Episode 2: Lala Kent from "Vanderpump Rules"

Reality TV Producer Jenny and therapist Sam return to break down a controversial figure from the Bravo-verse: Lala Kent from Vanderpump Rules. She's been getting a lot of hate online for breaking the 4th wall and "producing" too much. Is she good on the show? Does the show need her? We break it all down! 

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Transcript

nknown: Welcome back to Unhinged and on Camera. This is our second episode. Here we go. Thank you, everyone, for, listening to our first episode. We still like working out the kinks, but I got a lot of great feedback, a lot of great requests. And so our first episode was on Lindsay Hubbard from Summer House. And weirdly, a lot of the things that we talked about ended up playing out in the episode that aired the day we posted, which was Carl asking Lindsay for a softer approach. Did he get it? No, he did not. And then the PowerPoint came up, too. Well, they keep asking each other to be people. They aren't. Right. Like even you said, I think last time we spoke was like, I think Lindsay would benefit from being more soft. And I was like, no. why should she be soft? why should she be something that she's not? You know, I think there's a difference between vulnerability and softness. And I think when he says, I want you to be soft with me, it feels like when men on the street get mad at women for not smiling like this expectation that women are supposed to show up a certain way. But then what's on offer is that Lindsay holds the same expectation of Karl, why aren't you showing up as like a man who works, who plans, who can be this kind of guy? And like, I don't think that's the kind of guy he is. So I don't know if that's really fair for her to ask that up. No, totally. And I think when your partner is saying hey, I'm trying to build, you know, a career and I need some support right now, I think that I think his approach of saying, can you be soft was probably not the right approach, but it is like what he wants. So it's interesting. It came up in our conversation because I sense that's what he wants, right? But yeah, it didn't didn't go down well. And then when he brought up the PowerPoint, I my jaw dropped. I have had my husband ask me once like, do I need a pet? New ideas? And I was like, kind of yes. Like, I know what's interesting about Lindsay is that she and we were talking about this a little later afterwards, like she is such a parented child. And as per edified children, we don't feel like we're allowed to fail. We're not allowed to take risks. We have to, kind of go on these safe routes of what we know is going to keep us in a sense of like stability and a sense of security. And so, Carl, being like, let me start a sober bar and her being like like, no, that's a terrible idea. It's not coming, I think, from her, from a place of I want to reject your idea. It's coming from this place of like, no, we don't get to fuck up and fail because I never get to fuck up and fail. Oh, totally. Because I actually thought the sober bar idea was a good idea. I mean, especially now lay there, I really think. And this is a girl maybe not in New York. Yeah. I mean, it's kind of a big thing in L.A. and actually where Carl interviewed with Boston on I think is a place. And yeah, it like it sells like nonalcoholic and I've been there when I was trying to do my sober January that I don't even think I succeeded. But anyways, so I actually think Carl would do really well in L.A. and this is going to transition us into our subject of the day, which is Lala Kent from Vanderpump rules that are person this week. And I actually think Carl and Lala would be a chaotic couple that I'd love to watch, but I'm getting into Lala Kent. I had a friend recently and I was telling Sam about was like, so I mean, just the vitriol of Vanderpump Rules, it's feral. Like the fans. We scannable rotted our brains. We are unwell. Like, I don't I can't even tell you how many arguments I've gotten. I and I never looked at Instagram so much since Scannable happened, I was addicted to my Instagram from the moment that happened to maybe even presently. Yeah. I mean, it's every day and I just think like, there's just so much to get into with Lala, but It really is triggering something in the fanbase right now because I had a friend who was like, I can't even look at her face, I just hate her so much. And the hypocrisy of it all. And I totally agree that she's been a hypocrite But at the same time, I'm she admitting to it. So I'm like, okay, well, she admitted to it. Let's just move on. Right. She knows a. Well, it's sort of like if you admit to it, but keep doing it. What is like what are you really admitting to that? Like you're just admitting to that like you don't care about being an authentic. It feels like that. I think that's the disconnect people feel with her. It's like, okay, she has a she does have a strong level of like self awareness, but then she chooses to like not care. And I think that's really it feels very disingenuous. It feels very inauthentic. And I think that's where people like we come to reality TV because we want entertainment, but like also we want to feel like we're being entertained in some like baseline, authentic way, which is why like the beginning of is such like fascinating, amazing, entertaining television is because none of them, like, they were all young, they were all stupid, they all were desperate to be famous. And so they were going to just, like be their chaotic selves without worrying about like what story or how they looked or what fans were perceiving them as. And they've lost the plot of that like very much. And I think that's what's making people feel like disconnected from VR and like especially like I feel like scannable kind of saved it because it went back a little bit to those roots. But now we're seeing like, oh, like we are too far away. Like all these people are too aware of their need to create story and their need to create certain type of television that like there's no authentic friendships to feel connected to as viewers. Yeah. So we want to jump into the recap of like Lawless Story, because I think this will inform a lot of what we're talking about, because it's interesting, Lola doesn't join the show till it's season four, which I just thought was really late in the game. She actually joined the same season as Britney, which I mean, the show is already established and friendships are established. she kind of comes on and, you know, one of the original reality shows that sort of established a lot of the rules in the game was The Hills and you know, was a big reveal that people were being cast in. It was real. You know, it wasn't just a reality show where people were just generally meeting each other. So when Lala comes on the Vanderpump rules, to me it was very much like she was cast. They brought her on. They were like, We need a new a hot girl. She comes on as a hostess and yeah, she's just a new girl at Sur. Also, a couple of them weren't working at Sur anymore, so I think they were like, We got to keep the serve it all going. So let's bring on some new people working there. And the first season, she's just she comes in hot and literally and figuratively, she it is very hot, a very hot and very intense with the hotness because she like her profile picture, Sheena and Katie are weirdly in a good place that season and they're looking at her naked but as her profile picture on Instagram and basically talking about she's probably going to Italy as an escort, I have a lot of like thoughts and feelings towards Lala and her sexuality. I think the fact that we know she comes from Utah and comes from like what is likely a majority Mormon community and and it's similar to Katie and I it's interesting that they have similar like defensive strategies and come from this kind of specific place because we see this play out a little bit on Salt Lake City, the housewives of Salt Lake City, like the way that like Mormon community can like become about moral superiority and where better than you because of our faith, because of our beliefs, we're more superior. And it makes me think like how that's affected Lola's experience with her sexuality. I think she wants to own it in such like a feminist way of like, this is my body. I am allowed to do what I want with my body. My sexuality is mine to decide what to do with and like. I fully support that. But then I think she is very easily triggered by other people's feedback towards it and we see where she gets really defensive and shuts down and kind of flees. And it makes me think about like coming from this Mormon community where I imagine like her sexuality was shut down a lot or criticized a lot or judged a lot. And then she comes on this show thinking like, I'm going to get a lot of positive feedback. I'm in L.A., things are free here. These, you know, we're of a certain age where sexuality should be something that's like fun and playful and getting attention and positive feedback. Oh, yeah. She's basically has all this judgment from from Katie, from Sina, from and maybe everyone but Arianna coasts, which is interesting because Arianna has her own experience with her body that she talks about with. Yeah, I just have a lot of, like, feelings that come up in me around her sex. Duality in this like dynamic between where she wants to be sexually free, and yet there still feels like there's there's part of her that, is very easily triggered into some sort of, shame and judgment. Yeah, you know, she comes on and she's basically like pro casting couch. she's like, I'm going to go and I'm going to be with these rich guys and I'm going to. And no shame in this game. I mean, like. And maybe they almost cast are we want that classic L.A. girl who's just going to do, you know, use whatever skills. Well, she was meant to ruffle feathers. Like, I think they wanted to bring her in to ruffle some feathers. Yeah, definitely. And, you know, this Italy trip comes off that she's going to go to Italy. She first says that it's for modeling and then it turns out she's just being, you know, sort of arm candy for these rich guys. And that's where we see the shame. Right? Like, she can't just admit, I'm going to, get a free trip to Italy. I feel like she moves into a little more when she talks about VJs for PJ or whatever. Like it's this back and forth between I want to own this part of me and I feel like very I need to shame it and shut down on 80 to like protect against it. Which is interesting because when Sheena and Katie come to like confront her about this supposed lie about whether it was a modeling trip or not, the conversation is is very fast and very awkward and feels almost acting. I don't think that they were acting. I think that that's you. But I can also pick out when the producers were like, go confront her right now. And then they have this awkward conversation. But then it gets kind of real because she disappears. She doesn't go on this Italy trip. She comes back, tells Lisa Vanderpump that they were bullying her and that she had to go run to her mom because she was so upset about it. But it's like, but, girl, you put it out there, but like, don't we see like a little baby Lola in that, little baby Lauren in her, Utah school? And all the girls being like, we're better than you because we love Jesus or whatever, sort of like more mini narratives there are. And her feeling like anxiety. She doesn't fit. there's this huge part of her that wants to, like, be something. And I think this is also another disconnect we feel with La La, where it's like she's trying on all these personalities, how big she knows who she is. so she like was like, I am someone who owns their sexuality, And then it gets rejected. And her first instinct is run home to mommy, where I'm going to get, like, acceptance and praise. And I think we see that play out even now where it's like her core people are only her. Yes. People, her mom, her brother, her assistant, Jess Cena. Now, because, you know, it's like we'll be a yes person if you're on her side. But like, that's what you that's why her and Katie get so fractured because Katie's not a yes person. Well, it's interesting because even early on, I'm like, I see la la as an agent of production. She was cast on the show. She was, you know, cause to stir the pot. You know, they go to Hawaii, she takes her top off in front of everyone for no reason, even though nobody else as they're top off, it upsets everyone. You know, she's stirring things up, but the guy is trying to hit on Jax even when he's dating Britney, you know, getting with James, even though he's still kind of dating Kristen an agent of production, but she's still a person who's trying to, like, fit into the show, which means she's trying to fit into some sort of identity and friendship. Mm hmm. Yeah, there's definitely this push pull between, who am I versus who does everyone want me to be? So then getting into the next season, her and James, it's sort of her and James is this which Randall season? No, it is when Randall comes into play, but it's all very behind the scenes. I think Katie is the only one who calls her out on like we don't talk about you marrying a, you know, being with a married rich guy for Range Rover or whatever. But she does like talk about later seasons where she kind of discloses how they got together and everything. But the Randall of it all is really hard to follow because she's keeping it so under wraps. So the chest. Yeah. And it's she's never authentically sharing her life like even like go back to the Italy trip. Like authentically just be like, hey, I'm going on high. And I'm like, I wish I could be that hot that someone would want to take me to Italy for free. Like, come on, I would show my ass for that any day. There is no shame and you know, get that making those choices. Yeah. Like if you're consenting to it, like, what's wrong with it? Yeah, definitely. And so season five, I feel like La La came in. Like, if I'm not going to be friends with these girls, I'm going to be the villain because her strong villain energy, yeah. They come in and they criticize all everyone for not working on their summer bodies or whatever, which kind of goes against like everything she's trying to stand for with her body. Yeah. No, it was so calculated and they were just drinking way too much and they were a disaster. I actually don't have that much to say about that season. She quits mid-season and just like goes that where she like, it's Ariana's birthday and she, like, doesn't show up. Yes. And it was very strange. Ariana has this conversation. Like you kind of just sent me a text and she quits with Lisa and she leaves. I'm pretty sure that was all related to Rand, you know, doesn't matter because we didn't see it. So it's like you're giving us nothing to work with. You're not even giving us anything. Like even if you went with Rande and like or like, I don't know, like, we can at least connect with some genuine piece of, like, your story. Yeah. And it's tough to with la la because I feel like, okay, if this was a regular guy, not Rande, who has this company, who was going to give her, you know, her acting debut in a Range Rover, and yet it you know, all of that. I mean, would she have left the show for him? Like it never felt it was for love. It felt like it was strategic. It was like, okay, I have this opportunity and Vanderpump Rules and I have this opportunity to be in movies. And I'm going to take the movies for now. And then I'll keep Vanderpump Rules in the backburner because she ends up coming back the next season and sort of juggling balls. But I don't think if it was just a normal guy who worked in finance and was like, I love you and you love me, and I just I can't have you on this reality show. Like the way what happened with Stassi and Patrick. I just don't see that she would have left the show for that. She it was a business decision as much as it was, but that's the thing. Like, we never get enough of her relationship with Ryan to fully understand it. Like, that's the frustration, I think, and it's ironic and we just don't know what to believe with her about her situation with Ryan. Like she wants us all to believe that, she didn't know he was a certain type of guy. But it's also like you're not giving us enough of your story for us to believe that. And kind of like Erika Jayne, she comes in I'm smarter than everyone and I know things, but then, you know, you know, flash forward to everything coming out about rande. I had my head in the sand. I didn't know. And it's like it's the math. Is it mapping here, right? Like you're either too smart and can outsmart everyone or you don't know, but you can't be both. And I'm sorry you could have your head in the sand, but usually you put your head in the sand because you know something. And so, like, you knew something and you knew you were a mistress. You knew he was the casting couch guy. And it feels like people would treat her better around these things if it felt like she was being more honest and authentic with it. And then she's mad that, like, Ariana's getting love, but we don't connect with you. We don't know your story, you know, what are we supposed to, give you support around? Yeah. And I think where the hypocrisy comes in is you can't be pro casting couch and then get mad that you didn't know that he was acting casting couch? Yeah. You knew you were on the casting couch. He gave you a Range Rover of the first time you guys hooked up. Like, that's wild. But again, I am jealous. Like, I will take a free trip to Italy and Range Rover. Yeah. You know, if I wanted to be an actress, I might have gotten on the casting couch. I mean. Well, the casting couch is an interesting thing because it's like something about consent and power that is very fucking blurry. Oh, yeah, definitely. Because, I mean, I'm sure a lot of women were like, okay, you know, like, la la la, I think la la gives a nuanced perspective and I actually wish she had just owned that of because her perspective is like, I came to L.A. to make it. I'm from Utah. You know, I'm this is a this is a, you know, skill I have like I'm hot. I can use my body to get things that I want and I'm going to because that's like something I know is effective. Like, I don't know, again, I. Wish I had a body that could get me things. why not only in a truthful way that like really empowers feminism as opposed to like this partial shame and then shaming other women if their bodies aren't as sexual or aren't as overtly sexual as yours or seen within the like socialized ideas of what sexuality should look like. And again, she's like young at the beginning, I guess, like, you know, she is, I think trying on different personalities to see like you said, she kind of came in, I'm going to be a villain But in being a villain, like you're not a fun TV villain, you now just look like a shitty person. That's why I'm struggling with her because sometimes, you know, even though summer bodies comment, I felt very calculated and like for the show it like it's hard to analyze her as a person when sometimes I feel like a lot of the things she does right. We don't know her. Yeah. She's trying to get that soundbite. She wants she wants to be in the trailer. She wants to be in next week's episode saying a mean thing. And if she's got some good what Bambi eyed bitch, I could still be in too. I know. And she is good at it. Like she is a professional reality star. And you have to say, like, but I don't know. I don't know. I think she's too professional. Well, we'll get into that. So she should just be like a lifetime actress, like maybe she could go the Lisa Rinna route. A lot of these Denise Richards now is on Lifetime. So Season six, she comes back and gets her job back as a hostess. She's like in with all the girls again she's really tell you would stop because I think she replaced Stassi in her old apartment. Who Stassi. But let's skip to season seven I think. Yeah. See that's like where thing we start to see a little bit more of her I feel like with her dad dying. Yeah. So her dad dies. There's a great scene with Stassi where they go to solving and she talks about her dad dying and that's probably the most vulnerable I've ever seen her really talk about her personal issues. She also stopped drinking because she's, really struggling with her dad's death, right? let's make that connection where she isn't drinking and now we're able to see a little bit more of her. Yeah. And at some point, her and Rand break up because when she goes to solving, they had agreed they weren't going to drink together. And then Rand does like just a bender without her and she shows up and she seemed like the house is trash and he just drank the whole time and she couldn't believe like she was in wine country, specifically not drinking to hold up her end of the bargain with him. And he just went on a bender. But it's we don't get too much of that story. Again, we only get like 10% of her stories with Rand. But we know he took back the Gucci slides and that upset her the most. And she I think, again, she's so like there's such a superficiality to this relationship. It's like she got back with him to get the slides back. Did she give out to them because she actually like loves and cares about him? Like, I don't think so. And the first thing she talks about is, okay, he pays my rent, but I can pay my rent and this and that and the other. I could just buy myself a regular car. It's like the first thing is like, Oh, I'm losing my life partner and how do I figure that out? It's like he is supporting her life and it can she even survive that. So, you know, she could like she doesn't want to write like there's a part of her at that time that's I don't want to pay my own bills. Like, that would suck. I know. And I'm like, I wish she would have been honest about that. Like, yeah, which I mean, it is nice to be a couch woman. I would love to be a capital man. But when you when you see her talking now about how I have my own business, I have to pay my bills after taking my children as she throws it at everyone. Like, it's like a badge of honor. And it's like, are like nobody else is doing that. Like, nobody else is paying their bills. Okay, maybe not all of them have children, but they still have bills. They may have families they take care of. They may have like other things. Like it's such this assumption that her play is more important than anyone else's, So there's this one day at Sur where she loses her full mind. And it was hard to even follow because I guess her and Billy were fighting this one. Where she's in the J.Lo dress. Yeah, she's in the J.Lo dress. So Lala and Billie get into this whole fight about another fight that they had gotten into. Billy also feels like a very strong agent of production, and they were like, Okay, let's bring on someone in It's adversity. Hire a diversity hire. Let's bring her on. She's a hostess as well, because I guess all new people need to start out at Hostess and And basically, I don't even know what they're fighting about. They're just fighting about that. Billie thinks like Bake Living's thinks Billie Holiday. And I think Billie was upset that she came to the brunch first. I can't remember exactly what's going down. You did the rewatch more than I did, but I remember it was like something about her brunch, right? Like she's having this brunch. What is Lala doing here? Oh, no. Lala got into the big fight with Raquel. Rachel. Well, the fight with Billie happens first, I think. Well, was working, though. I think Billie just pulls our side and is like, let's discuss this other fight we had because I haven't had a lot of air time in a while. Your producer, mine, Canela, any of this be authentic? I mean, I'm sorry, but a lot of it isn't, though. And I mean, the fight with Helen, Billie, especially at this point, we're like seven seasons and no. And I mean, as a reality TV producer, it's just so clear when you're watching a scene and you're like, Oh, they're they're making this happen versus this is happening. And sometimes it blends like sometimes it's they're making it happening in the half way. That's what I real like. So if very much feels like they're like, it's time for us to square off. But Lala actually turns like Billie is right. She loses her damn mind. Yeah, Billie well she goes into she's clearly in grief and she's sober, right. Is this one. She's still sober. She's not drinking I don't think, during this day. And so like I imagine alcohol would have been something I think, you know, substances in general can do one of two things. It can either, like numb an emotion or make it more extreme. But I think she is really going into the depths of whatever grief, emotion she is feeling. And there's probably a huge insecurity around like being filmed around like how she's being perceived by the cast, how she's being perceived by the audience. And yeah, it makes sense that she kind of, like, loses her mind in this moment. Yeah. And Britney pulls her aside and to just let her rant because she's really ranting and she's like, I am better than everyone else, you know, Billy. Billy thinks I'm acting like I'm better than everyone else. Well, it turns out I am better than everyone else. And Britney is like, I know what she's saying is crazy, but it's it's too much to corrector right now. I'm just going to let her go and then Lala loses it on Raquel because Raquel's somehow looped in on this. They had always had this weird dynamic where it was like the three, it was la la Raquel and James in this sort of I bet Raquel is very similar to those YouTube almond girls. I mean, she went into the dark side when she had that affair. I'll tell you that much. And she has. But she kind of has that vibe. Like, she's just, like, quiet. Like, it's just kind of like ignorance is bliss sort of thing. Like she always in the beginning, she always just seems so, like, like, not connected to the same reality we were all connected to. it seemed like, I think people were thinking of it like she's dumb, but I think that, her reality was just so different than ours. Oh, yeah. I mean, I think Sheena talks on her podcast about how Raquel would rehearse lines and things she wanted to say and like the reason she would show up to reunions very differently than scenes, because she would she would play out the reunion, what she wanted to say, and she would have a time to really, like have that moment. And on this show, she would struggle with that. And Lala kind of calls her out in one of those later that last season where she's like, you're are you spinning out because the rehearsed lines you have in your mind aren't working on me because I'm actually reacting and saying something back, and you didn't expect me to say what I was like. And Raquel is very much like this. And this is when she spouts off for her being a Bambi eyed bitch. But also, you know, I have to say, when you look at Billie, Raquel and Lala like that, that whole fight, none of these people are original cast. They're all trying to earn their spot. They're all trying to make a moment happen. And I will say, you have to give Lala credit. She she is a professional reality star. Like she's really good. She comes in with her Bambi eyed bitch. It's authentic, it's real. She's in her face. Like for someone coming in and giving fights like Lala gives, you know? Is it always real to me? Definitely not. But she delivers. I mean more. She did, Billie. I don't know. I disagree currently, but I see I can see what you're saying in that moment. But I also think what felt what you're connecting to in that moment that feels like, okay, this is a produce scene. She is showing up as a good reality star, making the sound point by like doing the things she needs to do. And there is this real grief she's going through. So we're able to connect with like, oh, this anger is just like from nowhere. Like, this is her emotional expression of something deeper that's happening for her that we can connect with with her, that when she comes in and she's like my livelihood, my brands of what she gets over, like, I don't connect with this like this. you're just telling me that all you care about is being produced. You don't care about I think why that felt so important is that there is a deeper vulnerability that was happening at that time. Yeah. And Ariana calls this out in kind of a harsh way, but I guess it's justified. Ariana's like, Well, no one gave me a pass when my dad died, and she needs to realize no one's going to give her a pass either and she needs to stop. Which was one of the strongest things from Ariana. Ariana usually plays devil's advocate and is very in the middle. So I was, you know, surprised that she but I think it came from, you know, Ariana being kind of bitter, like, why is everyone letting Lala go crazy? When my dad died, you know, Kristen was trying to, like, emotionally murder me, and no one stood up for me and look at the role reversal. It's playing out with them now. I know so and it's interesting because now I think Lala thinks she's doing the same thing for Ariana by telling her, like, you need to confront you need to cope with this. But the problem is what Lala is doing is different because Lala is trying to tell Ariana how she should feel and how she should be processing her emotions. Where Ariana was telling Lala like the things that she can and can't expect from others. Well, I think in some ways, Lala, what I mean, she's talked about this and I do kind of understand where she's coming from that she was like, Listen, I've been through this with Rande. I had my angry period. I had that. None of it benefited me. So I just wanted to give. But you can't tell people how to move through their emotions. And it's not that she's just trying to give Ariana. She is holding a strong expectation of how Ariana should be coping and how she should be. Right. Like there is this projection of like, well, I know how all this goes. So like, why aren't you on the same timeline as me? Why haven't you processed your emotions in the same, like at the same and b at the same point as I am now, even though these are like completely different situations? Well, but I think if she had a better relationship with Ariana, it would have come off that way because there was times during the season when I felt like they well, she had a better relationship with Ariana. She probably wouldn't hold the expectation that she'd be healed or have a relationship with Sandoval. Oh, I don't think that I was expecting that from her. I think she was just expecting like it's, you know. No, I think that you expecting her to forgive her and let the show go on. Like the only way the show can go on is if you to heal in some way and Ariana's like, no, I don't want to heal with this guy. Like not going to happen. Yeah. I mean, okay, so let's just jump into. The scandal of all because she joins our RIAA. Nothing really happens. Season nine she has ocean. She breaks up with Rand and all of that is mostly off camera. Again, we can't connect to it because we don't actually see it. Yeah, she she filming did not pick up for that. I know. Right. And then season ten, she has a great scene with Lisa where she admits, oh, I didn't know that I was the other woman, all these things. And it just rings so hollow and you're like, okay, thanks for admitting something we all knew many years ago. But yeah, I think that's forced vulnerability. Like, it doesn't feel authentic. It feels like I am going to be vulnerable. It's kind of like Erica. there's such connections between Lala and Erica and. And their experience in their relationship of what they knew and what they didn't know and how little they showed us. So how hard it is to believe that they were as dumb as they want us to believe they were? No, totally. And she is very. Erika Jayne ask, but I have to say so during the whole skin of all of it all, Lala was the one who called it out from the beginning. And also, well, that makes sense. And she knows she's been the other woman. She knows that well. I mean, you know, also, there's a lot of insider baseball that she knows with that. Yeah, well, it's interesting, too, because Lala pulls Arianna aside and at TomTom and says, hey, you know, when you called Tom to say your grandmother died, we were all at a party and I watched him lie to you and say that he had no way to get home. And that was a lie. And I want you to know that. And I think she came in a very, you know, friend way, and you can just see the wheels in Arianna's mind turn. And she's like, I'm not filming this. You know, she totally shut it down. You know, they edited some of it. But it was just very clear to me that she turned to the producer and she's like, I don't know what's happening or why Lala's coming at me with this information, but I will not film negatively about Tom and it's actually one of well, that's like a different producer agreement that she and Tom have that like she needs to take some accountability for, which is valid. Yeah, I think I think that's the place that we can all be critical of. Ariana is around like where she had a role in contributing to the dynamic between her and Tom that manifested in this huge carnival. Yeah. And I mean, she really shuts things down in a way that's actually harmful to her. And I think it's as part of the show, you know, that's how she's, you know, survived is by saying there are certain things I won't touch. And, you know, in some ways that is healthy. I mean, if you want to have like look at Stassi and Beau, their relationship is so much better off the show because, you know, they have a healthy relationship. You shouldn't air out all your dirty laundry. I mean, they're healthy people probably individually off the show. Oh, yeah. Isn't this pressure to create drama or toxicity in order to get a paycheck? I know. And Vanderpump Rules is especially that because that's what the whole show was founded on was friends doing dumb things so by and then Lala sort of calls her out and that causes actually a huge distance between Lala and Ariana at the rest of that season. But then Lala comes into the reunion and honestly, a lot of that felt like you had you have no stake in this. Why are you the one the most mad? I feel like Katie was was justified in being as mad as I was, you know, and she really was more mad. She had way more justification. Oh, yeah. And, like, Lala was so nasty to Katie. Yeah. And not only that, she was caught up in the whole ritual of it all. Like, there was so much for Katie to be upset about, and she handled herself, you know, pretty well. And Lala was just losing, and it was like for why? okay, you can say, was it latent things about brand? Maybe. But then again, we're not like hearing that. Like she's just like calling him a narcissist and saying how she knows narcissism, I don't think we've ever seen her really reckon with her role other than that one scene with Lisa. And I think if she's going to call Ariana out for her, you know, why don't you own some of this? Like, why don't you own some more of what is happening with brand? Like you caused this whole situation. You know, you go out with a guy who is casting couch guy and then you got mad that you were casting couch girl. Like, that's the hypocrisy, right? But in her mind, she doesn't think that that happened, which is interesting. So why don't we see a therapy scene with in her mind or in her like, character? I wonder what's really in her mind because I think who she is and what she knows about herself is different than what we see on the show or what she'll ever let us even see in her podcast or all these different ways. I know we were talking about like la la talks too much and she comes her. A worst enemy by giving too much commentary on all of this. Oh, yeah. And yeah, I think I wrote Virgo Energy because we actually, me and Lala have the same birthday, the exact same birthday, and we're both Virgos. So I think there is an energy and James have the same birthday. So that is amazing or why we go with good James Kennedy So, yeah, I. I think she has a Virgo energy of, wanting to do good and, be organized. And, you see that in her branding. she, she does have a very successful podcast. You know, she had this makeup line, you know, even when she was working with Rand, you could tell they were sort of together in making these movies or doing these things. And she liked that. He put her on that equal level with him, although obviously there was a lot she didn't know was going on. Right. They used to do the podcast together and when they were doing it together, they used to get like kind of good guests because I think Rand had access. Like, I think they had. What's his name? Britney Spears ex-husband. Oh, yeah. And they had Machine Gun Kelly and making. Yeah, Machine Gun and now I don't think she now I don't think she like has just like Heather McDonald. Yeah. And then her I think her brother and assistant are the they, they host it with her. Her. Yes. Yeah. I mean I'm personally a big fan of Xena's podcast. Another person respectfully, I have all day for Katie. I have not even listened to Katie's yet, but Katie doesn't seem to say she does. She does a little bit. She doesn't spend the whole time. And I appreciate that because it's kind of like Gigli Squad where like they don't spend all this time talking about like Summer House or they never then, I don't know, I didn't I didn't listen to it at the very beginning. But I'm still a Googler. so back to Lala. Like, she really, she, she gets so angry at this reunion and it makes no sense, to be honest. And it again starts to feel like in her and James were kind of are you trying to get your moment in this? But also James had more reason to and you saw this this new season. He kind of expresses that more. And I think he's a little bit more vulnerable as opposed to just trying to make his viral moment happen. But also, you can't really blame Lala and James because they came on the show as disruptors, as chaos agents, as agents of the the production. They knew they they weren't a Stassi, they weren't a jock. They didn't have a. But isn't this the core problem with bringing people on as agents of this as yeah. Instead of like holding to the authenticity, this is where we're like losing the plot. This is where the show is kind of starting to like crumble and fall apart because we don't know who's authentically friends or who's just here to, like, create a show. And like, if I want to watch a scripted show, I'll go watch a scripted show. Yeah. And there's a famous saying in television called Jumping the Shark, and it comes from actually Happy Days Fun The show was starting to get stale because it was really just about people hanging out at a diner or whatever. And they had that Fonzie jump over a live shark on water skis. And everyone was like, That just was too ridiculous. And I feel like Sandoval might have been as amazing as it was. And the peak of the show, in some ways, it was jumping the shark because now this fall from here, this live show. No, you can't. Well, this is the thing, because but I also don't know if that's what jumped the shark. I think another part of jumping the shark was when they lost the core cast. When they lost Jack's. When they lost Stacy. When they lost Katie. Kristen, the show just was on life support after that because to be honest, Lala, especially this rewatch, she was never a main character. I mean, Gina, Sheena has carried this show in a lot of ways, but she was part of the machine of Stassi, Katie, Kristen. Like they were all doing their parts, but Lala was never Malcolm X Yeah. And Ariana was never in that. Magdalena still bridged things because she had a relationship with Sandra Paul, she had a relationship with Ariana and she it seemed like she almost even had a relationship with, like, Jax, because she, you know, she's the male whisperer. So she's definitely going to be closer with the men than the women. I think she has an easier time with men than women. Yeah, well, I think that Lauren has a. Thing where I think it's easier for her to get along with men than it is women, because I think it's easier for her to have those late like sexualized, flirty relationships that are easier to not have conflict around. And then whenever she gets into these, like, deeper relationships with women, it becomes so much more fractured for her because she has a harder time being vulnerable. And think about that moment between her and Katie this season where she's trying to compare everything to her situation, Katie's like, it's not your shit. Like, and I think she was just saying, like, it's not the same. Like, you know, you're not holding space for Ariana, you're just wanting to compare this to yourself. And her first instinct was to attack like you're shutting me down, and so I'm going to attack you as opposed to like, oh, okay. Yeah, you're right. Like, this isn't right. Like, there's other ways to respond to that. And then, but I had seen differently in some ways, I think she was trying to say to Ariana and I think this is what she was trying to say and never got a chance to say. It was like, I've been in the place that you're I understand how you're feeling and this is just my advice. Take it or leave it. And I think that's not what she said. That's not how it came with the problem, because this is where I get intended. Katie even said it at the reunion. There's a there. You have to be mindful that like your intentions are always going to be the impact. And if you can't ever like look back and obviously you can't be doing this all the time, but once in a while we have to look back and be like, oh, okay. Like my, my intention was lost and the impact was something that well, I agree with that. But I also think Katie inserting herself in that conversation kind of was part of that problem. Like, I feel like Katie would just came into the season, which is what Lala's point is at the reunion. Her she came in the season like, I'm going to be warrior for Ariana. And I think she had many reasons for that. One of them being authentically that is who she is. She's a very loyal person, very loyal friend. And like she felt that Ariana was in a bad place, so she was going to do whatever she could to protect her. But I felt like in that conversation it would have been a good like when Lala and Ariana would just the two of them having conversations. I thought it was really good. And I think sometimes Katie inserted herself in a way of, again, just shutting things down like and, you know, saying this is how it's going to be. And it's tricky because it's all involved in production. I mean that conversation and the in the girls night could have just gone differently but some of the other conversations like Katie is like I'm just not going to talk about Santa of all like why are we trying to do this? It very much feels like she's like the producers are doing this and I'm not playing a part in it and it's not like that, which is fine, but it's like, is that television? That was more entertaining to me than anything that Lala and she know we're trying to do with the redemption arc. to me, I enjoyed seeing how they were creating and holding boundaries with this person That actually is more interesting to me than trying to force Ariana and Sandoval to have some conversation that like That conversation wasn't going to be interesting. She already had conversations with him. She yelled at him like four times this season, like, okay, what more did we want? Like to me, I thought it was more interesting to see Katie and Ariana boundaries play out. I also thought it was really interesting to see Ariana Boundaries play out and shift over time because I do think she started from a place of like, no one can be friends with him or I'm not going to be friends with you. And as she moved through it, she realized okay, that's not a realistic boundary to hold. And so like, I'm going to let Sheena know that even if she wants a relationship with him, I will still love her and be her friend. Yeah. And I think that I think like a normal thing and they're like, Oh, no, she's contradicting herself. She's being a hypocrite by saying this and now saying that, it's like, no, we move, we're flexible, boundaries are not rigid. And you're assuming that they are and her coming in three months post this craziness still living with this guy and like who cares if she lives with him? Why does that mean she has to like have a certain relationship with him? Because, Lala, I'm sure if you owns part of Ranch House, you wouldn't leave too. So like, but that's that's a little bit that's okay. But in devil's advocate, Lala brought up a lot of conversations and a lot of things that the audience was thinking and feeling. So I give her a little bit of credit for that. you know, when she brings up, you couldn't leave the house. She could have left the house. That is, if you own a house and you're on a deed of a house, whether you live there or don't live there, you own the house like that. That made no sense to me. Her saying, I don't want to, but you're you're being in a presumption that someone in the depths of they're like the rug being pulled out from under them and having to like, you know, she's getting all these deals, like there's all this stuff going on. Like this is this assumption that like she's functioning at a high capacity when I think she is putting that capacity into these things and not into thinking about moving. Oh, no, totally. And I think and so I don't know if it is really fair to say, like, that's what she should have done. Well, I don't think that either. But I'm just saying I think that Lola asking that question was a question that everybody said it didn't feel like she was asking. It felt like she was telling her. And I think that she was fine, though. I think I think Arianna was lying. You know, that's fine. I think a lot of what was being mixed with the whole dog thing and she was calling out, okay, why did you leave food out? And now you're saying this is something deeply wrong with Arianna and her mess? Like, I will not like she needs some therapy, but that's what I'm saying. There's a lot about Arianna that's interesting and fascinating. And this is the problem with the show. Arianna was never a main character or like on the show because she shuts things down and she has healthy boundaries. This does not make for good reality stars, I hate to say, but it doesn't. And so because there's so many interesting things about Arianna that we're really not getting, you know, you're you're in this period, especially I can still read more into that than Lala. I'm sorry. Like I can like even in the season of Scandal Ball where she, like, shuts down, that conversation is like, I'm not going to film. Like, there's something more interesting to me about that then like where it feels like these people are like trying to click that lala going to lunch with Joe like no, I totally agree. I'm just saying without Lala you have a season of Katie and Arianna not addressing any of these issues. Do you know what I'm saying? you do need someone to push these conversations. Sure. But like, This is why the show is over. This this is where the conflict happened. This is why I keep fighting with everyone. Because the thing is, what's what's interesting and I don't know, they took rent out of Beverly Hills and they were still fine. Yeah, but this is the problem with housewives. Like a housewives is set up. There's rotating housewives. They live in this area. You learn about their life. That's like you're not like you. They try to pretend they're friends, but we know they're just pretending they're friends and nobody even cares anymore. But with Vanderpump Rules, it was about servers who work at Sur, who work under Vanderpump, who's Vanderpump Mentor. And now that it's been lost, I think the Dana season when they brought in Dana was when they were trying to bring people who work there back in and Raquel was working at Sur and that kind of they were trying to revive it. And then that's when they lost everyone to the, you know, great firing of total. I think it's well, I also think part of the problem with that shift was that there were still too much of the main cast in it that we couldn't like we weren't that interested in the new people. They were that and they had a very strategic strategy where they were going to have Stassi get married and that was going to shift all the older people into a show about them being adults in the valley. And they were going to have the younger people stay on Vanderpump Rules and probably the Toms were going to mostly be on Vanderpump Rules because they were making their their restaurant. So now I think the producers were under a lot of pressure to figure out what is the show while also dealing with the remnants of Sandoval. They have a very short shooting window. They're trying to figure things out. They're dealing with cast who are in the most vulnerable spots they've ever been in in their lives. You have a Lala and a Sina who's like, you know, whole income is dependent on this show. So of course they're going to go along with it. But I have to say, like I think where the season went wrong is, I think that day on the beach was pivotal. I think if Brock Brock has had some decent moments this season, but he had some really bad moments this season The the conversation with Arianna, it is clear that he is in desperate need of this show. Well, also, I think he's a he's a, you know, fitness trainer, and I think he's probably really good at coaching people in that way. But that doesn't make him a therapist. Right. So you sometimes he's on the mark where you're like, oh, I can see he works with people like on helping them in their lives. And then sometimes he's like, Oh, he in the moment on the beach. I think him bringing up Raquel in that joking way and then Sheena kind of going along with it was really the wrong approach and I mean, was brutal in. Mean to Ariana. And I think Ariana handled that like in a better way than I would have. And then that just set off the whole conversation. But to be honest, I think after she had yelled at him about the dog and then she still showed up at the beach, that was your moment. That was your moment to get an Ariana and Tom facilitated conversation. And I think if anyone in that group could have done it in a way that wasn't how Brock did it. Really, because they started getting into. Okay, well, how are you dividing the house? How are you dividing the dog? Like and if you are in a group of friends and you're all trying to be friends or I don't really feel like anyone was trying to be friends with Sandoval, to be honest, I feel like they were just on it because Sandoval, I think they could have had a good conversation to be like, What? Let's discuss these things that are clearly happening in your real life. But they just missed the mark by bringing up Raquel and starting that whole fight. And it was really bad. I mean, actually, when Lala showed up, she was trying to be a little bit of a voice of reason and Ariana started shutting her down. She's like, I don't even know what happened. And a part of me feels like and I know everyone hates LA right now, but if Lala had been there earlier and she had been the one to start that conversation, I think it would have actually gone better because Brock really messed it up. And then when they go to the waterfront and they talk to Ariana and she breaks down crying, that was the most real moment I saw from Ariana all season, and it was only Lala and Sheena that was there having that conversation with her. So as much as whatever Katie's ride or die, Katie's ride or die to protect Ariana, she is not trying to get those emotional moments from Ariana. The truth of the matter. Get it on camera. You know, it's clear she's not. So it's one of those things where it's like, I get why the fans are mad and they are right to be mad. But also, remember, they brought some of the best moments this season. So when the producers know that they have a cast member that's bringing them the best stuff, they're going to keep pushing. They're going to keep pushing. But that moment of happiness is just so vast. Right? Looks like it's it feels a little too. I think that's what we're experiencing is like the extremes. And, you know, as humans who often want to, like, label in one way or the other, if you bring the best, but you also bring the worst work in to lean towards recognizing you through your worst and not your best. Yeah. And I mean, the ending was just was bad. It was really bad on Sina. Yeah, it was tone deaf. I mean it was great. It like I thought it was a great ending if it is an ending because I think that's what it needs to be I think and we can go on to like we could talk more about Lala or you know, I think there's some interesting things about like the way Lala had like has used the show to like play different roles and to like try on different identities. And I think all of that's like kind of interesting, but maybe not so much like the point of like where we want to go around like should she's like, is she good for yeah. Yeah. So, so yeah. The, the getting into the wrap up of is she good for the show? So she definitely feels like she's doing a Tamera from O.C. where she's like, okay, this season, this is going to be my storyline. And Tamera does it well sometimes, and most of the time she does, you know, and Housewives, it plays a little bit better because it's such a you know, you tend to like you feels like as a producer, you're drawn to like production people. Well, it's not that, but it gives a framework like, you know what she was like, Oh, I'm going to be born again Christian. It was like wild and weird. But then, you know, you get that iconic moment in the finale with Vicky being like, I'm on the cross and they're jumping in the pool. And, you know, sometimes it just helps to sort of know where you're going. But with Lala, I mean, her season arc was, I'm going to be softer, I'm trying to be healed. And we saw no therapy session. We saw no real growth. We just saw her yelling many times, I want to be soft and I'm going to be softer. And I don't know that that's what we see framework towards men, which is like I feel like also a part of the Vanderpump Rules dynamic where like the men don't have the same accountability or criticism as women. I think there is like a softness towards men. That is a general theme in Vanderpump. Mm hmm. I think women get hold to their to a different standard than men on the show. Oh, totally. And that's, you know, definitely what the fans are mad about right now, like Southern Charm, I think falls into that same problem. Which is funny because, you know, the fan base is mostly women. So not a great. So do you think she's good on the show? I mean, I guess I think she's good for the show. Okay. I like I when you're telling me all these things about like the impact she has in like driving conversation and driving story Like, I think there are benefits for her being on the show on this. But I think that overall this like doubling role she has of producer and cast member it really. As an audience. It feels like it really disconnects me from her, especially if she's, you know, she's sitting there complaining about who isn't and who is bringing story. But like her story is only to drive other people's story. And again, it connects it disconnects me further from her. And I want to be more like when I watch someone, I want to be connected with them. And I think because there isn't like someone who's standing out in VR right now as like someone who can be someone who's like a star, who can, like be the main character and be vulnerable and like, stop her, use a little and hold all of those things that, like everyone now is just either they're pushing story or a background and who are we pushing it for? Because nobody wants to see us show all about Thomas at all. I know. And it felt like this season was. And that's why everyone says the redemption arc. I don't see it as a redemption arc because he did absolutely nothing to redeem himself. And there's my producer said it really interestingly that like the the field producers must have wanted a redemption arc and the post producers must have not. You know, it's amazing that people think we're that calculated because we're not honestly, we're not. I mean, we have this is the thing I want I want to try to get some credit here. I mean, you know, and sometimes we are we can be. I mean, I think last season with the rewind of the scandal of all stuff was amazing. Like they do some amazing editing and crafting and art and all this. But no, I mean, you have what you have on camera. And that's the thing I really want to instill in everyone, like the feel producers are running around like chickens that they had cut off, like just trying to follow what was happening. I can't believe they watched anything that went down. I mean, Tom crying in the closet. I mean, maybe they were a little brainwashed of like, he really is giving a lot. And that's something that people will react to. But I think the Post producers were like, Well, there's no way to make this good because it's just it's not, you know, you have what you have on camera and reality TV, you know, you can craft, you can select scenes, you can do that like the Tom Katie love triangle with that girl got reduced to flashbacks. And I was like, I actually, genuinely wanted to see I wasn't quite sure that that was the day. But otherwise, you know, I feel like they didn't, they had what they had, you know, and he didn't have his redemption arc. He had a full villain arc. But anyways, yeah, I mean, I think the show is struggling. It really it doesn't have I mean, right now, yeah. Main character energy is Tom Sandoval, which nobody wants to watch. So that's not that's not good. I think on the flip side and I was holding some like a boner, like some empathy for Lala if we think the show is good for her. Like, I do think the show helped her get sober and I think that's been a good journey for her and also a good journey for us to watch like and bravo Because what we're seeing with like Karl and his sobriety, like this challenge he's having integrating back into, you know, a big manifesto in like recovery treatment is around like you can't be around people, places and things where you used to use. And that's because they're so triggering. And it really puts your sobriety at threat. And we see that with Karl where like, it's very hard for him to be back on of our house and maintain his sobriety. And he's doing a good job of it. But you can see where it's a harder thing for him, where for Lala, we're seeing her show up and view. And, you know, that's one story she is telling that I think is really honorable and good. I think sometimes it becomes her whole personality because it's the only thing she made me feel safe and know she'll get rewarded for showing. But I think it's an important story to tell around, like sobriety and being able to like be, you know, still feel like you're a part of different communities while also maintaining your sobriety, especially in communities where alcohol is still going to be, you know, alcohol is so normalized, you know, in adulthood that it can be really isolating for people on sobriety journey is to like find communities that aren't just like sober communities. And sober communities can be really limiting and you might not feel like you connect with people who are in those communities. So the fact that she's able to kind of show up and maintain her sobriety. On the other hand, I think that the sobriety is also a control mechanism. It's a way that she can like control and produce more. I think there is something about when reality stars get sober that moves them away from being part of the chaos to being a conductor of chaos. Yeah, not solving trip. She was definitely playing that role. But yeah, I mean, I think she's definitely grown a lot of ways and I think she's. If I was a producer on the show, I would. Really try and get a scene with a Lala and Amber rants x. I think that was a missed opportunity. I'm sure that they've tried our media and I'm sure Amber doesn't want to be a part of it. Well, I mean, just a scene with the two of them. And maybe they felt like it didn't make sense either, because, you know, the show's about them being friends, but maybe she moved to the Valley. I would love to see and I know they can't have their kids on the show because Rande won't allow it. But even just the two of them talking about how do they co-parent with their kids and like now her having her own kid, it would be great, you know, for her to have that conversation with Amber and be like, you know, my child isn't actually siblings with your child in the way that ocean obviously is. So how do we want to manage that so that nobody feels left out but it would be a really good scene. I think her mom living close to her and her brother, it could all be interesting She talks about how she fights with her mom kind of a lot in these podcasts, which makes me think that could be interesting. But she doesn't want to show that right now because. Because again, then it threatens more of the relationship. And she needs her mom because her mom is her co-parent. But if she is an agent of a reality, you know, she'll she'll start putting stuff out there. Well, we'll see. I mean, I wouldn't mind her being okay, so I wouldn't mind her being in the Valley necessarily, although the valley's already got a lot of people. I would love to see her on Traitor's. I think she would be great on Traitor. Even Raid on traitors, I think. I feel like we don't need her in the Valley because we have Jax. Yeah. Like Jax. There's a lot of villains out, and there's a lot of villains on the map. The values that I position on it, I support Sina going to the Valley because I think she can be self producing but she's like, not calculated enough to do it really well. And so it's kind of like fun to watch her when she's doing it. But Jana is navigating this whole like Sandoval thing was kind of hilarious to watch, like the lack of self-awareness. And even now, her putting out, like, a t shirt line. That's like, what? Like, how can I make this about me? Is, like, so fucking tone deaf and like, girl, get your money. I'd like, support everyone getting their money, but, you're only further proving to us, kind of how narcissistic you all are and how little like, self-awareness they connect to. Yeah, this is maybe a good closing for Lala. Like, you know, she does these Amazon lives and I love that Amazon Live has these, you know, they get all the time now basically like you have to go like they're like you get paid to do you only get paid if people buy your things because you know you're giving a lot for free. If it's only people like I need to know like way more about the Amazon lives, but basically they sell a crop top. How can we do what? Secrets. Yeah, we are available. I mean, I have bought exactly one thing on Amazon now that I like. So I could be an influencer because I have one. I know I buy many. What, so we could make a show. So anyways, she was like, I don't look at the comments or what I read. She's like, I'm trying to be happy in my life. She really gives all on these Amazon lives. And she was like, You know, everyone's hating me right now, but I'm just glad they're talking about me. And that's Lala. That's. That's everything you need to know. She's just happy you guys are talking about her. So as angry as everyone is getting about her, just know you're fueling this monster like she just loves to be talked about. Yes. So we want to hear. Do you guys want us to give want them to give you more Lala or give you a less lala? Oh, yes. You know, leave it in the comments when you subscribe and like and follow us. Anything else before we wrap up? Lala Kent Unhinged. What we got to think about who's next? Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. So let us know what you think. I did get a really weird request to do a Ben and John relationship Deep Dove, which is not Bravo related, but I thought was a way that I could force you to watch the Jen, Jen, Jen documentary. I mean, I want to watch it just for that one scene, like where they're all like the council. So there's the the music film, which is wild to watch. I mean, do, do, do mushrooms beforehand. And then there's the documentary on making that, which is it's amazing that this film produced two films, but you get like Ben in the second one. I mean, Ben is in the first one too, as like a wild like news reporter. But I would definitely need a lot more time before we do that. But I do love this idea of doing like a couple. Oh, we could do like a Kyle Mo one. Oh, yeah, that would be interesting. All right. We have a lot in the works, so stay tuned. Subscribe. Love us forever. Thanks, guys. Thank you. Bye bye.