Stacy:
Welcome, writers, to another episode of the Write It Scared Podcast. I'm your host, Stacy, and today we are talking about writing middle grade horror with author, Wendy Parris.
Wendy grew up in the Midwest, loving books and hoping to glimpse a ghost. After graduating from Northwestern University with a bachelor's degree in radio, television and film, she acted in Chicago storefront theaters, performed improv comedy and freelanced in public relations.
Now she writes spooky novels for kids. Her debut novel, Field of Screams, is a junior library Guild Gold Star Standard Selection. Her next book, Stage Fright, publishes September 17th, 2024. She lives with her family near Chicago in an old house that's probably not haunted. Thank you for coming on the show today, Wendy.
Wonderful to have you.
Wendy:
Oh, you're welcome. You are welcome. Happy to be here.
Stacy:
Would you please share with our listeners a bit more about your journey to Becoming a writer.
Wendy:
Well, it was a long journey it probably started I know it started in the 1970s when I was a kid and I was a total bookworm red red red all the time climbed up in the willow tree in my backyard and with library books and constantly read.
I loved Nancy Drew. I loved ghost stories. I loved being scared. You know, when I was about 13, I got busy with other things and didn't read so much. You know, I was on the swim team and started to go to parties or whatever. So writing was definitely on the back burner for a while. What's interesting is, as you said, I studied film in college and I also acted so interestingly enough, I think I've always been a storyteller in some ways.
I had written. Like, 11 chapters of a Nancy Drew kind of novel when I was 11, which is hysterical, by the way. And my mom recently found in the base, basement and it's, you know, in a fabric color covered spiral notebook and, you know, written in pencil and it's a terrible handwriting. Yeah. But so that's, that's kind of when this.
Storytelling started and it continued through acting and studying film. When I was 45 years old and had middle school kids, I went to visit my dad, who lived in Iowa. And I went on a bike ride. He lives on a lake. So I biked around the lake and through some woods and down this lonely country road, and I spotted an abandoned farmhouse, and I was fascinated.
Luckily, it was a bright, sunny day, so I was not scared and I hopped off my bike and I went up and I took some pictures. Now, I did not go in the house. People always ask me that and I tell children, especially do not go into abandoned buildings. I was definitely scared of snakes or the floor collapsed or whatever, but I took a lot of photos and when I got home back to Illinois, I just couldn't get it out of my mind.
As I said, I was kind of at a point where my kids were getting more involved themselves in school, didn't need me so much, and I thought, you know what, I am gonna go back to my first love middle grade books, and I'm gonna read a ghost story about this abandoned farmhouse. So I did but it was a long process for sure.
I did not know anything about writing novels. I took a course at the high school, kind of a continuing ed kind of course about writing for children and ended up meeting a writing group. We went on and met even after the class for several years. And honestly, I don't think I could have written a book without them because they held me accountable.
You know, every week we each had to share five pages, whether or not they were perfect, whether or not we wanted to we shared five pages and then we critiqued each other. And I think on my own, I just would not have had the discipline. To do that, but knowing that these other four people were going to, you know, read my stuff and were expecting it.
I kept writing. And I got encouraged to join SCBWI, which is the Society of Children's Book Writers and Illustrators. Good job. That's a hard one to say. It's a hard one to remember. It took me forever to figure it out. Exactly. Yeah. I always said it wrong, but And I started going to conferences and I went to a conference, actually the National Conference of SCBWI.
I think this was 2013 and everybody there, all these writers and agents and editors. Said you have to get on Twitter and I was like, what Twitter I'm too old. I'm not getting on, you know, they're like, no, everybody's on there. You meet so many people. So, I did go on Twitter and I have to say it did. I learned a lot.
I got involved in some contests. I made friends all over the world, writer friends. And the other thing is, I got to you know, follow agents and editors and see what they were interested in. Looking for and acquiring. In books, and so I learned a lot just had a lot of resources again on my own in my house.
I wouldn't have known all this stuff. Right? So I joined a contest and things kind of happened from there. I started querying but I did not get my first agent until 2016. Team. And within six months of getting that agent, she left the industry and I had to find another agent and that took me a year and a half.
So it was a long process. I did get my other agent in 2018 and we went out on sub, subbed my first book, this, this book Field of Screams and got a lot of great feedback, but nothing really happened. So we subbed another book for a while. And what happened was my agent saw an editor tweeting saying she wanted spooky middle grade and she said, you know what? I'm going to send her your 1st, 1 field of screens. Not the 1 that we've we're currently, shipping around or, or subbing around because I think this one's a little scarier and she wanted really scary and she was new to the industry.
Well, she snapped it up and. That was I signed a contract October 2021 and it just came out August of 23 and August of 23. that was 12 years to the month after I first saw that. Farmhouse so long process for sure.
Stacy:
Wow. What a story.
Wendy:
That might have been way more than you asked for, but
Stacy:
not at all.
That was an amazing story. So, I mean. You had written this book and had gotten an agent for it and that evaporated.
Wendy: Yep.
Stacy: And then had to pursue it for another year and a half, find another home for it with an agent and still it didn't go anywhere.
Wendy: Right.
Stacy:
And it wasn't until you were working on a subsequent project that a place in the world seemed to open up. Yeah. It's always fascinating to learn how books come to the market and to shed light on that. Because sometimes it doesn't mean there's anything wrong with your book. It's just that. The market and the timing of the market, you know it's not it's it's not nobody's looking for that right now and You probably could have quit you can't probably could have been like nah
Wendy:
Totally.
Literally about a month before I got my contract My youngest child had gone off to college And this was 2021, and it was, COVID was still bad and my mom was in the hospital. She didn't have COVID, but she, she couldn't get a room forever because of all the COVID people. Oh, my God, you know, it was really a tough time.
And I talked to my son, who at that point was a junior in college. And I said, well, I don't know, I'm, you know, I feel like I'm at a crossroads here. Maybe I should give up. I don't know if I should do this anymore. Maybe I should find something else. This isn't working out. He said, mom, you cannot quit. You cannot quit now.
And he sent me a meme, which is hysterical, which I wish I could show you. But basically is it's, It's two panels and the top panel, it's a cartoon, the top panel is a guy with a pickaxe and he is carving through this tunnel and like, you know, 50 feet away from him through the rock is a huge pile of diamonds,the second panel underneath it, another guy, similar tunnel. He is maybe inches away, he has gone much farther than the first guy and it's maybe inches away from the diamonds. But he doesn't know it, and he's turning around and giving up. So my son sent me that, but I was like, okay, isn't that sweet? And you know, not that, but it was kind of just, you know, serendipity or something that he gave me that.And I thought, okay, well, maybe I should keep going. And then a few weeks later I got the honors.
Stacy:
Oh, wow. Oh, that just kind of gives you chills. That's very cool. Thank you so much for sharing that. So you said it was 12 years from the time you looked at that house. Till the time your book went into the world. And were you continuing to work on subsequent books while you were out on sub or trying to find a new agent?
Wendy:
Yeah. Yeah, definitely. Definitely. So in fact, I, so I have a whole second book, and I had had that when I got my, both of my agents, actually.That one just hasn't really gone anywhere. So this book that's coming out this coming fall, is actually a third book that I wrote extremely quickly, believe it or not. This first book took forever, and I had to learn, and blah, blah, blah. But the second book, I had an option in my contract, and my editor said, You know, I want to see your next spooky one.
And she couldn't look at the one that I, that I had in the can kind of because someone else at her house had already said no to it. And so they respect each other's opinions, right? But she said, Hey, I really want to work with you again. So, you know, pitch me some ideas. So I did. She liked one of them.
Long story short, she bought it. And then basically I had to write the whole thing in about six months. So she bought it on spec. She did. Yeah. Which was great. I mean, she made me write a whole entire synopsis. So I did have to figure out the plot, which took me about two months because I didn't know anything.
You know, I kind of have this idea. And before she would even really consider it, she said, you need to write a synopsis and let me look at it so I can see what's going on. So it took me a long time, you know, to really think through the story, but I did. And so when she did give me the offer, I had the blueprint there.I was ready.
Stacy:
So that's a great transition into my next question for you is to talk about a little bit about the process and you mentioned, like the first book took a long time and then you've written two other books since. So tell me about your, your process. How, what does it look like for you to go from ideation to a polished draft that you're ready to send on to the editor?
Wendy:
Well definitely for my first two books, the one that is not seeing the light of day yet and my debut. Interestingly enough, I started with a place. And a lot of people start with characters or situations. But as I said before, you know, I saw the farmhouse and that kind of sparked something in me.
So I kind of started with the place and I thought, okay, this is an abandoned farmhouse. What, if there's a ghost, why would a ghost be there? Who could the ghost be? How would this relate to a kid? You know, you want to think about your audience, obviously. And. I played around with it quite a bit. Just sort of brainstorming ideas.
With the book I wrote really fast, it was the same kind of thing. I kind of wrote down some interesting settings. I seemed to gravitate towards settings. But then I was thinking about, okay, what did I feel like when I was 12 and 13? What were my troubles? What was I scared of? And Sort of came up with the idea in the second book for this girl who she's moved away.
She comes back to visit She thinks her friend group's gonna be totally the same and guess what? They're 13 now and everybody's growing up at different rates and not everybody's the same and all these things have happened, right? And that's that's something that I think every kid can relate to so she In order to kind of get back in because she feels like the, the young, inexperienced kind of baby of the group .
She said, she says, let's go to this, you know, the theater, the haunted theater and have a seance and see if we can talk to the ghost. And so they do and they get a lot more than they bargained for. But yeah, so I, I don't know, I, I, since I was a theater major and I did some summer stock, maybe I just thought theaters were interesting too.
But yeah, that setting spoke to me as well.
Stacy:
I love that answer. And, and to me, like, it makes sense because. Setting provides so much atmosphere in the horror genre. I mean, it does. So the fact that you start with a setting , I think that's really cool.
Maybe it's a gift.
Wendy:
I don't know, but you know, I also think studying film, I've always been very visual. If I picture something, I really picture it and I love describing what I picture. So I think it's so settings can get so vivid in my mind that then the story flows from there too.
Stacy: That's, that's great. Good for you. Ha ha. That is not, that does not work for me.
Wendy:
Well, we'll see if it works. I'm working on a third idea now, so I don't know if it'll work the third time.
Stacy:
I get like a snippet of a scene and I have no idea where we are in time or space. And there's people and I know what they feel, but I don't know who they are.
And that's super fun. And I try to build a story around that. Yeah.
Wendy:
Plot is the hardest part for me. I can describe a scene and I can do dialogue extremely easily. I hear that in my head. It just comes right out, maybe again, my background acting and stuff, but the plot boy.
How's this going to make sense? Why would she do this? You know, what is she doing next? I don't know. So that's really hard for me.
Stacy:
Yeah. We each have our strengths and our weaknesses, and I think our community, like who we're in community with, like you were speaking about earlier, like being with a writers group or, you know if we have those people to help us, you know, to help us where, what should happen here?
Stacy: Well, yeah, I know. We don't, we don't do this alone.
Wendy: No, we definitely don't.
Stacy:
But so those are some really good tips is one, you know, just to think about your audience. And I love how you responded, like thinking, putting yourself in the shoes of, of your reader, like, what things would you be worried about at ages 12 and 13?
And that makes complete sense. Like reconnecting with your friend group and it's not the same vibe as it was when you left. Right. Yeah. And I can imagine if you moved away to someplace new, you're struggling with new and then you think you're going to come back to familiar and that's all new.
Wendy:
Yeah, exactly.
Stacy:
So this is stage fright. This is the book that's coming out in February. September, this September. Very cool. Well, thank you for sharing more about that, that novel. I'm currently reading your first one and I'm enjoying it very much.
Wendy:
Oh, thank you so much. Yeah, they're, they're different. They're very different. So that'll be interesting to see, you know, the reception for Stage Fright, but I, I did want to kind of. broaden my reach. You know, I didn't want to always write the same kind of story. So, my first book definitely is, centered on one character.There are certainly other characters, obviously. But the second book here is a friend group, and there's a main character, but these other three characters are very important too. And it's kind of a time. It's a compressed story. It's over 24 hours. Where's the first books?
Stacy: Ooh. Yeah.. That definitely that instantly increases the tension when you shorten that timeline up.
Wendy: Yeah.
Stacy: Okay. So a big part of this podcast is dedicated to telling the truth about why, why writing can be so hard exposing unhelpful internal narratives that many of us writers face. When we craft our stories and the point is, is that if we can identify these unhelpful , internal narratives. normalize them and then we can work through them so that we keep writing. We grow in confidence, right? And the end result is going to be more people writing more stories in the world, if they can beat that self doubt. So would you please share a time when the writing has gotten hard and how you struggled there and what helped move you through?
Wendy: I still struggle with this sometimes. I struggle with, and I'm sure a lot of people do, perfectionism. I've gotten better, but it is hard for me. I kind of want to make sure a sentence is really good before I keep going, or that's kind of my default. And when I'm in the zone, I'm in the zone and I can just kind of write, but it is very hard for me to let go and not judge myself.
And particularly with first drafts, you should not judge yourself at all. You should just get it out. And that's a big struggle for me. I'm getting better. But you know, there's Just back of my head, somebody is saying that sentence isn't good, or maybe this should happen and I overthink instead of just kind of letting it flow.
And for me again, not to keep bringing this up, but because I did improv the important thing with improv is yes and. Right. If you're, if you're in a scene with another person and they're saying here we are in the candy store, have a candy bar. The second person can't say, what do you mean we're in church?
You know, you can't know anything. You have to say, yes, here we are. And I love chocolate. And you know, so yes. And is the thing you have to take what they give you and build. Right.
Stacy: I love that.
Wendy: Yeah. So that's what I tried to do and not judge myself and say, no, that doesn't work. Just kind of keep going.And, you know, if I read it the next day and it doesn't work, that's one thing, but to get it all out there, because, you know, sometimes you go down the track and another idea comes that you wouldn't have thought of otherwise. So that is something I really struggle with and, and I encourage people I know how hard it is, but gosh, if you can just.
Let it flow and not judge as you are writing. Just play.
Stacy: it is really hard. Cause you're also trying to keep the plot going in your head and you're trying to keep, you know, tune into your character's motivation and all of the big picture macro elements of the story, as you're writing forward and ,I get bogged down with that too.
And sometimes it stops me and other days, other days, other days, I'm just like, Right, right. Yeah. And I, I write a little more recklessly Right. And a little bit more with abandon, I, I think just catching it every time you can catch it and just be like, Nope, we're in the candy store. We are not in church right now.
We are in the candy store. Yes. . And this is where we're gonna stay and I'm wherever gonna work myself. Yeah. . Yeah. Right, right. It's kind of like that inner critics telling you you're supposed to be in church. No, I'm in the candy store. I'm in the candy store. I'm working on my draft.
Perfect. Okay. So many writers struggle with the accountability and the finding the time, , to write. So how do you find the time to write despite all the life things? And how would you say this has changed for you over the last, well, I guess it's been, it's been more than 10 years, right? Since you started your writing journey.
Wendy:
Well when I started, I, I was having to write, when my kids were at school, I was a stay at home mom at the time. I was very busy with a bunch of stuff, but that was the time I wrote. And I've never been one, even in college and stuff to stay up late and do anything.Now if I'm on under deadline, I do, but I'm more creative in the morning, I'd say before I get tired. Before everything in the day breaks in oddly enough, that's when I'm creative, but A lot of times I have to sit there for a while and have it come through. It's not like, you know, there's a, there's a channel.
I have to say, I just do it when I can. And one of the things I learned is, I don't want to be a hothouse flower and have the perfect cup of tea. And the lighting just the right way and no one's in the house and it's very quiet and now I can write because, you know, you will not always have those elements.
You have to learn to write on the back of an envelope when you get an idea when you're sitting in the car, waiting to pick up your kid, which I've done a lot of. I have little scraps of paper and stuff like that. So, yeah, just be open. I would say to anytime some people find their, their groove and get up early and that's their thing.
I guess I just couldn't afford to be that specific about it because every day was different. So it's a muscle you use it and you learn as you go.
Stacy:
I love that. Thank you. Yes. There's many, many ways to do this. I, I work with a writer who does a 15 minute stint on her phone at night while she's in bed.
Her spouse is watching TV and, and she types tippity tap with the thumb on her phone and she's almost done with her first draft.
Wendy: That's amazing.
Stacy:
So there's many ways and, and one of her mottos is just one sentence a day. If I come to it and I touch it for one sentence a day. Cool. Yeah. So other people, they're sprinters, right?
So you know, they may block off however long and sprint and only do it once a week. So there's a bunch of different ways to do this.
So fine. Yeah. I love what your message is. Find what works for you and just be open to catching the moments.
Yeah, so when you look back on your writing life, what did self doubt look like for you?
Wendy:
Initially, what doubts did you have about your ability to write a book?
Well, I think most people think before they actually sit down to do it. Oh, I could write a book And then you sit down and you're like, well, huh? Wait a minute You know, this is a lot harder than I thought.
Stacy: 100 percent , I definitely thought that.
Wendy: Yes. I think everybody does really. I think everybody thinks they can write a book for sure. And probably everybody can, but will everyone know it's, you definitely have to be stubborn in a lot of ways. And I think I was stubborn. Also, you know I, I think towards the end there, I was also, I knew I'd been writing for so long, I thought, it's almost embarrassing that nothing has come of this and I'm going to prove them wrong and, you know, them, whoever they are and I'm, I'm stubborn and I'm going to do this anyway and I'm going to keep going kind of thing.
I think that one of the main things is once I got writing, I thought, well, okay, if I really stick to this, I can do this.
But will it ever get picked up? Will anyone ever read it? The competition out there, obviously, is fierce and there are just a lot of people, a lot of books being thrown at agents and editors and you know, if you think about the odds too much, you may stop. So don't do that.
Think about your story and think about your readers and the message you want to give, or how much fun you're having, or, you know. Focus on the positive. That's what I tried to do because if I thought too much about the odds again, I probably would have just stopped.
Stacy: And I'm so glad you didn't because then I wouldn't be reading your book.
Wendy: Right? Well, I'll tell you one other thing. This is kind of interesting. My editor is very young. She's in her late 20s. And when I started writing this book, she was in high school. So I had to wait for the right person to be at the right moment. You know what I mean? They're not always out there at the right time.
Stacy: So that is such a good point. The right time and the right person may come, but if you don't do the work and write the words to have the book to give them, it's all for naught. So you have to decide if you want it, decide to continue and then do the work for when the timing is right.
I love what you said about folk not focusing on the odds. I think if we focus on the end, on the end result of something we can't control. Yes. Ooh.
Wendy: You'll drive yourself crazy. That's painful. Yeah. So find the pieces of the process that you love, that you enjoy. And then, yeah. Hey, hang on to that, , but be stubborn.
Stacy: So what have been the most helpful resources for you to learn your craft?
Wendy: Yeah. Again, for me, SCBWI my local chapter you know, has monthly meetings and the beginning, I would go to those for sure.And then, you know, honestly, being online, I mean, you do, whether it's Instagram now, which is, or whatever, Twitter's sort of dying, obviously, but connecting with other writers that way, and someone knows someone who knows a book that's going to be perfect for you, or You know, here's a contest you should try, or here's an agent you should try, or you know, let's sprint together, will you be my critique part, partner, and then you learn so much critiquing other people, oh, my gosh and you learn to be gentle with yourself too, because you know how you, if you critique someone else's work, right, you want to, you know, Give them the positives and then say, well, maybe this could be, you know, what do you think?
I don't know if this is quite working. And you have to do that to yourself too. You can't be so hard on yourself. Think of yourself as, a stranger who is your CP, your critique partner. And, you know
Yeah, be gentle, be gentle,
Stacy: What would you say the best piece of writing advice you have ever received, if you could? Narrow it down.
Wendy: Oh, my goodness. I've honestly what I've said before is don't critique yourself and just get it out the best. This is a cliche. You've probably all heard it. Every writer listening to this, but you cannot edit a blank page. You have to get it out there and then play with it as much as you want, but don't be too precious about getting it out there.
You know, I would actually say to myself, and this is a little disgusting, but just. Puke it out, just get it out, you know, just get it out and then you can do something. I think there's a, there's a nicer metaphor about that. sandcastles or something that somebody talks about.
Stacy: I like, I like the puking it out and I think it, it fits.It's on genre. It is on brand. Well, that's true. It's perfect. Perfect for middle grade horror. Just, just puke it out. Just puke it out, man. And just maybe we'll title the episode, the podcast. So just puke it out. Oh, boy. Or maybe not. Yeah, maybe not.
Wendy: But yeah, I think that's the best advice I could give because honestly, for me, at least, and I know there are other people out there, you're just critiquing yourself too much.
And you're just being too hard on yourself and you're being too much of a perfectionist. Just get it out.
Stacy: I could not agree more because there is no second or third or whatever Unless you get the first one done. Yes. Right? And the only thing you can do is improve the book. . So, yeah. Let it rip.
Okay so what gives you the most joy and satisfaction when it comes to your writing?
Wendy: Oh boy I think when I can see and hear a scene and it comes together.
Stacy:Oh yeah, I love that it's a great feeling. It feels like you're in pocket. Yeah. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. I call that, I call it flow for me, and I'm in flow, like I can see it all. For sure. The percentage of time that that actually happens? Right. Yeah. Mm hmm.
Wendy: I think 10 minutes a week. Yeah. It's a narrow margin.
Stac: Okay. And what is your wish for your fellow middle grade? Horror writers out there.
Wendy: Well, horror is kind of having a moment and people are realizing that kids And some people knew this already, but I think parents are maybe hearing and realizing for the first time that horror doesn't mean it's, you know, should be completely censored for kids.
There is appropriate horror for kids. Kids need to deal with that. fears. And a safe way to do it is to read a book about it and put themselves in a character's shoes and think, what would I do? Right? And if they get too scared, they just close the book. A film is visual and more in your face harder to walk away from.
So I think books, middle grade horror for kids, if they have an interest in the book, go ahead and start it. If they don't finish it, fine. But they might just find a little kernel, you know, the safe place for them to be brave or to think about being brave. That's exactly what I find wonderful about middle grade whore.
Stacy: I love that so can you tell us anything about what you're currently working on?
Wendy: Yeah so stage fright is coming out and I have another option again, my editor has said, okay, throw some ideas at me. So right now I'm brainstorming ideas. And. I just at the very beginning, so I'm kind of playing and trying to not be too critical of myself and just get some things out there.
I'll write down a bunch of settings. I'll write it down. Fears, I'll write down situations and, you know, kind of puzzle piece them around a bit. Times of year, again, I'm very visual, so both of my books take place in the summer. And my editor's like, you know, maybe do something during the school year.
And I think to myself, school is kind of boring, so I'm going to do it, you know, during winter break or something, you know, and just have, just play around with, with that to be different. So right now I'm in the playing mode and I'm, yeah, trying to come up with ideas. That sounds so fun.
Stacy: Where could listeners and readers find you?
Wendy: Well, you can definitely go to my website, which is wendyParris. com. Again, two R's in Parris. Field of Screams is in 300 plus libraries, which is very exciting for me. Yeah, it's in all the stores. It's in Barnes and Noble and indie bookstores and everything else.
I'm very excited about that. You can find me on Instagram at wendyParrisauthor but do go to my website if you're interested at all in middle grade horror because, you know, there's some fun facts in there.
Stacy: Well, thank you so much for your time, your openness and your vulnerability. It's greatly appreciated.