, and all five infractions were for coaching. That's a little weird, I wonder. If the money goes to charity, it should probably.
Speaker 1:There's no continuity in the rules Like it's either a free for all or it's not, like it just doesn't make any sense. And also, should we develop like a soccer type thing where if you get the same infraction over and over, it should roll over into the next match. Like if you get coaching violations, should you get a fresh start each time, even if you haven't earned the right for a fresh start based on the infractions being the same over and over.
Speaker 3:It's like hotels and Monopoly, it's like speeding tickets. Yeah, it should accelerate. I mean, I think that coaching I think you're allowed to get coached on your side of the court, so I think one can safely assume that this just sits the thoughts that the father was was shouting across the neck. So, uh, if they had been, yeah, it's exactly okay.
Speaker 1:so like so wait, I'm allowed to talk to someone when they're next to me, but I can't like shade and put my hand motion out if someone's across the court like I. I I get it Like can't we just make a rule? Simple, you can coach. You can't coach, Obviously, if you're talking during someone's serve or if you're talking during whatever. But like it's just like us in tennis to make a rule and then have so many little things in the rule to make it confusing and to where nobody knows what they can and can't do like it's just dumb and also it like it's.
Speaker 1:The job of uh father sits upon us to know the rules and not get in trouble like god I gotta be questioning that.
Speaker 4:Why, why not just let them change boxes? Then just change boxes. Oh, each time you can't walk, I mean, come on, I can't like it, just yeah, yeah. But the court but, what you're not?
Speaker 2:no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no no because you're.
Speaker 1:You're like type of tennis fan that only watches matches on stadium court where they have boxes. Most of them, you're in the stands like everyone else. We need is what we need is sitsabas's father, to have more proximity, to talk more. That's exactly what we need. What's the next one, john?
Speaker 3:the uh. Can I just back up? I mean, can we not just say dad, dad, I don't know if you do the rules, but you broke it. I got fine. Could you please not do dad? You did it again. That's twice now. Dad, three maybe. Uh, you know, maybe you'll have the fifth time. You're getting an infraction for coaching.
Speaker 1:You could change your ways but anyway, uh, let's move on the department of redundancy department yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3:Um, let's see what else. Uh, a lot was made of the night sessions, 11 of them, not a single women's match. I talked to amelie maresmo yesterday and she was very you know, I give her credit. She took the question and she basically said nothing to with quality, it's just length. People pay a lot of money, they come from work. We can't start it until whatever the time 7, 30 or 8, whatever it is and basically, you know she didn't say this directly, but it was sort of we can't risk ego going out there and winning in 41 minutes when people are spending good money for a night session. So you know, if I'm the wta, I said here's what we're going to do. We're going to play not best of five, we're going to play four out of five, we're going to play four out of seven. Now, give us all 11 night sessions. But I think you know it's a fair riddle. I think she basically says look, nothing against women's tennis, but I can't risk charging for an entire session.
Speaker 3:What else there was a lot made of. Well, we can talk about the line calling, because, one thing, that they did not have this tournament, strangely enough, before we even get to the line calling because one thing that they did not have this tournament. Strangely enough, before we even get to the line, they didn't have electronics on the net. The let. Here we are. The world is going towards electronic everything. Robots are taking over. Nvidia's, you know, has the market cap of 10 amazons and they've gone kind of analog here. There was not any electronics on the net.
Speaker 3:That didn't end up being controversial, but it could have. I asked the tournament. They said well, it was a tournament decision and I'm like yeah, no shit, like of course it was a tournament decision. What informed that decision? I did not get very far on that and then, as you saw, in the fifth set of today's match and I thought zverev actually to you know, we can, whatever you think about zverev I thought he really high-rooted this. It could have been a lot more embarrassing. You know, critical call would have given a break and we do not have electronics. What did you, how did you react when you saw this call being made based on highly fallible human eyesight?
Speaker 1:There's a couple of things.
Speaker 1:We're basically choosing to have to rewind cassette tapes by hand, like we're literally choosing to rewind Vhs like this like we have streaming, we can press back, we can start from the top, and we're choosing to do it in the most antiquated fashion available, whether it's nets, whether it's line calling. Like we don't. Like no one churns butter anymore. Like we don't do that because there's a better alternative and time happens. And like players, they don't drink Cokes before they go on court anymore. Like we know that an all spaghetti diet will make you cramp. Like there are things. Like everything progresses, but yet like I will never and I go off on tangents on this all the time Whenever someone gives you the reasoning because that's the way it's always been done when it comes to progress, inserting new technologies, everything else it's going to be a failure.
Speaker 1:It's going to be a failure at it. May not show right away, but then you're going to get to the point where in a fifth set in a major where someone's trying to win their first grand slam, someone double faults, up a break. It doesn't get called they re, they run it back, there's no break. That is potentially career changing and it's because we want someone to trot down, look around and and also like the the part where umpires come in and explain to players ball flight and how it lands, as if we haven't seen it every day for six hours, from the time we're seven years old.
Speaker 1:Fuck off, like we're gonna go, we're gonna. We're gonna not use exact line calling, we're not gonna get it right because we choose not to. And then we're going to have them explain to a player how a ball travels, even though that's the job it just. It is just like mind blowing. But then we're going to innovate because we're going to put some stupid little camera that looks like a horn on an umpire so that we can look at players art, so that we can catch the live reaction of players reacting to our shittiness. Like what the fuck are we doing? Like we're gonna bait them.
Speaker 2:We're gonna bait them into bitching about what we're doing, and then we're gonna videotape them like really up close and in their face like I don't know like
Speaker 4:and it's like. It's like a shitty gopro too, it's like not even. Oh my god.
Speaker 1:It's like, you see, like someone arguing and it's like they're moving, like out of the screen and they're moving. I mean it's just like what are we doing? I don't, I just can't get over it. It's like this was a choice. Putting this up to translating marks was a choice that I'm sure a lot of people spent a lot of time on, and I haven't heard a good defense of it yet. Saying it was a tournament decision just means it was a bad tournament decision. That's what I'm hearing.
Speaker 3:Wait back up to what you said. I didn't even think of that. It's absolutely right. We are just to be clear about this. The chair umpires here were equipped with this ridiculous camera. It's like they're miners in the coal mine.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was a problem. It was like if my headphone was out here and then it was turned on. John, right now, and they're like, like they're taking orders at like Starbucks. I didn't even think of that.
Speaker 3:But your point is absolutely right. Use that camera to watch the the umpires bend over and look down at a mark with their own naked eye. Um, it's like taking a cab to get to an uber. I mean, it's just. Uh, yeah, I haven't even thought about it.
Speaker 1:But also like okay, so we have this dumb little and we spent too much time on this, because, you know, whatever it, shows what it is but we have this dumb little camera.
Speaker 1:And for those listening on pod, like I'm just holding my hand up like it's a dumb little camera to the side of my face and then we get to the point where it's a crucial moment in a fifth set of a major, on the telecast we have access to that camera. Zverev is next to you talking about it, like saying hold on, hold on, hold on, look at this. And that's the moment we don't use it. What is it for? If you're not going to use it in that moment? What is the dumb little camera for?
Speaker 3:I'm thinking every single person watching knew the correct call, except the three people that it impacted the most the two competitors in the chair umpire, don't feel free to cut me off there. Lovely moment. On Saturday, martina Navratilova is supposed to hand out the trophy to the winner and Chris Everett, who was once her fierce rival and now is as close a friend as you can have. Martina woke up and said you know what? It's been 50 years since Chrissy won here for the first time. Yeah, she gave away the trophy last year, but this is a nice gesture and we're both here. She's had a bit of a rough year. Why don't we both do it? And you know, saturday morning, these two friends made a decision and ega vatic wins this title. And who goes and gives her the trophy? But both chris everett and martina, because martina just thought that was the right thing to do. We need more of that. Um, that that I mean. I don't know that. Yeah I.
Speaker 1:So my take on that is like one the the, the part of the story that we kind of undersold there was. Martina has gone to hell and back with, with, with cancer, the last you know, however long and chrissy the same over the last couple of years. So there's years. So there's a shared friendship, there's a shared experience, shared history and now all of those things, but with a different opponent, right and so for her to extend this handout to Chrissy in this moment, and also, like, if you're Iga Sviatek and all of a sudden you're accepting this, this trophy, and you see two faces of tennis's Mount Rushmore up there, and you know the, the weight of those two being together, the significance of tennis history, the significance of, uh, the fighting spirit, in more ways than one, it means more to Iga, it makes her moment more special, which is kind of the point right, like we want to celebrate the special moments in tennis.
Speaker 1:I know that you have worked closely with Martina and Chrissy this year on a project and I don't know how much you can talk about it If you can't talk about it at all, great. But you have had an inside view of that friendship. I think you're closer to it than most of us and they just continue to be kind of the standard bearers, for we can be enemies on the court and a relationship can start with respect, then it can get to you know, shared experience, then it can get to friendship and then it can become what essentially is a sisterhood. At this point, this many years later, and I just think it's beautiful. And they continue to drive home the most important points that can be made time after time without missing a note.
Speaker 3:That's very well said. I've got to be a little cautious here. But yeah, I mean I have no objectivity here, I'm completely compromised. It's a lovely relationship and I think you know I mean I think we see this a little with with Raph and Roger as well I think there's an acknowledgement of not only are we sort of bracketed together for history, not only did we have this rivalry, but you know not a lot of people know what it's like to win 18 majors. They have this shared experience and I think you know.
Speaker 3:One time I said to Martina, like how do you perceive it? And she says look, everybody says oh, if Chrissy wasn't there, you would have won so much more. And she says not so fast. He pushed me in a way that no one else did and I am blessed for her presence.
Speaker 3:All right, maybe I would have had a couple more majors if she hadn't been in the draw, but then again, maybe I never would have gotten this point because, as trite as it sounds, rivalry brings out the best in both parties and it's really crazy. I mean, this was always sort of set up as the ultimate contrast and it's sort of Chrissy and soft versus hard, and gay and straight, and east and west and the baseliner versus the attacker and lefty righty. And here they are in their 60s and they are fast friends and it's not even sort of one of these mutual respect, as you said. That's a great word. I mean. There's a real sisterhood here and it's really. It's really. I mean it's really been a pleasure and an honor to see it up close and in person well, I don't know that we're going to get any better than than that.
Speaker 1:Uh, as a parting thought uh, john, get some rest. Uh, back after the break. Uh, hashtag, get served by andy roddick. We'll see who this week's lucky selection, or unlucky selection, is Back after the break. Thanks, john, welcome back to Served on T2. What a show.
Speaker 1:I'm humbled weekly by the content brought to us by the likes of Kim Kleisters, the student of the game, john Wertheim. I always appreciate their time, never take it for granted. I always learn something talking to both of them. You know, I just think, as tennis fans right now, we are spoiled in such a great way. We just witnessed the greatest generations, right. We witnessed Serena Williams march through history. We witnessed Federer, rafa, nadal, rafa and Nadal, novak, you know, venus Murray, the list goes on and on and on. Klysters, ena Sharapova, and now we get Iga already marching through the record books with five slams. Carlos Alcaraz, the youngest player of all time to win a slam on three different surfaces.
Speaker 1:And we become victim of the moments and look forward. Can yannick center overcome a hip injury? Can his? Can he get his legs? Uh, back underneath him? I know the wta wta tour is salivating over the possibility of playing ego on anything except clay. I don't think they want any more of uh, of that problem, uh, to solve. So, you, you, you got to think. Coco's looking forward to the gap the the grass, sabalenka, rabakina, they have to be excited to get off the clay and have to, you know, they get to solve for IGA on a different service, which is simultaneously her worst surface. Can Novak somehow pull off a miracle and do Novak type things and get back somehow for Wimbledon and do Novak-type things and get back somehow for Wimbledon? And if not Wimbledon, the Olympics, and if not the Olympics, the US Open.
Speaker 1:We all, as tennis fans, as I said the other day, we want to see the longest passing of the torch possible from Novak down to center Alcaraz and, to a lesser extent, medvedev, et cetera. We are just so spoiled with the amount of tennis content out there, the way it's been able to cross over, it has earned its seat at the global mainstream sports table and I think we're all better for having watched these great champions. And also I think we get to see one more great champion here. Mike, what do we got? Hashtag Get Served by Roddick, brought to you by Swing Vision. This is the part where you hackers send in your videos you brave hackers and we get to break it down courtesy of the technology of SwingVision. Who do we have today? What are we looking at?
Speaker 4:We have a friend of the show, Ivan Luce, who sent us a video with the caption, which I guess we're going to see, where this is leading making King Curious proud off to a rocky start.
Speaker 1:okay, oh, uh, on the, you know who that was. That was actually making murphy jensen proud, because, as I do, the hot shot on t Live every time unnecessary showboating. If you're a coach, you take Ivan out on the next play even though he was able to pull it off somehow. Completely unnecessary, looks over like they didn't choreograph the whole thing. Ivan, thank you for watching and listening to serve. Thank you for participating in Swing Vision and unnecessary showboating 15 yards. Listen, this is such a fun segment. I love seeing the submissions that you guys put in and thanks for putting yourself out there. It's not easy to get critiqued. It's certainly not easy to get critiqued publicly. Ivan, thanks for being a friend of the Served podcast. Mike, you got any other thoughts before we get the hell out of here?
Speaker 4:No, I mean I think we send us some other videos that maybe aren't tweeners. We're getting lots of tweeners, you know, let's, let's get. We only have one more week left.
Speaker 1:You know what I feel like I didn't see it coming. I feel like we're getting a lot of choreographed sequences that's what I feel like I feel like people are literally taking the video and creating their own highlight reel.
Speaker 1:Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'm gonna owe ivan loose a written apology, but that was pretty nicely in stride by your friend. Best supporting actor situation, I don't know, but fun nonetheless. Great racket skills from ivan. Uh. Thank you for watching on T2. In order to get your submission in for a hashtag, get Served by Roddick. Producer Mike has some more info. Thanks for watching.
Speaker 4:All right guys. Here's a reminder. Scan the QR code here on screen if you're watching, or go to swingvision slash served. The link is also in the bio. Sign up for Swing Vision. Submit your best serve or rally to X or Instagram using the hashtag Get Served by Roddick and tag at Swing Vision app. We look forward to seeing what you got. All you chuckers out there, as Andy likes to call you. See you next week.