Dialing In On Unwritten Phone Etiquette Rules

In a world where we’re overloaded with texts, anxiety-ridden about phone calls, and fatigued by video chats, there is a whole new book of rules when it comes to phone etiquette in 2024. 

Should you text before calling? Are voicemails still a thing? ... and what's the deal voice memos? This episode deep dives on all of those questions and more!

00:00
Introduction and Feedback

00:31 
Feedback on the podcast launch

02:23
Texting vs. Calling vs. Face time

07:04
Should we leave voicemails?

09: 40 
Is it ever ok to randomly Facetime someone?

12:09 
Facetime in public- is this ever ok?

09:26
Texting versus Calling

14:45
Is punctuation passive aggressive when sending texts?

17:00 
Are emojis a form of expression or cringe?

19:55
Decoding teen text-slang

27:02
The Pros and Cons of Voice Memos

33:07
The Pressure of Read Receipts

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Transcript

Lance Pendleton (00:01.245)
Welcome back to the Unmastered Class. I'm Lance Pendleton. And for today's hot take, we are joined by the amazing Erin O 'Keefe. And hi, Erin, how you doing?

Erin (00:01.902)
Hey guys, good to be here again.

Jake Dreyfuss (00:05.129)
And I'm Jake Dreyfus.

Lance Pendleton (00:14.717)
Good to see you. So today we're going to dive into the chaotic world of phone etiquette in 2024. But before we do, we just wanted to thank everyone for the incredible feedback on our launch. We've loved chatting with everybody in the live stream and on social. And we got a couple of interesting things I just want to touch on briefly as some early feedback for a couple of different things. And I was at a speaking engagement outside of Philadelphia and a bunch of people came up to me and they're like, oh, we love the podcast. It was so cool. I didn't realize that you were so weird.

Jake Dreyfuss (00:15.081)
Have a good night.

Jake Dreyfuss (00:43.913)
Yeah.

Lance Pendleton (00:43.997)
And I was like, wait, what? Like, that was not the reaction I was going for on that, but I guess that's true. Jake, have you heard anything?

Jake Dreyfuss (00:46.537)
Yeah.

Jake Dreyfuss (00:51.049)
Yeah, same. I got an awesome note from Valerie Dan. I love Valerie. Shout out. Just saying how much she enjoyed the banter. And I appreciate that because I love our banter too, Lance and Erin. This is so much fun. And you put yourself out there and you're never quite sure how it's going to sound or what people are going to think. So it's awesome to get the feedback. We appreciate it.

Lance Pendleton (01:11.037)
There were two other things that came in one on Instagram Margot Wallin said that she had a storage freezer just for her jeans and sweaters

Jake Dreyfuss (01:18.345)
That's aggressive. And I wonder too, does she have a second freezer for popsicles and extra meat that she buys? I imagine two freezers in her garage, one that's like, oh, no, that's the clothes freezer. Put it in the food freezer.

Lance Pendleton (01:21.597)
Yeah.

Lance Pendleton (01:29.181)
Or the deer carcass or like what?

Erin (01:39.342)
do you think you wait to take the jeans out of the freezer and then put them on? Because I feel like that could be the new cold plunge.

Lance Pendleton (01:46.941)
That's a good point. Like, and also if the power goes out, do you have to throw the sweaters and jeans away? According to our food, right? According to our food episode, that might be a thing. The other one that I just have to comment on briefly because I was wildly offended was the Megan and Katie group at Compass said that socks in bed aren't sexy. And I am offended by that because I think I am a dashing, handsome young man. And how dare you judge me for my choice of?

Jake Dreyfuss (01:47.017)
oooo

Jake Dreyfuss (01:51.561)
Yes, immediately. Yes, they're gone.

Jake Dreyfuss (02:09.481)
Yeah.

Lance Pendleton (02:16.189)
keeping my feet, toes warm.

Jake Dreyfuss (02:18.281)
Well, you're the exception because that's all you're wearing, are the socks. That's the difference. That's the difference. Yeah.

Lance Pendleton (02:20.861)
Oh, if only you knew. No. Yeah, no, I'm usually wearing like a whole parka. It's a thing. But anyway, moving into it, let's start the show. I want to, you know, dive in really, really quickly and we're going to start talking about the first topic. And so this this is a this is going to bring up some stuff. So.

Erin (02:21.742)
You'll have to book your skims campaign to prove them wrong.

Jake Dreyfuss (02:27.945)
100 % 100 %

Lance Pendleton (02:45.565)
We talk about etiquette in 2024 and phone etiquette in 2024. Nothing gets me more fired up than the first concept between texting versus calling versus FaceTime. So if we start unpacking this, let's really focus on the texting versus calling first. In a world where we're all glued to the smartphones, when do you tap out a message and when do we hit the dial button?

Erin (02:46.318)
. .

Jake Dreyfuss (03:11.113)
Erin, you wanna take a swing? Yeah, yeah. Well, let's give some context then. So you wanna deliver bad news. Text, call, what do you you you you you you do, Erin

Erin (03:11.214)
I think it's all contextual.

Erin (03:24.334)
Well, I feel like it depends on, is it a work relationship? Is it friend, close friend, family, acquaintance? And I think if it's a close friend or it's family, I would just call. Or I guess it depends on how close you are with your family. And if you have their location and know they're at work or like in the middle of something, maybe. So I think it's good to text and say like, hey, could I give you a ring?

Jake Dreyfuss (03:46.345)
Yeah, okay, yeah, that matters. Yep, yep.

Erin (03:52.91)
or I guess something more formal if it's more serious.

Jake Dreyfuss (03:53.129)
Right, the, oh, the old text to see if I can, oh, the old text to see if I can call. That's a whole other category we just stumbled into. Well, let's give it some context, right? Cause the USA Today published an article entitled, Don't Call First. So you can kind of see where the article is going. They basically say that what works for close friends and family is not the same for business nor professional relationships. So Erin, you're right. Context matters. And also age can play a role in what is socially acceptable, which is yet a whole other layer that I feel like I didn't have to consider growing up in the eighties was like,

Lance Pendleton (03:58.621)
Oh. Mm.

Jake Dreyfuss (04:21.673)
is this socially acceptable to call someone, right? There was, it was, I'm just gonna call somebody. So it says, it's okay to call first if you're reaching out to friends or family, or if it's an emergency. Now raise your hand, audience two, when you get a call from like, you know, a family member and it's a weird time of day, does your brain just like me go to, oh my God, it's an emergency, something's wrong. Does anyone else do that? Do you assume it's, no? No? No.

Erin (04:38.048)
you

Lance Pendleton (04:44.061)
I mean, 100 % first of all, just remember who you're talking to. Like everything to me equals like someone's dead, dead. I mean, I, like, I don't even go into nature because everything in nature is trying to kill me at all times. Like I just, I'm always going to go to the worst case scenario. So yes.

Erin (04:46.222)
Bye.

Jake Dreyfuss (04:50.953)
Right. Okay.

Right.

Erin, you're nodding. You're saying no, I'm seeing.

Erin (05:00.494)
No, I think maybe it's an age thing or just a me personal thing. I'm like, I'll call them later. They just don't know that I'm busy. Like, I feel like it's like grandparents usually and I'm like, oh, God.

Jake Dreyfuss (05:10.217)
Wow. Wow. No, Erin. No, no, your heart should stop and you should imagine the worst case scenario just happened and they're calling you from the hospital. Like that's... No.

Lance Pendleton (05:16.861)
Yeah.

Lance Pendleton (05:21.629)
Erin, that's.

Erin (05:22.062)
No, mine's more of an eye roll.

Lance Pendleton (05:25.149)
but how is the Xanax industry supposed to stay afloat if you don't have that reaction? Oh man. Well, Jake, so here's one thing for you though, because the thing that I get confused by, part of the article was mentioning too that you don't have to pick up if someone calls you and it's not a good time. What about that one?

Jake Dreyfuss (05:28.201)
That's right. That's right.

Erin (05:31.63)
That's a good question.

Jake Dreyfuss (05:32.777)
check.

Jake Dreyfuss (05:43.913)
I'm a hundred percent camp. I agree with that. I don't pick up. I do have the pre -written text message that says, Hey, I'm on a call. Can I give you, can I give you a ring back soon? I have that key, you know, queued up. Um, yeah. Cause like, you know, we, I remember when call waiting was like the big invention of our childhood, Erin probably has no idea what I'm even talking about. Lance. Right. And so, Oh, hold on. I got another call. Like that doesn't, you know, so I'm not going to interrupt the meeting. Um, yeah, generally like, unless I know I'm expecting the call and it's about something very quick, it'll be a.

Lance Pendleton (05:53.309)
Mm -hmm.

Jake Dreyfuss (06:13.769)
You'll get a text, even before you've left the voicemail, like, I'll call you back.

Erin (06:15.79)
I do know what call waiting is. I do. It brings another question to mind for me that I feel like is a little bit before my time, but it's referenced in television and movies and that's screening calls. And I feel like I do the modern day version of screening my calls, which is like, I don't pick up. You can text me or leave a voicemail and tell me what you need. And then I'll decide whether or not that warrants a call back.

Lance Pendleton (06:17.661)
And I'm super curious, Erin, do you know what call waiting is?

Erin (06:46.702)
But so with screening calls like a thing of the 90s.

Lance Pendleton (06:46.717)
Hmm.

Jake Dreyfuss (06:50.889)
Well, you're just opening up a can of worms. We also had, what was it, caller ID that showed up as part of like mind blowing technology where all of a sudden we could see who it was. And then when we didn't want to answer, we'd wait for the answering machine to pick up another buzzword for our 80s guests. And then we'd sit next to it waiting to hear the message while they were leaving. And if it was great, we'd pick up the phone. Hey, hey, hey, I'm here, I'm here. That was how it went.

Lance Pendleton (06:55.421)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.

Lance Pendleton (07:12.669)
And not to mention that you had to hope that you didn't run out of tape on the answering machine where you had to flip it over because then you didn't get messages anymore because there was no more tape left on the machine. So, yeah, so screening calls was a thing. There was a whole process involved in all of that. But what I wanna ask next is part of the article, which again, this is a fascinating one for me. When is the right time to leave a voicemail? Well, the article said people in their 20s and 30s say never, and I will tell you right now.

Erin (07:13.582)
Oh.

Jake Dreyfuss (07:18.281)
Ah, the real tape. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Mm.

Jake Dreyfuss (07:34.857)
Great, article.

Lance Pendleton (07:42.045)
I am 48 years old. And maybe it's because, you know, I always think chronologically I'm 48 emotionally. I'm like, I'm 14, but maybe I fit into my twenties and thirties on a good day because please don't ever leave me a voicemail. There is no need to leave me a voicemail. I saw you called. I will call you back. And even more so, not only that, like most of the time, what frustrates me and I can, this is probably more like my parents, like my parents love leaving voicemails. They leave these like six and a half minute long voicemails. And then I call them.

Jake Dreyfuss (08:07.625)
Yeah. Yeah.

Lance Pendleton (08:11.613)
And they're like, oh, did you listen to my voicemail? And I'm like, no. And they're like, why? And I said, because you're about to just tell me anyway the exact same thing you just left me on the voicemail. Whether I want you to or not, you're just going to repeat the whole story again. So yeah, is that a thing?

Erin (08:11.982)
I think it's another context thing, because I'm 30 and I like a voicemail, but I feel like you bring up a good point. Like I don't get like a six minute voicemail.

Jake Dreyfuss (08:23.561)
100%. Yep. Yep.

Erin (08:39.438)
And I probably wouldn't listen to like a voicemail from my Oma, God bless her, I love her, but I would just pick up the phone and call her back. So I wouldn't listen to her voicemail, but like in a business setting, if you called and you didn't text me saying what you needed, like I would listen to the voicemail to know what you were calling in regards to, to mentally prepare to call you back and for what we're gonna be discussing. It like takes away the anxiety of the unknown.

Lance Pendleton (08:48.637)
By the way, we just crushed Omar.

Jake Dreyfuss (09:08.009)
Fair enough.

Erin (09:09.134)
which I think is what freaks 20 and 30 year olds, or I guess 22, 30 year olds out about phone calls is that you don't know what's going to be said to you. You feel like you have to respond immediately because it's a conversation. You don't have the time to think and then text or reply.

Jake Dreyfuss (09:26.665)
This is fascinating. Side note, new feature, Apple, allow me to adjust the playback speed of my voicemails.

Lance Pendleton (09:27.741)
Yeah.

Erin (09:34.958)
Yeah, that would be great.

Lance Pendleton (09:35.357)
Ooh. Yeah.

Jake Dreyfuss (09:36.201)
Right, right. Here's the thing, I will leave, so I don't leave a voicemail the first time I call. So if I really wanted to talk to Lance, for example, I'd call him, he didn't pick up. I would not leave a voicemail. I might text depending on what it was. If I do though really wanna talk to him, the second time I call back, I will leave a message.

Lance Pendleton (09:55.645)
interesting but

Jake Dreyfuss (09:56.649)
Yep. It's my tactic. Cause I'm like, all right. Cause then I know, well, I know Lance, but the second time I call him, he's gonna be like, something's wrong and he's probably going to pick up. Right. A little bit of a little bit of a hack.

Erin (09:56.75)
That is interesting.

Lance Pendleton (10:06.429)
Yeah, I'll give you a bad etiquette part on mine. And this is because I know people have do not disturb. So I also know that if you call back a second time in under two minutes, it'll push it through even though they're on do not disturb, which I know is terrible. But a lot of the people that I work with, they put it on do not disturb and they forget that they had it on do not disturb. And I'm like, we have an appointment right now, like a literal meeting right now. And so I know it's not the best thing to do. But you know, I slide that one in there from time to time.

Jake Dreyfuss (10:32.745)
Well, let's take this a step further. Is it okay to randomly FaceTime someone? Reddit says, by the way, and Reddit knows, it's the, well, a user on Reddit said, it is the same as walking into someone else's home uninvited. Discuss.

Erin (10:54.35)
I think FaceTime is reserved for, unannounced FaceTimes are reserved for the closest friends. Or my sister, because with the caveat that she had a baby eight months ago, so I want to see the baby. But like, if it's not my two closest friends, and there's only two, and I have several best friends, but only two can do an unannounced FaceTime that I would answer.

Lance Pendleton (10:54.365)
I'm a let Erin.

Erin (11:24.558)
Unless...

I'm already ready for the day. If I have my hair and my makeup and my clothes on, then I would answer a random FaceTime.

Jake Dreyfuss (11:40.201)
Interesting.

Lance Pendleton (11:40.445)
There's a lot of caveats to that by the way. My God.

Erin (11:42.83)
Everything I say is contextual. I don't have a black and white answer for anything.

Jake Dreyfuss (11:43.177)
Yeah. I, I, I will not, well, yes, you're right. If chances are from getting unannounced FaceTime, it's from like, it probably has children involved. It's probably from someone I know that wants to show something their kids doing. So yes, it's probably going to be like a safe pickup. But another example, like last night, my good friend, Amanda Churchwell loves going out, doing her thing. And she'll give me a little FaceTime when she's out. Cause we, we have that kind of connection. And, um, but I was like making dinner for the kids. Like that can't happen. Can't pick that up now. Right. Um,

So generally the answer is no, not picking it up unless it's close friends and family. And I would not do it to someone else. In fact, I don't know if I ever have, unless it was like, hey, look who I bumped into from high school that we haven't seen in a thousand years or something like that. Some random, but not for like every day. I see people walking through the supermarket shopping. Like they're not even holding the phone up. It's just like staring at the ceiling. I'm like, why? Just the phone is the same thing. Why not the phone? What am I missing?

Erin (12:24.462)
Right. That's a common one.

Lance Pendleton (12:37.693)
So I'm so glad you said that because I've been sitting here rocking back and forth for those of you that can't physically see me because this is one of my biggest pet peeves in life. And this is where I turn into Larry David because I can't handle this aspect of society. I don't know when it happened. I don't know what prompted it. I don't know when it became okay. But the fact that people will just get on FaceTime in public and just yammer on.

I have no idea when this became some type of acceptable behavior in in practice. I was on a flight. I was on a flight literally on a flight the other day. A couple of months ago, actually, I was on a flight. And the person sitting in the aisle across from me decided that as we are taxiing down the runway about to take off that she's going to FaceTime people on the flight.

Erin (13:03.982)
It didn't and it's not.

Lance Pendleton (13:26.461)
and literally started into I told Melvin that he needed to buy bigger pants because the pants that he bought didn't fit really good. And I was unsure because he returns them all the time. And I was like, what are you doing? First of all, I don't care about Melvin's problems of his pants being too tight. And congratulations if Melvin's your husband. Second of all, why are you doing this? Well, they just told you to turn all this off. It doesn't matter where we are anymore.

Erin (13:30.926)
Okay.

Lance Pendleton (13:51.997)
It doesn't matter to your point Jake in the supermarket walking down the aisle. I don't want to hear your conversation. I don't care who you're talking to. To me this should be like one of the markers as to whether or not you can actually procreate. I'm serious like whether you're qualified to have children should be whether or not that you think that's an acceptable practice in the world. So it blows my mind regularly that people do this and I just want to slap the phone out of their hands and run.

Erin (13:59.342)
Yeah, no.

Jake Dreyfuss (14:16.649)
Well, it's like, it's like the, it's the evolution of the, the public speakerphone guy. Now I'm going to, I'm just going to add video to it. That's going to make it better. Like, no unnecessary. Not even looking. Not even looking. And like, and like frankly, the practical side of it is like, you're wasting your battery. Just call them. You know, that's, that's dumb, but it's true. It's really what I'm thinking. Like this is, this is what a waste of battery.

Lance Pendleton (14:25.693)
And, but your point too, they're not even looking at it. It's like pointed at the ceiling or it's like, the floor. I'm like, what are you doing?

Lance Pendleton (14:36.061)
Oh, man, we can move on before I actually have like a small coronary. But yeah, no, that's one of my biggest ones. So no, I don't do a lot on the FaceTime unless there's something really super exciting that I want somebody to see. And even then, I'm kind of like, just awesome. Yeah.

Erin (14:43.662)
Now I agree, no speakerphone, no video calls in public. And it brings to mind that we should have a whole episode on plane etiquette, because I have a really great story that involves FaceTime on a plane as well, but it's too long to share right now.

Jake Dreyfuss (14:44.649)
Okay, all right, fine.

Jake Dreyfuss (14:53.481)
You spend all day on it. You spend all day video styling my video. Anyway, go on, go ahead.

Lance Pendleton (15:02.525)
So the other thing that came.

Jake Dreyfuss (15:07.945)
Oh yes, yes. Let's do it.

Lance Pendleton (15:11.453)
And I would love to hear from our audience too, if you want us to do a whole thing on plain etiquette and things that we should have learned when we were younger and stuff like that, because I would love to have that conversation. Cause Jake, you and I also travel a lot for talks and conferences and work and stuff like that. And I'm, I guarantee you there would be hours of stories of things that as Erin just said, that we could go off on. But so, um, one thing that came up also to though, in the, in regards to texting is punctuation in a text message, judgey.

Jake Dreyfuss (15:17.609)
Yes.

Jake Dreyfuss (15:30.761)
Oh yeah, oh yes, oh yes.

Lance Pendleton (15:40.445)
like ending things with a period versus not like, should we be using proper punctuation or

Jake Dreyfuss (15:47.401)
Yeah, yes, but you don't have to end the text with a period. Like, don't give me one run on paragraph without a period in between. But you don't have to put a period at the end. Maybe that's talking about both sides of my mouth, but yeah, yeah.

Erin (16:01.134)
No, I totally agree. You use punctuation throughout, but then for the last sentence, you don't put a period there. That's mean.

Jake Dreyfuss (16:04.809)
Yep. Yeah. Right. And do emojis count as punctuation? And what's our position there? Like, I'm not an emoji guy. I don't use emojis.

Erin (16:15.246)
Yeah, I would say if anything you could replace the period with an emoji, but you don't have to. But don't put the period.

Jake Dreyfuss (16:20.297)
Yep. Right, right, right.

Lance Pendleton (16:22.301)
Well, I now know we need that with you though, because everything's contextual with you. So I have no idea how you're feeling or what you're thinking. If you don't give me an emoji in there, I'll give you the one that for me that texting becomes frustrating. I can't stand it when someone doesn't give me a complete thought. What do I mean? When I'm sitting there and my phone goes bloop, bloop, bloop.

Jake Dreyfuss (16:28.105)
and that's the end.

Jake Dreyfuss (16:47.401)
They're giving you a complete thought. It's just multiple messages to be clear. Yeah.

Lance Pendleton (16:50.813)
It's one sentence and one sentence and one sentence. Just stop. Take a moment. Take a breath. The sun is warm. The grass is green. We're in a safe, happy place. Come up with a complete thought. Write it out and I will respond. But it's just one sentence, sentence, sentence, sentence. I'm like, oh my. Oh, it's abuse. It is abuse. I'm sorry. That is should be a feature in Guantanamo for a torture thing. Like, no.

Erin (16:56.238)
It's stream of consciousness texting.

Jake Dreyfuss (17:20.521)
Well.

Lance Pendleton (17:21.085)
That doesn't bother either of you.

Jake Dreyfuss (17:23.401)
No it does. It does.

Erin (17:23.854)
It depends. Everything depends.

Lance Pendleton (17:26.077)
Here it is.

Jake Dreyfuss (17:27.849)
Yeah. Commit Erin. No, it bothered me. Like just take a breath. Like I'm cool with like two to three in a row, but if we're like a total screen scroll, like 10 or 11, like too many, too many, like, which that could have been a voice note, which we'll get into. That's a whole nother part of this we'll get into in a moment. Speaking of texts and emojis, it's not just about that anymore. What are the most used ones on your phone? Are you like the hands praying?

Lance Pendleton (17:29.277)
That bothers you though, Jay.

Erin (17:43.63)
I'm gonna work.

Jake Dreyfuss (17:57.673)
People, I'm just like a smiley face or a thumbs up guy. That's all I'm doing. That's it. You can look. You can see, you can take your phone out, you can look.

Lance Pendleton (18:01.853)
Yeah, there's like three. Yeah, usually it's like the crying thing, the smiling thing and a poop emoji. Beyond that, I don't, my repertoire, yeah, it's not very big.

Jake Dreyfuss (18:09.481)
Yeah, that's about it, right? Okay. Okay. Well.

Erin (18:11.63)
I have the little three yellow like sparkle diamonds. You know those?

Jake Dreyfuss (18:18.121)
Oh, I know what that is. No. Okay.

Lance Pendleton (18:18.237)
Oh. No, I have no idea.

Erin (18:21.838)
um the knife the knife um and it's it's at an angle so it looks like you're going like that

Jake Dreyfuss (18:25.033)
The knife? Wow.

Lance Pendleton (18:31.581)
Mm. Mm -hmm.

Jake Dreyfuss (18:31.785)
Oh, interesting.

Erin (18:34.574)
and thumbs up.

Jake Dreyfuss (18:35.881)
When do you use a sparkle diamond? What would be the context? I've never gotten one. What would you? That's a good thing, the sparkle diamond.

Erin (18:38.222)
all the time.

Lance Pendleton (18:40.445)
Yeah, I'm a little disappointed.

Erin (18:43.182)
It's multifaceted. There are a range of times you could use it.

Lance Pendleton (18:48.413)
I mean, Erin and I work together, so I get the knife frequently, but I don't, the sparkle diamond I haven't gotten in a while.

Erin (18:51.406)
I will say I think the crying laughing emoji is a hot topic. I think younger people think it's really cringy and it makes them uncomfortable. But I think older people tend to use it a lot. And I feel like I never used it and recently I've started using it more and I don't know if it's because I turned 30 or it's because I'm regularly communicating.

Jake Dreyfuss (18:51.56)
Yeah.

Lance Pendleton (19:00.797)
Hmm.

Ooh.

Jake Dreyfuss (19:10.857)
I gotta tell you.

Erin (19:21.166)
with people that are older than me that are using it.

Jake Dreyfuss (19:23.817)
Well, as someone who's older than you, I can't even see the tears on that emoji. Like, my eyes aren't good enough to even see what, I can't tell the difference between the smile emoji and like, are you crying, laughing? I don't care. I'm assuming you're happy. I can't even see it. They're so small. How are you supposed to see that? I don't know. I don't know.

Erin (19:38.542)
Oh my gosh. Do you have the large text on your phone? Maybe you should.

Jake Dreyfuss (19:43.817)
No, I don't. I don't. But it's coming. It's probably coming.

Lance Pendleton (19:45.341)
I do not only do I have it, my, my teen children take every opportunity to laugh at me because they're like, dude, I can read all of your text messages from three rooms away. And I'm like, yeah. And I'll talk about you to your face. I'm talking about you on here too. No, no, no, no, no, I don't have that. No. The book. Yeah. With the, with the cards inside and everything. Yeah.

Jake Dreyfuss (19:56.969)
Yeah. Oh my God.

Erin (19:58.478)
Do you also have the case that closes over it? You know what I'm talking about?

Jake Dreyfuss (20:01.705)
Oh, do you have the wallet case? Oh yeah. With the, with the, um, with the wrist strap.

Erin (20:05.198)
That's a total mom move, I think. Yes, with the wrist strap.

Jake Dreyfuss (20:11.145)
So we're now edging and entering the territory of like this, clearly we don't understand emojis, but Lance, you want to talk about the article from parenting .com that we found about new language here for teens?

Lance Pendleton (20:24.445)
Um, yeah, let me just scroll down to the, I won't, I won't. Oh, okay. So here's the thing. There's a whole new language out there with the coordinate parenting .com regarding, uh, the use of emojis and what they mean. But Jake and I don't know what any of these things mean. So Erin, would you like to play a little game so that everyone listening can try this and we can maybe get enlightened.

Jake Dreyfuss (20:26.569)
But remember, don't open it. This...

Erin (20:49.806)
Yeah, so I don't think... is there emojis too or are we just doing words? Okay, yeah, definitely words. So I will share some hot slang and you guys are gonna guess what you think these terms mean.

Lance Pendleton (20:54.557)
the words, I think.

Jake Dreyfuss (20:55.561)
the words, I think. Yeah, because we're getting away from emojis, yeah, apparently.

Jake Dreyfuss (21:08.233)
How hard could this be? How hard could this be?

Lance Pendleton (21:10.397)
Well, these are this is slang that's used by like teenagers just to. Or like cool people. Oh, teens.

Erin (21:10.862)
So I'm gonna.

Jake Dreyfuss (21:13.833)
Mm -hmm. Yep, teen slang.

Erin (21:16.59)
Yeah, I would say teens, maybe like 20s. It depends. I'll go with some of the... Should I start off hard or easy?

Jake Dreyfuss (21:26.889)
Give it to us. We got this. We got this.

Lance Pendleton (21:27.005)
Just do it. Yeah, because I'm not going to get any of this.

Erin (21:31.502)
Okay, we'll start with, I feel like this was like not a word of the year, but something in that vein. Riz.

Jake Dreyfuss (21:40.521)
Spelled, please.

Lance Pendleton (21:41.341)
When she entered into the spelling bee, could you use it in a sentence?

Erin (21:41.902)
R -I -Z -Z.

Jake Dreyfuss (21:45.321)
Can you use it in a sentence please? No, that would be cheating. No, Riz. Jeez, I have no idea. I feel like it's a good thing. Riz. I don't know, I got an idea. Sure.

Lance Pendleton (21:59.741)
Hmm. Yeah.

Erin (22:00.046)
Do you want me to use it in a sentence?

He's got Riz.

Lance Pendleton (22:05.629)
That did nothing for me. That did absolutely nothing.

Jake Dreyfuss (22:06.249)
He's got the style. He's got the je ne sais quoi. He's got something. He's got the Riz.

Erin (22:11.854)
Yeah. Well, I should have probably picked a person that Ryan Gosling has Riz.

Lance Pendleton (22:12.989)
Moxie. Not cringy.

Lance Pendleton (22:19.517)
um thousands of women that want him?

Jake Dreyfuss (22:20.521)
Abs, six pack abs. No, same as.

Erin (22:24.334)
A hint is it's a part of a bigger word that isn't frequently used.

Lance Pendleton (22:33.341)
Oh, that really narrowed it down. I got no clue. I'm lost. What does it mean?

Jake Dreyfuss (22:33.641)
We're not doing so well here. No idea. Give it to, what does it mean?

Erin (22:38.158)
It's short for charisma. So someone who's charming or has game. So you're right. It's a good thing.

Lance Pendleton (22:40.797)
Oh god.

Jake Dreyfuss (22:42.025)
Yeah, okay, all right, that's close. Okay, all right, give us one more. Clearly this is not gonna go well.

Lance Pendleton (22:49.341)
It could be more than one more, but.

Erin (22:51.63)
Um, we'll go with... Do you guys know what Yassify means?

Lance Pendleton (22:57.149)
Something with Kanye West.

Erin (23:00.43)
No, yass. Like y -a -s -s -i -s -y.

Jake Dreyfuss (23:02.185)
Yeah

Lance Pendleton (23:02.429)
Is it?

Oh, that's right.

Um, it's when you are saying yes to someone in order to pacify them. Yassify. No, damn, that was a good one. Yeah. What's the origin?

Jake Dreyfuss (23:08.521)
No clue.

Jake Dreyfuss (23:12.841)
Oh, is that right? No, can you use it in a sentence please?

Erin (23:13.806)
No, no. There are a popular series of memes with public figures yassified, such as Joe Biden.

Lance Pendleton (23:34.589)
What's a meme?

Jake Dreyfuss (23:34.761)
like made fun of, or like poked fun at.

Erin (23:38.798)
So it's a dramatic makeover or to apply several beauty filters to a picture until the person is totally unrecognizable. So like a Yassified Joe Biden would be with like a filter to make him look like he has a lot of really intense plastic surgery and like a crazy outfit. So it comes from like, I guess like Yassqueen, like, so you're like Yassifying something, making it.

Jake Dreyfuss (24:02.985)
Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.

Lance Pendleton (24:06.717)
So I want one more of these before we move on, because this is both really actually quite interesting and making me feel super old. But Erin, do you know what these mean? Like before you saw these, did you know if someone said Yassified, you'd know what this is? Oh my god, this is terrifying, Jake.

Erin (24:08.27)
Fabulous.

Jake Dreyfuss (24:14.025)
Mm -hmm.

Erin (24:20.398)
Yeah.

Jake Dreyfuss (24:21.288)
Oh my gosh. Whoever's worried about the future of the planet really shouldn't be. I mean, this is just, this makes sense.

Lance Pendleton (24:25.245)
Oh, no. And by the way, completely to just be clear, like if you ever want to understand why ISIS wants to kill us all, like this is why. Like this is it. Like this is the end of days for all of us because this is everything that's wrong with us. But go ahead. Sorry, give us another one.

Jake Dreyfuss (24:38.633)
One more.

Erin (24:39.662)
Okay, um, your last one is chuggy.

Lance Pendleton (24:44.861)
Oh, I know this. I won't say it, I know this.

Jake Dreyfuss (24:45.033)
spell please. Wait, wait, give me a chance. Do you spell it please?

Erin (24:47.918)
It's spelled C -H -E -U -G -Y.

Lance Pendleton (24:52.221)
And Jake, the only reason I know this is because my teens tell me this.

Jake Dreyfuss (24:57.513)
Your dork, does that mean your dork or bad parent?

Lance Pendleton (24:59.293)
you're getting warm. No, really? Damn, dude. What would ever make you think that simply because I use an e -collar on them like the dog that doesn't make me a bad parent. Smart.

Erin (25:02.19)
Oh, no.

Jake Dreyfuss (25:03.177)
I'm just spitballing here. No, that's not it? Okay. I don't know. What were you, I don't know.

Erin (25:13.102)
Hehehehe

Jake Dreyfuss (25:17.961)
I got nothing.

Erin (25:20.75)
So it's something that is out of date or a person who is trying too hard.

Lance Pendleton (25:26.333)
That would be me because I use terminology that's not cool anymore around them and they're like, that's so chuggy. And I'm like, wait, what? Did you just call me fat? Like what happened?

Jake Dreyfuss (25:29.289)
Uhhhh

Jake Dreyfuss (25:33.449)
Where is that? What's the origin of that? How does that make sense? Okay.

Erin (25:36.846)
I don't know what it comes from, what the root word is.

Lance Pendleton (25:40.157)
Okay, so Jake, here comes the cool part. So at this point in the program, we're now going to reverse it and we're going to ask Erin terminology from the 80s. And she has to then say, tell us what it means. All right, Erin, you ready? Gag me with a spoon.

Erin (25:49.262)
guys.

Jake Dreyfuss (25:52.009)
when.

Erin (25:52.814)
I'm ready.

Jake Dreyfuss (25:56.585)
You're so dark.

Erin (25:57.678)
Like, I feel like that's not from the 80s, it's later. Like, gag me, like, ugh, gross.

Lance Pendleton (26:05.501)
No, that's a true eighties term. And it means like, yes, it means that that's like, I'm actually like having reflected. Yeah. Yeah. It was the early forms of eye roll. Jake, what were your favorite eighties terms?

Erin (26:11.726)
Like, eye roll.

Jake Dreyfuss (26:16.169)
How about tubular?

Erin (26:20.526)
rad bitchin like in the same vein as those like totally tubular like probably southern california origins

Jake Dreyfuss (26:21.961)
Oh, okay. Yeah, totally. Totally. Totally.

Lance Pendleton (26:23.069)
Your hip.

OK. Well, we should move.

Yeah, right. As if.

Jake Dreyfuss (26:32.905)
All right, well, we gotta move on here, guys. So we touched on a lot of hot button topics about communication. The next one, I'm sure, will be as well, is voice memos. One form of communication text aren't really using, but we should discuss, is that, right? So dropping voice messages in people's, in text chains, is it convenience or is it a cringy thing? Some things to consider before you weigh in on your opinions.

According to some of the people we surveyed, it's easier to respond on the go if you're leaving a voicemail or a voice message, but it's not always that convenient to listen to. Voice notes may be the new phone call, but according to 40 % of Americans surveyed by preple .com, 40 % of people say they're a good replacement for phone calls. 50 % say they've strengthened relationships. That's old. 30 % say they're annoying.

and millennials in general find the voicenotes inconvenient, but baby rumors seem to love them. Where do you guys fall on this spectrum? Love it or hate it.

Erin (27:40.526)
This is finally not a contextual one for me. Across the board, jail. I hate them.

Lance Pendleton (27:44.125)
Oh. I missed it down.

Jake Dreyfuss (27:44.265)
Oh, okay. Tell us.

Jake Dreyfuss (27:49.417)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. Yeah, they really are.

Erin (27:52.43)
They're horrible. Most of the time I'm always somewhere where it's inconvenient to stop and listen to it. But also, especially if it's a long one and it's about something you're collaborating on, you have to keep replaying it and be until like figure out, okay, these were their three points that I need to respond to. And it's so much easier just to have it in writing or a phone call where you can respond like as they go.

Jake Dreyfuss (28:20.393)
Right. And it's true because apps like WhatsApp and iMessage have begun adding transcription services, which to me is proof that texting still remains king. Right. And like, here's the thing, Erin, too, like, I've been guilty of leaving them generally just responding to someone who already left me one though. I generally don't go to it naturally, but maybe you can relate. Like when I'm leaving one, I'm like wandering around the house. I'm cleaning the blinds. I haven't cleaned in a month. I'm like reorganizing the fridge. So the message is longer.

Erin (28:43.214)
Yeah.

Erin (28:47.534)
No, I totally ramble when because I'll reply like you meet them where they're at. Well some people I'm like, no, I'm not even stooping I'm texting but yeah, I always ramble they're always rambling It's like worse than the stream of consciousness texting that you hate Lance

Jake Dreyfuss (28:48.361)
And I'm not sure if everyone else does that, but I definitely like, yeah, ramble.

Jake Dreyfuss (28:58.953)
Stupid.

Lance Pendleton (29:07.453)
Oh, totally. And, but I really do question some of the statistics on this survey from probably .com. I mean, the fact that I could see millennials finding them inconvenient, but baby boom, baby boomers love them. Um, I don't know that a baby boomer would even know how to record that on their phone, let alone like, Oh, it's not what they're talking about. Then it's like the thing. Oh, God save us all.

Jake Dreyfuss (29:12.169)
Oh yeah, it's, yeah.

Jake Dreyfuss (29:24.169)
Well, when they discover it, I feel like it's on. It's on, bro. Because it makes, it harkens back to a simpler time when voicemails were something you got home. Is your, why am I blanking on the term? The answering machine, God, is your answering machine light blinking? Right? Remember that lance coming home from the movies? Hey, who called me? Like it harkens back to a simpler time, like the wonder years.

Erin (29:26.318)
Then they don't stop.

I feel like...

Erin (29:46.51)
I think the only way that they could have strengthened relationships is because people started blocking people that left them voice memos and then dedicated more time to the other people in their life that don't do that. You can block a phone number.

Lance Pendleton (29:48.989)
Yeah... Yeah...

Jake Dreyfuss (29:54.665)
After the Wonder Years, actually.

Jake Dreyfuss (30:05.513)
You can do that? You can block voicemail memos? Oh, well, yeah. I mean, that's, yeah, okay. I didn't, I thought you could just...

Lance Pendleton (30:11.453)
Well, but the other problem with the other problem, the voice memos though, is that Apple's default is they disappear. Do you know that? Yeah. Your voice memos disappear in your text history. So again, it's one of those things where I'm sort of like, well, did you just tell me something that you intentionally like a lot inspector gadget style was going to like self destruct in 30 seconds. That was a show Erin back in the eighties for us when we were younger as inspector gadget. Um, yeah. Dun dun dun dun dun. So.

Jake Dreyfuss (30:18.889)
Yeah, that is a thing.

Jake Dreyfuss (30:27.657)
Yeah.

Erin (30:29.774)
I know Inspector Gadget, go go Gadget. Go go Gadget knife emoji.

Jake Dreyfuss (30:32.937)
best.

Lance Pendleton (30:40.093)
But that, right? Like, why does it need to disappear?

Jake Dreyfuss (30:44.329)
I'm very likely, that's a great question. I'm guessing it's like a financial thing, like saving the, taking back that bandwidth that you just took up. But I'm more, if someone gives me a voice message unannounced as part of a chain, I'm probably just gonna pick up the phone and call them. Or like text and say, let's just chat. Like, let's talk about this. You know, then more likely do that than respond via.

Lance Pendleton (31:06.621)
I will tell you the only time that I use it and you and I would love your opinion on this because I agree. I don't really like it. I find annoying. I used to have a business partner that every morning I had a new voice memo and I wanted to fling myself out a window. I was like, please stop it. I don't want to start my day with your voice in my head. But what I what I will ask is this. There are the only time I will use it is when I get stuck playing phone tag with somebody and I'm like, I just need you to understand this one thing and we don't need to keep doing this right where it's longer than a text because I'm like, I just need you to get this concept.

Erin (31:32.494)
That's fair.

Lance Pendleton (31:36.669)
and then we don't need to keep doing this. So that's the only time I've really done it. Is that acceptable or not?

Jake Dreyfuss (31:41.257)
It's an escalation. It's like, all right, I'm gonna take this to the next level. I'm not yet ready to commit to a phone call with you though, but I'm trying to prove a point I'd like you to stop is what I'm hearing from you on that. And I've done, I think I've done that too, but that is an escalation.

Lance Pendleton (31:53.917)
interesting because I didn't, Erin, what do you think? Because I didn't think about it like that. My thing was like, you're busy, I'm busy, we keep missing each other. I don't want to keep trying to remember that I have to call you because you called me, so I'll just do it. Is that what, Erin, what do you think?

Erin (31:59.982)
I think it's kind of like a voicemail in that sense. Same perp, like serving the same function, but I think it's acceptable. I did realize that I do occasionally use them, but in a joking manner and they're only like five seconds long. So sometimes I'll just randomly send my friends a voice memo where I'll be like,

Lance Pendleton (32:12.861)
I just assume no one listens to voicemail.

Erin (32:30.062)
Welcome to the heiress tour. Or just like, you know, that's how Taylor Swift like opens the heiress tour all the time. Like you'll just like imitate a funny sound bite and just send it to them to make them laugh.

Lance Pendleton (32:32.381)
What?

Jake Dreyfuss (32:33.225)
What?

Lance Pendleton (32:39.357)
Oh.

Jake Dreyfuss (32:45.513)
That's, oh, 100%.

Lance Pendleton (32:45.597)
Guess what I'm doing all weekend with Jake. Hey. Um, so another really quick one that I'd be curious to what y 'all think about in terms of, we talked about the etiquette around a bunch of this stuff too is like, you know, is it, is there pressure? Like if someone does it for you, do you feel the obligation to then do one back for them?

Jake Dreyfuss (33:07.881)
voice memos in general, I think in general with text messaging, anytime receiving a message through that type of a mean WhatsApp signal, like whatever, I feel pressure to like volley back, like a tennis match, I do, no matter what it is. I may not respond the same way, right, to your point, just because I get a voice memo, I might not respond with one, but I will respond.

Lance Pendleton (33:24.189)
Thanks for watching!

Erin (33:24.718)
Unless it's Trish. Are you out of your mind?

Lance Pendleton (33:31.901)
Um, I almost don't want to open the, I almost don't want to open Pandora's box because I know we're almost at time, but I do want to then just throw one last one in there. Read receipts, like them, hate them.

Jake Dreyfuss (33:36.105)
Apparently that's a stress - Sorry Trish. Sorry, yeah, sorry about that. I don't know what that's about, but...

Jake Dreyfuss (33:49.673)
Minor off. I don't want people to see what I'm reading or when I'm reading.

Erin (33:52.238)
Mine are off.

Lance Pendleton (33:53.917)
Interesting. And see, mine are on because I want you to know I read it and if I didn't respond, I got you. Like I saw it. You don't need to keep following up with me. Like I view it as the other way to be able to let them know. Like I did see this.

Erin (33:59.886)
Use periods at the end of your messages too. I said, do you? I don't know if you do.

Jake Dreyfuss (34:06.057)
Hmm.

Lance Pendleton (34:12.029)
I don't know.

I do. I will see. Well, that's no I do want me to text you sometimes and I y 'all could tell me I don't even notice what I do. I will tell you that there's two things one of which is I'm terrible with grammar and punctuation and stuff. No, but here's why I'm married to a grammar Nazi like she just is so in she's really good at grammar and spelling and everything and I'm so bad at it that I'm like all caught up in my head when I send things to people because I'm like, Oh, no, did I put commas in the right places and

Jake Dreyfuss (34:16.009)
check.

Erin (34:21.934)
I know. You do.

Lance Pendleton (34:41.661)
Like it just stresses me out. So yes, that's probably why, because I don't think I would if it weren't for like hearing Meg's voice in my head. But the other part of that too, though, is I think sometimes when I'm like texting, I use Siri and voice the voice dictation for texting all the time. I like 80 % of the things that come out of me in a text, I probably dictated. And you can usually tell because I'm you know, the word books got converted to boobs. And I'm like, oh, that's embarrassing. But

Jake Dreyfuss (35:02.441)
No.

Erin (35:03.982)
Tame.

Lance Pendleton (35:09.373)
I just kind of assume you know that, right? Like, but do you, do you type all your stuff out or do you text it like our audio? Really? Oh man, it's so much faster. I just sit there and talk and you know, and that then the commas and periods are all screwed up.

Jake Dreyfuss (35:14.921)
Yeah, 99 % typed. I kind of forget you can do the voice to text thing to be honest. Yeah.

Jake Dreyfuss (35:27.177)
But same comment as the voice memos, I feel like I ramble on. If I'm just talking, I'm going to keep talking versus like my texts. I feel like I keep them clean, keep them tight. Yeah, man. Ain't got time for that. If I don't hear from you over, over what period of time, if I don't hear from you, should I assume you're never going to respond or that you forgot? Trying to back into like how quickly you think you normally respond. You guys seem to be pretty quick to me, but like if it's been two days, can I assume you're either not going to respond or you forgot? For example.

Erin (35:27.822)
Mm -hmm. I gotta pare it down.

Lance Pendleton (35:35.101)
I'm a long -winded human anyway, so.

Erin (35:46.062)
Thank you.

Erin (35:57.486)
Sometimes I'll go back and be like three days later and realize I didn't respond to some people. And I'll go respond. Because it's gnawing on my soul and I know that they texted me and I didn't get back to them. And I'm like, oh, okay, I'm gonna do it now.

Jake Dreyfuss (36:03.817)
Okay.

Lance Pendleton (36:04.605)
How do you realize? But how do you realize that?

Jake Dreyfuss (36:11.625)
rolls back. Yeah.

Lance Pendleton (36:17.885)
So, but honestly though, like, but you can remember that though, that that person text you three days ago without the little red dot on it and you, wow. So I have to respond relatively quickly. Otherwise, I guarantee you, I forgot. It's very simple for me. Like it's that easy.

Erin (36:24.782)
I don't forget anything.

Jake Dreyfuss (36:33.449)
Yeah. Yeah. I'll just scroll back to everyone. So while like over weekend in the morning when everyone's sleeping, I'm like, Oh my God, I forgot to write back to Thomas. Oh my God. Yeah.

Lance Pendleton (36:42.077)
Really?

Erin (36:43.214)
I guess occasionally I will actually forget, but for the most part I don't forget.

Lance Pendleton (36:46.173)
See, and that's super interesting because of my read receipts, I actually won't tap on something, I will leave it there knowing that I have to deal with it. So I won't actually open it until I'm ready to deal with it.

Jake Dreyfuss (36:53.161)
There you go.

Erin (36:57.23)
That's a good way to hold yourself accountable.

Lance Pendleton (36:59.965)
Yeah, I do have a couple of like ground rules in my life that are somewhat useful. Most of them aren't, but...

Jake Dreyfuss (37:00.809)
you know.

Look guys, I think we've probably created a lot of debate out there. We're about out of time for today. Whether you text, call, send voice notes, we hope you picked up some gems today. Maybe you'll tweak some things, I don't know.

Lance Pendleton (37:18.141)
And remember the unmastered class is here to help make navigating this chaotic world a little bit easier and remind you that it's okay to laugh at yourself. And something tells me much like someone telling me that I am not a sexy human because I wear socks in bed. I'm going to get some hate mail because I can't stand it when you're on FaceTime in the middle of public. But what do I know?

Erin (37:30.51)
Bye.

Jake Dreyfuss (37:35.401)
Well, don't forget to follow us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever it is you find your podcasts. And yes, please hit the subscribe button on YouTube too. It really helps us. Until next time, stay curious and keep mastering the unmastered. Love you guys. See ya.