Navigating the Changing Landscape of Indie TV and Film with Director Soma Helmi

Tune in to filmmaker Soma Helmi as she discusses her journey in indie film distribution, highlighting platforms like Amoletto and Dusk that boosted her short films. Discover essential grants like the CAPE grant and how YouTube is reshaping opportunities for filmmakers to connect with audiences globally.

Explore budgeting strategies for indie films, focusing on the benefits of starting small to spark creativity and refine your unique voice. Soma shares practical tips and anecdotes about gradually scaling up budgets while minimizing financial risk.

Delve into the evolving landscape of indie TV and film distribution, from enhancing web series visibility on platforms like YouTube to navigating the festival circuit for streaming deals. Gain insights on networking, the pandemic's impact on distribution, and crafting effective business plans, all essential for aspiring filmmakers in the digital age.

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A Podcast for Indie Filmmakers

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In the world of social media, and fast-paced journalism, knowledge is abound. But with all the noise, finding the right information is near impossible. Especially if you’re a creative working in independent film.

Produced by Cinematography For Actors, the Indiewood podcast aims to fix that. This is a podcast about indie filmmakers and the many hats we wear in order to solve problems before, during, and after production.

Every month, award-winning Writer/Director Yaroslav Altunin is joined by a different guest co-host to swap hats, learn about the different aspects of the film industry, and how to implement all you learn into your work.

"We learn from indie filmmakers so we can become better filmmakers. Because we all want to be Hollywood, but first we have to be Indiewood."

Transcript

Speaker 2: 0:30

welcome back to the indie wood podcast, where we talk about indie films and how to make indie films and the many hats we have to wear in order to make those indie films. This season, uh, my guest is soma helmi. Director, writer, um winner. Winner of the blacklist, I guess, because you had a script with a co-writer on a blacklist the cape and blacklist okay, I'd love to hear more about that sure uh, and then was also a.

Speaker 2: 0:56

A fellow I get was that the right word that they use? A fellow for the paramount viewfinder program and is now going to make her first feature after seven years in Los Angeles and many more years of making commercials in Jakarta. And today we wanted to talk about distribution, because I feel like that's such a unique and nebulous thing for filmmakers coming to Los Angeles.

Speaker 1: 1:29

Soma, you had two shorts, yes, um.

Speaker 2: 1:31

Well, if you listen to the previous episode, uh, you would know that, uh, someone has done more than 20 shorts so far. Um 24, right, but two of them ended up on Amoletto and Dust.

Speaker 1: 1:46

Yes, Actually three, I think.

Speaker 2: 1:49

Three okay.

Speaker 1: 1:50

I have two that I've directed on Amoletto and then one on Dust.

Speaker 2: 1:54

We think of short films as these calling cards that don't really do anything for our career, that you can't sell or that you can't utilize, or that you can't, kind of you know, utilize beyond um, showing a producer and saying, oh, this could be a, a feature film, uh. But I think now, in the age of youtube, we have these opportunities to showcase them in a more it's monetized, just distributed fashion I know that there is a web series that I did that found success thanks to a grant.

Speaker 2: 2:25

It ended up being broadcast on TV in New York and now it's on a small streaming platform called Real Women's Network. And then Amoletto and Dust are huge, and Dust is owned by a company called Gunpowder and Sky, which was founded by former MTV executives. They've done a lot of really great shows. Which was founded by former MTV executives. They've done a lot of really great shows. If you haven't seen a film they did, prospect with, oh my God, pedro Pascal, one of the biggest stars on the planet I can't remember his name, pedro Pascal which was a really big film and it was made by these two filmmakers out of Seattle, my hometown. But what was your experience making those films? And, kind of, did you know they were going to end up on those platforms when you made them, or or no?

Speaker 1: 3:15

no, so you tell, you tell the story, I guess um, so the first one that ended up on a platform on Dust was a sci-fi short that I did a few years ago now and it was sort of a proof of concept I suppose at the time, and it was just more like I had this story written out and we, you know, as shorts come about, producer comes on and you know, the team comes together. You kind of have to work, comes together. Who are? You kind of have to work with people who are passionate about it because there's not a lot of pay and you know,

Speaker 1: 3:48

everybody has to be really into the story. Um, so it was like this passion project and it. You know, I had my favorite dp working on it and it just came out really wonderfully and and when we submitted it to dust it wasn't like a sure thing or anything like that, it was just we were quite delighted. I think, if I'm not wrong, it came about because it had gone to a festival and the programmers were at a festival and they saw it and asked for it. So, um, no, it was definitely not planned.

Speaker 1: 4:24

The the first one on the letter was black creek trail, which I directed, but I didn't write. Um, we got on there and that was. That was a kind of a female driven thriller and that again was not like a sure thing. You know, all of these we kind of just submitted. But the latest one, the full service short film that I did, was I actually got a grant for it too. I was the first one of first four recipients for the CAPE grant, brought to you by Julia Gao, and it was for women and female identifying non-binary filmmakers and I think it was. It was really interesting because I made a comedy and it's not really a festival film, so we weren't really planning a festival run for it. So when it got on omeletto it was like this is where it belongs, this is where it should be, because it's not a. You know what I mean festival film right so it's.

Speaker 1: 5:29

It's kind of this raunchy comedy um about with all indonesian cast you know so you would. We knew it wasn't going to do a festival run. So, like I said when omeleto picked it up and it's done, 600 000 views it's amazing. Six months or something. Yeah, it's done 600 000 views it's amazing, six months or something. Yeah, it's done really well there and we were like that's where it belongs.

Speaker 1: 5:47

That's where home is and that gets to be seen globally and you know I have people writing from like africa and south america that's so cool.

Speaker 2: 5:58

Your audience is so much bigger. Yeah, on youtube, you know, because you're like oh my tv, my tv shows on you peac peacock and like cool my tv shows all around the world.

Speaker 1: 6:08

Right, yeah, it's not a screen, but you know, yeah it's like 600 000 views is nothing to sniff on and kind of. We were talking about it with the team and we're like that's way more views if we did a festival than if we did a festival, right yeah and it's global. And the great thing about that is I've had inquiries from production companies straight from amaletto. Like not even they contacted, contacted me cold. Some very famous ones just said hey, saw your film on amaletto. Can we have a lunch?

Speaker 2: 6:35

you know. So it's a great avenue, but yeah, definitely not like we're making it put it on this platform I, I, I want to kind of champion those, those channels and I think there's a couple more now cropping up beyond, beyond, uh, dustin amoletto because they they feel like the right place for, for short-form content yeah I know people are trying to make kind of you know snapchat tv happen or quibi happen, or even kind of TikTok TV happen and there just isn't, I think, longevity for holding your phone in front of you and watching a piece of content that's more than 30 seconds long.

Speaker 2: 7:13

Like I know, there are people that are doing TikTok videos for six minutes and I'm like I don't have that capacity to sit on a social media platform for six minutes and watch a video. Uh, so yeah, but but there's that middle ground where it feels more traditional, like a, like a tv show, uh, on youtube but you have a dedicated audience.

Speaker 1: 7:33

Yeah, they're. They're coming there to watch a short, so you know they, they're expecting that and they do you know, and they're also a lot of like return customers. You know that coming in specifically and I think Dust and Alter is the other one it's the Dust and Alter both from Gunpowder and Sky, and Alter is their horror slash thriller ALTER ALTER. Alter.

Speaker 2: 7:55

I think, it's their horror arm Because Dust is more sci-fi.

Speaker 1: 7:58

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 7:59

The other one is horror, yeah, and then Amoledo.

Speaker 1: 8:08

Amoledo is a different, different organization. Right, it's a different organization. But they also do have sub kind of um, sub channels, sub channels, but they have the main amaletto channel. Yeah, and it's all for short form content it's all short film, really great shorts, and I think I don't know how long those platforms have been around, but I feel like it's such a great thing for indie filmmakers they've been around for about a decade.

Speaker 2: 8:25

I remember uh prospect, the film that gunpowder, gunpowder and sky did started off as a short film yeah and it was shot on the original black magic cinema camera, which was now 10 years old at the time. Now, now 10 years old, or long, more than 10 years old and so that film was shot in 2013, 2014. Oh, okay, it's been about 10 years old, or more than 10 years old, and so that film was shot in 2013, 2014.

Speaker 1: 8:45

Oh okay, it's been about 10 years yeah.

Speaker 2: 8:46

And then that ended up on dust and I think they had a deal that then brought a movie to life.

Speaker 1: 8:54

Because it is that kind of unicorn thing right when a lot of people don't believe that you can get a long film from a short. So there's two things I think. For me, making a short film is vital for any film filmmaker.

Speaker 1: 9:09

starting, I feel like you can't just, I don't want you to just jump straight into doing a feature because you're not really set up for you know success because like short short films are so much fun, they're where you learn your craft, they're where you can experiment with like low stakes. I'm I feel like I I'm not a really big proponent of like first time directors getting like 150 grand to do a short, because I feel like that's too much money. It's too much money, too much expectation like you should just be messing around in a short.

Speaker 2: 9:39

Here's the interesting said that because we just uh, my wife and I had a conversation about um this topic, and she was asked to produce a film that and they were going to spend fifty thousand dollars on it right and so we were talking about like, what's the like, what should a short film cost? Well, you know, and so long as a piece of string, yeah like that's my question to you what do you think a short film should cost, and at what point is it turning into like a really low budget feature?

Speaker 1: 10:05

That's a really good question, because I feel like there's so many answers to that, I think, for me. I've always said if it's your first and you don't really know what you're doing, the budget should be low.

Speaker 2: 10:15

Yeah, it should cost a sandwich for your you know friend who has a camera Pretty much and you're just asking for favors for all of it.

Speaker 1: 10:30

You know like I've made films zero, yeah, um, that's obviously an exaggeration, because you're.

Speaker 1: 10:32

You know, everyone has their skills and they're bringing into it, whatever, but like cup of coffee, yeah, um physical, yeah, exactly and I have you know, I think the biggest budget I've done is around 35, 40, but I think for I think, the 50 threshold yeah especially for people who are already have experience and are just wanting to just really push yeah that quality and that creativity. I feel like that's a good area to play in. But I just don't agree with I don't know first-time filmmakers. Because I don't know you want to just.

Speaker 2: 11:09

Because then you're going to waste that money.

Speaker 1: 11:11

I'm sure there are incredibly talented filmmakers who could take that money and make an incredible film. Yes, and you get your team behind you, but I don't know, I feel like it's just time to play and time to just figure out your voice. And I don't know, I feel like it's just time to play and time to just figure out your voice and you don't want to be doing that with 50k over your head like that pressure there is a lot of pressure when it comes there's, there's people you're not getting that money back.

Speaker 2: 11:32

I'm sorry, even if you do get on any kind of platforms, whatever their acquisitions are like 600, you know, you're not gonna pay that back, unless you like cut it up into like a web series and put it on and become popular and then have a youtube channel. Yeah, but even then that's still that's a long shot.

Speaker 1: 11:47

So I don't know. It's just like I always say, because I teach prep, you know, to younger or beginning filmmakers, I'm like just go out on the weekend like spend maybe a couple hundred bucks, feed people, get some you know favors in and just experiment and play and figure out what your voice is and yeah, but then, like with people who've done it a couple of times, 50k that's enough to like really I feel, like, that's the limit, because if you're going over 50k or if you're at 50k even, then I feel like you know that's a lot of money, unless you're making a lot of decisions that, and it's also if, like, if you really want to pay everybody

Speaker 1: 12:28

yeah like the minimums that's true it does shoot up very quickly. But then there's also, like all the sag laws and all that you know where you have there's like ulbs and all this, those numbers, by the way, for indie filmmakers, I think for certain limits, like you have to keep it under 20, if I'm not wrong yeah, right, I think 25 now maybe I don't know last one, I was 20, but anyway, it's like you have to put all of that into consideration, right? Where are you putting the money?

Speaker 2: 12:55

yeah, and I think when you start to have those conversations like, okay, we have this money and we're we have to spend this money in order to make what's on the page a reality at that point is like, well, is what's on the page really the short film that it needs to be? Right then you start talking about artistic kind of questions and then it becomes very, you know, subjective at that point, because some people are like oh no, I need 20 scenes, I need three locations, I need to go to Greece.

Speaker 1: 13:24

I think there's definitely limits and I think, in a certain way, having more money is probably going to be detrimental, because you're not really going to be able to learn properly, I feel like because you're not going to know your limits.

Speaker 1: 13:38

You're not going to know because you know having very like zero budget or no budget, your creativity is pushed to the limit you have to be so creative, you have to be so creative thinking outside of the box and all those kind of things, and like that's where you should be learning all these things, so that when you do end up with like a bigger project under your belt, you're not gonna lose it, you know yeah, there's so many first-time directors and filmmakers who get onto a big set and they just don't know what they're doing and it shows, because they haven't been in that like pressure bubble, where you're like oh my god, I can't shoot this in 12 hours it's gonna all go yeah, I, I, I still feel that today.

Speaker 2: 14:19

I started a new job as a technical writer for sony um and I kind of went from working as a journalist to this kind of big corporation. I had a small team of like you know five people to then now I'm, you know, one of the biggest companies in the world and I choked like I didn't, nobody knew, but I was sitting there and I was working and I kind of I was, I got into my little like workflow mode and then suddenly I could feel this, you know, like the self-doubt crept in.

Speaker 1: 14:49

Right.

Speaker 2: 14:50

I was like oh no, I'm choking. Oh no, oh no. Thankfully like I ran. I kind of rolled with the punches, but it's tough kind of if you're not prepared for those big environments.

Speaker 1: 15:00

Yeah, and you show up in those big environments yeah, like you're gonna choke yeah, and you're also literally because you're also put under spotlight right because if this is your first big job, or like if you haven't been doing whatever bunch of shorts beforehand and this is your first big thing. There's gonna be even more pressure on you because producers are all going to just keep you under a microscope, so you're not going to get as much yeah, exactly so, yeah, I think there's definitely.

Speaker 1: 15:28

There's something to just doing it scrappy and learning and figuring it out so that you can become a better problem solver because, let's face it, as a director on set, that's one of your biggest jobs it's.

Speaker 2: 15:41

It's interesting that you mentioned that because I worked with um, a cinematographer who cut their teeth doing tv. They went straight into network television from school and that's all they knew. And so when they came on to our small little project and we were really excited because this is a, you know, this is a they kind of fit a lot of the criteria that we were looking for. They were unsure of how to handle themselves in an environment where you had to be scrappy.

Speaker 1: 16:13

Right, yeah.

Speaker 2: 16:15

So if you have this, you know, knowledge base without indie film, an indie film background you show up for, without indie film an indie film background. You show up for an indie film project and you don't know how to be scrappy I think that also you get that experience as a commercial director too I can believe that because you do have to be very creative, not just, like you know, on the screen, but scheduling and all of that kind of

Speaker 2: 16:35

stuff, you do have to be very on the ball the turnaround for commercials from what I know is it's very limited is like immediate you know you've got like two days for prep and shoot and done and you're move on.

Speaker 1: 16:47

But also clients demand a lot more from your prep because you're not just going to be like here's the script and I got a shot list. You know it's not that like. A lot of times they will want a board. They like a lot of times they will want a board. They will want. You know there's like the agency board. Then you have to make a storyboard, then you have to, you know, and you have to show everything to the client. So you have to be super extra prepped and you have that one day. Sometimes maybe there's longer maybe two contingency days.

Speaker 1: 17:11

You know we're like, you got that day to get it all, so make it happen and I remember uh when I uh wrote for a website called no film school.

Speaker 2: 17:20

I was a tech editor for a couple years and we talked a little bit about brands like working with brands and how difficult it is because not only do you have the tight turnaround, but you have to really be conscientious of the color, because sometimes a brand's color is very specific yeah, you know their brand identity is very specific and they'll have a brand book that you have to follow very closely.

Speaker 2: 17:40

Yes, and that can be very tedious and you know their brand identity is very specific and they'll have a brand book that you have to follow very closely. Yes, and that can be very tedious, and you know, especially in a short turnaround time which is, I think, why commercial directors are especially um prepared to go into episodic yeah because it's a similar kind of rhythm and speed that you're going at and you're also quote unquote serving a client.

Speaker 1: 18:00

It's not your story yeah you're coming in to service that and you're coming in to honor that, but also give it a little bit of your own quote-unquote spice, you know so I think that's why commercial directors deal with that transition a lot better than indie directors in a lot of ways because, they're very much more used to working in that environment and collaborating and also but knowing they are not top dog yeah that's a lesson that I feel like a lot of indie have a trouble learning because the indie folks there, they want to, they want to show off, they want to be like look at how artistic I get right, yeah, for commercial people like no, no, we got two, two weeks to shoot.

Speaker 2: 18:38

this like prep and and shoot, let's go.

Speaker 1: 18:40

Yeah, this is the storyboard we were given. This is, what you know, our brief, and we got to follow that. Yes, we got to make it look as great as we can and whatever we want to add to it, but yeah, my partner and I wrote.

Speaker 2: 18:52

it was her kind of idea, her baby. I helped write it and I helped write it and she was starring in it, so I directed it and it ended up, you know, finding life because of a grant. And I think for people looking for support for these smaller projects, I know this is kind of the inverse of distributions, of how do you find money? You go for grants, you go for a Kickstarter, you go for your own pocket, you go for your own pocket, um, but with this grant platform, I think it opens you up for distribution a little bit, because through that grant it forced us to kind of go to new york and shoot new york, but also gave us an opportunity to then have the show broadcast in new york. So we were on new york, nyc media, nyc life. So like I had a, we had a friend call us like, oh why, why am I seeing your?

Speaker 1: 19:42

face on a taxicab our show is in.

Speaker 2: 19:44

New York. Now, yeah, and so, and through that, we we had found a home on this in a stream platform and, granted, it's not like, oh, it's not on, you know who but, it's, it's it's. We made money from it. Yeah, I mean like 20 bucks, I mean it's most shorts you's.

Speaker 1: 20:00

We made money from it. Yeah, I mean like 20 bucks. I mean still most shorts you see, or web series, you see nothing.

Speaker 2: 20:04

They don't see money at all yeah, so we're, we're excited, uh, you know, having kind of achieved that, you know that kind of success with it, because we didn't think it would go anywhere right uh, and then we had another friend who had a similar thing and this was talking to my friend.

Speaker 2: 20:18

Later on he his his thought process with everything going on was everything's cyclical. So he goes we and this was at the tail end of our web series, web series journey and we wanted to kind of have it be a bigger thing and he's like no indie tv's dead it's cyclical, because what happens is, you know, like something indie happens and blows up and the studios are like oh, that smells good, like I want, I want that, I want that money.

Speaker 2: 20:42

And then they jump in, they eat it all up and then it's done, it's become the new studio thing, and then the indie thing happens again and it's something else. It could be indie film and I think for me, you know, looking into the future, it's going to be indie film. So the next 10 years, I think indie film is going to have a resurgence. The studios are going to come back in, eat it all up and then indie tv is going to come back so what, what should people be doing before that?

Speaker 2: 21:06

you know, like, if they want to do a web series, is it back to kind of publishing on youtube, or from my experience I think so, because when, when, when, we had, uh, our show, it was kind of this like TV show for the internet, and it was on the tail end of I won't say the tail end, but all these kind of web series had success a decade prior maybe even more.

Speaker 2: 21:32

And now we were coming in like we want to do this thing, but we came in at the tail end of, I'm sorry, the new kind of cycle and our friend who just finished a web series ended up having it on Hulu, I think through a different. It was on a different platform, I forget which one, but they specifically made that web series for that platform. So they teamed up with that social media platform, I believe. And then they made I believe it was Snapchat actually and then that ended up as a web series on hulu for a while oh, that's interesting.

Speaker 1: 22:04

Yeah, so there is this kind of snapchat. Used to be one avenue exactly are they still doing?

Speaker 2: 22:09

I don't think they are episodic?

Speaker 1: 22:11

yeah, I'm not sure either. I know facebook were doing everyone tried everyone tried sort of web series, so that's interesting. If it's a cyclical thing, and I guess, yeah, there's cyclical and there's also like Bolt of Lightning right, true, there's also like did you just see the news in the last couple of days of Mark Duplass? No His show, indie show called Penelope, if I'm not wrong, just got acquired by Netflix. That's interesting In a very big and different move, because you know there was always exactly that conversation of like indie shows go nowhere.

Speaker 2: 22:50

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 22:50

I think everyone's very excited at him I'm sure especially, but so that is an interesting model. I think he has been really talking about very interesting indie models recently and disrupting, and you know distribution and all that.

Speaker 2: 23:07

Unfortunately, I don't really understand distribution I guess that's why I'm talking about it. His, uh, the duplass kind of approach to things is, you know, finding a scrappy avenue to kind of bring it back to. Uh, you know, our, our digression. It's like I remember him speaking to somebody who brought up uh, you know, oh, I have a short and I want to make this into something successful and I don't know how to fund it. And, um mark, you know, kind of poked and prodded at his, at his setup, and he's like, oh well, like you have a youtube channel here because you want to make it about this.

Speaker 2: 23:41

So he's like start your YouTube channel, gain a little bit of money, make this short boom. You already have a built-in audience. So, he thinks about film as something more than just a movie you make and then screen. It's more of like I don't want to say a lifestyle brand, but he thinks about it holistically in a way where you know it's not just a movie, it's a life, a lifestyle. Yeah, lifestyle brand.

Speaker 1: 24:03

I think that's a good I think that's where a lot of filmmakers maybe stumble me especially because I just think as far as the point of like making it and I don't know what to do with it.

Speaker 2: 24:13

That's why you need good partners you need people to, to work with you, to help you on that, because I'm the same way I I hate producing oh, yeah, and so I want to make a movie and I don't know what to do or I don't want to do anything.

Speaker 1: 24:25

Well, and then you have a movie and you're like I don't know what to do with it.

Speaker 2: 24:28

I'm not sure, yeah so for a web series, for, like independent stuff, there's this kind of avenue to take that it could end up on on a streaming platform. But it does require you to kind of, you know, make it have it be a success, even on its own platform, through YouTube or through Vimeo or, you know, through a festival, because when we were in our festival run for Stupid Cupid, there were a bunch of other web series that really had a lot of success too.

Speaker 2: 24:57

Some from out of Australia, which were great and you know they found a home in australia there's also those um like hbo visionaries yeah which hosts the, the shorts on hbo.

Speaker 1: 25:09

So there's different ways, I guess, to go about it.

Speaker 2: 25:13

Yeah, for sure and and just to kind of talk more about streaming, I think I know this is kind of a bigger, bigger project projects, but uh, two big filmmakers created their own kind of shorts thing. Uh, david fincher supported uh, love, death and robots, which is an anthology series which is more vfx animation and then uh, neil blomkamp I know who you're talking about, but yeah uh, the director of District 9, elysium, a bunch of other films created Oats Studios, which was his kind of testing ground for short film content in the digital space as well, but there's some live action stuff in there and so like those are shorts yeah, you know those.

Speaker 2: 25:52

They're on Netflix, they're on YouTube, they're all over the place. I think Oats is on on Netflix now. Oh sorry, oats Studios is on Netflix as well, but there is this outlet. But I think we have to stop treating that series as short-form content and more about as the giant product as a whole. When you look at an anthology series, it's not really the individual episodes.

Speaker 1: 26:14

Right.

Speaker 2: 26:15

It's kind of the bigger picture, the bigger project, the bigger thing, and I think if we treat them as features, the dynamic changes, the conversation, changes, yeah, yeah and and I think that's a good way segue to talk about features and and and kind of distribution for features teach me, and so you have your first feature coming up yes, we can't talk about, we can sort of and and for. For me, my experience with features has always been kind of with screenwriting.

Speaker 1: 26:42

Right.

Speaker 2: 26:42

And pre-pandemic I was very close to a deal with. I had a script that was shopped or under a shopping agreement with a big production company. We were talking to a comic book production company for adapting my script into an origin story for a character under that brand, and then the pandemic happened, um and so my entry into kind of or not my entry, but my, my path towards distribution, I think, always comes down to networking sure and then finding my, my niche as well, because I I in the beginning was all over the place.

Speaker 2: 27:24

I was like I can write whatever you want, just give me a job. And I had to stop treating it like a job, but also treating it like a job.

Speaker 2: 27:33

So I'd wake up go to work and write, but I couldn't go to somebody and be like this is my job, give me a job. I had to treat it like it was a friendship as a network, as I had to treat it like as a friendship, as a network, as a networking thing, as a friendship thing, and so my experience has always been you find distribution through these partners, your production companies, through you know even commercial production companies, because sometimes they would want to venture out into a feature films as well. I one of the plans I had for a short film was let me plan this out, beat it out, have a good kind of business plan and then approach production companies that do only commercials and then see if they wanted to fund it for a micro budget feature.

Speaker 2: 28:13

So, um, getting kind of set up at something is kind of the first step, and then the second step is a little out of my hands, because it's then, you know, their responsibility to take it to a studio or take it to a streamer and I think nowadays a lot of companies are tied to streamers. They won't put anything in production. Uh, feature wise unless it's already going somewhere, right, so?

Speaker 2: 28:36

um, me talking to some folks now. They're like cool, we know the producers of you know this horror franchise like what do you got? And I pitched them something. They're like we love this idea, right, a synopsis, I mean it's that.

Speaker 2: 28:49

And so they already have like a production team in mind who already have distribution routes right so, like as a writer and a creator, it's like oh, it's a little bit easier because you don't have to think about it. But then, as someone who's crafting a film from scratch, and then you're like I finished a film, what do I do?

Speaker 1: 29:08

oh, which is interesting because I in the last I guess the the first half of this year. What I was hearing a lot of was people just saying just go make the movie yeah just you know, everything is a mess yeah go indie, go make your movie, and then there's all this demand for content, etc. Etc.

Speaker 2: 29:28

So I I heard the opposite of that, where everyone's like go, just go make the movie, because you're not gonna get it made yeah so, but that's like saying, oh, just go write the screenplay, except for you have to spend a hundred thousand dollars, two hundred thousand dollars on the script yeah, the risk is you can write the screenplay, but is there someone to buy it?

Speaker 2: 29:48

Even if there's demand, I think there's always a risk of it being good. I know we all believe in our craft and our passion for stuff. But sometimes you make something and it's fine, you've lived with it, you had a good time with it and you, you know you're letting it go into the world. But then everyone's like cool, I don't want that. You know, I don't want to put that on my platform. So there's always that risk because you can't just make it. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 30:16

Because I think a lot of people were shy about doing that. And then we're, just like in the last six months, just told if you really want to get it made, you just gotta make it yourself, you know, and you're just like suddenly have a film on your hands and you've spent hundreds of thousands exactly like please take this, like I'll give you a ten thousand dollars for it.

Speaker 2: 30:35

You're like. But so what? This?

Speaker 1: 30:37

is my question for you. Like, I don't know if you know about this process at all, but what if, for example, you have a film and you went out and shot it and now you have this feature that you love yeah, what do you do with?

Speaker 2: 30:49

it. So remember that analogy about the treehouse and how in the corporate america you climb the ladder and in film there's no ladder, and sometimes in the treehouse, um, I guess it's that it's like however you can, you know, you know, there's there's. There's people that I know who've self-released a film.

Speaker 2: 31:06

They've taken it on tour where they'll rent out movie theaters promote it themselves and then go across America and they'll make their money back for a low budget feature and then through that process they'll, you know um, get a theatrical release or a limited theatrical release, or get it on Hulu or Netflix. You know, sometimes you can go to a film market, you know, can AFM here in Los Angeles and then Palm Springs International Film Market, I believe Maybe there's one in Venice too. They're everywhere.

Speaker 2: 31:37

Take it there, like I have a movie and they'll be like cool, give me two more and I'll buy all three, you know, or whatever. Cool, give me two more and I'll buy all three, you know, or whatever. So there's these uh places where you can sell a film or you can kind of use it to make money or even kind of do your own self self-release on itunes or amazon prime. But the answer is, it's always changing yeah and, uh, it's nebulous and it's. However you can, you know.

Speaker 1: 32:02

Yeah, because I've had friends who have done that.

Speaker 2: 32:04

The amazon prime, yeah, and itunes kind of self-publishing route, and it's so interesting because I feel like the amazon one especially is such a wild west yeah because you can get nothing, everything exactly yeah, yeah and one thing I'll say is I remember I was an intern for a big production company who just just won an oscar for a film and I handled their review process for, um, their like film distribution. So they also handle distribution. And I'm not saying that like they gave me all their films because you know they don't want to watch them and they just made their intern do it, but I was kind of the first wall of defense, uh. And so what you could do is just call a production company like hi, we have a film, we made it won a festival like do you want to watch it?

Speaker 2: 32:54

and distribute it and and as long as it fits their niche and their kind of mandate right, why not?

Speaker 1: 33:00

yeah, what do?

Speaker 2: 33:00

you have to lose yeah, well, that's.

Speaker 1: 33:02

I feel like that's the attitude a lot of people have, right? What are you gonna lose? Yeah?

Speaker 2: 33:05

as long as you're not like being kind of that weird network, you're like, let me give me something for whatever you know uh what do you got to? Lose. I, my partner recently, is producing a film and they wanted to shoot on film. They're like, let's just call kodak and they did. And they're like we want film kod're like let's just call Kodak and they did, and they're like we want film and Kodak's like cool, we have short ends.

Speaker 1: 33:25

We'll sell them to you for like a third of the price.

Speaker 2: 33:27

Amazing they're shooting on film now. There you go, Give it a go Well so distribution is tricky because it's like having a career in film it's always changing. It'll, I think, for some projects or for some things for a little bit, but it's always going to be a nebulous thing and I hope your work continues to find a home and I hope people find homes for their work so we can watch it and tell them how cool it is thank you for coming on and we'll see you next week.

Speaker 2: 34:00

Everybody take care appreciate it thank you for listening to the IndieWood podcast. You can find us on anywhere you find your podcasts and on Instagram at IndieWoodPod. See you next time from the CFA Network.

Speaker 3: 34:12

Cinematography for Actors is bridging the gap through education and community building. Find out about us and listen to our other podcast at cinematographyforactorscom. Cinematography for Actors Institute is a 501c3 nonprofit. For more information on fiscal sponsorship donations because we're tax exempt now, so it's a tax write-off and upcoming education, you can email us at contact at cinematographyforactorscom. Thanks.