Josh Lane is a singer songwriter and front man of the soul band Thee Sacred Souls, who are currently working on their second album.
In this intimate conversation, Josh opens up about the emotional toll of touring success, the challenges of learning to manage a band-as-a-business, and how activism and self-education is a way to fight for our own humanity.
Follow Josh on Instagram!
QUICK NOTE: Sooo I was getting over a bad cold when we recorded and, high on Dayquil, I messed up a setting; recording through the wrong mic. The audio is lower-quality than I aim for, but I think you’ll still find this a fascinating conversation. Thank you for your understanding. I’m feeling much better now.
Thanks for listening and supporting left media. If you’re interested in conversations about the intersections of creativity and social change hosted by a socialist organizer, please follow along for this 8 episode “Season One”. I am also so grateful for comments or shares that help us reach more people!
Here’s some links to your favorite websites. I’d love to hear from you.
- Jordan
And Roses Website
Youtube
Instagram
Twitter
Josh Lane is a singer songwriter and front man of the soul band Thee Sacred Souls, who are currently working on their second album.
In this intimate conversation, Josh opens up about the emotional toll of touring success, the challenges of learning to manage a band-as-a-business, and how activism and self-education is a way to fight for our own humanity.
Follow Josh on Instagram!
QUICK NOTE: Sooo I was getting over a bad cold when we recorded and, high on Dayquil, I messed up a setting; recording through the wrong mic. The audio is lower-quality than I aim for, but I think you’ll still find this a fascinating conversation. Thank you for your understanding. I’m feeling much better now.
Thanks for listening and supporting left media. If you’re interested in conversations about the intersections of creativity and social change hosted by a socialist organizer, please follow along for this 8 episode “Season One”. I am also so grateful for comments or shares that help us reach more people!
Here’s some links to your favorite websites. I’d love to hear from you.
- Jordan
And Roses Website
Youtube
Instagram
Twitter
Hi everybody. Welcome to and roses My name is jordan and i'm here today with josh lane who is a singer songwriter and front man of the band the sacred souls A soul band who's currently working on their second studio album. Josh is from sacramento by way of san diego and fun fact He used to be my roommate. Welcome josh. Nice to have you here.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:hello internet. This
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Josh
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:here.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:I was so glad to have you. I wanted to ask before we dive into anything Josh, what has been inspiring you lately
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:First I want to say I'm excited to be here on and roses and
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:for the, for the podcast only audience? Josh has just produced a embroidered, not embroidered. That's not a rose. It's a beautiful rose
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:I'll just hold it. I
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:and it is going,
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:They threw it on the stage and I actually really love this thing. Boom.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:it's really nice.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:What's inspiring me as of right now? Maybe as bleak as it sounds current events are inspiring me. In the world, in our country, and overseas, it's just, it's It's inspiring Because it feels like a tug of war with humanity,
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:with everything that's going on in the world. And I think that is a really interesting way of, of sort of looking at it, seeing that tug of war and seeing the, the opportunity, not just the pain, but in the middle of, yeah, just 24 hour news cycle where there is always something just. Terrible going on. I feel like a lot of people just have a hard time like keeping up and it's easier to just tune out. It's easier to, I don't know, just find ways to kind of like self medicate or to distract yourself. How do you cope with being a person who is like, yeah, engaged with the news and educating yourself and not just Turning away from that.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:Personally, I feel like it reminds me that I am a human in a body of humans. And, I'm not some perfect person. Like I, I was numb to and shut off to the truths. I feel like the urgency to take care of my own life up until October 7th. So for me, I feel like if I were to stay numb and You know, horse blinders, you know, and just look forward at my career and all these other things. It feels like, it feels less than human. And so it's the opposite of inspiration. I feel like I just feel guilty. And I think with pain and it really does. have some kind of a soil nature to creativity because it's it's all of our humanity that we're watching participating in. And so I can't feel like a blossoming human in this humanity if I'm not at least engaging or at least tuning in at the very least. Because that forces you to feel or not feel. So if I see you know all that knowledge seeing goes into my being and hits my receptors and gets to whatever factory is in there to feel and I get to decide to be apathetic or empathetic. But if I turn a blind eye, I don't even give myself that opportunity to unnum myself. And I do feel like America, as much as I love my, my life and my friends and And the concept maybe of America, it's built to kind of numb us from the food to the entertainment to the apathy. So for me, it's just important to let the floodgates open and keep learning and let things drop other dominoes when it comes to the historical and the context and the, and the current events for my growth as a human.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:There's that element of just being like a whole person and accepting the difficult, painful parts of that too. And understanding that that is something that's actually necessary to living your fullest possible life as a, it can be like a very individualistic sentiment, but I think when the The cause of that is sort of the recognition of everybody and everything that's going on around us. It's important. I wanted to really get into this conversation by kind of talking about your career and how you've sort of gotten to this point. The interesting things that you're observing about the moment in time that you're living through, but to kind of take a step back, you know, you prior to being a member of these sacred souls, you'd been, you know, working on your own independent music for years and you had a lot of friends supporting but being able to join these sacred souls kind of was like a real game changer for you. And I'm just kind of wondering if you can tell us the story a little bit about how that came about.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:long story short, my co owners and writer of my band, Alex and Sal they had met each other maybe a month or so before they met me. Both playing in separate bands at a DIY show, which was the regular thing in San Diego for a minute there. I don't know what happened there because that was their story to tell, but they they met at this show and they were in the green room drinking, talking about inspirations and they both were inspired by soul music and the Chicano soul culture of listening to music, whether it's in the morning with your family or cruising. or whatever, soul music was integral to their upbringing. And they were talking about maybe doing a project where they let those influence thrive through their music. And so they started, they got together and started doing covers. But then Alex had stumbled across my Instagram or vice versa. One of us, and we both liked each other's stuff. I, I, I. Really liked what he was doing in instrumentally and he liked my voice and He invited me over to his garage to just jam And I you know, like a jam goes I brought some stuff I was working on and he played some drums and then at the end of the session He showed me some stuff. He was working on with sal And he showed me An instrumental he had done a while ago and he's just been sitting on and it was the instrumental for can I call you rose? and that session I was I fell in love with the, it just attached to me really quickly. And we just worked on it for maybe 40 minutes. And the song came together fully. I was like singing melodies and using placeholder that helped me sing melodies. And
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Cool.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:it kind of just flowed pretty naturally. And then from then on, we became, we, we did another session and then another song came out and then we were like, should we become a band? And you know, that was, that was that.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:And you mentioned that that was kind of the, that San Diego, like DIY community and you all sort of started playing together after that, were you like signed in any way, or was it truly just like, did you kind of start playing some shows and then like attract the attention of like a label that's
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:No, we weren't signed. We didn't really have a team to get proper shows together at that point. had a couple shows I had, I was working at this coffee shop called Communal at the time, and I was in charge of some of the events and open and hosting an open mic. And so I, I guess like booked us at this coffee shop and so, but I think our first show was at a friend's record store, Soul Shack, when it was in its downtown location. And then I think communal show happened, if this timeline is correct. And then a little bit later we had our Another show with Soul Shack at its new location, which is Off Adams. And that was a big one for us, I think. Through certain events, were on Gabe Roth's radar, who is the owner of Daptone Records. And he came to our we did at this bar called 2J's then after that he asked if we wanted to make a a single and then conversations of what we're trying to do. And we, so then we signed with Daptone Records. And then during the pandemic, use that unfortunate time to kind of build our team with managers and booking agent and fully get dialed
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Can I ask, like, the, the, you know, coming up on the radar, there's, you know, no shortage of. Bands that form that have a great sound, have a lot of talent and, you know, can feel like maybe they're just playing, performing indefinitely, but not really like getting through and not really like connecting with the people that they want to connect with. Tell me a little bit more about how you all like came up on the radar. Do you think that there was anything, you know, unique about your approach?
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:An individual named Diego who is in this band called With Strangers, who happened to be a friend of Gabe's, he had reached out to Alex, and asked if he could get some of our demos so he can send them to Gabe. So there was that, there was a connection there. It definitely was perfect place at the right time. Good sound. I feel like without that. think we still might have been what we are, but it would have definitely took a little more time.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah, well, and I think you had mentioned that it was just like he had seen your stuff, like he had seen it on Instagram or, or something. And I think there's just something interesting about like, you never know. You never know who's.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah, it's true. We weren't even posting full songs, we were just posting little snippets, 15 second snippets on Instagram. And that was kind of getting people buzzed.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah, so I mean, you know, flash forward to today and it's just like I haven't seen snippets of you, you know, performing all around the world and some pretty likable venues. But, you know, when you were still back in that early stage, yeah, there's some conversations taking place. But before you got to any of this, like international presence, it was like, you were, y'all were still just like a local San Diego band and you were getting like a lot of local love. I'm kind of curious if, if that's sort of like how it felt at the time is like, yeah, we're, we're getting some clout, but we're still like pretty, pretty locally based. And yeah, how much of, was there like some real strategy to try to like level up beyond that? Or did it just kind of feel like things were like organically unfolding and getting bigger?
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:My opinion as I look back at the trajectory is that it was equally natural buzz because the sound we're doing, I genuinely believe soul music as a As a thing, as a cultural thing is a very relatable sound and it's so deeply rooted in American culture and deeply rooted in black culture and deeply rooted in Chicano culture. I think black and brown people in general really vibe with soul music and have for since its inception. Every, every American, I think. I think it's hard to too many people who are just like, I really hate soul music. So I think it had appeal because it, it's a, it's a good genre and we were making, I think, good music. And I, do want to shout out just in general, the Chicano culture because, in the early days, our biggest fan base was the brown community in San Diego and like San Antonio, you know, it's like, We started off with a pretty proper fan base in the early days. And then when we, we started to play more in different cities and get a management and things like that, the appeal spread to like, you know, pop culture and people of all races and old people alike. So it was a mixture of like natural growth and Team strategy when it comes to having a team behind you moving things. Like the team definitely got us our live show presence unlike the late shows and stuff But we did a lot of the groundwork when it comes to appealing to the audience The people right there, you know.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:yeah, so once you started getting, yeah, the late night shows, I, I actually remember, I think it was maybe playing like Jimmy Kimmel or Fallon or one of the Jimmys. And I was like, Oh my God, Josh is going to be on late night. And actually like, I never watched any of those shows, but I like stayed up and realized like, Oh yeah, it's. It's gonna be all the way at the end of the episode, so I'm gonna sit through this entire episode. But then it's just like, that's Josh, he's on TV. When this was happening for you, like, what was going through your head? I mean, suddenly you're reaching this like huge audience. How did you, how did you feel? How were you processing those moments?
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:Personally, just to keep it 100%. I was just stressed out and in my head and not having a good time because things are moving fast. They're definitely moving faster than I personally could handle. I had the container for a capacity for and just the movement of how fast it was going, having a team, having a band and interpersonal life and all these things. It was, it was overwhelming for me. Still kind of is, but it was at that point really overwhelming. So I would love to say I was having a good time, but personally I was kind of just holding on looking back. I'm, I'm so glad we got to do that, but it wasn't it wasn't a fun time for me, unfortunately,
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:yeah, how, how, how were you, how were you able to like cope with that then? I mean, how were you able to try to keep keep your head on straight as, as these just like entirely new experiences are happening?
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:I didn't have many strategies for that at the time. I was doing a lot of, trying to do a lot of breathing exercises and some basic asanas in the yoga practice, like the sun salutations and every day to try to calm my body. But, yeah, just, it, it really wasn't like I didn't, I wasn't really on top of, on top of that. I kind of just felt like I was being washed around in the, in the like not on top of the wave anymore, kind of fumbling my way through the waters and coming up for air. And then, you know, it was, Hmm. it. I think some, sometimes being on the stage, And seeing people look back and, and seeing genuine, like, vulnerability in faces helped. And then talking to people after helped. And hearing how the music has helped them in some way. And maybe my aspirations helped. But the busyness early on and the unknown early on and the two jobs worked at, at a certain, when that happened, that was really, that was the, the onsite of like real stress because lucky for me, you know, I had some jobs, the coffee shop, communal coffee, and then the Rose wine bar, which, you know, The owner, Chelsea, was, is a friend and was really gracious to, to work with my schedule when it comes to having big chunks of time off and then still being on the roster to come back and make some money. then when I had to decide to, to,
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Hmm. Yeah.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:really helpful to that business I needed way more time off and it was way more sporadic, I had to do that leap of faith thing because Buzz and The money to pay your bills are two different things. And so we definitely had the buzz early on. So that was scary, but I guess we're surviving it.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah. I mean, as, as the, last few years have gone by, is this something, a bit of a routine that you've, you know, settled into more? Is that even possible when so much of the routine is just traveling for weeks at a time? Yeah. How are, how are you, how are you doing these days?
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:My personal experience is no, it hasn't gotten, I don't have like a routine that works. I think it's just that for me, it's digesting the fact that in this career and at this time so much so many eyes and so many opportunities. I just have to realize that it's going to be a pretty drastic ebb and flow of me feeling my nervous system is regulated and it not being always trying new ways to that on the road. Not to be cliche is like some humble person, but I never got into making music to be any kind of us any kind of what a star is considered. So that's just made it really stressful because in order to get the music to the masses, that's just part of what comes to it. If people like it and if you have a team whose job is to make you as big as they can, you know, so I just think it's more
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:the truth of it. If you're going to be making music that touches people and that, and if you get it to enough people, you're going to have less consistency, maybe when it comes to some of the things that I think make a person happy, which is like routine. to be in your community or in your room with your your cat for me my cat Ella. She's somewhere in here
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:I do always think it's so funny. How I'm always thinking about, like, the best case scenario for, like, a musical artist. It seems like, it's like to write a song or a couple of songs that, like, resonate with people so much that you're then, like, cursed to perform them for the rest of your life.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah well for me, keep making sure to say for me because it's different for every Artist and even in my band is probably different. Everyone has a different vantage point and a different experience with being the road a lot and having this success. But yeah, for me, it's not as much playing the songs all the time. I think it's what comes with that after playing the shows and songs and, being a little
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:what, what is it that comes after?
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:I don't know, to me, it feels like, you trade in some normalcy. I don't think it's normal to be on the road all the time, or we're not on the road as much as a lot of the bigger A list bands, for sure. But I just, even for them, I don't think it's a natural to be, I think it's natural to make a record and that record goes, travels and lives on forever. And isn't, and that's traveling and in people's houses and always playing. That's great. I think the human body and mind, it's like being, it almost feels like a less drastic version of being like a fisherman who goes out for seasons and it's gone for seasons, but they know there'll be back for seasons. It's just kind of more of
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah. Yeah.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:Don't want to sound like an asshole who doesn't have any gracious or who doesn't feel grateful. I feel grateful that we're here. The dichotomy, I guess.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:A minute ago you were saying something about, this is not, you know, why I wanted to start making music. Why did you want to start making music?
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:To express myself. And, to feel, to feel some value and to give value to creative process that I was gifted with. And that I've been putting time and effort to build and grow. I think that I wanted to plant things sonically and watch them grow and keep doing that over and over again. I would be a liar if I said when I was young, when I was in college, I didn't think for a second that I wanted exactly what I'm doing now. As I have it, I just want to, I just want to settle it in a little bit and have more of a balance with it. I think I, I want to do this, but I
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Hmm.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:balance and, and there's balance coming and I definitely feel like Eeyore a little bit when I talk about these things, but that's just because this is what's going on in my head with it. It's still opportunities and a blessing. But that doesn't, I can't fake what goes through my head when I digest all these blessings or digest what it is to be on the road all the time. I want to balance it. I want to make sure that people
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:a blessing. It's just, it's hard for me, personally, to grapple with.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah, well, and I think, a lot of people see successful artists. I think that, you know, yeah, the music is all there is to it. Like, Oh yeah. When are you going to drop again? And where, you know, just kind of like analyzing the creativity and that's obviously like an integral part, but at a certain level, once you, Achieve a certain level of success. It almost becomes like you are managing a business. I was just reading an article recently about like, just how absolutely brutal the, you know, kind of touring economy is right now and how difficult it is for so many bands to like, actually like make a living from the time they spend touring. And, and that article is talking about like, you know, in the music industry, the biggest employer is like artists themselves. There is a whole like kind of sub economy and a lot of people whose livelihood comes from like just supporting artists who are going on tour. And so I'm just kind of curious for you. Having to deal with not just like the personal toll that it takes on yourself, but also having to kind of learn about like the band as a business. We were chatting about that a little bit earlier, and then when you mentioned you referred to, to your band mates as, as your co-owners and Yeah. Like does it, is that what it feels like sometimes?
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah, that's just the facts. I mean, I think most of us, even myself included, have this idea of banned Bandhood something like the movie show with like, like these, friends from childhood who struck it big or whatever, there is the artistic element and the camaraderie and all that stuff. But then in a business oriented culture. And so it's, I'd be, lying if I didn't say this is a business and there's, decisions and there's, your managers are there to guide you through those things because they of, usually it's kind of a prerequisite that they have some business savvy, I guess. And then you're there to okay things and kind of work through it. But if you don't have a business mind or you have, you don't have any business, background, it can be daunting and it's. You're going off the word of others and doing whatever research you can do or advised, however you can. But it's been that, that part is I'm not by any means like a, a good business person, I see the importance of it now, but yeah, we're a business.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah. You're a business as you've, become more acquainted with the like business and the economic side of things. Now seeing things, you know, seeing how the sausage gets made What are some of the aspects of the business or the you know The music economy that you think are making it especially difficult for like other younger up and coming artists to get a foothold
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:the importance in monopoly of app based music. Things like Spotify, Apple music and the, the unfair hold they have on the artists. And it definitely feels like the same way that, corporation will go in and corporation or country will go in and exploit a place for their natural resources. I feel like that's just an easy model for business people in America to implement and So like the Spotify world, it's like that's exploiting the musicians and extracting all their minerals and giving them almost nothing. And so, yeah, if you're artist, you can see some, some dividends from plays on the sites, but the smaller bands who. Yeah, they give them the opportunity to be on there, but it doesn't, what's the, you know, I think it's those, those practices, which I know a lot of good people are trying to fight against the touring sector, like it is a lot harder to get, Any kind of national support tour support unless you're opening for someone who has that reach Yeah, I think we're kind of starting to slowly see the death of the smaller venues is where an up and coming band would get their get their start because you can do a lot more pitching to a smaller venue without even a manager even Than you can like these bigger venues and you know, without getting into details, there's companies who are extending their reach when it comes to how much control they have over the touring circuit. And I kind of feel like, you know, That's problematic.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Is there, I don't know, from, from a fan's perspective or from a young artist's perspective? I mean, cause yeah, you're talking like really big picture things like, yeah, you know, local venues shutting down. Is there anything that like, what can people do? Do you think there's any chance of these dynamics changing or is this just. You know, the reality that people need to learn to adapt to while we, you know, slowly wage our class struggle in the hopes of being able to permanently and broadly affect economic dynamics and society more in the future.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:Mm hmm. Part of me, you know, I'm glad I'm here, but once in a while I realize, like, I'm not a specialist in these areas. know what feels right and wrong. So, personally, I feel like we shouldn't just give in and say, yeah, this is how it is. But, do I have the answers? I do not. Because, just being honest with you, at least in this place and time I don't feel the agency to just say no to, a touring company who has opportunities the band. And I don't have the organizations in mind that can offer, national tours or international tours to artists. I would love to dream up some stuff at some point. And I want to educate myself on a lot of, a lot of things that'll be, that could be some some, some foundation for any change that I can be a part of. But at this point, I don't even have much foundation other than I think that things are kind of backwards would love to see change. I I'm
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:of trying to educate myself and, have relationships with the right people who can mentor in those ways. At the same time, as that's going on in my mind, I'm also taking a step at a time in career mode and, you know, shows and booking tours.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah,
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:So I know that there's a problem, and I want to be a part of the solution at some point in my life, even starting now, but I don't know what the solution is. than paying the artists what they deserve, and that they are the reason that there's even an industry is because of the people creating the product. Yeah.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:know, like, sinister to this idea that, like, you are not allowed to advocate for change, or you're not allowed to, you know, say what you think is right and wrong unless you're able to engage in some, you know, like, debate club level, pundit level, like discussion about the exact policies. I think a lot of people are discouraged from participating in politics. And I think that, you know, for people who are trying to build towards a mass politics to see deep social change, it's, it's, you know, people feel disqualified because that, because they're not experts, but I think that absolutely is not a big deal. Disqualification like, yes, you know, like educate yourself. We all should educate each other, take the time to do that. We do owe it to each other to educate each other. Like, let's do that. But, I appreciate you like leading, giving the example of being, you know, willing to be open and vulnerable about the fact that, yeah, you're not the expert, but that's not going to stop you from, yeah, saying what you think is right and wrong. In fact, one of the things that I really respect about you, Josh, is the way that you have like really been using your platform to educate and share content and information and even, share some like original songs that you've been writing. To, raise awareness about social issues, especially like after October 7th, I think you were one of the first artists that I saw who just, you know, was not just like equivocating and saying, you know, like all violence is bad, but explicitly talking about the political situation and the history of what's been going on in Israel and Palestine and being unafraid to call it a genocide, which is something that still there are people who are many people who are unwilling to do. I'm wondering if you can talk just a little bit about sort of how you see your role as an artist, not necessarily like an expert or a historian or a professor or a journalist, but, but as an artist, how do you see your role, like inner intersecting with the social issues that, that you're aware of and that you care about?
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:I kind of feel like, personally, I am called to be, kind of a, a social commentator, or, someone who uses whatever they have available to voice concern about this, this, the state of humanity and, I don't know, to be honest, it usually for me comes from Digesting stuff And then It getting filtered through my humanity And Grappling with that, so early on It was just shock And mostly shock of my lack of understanding and realizing that I had been pretty numb by my own problems in my own because I think I had seen some stuff in 2017, 18, somewhere around there, maybe 2011. One of the 20s, I saw someone post something about, or some article or something about the, some bombings in Gaza and I just didn't know much. And I also felt like it wasn't my problem at the time. And I felt like it was sad, but so many things are sad in the world, you know, just numb and focused on my problems. And it wasn't until October 7th that the problems of the world were in my face on this phone. And at the time I definitely was on my phone too much. So I would see it all the time. And the time also, it wasn't being Crack down on by meta or by Instagram. So like I was seeing it all and I had a friend who is an inspiration for me when it comes to just human rights and activism in general. I was in Monet who and who invited me a place to kind of talk about her experience when she had went to Palestine with a group to kind of just see how bad like things like apartheid and treatment of the Palestinian people, how, how it went down things that I had no idea, not even one inkling of, I had no, almost felt like the matrix cause I genuinely felt like I was suffocating and all this information that I just had no idea about. And it woke me up to some things. And I, I think even as a young person, I always used music to kind of journal I would say before it even becomes a creative venture in my mind, it's like a journaling kind of thing. That's why some of the things I've posted don't even to me sound like extra, juicy and musical because I would just pick up my guitar, sit at the piano and play some things and the melody wasn't as important as like what I was trying to say. And it was more to kind of make sure that my humanity Was alive and well. As much as I want to say was automatically always to be like I'm gonna use my platform It was more to make sure that I was awake. And I just got so used to like going on live and playing stuff so but I do feel like our jobs and my job as an artist and someone with platform is to find ways to to people. I mean, I can't make people do anything but I can appeal or I can Put something in their consciousness and subconsciousness that they have to deal with internally themselves. But I can put it there. And so that's, and I feel like it's the least I can do. Like, it's scary maybe. Yeah. But I mean, anything that can happen to me over here is isn't, is not even, can't even compare to what's happened 75 plus years. And I think one thing that I, I think was, I don't know who told, who said it first that, that it stuck to me, but just the idea that all of these struggles are interconnected and they're the same struggle. heard that so many times and it wasn't until I started to read books on this or activist would like post a video about the Congo and be like, don't forget about this while we're talking about this. then I would look into that and be like, man, I was just as ignorant about this, if not more than I was about the Palestinian struggle. And then it just made me realize the domino, the dominoes had fallen. I realized that it's all connected and it all comes from this exploitative way of life that we don't even realize we benefit from, which is colonialism and imperialism. And the idea of going somewhere and getting what you need from a place. And not giving it back. We see it in ways in our communities with gentrification, taking a thing, kicking people out and not. Putting something there in place. That's gonna that's gonna serve the place that you just took over It's the same thing in other countries it kind of just kind of messed me up in a sense that like I the things that I that I Strive for like with my own life and my comfort just kind of were Flipped upside down and I still have those desires to have comfort and things like that But now of those desires go through this filter of like look what's going on The blissful, the blissful ignorance is no longer available to me. And so I feel like my, my goal is to help other people also not be ignorant.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:What an incredible opportunity to, you know, have a friend who's willing to like reach out like Aja did to, you know, invite you over and share more information. But you've also, you know, have, it seems like you've really furthered that and you're, you know, pursuing that sort of like education. You're curious to learn more yourself. Are there any, you know, particular like, Books you've read or movies you've watched or, you know, Instagram accounts you follow that you've found like, you know, quite interesting and anything that you'd like to shout out that, you know, you, you recommend other people check out.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:Definitely there's, there's, I I, don't have too many resources but one book I've been reading and it's taken me a while because I keep going back and re reading chapters because it's kind of dense. I'm at the halfway mark now. Is this book The Hundred Years War on Palestine. I'm I don't want
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Cool.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:his name, but
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Can you, can you say the author for people just listening?
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:it's it's, it's a, it's a history of settler colonialism and resistance. And it's It goes from 1917 to 2017. It's very dense and it's very much like, historical textbook for school. Almost. I would say if our school systems weren't so jacked up, I feel like this would be a perfect, text to do a class on, but it just, it just woke me up to some things that I would have never known about, like that give context to anything we see with these political debates or. conferences and stuff. All that stuff has been going on in like ring around the Rosie and for years and years. Like the whole victim thing with Israel. That's been, that's been a narrative from the beginning. And I learned about the Balfour agreements, which I would have never known about, which is when Britain was pretty much like, yeah, come settle here. You have our blessing. And our muscle don't disrupt the people who are there, you know, but the Balfour agreement didn't have any like didn't give the Palestinian people any or rights or anything. So it was definitely something I didn't know about. I just, I didn't even know where the conflict. I honestly thought the conflict might have started a few years before. That's how ignorant I was to it, I really recommend it. I've given some to some friends, hoping that they share them. And I found it at a local bookstore. They're kind of hard to come by. I think libraries have copies as well, but that's been a big resource. I just reached out on my social network, asking people for resources on, the struggles of the, Congolese, the people in Congo. And, I plan on posting all the responses cause I didn't know any of these books or resources, but I haven't looked through that yet. And then Instagram, been following my friend Aja Monet has been a big resource for me and encourage, mostly encouragement in the struggle of, freedom and being a, even just being a small part in the, in that. And then Joe Leon is another, person who's been inspiration and would post things that are encouraging and have, and, and the history of what's going on in real time. And Saul Williams is another. There's a lot more I'm just kind of going. And then lot of the journalists who were a lot, were a lot more outspoken early on, but now are being quiet. They're still outspoken, but they're being censored. I know there's a lot of documentaries. I plan on getting into some of
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:When
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:but I haven't yet.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah. And I think actually that book in particular, I haven't read it. I have it. But I also want to give a shout out to my chapter of DSA, DSA Los Angeles that did a reading series on that beginning in January. I've heard that that's an amazing book and I am now reminded that I need to read it. Josh, I did want to ask as you
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:about it with more people.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Okay, absolutely.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:We could Book
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:as As you've been using your platform to kind of like amplify some of the messaging, yeah, from organizations and journalists that are, that are covering the ongoing genocide, and even before, I remember talking with you a little bit about this just during, like, when you were trying to raise awareness to, to Things going on in 2020 during the George Floyd uprisings. But in, in your industry and in your position, like as an artist, I think about the sentiment of, you know, when, when LeBron started speaking up about some, you know, social issues and, you know, conservatives are just telling them like stick to basketball. And I feel like in the, in the musical industry, there are a lot of people who do kind of like try to keep their head down, just stay focused on the music. I mean, certainly there are a lot of like amazing activists who are speaking out about things, but, but yo, what, what is your experience of that? Like dynamic? Been like, as you've been kind of trying to build your career in, in your industry, but also you're trying to use your platform to talk about, you know, these things that really, really matter.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:I don't know, I guess it's kind of conflicting because there's no conflict in me when it comes to my personal humanity and who I am and wouldn't want to be in rooms with people who don't want to be honest and truthful about their feelings in general, whether I believe in it or agree with it or not. So, it really comes down to, the industry and my place of work, I guess is how you'd say it. I don't know, I don't have an answer for that, I'm still grappling with it. I feel like, Personally, I haven't felt any pushback on a personal level with my freedom of speech and insane things that I have. Like I haven't had people be like, you should be quiet or be careful. That's not my personal experience, but I felt the fears of that, because especially, with group settings. I'm not speaking for myself alone in a band setting. Mean, I guess I am speaking for myself, but I'm a part of a, of a whole vehicle you know, there's consent there when it comes to what is said and, and how I use my voice and disrespect for other people's differences. Not to say that there's like some, some grand differences with my band. Point being, it feels a lot more free and I feel a lot more freedom. as an individual because I have control of myself and I am in cahoots with me, know, so it's a lot easier and I, I really don't know. I'm still, I mean, I feel new to the industry and I don't know how my body and mind will react when there's, More pushback on a personal level, but I guess I'll just have to experience that when I experience it I don't plan on letting fear of that stop me from It really comes down to keeping my humanity alive, I think that's all of our jobs At the very least is at least grappling with your humanity and that's like a buzzword, but it's like humanity is like We are all breathing humans until we're not breathing anymore. And if it's not from natural things, that's something that should cause alarm in the tribal mind, you know, like universally we're one big tribe of humans. We have cultures and we have differences of opinion that are drastic sometimes that even lead to big conflicts. But so it's a lot to grapple with when it comes to what's right and wrong. And, but at the very least, You need to not be numb to the idea of what murder is when, when to call it what it is. And when you see people who don't have infrastructure or weapons and you their moves acts of war or whatever that that's just like anti human and it doesn't take It doesn't even take the most empathetic person in the world to realize that it's bullshit. But there are powers that brainwash us and make us feel This or that our friendships with people who also don't have the answers, but have emotional power And can tell you what about this and my family and what do you know? That stuff is strong for me personally, I combat that with context I don't think everything is like has to be on a technical Collegiate level of like studying, but a lot of times in this specific conflict, it's very important to have context. Cause then when you have your friend who appeals to your emotions, who also doesn't have the answers and doesn't know about like some of the big turning points for the Palestinian plight, like the Balfour agreement, then you're just going off of their friendship and emotion. And that's, that's a strong thing. I know early on, you know, a lot of Jewish people and Jewish friends, coming up to bat and to defend Zionism, but then you realize it's not even their fault necessarily. They're just kind of ignorant to like history and context. You even get like famous influencers or actors are stuff like, yeah, we were taught and we thought that like Israel was this vacant spot that just, we filled. So it's like you're fighting against lack of context. And so I try to make sure that there's context, this is great. In my, in my fight so that when I'm in my industry, you know, when I didn't know anything at all, it was a lot harder to be, to voice things. It's once you get context and there's a backbone in the context where you're like, no, there's a structure here. I, I, I I'm sound in the fact that I know that this is wrong. not like I'm just hoping that these people that I am influenced by and that speak to me are right. It's like, no, I have context now. And that's why I keep sharing this book. I know there's other resources, but this has given me so much context. Like, timeline style. To where you realize that the Palestinian people weren't even considered a people for so long on purpose. To the point that we have officials in our government saying the Palestinian people don't exist there. That's not a people group You know Like we're fighting against very ignorant evil like evil in its truest form it's not Jewish people who are the evil in the truest form It's certain so like these these words get tossed around like salad like as if they're the same thing But it's not it's like I can say that there's an evil afoot And not be saying that Jewish people are inherently evil or that the Jewish community is evil But,
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Sure.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:a timeline that shows time and time again.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Yeah.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:A certain group of lawmakers or people in power being evil. But yeah, in my industry, I don't feel the fear. I haven't felt any pushback, but I know it's there probably. But you know, I also don't think I'm being as radical as I could be just when you, when you start to critique yourself.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:No, I, I, I really appreciate all of that. I think we're probably at a pretty good time to wrap up, but I don't know any, anything else that's been on your mind that you want to, Want to get off your chest today?
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:I guess one thing that I've been thinking about a lot and I kind of talked about a little bit is that, If your art isn't to your humanity, then it's I wouldn't say it's not art, I don't know, I can't be that one to say that, but I think it's, it's vanity and it's not worth anything. And that doesn't mean speaking up specifically on a thing or this or that, but like just your humanness, humanity, if it's, if it's just a means to a thing and it's not meant to help you grapple with your own humanity and grow and it's not a part of your internal dialogue and it's just like of internal dialogue or context of culture current events. it might be beautiful, but I don't think it's worth anything. Or at least if it's not making those, it might not on the nose be on this or that or the other, but if it's not at least starting dialogue in your own mind. To any artist or people coming up or People who already are doing it. I know that I feel a lot more alive when it's when I'm connected to that source of common ground, even if I don't know things or don't know how to Yeah. at least if it's if I'm bubbling inside with passion. And sadness and happy, you know, that's what art's for is to, it's to grapple with humanity because we're, what are we than humans? We're, we're, we're spirit. Maybe, you know, there's all these things that we hold open. We don't know exactly, but we're, I think we're a spirit, but I know I'm, I know I'm here or am I,
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:well, I am so happy that you are here today, Josh.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:Jordan, we're just talking. I don't,
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:We're just,
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:Anyone
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:just yapping.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:I feel like anyone listening it, it'll go into you and then you decide what the hell it is. I, the, the idea of podcasts, I understand it, but it always scares me because I'm like, I don't know what, I didn't, I don't know. I'm just talking to you with my, with my convictions.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:No, this is, it's good. It's really good. I'm, I'm so glad that you came on the show today, Josh. Thanks for being here.
josh-lane--he-him-_1_05-05-2024_134824:Thank you for having me.
jordan_1_05-05-2024_134824:Thank you for the rose. Okay, I am going