#4 Reflecting on Life's Lessons Through Shel Silverstein's Poetry

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Ever wondered what childhood joy and financial wisdom have in common? Our latest episode takes you on a whimsical journey through Shel Silverstein's captivating poetry, where humor and deep insights blend effortlessly. We start by sharing our personal experiences with Silverstein's iconic works like "Where the Sidewalk Ends" and "A Light in the Attic," revealing their timeless appeal to both young and old. Along the way, we dissect the multifaceted career of Silverstein, appreciating his genius in balancing lighthearted fun with profound life lessons.

Our conversation uses Silverstein's "Invitation" to question how modern entertainment influences our creativity in today's fast-paced world. We explore the significance of imagination and self-awareness, reflecting on the transformative power of podcasts and the benefits of stepping out of our comfort zones. Nostalgia plays a big role, as we discuss the importance of preserving childhood joy through cherished memories and how these moments can enrich our adult lives. We even touch upon the delicate balance between appreciating our past and making the most of our present.

From accumulating possessions to the symbolism of giving, our exploration of poems like "Snowball" and "Hector the Collector" uncovers deeper meanings related to financial habits and life priorities. We delve into the poignant themes of parental love and sacrifices depicted in "The Giving Tree," drawing parallels to our own experiences. The episode also includes an engaging discussion on the contrasting worlds of night owls and early birds, enriched with personal anecdotes about the challenges and rewards of unconventional sleep schedules. So, come along for an enchanting and thought-provoking journey through Shel Silverstein's timeless poetry, and discover the life lessons hidden within his verses.

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:09

yeah, I mean I again I used my old friend chat gbt to uh write up a little uh backstory of who shall salverstein's work and describe it for our audience.

Speaker 1: 0:23

So so maybe we can start with that okay, let's start with that and then we'll keep going. Okay, perfect. So this week we're analyzing Shel Silverstein's. I'm not sure if I'm pronouncing that right. I'm sorry to anyone who loves his work and I'm just offending you right now, but that's how I can read it Anyway. So we're analyzing his work.

Speaker 1: 0:45

Different poems Carlos has a couple he chose from a variety of different books and maybe work that singled out that he just made for that one purpose and for myself. Mostly all my quotes and poems I got are from when the Sidewalk Ends, and that was the one I read as a kid. So that's why I chose that book for myself. So for a backstory, if you haven't ever heard of who this author is, is it poet? Yeah, this poet is. I have a little brief intro introductory of who he is and what he does. A little brief intro introductory of who he is and what he does.

Speaker 1: 1:27

Shel Silverstein was a multifaceted artist known for his distinctive and playful poetry, captivating illustrations and timeless stories that have enchanted readers of all ages. Born in Chicago in 1930, silverstein's career spanned various creative fields, including songwriting, playwriting and cartooning. However, he is best known for his children books, particularly his poetry, his collections when the Sidewalk Ends, a Light in the Attic and Falling Up. His unique blend of humor, wit and profound insight into human nature has made his work enduringly popular and influential. Silverstein's poems often feature quirky characters, unexpected twists and a delightful sense of wonder, inviting readers to see the world through a lens of creativity and curiosity. Have you, uh, previous to you know, doing this for this podcast, carlos? Have you ever? Have you ever read any of his poems before?

Speaker 2: 2:34

personally, I mean, I've always encountered them before. I've seen some of the illustrations, I probably did, uh, read at least one of them, but I never like distinctively, like looked at his work or or even purchased a book by itself, like maybe. I've seen some of the pictures here and there and I think some of the some of his books are really famous, like maybe the light light in the attic.

Speaker 2: 2:59

I've seen that one before, uh, and his art, like, like you said, it's very distinctive. Like when you see what some of his artwork, you can tell that it was by him.

Speaker 1: 3:08

Yeah, and for for myself, I, I, I remember reading it like I feel like in sixth grade I don't know if it was like just my language arts class in middle school or what, but I remember reading it and, uh, I think that was my first introduction to poetry. I think was like in sixth grade and was by Shel Silverstein. Here and when I was deciding what to do next, we chose to do something more lighthearted. And again, his books and poems are, I would say, directed to a younger audience kids, children directed to a younger audience kids, children's but he does have like a very unique way of writing and even interconnecting the like child life experience with adult life and and, uh, I feel like we're going to analyze that this this this evening a little bit, how we can still have the inner child in us and see what else we can learn from his work. So maybe you can start. Is there something?

Speaker 2: 4:10

Yeah, Go ahead. Sorry, that's what's so interesting about this genre, Now that you discussed that it's children's book. Children don't write children's book. Obviously Most children don't end up writing a novel or a book for children.

Speaker 2: 4:26

It's adults that do it in most cases, but they have this audience of okay. This needs to captivate a child and a lot of times they do it with very few words and they do it more with illustrations. But in the case of this author, some of his poems are a little more lengthy and you know they're full of stories that could, like you said, to captivate not just children but also adults. You know like maybe when you're writing some of these stuff for children, you're kind of thinking of yourself as a kid and and what would be interesting to you, or maybe the rhymes that would.

Speaker 2: 4:59

You would find funny, and you know the drawings that you would be like. Oh, this is a cool drawing you know, and I think that that makes this genre a lot different, because obviously, if you're a parent I imagine you're you're gonna select these books and be careful, right you?

Speaker 1: 5:13

you don't want to have your children be exposed to something that you wouldn't want them to be exposed to, but you might find yourself drawn to some of his writing and be like oh, this is cool like I want to read it to him, but also, at the same time, you're reading it to yourself and you're like enjoying it yourself yeah, and when I was like reading specifically just this, this, uh, this book, um, where the sidewalk ends, I noticed that it almost seemed like a uh, like it was like four for kids, one for an adult, four for kids.

Speaker 2: 5:45

What I guess what I felt like it almost felt like there was like four for kids, one for an adult, four for kids.

Speaker 1: 5:47

That's what I felt. I almost felt like there was this pattern of uh, this is super lighthearted, jokingly. Sometimes there was like morals learned for a child, you know, but then all of a sudden you'll have a poem that's like deep and you're like I don't think a child understands this. So it's almost like when nowadays, you know, know a lot of um movies you know that are directed to kids, there's a lot of jokes or things that innuendos that maybe just adults understand and those are just like little, like pieces of dessert that are giving to adults because they're taking the kids to watch this movie.

Speaker 1: 6:22

So I think that the same same thing was happening here, but book form. Written form.

Speaker 2: 6:27

Yeah, perfect example. Right now I don't know if you and your wife have gone to go see Inside Out.

Speaker 1: 6:32

That first one was really good and the number two is out and it's kind of a good example of that?

Speaker 2: 6:38

No, not yet.

Speaker 1: 6:38

But it's a good example of that right.

Speaker 2: 6:41

It's meant for children in a way.

Speaker 1: 6:51

It's a cartoon. A lot of kids want to go see it, but also like adults want to go see it. Yeah, that's true. I mean now they're introducing like an anxiety character, right, or depression, yeah, anxiety, I think anxiety is a new character, yeah, or at least I haven't seen it yet, but I think it is one of them a new emotion yeah, the first one I want to highlight or maybe we can even read them, this one's a short one so we can share with the audience Is put something in.

Speaker 2: 7:10

And this is if you want to find it. It's in a light in the attic. It says put something in, draw a crazy picture, write a nutty poem, sing a mumble gumble song, whistle through your comb, do a loony goony dance, cross the kitchen floor, put something silly in the world that ain't been there before. So what do you? What are your first thoughts on that one? At first, I think it probably didn't do the best. Uh, reading, um, you know, if he would heard me, he probably wouldn't be very happy with my reading, but I think his rhyme is probably something that you can highlight on this poem.

Speaker 1: 7:53

Yeah, I mean, when you're reading it for myself, it's a really good lesson, right, I think it's a really good lesson in this poem for me. A really good lesson in this poem for me. Like, I don't have, I don't have it in front of me, but it just, uh, it's inviting kids or anyone to. It's okay to think outside the box and not only think outside of the box but share it, right, share it, yeah. Um, what did you take from it?

Speaker 2: 8:19

yeah, I mean some of the lessons. If a kid's listening to this, he might, you know, think it sounds funny. Right, mumble, gumble, song or dance, or do a loony goony dance across the kitchen floor.

Speaker 2: 8:30

It's just funny, he might even laugh yeah but when you read as an adult or you know, even us reading it we might think of the moral behind it or the lessons behind it. Right, you know, be original. It's something that comes up to mind. You know, don't be afraid to do something that from the outside looks a little crazy. You know, as long as you're not doing anything bad, you know, don't be afraid to be a little different, which is a very valuable lesson to a kid. You know a kid is original, probably for the first six years of his life. You know he's willing to do funny little silly things in front of his parents, but then when he gets to school he's like dropped with all these rules. Some of them are good, obviously like to be a fitting part of society, but he might not be willing to do that loony goony dance anymore, anymore it's a good lesson to keep that I remember seeing this not too long ago in social media.

Speaker 2: 9:22

It was like a, like a one of those videos where they share the clip of of a sound and then do something. Uh, they add like their own version to it, and in the, the meme it was like say the weird thing, you know, like say that, even though it's weird, like just say it, you know people are striving for, for connection.

Speaker 2: 9:42

Course, they took it to an extreme. Yeah, it was like a funny way of doing it, but I mean, a lesson is found there. Whereas if you associate with you, you're with friends, you feel comfortable with their certain value of being able to put something else into the world that maybe doesn't fit in exactly right. That ain't been there before.

Speaker 1: 10:02

Yeah, and I feel like the more episodes we're doing for this podcast, it almost feels like we're building a wall with different bricks and somehow they're interconnected. Right, because, like the way you're describing this, I'm connecting with previous lessons we talked about in different books. Um, yeah, I just want to ask you, like personally, like do you hold yourself back? Um, or when is it? When you feel comfortable, I guess, being yourself or whatever that means, right, or being able to be silly, or or whatever that looks for you, because I think you and I have different personalities. Right, you're more introverted, more I feel like someone sees you in the room. They, like man, respect this guy, man offer offer the chair, you know, and me I'm more of a like.

Speaker 1: 10:49

I don't know like I have like this chaotic energy. So I'm just curious in your like your experience like what? When do you feel like that feeling of being silly?

Speaker 2: 11:01

well, I feel like my personality in most cases. I choose or I desire or I want to not stand out. Right, like that's my personality in public, especially people that don't know me very much. Right like if I'm out in public I don't want to stand out in any way. Right, like I don't want my clothing to stand out and be like, oh, that guy has you know one way or another. Like I don't want them to think, oh, he has really good style or really weird style. Like I just want to be the guy that you know, you don't remember. If I commit the crime you're not going to be able to describe me. He's gonna be like, he just looked like a guy, he was like, he's like, he's like.

Speaker 1: 11:37

Do you know that mate? That myspace icon you know like, is that gray figure? That's carlos, yeah yeah, where's that. Where's that root from, though it's so interesting, like why do you like? Because that seems like an active choice that you're actively trying to uh, be that.

Speaker 2: 11:55

That's where I was I was getting into part two, I think, and part two is just when I'm with friends, right, when I'm with friends, when, like, I'm with you, some of our other friends that we have in common, I think that's when the second part of my person I can come out, where, like I do feel like I can, like this poem invites you, you know, do the silly thing in the world and then put something that's a little different. I can do that more in those situations, right, like where I don't feel as likely that I'll bring judgment to myself, right and and mean I think maybe that's a lot of people, though Like I don't think I'm unique even in that way, like I think a lot of people you know are willing to be a little more weird or a little stranger or different when they're with friends.

Speaker 2: 12:36

Some people are the opposite. Some people are, like, are perfectly normal when they're with you, and then they're crazy when they're in public.

Speaker 1: 12:43

I don't know many people like that, but I know that they're there, they exist, they exist for sure.

Speaker 2: 12:48

Yeah, it's like that joke where you're like this is my friend. But when he's around girls he's someone else yeah he's not my friend around girls. I don't know the guy. I don't know the guy.

Speaker 1: 13:08

Yeah, I'm curious if you think um people, especially now more than ever, they do that less and less like be silly, um, you know, like again, the word original is kind of uh, misconstrued, as we talked about with steel like an artist, but but the idea behind it of just doing something that you want to do, do you think um, because of social media, so many eyes on us, like, do you think um, the average person doesn't do that anymore, or am I just perceiving it incorrectly?

Speaker 2: 13:39

I mean, I wouldn't know like I, I'm probably not the moral authority on that topic, and be able to say anything about it.

Speaker 2: 13:46

Um, but I think you know, even still like an artist, right, when it mentions the word original and how we all take and we steal from different sources different personalities. I think a lot of people do that and and that's the best way to find what you are right like. You are a certain way and I observe you and I'm like that's really cool. But maybe he went a little too high in the you know being loud part and I was like I want to be like that, but maybe dial back the loudness, and in how he tends to fill a room when he walks in like yeah, and we all do that from like from different people and different sources, maybe even people we've never met.

Speaker 2: 14:22

Right like people that we all do that from like, from different people and different sources, maybe even people we've never met, right like people that we observe online.

Speaker 2: 14:28

And you know, now more than ever it seems like the world is very connected and you get to you know, if you use it right, you know be, experience different cultures and see different things, and kind of take a little bit here and there and and see where you, where you can like put something a little different, or even it doesn't have to be different, but you got to put something out there yeah I mean, this is my going outside the box and going outside my comfort zone, you know.

Speaker 1: 14:54

Yeah, this is you being silly.

Speaker 2: 14:55

The podcast, yeah exactly I feel like, little by little, you've been kind of like it's gonna sound like a heavy word, but grooming me into a podcastcaster.

Speaker 1: 15:04

When you met me.

Speaker 2: 15:05

I would have never even considered it.

Speaker 1: 15:10

Yeah, so those I mean most people, or anyone who's really listening to this podcast probably knows us, because that's the only people that are supporting us and we appreciate it. So thank you for listening and watching, like interested in personalities that were different than mine, because I was curious, like of you know what made them who they are, just how, what made me who I am? But I was. And Carlos man, you made it so hard, bro, like I try to be like his friend and I'll ask him questions. And he was like you know, know everything close to the chest. You know like no, I'm not gonna show you my cards.

Speaker 2: 15:47

Like nah, like you gotta earn this trust, yeah, so to everyone listening, joel does not take no for an answer. It's kind of his problem. He needs to get help on that first poem that I'm gonna start with uh I think is.

Speaker 1: 16:02

So. Can I do two? Can I start with two carlos? Is that possible? You, I start with two, carlos. Is that possible? You can start with two.

Speaker 2: 16:06

I'll allow it. I appreciate it. We'll tell the production to edit it.

Speaker 1: 16:12

So the reason, the first one, we don't have to analyze it too deeply, but I thought it gives you a perspective on on Shell, on his, on his personality maybe, or maybe a little bit of more insight in his mind it's the first poem of where the sidewalk ends and it starts with invitation.

Speaker 1: 16:35

It starts if you're a dreamer, come in. If you're a dreamer, a wisher, liar, a hoper, a prayer, a magic beam, buyer, If you're a pretender, come, sit by my fire, For we have some flax, golden tails to spin Come in, come in. And that's the invitation. And I felt like it's such a great poem to start this book because it's admitting to you that for you to really enjoy what you're about to read, you have to buy in. You can't have one foot out, one foot in. At least that's what I'm hearing when I read this Because it's saying that he's calling out all people who are dreamers. Because it's saying that he's calling out all people who are dreamers you know magic, being buyers Basically saying anyone with an imagination.

Speaker 1: 17:31

You need an imagination to consume the following words that you're going to read and I just feel like it gives a little bit of insight on how he writes and his whole goal of helping especially kids because again it's directed to children to have an imagination of what you're reading and really be involved in what you're reading. Do you think imagination is something that because of movies, books, everything we have, because of movies, books, everything we have entertainment consistent dopamine. Do you think that people use less and less imagination in their lives, in their day-to-day?

Speaker 2: 18:14

lives. It's certainly possible, right? I think you know a kid nowadays doesn't have to play with imaginary toys. He can, you know, get one toy, an iPad, and it's full of cartoons, full of movies. You know, full of this at its core rush of dopamine, that he doesn't need to like buy a little toy cars and play around like we used to when we were growing up I'm not saying that's any better, right?

Speaker 2: 18:38

I'm not saying like that's the only way to have a childhood. Those kids can become, you know, very smart and very you know, live very fulfilling lives.

Speaker 1: 18:47

But they're not going to need to use imagination as much. Why Give a hot take? Give a hot take.

Speaker 2: 18:54

You say something controversial.

Speaker 1: 18:57

Okay, so here's the controversial part regarding that poem you just read. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 19:02

It says if you are and if I'm not mistaken, because we're also at the same time, we're doing a blind review, right, because if you don't know what poems I read, I don't know what poems you read Exactly. This is the first time I've heard this one specifically, and it's a very interesting one because it's an invitation.

Speaker 2: 19:17

And it says if you know, I don't think any one of us would have a problem in someone thinking we're a dreamer. Well, maybe some of us would. Maybe there is some like oh, you're a dreamer, maybe there is an issue with that one, but you know, you're a liar. That is a problem, like you wouldn't want anyone to say you're a liar. Yet he says if you're a liar, you can still come in. And I think what he means by that and here again it could take on different meanings to different people. He says if you are this or that, you can still come in, but if you don't know who you are, then maybe you can't.

Speaker 2: 19:57

Right, At the same time, even if you like, let's say something as harsh as you're a liar, you know you can still enjoy this book, even if there's something bad about you we could say or something that most people would judge.

Speaker 2: 20:11

But it does take knowing yourself, knowing what you are and I think for any part of life, knowing who you are. It is a very important part, right? Like, if you know who you are, you'll be able to take those invitations to learn more and, kind of you know, expand on your knowledge of life and things in general. But if you don't know, or if you don't, you know, more importantly, if you don't admit it to yourself, right? Because what if you're a liar but you don't want to admit it? Like, oh, I'm not a liar, you know. And I think maybe what the author is trying to bring out is you know, regardless of anything that you are, even if it's not very we could say admirable or lovable or cool, you can still, you know, in his way come in or enjoy what he has to show okay, that's why I love this podcast, because you literally took it away.

Speaker 1: 21:06

I didn't even, I didn't even think about. Honestly, I mean, that's the cool thing, we have different perspectives. Because when I did, did think that he used you know, it's so interesting that he did use the word liar, right, but for me, when I was reading it and I was seeing the other words or the titles of the other, you know people sort of speak the dream, you know people, so to speak, the dreamers, wishers hope or prayer. For me I was like, okay, how does a liar fit into this? Okay, yeah, and for me I mean, again, kids don't lie. It's bad, anyone, it's not good, it's a terrible habit to have. But okay, just a devil's advocate here is that a liar needs imagination to create stories. Yeah, right, if there's one positive right is that you have to be creative. Right, you have to be creative to be a liar, right.

Speaker 2: 22:00

What if he was talking about lying to yourself? I didn't think of that side. Is that how you analyze it Lying to yourself or lying to other people?

Speaker 1: 22:08

Oh, man, I said, like lying to other people, not lying to myself, yeah, yeah I feel like most people are much more guilty, including myself, you know, are much more.

Speaker 2: 22:18

It's more, much more possible that we lie to ourselves than others. Oh wow. Yeah, I didn't think about that who knows, maybe he was referring to that.

Speaker 1: 22:26

I mean, we could probably break it down a little more, but we have a couple of poems to get through yeah, so, yeah, I just thought this was such a good poem because it's inviting this imagination, right, be imagined to enjoy this. This. Uh, you know the the following poems you're going to read. Okay, so the next poem. It is like a little bit, in my opinion, a little bit deeper, there's more meat on the bone, so let me pull it. It's actually the title of the book, or this poem book, right, so let me find it here, number 64, where the sidewalk ends.

Speaker 1: 23:04

Okay, it says there is a place where the sidewalk ends and before the street begins, and there the grass grows soft and white and there the sun burns, crimson bright, and there the moon bird rests from his flight To cool in the peppermint wind. Let us leave this place where the smoke blows black and the dark street winds and bends, past the pits where the asphalt flowers grow. We shall walk, with a walk that is measured and slow, and watch where the chalk white arrows go, to the place where the sidewalk ends. Yes, we'll walk with the walk that is measured and slow, and we'll go where the chalk white arrows go, for the children they mark and the children they know the place where the sidewalk ends. So this poem describes this mystical place where this sidewalk ends, and he's depicting this contrast of this beautiful natural place where there's birds, there's grass, it's beautiful. And then he compares it to where the asphalt flowers grow past the pits. It says dark streets, let us leave the place where the smoke blows black. So maybe like industrial, the city right.

Speaker 2: 24:40

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 24:41

So in this poem there's this contrast between the, so to speak, a city life and the natural world, so to speak, a city life and in the natural world, so to speak, you know. So the reason I appreciate this is that it says at the end for the children they mark, and the children they know the place where the sidewalk ends. And I was curious to think, to ask you more so, and I was curious to think to ask you more so do you think children have more access to this place where the sidewalk ends, to this imaginative place where they're happy or enjoying life as a child? Do they have easier access than, maybe, an adult?

Speaker 2: 25:27

Yeah Well, honestly it's interesting. This is the first time I read read this poem and I don't feel like I know where the sidewalk ends, so I don't know if I'm a little lost but he says, children know, so it's making me think maybe I'm not a child enough to understand where this sidewalk place ends, but something that is in uh, that I did take from the poem was his you know he repeated this phrase.

Speaker 2: 25:53

It's measured and slow, right.

Speaker 2: 25:57

So when you think of a highway, you know it's very hectic and it's very crowded. You know things move very quickly. When you think of a sidewalk, I'm thinking more like a scroll, like a stroll. It's not a scroll, stroll. Are you strolling? You know, maybe in the afternoon, right now it's pretty cloudy. You know you walk out and you just go for a nice little walk.

Speaker 2: 26:18

Maybe it's measured and slow, you know, like you're not really going for distance or you have a goal in mind. And I think that's where kids do have an advantage over adults, right, adults have all these responsibilities, all these things in their head. You know the to-do list, you know they got to get through all these things that they have to get done, whereas children, you know they probably take life day by day and they just look. Maybe that's I don't know if it's right or wrong but they look for fun, right, like they're looking more for the things they enjoy. Um, and I'm sure, as a parent, you probably want to limit that to some degree, but in another way, like that is kind of what makes being a kid so beautiful.

Speaker 2: 26:58

Right, like you should be able to not care about these other things that adults should care about yeah you just take life a little more slowly, which an argument would be if that's the way life was meant to be lived lived all our lives or if that's like a special, you know time period in our life that doesn't come back at all. What is your take on that? Can you bring back some of those childhood moments into your adult life?

Speaker 1: 27:28

That's a good question. I think there is a power in just meditating and reflecting on on past memories, right, past stories and and if you think about, like maybe, your experiences now with your family, like now that we're you know, we're adults, right, we're not kids anymore, like, and you see, your, you know cousins that you grew up with or grew around, and you can sit around and run on fire a couch and just talk about stories as a child and it brings laughter and positive joy. So I do think there's a way to reach back at this innocence or very just innocent joy of being a child and not thinking of any other things I do think it's harder, though.

Speaker 1: 28:17

I do think it's harder because, as a child, you're in the moment, you're just enjoying it, right? You just, you don't have any responsibilities. You just, what are you gonna do today? I don't know, like I'm gonna, let's cause some havoc. You know that's the type of child I was, you know, yeah and uh, I felt like this book or this sorry, this poem was trying to invite the reader to escape. I felt like it was like an escapism type of poem, like inviting the reader to escape, like try to escape your reality from time to time, and it's basically saying it's okay. I do feel like children, at least in my opinion, have an easier access to escape because they don't have anything to be responsible for so they can go to that imagination place or they can just doodle on a notepad for hours because they don't have responsibilities.

Speaker 1: 29:17

So I do think children have an easier access to get there, but I don't think it's impossible. But when I was reading this I was thinking to ask you do you have any particular, like joyful stories you have as a child that you can share with me, like anything that you like look, look back on with, like you know, like just joy and happiness, something you experience?

Speaker 2: 29:44

you know that's. That's kind of a funny question, because I don't I don't particularly have like any bad memories of childhood, like it's not like this traumatic event or anything like that, but I think that's good.

Speaker 2: 29:54

I was kind of forced maybe I was forced to grow up too soon in in some ways, and you know, like I feel like that's the case for a lot of adults, right, they feel like they grew up too soon and they want to go back to being a child. I don't know if that's the case with me, but I do remember, like when, when I was younger, like wanting to grow up, right, like wanting to be an adult, wanting to finish school, wanting to work, wanting all these things that you think will give you more freedom. You know, if only you knew that you probably will never have the level of freedom you used to have. But I think you know, know, having that life, not perspective, but that life or that common habit of always looking back and wanting that yesterday, wanting whatever you had in the past, is not really healthy, right, like, because you cannot go back. You cannot go back and repeat, you know, this childhood that you lived.

Speaker 2: 30:46

You know, even if you went back to your hometown and you went to the children museum like you used to, or went to the zoo, you're not a kid anymore, right, yeah, and in some degrees you'll not, you're not able to repeat, it's not repeatable, but something that you know would be respectful of a child is a child doesn't have any like retrospection or the ability to look back that much I imagine you know from 5 to 12, at least you don't To be able to analyze the past as much or be able to look forward into, like these big goals of you know, 10, 5, 20 years in the future and maybe there's some children out there that do, but I'm saying in my personal case we don't have that, I didn't have that there that do like, but I'm saying in my personal case we don't have that, I didn't have that, but I did have that, you know, desire to be an adult, and maybe now the most respectful thing to my self as a child would be to keep that, you know, enthusiasm about being an adult, instead of trying to repeat what I can't anymore, like trying to go go back to that, and I think the ways that I keep alive, you know, my way of being a child is more to like, you know, do or like watch some of the things that I enjoyed when I was little, like maybe some cartoons some movies, things like that, right, like things that remind you.

Speaker 2: 32:07

And even if you look at them now and they're kind of silly, know, there's a lot of shows when I was little that I would watch and I would just start laughing like they were so funny, like in my mind they were like extremely hilarious. And then I look at them now and I'm like it's repetitive. You know, it's kind of like predictable, like they're doing the same joke. But out of respect for myself, I'm like, okay, it's so cool, like I'm not gonna hate on it, right, because that would be disrespectful to to what I used to think okay.

Speaker 1: 32:38

Yeah, that's a that's a good perspective to have, though I do agree that it's unhealthy to consistently look back, um, because you're not enjoying the moment. You're just wasting time, right. I think there is like a time and place, like I mentioned earlier, like where you can look back with fondness and happiness, but I do think there's a difference between looking back with fondness and happiness and looking back with oh, I want that, you know, because you can't, you can't have that back. It's more so, like man, I had a great childhood, I enjoyed it. Now, what can I do now to keep enjoying in my life? And, like you said, like how can I pay tribute to little Carlos or little Joel?

Speaker 1: 33:18

Yeah, so maybe like, for example, me growing up, like I always wanted, like my cousins always like had like the fancy, fancy stuff, fancy toys, video games. I usually I, I didn't, I didn't, so I always wanted it. I always, like man, my dad wouldn't let me, my I and, long story short, I couldn't. But now, like that's my little thing, like I bought myself a switch, you know, like I always wanted, like mario kart, and I bought the games like I you know. And again, do I play them every day?

Speaker 1: 33:50

no, I don't I don't have time for it, but yeah, but it's something it's like a tribute to like what I, I, you know, to my little me, that that now you have it, you know, and you can enjoy it a little bit.

Speaker 2: 34:01

So that was a good one, you know, let's you. Are you ready to move on to the next one, or do you want to?

Speaker 1: 34:09

yeah, let's do this one.

Speaker 2: 34:10

No, let's do it I found one in a book he named falling up. Falling up, which is kind of an interesting phrase. Usually fall down, but this is falling up and it's titled snowfall and as I read it you might want to think of like. I mean, at least it brought up some ideas of like financial success, savings, inheritance, you know, things that we plan for in the future, and maybe how silly those could be if we're not careful. Right, the name is Snowfall and it says I made myself a snowball, snowball, snowball, not snowfall, snowball. I made myself a snowball, as perfect as could be. I thought I'd keep it as a pet and let it sleep with me. I made it some pajamas and a pillow for its head. Then last night it ran away, but first it wet the bed.

Speaker 2: 35:06

it's kind of a funny one, I'm just you know, I can't probably laugh, especially, you know you know, when you read it, with the artwork, but yeah, there's, there's, there's a moral behind it. You know, there's some things, as much as you love them, you can't really keep them for tomorrow. Like what are some examples of that? Like what are some things that you, if you accumulate too much of it, kind of defeats the purpose? I mean.

Speaker 1: 35:30

No matter how much you like it, I mean.

Speaker 2: 35:32

I'll even go first right Like fruit Go first.

Speaker 1: 35:34

Let's say you love strawberries.

Speaker 2: 35:36

You can't stock up on strawberries too much, right Like if you buy too many strawberries unless you have like a little method of like freezing them, or you know, I've heard about dry freezing. It's pretty cool. I haven't done it, but maybe I'll buy a dry freezer.

Speaker 2: 35:55

Unless you do that, you know within a couple of days some of them are going bad and they're not going to be any good within maybe a week. Maybe a week is like the max, or a week and a half, um, yeah, well, that's a lot of that, yeah, go ahead.

Speaker 1: 36:06

No, I mean, the biggest thing that I mean rings to our head is because you know we live in a world where we need money to survive. I think, well, financial security, or that word is thrown out to us left and right. Are you financially secure? Are you ready to retire, even though I'm 27? That's thrown out in our face all the time, so I wish there is some wisdom behind it. I'm not going to like that. That's thrown out in our face all the time.

Speaker 1: 36:29

So, which there is some wisdom behind it. I'm not gonna say that that's not smart, but I do think there's this reality that we, we can't control tomorrow, you know. So, to be balanced with whatever you are accumulating, you know like, because, like there's, I think there's an extreme, because I think there's people who it's a good thing to have savings I think savings are good but there's people that don't like. Let's say, they love ice cream, right, and they love it, and they pass an ice cream parlor and instead of buying that ice cream, they're like no, well, I got to save for tomorrow.

Speaker 2: 37:04

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 37:05

And for me it's like no, I just enjoy the ice cream. Buy yourself an ice cream. Yeah, you didn't save the $5 or $3, whatever the cost, but enjoy the ice cream, because what if tomorrow, you know, like I don't know, the banks blow up or something and your money is worth nothing, you know.

Speaker 2: 37:21

Yeah, it's funny, I guess, the symbolism behind this idea of a snowball, right, and at the end he he says it wet the bed. When you say that phrase, you know, you hear it in movies and tv shows oh, he wet the bed. You're like, oh, he made a mistake, like that's what it means, right? Yeah, and you know, the idea that he wanted to keep this pet is silly, right? Only a child would do that someone that doesn't know.

Speaker 2: 37:46

Yeah, but when it comes to money like, let's say, you, you generate enough and you keep this huge amount, but the reality is we don't know. When you know something bad will happen, we'll pass away, and what will happen with all of that? What will happen with the money we accumulated? Someone else will enjoy it like it won't really benefit us.

Speaker 2: 38:07

It won't be like a pet that you keep and you love and you enjoy, it'll just be. You know, I heard a saying not too long ago and it's kind of like a silly, funny way of thinking about an inheritance, and it said you know, inheritance, or leaving money after you die, is a mathematical mistake. It means you didn't run the numbers right it means you saved so much and you overworked that there was left over.

Speaker 2: 38:30

Like if you, if you would have worked less, you would have enjoyed life more. You know, like there was, there was more work in your life than there should have been. Like there should have been less work that's a good obviously, like it's the first time that I see it that way.

Speaker 2: 38:44

Right, because most parents and most adults want to leave this huge, enormous amount of wealth to their children. Would it really benefit them, though? Like and that's kind of like okay, now we're getting into like a, like a hot take or not a hot take, but a controversial topic, yeah and I don't know.

Speaker 2: 39:00

You know, I don't know some parents would leave everything to their children. Others, you know, and I've even seen this, like in interviews with, like billionaires and people like that where they're like we're not going to leave them anything because it would ruin them, like I don't know if I agree with that either yeah what would be the equivalent of wetting the bed yeah, exactly right, I I think what's equivalent.

Speaker 1: 39:23

Yeah, I mean, my hot take is that I mean it's never zero. But I think majority of the cases leaving that amount of money to anyone won't benefit them in the long term. Especially, again, there's case to case. I can't say there's any, but you need so much education to even handle any of that. How do you even handle such a thing? And then you become reliant on something else instead of yourself. I just do think that there's a lot of lessons in life that is lost in that um gift. I do think it's. You know, it comes from maybe a place of love, but when you're speaking earlier about like dying with like zero, it's such a, it's such a cool concept. It's a cool concept. I never really thought about it too much how you know if you, you know if you die with savings or something. You you got the calculation wrong and yeah, you're getting it wrong well, can I say I 100 agree?

Speaker 1: 40:25

maybe not, but I do think it opened my brain to considering it or like reading more into that idea.

Speaker 2: 40:31

I mean it's worth thinking about at least. Like when we're doing this podcast, we're trying to share ideas, we're trying to share what we think of. It doesn't really mean that that's what I feel, 100% I mean obviously if I stop to think about it, I probably fall somewhere in between.

Speaker 2: 40:44

I'm not one way or another personally, but I mean when you think about these things it does kind of like maybe elicit a thought where you're like overworking, or you're at the office at 9 pm and your son calls you and he wants to go watch a movie, and you, instead of telling him like oh, no, I'm working, and in your mind I'm sure most parents are like, oh, I'm working for the kid, I want to make sure that he has a future. But you know, if you're really doing this for the kid, for your son, maybe it's worth it to leave that job at that time and go watch the movie that he wants to go watch or like living that money and you know treating money like that, like that pet.

Speaker 2: 41:27

You know saving. I want to keep. It might be what makes you wet the bed. Because what if you? You pass away earlier than you think and you don't accumulate as much as you you predicted?

Speaker 2: 41:38

well, all those memories that you could have made with your son are no longer there you know, and I think those memories are going to last a lot longer than the money. Like the money will go within a couple of years of you passing away, but the time you spend with your family, the time you spend with your children, you know, those are probably last more.

Speaker 1: 41:57

Yeah, and now I'm thinking about it a little bit further, about that illustration. You know how did the child wake up? Right, the bed was wet, but potentially it's like with sadness. Right Like the bed was wet, but potentially it's like with sadness. Right Like, oh man, like my snowball. Right Like my thing I held with value. Right that I put pajamas on it to take care of it. Oh, it's gone.

Speaker 1: 42:17

Right, like at least that's what I'm imagining a sad child to seeing this in front of them. So for me I was thinking like, oh, what other way or what other things in life can can this connect to? And I can think of like maybe, maybe like our childhood, or maybe we're you know aging, maybe like you're, you're so fond of how you used to look, or when I was younger, or my weight, or whatever you're so fond or holding onto these past memories that you're missing out on the moment, really, because you're trying to hold on to something that's not there anymore. Such a that's a good poem. I'm surprised how deep we went, because when you're first reading it, I'm like where is he taking this? Because I was like how is this a deep poem? I love it is that?

Speaker 1: 43:07

I got I got one. Hit it Okay Again. I'm sorry, I chose a lot of these longer ones, but I have Hector the Collector. Okay, hector the Collector, and everyone who's listening to us or watching us, be mindful that none of us. He's hearing this for the first time, so let's see how we consume this poem. Okay, hector the collector collected bits of oh sorry man, I read that terribly.

Speaker 1: 43:41

Hector the collector collected bits of string collected dolls with broken heads and rusty bells that would not ring, pieces out of picture, puzzles bent up, nails and ice cream sticks, twists of wires worn out tires, paper bags and broken bricks, old chipped vases, half shoelaces, gatling guns that wouldn't shoot, leaky boats that wouldn't float and stopped up, horns that wouldn't toot, butter knives that had no handles, copper keys that fit no locks, rings that were too small for fingers, dried up leaves and patched up socks Worn out belts that had no buckles, electric trains that had no tracks, airplane models broke in, bottles, three-legged chairs and cups with cracks. Hector the collector loved these things with all his soul. Loved them more than the shining diamonds, loved them more than glistening gold. Hector called to all the people come and share my treasure trunk. And all the silly, sightless people came and looked and called it junk. So that's it, the Hector the collector.

Speaker 1: 45:03

So, to break down the poem a little bit further, as we can see that he's describing this character, his name is Hector and he collects things that to the common eye is junk right, it's things that are worn out, they don't work, or maybe they had an original purpose but now they're not useful. But it highlights that he cherishes these items. He sees values in them, even if others don't. So much so that the end of the poem explores the theme of value and the perception of that, because to him he describes it as he says come and share my treasure trunk.

Speaker 1: 45:42

And at the end it says says and all the silly sightless people came and looked and called it junk, and I think that's like that's such a powerful last phrase there to end it um. But I feel like hector embodies, um, maybe, individuality and and values of what he enjoys, even though maybe others don't. So what I'm trying to get to with this long explanation of this poem is do you think a lot of people also like junk, so to speak, like Hector? But because majority of people view it as junk, they don't pursue whatever that is, whether it's, you know, a certain passion. Maybe they like painting, drawing, whatever, because other people don't value that thing.

Speaker 2: 46:39

They hold themselves back. Do you think that's the case? I mean, I'm in a very like thin ice right now because I don't want to promote a hoarding lifestyle. We're going to put the hotline number here. If you had a hoarding problem, there's help out there. But it doesn't seem like the author is trying to describe that in Hector the Collector.

Speaker 2: 46:59

In fact I think the poem is, even though it's a little bit longer, it's, you know, just short enough. I feel like it was missing this you know better ending of you know hector the collector figuring out that actually all those things were antiques and they're worth millions. It ends with them being junk, yeah, and it's fortunate. But I think you know it like, I think you actually hit something that I was it brought to my head which is this idea of intrinsic value or value right. Like things have intrinsic value, like you know, they're worth something in themselves, like our phone you know, we have things that are around our home.

Speaker 2: 47:42

Our home itself has a certain value, but there's also like what we could call emotional value, right, like I'm sure that if I google what is the golden retriever worth, I'm gonna get an answer like it has a certain amount of worth out there in the market, but my bruno, you know, is worth a lot more because he's he's my pet, you know he's.

Speaker 2: 48:01

you know I love him the same more because he's my pet, you know I love him. The same thing with Hector, like, even though he was collecting all these bits of stuff. You know the misfits, rejects. You know jungles people call them, you know it's a funny one. He seemed to collect things that had a main purpose but they were not able to do that main purpose anymore Because he said he collected boats that didn't float. Like what good is a boat if it doesn't float? You're not going to be able to sell that. It has no use anymore. But to him they were treasure.

Speaker 2: 48:31

And I don't think you can really apply that to things in itself, but I think it's very true of people, ideas, all these things that might not have value and other people looking out, looking in from the outside, might be like, oh, what is that guy doing? You know he's wasting his time. Why is he collecting? Why is he traveling so much? Why is he doing all these things? That's not going to make him more money. That's not going to make them, you know, more successful in their eyes.

Speaker 2: 48:58

But to him they're a treasure he really. But to him they're a treasure he really enjoyed it. You know, hector was collecting things that were valuable to him and I think if, if we were to do that, you know, stop looking at what people value like instead of focusing oh, I want to collect all these things that people like, that people think are valuable or that you know. You know, I feel like people do that when they collect, like stamps and coins, they're more worried about what they're going to be worth one day People are going to pay a lot of money for this and I mean that's right.

Speaker 2: 49:28

If you're investing, that should be your goal. But if you're doing something for fun, then you should do it just for fun. You should be willing to do like Hector, you know, collect all these things, even if people see it as junk, junk, they can still be your treasure, you know, even if people wouldn't be willing to give a dollar for it.

Speaker 1: 49:48

Yeah, and when I was reading this, for me it almost seemed like a critique to materialism a little bit. Yeah, um, I felt like it was trying to contrast two value systems, right, like we had like this with society. Right, society was saying his collection was junk but he valued it and he was happy and he called it a treasure. Um, for me, when I was so, when I was seeing this like this, like slight critique to materialism of what actually things are worth and why, almost made me questioning why do I buy what I buy and why it almost made me questioning why do I buy what I buy, right, yeah, like Hector, he was maybe getting these things or maybe even buying these things, but when he bought them he was happy, like, oh, this is my treasure, I value it. And I think in the crazy Amazon world we live in, man like the speed of purchase things that you can can just get immediately, it's crazy how fast you can get stuff.

Speaker 2: 50:51

It's like again, and this is in right in in a first world country that has access to internet or whatever, but I'm trying to get to is like now more than ever, we have access to just buying things yeah, I mean, they've done an amazing job of removing any sort of friction from a transaction, right like really it's frictionless you don't need a wallet, you don't need a phone, like I think. I've seen that hopefully I've never used it, but I think you can use it like your palm or something and you can do it with your palm bro the marketing.

Speaker 1: 51:17

I heard, like disney, like disney, you go to disney world. I heard that they gave you a bracelet. Now right that you connect your card to and it's such a frictionless experience. You just go to the store, you know you want to get a coffee. They just beep.

Speaker 1: 51:31

You know beep like yeah like literally, and then at the end you're just charging your card, right, but like they make it so easy for you to spend because you're not physically pulling out a wallet counting the $20 for the seven ounce water bottle. You know, like you're just like beep, beep, beep, you know, and just buying everything.

Speaker 2: 51:52

Oh man, I'm going to miss the good old fashioned, painful way of pulling out A wad of ones.

Speaker 1: 52:05

A wad of ones, yeah, and what I was trying to get to ultimately with all like how we have so much, it's always so easy to buy things is that? That question of why am I buying it? I think is getting looser and looser. You know, like it's more, oh, I want it, right, and you buy it and then then it ends up in storage. You know it ends up in storage. You don't really value it, you don't treasure it at least you can. You know we can argue that hector valued his things. You know exactly what he owned, what he had, and he appreciated, he valued it.

Speaker 1: 52:36

So it almost made me ponder on myself. You know like when I buy things I'm just just beep beep beep, you know like you know am I being influenced by materialism. The more.

Speaker 2: 52:45

I think about hector, though, like in your eyes, hector is let's summarize this in generic terms a hero or a villain. What do you think? I think he's a hero. You think he's a hero right, he's collecting all these things that to other people have no value, right like, and he values them and he loves them. He kind of gives them a second chance of living their full intended life, you know of having someone that loves them.

Speaker 2: 53:09

And I think you know, when you collect maybe not things, but when you go into a more like symbolic way of maybe friendships, right, a lot of people and this is strange but I have seen it live people even collect friendships based on what you know value it brings to others. Like, oh, like they start name dropping, like I know this doctor, like I know this lawyer, and only like they want to impress others based on their connections.

Speaker 2: 53:38

But it seems like Hector was collecting all the rejects, like all the things and people in my symbolic way, people the others have no found, no value in, and he saw them as a treasure and he, in a way, that's kind of like a service to provide to society, where you find a use or something lovable and what people are like kind of like disregarding as having no use left in them do you feel like?

Speaker 1: 54:05

you know there's some, there's something there like no, I know, I didn't see it that way, but I can see where you're going with it. I see what you're going with. I think you're right. I think that he is seeing value in things that, again, based on some whatever weird societal standard, doesn't have value. Because, like, like, think of we can, we can illustrate this with art. Right, there's people who, who've you know we, we've all done it, we've all done it. We see, we go to a museum and you're like that that's worth twenty thousand dollars, like, and we all joke around like we had the skill to do it ourselves, which we don't but we're like, oh, I could have painted that, but someone out there is passionate enough that values that thing. So who am I to throw mud on their value system?

Speaker 2: 54:57

right there. Now. Here's a. I'm gonna throw this to you and to the listeners. This is gonna be like a like a little test, right, oh gosh. And this is like let's see where you fall in this. I'm kind of making it up on the spot, so we'll see how it goes. Imagine you have a piece of art, this, you know, call it a drawing or a piece of art like we would find in a museum a painting, and you cannot sell it, you cannot trade it.

Speaker 2: 55:23

So whatever it is worth and money is completely meaningless because you're not going to trade it, you're not going to sell, you're going to keep it in your house forever. What would you rather have a piece of art that you love and you find beautiful and you treasure like? This is amazing. It goes well with my home, love it, but every visitor tells you they hate it and that it's ugly and that it's worth nothing. Or the opposite a piece of art or painting that to you, is ugly, you don't even like it there. Maybe your wife convinced you and it's there, but you hate it. But every time someone walks in, they admire, admire it, they love it, they pay you, they offer you $10 million for it Jeez.

Speaker 1: 56:12

What would you rather have like in your home For me? When you described the first setting for me it was like well, it seems like I got to get new friends Like I got to get some new friends. So for me, like the answer is option a right, like I want to love whatever I love, but if someone's hating on it, for me it's like I gotta get better friends, fam.

Speaker 2: 56:34

Like why are they hating on me? Take the heat. I mean, hector, took the heat. They didn't like it.

Speaker 1: 56:40

They said it was drunk. Okay, can I? Can I add a little asterisk? Can it? Can there be more like, like, for example? Let me give you an illustration. Let's say my wife painted it.

Speaker 2: 56:53

Right now there's an added emotional connection to this painting well, there was an emotional connection before you liked it no no, yeah, but like if it's a purchase, it's way different than a gift of someone else.

Speaker 1: 57:08

Do you agree with me or no?

Speaker 2: 57:10

It is, but I think that's a cop out. I think you got to decide on the parameters I set, like I know where you're going with it, but you know it's interesting because you might not be able to come up with an answer, but the fact that you were trying to make that first one work is kind of an answer, right. Yeah, you'd be more willing to have that one that people hate, but you love it and you find it valuable.

Speaker 1: 57:36

I think so. I think in the long run I would Okay, because, okay, here's another variable to throw in the place. Who sees it more? Me, or the people are coming into my house, me, so like yeah so like if I have a painting I hate I'm the one that sees it the most like if there's a painting that people love but you know they come over once in a while and they're like oh, oh, this is amazing, but I hate it. Like I'd rather see something every day that I love than have a couple people just be haters.

Speaker 1: 58:09

you know, yeah, you can't cop out.

Speaker 2: 58:13

What about you?

Speaker 1: 58:17

You can't cop out. You can't cop out. But what about you? Option A or B, and why?

Speaker 2: 58:25

I mean it's hard for me because I'm the one that kind of like made the question and, in a way, I feel like, yeah, I feel like, I feel like a is a like option.

Speaker 2: 58:36

One is a correct and, morally, you know, upstanding answer to the question. Right, because if you answered even, if that's the truth I mean the fact that someone's willing to offer $10 million even if I'm not going to trade it would that be enough to make me like it? Like, would that change my perspective on it? It shouldn't right. Like the obvious answer is A. The obvious answer is number one.

Speaker 2: 59:01

You should go with what you love and you know, select that even if people hate it. But you know when I think of the function of art or anything that you know that's material Like this wouldn't translate if we're talking about a friend, you know, if we replace the piece of art with a friend, it wouldn't translate a piece of art with a friend.

Speaker 2: 59:25

It wouldn't translate. But when it comes to art, you know, maybe the value of a piece of art to me is something that you can talk about. You know something that people like. So in that way, you know, my opinion versus 100 opinions is outweighed and am I worth more than 100 people's opinions? I don't know. Like, if you analyze it that way, maybe you could work out answering number two, but I still think I would go with a right like. In fact it would probably be. It's probably the only answer like, if you, if you go with the b, like you're admitting that the way you value things in your life is through others, and I think that's a hard admission, even though it's true for a lot of people.

Speaker 1: 1:00:07

I think I wouldn't, I wouldn't want to admit that yeah and well, and if you can, internally, can admit that, well then try to work on that right. Because yeah for me, for me, with that signaling, right, what's? You know? We've had this conversation before that. I've always had a.

Speaker 1: 1:00:26

I think there was a moment I don't know how old I was when I started to. I think it was an issue with my dad that I started to want not let others control my emotions, because if someone's, because if someone's affecting me right, like, let's say, they make me angry, they have some set of control over me, and I hated that idea. I hated the idea that someone else is somehow controlling me. So it helped me to like, forgive people. It helped me to not internalize external factors to my life. It was a great, great thing. I loved it. I'm glad that I applied that to my life.

Speaker 1: 1:01:02

So with this case, with material things, for me that signals that someone else is controlling a big part of my life, and not only is it a big part of my life, it could potentially ruin my life Because, for example, the world values materialism. You know, buy the biggest house, buy the biggest, newest car technology. You know you can keep adding clothes name brands If we go through their value scale. If we go through that value scale, then they're controlling me and maybe I can't even afford those things. But I buy them because my value system is someone else's value system and then now I'm ruining my life a little bit.

Speaker 2: 1:01:48

So yeah that's why that's my fear of someone living that way, or even myself, if I fall into that skill yeah, I mean, we could probably spend more time with Hector the Collector, but we should probably move on, just shout out to hector the collector.

Speaker 1: 1:02:02

Respect the time of our listeners, yeah he's, he's a true one.

Speaker 2: 1:02:07

He's a true one. Is it my turn? Yeah, it's my turn. Your turn, yep. So I guess it's been so high here in arizona that I've been kind of like reading about snowballs and frozen dreams.

Speaker 2: 1:02:17

This next one is called frozen dream, okay, and you find it in the book of poems. A light in the attic is the name of the book. So a frozen, frozen dream. I'll take the dream I had last night and put it in my freezer. So someday long and far away, when I'm an old gray geezer, I'll take it out and thaw it out, this lovely dream of frozen, and boil it up and sit me down and dip my old cold toes in. So we're snowballing our frozen dreams. Do you feel like it's even possible? Does this even make any logical sense? Or is it just comedy, like something that's meant to sound funny? Do you think people do this where they dream of something, whether it was last night or, you know, over the lapse of a couple of years, where they have this goal or dream and they decide to put it in a freezer, like it was, you know, a drink? I do think so. You do think so? Is it possible?

Speaker 1: 1:03:23

I think, do I? It depends what you mean by that. Do you mean is it possible to then achieve the dream? Is that what you mean, yeah? Is it no? I don't think it's zero.

Speaker 2: 1:03:34

What are your thoughts on it, so high?

Speaker 1: 1:03:36

kind of like bumble on mumble on it, mumble my rap on it rap on it.

Speaker 1: 1:03:42

Yeah, just chew out so how I I view this circumstance is almost like a mother who has an unplanned child, right? Okay, maybe this mother's dream was to become a chef, right? Or loves cooking and would love to own a restaurant one day. That's the dream. But her circumstances change and now she's having a child, or, hopefully, with the father there, they're helping her, but she's having a child. So now she puts this dream saying like oh, when my son's out in college or, you know, as an adult, I'll then, you know, try to achieve that dream. I do think this happens a lot, that people put dreams in the freezers. I think the percentage of the people who open that freezer and pull the dream out again is like 1%. I think a lot of people let the dreams die in the freezer, and that that breaks my heart, but that's what I think, and what are there any dreams in your freezer?

Speaker 2: 1:04:49

is it full of dreams?

Speaker 1: 1:04:51

dude, I think that's if I were to find myself. I'm like a dream, a hobo dreamer. You know like I have zero financial way to achieve the dreams, but but I, I'm gonna get there one day. No, I. I think my wife would describe me as a big dreamer, always having ideas. I think you and I are like that. I think we. That's why we love, we talk about things. We try to imagine ourselves future, hoyle and carlos, having a margarita in hawaii or something, or some tropical island and somewhere you know, I think you know.

Speaker 2: 1:05:23

It makes me think of this idea that you know people put things in kind of a back burner have you heard that before? Like whatever they hope or dream I mean, I think you mentioned a point that I wanted to bring up. But it's like career over kids, or kids come in and they come over everything. You know like they. You kind of switch gears, like when you're on this path, and then something happens that you know like they, you kind of switch gears, like when you're on this path, and then something happens that you know this path becomes no longer viable. You cannot do it, but you're not ready to give up yet and you put it in the freezer per se and then you come back to it later, when it's easier, when it's possible. Does it, does it taste the same? Like, let's think about a meal, oh wow. Like, let's think about a meal. Like, oh wow, you can, you can freeze, you know, preserve a meal that you had, or some ice cream to enjoy later. You know, in the far away. It says here someday, long and far away, and you can just sit down and enjoy it. Then you know.

Speaker 2: 1:06:16

Let me give an example to illustrate this. Let's say you know, you're young, don't have a of money and your dream is to open a coffee shop, let's say but it's just too hard, right, getting the lease and the recipes and the managing employees. It just becomes an insurmountable or something that you can't accomplish at the moment. So you put it in the back burner and you work, you do your thing. Later on you decide, okay, okay, I have enough savings. This would be a lot more possible like. This is a. This is something I can achieve. I could just easily grab it from the freezer and boil it up and boom, it's here. Does it taste the same? If you wait till it's easier, bro, if you wait till, it's like totally possible. So or should, what is there some worth and value in? You know this is going to be a lot harder to do now. My circumstances are a lot more difficult, but I should give it a shot anyways. What do you think I?

Speaker 1: 1:07:12

think, linguistically, how you're describing it being easier is incorrect in my opinion. Okay, what is the correct way? No, no, because, well, the way you're describing it, because, like, as long as the dream is still there, I don't think it devalues the dream. Once you, if anything, I think it tastes better. Um, because this is my reasoning, because you plan, like you're still doing things to get there, you know, because you know you're working live, you're saving money. Well, this is my coffee shop fund, this is my coffee shop fund. Yeah, you know. So, like you're still working for the dream. Once you get there, you'll get there, and I do think I see your perspective, or where you're trying to get to, of you know, well, forget all the variables I'm going to put in the work and you know if it's gonna, you know, fight tooth and nail until I achieve this dream. I think that's cool and valuable, but I don't think it's more valuable than someone who who slowly grinds to get to the dream.

Speaker 2: 1:08:15

As long as the dream isn't forgotten is my point, I think now like maybe I'm reading too much into this again and this is why this podcast came to be right, because maybe we read too much into some stuff. Maybe the poem is very simple and straightforward the art.

Speaker 1: 1:08:30

The author is like what are you guys talking about?

Speaker 2: 1:08:32

he's like they completely got it wrong. But you know, his last phrase is when this lovely dream of him that he frozen comes back to life. He would boil it up and sit down with it and dip his old, cold toes in. You see that that's interesting that he used that phrase because he didn't say prepare it and eat the dream like we don't know if it was food.

Speaker 2: 1:08:57

We don't know what it, what it was, yeah, yeah, but he used the phrase dip my old toes in. You know, think, for example, like, maybe your dream is not really like material, or you know it has nothing to do with that. Let's move aside. Move aside from that. Let's say, your dream is to go to madagascar. You, you want to see, you want to, you know, meet the crew where the movie was filmed. You want to meet the crew where the movie was filmed. You?

Speaker 1: 1:09:22

want to meet the penguins.

Speaker 2: 1:09:24

Yeah, you want to meet Marty.

Speaker 1: 1:09:25

You want to meet Marty?

Speaker 2: 1:09:26

and hang out with him.

Speaker 1: 1:09:27

That's your dream.

Speaker 2: 1:09:28

That's what you want and you can't do it, or it would be too hard, it would require work and savings. If you freeze it and wait too long, right, like, let's say you're older, you can still go, but you're probably not going to do the. You know the excursions where you walk you're probably going to be in the safari just in the Jeep. If you do that, it's kind of like you just dip your toes in. Yeah, Does it lose value Was?

Speaker 2: 1:09:55

it worth it to just push forward and do it and get the full experience, instead of waiting and maybe make it way easier. Easier, because it'd be a lot easier. You're gonna have a lot more means to actually take on this this trip, but the result is that you only dip your toes in it at that point and I think that's what's being illustrated with this poem, because I don't think it was a positive poem.

Speaker 1: 1:10:15

I think it, like what I was trying to get to, is that I think most people, this is what happens, so they put this dream in a freezer and then, once, once, they can kind of achieve it. They don't really get to enjoy it because it waited too long. So I don't think that that's the best way to do it, because that's going to happen. You're going to just barely a little bit enjoy it, and that's so sad, sad. Yeah, I think again, I think majority of people live this way, because I do think society is, is kind of guided to oh well, you'll retire at 60? Like why is that the norm? Like, why do I want to retire at 60, fam? Like what if I want to retire when I'm 33? You know I'm saying like what, why is this? You know, like there's this mentality of working, working, working, working, and then you'll get that, you'll get to 60 and you'll buy yourself an RV and go visit all the United States. You're old, you don't have the energy anymore.

Speaker 1: 1:11:12

And I do think there's circumstances to circumstances, right, this doesn't fit all, but I do think there's value in planning when to pull out that dream out of the freezer. But don't wait too long because you'll get freezer burn yeah, I think you're definitely right.

Speaker 2: 1:11:29

Do you want to move on to one of your next ones?

Speaker 1: 1:11:32

yeah, I have a short one. I have a short one. Uh, it's titled early bird, early bird, yes. It says oh, if you're an bird, be an early bird and catch the worm for your breakfast plate. If you're a bird, be an early bird, but if you're a worm, sleep late.

Speaker 1: 1:11:56

That's a short one so, so how my take on this, on this early bird, here it's. It's, it's like a reimagination of the phrase right, the early bird catches a worm, right, we've heard that countless times. But that added last phrase saying but if you're a worm, sleep late, right, so you don't get eaten by these birds. Yeah, so what? I was again thinking when I read it.

Speaker 1: 1:12:27

My first knee-jerk reaction was like this was like um, act on your circumstances, but don't let your circumstances define you either. So like, take advantage. Like, for example, the bird. Like, take advantage that you're a bird and try to get the worm early, right, like that's your circumstance. But if you're a worm, right, it's counterintuitive. Like, oh, all the worms wake up early, they're going to eat me, so let me sleep late, let me protect myself. Angle, I was kind of taking it was um to am I taking advantage of my personal circumstance and not comparing myself to the bird, so to speak, or the worm, right, but just take advantage of my current circumstance yeah, I mean to me it brings those ideas to mind, but also what really kind of like speaks or like it's highlighted in my brain, is this idea of waking up early you know you've heard it like that phrase itself is kind of what I'm thinking.

Speaker 2: 1:13:32

Right, the early bird gets the worm. And even with us, you know people have been pushing this idea of wake up early. You know, wake up at 4 am work out, do these scenes get started early. You're gonna get so much ahead you can get so much more done.

Speaker 2: 1:13:47

And some people like including myself maybe, especially my brother we don't like to wake up early, we like to like sleep late and you know a lot of people get a lot of work done, like at 11 12, and it's different, right like, if you try to force me to wake up early, I probably won't get much done in the morning. And if you know, honestly, to wake up early, you have to go to sleep early. So knowing whether you're a bird or a worm makes a difference in how, the way you're going to lead your life, right like so knowing your circumstances and understanding them and not trying to, you know, have this, you know, following advice, whoever gives it, or, you know, blanket, you know fits all. You know genre of like doing things like some people should do this and some other people should do this other thing. When it comes to some things, I think waking up is one of those right like, if Like, if you're the worm that wakes up too early, you're in trouble because the bird is coming.

Speaker 2: 1:14:46

So, I mean, I don't know, I think that's the only thing that really speaks to me on that one. Maybe that is one of like for me, like one of those surface poems, maybe.

Speaker 1: 1:14:54

I'm wrong, maybe I'm sure it has a cool illustration with it. No, yeah, it was a lighthearted poem. I was just curious. So you consider yourself a night owl then?

Speaker 2: 1:15:04

probably more, more than more than an early bird for sure yeah, and I'm the opposite. I think I consider myself early bird personally you were some weird mix of the both people before when I met you you were neither.

Speaker 1: 1:15:18

Oh, you're right. Yeah, bro, I was um.

Speaker 2: 1:15:22

Yeah, no, when you met me bro I would sleep like three hours.

Speaker 1: 1:15:26

It was terrible, bro, I mean okay. So for those who don't know, when I was in arizona for a long time, my dad had a carpet business and I worked for him and we woke up because of the, because of the sun beating on us, we would, uh, wake up at 2 30 in the morning, to be out of the house at 3 30 and be at the job site at four. Yeah, that was like my life every day, basically, even the weekend sometimes. But but I but I'm young, you know I'm young and and I have friends and when I hang out, well, everyone has a life going to school or work, and when people do things is in the evening. Life going to school or work, and when people do things, is in the evening. So the smart thing to do was to sacrifice my social life for my health. Right, that was a smart thing to do. Like, hey, well, my circumstances don't allow me to go out and hang out with my friends because I have to work, but I said nah fam yeah, it's crazy man.

Speaker 2: 1:16:20

You were crazy. I mean, you might end up with the pacemaker at 30, but you really lived it to the fullest back then it wasn't a sustainable equation, but but you know, I did it.

Speaker 1: 1:16:33

I did it, it was fun. So, yeah, I am for sure more of an early bird. Um, I do think how you're saying there's wisdom and just understanding what works for you.

Speaker 2: 1:16:41

Yeah, don't try to force yourself, you know like, like you said, you're not playing the devil's advocate. I have seen or heard different things that say that you know humans are meant to sleep during the night. So if there's a better one of the two, I think waking up early is the healthier thing for our bodies. Like the night is meant more to rest, like certain things happen inside our body, apparently during the night, where it cleanses itself, and it can only happen if you're asleep.

Speaker 1: 1:17:07

So those late night sessions.

Speaker 2: 1:17:09

Maybe you're not that healthy, who knows? Yeah, that's a good point have you?

Speaker 1: 1:17:13

have you ever done an overnight job?

Speaker 2: 1:17:16

actually maybe I'm embarrassed to admit it, but like when you were living that lifestyle or like, oh, maybe I could do it and I got a job at a company doing um interpreting, and you get to select your shift right, like you could pick between overnight.

Speaker 1: 1:17:34

I don't think I know this story you don't know this story, it's probably a story I don't think I know this.

Speaker 2: 1:17:40

back then, when we were like going out more often, you would go to sleep like really late and wake up really early, yeah, and we wouldn't like, maybe like your more available time would be kind of during the day, like after one or two, till like eight is when you were more available to like go to the gym and do other stuff. Well, I had this opportunity to get a job and I could select the schedule because it's a 24 hour. To like eight is when you were more available to go to the gym and do other stuff. Well, I had this opportunity to get a job and I could select the schedule because it was a 24-hour company, so it's a call center, they're open 24 hours, and there was actually it's not like I made a decision just for this, but also during the training, because it's like a week-long training, I realized that the night shift is, we could could say more boring in a way, because there's less calls coming in, okay, but you get paid the same.

Speaker 2: 1:18:27

so if I could manage to stay awake during the night. It would have been, you know, a lot less work, for you know the income I would be making for the same amount of you know energy you're expending.

Speaker 1: 1:18:39

You're making right.

Speaker 2: 1:18:40

I mean, it's not like I could be on my phone or anything, but it's like it was a regulated call center but I could be, you know, you know doing a hustle, or I think people took books. You could be reading a book or something like that, something that you can kind of like put to the side if a call comes in during the day you didn't actually get those opportunities because you know you were back to back most of the time, but during the night you could.

Speaker 2: 1:19:03

So when I selected a schedule, I think I picked the schedule that was like 1230 to like 6 am or something like that. It was crazy, crazy. That was dumb Lasted about two weeks and then I moved to like an early morning schedule. I think it was like 6.30 to 12.30.

Speaker 1: 1:19:24

Because I was doing part-time.

Speaker 2: 1:19:25

If I'm not mistaken, I think I was only working part-time.

Speaker 1: 1:19:29

That's crazy, I didn't know that. No, I mean, bro, it's not, we weren't meant to be working at night. I mean, you remember when I was working at the food warehouse too, like overnight, when I was trying to save up to buy the ring for lynette? Um, oh, I mean, I was in new york back then, but oh yeah, I mean it was pandemic.

Speaker 1: 1:19:48

Pandemic had hit and um, I, uh, I was trying to save up to get married and my job I was working at lint and I was making like 16 bucks an hour or whatever. It was like 15 an hour and like it was just taking forever to save and I'm like man, how can I make progress? So I found this long story short. I found this food food warehouse job. Yeah, and because of the pandemic it wasn't shut down, because it was a necessary job. It was like a food. You know, you're for food, for walmart and stuff, but my schedule was like 8 pm to 6 am, but my schedule was like 8 pm to 6 am. Bro, I did it for three months just enough to save for the ring and I quit. But, bro, it was the worst dude, it was the worst Like man.

Speaker 2: 1:20:33

I told you man, five carats was too much, but you didn't listen to me, whatever.

Speaker 1: 1:20:39

I didn't buy five carats everybody I'm broke. I didn't buy five carats everybody I'm broke, I didn't buy five carats, if you see him on the street, take his wallet. No, I bought some moistenite fam. Yeah take care. You know I didn't want to get some blood diamonds on my hand. You know what I'm saying. Anyway, any other quotes you might? It's your turn, right.

Speaker 2: 1:21:00

My turn. Okay, yes, long one or short one, cause I think I'm running out of sunlight, here.

Speaker 1: 1:21:06

Oh, okay Uh this can be the last one. So may a long one, but this can be the last one, okay.

Speaker 2: 1:21:11

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:21:12

So I don't know if we should read it cause it is long, but I'll read it. I'll go ahead. The giving tree poem by shell silverstein. Once there was a there was a tree and she loved a little boy and every day the boy would come and he would gather her leaves and make them into crowns and play king of the forest. He would climb up her trunk and swing from her branches and eat apples and they would play hide and go seek and when he was tired he would sleep in her shade and the boy loved the tree very much and the tree was happy.

Speaker 2: 1:21:54

But time went by and the boy grew older and the tree was often alone. Then one day the boy came to the tree and the tree said come, boy, come and climb up my trunk and swing from my branches and eat apples and play in the shade and be happy in my shade and be happy. I am too old, too big to climb and play, said the boy. I want to buy things and have fun. I want some money. I'm sorry, said the tree, but I have no money. I have only apple leaves and apples. Take my apples, boy, and sell them in the city, then you will have money and you will be happy. And so the boy climbed up the tree and gathered her apples and carried them away and the tree was happy. But the boy stayed away for a while and the tree was happy. But the boy stayed away for a while and the tree was sad. And then one day the boy came back and the tree shook with joy Shock Shook with joy, or shock with joy. And she said come, boy, climb up my trunk and swing from my branches and be happy. I am too busy to climb trees, said the boy. I want a house to keep me warm. He said I want a house to keep me warm. He said I want a wife and I want children, and so I need a house. Can you give me a house? I have no house at the tree. The forest is my house. But you may cut off my branches and build the house, then you will be happy. You're dying over there. It's sad, like a heartbreak. We're about halfway, but you're probably getting the theme of's sad, bro, it's like a heartbreak. We're about halfway, but you're probably getting the theme of it.

Speaker 2: 1:23:28

And so the boy cut off the branches and carried them away to build his house and the tree was happy. But the boy stayed away for a long time and when he came back, the tree was so happy she could hardly speak. Come, boy, she whispered, come and play. I am too old and sad to play, said the boy. I want a boat that will take me far away from here. Can you give me a boat? Cut down my trunk and make a boat, said the tree, then you can sail away and be happy. And so the boy cut down her trunk and made a boat and sailed away. And the tree was happy, but not really. And after a long time the boy came back again.

Speaker 2: 1:24:12

I am sorry, boy, said the tree, but I have nothing left to give you. My apples are gone. My teeth are too weak for apples, said the boy. My branches are gone, said the tree. You cannot swing from them. I am too old to swing on branches, said the boy. My trunk is gone, said the tree, you cannot climb. I am too tired to branches, said the boy. My trunk is gone, said the tree, you cannot climb. I am too tired to climb, said the boy. I am sorry, sighed the tree. I wish that I could give you something, but I have nothing left. I am just an old stump, I am sorry, I don't need very much now, said the boy, just a quiet place to sit and rest. I am very tired. Well, said the boy, just a quiet place to sit and rest. I am very tired. Well, said the tree, strengthening herself up as much as she could. Well, an old stump is good for sitting and resting. Come, boy, sit down, sit down and rest. And the boy did, and the tree was happy. What do you think?

Speaker 1: 1:25:11

you like it. Uh, yeah, I mean it's a good, it's really good, it's really good.

Speaker 2: 1:25:16

Um, when I was reading, I was so afraid because like this is gonna end bad like I know, in my mind I was like I thought it's gonna be like at some point he would come back and the tree wouldn't talk anymore. That's what I kind of envisioned when I was halfway through it. Is it a good ending, like do you think this is a happy poem or a sad poem actually? In one second, I'm gonna turn the light yeah, that's so fascinating it was.

Speaker 1: 1:25:41

I mean it was such a good poem. Yeah, I mean it was such a good poem. Um, I mean, I man, I can't say it's happy. I I do think it ends on a positive. No, a little bit, but at the same time, like you feel bad for this tree, like bro, like you're not being valued, like why are you but? But she, the tree, keeps saying that it's almost like her whole purpose. What brought the tree happiness was giving, yeah, and not really receiving. I mean she wanted him to play, but at the same time it was giving, it wasn't receiving. So maybe it is positive, like the tree just always, throughout the tree's life, was happy to give and happy to be useful, I guess.

Speaker 2: 1:26:35

Do you think there's a symbolism behind it? You think there's. There's something the author was trying to like, explain or say to the author, the listener. What are the listeners to think?

Speaker 1: 1:26:45

leave it in the comments there you go. You're pulling on youtube right now boy. Um, you know what. You know what's sad, I feel like. The tree symbolizes parents and then the child represents well us as children you know what I was thinking.

Speaker 2: 1:27:04

I was thinking the same thing, but you know why? Because this boy grew up right, like at some point he was too old, so he was not a boy anymore. Yet up until the end, it says in the boy did, and who sees us as boys or, you know, girls, regardless of our age?

Speaker 1: 1:27:21

parents, yeah, parents, yeah, our parents, in this case, like a motherly figure right, because it says and she loved the little boy.

Speaker 2: 1:27:30

So the tree is a woman or a girl.

Speaker 1: 1:27:33

Yeah, yeah. So I think that's the symbolism there. I think we agree that's what I saw there that it's symbolizing how parents throughout a child's life will always be happy to give. But it also made me angry at the child for just using the parents right and not giving back a little bit. Right, because all the all the tree wanted was, oh, play with me, like, spend some time with me. But the child kept, or the boy kept saying, well, I don't have time, I have my goals and my job. I want to make money, I want to make a house, yeah, so I? I do think it's like a critique to children, like are you valuing what your parents while you have them?

Speaker 1: 1:28:16

and give back a little bit, because parents aren't asking, oh, buy me up, buy me stuff, it's just spend time with them so I don't know it makes me value my mom, you know, and make me like want to call her right now, you know, and just tell her I love her it's also interesting how, like it kind of explains how life gets a little more complicated as you age.

Speaker 2: 1:28:36

Right, this little boy at the beginning of the poem was happy, just swinging from the tree, you know, climbing up, you know being with the tree, and that made him happy and that made the tree happy. It was like a mutual exchange where both of them ended up feeling better. But as the boy progressed, his happiness changed. Well, the tree didn't. The tree was still making the boy happy or spending time with the boy. That was its source of happiness.

Speaker 2: 1:29:04

In this poem, the boy, though, however, he had all these other plans, like he wanted to have a house and a wife and children. He wanted to buy things, he wanted to have a boat, all these dreams that maybe at some point he forgot. If you look at the poem, the only time when the tree wasn't happy is when it said that the boy left for a long time. You know like he would come back, you know very late, and the tree was happy, but not really, and I think that's where I agree with you that it is a critique to children, for you know being maybe ungrateful or not seeing.

Speaker 2: 1:29:43

You know how much they're asking or demanding for you know like and you could get mad at the boy in this scenario oh yeah, I was angry when you're reading.

Speaker 1: 1:29:53

I was like this dude. You know, my fear was that that her like at when, when he said I want to build a house, I thought that's where the tree was gonna die.

Speaker 2: 1:30:02

I thought she was gonna build the tree out of the corpse of the tree, you know, um, but I'm I mean I mean it's a children's book maybe that's why I didn't end so violently, but but yeah, it did make me angry though but it could also be like symbolic of, you know, how we, in most cases, the people and the listeners that have been blessed with having good parents, how we take on, you know, like from them at any stage of life, and it seems kind of like this uneven exchange where we are the takers and they are the givers and you know they they're willing to give up till, like, up to the trunk, like up until like that.

Speaker 2: 1:30:49

Say like there's nothing else to give. Like the tree was saying like I'm sorry, like I don't know why you came for, like I have nothing left, dude dang yeah but I mean, that's what made the tree happy too. So I don't know like I don't think like you can get mad at the boy, but the tree was willing to do it and it made him happy.

Speaker 1: 1:31:12

It made her happy to be giving, so can we, can, we, can we critique the tree, though then did?

Speaker 2: 1:31:19

did he give too much? Did he give you know more than he was able to?

Speaker 1: 1:31:23

well, I I mean again, we like to play that at the devil's advocate of like we could critique the tree too. I do understand that it would bring happiness, but now the question is, you know, was the tree bringing like spoiling the boy? Now, I guess is the word you know, because the boy came back when he needed something and oh yeah, take from me, you know. So like we can critique the tree too, even though, like it did bring the tree happiness. But was it the right decision? I don't know.

Speaker 2: 1:31:58

I mean you know what I was thinking too. It could be an you know, prolonged way of saying we come back to our roots because if you think about it. You know, a tree has roots yeah, the boy constantly, at different stages in life, came back to it whether he wanted money or he wanted all these things. He would come back to his roots and it's kind of like this you know cycle where, like he would leave for a while and then he would come back. You know, is that maybe?

Speaker 1: 1:32:33

maybe that's what the author was was trying to explain too yeah, maybe like, and you mean like cultural roots, or do you mean just roots of like where you were raised?

Speaker 2: 1:32:42

yeah, I mean you, you take those lessons.

Speaker 2: 1:32:45

It's like they say you know, when you're a parent, like you take those lessons with you no matter what stage the boy was in, even though he was an adult or an old man, at the end of the poem he was still a boy, he has. He had less experience than in the tree, you know, less knowledge, and he kept coming back to it. You know, and it's that interaction of you know, looking for that source of wisdom, you know, that kind of takes us to the next step.

Speaker 1: 1:33:21

Wow, man, it's it's so crazy how we could we could talk an hour over books you know that were, or these poems that were designed more so for children. Again, that's. This is something that makes me happy because it just shows the power of you know, talking about a topic and diving a little bit deeper than just reading it that one time. So anyone who's listening or watching this, what we covered was Shel Silverstein's various works. I covered more where the sidewalk ends, and Carlos had a couple other different works that he highlighted. So we recommend, you know it's. What do you, what do you think of this author? Because you know I chose him. What's your, what's your take?

Speaker 2: 1:33:57

I've actually really enjoyed him. You know this is an author that it was completely new to me. Like I said, I've seen him at different stores, like his art kind of when you think it's children's book I think a lot of people that read maybe more than I do they would have instantly said him right, because he's very known too.

Speaker 2: 1:34:16

But it was completely new and I still had one more poem that we probably didn't get to. But it was easy to find something to share and kind of go over, and we invite the listeners to do the same. If you're looking for a quick read, something to just enjoy an afternoon with, I think he's a good, obvious choice.

Speaker 1: 1:34:34

Yeah, exactly so thank you for tuning in to this latest episode of Re-Enrolled. Again, this is Joel and this is Carlos Super lagged and it's all good.

Speaker 2: 1:34:49

It's all good and then stay tuned.

Speaker 1: 1:34:53

We're analyzing things weekly. We'll jump around from books to poems to current events or any really topic that we can dive into more I don't want to use the word educationally, because we're not no professors, but trying our best to look deeper than the surface level of whatever we're consuming.

Speaker 2: 1:35:13

And that wraps up our discussion for this episode.

Speaker 1: 1:35:16

We hope you enjoyed diving into this topic as much as we did.

Speaker 2: 1:35:19

If you found value in our conversation.

Speaker 1: 1:35:21

Don't forget to subscribe and leave us a review and share this episode with your friends and anyone else who loves to learn.

Speaker 2: 1:35:27

We've got more exciting topics coming up, so stay tuned.

Speaker 1: 1:35:29

Thanks for joining us on Re-Enrolled. Until next time, keep so, stay tuned. Thanks for joining us on Re-Enrolled. Until next time, keep learning and stay curious.