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Speaker 1
Hello and welcome to the Literary Hype podcast. I'm Stephanie Cutter, Literary Hype Woman. Today's Off. Their conversation is one that's like six years in the making, which is wild that it even got to happen. I first met Danielle Page at Bitcoin in 2018 when she was promoting the Dorothy Day series and now before 50 bop any boo she's got a new series Wish of the Wicked is the first book in this series and it is a fairy godmother origin hence the ones that she gives out when you go see her.
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Speaker 1
Not only is Danielle, a New York Times bestselling author but she's also a TV writer and writes for those soap operas you see on television. We get to talk about all things which are the wicked before our panelists see to it. So without any further ado, here's my conversation.
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Speaker 2
With Danielle Page well, welcome to Literary. Hi. This is so exciting to have you on. I've been a big fan of you for years. As we just saw, I'm going to.
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Speaker 3
Take a picture of that picture.
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Speaker 2
I've got a picture from back in 20, 18. The first time we met in person back when you were talking about the Dorothy Must Die series. Now, you've moved on to another fairy tale twists. Yes. So those who haven't seen Witch of the Wicked give us a little synopsis of what this book is about.
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Speaker 3
I always wondered, like, who the fairy godmother was because she is like the Alice for the most, I think the most popular, most famous fairy tale. And so I wonder where she came from and what her agency was and like, why does she show up? And I wanted to create an origin story for her so that actually it's been rattling around in my head for years.
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Speaker 3
And so I thought what if all the fairy tale characters came from the same sector, which is like all the villains and so the evil queen and will represent and like they're all part of the same group and then they get persecuted and they have to get revenge. And so the fairy godmother was part of the same sock, too.
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Speaker 3
And she takes a different path. She wants to stop her sisters and save the world. But first, she wants a little revenge to risk the revenge.
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Speaker 2
But also saving the world at the same time is an interesting balance to try to find. What was it like for you kind of crafting this storyline with both aspects?
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Speaker 3
I think I guess I'm always kind of going for saving the world. So the revenge part was just it's kind of like combining Dorothy and Amy together in one person.
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Speaker 2
You did. But we're hearing that this was a fairy godmother origin story. I was a little surprised at how early we find Cinderella coming into the mix. Talk a little bit about deciding the story arc and how you were going to piece together these classic stories into this.
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Speaker 3
Well, and this story is Cinderella is not the main character. And I thought, what if the fairy godmother into the role? I got to be friends. And I thought it'd be a great way to get to know her in a different way. And she's more of a scrappier than even than the normal Cinderella, in my opinion. And it was it was just fun to have that interaction for me.
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Speaker 2
So with this being a kind of a twist, a retelling of a story that we all know, how much research did you do into the lure of fairy godmother and other stories that she said?
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Speaker 3
Well, the weird thing is that there's not a lot in a fairy godmother. There's a lot of very godmother. I mean, aside from Olympus, which is a kind of a godmother story in general, like even I read every Cinderella story I could. And there's there's stories where Cinderella is just a flock of birds that who get revenge on the stepsister is there is stories where she's like just an old hag.
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Speaker 3
Like, they don't really there's not a lot there. So I got to make it up.
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Speaker 2
Which sounds away fun. Yes. What is it about retellings? They're such a big trend right now. What is it about retellings? That people love so much that has that you love to them, has you drawn into them and to write them?
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Speaker 3
I think I've always loved writing for existing characters. There's some there's an ease and that and these are the characters that we grew up with. My first job was in soap operas, so I wrote for characters that I loved, that I grew up with. And this is another way of doing that. And I think that that there's a I think that when I was little, I had all these questions about fairy tales, and I wanted to reshape them in ways that like, why did this happen or why what, you know, why not this?
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Speaker 3
And so I got to grow up and do that.
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Speaker 2
Some of the fairy godmother is family, some affairs, family are the fates. Yes. What made you decide to mix those in to this story?
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Speaker 3
Well, when I was looking at fairy godmother stories, there's a lot of idea, the idea of someone having knowing the future or knowing what is going to happen was kind of tight and there a little bit. So I thought, well, what if I use the fates as as the model? So and I and I was really fascinated by the idea of a kind of a female society and I having watched Game of Thrones, which I absolutely love.
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Speaker 3
But but I wanted to create a matriarchy. And I thought, why not the fates? Is that the head of that? And have the women run the world and so make huge, horrible, horrible, horrible mistakes but different mistakes than we see. And those and patriarchy is.
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Speaker 2
You have a line in there about like she's not like other girls and how it means different things coming from women versus men. And I love that line because it's so truly people try to weaponize women against each other. So I really loved that.
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Speaker 3
Thank you. But that wasn't purposeful.
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Speaker 2
Ferrell becomes part of this coterie, the society thing and has to go through all these surgeries to look like someone else comes. Talk about where that plot point came from and how you decided to work that through.
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Speaker 3
Well, since I had the idea about fate and the idea that maybe there are certain things that are portended, I wanted I wanted to add something creepy I wanted to add, you know, like if you can see the future and you saw that this person belong with this person, what if you just changed your face to look that like that person?
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Speaker 3
And I liked the idea of of having this back up.
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Speaker 2
So often when you hear a fairy godmother, you think of the old white lady in Cinderella and like the animated movies what was it like for you to re-imagine her as a young black woman?
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Speaker 3
This is the first time I've actually said what color our character is. And Dorothy, I think I just said that Amy had pink hair and I never really talked about it. And I never really I think the conversation and why was not the same that it is now. So I wrote pretty plainly and I come from a film TV background where you think see a cast, you don't necessarily, you know, write a character for a certain group.
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Speaker 3
So I thought it would be and I'm actually made it or suggested that she's like, What if we what if we make you're the fairy godmother, African-American? And I was like, oh, we'll be I haven't done that and like it, but let's let's do it. You know, I was it was actually just I and it was kind of time, you know, I've been writing books for ten years and this is the first time have like I have just written blindly before.
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Speaker 2
And ones are a big part of this story. If you were to whittle your own wine, what would you put on it?
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Speaker 3
Because I would put coming to New York. So New York City, Columbia is where I went to school. I got my first job at a soap opera. I would put I starting to write books to a book, Dorothy Shoes or something. Comic books, like something from that meeting ring for my fiancee maybe something is like something about my friends, something for my childhood, my family I love.
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Speaker 3
So it'd be pretty full on.
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Speaker 2
A full one for a full life.
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Speaker 3
Yes. What would be in your want?
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Speaker 2
Probably books. And I guess something for that guy over there. Run the camera my husband probably a Thor hammer because he dresses up as Thor sometimes.
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Speaker 3
I could see it. Yeah.
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Speaker 2
He's he makes a good Thor. He's if he's like, what just happened then are suddenly looking at me and I don't know what's going on. That's great. The TV, that's my background. Like journalism, maybe an Emmy or two all the shenanigans.
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Speaker 3
We talked about. You and TV.
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Speaker 2
Yeah, I've been a wasn't news for 11 years, and now I'm out of news but still doing TV during the daytime and producing and then working bookstores of late. I love that. But since you touched on your soap opera and your TV writing experience and like you just went through the writers strike.
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Speaker 3
Yes.
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Speaker 2
So what was it like for you to do? You still have the book career, but you're on strike for your TV career. What was that like for you?
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Speaker 3
Well, my fiancee is we used to be the Writers Guild president, and so we're we're very strong union. So it was I mean, I think both strikes are such a cool I mean, it's you get to see everybody. There's like there's there's kind of a camaraderie and a sense of coming together and you're you want things to be better for the industry.
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Speaker 3
So it's like this weird party of like getting to see everyone, you know, but also everyone's out of work, but also you're fighting for something that matters. So I feel closer to your union. You feel closer to other writers. It's I think it's so important. I think we got a lot of things that we wanted and some things we still haven't gotten and there's like this threat of a I there's like there's so much going on, but at least I feel like we're trying to make things better.
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Speaker 2
And air has become kind of a threat in the book world, too, from everything from works being fed to air to teach it to how to write a book and arts. What do you see as like the future for books with AI right now?
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Speaker 3
I think that in some ways books have more protection because you own your own. You own the IP, you're not selling the IP, but like you might optioned the IP to a studio or something. But it's yours in a way. That TV and film is not because you're selling the product in a way in a different way. So I think that books have a little bit more protection and and but I'm scared for both things, honestly.
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Speaker 3
But I think that readers are so smart that they're never going to want to read the iBook. They're going to want to read the real book.
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Speaker 2
Art needs soul.
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Speaker 3
Yes.
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Speaker 2
So what should the Wicked is the first in a series what can you tell us about book two and where you are with the process of that?
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Speaker 3
It's done. And the cover just got released a couple of weeks ago, and it's very pretty it's told from two points of view from Pharaoh, who's our fairy godmother, and Bari, who is her ex best friend and and the the cabin. And basically and you get to see both of their journeys as they're still kind of fighting for what they want.
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Speaker 3
And Pharaoh really, really wants to save Bari from this world and make her better. And she wants all her sisters to make it to make this choice. And Bari really wants Pharaoh to make her choice and join the side of revenge. So it's kind of a tale of sisterhood, but also more revenge.
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Speaker 2
And social media. You do a lot of giveaways. What is it about the books community that makes you want to give them books all the time? Well, I always.
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Speaker 3
Like I call my my book friends, and I'm like, can you you want to give away a book because I'm getting a boy book? And then and I think it's a great way to promote other writers. Like, I really I feel like I've been so lucky to have so much support from from like from a second I got into this community that I think it's a good way to kind of just kids like free books, read grown ups, like free books, I feel like.
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Speaker 3
So I do one every year. I try to do one every week. I have this amazing assistant, Emily Williams, and she, like, makes a pretty graphic for me every week. And I honestly like if I if I if I'm doing an event with somebody or if I'm talking to someone, like, do you want to do a giveaway? Like, tell me if you will promise to mail this book.
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Speaker 3
I own my own one of my books and I just keep doing it.
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Speaker 2
We love it. We love free Bugsy. You say free book. I run literally. I will run for a free book.
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Speaker 3
So please follow me. Instagram.
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Speaker 2
The link will be in the description or show notes, depending on if you're watching this or listening to it. Is there anything else I want to talk about?
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Speaker 3
I'm also working on another DC Comics project, but I can't announce it yet, but I'm very excited.
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Speaker 2
I do have Mira.
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Speaker 3
I loved Mira. I was so much fun writing. I was like the first one out of those books and I. I love that.
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Speaker 2
I may have lost my mind in that press conference at BookCon. I was like, There are so many great authors.
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Speaker 3
Who are already my nerd stuff. I just love it. That was such a crazy thing. I'm Michelle Boyle's shout out to her. She was like, She organized everything. She's so great. And generally it was amazing.
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Speaker 2
So well, since this is literary hype, the last question we always ask is, what books are you hyped about right now?
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Speaker 3
What books are my hyped about right now? I am reading to a Darker Shore by Leon Schwartz. Very excited about that one. It's had a fairy tale ish with autistic characters, and it's wonderful we also well, thank you.
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Speaker 2
So much for taking time to talk to.
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Speaker 3
Literary guys.
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Speaker 1
Thank you thanks to Danielle for taking time out of her C2e2 schedule to talk about Witch of the Wicked and Spell of the Sinister. Coming soon, if you'd like to get your hands on Witch of the Wicked or Spell of the Sinister, the links to do so are in the show notes for you. If you enjoyed this conversation, don't forget to subscribe to the literary hype podcast.
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Speaker 1
Give us some stars and share this with your friends. Thanks for listening to the Literary Hype podcast.
