Episode #21: Greg Sheley

Greg Sheley is the Director of Athletics and Head Women's Basketball Coach at Lane Community College in Eugene, Oregon.  He has had an illustrious 32-year career as a Head College Coach that includes 7 years at Butte College in Oroville, California and the last 25 years at Lane CC.

He is well on his way to the Hall of Fame with a career record of 789-204 (.821 win percentage).  His team's accolades include:

• 8 30-win seasons
• 16 league/region titles (4 at Butte, 12 at Lane)
• 7 NWAC Championship Titles
• 15 Final Four appearances (1 at Butte, 14 at Lane)
• 21 consecutive postseason appearances.
• 84 game home win streak from 2002-2011

Learn more about Greg Sheley here:  https://www.lanetitans.com/sports/wbkb/coaches/sheley_greg?view=bio

Transcript

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Hey, everybody. Welcome to the significant coaching podcast. I'm coach Matt Rogers. I'm so glad to have you back again. I don't know what it is, but I keep interviewing these coaches. That are knocking my socks off. I it's amazing to me how many. What I would consider. 10 out of 10 level coaches, gold standard coaches. That I'd never met that I never heard before or heard of before. That are out there doing amazing things, running programs, coaching, teaching, and evaluating. And today's coach is one of the best I've ever met. Greg Sheely from lane community college. up in Oregon. He coaches in the Northwest athletic conference up there and the sky is amazing. 32 years as the head coach at lane seven at Butte college in California. 25 at lane community college. This record of blow you away. 789 wins and only 204 losses. That's an 82%. Winning percentage. Unheard of. 16 league and regional titles, seven N WAC championship titles. 15 final four appearances. 21 consecutive post-season appearance. And he's got an from 2002 to 2011. That that a nice stretch. They want 84 straight home games. A amazing, amazing, amazing. coach Sheely has fantastic story. it's in his DNA, it's in his blood to coach and teach and lead and mentor. And I'm so glad that he followed his heart into this career. what a great role model for all student athletes and in, in kids. What a great role model for guys like me. that are in the coaching world. so I was just really impressed with him. So this is going to be a good one. he's going to give you a lot, He is really humble and really modest. Like most coaches are when they're trying, when I'm trying to get them to talk about themselves. But he tells such great stories about how he got to where he is. He, he doesn't cut any corners. He doesn't. doesn't put his kids in bad situations. His kids are come Delaine to win, to get an education and then to go somewhere else and continue to do great. And he prepares them for all that. So without further ado, please enjoy great. All right, coach, we got to talk first about you being a Dodgers fan because I've got my Jackie Robinson Brooklyn hat on. So what, have you been a Dodgers fan since you were, can you remember? Yeah, literally my whole life. you know, I don't know how it started. I think, you know, I had an aunt and uncle that lived in Southern California and we would visit them. That was the big vacation, you know, I grew up with teachers, so there wasn't a whole lot of, vacation time when we were young, but when we could visit family and, and just got to see them Garvey say, you know, Russell, that's, that's what I remember the start being in the Fernando mania. and I think that's where I got hooked being able to sit in the bleachers back when they truly were bleachers at Dodger stadium was a lot of fun. So that was, that was, a great opportunity for me. And, and I just really enjoyed, baseball my entire life. Well, I'm a huge Cubs fan. So when, when I hear Ron say, you know, the penguin was, you know, at the heart of my youth, you know, playing third base for the Cubs and that, that 84 team that had it couldn't finish the deal. So, yeah. And you'll love this. This'll be a lot to you. When I was 13 years old and I grew up in a town of 2000 people, just tiny little town, And in our town, we had a photographer and he, he took pictures for Sports Illustrated, all the major magazines. And he was just a great guy. I mean, he, he was just always around. He is at every high school game taking pictures. So anything I have from my high school career, it's because of, of Dave Bush. And Dave called my dad when I was 13 years old and just said, Hey, I've got to go into Chicago. And take some pictures for a couple of these golf tournaments, celebrity golf tournaments. And I'd like to take Matt and my friend Brad with me. Would you guys be okay with it? And you know, my dad was like, yeah, bring them back alive. And we're happy, you know, and you know, this was the eighties and, and Dave took us in. And we drove into this golf course, this really luxurious private golf course. And we walk into the course and there's this big tent behind the clubhouse and we go in and sit down and within 10 minutes, we're sitting at this table. They've got this huge lunch that, you know, buffet lunch within 10 minutes. Lou Brock, Ernie Banks, Dr. J and Steve Garvey sit at this big table with us, this big round table. So at 13 years old, I'm staring at all my idols, all the guys that I've been watching play and dreaming about, you know, they're sitting there with me. That's amazing. Yeah. It was, it was, I have zero memories. You know, I can't remember anything, you know, past 25 or before 25, but I remember that day. So I, as a Steve Garvey fan, I figured, yeah, no, no, that, that, that must've been a lot of fun. I, you know, childhood memories of your idols are amazing. Yeah. They, and they signed everything. They, and anything I had baseball cards, news clippings, they, they signed everything. They were just the sweetest guys and the most caring guys that ever been around. And it was a lot of fun. So. So you, you've had this amazing career and, and you were a great player. You played junior college, went to Chico state, had a great career. And I want to get into how you got into women's coaching, but where did, where did your love of athletics and coaching, where did that come from? I think it came from my childhood. My, my father, Was a junior high school back in those days, junior high, where I grew up with seventh, eighth ninth grade. So he was the athletic director at the junior high school, but he coached track and cross country. So even though I didn't, end up pursuing those, those type of, sports. I was around sports and athletics, I think all my life. I was fortunate to be grow up playing every sport that there was. And so I think I started with that affinity and then, you know, as you get older and you start realizing, hey, I want to keep doing this longer, you know, I went to juco route, was able to play both baseball and basketball in juco, which really was the main reason why I went that route. I wasn't quite sure. Geez, you know, I don't want to give up either one of these. and so I had some great opportunities and I think that those first few years at JUCO really kind of solidified the fact that I'm like, okay, I got to stay in athletics somehow. coaching seems to be the logical thing, you know, get into teaching, coaching and just be a high school coach and go back home and try to fill a legacy. And that's, that's basically where it started. It was in your DNA, wasn't it? I think so. Yeah. Yeah. I, I don't know if you know this about me, but I coached at the coach women at the university of Laverne for three years and I loved it to this day. I tell anybody that asks me, cause I coach men for a long, long time. And then I had three years coaching women. Anybody that asked me the difference, I said, coaching women was the best three years of my coaching career because they, they listen and they do it. You know, they're just, we're boys, you're constantly massaging egos and you're constantly trying to. Kind of range cats in and get them focused girls. It was just every day I knew what I was going to get and they were great. Now I was probably a little too intense for them. And some would tell you I was their favorite coach. And some would tell you I was their worst coach they ever had just because of that. But how did, how did you get your mind? You were a men's basketball player. You were a male athlete. How did you figure out that coaching the women was, was something that fit you? Well, I got into it kind of randomly, you know, as after I finished playing at Chico state, I was kind of a, you know, they weren't true grad assistants back in those days. I just kind of volunteered, helped out. was coaching a little bit with the, we had a JV program then was doing some of that, working camps, you know, every summer and, the local community college, guy just calls me out of the blue and says, Hey, how much are you getting paid over there at Chico state? And I said, nothing, I'm volunteering. He's like, I got 1, 500 for you to come out and be my assistant. And, you know, I was also trying to, Be the assistant at the local high school, which was where I played. And, and they had already had a staff set aside there. And so I, I come to the head coach at Chico state who I played for. And I said, I said, puck, you know, I got this opportunity. I really want to stay here and help you out, but you know, they're going to give me some money if, if I head out that way, he goes, you should take it. And I'm like, wow, I didn't know how to handle that. Does that mean you suck as a coach and get the heck out of here? Or, or was he really saying, hey, this is a good opportunity for you. You should explore it. so, I went ahead and, and got into that. And I think that career changing for me in the sense that I coached one year of junior college women as an assistant, then bounced back to the men. I was finishing up my student teaching at the time, so I wasn't able to continue to be the assistant at Butte College at that time. And so I went to Sierra College and was an assistant there as I was finishing up student teaching. And then, All of a sudden, you know, you get your teaching credential, it's job time. And so I was planning to go back to Butte college to be the assistant, with the coach that I worked with. And literally two weeks into the school year, he steps aside, takes another job and all of a sudden the AD is like, well, you want to be a head coach, huh? and, yeah, you know, Mike Liddell, he changed, changed my career path and gave me an opportunity that. Not many people would do, you know, given a young white guy, you know, white male, and, and, you know, Northern California and opportunity. I was young and I was, you know, to, to coach women. And so it was, interesting how that, provided me an opportunity and then go from there, Mike. Mike had a lot of confidence in me that I didn't even have in myself. So it was a great opportunity. And I really, really appreciated that. and so then I was at Butte for seven years and, to me coming to lane and not just a view for seven years, but an amazing run. yeah, we had some good years at Butte. I was really lucky. I had some really good players. Again, thinking back, you talked about, you know, you know, in too intense, you know, I, I didn't know any better. I didn't have a whole lot of mentors at that time, you know, you know, and so I think back to how many, how many games that, that we could have been better if I was a better coach and, and probably would have been a better mentor to, to some players that I had a better understanding. So, but it was still what an opportunity that, that I was, able to have. which then led to a career that I've been very fortunate with. Yeah, I've got 150 former players that would tell you the same thing. If only he was a better coach, what would you have? Exactly. Tell me about for you, what has been some of the joys that you've learned about yourself coaching women, man, I would agree with you. I think, Early on, you know, just the ability for for young women that are want to be sponges, they really wanted to learn, you know, they they would do what you do to their best of their ability, what you asked them to do without a whole lot of asking why. And I think early on. That probably was good for me because I don't know that I knew the wise. I think in the latter part of my career here, I've been better at, at being able to explain the wise and, and answer those questions and, and also then in, in turn, you know, advocate and, and really encourage, these young women to be self advocates and to ask reasons why, you know, there's always time and place, but, just to open those lines of communication. And I think that that. has helped me become a much better coach. Yeah, I think whenever we're in a position to coach and we have the ability to empower young people to stand up for themselves and to think analytically and and to think thoughtfully and learn how to express that any time we have the opportunity to help a teenager transition to an adult. It's it's it's why I do it. You know, it's I I live for those opportunities. I agree. I think the empowerment pieces is something that is, I think again, through my career, it really, when I started figuring out how to do that better, I think, the relationships were much better, the team chemistry was much better and, you know, it took me a while to figure that one out, unfortunately. So I'm glad that eventually I did. Yeah, it's, it's, it's nice when you have people around you that are patient enough and they see your value they, and they're willing to give you that time and, and, and runway because we all need it. Yes. Every coach I talked to, you know, and I, I just got off the, we just did a zoom with, Mike DeGeorge, the new head coach at Cal Poly and every coach I talked to. Has that same story that you had, you talked about Mike Liddell. You know, mine was Ray Shovlin and Rich Fanning that gave me a chance and mentored me and saw something in me that I probably didn't see in myself. You know, now to be able to give that to kids. Is that, is that a big part of why you keep doing what you do? Absolutely. And, and I think it's also, As my other role as the athletic director here at Lane, I think that I think back to Mike Liddell when I make hires, when, when young inexperienced coaches come through the door, a lot of people, you know, just look at experience and, and resumes and, I think, I try not to, and I think that I've done a good job, or I've tried to do a good job of giving opportunities to others as well that might not have the experience, but they have the passion, they have the desire, they have the organizational skills. They just need that chance because, you know, no one's going to get experienced until they get experience, right? And so, let's give them opportunities, especially at our level where it's high turnover rate anyways. and so I, I, I've taken, I think the experience that someone gave me and I tried to give back, to that, and empower others and, and it's really empowered me and I've really enjoyed that part of the job outside of the coaching and, and obviously within the coaching that that has been a great opportunity there. There's just not enough of you in the world because. you and I kind of talked about this before we hopped on and started to record how important is that coaches get coached. Right. You know, and there's a lot of ADs out there that make the hire and just say, okay, that's your island. Do it well. And then they don't have meetings of substance and they don't have meetings of coaching and or, and give them an orientation. How important is that for you to, to be that, to be that person for your coaches and, and how did they handle that? I think I didn't become the athletic director here till 2009. And so I had a pretty good coaching career and then a couple of good mentors here, coaching and administrative wise. And so I think when I took over speaking of resume, I think I had a little bit of cachet, but it still took me a while to then understand how to be a mentor to multiple coaches, not just directly in my, Field of expertise, but the you know, trying to kind of take a step back. I think that was a learning curve as well, but, but I've really, enjoyed that, that, that process now. I mean I have probably, you know, at least once a month, individual meetings with my coaches now, just generally, you know, not even chatting about, you know, Hey, this is what, you know, we need to do, but just talking in general about things learning more about them and finding ways, trying to gain their trust, I think, you know, and when you gain trust, I think that. you know, they were giving me the benefit of the doubt because I've been here a while and I've had success as a coach. I've had success as an athletic director. So they give you that benefit of the doubt. But I still think you need to gain their trust and doing that through those individual meetings instead of, you know, just always telling them what to do. I think the advice goes longer and I think that also then it makes you feel better when when they call you or they stop in their office and they're like, Hey, can I pick your brain about something? You know, like oh, yeah, excellent because you know, you don't want to Micromanage people you want to you know, them to do the job and and you want them to do it But also, you know as an administrator, you don't want to be Having people feel like you're unapproachable and like you said that they're out on an island To where then all of a sudden they make a mistake, you know They're not reconciling their travel reconciling their travel correctly or those type of things There's a lot of those things that you need to mentor as well and you know Those are things that if we don't communicate effectively i've found that early on I didn't communicate very effectively with that Then we ran into some problems. So i've really really learned a lot from that. I think that is then in turn You Again, goes right back to the coaching piece, you know, just that, that, that full circle of just mentoring and young people. It's awesome. I probably already know the answer to this, but I'm going to ask it anyways. You've had such an illustrious career and, and, and, and Lane's done really well in a lot of the sports and especially it's bad, including women's basketball. What, what, what motivates you today? Has your motivations changed? Yeah. It has people have asked me this recently, coming off our second back to back winning our seventh title, you know, is And COVID was a really big, that COVID year was a big reset for me. And I think I was kind of getting to my point in my career where I was starting to think, okay, you know, it might be time to step aside. It might be time to just kind of Right off into the sunset. But all of a sudden COVID hits and you just start really rethinking about why are we doing this? Because all of a sudden it was like, you're just fighting every day to, to have the administration understand what you're doing and why you need to be on campus and why you need to be around these people and that you can do it safely and that it can still be productive. And, and that these young people need this outlet. Right. And I needed it as well. And it just really changed my look on things. It just invigorated me. And man, I just thought, man, there's no way I'm quitting coaching this. This interaction is, is just so vital to who I am and my fiber and my core. And it just, you know, I, it really changed. it helped me a ton and yeah, and it's motivated me. I mean, there's always so much golf you can play. What are you going to do? Might as well keep coaching until they, they carry you off. That's right. That's kind of my mindset, you know, and then obviously having success too, you know, I mean, you can't, you can't put that by, but you know, being able to have more genuine feelings about what you're doing and just really increasing the interaction and the trust with your players and then having that all then culminate. With very successful seasons just to see the looks on their faces when they achieve their goals that you know Of course, we're recruiting them and we're telling them that we're gonna do that But then when you do it that's also another thing that is just that from coaching is just amazing And then even the administrative side when you see other programs and see that the looks on those kids faces have success It's it's really it's a great feeling man. We're we're in a I got the best job in the world, man. It's wonderful. And you've created it. You've created the best job in the world for you. So. I, it's amazing to me. I, you know, I did my research on you 32 years as, as a community college head coach, 16 league titles, sir, at least once every other year, you've won the league title 21 consecutive postseason appearances. 30 win seasons. I mean, I can find, I can find a hundred college coaches for you now that would cut off a finger just to have one 30 win season. You've had eight. This is very much a basketball coach question. What is the core of what you do that's allowed you to be this successful? Ooh, that's probably a few things. I, right away, I think the fact that I've been. fortunate enough to stay in one place for a long period of time. I think that that continuity and that consistently consistency at our level here in the Northwest, I think that that has that has been a big deal. I think that I've been very fortunate to be surrounded with assistant coaches that have been Able to stay with me for long periods of time. So there's continuity there Is that is that a huge value or what? Oh, it's it's unbelievable. It's unbelievable You know at our level where head coaches turn over a ton where i've been able to you know Have the the ability to to stay in one place be a full time employee that that has been huge The assistant coach has been huge and then I think that just over time, you know your core values your core being You It's been absorbed. And your culture now embraces that, you know winning is not everything. But when you're making the sacrifices that you know, I that that I personally make that our players make that our assistant coaches make that our colleges makes to allow us to have these opportunities that my family makes to allow me to have these opportunities. I think it's it's been you. amazing. And I think that that that we're able to effectively communicate that with our recruits, with our current players. And then when you build on something at a two year level where you can show that you are consistent for a long period of time it I think it draws attention that that helps In recruiting? Well, here, here's what's amazing. This is what I've always, I've had an enormous amount of of respect and admiration for junior college coaches because as a four year coach for many, many years, I always assumed, okay, I'm bringing in this freshman. It's going to take me at least a year to teach them how to play man to man defense. It's going to take me a year to teach them how to run the floor and, and space the floor and get the ball out of their hands. And then my sophomore year, I'm going to have three years where I'm going to be able to really grow them. You don't have that to be able to do that with constant, you know, you're probably bringing an eight to 10 new kids every single year. So that's, what's amazing about the success you've had. So. Now let's now I'm going to make you put your humility and your modesty on the shelf for a couple of minutes. Tell me about what that practice looks like on every five days and what you feel like has become the difference maker and winning your league and getting to the Nationals. What is what do you feel like you're doing that's That's unique and special. Well, I don't know that I'm doing anything unique or special, but, but we've been able to do it better than others. I, I think our attention to detail at our level because of what you talked about, where literally we have 18 months to get them in and get them out and then we need to get them to the next level. So, so really attention to detail early on with just the basic fundamentals trying to speed up that learning curve is very, very difficult, but, but it's what we do. And we have to do it. Well it's funny that you talk about spacing and defense. Yeah, absolutely. You know, at our level, in Oregon just recently, they started a shot clock so that you know, kids, kids within our region don't don't understand much more than zone defense. And so trying to teach in person to person and, you know, running and jumping and tempo and spacing all those things, you just have to do it and you have to really Build, build. I think when I was young and dumb, I spent way too much time trying to emphasize, you know, one thing, and we're going to stick with this until we get it type of thing. And through osmosis, through learning curves, through mentors, I think I've changed now to where. You know, my practices are way more organized and we're gonna spend X amount of time on something and and maybe come back to it later. But But the next day, boom, we're hitting it again. And so I would say the attention to detail. And then, obviously, we've been fortunate to recruit, you know, more. Players that are better than our opponents. And so that, that, that's the biggest deal. I mean, you know, the coach, when you have better players, they make you look really, really good. So I think a combination of being able to recruit young a quality young women that buy into what we do. And then are willing to put up with the attention to detail. Nope, we got to do it again. We got to do it again. We got to do it again. But I think also, and I apologize for the lengthy answer. But then I think again, that that willingness to communicate effectively as to why this needs to happen this way is something that we've done really well. I don't think young coaches understand that you have to teach the why. Yeah, especially now. I maybe you could get away with it a little bit more 20 years ago. Do what I tell you to do And that's that's it If you're not explaining the why now you're going to lose them you agree with that. I I totally agree with that I I would agree back you know young you just You do it because I said so right and then I would agree within the last 10 years. Again that empowerment and and it's reciprocal you empower them, but then you have to accept that empowerment. And I think that that has made them better players. It's made me a better coach. So I agree. I talked to a lot of young coaches that will call me or email me and just say, Hey, Matt, I'm, you know, I've been struggling, I'm trying to build my program or trying to do this or that, you know, what, what are some advice you can give me on building my practices? For me, especially young basketball coaches, I say, figure out the five things that are most important to you and make those a huge part of your practices every day. You know, for me, I remember my first college game. I played against this Hall of Fame coach at Hanover College. And I thought, I got my guys ready. We're ready to battle. Well, we lost that game by 50 points. That was my first game as a college coach. We lost by 50. And the next year, I must've watched that film from the game until playing them again a year later. I must've watched that film 50 times. And what I started to take from watching that film was They were just in better shape than we were. They were stronger. They blocked out every trip. Every guy was hitting somebody and blocking out that our opportunities for offensive rebounds were almost terrible. They move the ball. Nobody was ever holding the ball. So when I talk to coaches, I go figure out what's really, really important to you. That you how you want to coach the game and make sure that's a huge part of your practices every day. Don't let those things, even if it's five minutes of this and five minutes of that, make sure you're emphasizing. Do you have something like that? Do you have that kind of mindset? Well, yes, absolutely. I do. I don't know that it's the number is five, but right, whatever your arbitrary number is, is, and again I've been fortunate to have a long career starting young and then kind of learning these things. But I, but if I were to go back, I think that's good advice because you need to figure out what it is that is important to you and that will help you win. Or be successful, you know, a lot of things, you know, equate winning to success, but that's not necessarily always the case. But, but I would agree whatever those things are, whether it's two things or whatever, five things, 10 things, whatever your core, you know, Core ideas are you've got to emphasize. And then now, like you said, explain why you think those things are valuable and why we need to be doing this and how this translates to game. I think that that's the biggest thing that I've I've done over the last 10 years is explaining why what we're doing in practice is going to translate to game speed. And then if it's not, Then trying to explain to them why we need to continue and, and how, how we can make that translate to game. I love it. I want to, I want to, recruitment is such a huge part of my professional life and my career. So I want to translate transition to recruitment because you are, you know, whether you'll admit it or not, you've become a master recruiter. So what, what do you have to look. Obviously you want great kids and you've talked about that. What are you looking for? Because it's a very specific young lady that's going to go to Oregon, going to go to a community college, going to pick a two year school instead of a four year school, going to come in and fit everything that you want them to be able to do quickly and learning curve and all those things. What is it that you're, you're looking for when you're on the recruiting trail? Well, you, you brought up a lot of things there. Especially probably within the last five years, but definitely the 10, the recruiting at our level has changed so much because you know, it used to be, well, we'll, we'll talk to you at the beginning of your senior year and they'd say, I'm going to go four year. And then you say, okay, well, we'll be here in February and March. And then sure enough, February, March would roll around and then they'd start talking to you. And then they think, okay, this might be a good route in April. Things are completely all over the board now with, with, you know, recruiting services the explosion of club and AAU and the exposure, which I think is really, really good. But we too are now having to adapt to Communicating with kids earlier that summer before their senior year, sometimes even in their junior year, just letting them know that, hey, I know that, you know, Juko is probably not, you know, your first option, but if it does pan out, you know, we'd like to be here. And then I pretty much. Recruit the best players that I can get, you know at our level, we're, we're not able to say, oh, I need a five and I got to have a point guard. I got to have this some years I had five point guards and we'll put them all on the floor, you know? Oh, that sounds like heaven to me. I didn't have a point guard last year at all in my system. So five sounds like heaven. So, so ideally, of course, as a coach, you'd like to have, you know, some height, some length, some athleticism and, and be able to fill all these spots, you know, that on paper look great. And it just doesn't happen that way at our level. So we just, I, I kind of always had this philosophy, but I believe that it's way more relevant now as it's just getting the best players that you can get, spending as much time as you can, getting to know them, which sometimes at our level can be really quick. You know, all of a sudden, two weeks ago, you get this, this kid who thought they were going division one, literally, and, and it's June now, and they're trying to figure things out. And so you're trying to let the parents know that you're a trustworthy person, that they can, you know, that you can trust us with your, your daughter, that we will help instill their values that you have. We're going to help develop their skill. We're going to give them opportunity. To, to play and then hopefully use that to then go on to the next level. So there's not a real defined method. It's kind of all over the board, but it's basically in the masses at our level. We have to cast a huge net and then start figuring out, okay, yeah. Would you consider community college? Would you consider Oregon? You know, would you consider Eugene, Oregon, you know, all those things. And it is a. Much more intense and lengthy process than even five, six years ago. It's been my experience. Yeah, it almost has to be anymore. If you talk about trust, you, you want to trust your decision you're making. And it's, and it's so hard to do that. When you see a kid play, you have a conversation and, and you got to try and figure it out in a week. Do I want this kid? Or is this going to be good for my program? You've got to get to know the parents. You know, are the parents going to be a problem? Is the kid going to be able to handle the academics? Are going to go to class? You know, is there baggage there that you haven't, because you haven't seen her enough, you know, so let's say you and I are sitting there at an AU tournament, we're in a gym or sitting on a court. What are the things that jump out at you when you're watching a young lady play? Are there certain things that you just like, okay. That that's what I wanted to see, or that's what I wanted to hear. Oh. I think there's, there's just a ton that I, I mean, it's hard to put finger on it if, if I had to pick one. With the emergence, of the three point line and how it affects positionless basketball now that you know, over the 10 years it's kind of started at the NBA and then it's kind of worked its way down. We really excel with shooters. We excel at developing shooters. And so that, that is easy to pick out. And that's something that. You know, you don't have to be a five 11, you know, on the women's game, a 5 11, 6 foot wing, you could be a five foot one wing, and if you can hit, you know, 25 footers consistently a lot of the four years are gonna overlook you. But hey, you will have a successful career with us. And then I'm with you, coach. Yeah, a lot of those kids. Then all of a sudden the ju you know, then the, the D twos and, and even D ones look and go, okay, well we missed on this one. You know, we need to re-look here. So I'd say. The ability to be a shot maker, not a shot taker. There's a ton of shot takers out there. So that, that's something that out. And then you know, this is probably cliche cause even you know, all the coaches say this, but, but when you watch how they interact with their club coaches, their parents are they appreciative of that opportunity? Because. We're not at our level, it's not like we're going out and giving people full rides and paying for housing and stuff. You know, we're giving them a little bit of investment, but they're having to then invest back. And so it's nice when you see that they appreciate those opportunities. And, and then last thing is, is how do they react when you let them know that you're a community college coach, you're not a four year coach. It's it's a big deal. Absolutely. Are they respecting you as a coach and a leader and someone that has someone something to offer them? Correct. Right. Yeah. We do have something to offer them and we feel we have something amazing to offer them. You do, which is an opportunity right away. So but, but the baggage, you know, at our level you know, back to your previous comment about baggage. We, we, we have to take a lot of those opportunities. That's basically the life of a JUCO coach is that second chance opportunity. And we spend a lot of time in the recruitment process talking about that. Some people. are aware of baggage, even the student athlete and some aren't. And so depending upon how aware they are of what kind of baggage they have, you have to address that. But I've, I've been very fortunate. We've had a lot of kids that, that have been very successful in our program that their high school coaches have told me, you know, coach, you really. really want to be careful about this, you know, cause they, they don't want to steer me wrong. And I appreciate that. But also I'm like, you know, I got to fill rosters. I got to take chances and you know, this person can run and jump better than most of the other kids. So let's, let's, Let's give him a second chance in here. And I'd rather them do that second chance with me than with somebody else. So, do you make that young lady aware of what you've been told about her? And, and or do you, do you go about that in a different way to say, yeah, this is what I'm, this is characterized. This is what I expect for me. Right. Right. I try to just spin it in and in the process, tell them this is, this is our expectations. This is our culture. These are the things that. When you join us that are expected of you and we're going to hold you accountable, your teammates are going to hold you accountable. Sometimes as you build up the trust and they're already in your program sometimes a few months into the program or the school year, something will come up where they might say, well, I gosh, coach, You know, somebody used to tell me this and I'm like, well, you know what? They tried to steer us their way too. And you have done a great job of proving them wrong. That's awesome. You never want to throw anybody under the bus biting in you. So it's, it's a very touchy subject. I love it. You got to handle it delicately. You'll love this. I'm going to, I'm going to brag on my girls at Laverne. We led the country in three point shooting in 2012 and we hit 26 threes at a game Excellent. So we, we hope we, I think we're tied now. I think somebody is, is tied us, but we had seven games that year where we made over 23. So we're kindred spirits there. We are shooting the ball. And if I, my memory serves me correctly, I think our record is 27. So, so you beat it. You're definitely kindred spirits. Yes. That game blew me away. We just could not miss and talk. I want to go back to the size you talked about that group of kids. My starting point guard was 5 1. My shooting guard was 5 2. She hit 9 3s that game. So you're speaking my language. Best shooter I've ever coached is About five, three and a half, maybe five, four on her tippy toes and love it. Just love it. Yeah. All right. I'm, I'm, I'm going to put you on the spot a little bit here. You've, you've given me an amazing amount of time and I really appreciate it. But my world is recruiting and, and I'm going to put you on a stage and there's 300 parents and student athletes in an auditorium, what's the advice you give? To kids about recruiting? What, what did they need to know if they wanna play for a Greg Sheeley, if they wanna play college basketball or college sports? Yeah. I, I, I, I'll take the college basketball approach, just college sports. I, I, that doing the research and, and developing a, a, a relationship with. The prospective coaches and not afraid to ask any question to any coach. I know when we recruit eyes focus on my program and what we can offer, and I don't talk about other programs, but I encourage my rec, the kids I recruit, I'm like, you should look into other programs because. You need to figure out what is best for you. Obviously, I'm telling you it's us, but but you have to buy into So I think the recruiting process is important that whether it's a single parent, multiple parents, split family, whoever the people are that are helping this, For my instance, a young young woman make a decision on what they want to do with their future. I just think it's really important to try to gather as much information as possible. To me, no question is off limits because you're trying to educate yourself to make a really good decision that hopefully will affect you in a positive way as you move forward. So do your research, ask your questions. And, and I would say be leery of people that are telling you, Oh no, no, no, no. Don't talk to others. Just talk to us. And, and you know, be leery of negative recruiting coaches too. We run into that all the time and, and it's amazing how coaches think. Talking negatively about another program makes you look better when they, when it doesn't, and people still continue to do it. And it's like, man. So I, I love it when people start talking to me about, well, Hey, this other coach said this about you. I'm like, wow, they must, they must be in our office all the time. They know more about it than us. Crazy. Yeah. And I told kids the same thing. I, and for me, I was a four year coach. I tell them, I don't want you for one year. I don't want you quitting in October because I didn't prepare you for what, how our school works or how our culture is or how hard our classroom is. You know, I, I, I want you to know all that. So I want you to do your research. I want you to go visit some other schools and if we're a good fit, I want you. But you got to figure that out. I don't want to be fighting the whole time. You're here trying to convince you to stay. The worst feeling in the world for me is when somebody, and you know, September, October, early that first year, you know, they come in your office and they say, coach, I didn't know about this. You know, you never told me this or. Or they misunderstood something that you said. And then I'm like, Oh my gosh, there's no way I would have said that. I, I somehow must not have communicated effectively to make sure that you're aware of X, Y, or Z. I fortunately, you know, knock on wood that doesn't happen very often, but it's the worst feeling in the world when, when somebody comes in with confusion about, you know, okay, but I thought you said this. And it's like, Oh, So then obviously I didn't didn't do a good job of finalizing every question for you. But I'm fortunate that it doesn't happen very often. But those are the worst. Yeah, I agree. I agree. Coach, such great advice. Your wisdom is, is fantastic. I'm so thankful I got to know you. And, and, and I, I, I say this all the time, but I started this podcast because I, I keep talking to families that don't understand the quality. Of coaching and learning that is out there at the small school level, and especially a school, you know, the NWAC and, and how great a schools. And, you know, that consortium of schools you have out there every coach I've met from the NWAC is blowing my doors off. I, if I was the an AD at a division one program, I, I would be knocking on your door and say, Hey, come take a look at us, come think about our program and coaching for us, your, your, your experience is phenomenal. Your success is phenomenal, but your heart and your character and your integrity and how you go about your business is really the reason it's obvious to me you've had so much success. So I'm really thankful that you're in the world. I'm so thankful that. you're, you've, you decided to get into education and coaching and I'm thankful for the time you gave me today. Well, I appreciate those kinds of words and I'm, I'm thankful of the opportunity just to talk basketball. It was fun to get to meet you and just, just learn more about you and what you're doing and then just talk basketball and young people and how we can help them. It's very fortunate. So I appreciate you as well. My pleasure coach. The pleasure was all mine and I'm excited to have future conversations with you and talking athletics and talking coaching and, and I know this won't be the the last time we talked. So that'd be great coach. Good luck. I hope recruiting finishes up strong and I know you guys will have another great year next year. Appreciate it. Thank you. There you have a coach, Greg Sheely from lane community college up in Oregon. What a fantastic guy championship coach. Does it the right way. And if you're a family, that's got a daughter who's a really good college basketball player and is looking for a really good high school player. I should say. That's looking for a college. Where someone's going to coach her developer, be a surrogate parent care about her future. You're not going to find a better human being and a better coach than Greg Sheely. So it really enjoyed that hope you guys did too. Um, remember if you're liking these, it helps me a lot. If you follow or subscribe. So I know you're interested. If you're not enjoying these enough to follow or subscribe, don't be afraid to shoot me an email. Don't be afraid to leave me a voicemail and let me know how you're feeling about the conversations. Is there a coach out there that you know, that you'd love for me to interview, please let me know. I love getting referrals. I love meeting new coaches, who are fantastic. And we'd love to have them on the podcast. You can follow me on all the social media platforms, YouTube Tik, TOK, Facebook. what am I forgetting? Twitter, Instagram. And I've putting content out almost every day. Videos, reels. w just put out some great reels of Ryan Kerrigan. Uh, former NFL All-Pro at for the Washington commanders. And now the assistant coach there. We've got a great reel out, with the head women's volleyball coach, the university of Wisconsin, Platteville, Samantha Burkett. and they're all great. They're all going to help you with your recruitment needs. And finally, if you would like to meet with me. you're a family and you're looking to get help with college recruiting. Go to coach Matt rogers.com. Schedule a 30 minute meeting with me. It's free. I'm going to strategize with you. I'm going to help you through your process. I'm going to answer your questions. So take advantage of me. I'd love to talk to you. If we're not a good fit longterm, you can tell me or I'll tell you, but. Typically when family schedule with me, we get something really good out of it. And I make sure you leave our conversation. ready to rock and roll with your recruitment, even if you don't want to work with me. Long-term but check out my website, coach Matt rogers.com and you can find my blog and all of the podcasts there as well. But thank you for hanging out with me for. 45 minutes today. Hope you enjoyed this and I'm looking forward to talking to you next week.