Shay and Mer: What Puppies Really Need From Us (Part Two)

Shay Cline and Meredith Decker are back for Puppies: Part Two!

Discover:

• Why it’s normal for puppies’ preferences to change as they grow
• What your training priorities should be to set your puppy up for adult dog success
• Shay and Mer’s favorite pieces of advice for anyone raising a puppy

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Transcript

Shay Cline and Meredith Decker: Puppies, Part Two

 What's up woofers? We are back with part two of our puppies episode with Shea Klein and Meredith Decker, adventure camp counselors and local puppy gurus at Summit Dog Training. If you are a person that is considering raising a puppy, is actively raising a puppy, or even just a person that likes puppies, you're in the right place. If you haven't already listened to part one, which dropped last week, I also highly recommend that you give it a listen. This second half of our conversation really ties together all of Shae and Mare's great insights about what baby doggos really need from us to thrive in a human world, complete with a few authentic puppy noises in the background from my best buddy Otto. Let's get right into it. Oh, there's something so piercing about the way a teenage dog can look at you like they would they just. So no one used to side eye. know he was hesitant. As you explained to me very well. It was a lot less about him having the thing and a lot more about him and getting something out of me for grabbing the thing. And he would literally he would pick something up, and I swear he'd look at me like, you can do that. They love to just make things happen. They just love to test and see what can happen. It's like they've got, you know, that that that board and inside out. Or they had all the. But yes. And then they're like, what is this one? And they just go and start pressing, what is this huge Disney? That really doesn't mean anything. You know, you can see the wheels turning. You can see them studying everything. Oh little what happens if I do this? What happens if I bark at you when you're, you know, sitting on the couch and you had a really long day of work? You're sad. What happens if I do that for Otto? He's as. And you both know how social he is a puppy. How friendly he like. He's a big he's a human type of a dog. He really likes people. Including young people. Uh, like children. And he delivered a little bit of stranger danger. Um, that was a little surprising to me because of his nature, but is that something that you can often see even without going drugs in this period of adolescence? Yes. Um, it is it is very common for a dog's social window to kind of close as they as they mature. Some dogs will remain super friendly with an optimistic about every person and every dog. Um, but it is it is very common for a dog to, as they mature, kind of become selective about who they want to be friends with. Like, you know, and that doesn't mean they can't be neutral around people and dogs with with training. But like my daughter, who's six now is she can make new dog friends, but she is not interested in meeting their dog. She doesn't want to say hi to other dogs. She would be much happier just with her her small circle of dog friends. So she's not a dog I would take to a dog park. She would have a good time. Um, he would not be setting up to be successful. And, um, there's nothing wrong with her. Like, she's, um, she's a very healthy adult dog with healthy boundaries, um, very closely related to, especially her breed and the age she is. Yeah. And I like going off of that, too. It's why, when you have a lot of dogs. And I feel like this ties up in a little bit to, um, one of your other questions, which was do's and don'ts of socializing your dog. A lot of the times, if you bring your dog to daycares and every day care that I've worked at, like. Starts at 16 weeks, which is like the moment they're fully vaccinated, right? Um, and some people will like, do that, like 16 weeks old, take my dog to daycare, right. Whether that's because, oh, we want to socialize them, um, which is a whole other can of worms or like, I'm gonna be gone all day, and this is what's most accessible to me and what you'll get. And it personality based, for sure. But what I've seen a lot of the time is, uh, you'll get those dogs, you'll know them. Since they are itty bitty, they will grow up and then, like, they'll hit two third, they'll just, like, get into that late adolescence and adulthood, and suddenly they're not a good fit for daycare anymore. Some of that is based on how the daycares are run, um, like all day play, uh, which is like no small daycare should have breaks. My last daycare had it, and it was like, game changer. Yeah. You see that a lot in like dogs will hit two and they'll go, oh, I don't like you. Got some boundaries. Yeah. Yes, I have boundaries. And once again love analogies. And so when I say a lot of times is first of all, when you're younger, like us humans, you know, and once you're in personality based. Some people love to go out to bars in their 20s. Got bars on Friday night, do a bar crawl like all of that, and then you get your 30s and you're like, I should be in bed by ten. But my body hurts like I need a cigarette. Yes. Yeah. Like actually. But yeah, like I, I would rather not go out and same thing like it's I even though we don't want to anthropomorphize dogs, I still think there are a lot of similarities and connections because we would never ask an adult or, you know, a person to be friends with every single person, especially people that they just meet on the street. Like they didn't want that to be like, yeah, if somebody started coming up to me on the street and tried to be my best friend and I, that was the first time I never met them. Like, what can I get out of here like I want? That is probably not like a nice man. I hope not here. You know, it was my friends and. Yeah. Yeah. No, I think that's such a good thing to point out. And I think that's the real key is having those analogies because I think is mammals. There are some underlying similarities that we have, um, some underlying needs that have to be met and some underlying, um. Ways that we interact with others of our own kind. Yeah. Um, and I think that really does matter quite a bit. And, um. Yeah, I think so. In terms of boundaries, what's the best way that someone can support the boundaries that their puppy is starting to develop? Because they know that it's like, oh my gosh, that hits like so many, so many points. This is uh, like, uh, I think my favorite is once again. And because like, like I said, a lot of my experiences come from like two years of daycare. And that was like my thought was like my foray, you know, into, um, into. So I've seen a lot of the fallout of something was and it's just really it's really interesting to have done that and then learn everything that I've learned and go back, oh, that's why that park had a problem when we had to ask them to not come back or this or that, but it like some people kind of just think like, oh, I'll throw my dog no daycare. Um, and depending on the size of the daycare, um, and the setup, but, you know, doing your average one all day play in Colorado, the park regulations are one dog, no one person per 15 dogs. So if you're in a group and you're by yourself since there are 15 dogs and one person. Oh my God, yeah. Oh. Oh yeah. And, uh, and then some of them don't have toys because there's 15 and they don't want to deal with resource guarding, which is understandable. But then the dogs are just like. All we have are each other. Like all day play. No breaks. Like. Yeah. Like is a recipe for overstimulation anyways. Or support. Um, is where I'm going with this. Yeah. Like throwing your dog into that setting and like, oh, they passed their interview, inspection, analysis, whatever word the place chooses. Right. But it can be really overwhelming. And so for me, like, I have a soft spot for the nervous, like the ones that really want the confidence boosting. And so in support, it's like if your dog is scared, being able to tell them, hey, it's okay. Like you can go into your safe space. Like I think that was something that really in the last year or two that I learned from Angela, that was like, um, even though I knew, like, yeah, if the dog is nervous, I am not gonna keep them in there. Right. But really fully teaching them, like, yeah, having a safe space creates that confidence than you want, rather than babying them or not letting them social like it is socialization because we're teaching them boundaries, and it even more like the more important half of the skill, which is learning that you don't have to play when you're in a space with dogs like you can if you want. But it's more important that they learn how to take breaks and to just exist. That for me, what you just said that they don't have to play when, when when they're with other dogs. It was a big mental shift for me as I started learning more about puppy socialization. When you're in playgroup with with Otto. Um, it's because I realized I was going into it thinking, well, we're here so we can play. Yeah, we're here so he could play us playgroup. We're here so he can play. But I mean, when you take your human child to preschool, they're not there to just play with no boundaries with the other children. Albeit it would be a little teacher who is saying, I think we need a nap. Yes. You have a teacher who's saying, I think we might be hungry. Yeah. You know, I think we need a break. I think we need a, you know, a timeout, not for punishment, but just for just a moment. Regularly. Remember how to breathe those deep breaths. Anybody else I think, really, truly understood our job on the day to day. It's kindergarten teacher. Yeah. Oh, my. My sister is an elementary school educator. And the amount of conversations we've had were, I think in particular was recently I was babysitting the kids, and she's telling me the routine. I was like, yeah, yeah, that's about what I do at work. Yes. Oh, it was so funny anecdote for you both. So I have some history of music education, though. I'm a marketer now. I used to run the grant funded strings programmable rural elementary, and that was a program that spans kindergarten through fifth grade. So I had little littles and I had fifth graders like me. Yes. And it was when I was teaching her that I read Hear empires Dot Truthdig, and it was full of so many light bulb moments for me because I was like, oh my goodness. I'm like, okay, these little five year olds that I'm teaching not all that different from from the dogs that I love and spend my time with. Not feeling particular. Yeah. Oh, really? No. Um. And. Yeah, it's just it's so funny that you talk about parallel because it was that group of kids that age that really helped me to realize, oh my God, like, we're really not that different. Um, in terms of, like, what we need to thrive as creatures in this world. Um, that's fantastic. And kindergarten teachers are also some of my favorite unsung heroes in like world. They are the tightest ships. Like, I would arrive at those classrooms and I would take a group of kids and like, their violins were lined up by the door. The children, like, they had their stuff. They're in a line like they were ready. And I'm like, you all need to go over to the fifth graders to teach them about their art form. And then you have we have slowly. I mean, we are slowly developing our craft, but there is an art form to keeping a bunch of baby mammals together in a space and keeping everybody regulated and making sure their needs are being met, and that we're getting something productive out of it and not damaging. Well, I want to pivot slightly here, um, about maybe some misconceptions that folks have about where to focus in training with puppies. Obviously, I think what's top of mind is house breaking, right? Basically, that's top of mind for lots of people, for obvious reasons. Um, yeah, because I'm convinced, like the negative reinforcement for us is so present where like, yeah, no no no no no. It's the idea of a dog peeing in your house. You're like, nope, we got to handle that. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So people were naturally focused on that. Of course, it's an important skill, but other than that, I think what comes to mind when people think of training is obedience. Basic sit. Stay down. Heel. All of these things. But what I've learned from both of you and all of summit's resources is that there are more important priorities in puppy training. And so we've talked we've talked a lot about socialization and self-regulation. But can you describe a little bit how we can support those important skills and why? Why are those so important at this stage of a dog's life? Why is that top of mind? I think, um, that's such a good question. I think, okay, so my my general broad statement, which is based on like the what is besides the top of mind, things like what should people work on? Um, and the, you know, go to answer that I did for every single one of us is. Regulation and socialization. But I think really what what that means is, are dogs learning how to exist and to be dogs, like the word regulation is good and accurate. I also feel like it can be a buzzword that we just cover with a lot of things, right? And so, um, I think like, what's the most like the first thing or the most important thing, and the few days that I had a puppy in my house, despite the fact that I was not there for long term. So I went, I don't have to teach you anything. I just have to survive five days and see if I like it. It's just gonna keep you alive. Yes. Um, but for me, it was. I am not going to worry about anything. I am just like, we're gonna exist. Like, I think I think that's it for me is we're just going to learn how to be alive. And if both for me and for you. And so things like cit like don't get me wrong, there's a reason we teach it to our dogs. And I think it's also a really kind of like nice, reliable, automatic skill for our dogs to have. Yeah, but my dog can't do that if he doesn't know how to deal with his feelings. Yeah, and I was listening. I started listening to, um, drinking from the toilet. We ran again in his house, but something that I was listening to, an episode about arousal and about, like, how to deal with arousal. And one of the things that I think Leslie McDevitt said that when he was like, If I'm anxious or I'm having a panic attack. Yes. I'm not gonna want to set it. So, like, we asked our dogs to, like, sit down to watch something. So they're not screaming, so they're not doing whatever arousal quote unquote non desirable arousal behavior. Yeah. Like we don't want. And hearing that I was like you're right because I like oh my gosh. Before I was medicated, the amount of panic attacks and anxiety that I just dealt with in my own life, like for me, when I was anxious, yes, sitting moved the like, escalated the panic as though seeing it. Yes. So pacing and breathing and stimming were like what helped me regulate. And that was one of those things where I was like, oh, no wonder. Like, yeah, you know, you ask a dog to down and they if their appearance is incredible, they can do it. You can see, you see them a tension. And you know, the more that they release them going off like a rocket. Yes. So that was that was a bit of a tangent. But it was I think it, is. It goes along those lines of like teaching my dog how to exist and how to deal with their feelings, a.k.a. regulation and learning how to how to exist not only in my house, in the routine, but also out and about. When we see nervous things, when we see scary things, which then ties into the regulation, like me, that is like that is going to support every skill you teach them because like, you can't have like the most beautiful down state in the world. And once again, important like especially if you're in a like emergency situation, you're like, I need you to stay there. Like, don't move. I dropped glass on the ground and they're down. Doesn't need to be relaxed, right. But most time when we teach settle and like the conversation I think we have at summit a lot is like when we're teaching subtle, it's a prolonged. We're hanging out. You don't need to stare at me, waiting for me to tell you to do something. It's like, okay, you are placed here. Here are your boundaries. Occupy yourself in an appropriate manner, right? And if your dog can't regulate their feelings. They're not going to relax and do whatever it's going to be. Tell them to do. Tell me what to do. Tell me, what do you like? Well, it's like I mean, I love what you said about how that skill will support the learning and the anything else that you want them to use. It's the same for human beings as well, because an anxious kid in school is not in the right headspace to be absorbed. Yes, but if that anxiety is regulated, whether it's through activities or through medication or whatever, whatever helps. Um, if that child or teenager or, you know, person is enabled with some type of self-regulation approach, then they can work. Yeah. Then they can get the most out of the environment that they're in. Yeah. Yeah. Um, without just being wrapped up in all that anxiety? Absolutely. Yeah. That's so huge. Didn't Lesley McDevitt. I listened to an episode on drinking with the toilet, where she said that she had her brain, her own brain activity monitored, the results of which she used to develop some of her approaches to emotional regulation. The dogs that she's working with and which I found, that said, it is very, um. There's something extremely interesting about Leslie Rivers pattern games and similar exercises in that, I think, that are so helpful for dogs. Like there is something about that. It is easy, it is achievable, and we're not asking too much of them and it's predictable. It is and it is the predictability. Right? It is that in some some parts of it, um, a lot of pattern games, games that we will do, we will involve like something very simple, like we throw a cookie on the ground, dog eats the cookie, dog reorients some things like attention ping pong. Right. Um, those things are so much more like they you can look at them and be like, okay, what do I do with this? But something like that is going to be a lot easier for a dog to do that. Is that is having feelings. Then something like a sit stay. And I learned, uh, so many, so many feelings on this topic in particular, I learned so much with my with my dog because I did I had a puppy genius, and I taught her all of the behaviors. And as I was so excited to teach her all of the behaviors, and I had a dog that was like deep quotes here, that one was under command, right? Like when my dog was being cued to do something when I was telling her what to do when I was, you know, she was good. She was able to do it, she was able to do a stay. And she that's just who she is. She's very motivated to work and participate and do things. But, um, left to her own devices, we there were some gaps, like with regulating her excitement. Um, and um, we spent in the last even in the last couple of years, you know, my adult daughter and I've learned a lot about navigating her, um, like, feelings about, like. Like rabbits and squirrels and like how to actually like. I almost cried the day that my adult dog looked at a squirrel, and he was totally, like, just able to watch it move around and and things. And so you can have the best recall in the world. Um, but if we don't have some of those underlying pieces, those things are not, um, you know, and not to say they don't matter, but they're not as impactful. You're not going to get as much out of them, right? I think the the other thing that I say to a lot of people is, which is also based in my own experience. So my dog, um, that I had had for 13 years, he was my, um, home for 13 years, got him when I was 13. So he was my like adolescence into adulthood dog like, we didn't have a dog. And I was like, I really want. That. So I had Charlie for 13 years and love Gosh, that's what he, um, I lost him. 2020 2nd October 2022. So not this past one, but the one before. And he was. We were just in a closed circle of emotional regulation I never taught. First of all, I didn't have the tools. Um, I never taught him how to regulate his feelings and based on my own baggage. Like, that's the other thing. Like, just like kids, the amount of baggage we as humans put on our dogs. Like, I never taught him how to regulate his emotions. And I never let him, like, finish that cycle. Yeah. And so he was just like, I would try to regulate his anxiousness, um, for him, like, I never taught him how to do it himself. And so I had to manage in quotes because I wasn't even managing it, because it was just feeding into my own anxiety. And so we were just closed loop with to anxious creatures. Yeah. But, um, like, that's like I think the biggest takeaway from him, like the biggest lesson I learned from him and from having him as next dog I have is learning how to deal with their feelings because so many that I say to people all the time in classes, you don't want to have to micromanage your dog. Like it is not fun to have to micromanage your dog. Ask me how I know. Like, yes, it is going to be a better plan out for you. And if your dog to know how to do those by themselves and like that job, like when we have puppies, do it at camp to watch them go like screaming and paddling. Oh, you guys so sniff. Let's. Yeah, this is from day one of the puppy right now. It's like he's had he's on the grand total of three days of camp. And from day one to day three is just a different dog. Like he's like, yeah. Oh. I'm okay. And like having a lot of like I'm okay is is huge. And those are lessons that like, you know, there is all the time in the world, right in the your dog's amount of life and to teach them to things like sit and stay and those, those behaviors. Um, but like I said, that that window of brain development that puppies have is is short. It's expensive on the body. They can't do that forever. Mhm. It is more advantageous to teach them those things like navigating, you know, their uh how they self-regulate, um, their relationship with you, how they feel about the environment, um, reinforcing, you know, like I said, you guys should have fun together. They want to be with you. You want to have a good relationship with your dog. We want it. We want them to trust you. And we want them to feel safe and secure. And those things can be taught to an adult dog. But adult dog brings a longer learning history. An adult dog brings um, you know that learning still happens as adults, but we, you know, are primed to learn when we're when we're young, those types of lessons. So, um, I can, you know, I might have learned another language faster as a kid. Um, I could still learn another language if I wanted to. Um, But some of those, those skills like, you know, I mean, I still am as an adult. Um, we're very pro therapy here, learning how to deal with our feelings and how to regulate those things. But I think there's a huge advantage to learning those skills when you are still developing. Yeah, absolutely. Bringing them into adulthood instead of learning them and all them. Absolutely. Yeah. I think just kind of like to I think like to finish up that thought and like the answer to a question of like, besides the things that are top in mind, what do we want our dogs know or like? What's really important is I feel like kind of the moral of the story is when you bring your dog, in this case, puppy home, it's like, trust me. Every single trainer has fallen into the trap of like, your dog being in work mode all the time. Like my, um, my other dog that I had for a time, uh, I only knew him from like 9 to 13, and he was my capa dog. And when, like, he was recovering reactive dog. And, um. But we never learned how to deal with our feelings until when he was in work mode. He just sent me, and I'm like, go grab working. Go do something. You feel like you haven't taught me how to go to something by myself? Um, but I think, like, when you first bring that puppy home, it's really about, um. I'm like, yes, there are things I need to learn right off the bat, right? Like the the potty training. Because. Yes. And getting, you know, and learning the boundaries of the home. But I think really the most important thing is the relationship. And like building that because of that young age. And I think that is paired into the socialization because you want to create like a, you know, positive reinforcement. Here. We want to create a, a loving and accepting and forgiving environment. And you can you can people like absolutely have that. If you do have a puppy genius and teach them all the things by 14 weeks. But I think taking the time to focus on that is going to be far more beneficial and important. And you do have a you have a lot of time to teach your dogs all the cool tricks, and you can still do that at a young age, because I think that is incredible relationship building. But it's not like they don't have to be perfect. They don't have to look perfect like my dog skills. And like I said, I, I haven't raised a puppy yet. The like it will happen, but I haven't done, I have contributed to yes I have at this point. I have not had one of my house that I have. I have put all of my own baggage on, but with my adult dogs and teaching them things like. My stuff oftentimes did not look perfect. Yeah, like I had the messiest recall ever, like with my dog. But he came back and we had a fun loving it. And that's what mattered. Yeah. You know, so I think that's that's kind of like my takeaway of besides the most important things to make them livable in our house. What do we want them to learn? We want them to learn that their loves. Yeah, that's like that. We're a team how to deal with their feelings. Yeah. And how to be comfortable in this world that we have put them in. Because dogs did not ask us to accommodate to their world, we ask them to accommodate two hours, which then, you know, since human existence has just like like our evolution skyrocketed and then dogs are still dogs and they're like, what is this apartment you put me? If we were hurting sheep 100 years ago, I know. Oh my goodness, another thing that I heard, my cousin who is a trainer, say is the other part of the relationship building is you want to show your puppy or dog that your judgment is good, right? Like you're not gonna put them in a situation where they aren't able to regulate or where they don't have a safe space to come back to. And that really, really resonated with me because, you know, I feel like a lot of folks and there is absolutely no judgment from me here on this. A lot of folks, they want their dog to be with them through every experience, which is fabulous. But at times they'll bring the dog into those experiences before the dog is ready. Yeah, and I think the learning from one is largely about, um, you know, what does that do to your relationship? Yeah. With the dog. Right. And I think that there's something a lot to be said for like, that is why we choose the the type of training that we choose. And certainly there are very many ways to, to change a behavior. Right. If we look at behavior as something that exists in a void. And I have a behavior and I don't want this behavior anymore. There are several things that I can do to change that behavior. Um, some of those things are going to be more impactful on my relationship with my dog one way or the other. And so that is often why we are going to pick those, those options that are going to boost our relationship with our dog instead of reinforcing maybe that idea that we're unpredictable where we do scary things or, you know, when we're around, scary things happen. Yeah. Um I want to put my dog in situations again. safety is is a priority. And I want my dog, honestly. I want my dog to feel like they can mess up. Yeah. Why did I need to be perfect? I do not value perfection in my dog. Um, yeah. And she she can. I want her to show up curious. And I want her to show up happy and trust me. And, um, I want to trust in myself. I've taught her the skills to get it right. Yes, most of the time. And most of the time she does. And when she does it, we have the tools to we've got the tools to work through it. So I'm gonna move to my quick fires for y'all. But at the end, what's your favorite piece of advice to give people about puppies or puppy raising? Um, yeah, I think I feel like just sitting there in the conversation that we've had has, has made me verbal. I'd like has a lot of my sentiments have been verbalized or I'm like, I should say, not to a client, but historically, my, uh I think my favorite one is like. This idea of you have time, both in your earthbound way more years with your dog as an adult where all of this hard, sometimes stressful puppy training has paid off. But I think also just like so cheesy, but like learning to slow down a little bit like the. I remember one time we were in a class and we were teaching recall. It was our level two recalls class, and we were practicing like recall from a distance, and we had the dog on a long line for management issues across the room, and they were supposed to take the leash off, put the leash back on, do it. There's a lot of gross motor movement. And, um, the person who was practicing was, I had noticed was doing it really quickly. And she was she was struggling a little bit with just like the sequence of events. And I like I was assisting Angela and I remember watching, I was like, why don't you just slow it down? Like, because we're like, we have to do this routine and we're also under a time pressure, like we have to do it quickly. Yeah. Um, and then what I noticed, I was like, just slow down, like we're not under. This is an obedience. Trial. This is the like we're just learning skills. And even though that was such a like a hyper specific situation and helped, I feel like it is true. Or it's like we got stuck in our in our human overthinking brains and we're like, our dogs have to know this by this time. They I need them to know this before we go do this or that, like all of these things. And sometimes it's just like, just slow it down. Do you think I was telling you about this last week where I was like, I sometimes get stuck at camp or I'm like, I have to, I have to take this dog out. We have to get back so that I can do the next one. I still got 15 minutes and we gotta get these puppies in. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like you can't sniff them. Like, why can't they just sniff and enjoy the grass? Because they've already potted by. Priority is done. Give them two minutes. It's fine. Slow it down. Yeah I think that I think that's kind of like my overall sentiment is like I get it. I get the societal pressure. I get like, especially the pressure of walking into a classroom like all of this. But it's like, take a breath. Yeah. Slow down. Like you've got a you've got more time than you think you do. Yeah. And you, you'll get there I love that, I love that. How about you. Favorite advice. Advice to give to somebody raising a puppy? I'm like, I don't remember the question, I think. So I think that particularly when we come in to puppy raising and we're excited about our puppy, um, it is very easy again to get caught up in how to teach skills and what I wish as a dog trainer, I could put into the brains of everybody that I work with is. The value in building a predictability and the value in building. Um, building up your reward systems so your your play. Can my dog eat food? Can my dog, um, does my dog want to be pet? Do I know how to pat my dog in a way that my dog likes to? I know how to play with my dog my way. That my dog likes my dog. That is an individual with their own baggage and their own things. Do I know how to play with this dog? And someone might not think that there is a lot to learn about how to play with the dog, but I can tell you, as someone who is continuously learning and with a lot of dogs, there's a lot to learn about how to play with a dog in a way that's going to be, um, the most impactful. Right? And those skills, like the learning your individual dog's building, your reward systems, building your relationship, um, you know, thinking about your treat delivery even sometimes. How can that impact how your dog shows up, right? Like, yeah, if I'm slow and calm about how I'm delivering my food versus rapid fire throwing food into my dog's mouth, that's going to produce a different behavior, that's going to produce a different result, right? So those skills, if I get, like I said, if I could, if I could put into the brains of all of my people to teach like the things that they want to learn from me. I want it to be those skills. Yes. People don't come to me for those skills. They come to me to learn the the bigger ones. Right? And the dog to come back to them. How to teach their dog to sit and stay. And all of those go into that. But it is those skills that make up those bigger behaviors. Yeah, I love that. Is it actually rewarding what I want? Is it actually something that my dog looks at and says, yep, I want that back. Yeah, I want to be played it that way. I want to be touched by it. I want to eat that. Is it actually what they want or is it our idea? Yeah. You know. Yeah. If you liked this episode, don't forget to share it with a friend. And remember that the best way to motivate me to create more is to leave a five star review to make sure you don't miss the next one. Follow and subscribe to the subwoofer on Spotify, Apple Podcasts and wherever else you're listening. If you have thoughts or questions about what we talked about in this episode, I would love to hear from you. Genuinely, feel free to DM me on the social channels for this podcast, or send an email to the subwoofer podcast at gmail.com. We'll see you next time on the subwoofer.