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The Property Investor Playbook
Welcome to The Property Investor Playbook, your ultimate guide to building wealth through property investment. Hosted by Daniel Chadrawy and Lara Osborn, this podcast offers step-by-step insights into growing your financial portfolio through real estate.
Join us as we bring you in-depth interviews with industry experts, successful investors, and everyday Australians on their journey to financial freedom. Learn from those who have successfully navigated the path to prosperity and gain invaluable tips to kickstart your own investment journey.
Tune in to discover the strategies, tips, and secrets to creating long-term wealth through property investments, only on The Property Investor Playbook.
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The Property Investor Playbook
Get Into the Property Market with $10K: Opportunities for New Buyers in Tough Markets - The Property Investor Playbook
Ever wondered how to expedite your home-building process while securing valuable incentives? This episode of the Property Investor Playbook features an enlightening conversation with Renato Tartaglia, the visionary director of Verv Group, Melbourne's top medium-density builder. Renato's innovative strategies are revolutionising home-building, from unique incentives for investors and first-home buyers to cutting-edge financial solutions like HomePay. Discover why Melbourne is becoming a property investment hotspot, backed by recent ABS data signaling a significant uptick in first-home buyer lending.
Join us as Renato shares his transformative journey from a building designer to a successful entrepreneur. His passion for design and sales expertise led him to establish Verv Group during the challenging onset of COVID-19. Renato's story is a testament to seizing opportunities amidst adversity, with inspiring anecdotes including a first-time homeowner's triumphant journey. This episode underscores the importance of perseverance in property investment and offers valuable insights into navigating market challenges.
We also tackle common concerns about home and land packages, particularly registration delays. Renato sheds light on how Verv Group mitigates these issues, ensuring projects are released only once work has commenced. Learn about the financial education strategies that Verv Group employs, including partnering with savings coaches and innovative solutions like HomePay, which eases the path to homeownership with minimal initial deposits and interest savings. Whether you're a first-time buyer or a seasoned investor, this episode equips you with practical tools and strategies to thrive in the Melbourne property market.
Welcome to the Property Investor Playbook. I'm Lara.
Speaker 2:And I'm Daniel. We're going to show you, step-by-step, how you can grow your wealth.
Speaker 1:Hey Daniel, miss Lara, Welcome back.
Speaker 2:I'm always back, happy birthday. One year older. One year older.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:We're getting there. We're getting there.
Speaker 1:We are.
Speaker 2:yes, the greens are coming out now, I think.
Speaker 1:I hope not when, just in case. All right, we have a great guest on today. We had a really good chat with him. Um he, I'll let you give a little yeah rap about him so verve.
Speaker 2:They're one of the um. They're melbourne's leading medium density builders. Um. Why I like them is that they they're not like the bigger developers out there. They can control their land and build supply straight away so you can get quicker in terms of completing their homes and just getting there much faster pace. So I like that fact. And they're trying to be innovative. They're trying to put all these saver schemes and all these incentives together to make investors and first home buyers having that better opportunity to get into the market. So I kind of do like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so we had Renato in the director of Verve. Yep, he, I guess, presented a few of the great first-home buyer specific opportunities that are also available to investors. Yep, I won't say too much more on that, but I was actually doing a bit of research yesterday on the ABS data that was released on the 31st of July and a lot was leading to first home buyers in victoria. So in june alone, first home buyers held over 30 percent of all new loan commitments across the housing sector, which is 3.8 percent higher than a year ago, but specifically in june, but specifically in June, first home buyer lending in Victoria rose by 6.5%.
Speaker 2:Wow yeah.
Speaker 1:Interesting. So Victoria is, I guess, a state that's due to have a bit of growth.
Speaker 2:It's becoming a little hotspot. We don't know about it. It's right underneath us. We're not focusing on it. I think it's time to put some spotlight on Victoria.
Speaker 1:Yeah, definitely All right. Well, let's jump into the podcast.
Speaker 2:Let's kick it.
Speaker 1:Hey guys, how are we going? Good, hi, renato.
Speaker 3:Hello, how are you?
Speaker 1:Nice to have you on.
Speaker 3:Thank you. Thank you for having me, yeah.
Speaker 2:You look fresh today, man. Thank you, I like it. I like it.
Speaker 1:Traveling up from Melbourne, melbourne right, yes.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Did you come up today yesterday.
Speaker 3:No, yesterday Nice.
Speaker 2:What's your coffee?
Speaker 1:What's your coffee order? Long Macchiato.
Speaker 3:Ooh, that's interesting. Yeah, no sugar.
Speaker 2:Oh, okay, yeah, Why's that? I'm just curious. I discovered this coffee. It's called Skin Magic. What's that? Apparently it's the melbourne coffee. So, like now, everywhere I go, I'm like I want skin magic. So only some places have it, not everyone has it. So these guys all laugh me in the office saying this guy's having another skin magic. All this is double distretto for a little bit of milk yeah I love it.
Speaker 3:It's like a double shot piccolo I don't know, I'm not a fan, I'm more of a purist. You know what I mean. Just give me two shots of coffee, thanks we try I'm a latte girl, so living the cameraman.
Speaker 1:He has like six sugars in his coffee yeah, we call his coffee pancakes because it's six, six sugars and like six shots of caramel syrup oh no, that's a heart attack.
Speaker 2:Yeah I love asking people the coffee orders because it tells you a bit about them like, for example, like you guys laugh at my coffee, order your ones unique, it's just coffee, straight coffee. Yeah, people have long blacks at 2 pm, 4 pm, like why are you having a long black at 5 pm? What's?
Speaker 3:what's happened today? Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah what's happened today that you need a big cup of coffee? Yeah, let's go, all right I think let's start off with our fast five questions. We've got a couple of questions I like it we try and get them all wrapped up in 30 seconds. We'll go from there.
Speaker 2:I'm ready, let's go all right, ready go.
Speaker 1:What's your name and age? Renato tatali on 38 how many properties do you own?
Speaker 3:uh, at the moment just one nice, what's your biggest property regret?
Speaker 1:not buying enough what's one thing about yourself that you've never told anyone?
Speaker 3:um, that's a good one, that's a very good one everyone yeah, it stumps everyone. I don't know.
Speaker 1:I'll tell, tell everyone everything that's also what someone said last time um what's your most embarrassing moment oh geez, there's too many to mention.
Speaker 3:Probably some you haven't told anyone. Yeah, no, that's the thing, that's how I tell everyone, so that's why I'm always in those situations.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there you go, there's our fast five. How?
Speaker 3:did we go Just under 44 seconds? Ah, it's not bad.
Speaker 1:Not too bad. Definitely. That question stumps a lot of people about. What haven't you told somebody about yourself? I honestly, if someone asked me, I would not know how to answer, so don't ask me the first five every week the same thing.
Speaker 2:I guess something that for the last two questions yeah, well, they're good questions yeah, they're just start off the conversation and see how we go yeah, I like it yeah let's get into it, um rather tell me a bit about, um what you see currently in the Melbourne market, what's new, what's something that's caught your attention so far this year in comparison to last year?
Speaker 3:Because this is a different year than it was last year. Yeah, it definitely is right. So, in terms of the Melbourne market, I'm pretty optimistic about it. Right, I think there's a lot of green shoots compared to what there was the last 12 months in terms of inquiry opportunities for first-time owners and investors alike. I think the next three to five years is going to be really, really good for the Melbourne market. We've been a little bit dormant the last three years. Right, queensland's had a really good run, wa's had a good run and same as South Australia. I think Sydney and Melbourne have probably been left behind a little bit, but I see that as an opportunity. I generally think Melbourne is at the bottom of the next property cycle and I think that if people are wanting to buy, now's the time to buy.
Speaker 2:Agreed. Tell us a bit about your personal journey, how you got into this position, what you did the last 10 years, why you love your position right now. Just a bit about that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so I'm a qualified building designer by trade, so I started off designing and going down that route. I'm very passionate about that and will come to that when I start at Verve Worked my way through, sort of got into sales. I remember the sales manager at the time. He was like mate, you're good at talking and you actually understand the product he goes. I reckon you'll make some pretty good money in sales. So I was like oh stuff it. You know I was young, I had a crack and did all right and then came back into the office and I wanted to get an understanding of how the whole construction business operated, working my way through the industry and a few different volume builders and sort of progressing my way up into that sort of general manager role. I've learnt a lot right on both retail and wholesale, so that was a really good learning experience.
Speaker 3:And sort of 18 years down the track COVID hit and for me it was like great, let's go start our own thing. And now that I am doing my own thing, you'd never go back right like when you've. When you've started your own business, it's your own brand. Um, it's a reflection of me and and I guess you know what I want to be able to deliver in the industry, um, and I want to be the best medium density builder. I want to, you know, drive down the streets and you know, you see a house and that's a Verve house, you know. So that's what our vision is and that's what we want to do, and I think we're doing a good job of that at the moment, which is great.
Speaker 2:You saw opportunity and you took it. Yeah, which is great.
Speaker 3:I think we important message is don't take the opportunity when things are good. Take the opportunities when everyone thinks the world's ending right, Because it's not. The reality is. We just go through the motions. You always get through the other end and have a crack.
Speaker 1:Yeah, right.
Speaker 3:You've got nothing to lose?
Speaker 1:Yeah, definitely you. You mentioned earlier you've got one property yourself as well. Yeah, tell us a little bit about that and your experience with buying property well.
Speaker 3:So it's quite funny actually. So I bought my first block when I was probably 19, um, and uh, sold that six months later and made 50 grand cash, right. And I was like, far out, how could this? I made 50 grand, you know. Like that was pretty easy, yeah. And then I literally bought another block of land six months later. I just literally rocked up and threw the land contract on the table and said to my old man you know, I'm going to build a house. He's like what do you mean? Like to my old man, you know I'm going to build a house. He's like what do you mean? Like you just sold one, you know, and you want to do another one. I'm like, yeah, he goes all right.
Speaker 3:So you know, I was still young and very green, but I was in the industry and I knew the right people. So you know, before you know it, you buy one, you buy two, you buy three, you're flipping this one, you're selling that one and you're leveraging, right. And what I understood through buying and selling is that the property does all the heavy lifting for you, right, back then I wasn't earning big money, right, but the property was earning the money for me, right, and that's the key. We're very lucky in this country and I say it all the time that it is a very young country and it's growing extremely fast. Right, we get a lot of people migrating to the country, which is great because it gives us opportunities as investors to buy more. And I still say it today right, no one's going to save as fast as the property market goes up in value.
Speaker 2:Yeah, 100%, and I think that's a good point. Everyone's asking us like they want to get to the market or they're a bit curious about the market. You made a good point there. Like you were young, you got yourself into the real estate field. You made some money. You wanted to go again.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 2:I guess when you made that first transaction, you you said you felt like there was an opportunity, you made the money. You went again. I think that's all of our listeners now even our clients. They need to understand once you put your foot into the market, you won't go out.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and this is what I say to a lot of first-time owners right, get your foot in the door. Once your foot is in the door, the rest is easy. And they're like oh, but they're nervous about paying the deposit. And I get it. You've saved so hard, right to get that deposit. And it's deflating the first couple of times because it's like shit, I've got no money in my bank. But guess what, you've got an asset. Yeah, right, and that's the critical part.
Speaker 2:Yeah, what's a good news story. You've had one of your clients who bought a property, or a bit unsure if they were going to buy it or not, and just come across the other end Great result couldn't have gone any better than they expected it to be.
Speaker 3:Listen, I've got a few clients like that right, but over the journey I've got one at the moment, actually, he's just a first-time owner, you know didn't have a huge BC, but he was reserved in terms of, oh, do I do it, do I don't do it? I want to do it. Um, how am I going to get the finance? And you're working through all these challenges, right? Um, but when he did deposit even he calls me like once every couple of weeks and I don't mind because I like giving young people the advice that I never got when I was that age right yeah, that assurance.
Speaker 3:Absolutely. And he's like, oh man, I'm super excited, but I'm still a bit nervous. I'm like that's a good thing, right. I'm like it's the single most biggest investment you're ever going to make is buying property. But when I tell him about the stories of the houses that I've completed sort of six months ago and clients have unsold it and made $100,000, right, that's the stuff that gets him excited. Because I'm like what I tell you, I'm not lying, right, I've got no reason to lie to my clients. There is money to be made in property and you can go again and again. And now he's thinking about, well, about what if I can do one every 12 months? I'm like that's the best mindset to have. Yeah, right, challenge yourself. Right, because now that you do have your foot in the door, that's exciting yeah, it doesn't matter, taking that first it doesn't matter whether you're buying a house for 450 grand or 800 grand.
Speaker 3:Right, buy within your means, get into the market and you'll be able to purchase that thing for eight, nine hundred a million dollars, whatever it is.
Speaker 2:It's all about mindset. You challenge yourself and good things will come. And I guess I tell our staff is our clients, is everyone needs to talk to my social circles if you get those butterflies in your stomach like every athlete when they're running on the field, they got butterflies.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, when you're paying a deposit, you those butterflies in your stomach, like every athlete. When they're running on the field, they've got butterflies in their stomach, yeah, yeah, yeah. When you're paying your deposit, you've got butterflies in your stomach. You're nervous, you're scared, yeah. So it's the right, like you said, it's the right feeling to have. So go ahead and keep going.
Speaker 3:Keep pushing. And I also think it's critically important for first, with the purchase right, because if you do, that's when those bad thoughts might start to creep in. It's like, oh, am I doing the right thing? I was speaking to a friend at breakfast the other day and they're like, oh, you know someone's buying something in bloody wherever. Oh, you should try and do that. Well, hang on, no Like, stick to what you know, right, you've been given good advice and, let's be honest, you never you never go backwards in property. You know you never really lose money by purchasing. Uh, you know a property in australia. So we're pretty lucky, we're very blessed.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, I think there's a lot of good news stories there yeah, definitely, even if you, if you purchase in a suburb that might have slower growth, if you hold on to that property for a little bit longer, you'll still make profit out of it.
Speaker 3:Absolutely, and I think a good thing to note is that and I'm sure this is the same for Sydney and all the other states, but definitely Melbourne If you're buying in a greenfield estate, right.
Speaker 1:What do you mean by a greenfield estate?
Speaker 3:just in case so in the growth corridors, right. So, generally, the new suburbs you know, in each region they're master plan communities, right, and it's a blank canvas, right. So if you get into that estate early, you're doing really, really well by the time that thing's finished. So, for instance, if there's a thousand lot subdivision and you, you buy in stage one, two or three, right, the reality is the developers are going to be bumping up the land price each stage, right. Every, every time they do that, you're welcome. You've just made 10, 15 grand, you know what I mean. So by the end of that estate they've made plenty of equity. Yeah, definitely. So, yeah, you never really go without. And it's not like you're buying an established property where you've got to spend another 30, 40, 50 grand on maintenance and then you complain that you're not getting the same returns.
Speaker 2:I think that's the biggest mistake. A lot of people talk about all the time they want to buy established People. They feel like it's better to go on four or five-year-old properties.
Speaker 1:It's a bit better, even older.
Speaker 2:We told them warranty. How big do you feel like warranty is? The maintenance period is seven years. Tell me a bit about that. How would you tell a client why it's a beneficial going for a brand new home over something that's six, seven or even older?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so really good point, and I've had this conversation a lot recently because a lot of clients do want to go for an established property. But why? Because if it was me, why would I be buying something where I'm essentially paying for someone else's equity? I'm paying at a premium price on something that I've got to do maintenance on, whereas if you buy new, you get the capital growth of it during construction. And it might be if it's a land title it might take four or five months to build. Property still goes up in those four or five months. Right, if it's 12 months there, you're getting capital growth over 12 months when all you've really done is paid your deposits. So they're laying all that on the table and they're missing out on the opportunity. Right, and it's significant money. Right. In Australia, property goes up generally on average 6% or 7%. That's 6% or 7% that you've just lost because you've bought something at a premium. It's important, it is critically important, right? You know you're getting brand-new appliances, fixtures, fittings. You get to depreciate it if you're investing.
Speaker 3:If you're a first homeowner, you get to move into a brand-new home right and when you see the first homeowners walk through that they're excited. You know they're pumped about it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's not an existing property that they're walking through going. Oh, there's a crack in the wall. Oh, we need to change the light. Correct, correct. You know, everything's ready to go.
Speaker 3:And you know, we do a three-month maintenance period, right? So in three months you write a defects list, we, you know defects lists, and we come back and we essentially, you know, do the repairs. Yeah, and you buy an established house in three months. You can write as many lists as you want. The only person that's doing the maintenance is you, right? Um, so, so there's, there's a lot of benefits to to partnering up, um, I guess, with a reputable builder. That is about building quality, not quantity 100%.
Speaker 1:Definitely you were talking earlier, Daniel, about, I guess, a few things in the news lately that are affecting the new property market and you know things that people are seeing. Do you want to talk about that a little bit further?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so a lot of people um they they get a bit more scared of buying brand new properties, registration delays, all this kind of stuff. So, um, you just want google search away.
Speaker 3:Like everything's online these days.
Speaker 2:There's no hiding anymore hence we, why we only partner with reputable people who know their stuff, know their trade, know their craft. Now my client was going up to me saying that, daniel, I don't know if I want to go for a home and land package. I'm like, why, what's wrong with a home and land package? I want something that's completed or already done. I'm like, okay, so talk me through it, let's go. Why, what's the big hold up?
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I had a client who had a sorry. He had a friend who had a past experience just before COVID or just after COVID. Sorry, I'm like okay, so there's a lot of factors. Maybe the land wasn't ready, they're waiting for sewage external factors could be a lot of it and he goes. That was more of a common his friend was saying this again they were telling me so they wanted to get something that's completed.
Speaker 2:They were paying maybe 50k or 70k premium over the home and land normal contract. When we're trying to explain to them, you can save on stamp duty because you only pay stamp duty on the land. So they won't understand that until we break it all down. Like you're getting a brand new property, like the bank's giving money every time out to the builder and they're making sure that everything's in the build contract, it's completed correctly, it's the right materials, all that kind of stuff. And like, most importantly, you'll see once it's, once it's built, and if it is in the master plan of the stage two, stage three and they're building stage four, stage five, and they're advertising that you're making your money. So talk me through it. Do you not want to make money? Is there anything more to it? Honestly, for the retirement self-managed super fund, it's a whole different story, but these guys are just getting their first time investment.
Speaker 1:So what did they say was the reason or the cause for that angst?
Speaker 2:That their friend told them that the registration delays scared them. That was it. That was the main root of the cause. They were so happy before to go ahead and go. But it was the friend said registration delays caused a massive issue. They didn't want to go ahead anymore.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:So I broke it all down, but like.
Speaker 2:what would you say to that?
Speaker 3:Well, and then we go back to you know bad advice, right?
Speaker 1:Like and we go back to you know bad advice right?
Speaker 3:I mean can you?
Speaker 1:say advice is coming from a friend, it's not guided advice but a lot of people take that as gospel right.
Speaker 3:Yes, you know, because they trust their friends. You know, they trust their family. They trust that uncle that supposedly has been a developer and a builder for so long. Family barbecue they know everything right. The family barbecue yeah, so long. And they know everything right. The family barbecue, yeah. But listen, I think we need to understand that there are things out of the industry's control right, especially with developers, in terms of titling land. You know, the authorities, you know, hold things up massively and clients need to understand the process probably a little bit more. So they're not so hard on the builder or the developer and, to be fair, it's actually not the builder's fault. We're, we're just as annoyed as what the client is half the time because we're calling the authorities and calling the developer and chasing these things up and saying where is everything right?
Speaker 1:um, so it would cost you time and money at the same time as well, with resources to follow that process.
Speaker 3:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:So as much as the client wants to hurry that process up because they want to be in it or earning money through a tenant being in it, you're also saying I want this done as well, so my team can wrap this up.
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely so, like some things that we do at Verve to sort of prevent those issues arising, is that I won't release a project unless I know that titles are going to be definitely within 12 months, right. So I'll hold back releasing something until I know that the civil contract has been engaged and they've broken dirt right, because I know how long, roughly, it's going to take for them to do the civil program. You give it, you know, a three-month buffer in terms of what the total delays are going to be. And then you work through that you know, with the client and the agent and so on and so forth. So you go into it knowing that you've done the best that you can to alleviate that problem.
Speaker 2:I think 100%, and if there is anything that's registered.
Speaker 3:now your advice if you want to go ahead right now and you have the capacity to go ahead.
Speaker 2:It's registered. Now the risk is pretty much gone. As a developer yourself, you have your guys ready on standby to go straight away. Is that fair to say yeah? Correct what's your site start, so the client's settled. They're happy to go ahead.
Speaker 3:Yep.
Speaker 2:When do you usually start construction?
Speaker 3:Yeah. So if a client came in with a total block of land, for instance, we can get the site within six to eight weeks. That's pretty quick, providing that they've got their finances sorted. We don't muck around. And the reason I can do that is because I'm not the big volume uh, builder right, I'm not doing eight, nine hundred a year. Um, we cap our business at a number that that's comfortable for us. Um, so you know, yeah, I think if, if you're a purchaser and you've got a title block right or you're thinking about buying a title block, now's the time, you're thinking about buying a title block, now's the time to do it. Like you should have bought it yesterday, right. Like that's the advice that we should be giving people. If you're in a position to do it, do it. Don't wait, right, because if you wait, you're only going to miss out on the opportunity in three to six months' time when you think, oh, I'm going to save a little bit more money, money.
Speaker 3:Well, guess what the market's moved yeah and when the market moves I'll tell people all the time you can't save as fast as what property goes up. So, um, you know, with medium density runs I lock in the side start Right. So if we're at, say, 80% sold right, for instance, and I know titles are going to be, you know, within four to six weeks, well then I know I'm going to sell it within eight weeks of those titles. So we need to haul asses of business to get the last couple wrapped up, and then we're not waiting for anyone, we're taking those things to sign um and also just based on what we said earlier about master plan investing yeah like even me personally.
Speaker 2:I bought in a master plan may did so well, perform so well. Um, I want people to understand, even listeners out there. If you're purchasing when they're building a proposed new school town center, you're getting there early. Why would you wait like you're not going into something that's or it's brand new, it's unfamiliar territory just for the developers are putting all their, all their activity and energy into the master plan.
Speaker 2:It's going to look good yes, so I use the example to all our clients if they're sydneysiders. Just look at oran park was 10 years ago. Cricket wasickbury was 10 years ago. It was just dirt in Sydney. Now they've got the Bad Roos Creek Airport. They've got new restaurants Now they've got the schools everywhere. Now it's established. Imagine if you can find a spot like that in different towns around Australia. Why would you wait? Give us an example of one of your mask plans, because I love the mask plans. I think they're the most interesting form of investment because if you can get something that you own land, you actually got a piece of dirt on it and you got a house on it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're not buying an apartment townhouse not paying for apartment townhouse, but you can get a home in a master plan estate just go go yesterday, absolutely, and that's what.
Speaker 3:So I love houses and townhouses in melbourne, right, because, uh, townhouses is now the affordable house. That, that, um, you know you can get into the marketplace for sort of that sort of 500 to 700 mark, um, uh, and I think you know, because the way we build them down there they're two-part house and land, right, so the client gets their own title. There's no body corp, um, which is really really good and, like you're saying, right, they're in premium locations really really good, and, like you were saying, right, they're in premium locations. I've got a run of eight townhouses that are park-fronted 25K from Melbourne CBD for 680 grand. Yeah Right, sydney solders say why are they so cheap?
Speaker 1:Yeah, we'd never find that.
Speaker 3:Melbournians are like, oh gee, that's bloody expensive, yeah, and you sit there and you scratch your head and it's like this is actually really good value, right?
Speaker 3:Because you know, when you've lived through a few property cycles, you actually understand, right, a lot of the first homeowners and investors that are probably getting into the market haven't lived through a cycle, right, so they probably don't understand what is going to happen. But you're right, the master plan community is fantastic. And even if you're in a smaller boutique development but you're park-fronted, right, you've got a Stocklands or a Murvac or someone who's pumping millions and millions of dollars in infrastructure LendLays do it really really well? Right, they used to deliver the infrastructure first, then they used to start selling sort of you know future stages. So Mervac, do it really well? So just to name a few.
Speaker 3:But a lot of the guys in Melbourne, they're mandated, I guess, by the councils to be delivering the schools, the parks, the wetlands. So, you know, I actually almost think sometimes that they're better than some of the brownfield sites, which is like the, the suburbs sort of closer to melbourne, cbd, um because they don't have the brand new shopping centers and all the all the fancy amenities. Right, they've still got an old shopping center from 40 years ago. You know, it's, it's it's things like that that, when you put them in perspective, you know if you're living 20, 30 k's from out of the out of the cbd, you're getting the best of the best, essentially right.
Speaker 2:Everything's brand new, yeah and I talk about this a lot now I'm common sense investing yeah, yes so all my clients like okay, I can give you the greatest numbers, that's, we can look at all that stuff. That's great, great If there's a master plan community. They're building a Woolies Bunnings brand new shopping center, brand new schools, brand new cafes. It's just, it makes sense to invest it because they're going to have employment. People are going to walk their dog, take their kids to the wetlands go to a new shopping center.
Speaker 2:It's a good place to live. Imagine a young couple mom, dad, one, two kids, maybe just on their own, whatever it may be, and they can just walk to the local shopping center or drive within a couple of minutes. The new Woolies is there. They can do their Woolies online order, which everyone does these days Chase the Woolies?
Speaker 1:Chase the Woolies.
Speaker 2:It makes sense. It's just common sense investing. Don't try and overcomplicate. When you invest in something, if it's brand new amenities, center infrastructure all around me, brand new parks, like it feels good to live in that area and your tenants will feel the exact same way as well. So don't over complicate it yeah in terms of, yeah, like I said, it's 25k is away from the city, but you got everything as good as being in the city, or even 10k from the city for half the price. Yes, so like, why not go crazy go?
Speaker 2:yes and then you've got those other, maybe 10 or 12k from the city. They're paying maybe 850, 800k and they've got those older town centres can't even park anywhere. Streets are smaller. So just understand, like if you're a tenant and you're investing in your property and you're a tenant, now think about what they want to see. They want to be in the brand new home, they want to be in a nice facilities. It makes them feel good, it gives everyone a good feeling. At the end of the day. That's right, just yeah, chase all these man.
Speaker 3:That's all I could say.
Speaker 1:Best way of investing.
Speaker 2:When you have all that around you, you can't lose.
Speaker 3:That's right.
Speaker 1:Definitely. We spoke earlier about I you know struggling, especially in Sydney. But you know, even in Melbourne you're saying if people think $680, $650 is a lot of money, then you know, coming to Sydney they would have the shock of their life. But what kind of opportunities have you got for first home buyers at the moment?
Speaker 3:Yeah. So we've got a little thing called the Verve Saver right and what we do there is we basically get clients into the market that probably don't have the full 10% or 20% savings right now. But, for instance, if I've got land, if I've got a project with lands titling 12 months from now, I can get a 5% land deposit right, negotiate a good term with them. Yeah, a client and it's mainly on some Tannas product that I've got because the land component's smaller right, the purchase price is smaller right. So if your land's at $170, $200, call it $220, you know you need $10,000 or thereabouts as a deposit to get into the market as a builder right. I don't need to take a deposit to sign a build contract.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so it's 5% of the land price.
Speaker 3:Of the land because we do them as two-part house and land, remember Right, and that's the really creative way to get clients in. So what we do is right. You take a $5,000 initial deposit right. $1,000 then goes to the land developer. We secure that land under a 5% deposit. Right, and then we engage another business that we've partnered up with to help clients on their saving journey. Right, because finance education is the biggest thing in our market at the moment. It's not selling houses.
Speaker 3:It's finance, yeah Right, and if you can get the finance right, well then the the journey to purchase is actually quite easy, because you found them a solution.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so, um, so we've partnered up um with this company and basically you've got a savings coach that helps them right and say, okay, well, based on your income, based on your current savings, your purchase price might be call it 550. Right, you've already put ten thousand dollars down. Great, well done. Now you might have another twenty, thirty grand worth of savings, right, they'll open up a separate savings account that you can't take money out, only money goes in. Then you go on a savings journey. Right.
Speaker 3:Once you sit down with them in our broker, I know, right, how long it's going to take this purchaser to to get into the market. And generally, if it's called eight months, 12 months, whatever, that is because they're saving towards something and they've committed to that package. They save so much faster, right, but not only that. If you're a young professional or you know you've got there's a young couple or whatever, you might get six months in and the parents might want to help out. I've got little bonuses for them along the way as well. So, once you get to 50% of that savings journey, I'll throw in a 900 mil appliance pack to the value of four grand appliance pack right to the value of $4,000. Once you get to 75%, well then I'll throw in a dryer and a washing machine, right, because it's a first homeowner. It's like these are the little things that they probably don't think about at the end. Yeah, but I'm incentivising them to, you know, knuckle down and start saving for their future.
Speaker 1:Yeah, things that they certainly wouldn't be able to afford when they first potentially move into the property either.
Speaker 3:Well, that's right. So the advantage that we provide is that we're a full turnkey builder. So you know, we do everything landscaping, fencing, alarms and so on and so forth. So once you throw in those two things, there's nothing else essentially other than your furniture and your fridge, which we can help out with the fridge as well. Right, so we try and, you know, take out all the sort of the stress for clients. But it is all about just finding solutions for people. Because if they were to try and buy an established house right, you know, average house in Melbourne $600,000, $700,000, $800,000, you know who's got $120,000, $160,000 just sitting in the bank account to go buy their first house.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:It doesn't happen. So the reality is, if I can get you in for $10,000, that's a really good message yeah.
Speaker 1:I actually had somebody ask me this today. This morning someone I bumped into outside and we were talking about property and getting into property and I started mentioning a couple of these opportunities and he was like so I don't need a hundred thousand dollars, I have 40. Can I start with 40?
Speaker 3:And I'm like like yes, yes, and it's like oh my goodness, I need to change my mindset and and this is I talk about this a lot right, we do a really average job of educating clients in our industry, um, and mainly around finance, right, no one teaches people how to save or what to save or or how much you need to get into the market, and everyone's perception is you need 20%, right, which is what the big bad banks always tell you. Yeah, and don't get me wrong, if you've got that, fantastic, you're miles ahead of everyone else. But when you're buying off the plan and you're buying a new home, right, we can help you get into the market for limited deposit amounts. So that's one of the things that we're doing.
Speaker 3:Another one's HomePay. So we've partnered up with a company called HomePay. They're a fantastic operation, so we've just launched that recently in Melbourne. I'm lucky enough to be one of only a couple of builders in Melbourne that have actually been accredited by the bank and home pay to participate, and there's a lot of sort of hoops that we had to jump through by way of build qualities, build timeframes, financials and so on and so forth. So we passed all that with flying colors, which is fantastic. So now I can offer that to our purchasers and basically what that is it's build now, pay later and save interest up to 12 months right, so like an after pay for property almost almost right, but I mean you still need to come up with a deposit, right?
Speaker 3:so with with home pay, um, you can still do it as a two-part house on land, which is fantastic. As an owner rock, you need eight. Do it as a two-part house on land, which is fantastic, as an owner rock, you need 8% deposit. As an investor, you need 10%. So we can still offer these to investors To investors as well.
Speaker 3:That's great, it's not just for first homeowners, which is fantastic, right. And from the developer's perspective they're still happy, right, because they're getting land settlement when they call for titles, which is fantastic. And then all we need is our five percent build deposit, we're off our, you know, on our way starting to build that property, so the client doesn't pay any interest from land settlement all the way throughout the build imagine we had that yeah, I know, I wish I'd make it for me, for me in a ps5 monitor tv.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I yeah.
Speaker 1:I love the process of that first one with the incentives along the way.
Speaker 2:I think that's really great. You got me hooked, yeah, yeah, I'm like if I had that go.
Speaker 1:Whatever you need.
Speaker 2:I'm going, I'm going, I'm going.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's definitely a mindset thing in that you know, okay, you've reached a certain milestone, here you go have a little treat.
Speaker 2:Like throw treat, like throwing this little bonus.
Speaker 3:But yeah, it's a yeah, it's a really great concept. You feel like it's worked well so far, yeah, yeah, I mean it's really starting to get some really good traction, um, but more importantly, it's getting people into the conversation. That that they probably were, you know, a bit nervous or I don't know who to speak to, or or they're not getting the, they're not getting the right advice, or they probably just yeah, they, you know they're probably renting, right, they don't have a huge deposit and they want to get into the market. Right, they're motivated.
Speaker 3:But they just haven't had the right guidance.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's when a support team comes in.
Speaker 3:We keep talking about. You need the right team around you to succeed.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I think, like you said it perfectly, you're supporting the first home buyers along their journey. Yeah, we're supporting our investors as well, alongside their journey. It just makes sense like the right support team will take you a long way yeah like no team has ever won with one player. Have a team, utilize them around you and you can find good success.
Speaker 3:Absolutely yeah and so the other cool thing is I can actually combine the verge saver with home pay, right, because I'm the only builder in melbourne that can do that under a medium density structure. Um, you know, we can get people off, you know, out of the market with 10k, yeah, and then actually take them all the way through the journey without having to pay a single bit of interest, from land settlement to completion. So that might be, you know, 18 months, two years, right, where they've, you know, paid the deposits, which is fantastic, but they haven't paid any interest. So there's complete uplift right in terms of equity for that particular purchaser.
Speaker 2:It's crazy.
Speaker 1:That's amazing. So you can get in the market for 10K. Keep paying your obviously savings plan through that process all the way until completion.
Speaker 3:Until you get your deposits. Yeah Right, so if you're owner of, you're at 8%, 8%, you know, on a $600,000 house and land package it's not a huge amount of cash.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's pretty good actually. That is good, it is the finance education around that, and that's why we're doing this.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the more education people have and investors have, you can make those better decisions and you can have a better outcome. So go on to the bad news stories, go on to the bad research that you're trying to do. Bad advice with the property, education with all these little incentives can take people a long way.
Speaker 2:Utilize them Just stop trying to think about it or research too hard. Utilize it, experience it. The only way you're going to learn is if you actually test the waters. It's like you can't swim by just reading a book. You need to go into the water.
Speaker 1:Try it, learn, jump in, take the first step. Whichever analogy you want to use, yeah. That's right, yeah, all right. Well, it's been great having you on Renato. We might be able to have you on another time and touch on. I'm sure there's a thousand other topics we could talk about, but it was really great to hear about some good first-time buy opportunities and what's happening in the market down in Victoria.
Speaker 3:So yeah, no worries, it was a pleasure, thank you. Thanks, guys.
Speaker 1:Thanks.
