WRDSMTH – The Heartfelt Journey of a Street Poet

What if the walls around you could give you messages on hope, love and heartbreak? Well, if WRDSMTH, the legendary LA-based street artist and writer, is in the area, that might just be the case. 

In this episode WRDSMTH shares his journey from comic book enthusiast to an internationally celebrated muralist in the very first episode of "This is Disruption", hosted by me, Rua.  

We delve into WRDSMTH's fascinating shift from advertising to street art, the trials of scriptwriting, and his pride for his novel "The Holden Age of Hollywood". His powerful mantra, "Talent plus perseverance = Luck", and his process for getting the words he is feeling to being words on a wall. 

Have you ever wondered how serendipity shapes our creative paths? In this heartfelt episode, I recount my own transformative encounters with fate. From a Hollywood muse who inspired WRDSMTHs piece "Blush Shine" to a life-changing chance meeting I had with WRDSMTH on a London street—these moments of chance have guided my own journey into the world of street art, where I'm learning all the time. We discuss the unspoken rules of graffiti, the tight-knit community of street artists, and how these relationships have nurtured our respective growth and kept us inspired through initial missteps and unexpected successes.

The world of street art isn't always painted in bright colors; sometimes, it’s the darker hues that give depth to our work. WRDSMTH opens up about handling creative blocks, the emotional toll of loss, and how these experiences can shape art. We explore the dual nature of public reactions while doing street art, the strategies for creating art in plain sight, and the importance of confidence—even when confronted by law enforcement. 

From personal heartbreaks to finding love where you least expect it, and the therapeutic power of art - this episode is a raw, real, and uplifting look at how creativity can rise from adversity and evolve into something truly transformative.

Thanks for tuning in, 

Rua x

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

Hello there. You are very welcome to. This is Disruption podcast, with me, your host Rua. This podcast brings you in-depth interviews with the fearless creatives in street art, graffiti, music, photography and beyond, who boldly challenge the status quo, break barriers for others and share their work unapologetically. Each episode is a deep dive into the lives of artistic risk takers, exploring their motivations, their inspirations and their reasons for their willingness to disrupt societal norms. Some of these stories involve revolutionizing their industries, while others are pushing the boundaries of legality with their art. Coming up on today's episode.

Speaker 2: 0:38

Nobody's gonna think I'm brazen enough to be painting on this wall in the middle of the day, so it looks like I'm supposed to be there.

Speaker 1: 0:44

For the first ever episode of this is Disruption. We are going to be hearing from a true street art legend, and that is Wordsmith. Wordsmith is a street artist and a writer, and in this episode, he shares his journey and the impact that his work has had on his own life and on others. His art is deeply personal and resonates with people all around the world. It captures emotions like love, heartbreak and inspiration. In this episode, we get deep. We talk about chance, fate and love, and I share a personal story about how I met Wordsmith in London, how it was him who inspired me to become a street artist, leading to a truly life-changing journey and, technically, I suppose the podcast that you're listening to right now. Wordsmith encourages others to pursue their creative passions and expresses the importance of creating every day. He also emphasizes the importance of believing in yourself and persevering to creative endeavors. He really believes in the importance of taking chances and staying true to yourself as an artist. This was a wonderful conversation and it truly felt like a full circle moment, considering he was the person who got me painting for the very first time. I can't wait to share this conversation with you. Go and check out Wordsmith. It's W-R-D-S-M-T-H, so I hope you enjoyed the episode. Thanks for tuning in and let me know what you think. All the best. Enjoy the episode. Thanks for tuning in and let me know what you think. All the best.

Speaker 1: 2:10

Hello everybody, I am in California right now and I could not be happier than to be speaking with the one and only Wordsmith. Wordsmith has a super interesting story that I can't wait to share with you. I'm going to hand over to him in just a moment to tell you a little bit about what he does, but I would like to introduce Wordsmith as somebody who has been super and personally inspiring to me and, as I'll explain shortly, is the reason that I became a street artist, a chance encounter that really changed my life, honestly. So, wordsmith, it is such a pleasure to talk to you. You are an author, you are a street artist and you are an all-round inspiration. But, in your own words, can you please tell us a little bit about who you are and what do you do?

Speaker 2: 2:49

First of all, it's great to be here. It's great to talk to you and see you again, and the story that we are going to tell is fun. I am the LA-based street artist known as Wordsmith. I was living in London for two years, splitting time between the US and the UK, and that's when we met, and I'm back here in LA now, and for the last 10 plus years I've been doing street art and it's been pretty fantastic. I always say this in interviews.

Speaker 2: 3:17

If you want to know who I am, I'm a writer. I love to write and through the years I've written in a lot of different mediums. I used to work in advertising. I'll even go back farther. I used to be a comic book kid. I was a ferocious reader and I just loved I would see a movie and be more fascinated how they created the characters and the dialogue and I just loved writing. So when I discovered that that could be a career, I think it was a game changer for me.

Speaker 2: 3:44

I like to say I got sidetracked a little bit in advertising. I liked my time in advertising and I was a copywriter for most of the years and it was a very cool style of writing. I learned a lot and I was good at it, but the corporate world and advertising really eat you up. I always say it's like dog years. So my time even though I look back at it fondly and it helped shape me as a person and as a writer one day I just realized I was not happy. I did not want to do this for the rest of my life. So I quit my job and moved west and started writing scripts and short films and worked in documentary TV and wrote a novel which ended up getting published. So even when I came to LA and took the chance to chase my creative dreams, la was good to me and I think it always falls back on.

Speaker 2: 4:36

This is becoming a mantra now is I believed in my writing? I believed in myself and I persevered, and I used to think this was like a thing in Los Angeles, but it's really any creative endeavor? You know there is no. How did you do that? There is no set path or anything. The only thing that I give advice to people is talent plus perseverance equals luck, and that's my story. I believe in my writing. I think I'm a talented writer and always believed I was, and I love to write. So I persevered and just kept putting things out there and had some success along the way, but it wasn't until I started painting words on the wall that I can now say the world took notice. So that's amazing for me as a writer today.

Speaker 1: 5:23

Yeah, wonderful. So it must be such a difference taking the words that mean so much to you in a novel and then bringing it to the streets, where you can immediately impact people, where you can immediately see, rather than giving somebody a book or telling them to read a book and then they go away and then they come back and give you feedback. You can get it in real time. What's the difference for you in that situation?

Speaker 2: 5:47

It's exactly that. It's instant gratification for me. And it is almost instant because I'll come up with an idea, especially now that I have the formula down. After 10 years, I'll come up with an idea, I'll come up with new words and I'll craft them, I'll polish them when I deem them to be ready. I then, you know, print them, I make a stencil and I find a perfect wall for them and that's what. That's what street artists do.

Speaker 2: 6:16

So, being able to do that, being able to be the boss, like my frustration in advertising started when there were too many chefs in the kitchen and I think great ideas were getting watered down on a on a daily, you know, weekly, monthly basis. And it beat me up as a kid because I still had this idealistic thing of, oh my God, the idea that we came up with is so great and then, watching it, you know, kind of wither away or just be corroded, or just too many chefs in the kitchen, you know, ended up at the end of the day, I just felt, you know, like whatever, exhausted and beat up. So so being my own boss now is amazing. Yeah, I've always, you know, believed in my writing. So one thing people don't realize you. You touched on it in that everything is very personal, like everything I've ever painted on a wall resonates with something in my life. I could be talking about things that happened yesterday or last week, but I could also go back to, you know, loves that I had in grade school and high school and college and I revisit that as a writer. That's what we do.

Speaker 2: 7:21

But then when I, as a street artist, say, okay, I love this idea, I love this nugget, and boil it down just like advertising, into the fewest, most powerful words and I deem it's ready, I'm still taking a chance. There's some things that I come up with that are personal and I'm like are people going to understand this? Is it going to resonate with them? Like it's meaningful to me. And it's crazy more often than not, and all the time, it surprises me that I put it out there and people, their response is oh my gosh, you're reading my mind, or that's exactly what I needed to hear, and I stumbled upon it and and and that's great. It's just amazing to me. To this day, even some of the most popular words that I've done started off with me painting them and saying, wow, I wonder if people are going to get this completely and it for a living.

Speaker 2: 8:13

I do this every day, so I boil it down very quickly, I work on it, I polish it and get it out there in the streets and that's awesome to be able to do it, you know so quickly and see the, the fruition you know immediately, and then the response it's. It's funny. I came up with something a couple of years ago and all that is true, like it's just thrilling to paint it and take the chance and you know most of my work is still renegade, so it's just a thrilling adrenaline rush to do that and walk away from it. But then I came up with this thing because it's true, it's like the art happens long after I paint a piece in the streets, because it's how people interpret it, how they photograph it, how they interact with it, that it just takes on just a whole new meaning or just scope and you know depth and things like that.

Speaker 2: 9:11

Like I love the photography that pops up on my, my feed from people that just see things that I didn't even see, like at a certain time of day or a certain angle, or just, like I said, the way they interact with it. It's amazing, it's so thrilling and that is also the thrill of being read on a daily basis as a writer all over the world. So I don't know when I talked about with my friends like this. They're like shut up. We know you're happy, but it is truly a passion of mine and I love spreading the messages and I love spreading the idea of doing what you love and being creative and flexing those creative muscles.

Speaker 1: 9:53

Absolutely. I am all about that. So this is perfect. So the reason that I think your work resonates so hard is a lot of it is about love, relationships, heartbreak, and every single human experiences most of those things. I assume most people have had some sort of heartbreak, and not just love, but all humans experience those things and they really resonate. Is there one piece of work for you in particular that's particularly meaningful?

Speaker 2: 10:22

Absolutely. And I'm going to actually cite two, because the one that I took a chance I remember painting it for the first time and wondering if people were going to get it did turn out to be the most popular piece or one of my most popular pieces, and it was something that I was going through at the time with a muse, with a woman in my life, and I wrote the words. The only lie I ever told you is that I liked you when I already knew I loved you, and again very personal and I remember putting it out there, going, wow, are people going to get this? And now, over the years, it's just amazing to me. I look back in hindsight and I'm like, of course they're going to get it. You're either in that moment. You either want to be in that moment or you were in that moment and you look back fondly. So it's just there's not a person on the planet. You know that it doesn't resonate to some degree.

Speaker 2: 11:12

The other thing that I'll say and I haven't talked about it a lot, but there was a muse in my life and I did write words. She was an actress in Hollywood, she is an actress in Hollywood and we used to get together and just, you know, talk about the craft and the driving for dreams and big, dreaming bigger and a lot of happy hours happening along the way. And and I just loved her energy and I believed in her ability and her talent and I would tell her that and she would always, you know, react in different ways, including, you know, modest ways. And I wrote this one line, one line, and it was I love the way you blush when I tell you how you shine and I remember writing it and I remember putting it out there and I did a piece. It wasn't a large one, but it was.

Speaker 2: 11:53

It was on like a busy road here in here in LA, on Fairfax, and I came home and and I think, like the next day or whatever, I took a photograph of it and like the next day or something, I was gonna a photograph of it and like the next day or something, I was going to put it on my Instagram feed. And she texted me that night and she goes I just saw Blush Shine. She had driven by it and looked over and saw it, even before I put it out there. So, first of all, the words are just completely personal and meaningful and just encapsulated an incredible time in my life. And then the fact that she named it because she called it Blush Shine you know what I mean and I love that and then the fact that she saw it beforehand, I just I thought was fate and it was just a beautiful moment. So that, to me, is a memory that I will remember for forever.

Speaker 1: 12:41

Wow, that's so special and how incredible that she happened to see it.

Speaker 2: 12:45

Yeah, complete happenstance that she stumbled upon it while driving, so it was crazy.

Speaker 1: 12:49

I love that. The only lie I ever told you piece was actually the first ever Instagram post that I posted. It's still there. I have like 30 posts on my Instagram and that's one of them. So before I ever met you or knew you, that was the first thing I ever posted on Instagram. But it was so beautiful and you have just touched on the topic of faith and I feel like this is the perfect time to explain my story, which I have actually never told before, and how I met you, how I started doing street art and how I ended up changing my life, and it was all through faith.

Speaker 1: 13:21

One morning I was lying in bed early in the morning and I was living in London, just off Brick Lane. I had a boxing class I was meant to go to, but I'd been out the night before and I was tired and wasn't really feeling going to boxing. But I told myself get up and go. So I got up and I had boxing gloves around my neck walking up and who do I see spray painting on the street, except for Wordsmith? And where he was spraying on Hanbury Street was some shuttered doors, and right beside that, across the street on the other side, is a huge piece from him that's up really high. So I used to see this piece every day, aspire to inspire others and the universe will take note. And I used to walk past it every day, but I didn't know who it was.

Speaker 1: 14:01

And I was walking up Hanbury Street and I saw this artist that I recognized painting right there in the same spot. So I stood there and I took a sneaky photo and I was like I will always regret it if I don't go over and speak to this person. So I went over and I approached you and Wordsmith, you were so kind to me and you were so lovely and I remember you saying I said you know, I see your art and I don't know who you are and how can I follow you. And you said I'm known as Wordsworth, but my friends call me Brodie and I thought the fact that you had introduced yourself to me as Brodie was just so charming and so kind and lovely, as if I was already a friend. I thought it was lovely. I spoke to you a little bit and I said you know, I want to do what you're doing and you said so, do it. So go get yourself some spray paint and do it. And I said I will, and then I did so. I went to boxing class, I bought some spray paint and the rest is history. I started spraying and then the really nice little part of the story that absolutely nobody knows. I've never spoken about this before, in fact I'm not sure I'll leave it in, but I think I might as well On my lunch break one day.

Speaker 1: 15:09

I should have gone to the office this particular day and I didn't. I decided to stay home and on my lunch break I went spraying in Allen Gardens down the tunnels and I was covered in paint. My hands were covered in paint. I wasn't very good.

Speaker 1: 15:22

Where my flat was from, allen Gardens, is a straight road and I didn't go straight down the road. I, for no reason at all, apparently went around the block and in the exact same place that I met you, but across the road was a boy putting up pieces of art and I had tried to do that and failed miserably. It just fell off the wall. So I approached him and I said hi, I'm sorry to disturb you. Would you mind if I asked you how are you doing that? I want to do that and I'm failing. And he turned around and he had beautiful eyes and a lovely smile. I got chatting to him and, long story short, he is now my boyfriend. We live together. He's an artist, we're both doing street art, and all of this came about in the exact place that I met you by chance, under the Aspire to Inspire piece, and it all felt so faithful. So for the longest time, I wanted to tell you that story.

Speaker 2: 16:15

I love that, I absolutely love that and it makes me happy. And just going back to the original day or the first day I met you, like you said, oh, you were delighted and surprised, but like those words that were above or on the roof behind me, I'd be a walking contradiction if I didn't. You know what I mean and that's who I am. I wrote those words because that's what this is to me, that's what wordsmiths to me is aspiring to inspire others. So I love taking the time to talk to people.

Speaker 2: 16:47

I love running into tour groups all over London and I always thank the tour guides for doing what they do. And I love talking to you, know, everybody. That's that's taking the tour to see the art and learn about the artists and hopefully be inspired by it, and I give them stickers. It's just who I am and I'm not bragging. But but I would be a walking contradiction if, if I didn't you know, do that, if I didn't talk to you. You know what I mean and and and encourage you so. But that is just who I am and I love that. The one part of the story you didn't say correct me if I'm wrong. You said can I try it right now and put the can of spray paint and you sprayed some and we showed. So I love that and I love that you had the gumption the next day to to just buy paint and dive into it. So that makes me very, very happy.

Speaker 1: 17:32

Oh, thank you, I actually yeah, so I I did that's great, I remember.

Speaker 1: 17:38

But I. But I was. So when I got into street art and when I learned about like the community and when I find out you know the do's and don'ts I was told early on you never ask someone can you borrow their spray paint or can you paint? And then I was like, oh my God. I was so embarrassed, I was like I can't believe. I asked wordsmith, could I? But you were so blind and you were like sure, go for it I did spray.

Speaker 2: 18:05

Yeah, those might be the rules, but they're not my rules, so I buggered. I'm glad you asked. I thought it was fun and it makes me happy. So the one part of the story that you don't know is I was just back in London and there's a mutual friend of ours. She's an artist. She told me it was so strange. We were in a bar, we were in the Well and Bucket, which is an awesome place in Shoreditch and she goes, oh yeah, and she said your artist name and she goes. You know her.

Speaker 2: 18:29

You probably don't remember, but one day, this, this, this, this happened. I go, oh my God, I do remember and I'm not being pretentious, but I meet a lot of people and a lot of things happen when I'm in the streets and over time and this was almost maybe a year later, but I remembered I go, oh no, I remember that day because I think you said can I spray paint? And it was always in my mind that I loved you did that. So I knew exactly who you were when she was telling me the story that there's this artist that she says I inspired you know you to to start art and she showed me your page and I knew exactly who you were. I remembered it was. It was crazy, it was funny.

Speaker 1: 19:05

So oh, thank you. I'm so glad that I hadn't upset or offended because I was. As soon as I found out you don't typically do that I was like, oh no, but I did. But I went to boxing that day with paint black paint on my hands and I was delighted. And oh no, but I did. But I went to boxing that day with paint black paint on my hands and I was delighted. And honestly, you always say that you were. When you sprayed for the first time, it was like you were bit by a radioactive can of spray paint and it was the exact same for me. Immediately, I was hooked. It was that same day that I went bought spray paint for the first time.

Speaker 2: 19:34

That's great. Yeah, that's one of my favorite ways. Like I said at the beginning of this, I was a comic book kid, so when I was trying to describe that first night, that adrenaline rush, and coming home, I was hooked. And it was, I always say it was like I was bit by a radioactive can of spray paint, because I didn't know I had this in me and I suddenly felt like, oh my gosh, I feel like I can do it all. And then it just took off. I wanted to do larger pieces, bigger pieces, rooftops, just everything. So it's been an incredible ride.

Speaker 2: 20:03

There was one other thing. There was one thing that we've kind of said or not said, like I always encourage people to do it and I said that to you, but I don't care if you do a sticker the size of a postage stamp, or if you do wheat paste, or if you, you know, learned a free hand, or if you do stencils Any way you can express yourself and get it up on a wall. I applaud it. You know what I mean. So, so I just encourage people, you know, not to be intimidated, just to start, and you'll get that. You'll get that adrenaline rush, and it's a beautiful, beautiful rabbit hole to tumble down, and I think it's awesome when anybody does it. You know what I mean and if I'm part of that story, if I gave that push, it makes me smile as I walked away that day. It made me smile that your excitement and your exuberance. You know what I mean for doing it for the first time.

Speaker 2: 20:55

I would say one other thing. You reminded me. I have that thing of the art happens long after I put up a piece in the streets. But I have another thing that any day you get paint on your hands, that's a good day. So I I typically try to wear gloves, but I always forget and I hold my stencils down with one hand and spray. So half my hand is always covered with all these colors paint and at the end of the day, you know when I'm relaxing or when I'm having a beer or just happy hour, and I look at that, I look at my painted hand to this day and it just makes me smile because. Because that means I created and and that's another thing you should create every day.

Speaker 1: 21:34

That's beautiful and I totally agree. Do you ever struggle with motivation? Do you ever struggle to, you know, create for a day, or are you always feeling driven?

Speaker 2: 21:44

I'm always feeling driven and I'm not just going to say this, but I will backtrack and say the troubles that I've had over the years. I'm always driven, and what I do, I do a full time for the last eight and a half years. And what I do, I do a full time for the last eight and a half years. So if I am not motivated or if I am having a writer's block, I just did quotes like quote unquote, writer's block. I'll explain that in a second or just not feeling. You know one part of it, I can always shift to another part. You know what I mean. I can, I can go to cut stencils and that's like very meticulous and repetitive but also therapeutic time. You know what I mean. And my studio is a garage. When I open up the door the sun is shining. So it's like if I'm having even a off day, I'm like I'll cut stencils today, I'll just get in the rhythm and put on some music and it'll be great. Or I'll sit down at the computer and if I'm not feeling motivated to get out, I'll just write. You know what I mean. I'll figure out new words and that'll get me excited to get back out in the streets If I'm too much. If I'm out in the streets it's always great. I'm getting pain on my hands and doing all this great stuff, so that's usually very happy. But then I know I have to come back and cut stencils. So it's this repetitive thing that I can bounce off of, you know, at all times, and find something to do. You know what I mean and in the weird sort of way, even if I'm not like feeling creative in writing, I'll turn to emails. You know what I mean. I get emails and there's a business side of it, but I craft a beautiful email. I consider that writing so. So I always find something to do creatively and of course, I have my down days and this and that.

Speaker 2: 23:19

The one thing that I don't talk about much but I will talk about with you or just right now, is that muse that I mentioned. I did lose her. You know what I mean. It's a story and she wasn't in my life for a period of time and it was very hard. I didn't realize how much the muse like she, was a big part of Wordsmith, especially in the beginning. So when she kind of left my life, I had a moment where I was like, wow, I don't know what to, not what to write about, but I just didn't feel the daily pouring out of me this or that and I had to figure out you know my bearings. And I had to figure out not how to walk again, that sounds very dramatic but just how to, like you know, be inspired by different things. And it made me research the muse. You know what I mean To a big extent, which is a fascinating thing If you really go down that rabbit hole. But but I figured it out.

Speaker 2: 24:09

But there was a, it was a time when I was just almost reinventing and figuring it out, like how am I going to approach this? Especially the romantic stuff is what I'm getting at. But then again, you can talk about the heartbreak, you can talk about the breakup and, like you said, those pieces resonate with people. And at first, like I'm very positive in my work and I'm a very positive person. So at first, when that was happening and I was, I was kind of talking about, you know, the breakup and pulling from a lot of different things.

Speaker 2: 24:36

It wasn't all about her, you know what I mean. I went back and be like oh yeah, there was that girl in grade school that broke my heart. What did that feel like? You know what I mean. So as a writer, I kind of explored that and I thought, oh, this is going to be different. This could be, you know, not the positive wordsmith, but those again are some of the most popular pieces that resonate with people because everybody's had their heart broken. So it was refreshing to kind of see, still expressing myself, still things that resonated with me. You know where I needed that at this time. You're reading my mind, you know what I mean. I stumbled upon this and so it was kind of good to see, you know, that those things were embraced and resonated as much with my followers and with my audience.

Speaker 1: 25:19

Yeah, absolutely, because it is highs and lows. When you're deeply in love, you love to see the love pieces, and when you're hurting, it's nice to see that somebody else is also hurting and maybe has put words to a feeling that you haven't managed to put words to yet.

Speaker 2: 25:35

I agree with that and it was. It was a learning curve and that's what I'm talking about with that period of time. It was a learning curve to say am I going to put this out there? This isn't the, this isn't the positive, this isn't the bright, but again, I'm glad I did and now it's part of it's just, it's part of everything. And then, even like I'll go the other side of it, I do pieces that are motivational and inspirational. But I'm not going to lie, the world sucks at times and it really sucks now. So it's like approaching that in a realistic matter where I'm not going to ignore it. But there's people that do that kind of art very well political or just angry or just in your face, and that's not me. But I found a way to still address you know that. You know there's things going on in the world and you know here's some realistic but encouraging words about those things happening.

Speaker 1: 26:28

Oh, perfect, thank you. I love that, and I only speak to people that I genuinely find inspiring, to people that I genuinely find inspiring. And the people that I find inspiring are people who are really authentic and genuine and have a bit of vulnerability. Usually because on social media everybody looks like life is wonderful, but it's when people are willing to say on the streets, for example, this is a painful thing for me. This is something that I'm creating because I'm processing something I think that's so beautiful. It's a really nice way to share your feelings and hopefully share some your feelings with somebody else. That does resonate as well. But when I met you and I had all this creative inspiration, I was I was really heartbroken at the time and what I did was I was spraying angry shit on walls wow, that's incredible yeah, you.

Speaker 2: 27:16

That's great. You had to express yourself, you had to get it out.

Speaker 1: 27:19

I really did and it really helped. I was just spraying angry words Like I didn't have a style. I was just angry and spraying my feelings.

Speaker 2: 27:26

That's what I was spraying.

Speaker 1: 27:28

So, anyway, aside from that, we'll come back to the good stuff now. Because you put such emotive work out, I bet you get a lot of people reaching out to you with positive or heartbreak stories, whatever it might be. Is there any that was particularly touching?

Speaker 2: 27:43

Yeah. So I get a lot of messages from a lot of people and I love that. I am very close to this, that I do, and if you send me a message on Instagram or send me an email, it's me reading it, it's me responding, and I always find time to to do that. So the messages have been pretty amazing through the years and some of them kind of made me taken aback. You know what I mean. Like they said oh, I found your words at a very dark time and you got me through some very, very dark times, and I won't go any deeper than that, but it was at the moment that I was reading those messages or when the first ones came through, I was intimidated. But then I quickly realized, like almost in the same day or that night and following morning just realized I'm doing the same thing. I was doing since day one. You know, just stay the course and do what you do and it's, it's working. You know what I mean and it's helping people. So I embraced it. You know what I mean. That, that the words were that meaningful to people. That means a lot to me. But at first it was holy, wow. You know what I mean. It was intimidating. That's all I can say. But I love that. I love that I'm affecting people to all degrees.

Speaker 2: 29:04

Then there's the real positive like gotten messages from people that they saw a piece of mine and sent it to somebody they were interested in and it sparked the relationship. And then it's gone to to we got engaged in front of your piece and now we're getting married and we want to commission a piece. So it's just been this incredible several people through the years that all those things have happened and it's just been incredible to kind of be part of their relationship, you know, through those years and through those stages. So so that makes me happy.

Speaker 2: 29:36

So I always find a way to kind of express it and and I love that, like I could be very sentimental, I could be very romantic about, you know, those actions that I just said. But when I thought about it and when I was talking with friends and I think I've even said it in an interview or two I took a lighter thing and I said my slogan should be wordsmith getting people laid since 2013. I can even make that more family friendly, you know, getting people together since, but that makes me laugh. I have heard from people that, yeah, like sending a picture of a piece you know to someone. Can spark. Can spark things, so that makes me happy. That's how I'll leave it there.

Speaker 1: 30:15

Can spark things so that makes me happy, that's, I'll leave it. Yeah, no, that's so good. So, who knows when, when most of us put work on the street, we're like, okay, that's done. And you're saying the art happens long after you walk away.

Speaker 2: 30:26

Definitely, that sounds like the truth yeah, yeah, yeah, that's a hundred percent there, hundred percent there, so yeah so have you had any scary experiences putting up work?

Speaker 1: 30:37

You know, when we are as bundles, we put things up and we're not usually supposed to be there. Have you had any experiences that scared you or shook you up a little?

Speaker 2: 30:48

Yeah, I mean, when you do this as much as I do, you know what I mean and through the years I have a lot of it. From the first time that cops rolled up on me it was about a year in and I was very I was like very, very nervous when it was when it's first happening. What happened was the cops got out of their car and I'm not going to run, I'm going to talk to them, I'm just not gonna be that person. And we started talking and I was so nervous and like 60 seconds in one of the policemen said hey, don't be nervous, we actually like what you're doing. They were just doing their job and they they make. They ran my name to see if I had any you know warrants or prior arrests or a record, and I didn't. And they basically said just be careful out there.

Speaker 2: 31:32

But that was massive for me, especially back then when I started. It gave me so much confidence that these policemen said we like what you're doing. You know what I mean. We know you're not destroying, we see that you're beautifying and you're trying to do positive things. So that meant a lot to me. That also was around the time that I realized, because this was like at 4.30 in the morning and I'm like you know what, no matter what you do at 430 in the morning, there's going to be a spotlight on you. So I just started doing stuff in the middle of the day and acting like I'm supposed to be there, and that's one of some of the greatest advice probably the worst advice and also the greatest advice I can give any street art. It's just own it, pretend you're supposed to be there, don't look over your shoulder. And I'm lucky because again, people Don't look over your shoulder. And I'm lucky because again people like my work, people recognize my work, and again I'm beautifying, I'm putting positive things out there. So I don't know, I don't know how it happens Like I've been very lucky. That's part of the talent plus perseverance equals luck. I've been very lucky in that I do go there to places and walls at noon and just paint and then just walk away. I don't know if cops pass me. I don't know if anybody you know like, other than the building owner. You know what I mean. Nobody's going to think I'm brazen enough to be painting on this wall in the middle of the day, so it looks like I'm supposed to be there.

Speaker 2: 32:50

There are times that obviously that I have to take chances and I'll do middle of the night or really early in the morning to get the job done. But most of my work I just do that, I just pretend that I'm supposed to be there and that works in my favor. But other scary things, you know, I've had angry people that it's their neighborhood so they just go off and they say we don't want this here. Oddly enough, that's usually when I'm starting to paint and I've seen it and I like to think it happens a lot. Once they see what I put up, their attitude changes and everything. So so, and and I get messages like even places I take chances. I get messages from the building owner or the establishment that, oh, we love the piece you put up, and and it starts, it starts a conversation even, and it starts a relationship and that can lead to other things.

Speaker 2: 33:39

So so again, I've been, I've been lucky, but but I say, take chances. You know what I mean. If you're doing creative stuff, if you're doing stuff that people embrace and love it's, take those chances. Put the art where you, where your heart tells you, and take those chances. It can lead to some good things I mean. First of all, it can lead to more people seeing your work. I mean, that's one of the reasons a lot of people still ask me like, wow, you go to shortage a lot when you're in London. I do, it changes over a lot, but guess what, there's so many eyes in a concentrated spot that my words are being read. So I'm going to go there and spend ample time every time I'm in London, because that's like the mecca of art. You know what I mean. So, however long it lasts, I know, sure, if I did a piece, you know, in Covent Garden, I mean it might not last long and X amount of people will see it. If I do one in Brick Lane, it's not going to last long, but guess what? 10 times the amount of people or 100 times the amount of people are going to see it. And and that's what I'm striving I just want people to read my words and and hopefully it'll affect them and that starts. That ripple effect is amazing. It's like if they take a picture and send it to somebody and that affects their day and they send it to somebody. It's a beautiful thing. So, so that's what I'm trying to do, in a roundabout sort of way, anything else.

Speaker 2: 34:52

I've encountered some, some hate. You know what I mean. Like some people don't like my work and you know they. They kind of take that stance and I've dealt with that as much as I can and just I'm going to diffuse the situation, whether it's on the street or online, and I just ignore it. Some of the it was a roundabout sort of way, but some of the best advice I give people, like if they encounter hate from from anybody, is never take criticism from somebody you wouldn't ask advice from, and that's massive.

Speaker 2: 35:23

Like people that don't like what you do and uh, you know just in all walks of life that they'll come at you online or anywhere. It's kind of like why you know what I mean Like continue to walk down the streets. It's like I'm doing my thing, you do your thing, but I don't know, some people can can like shatter their day or shatter their confidence, and that's not me, it's just it's kind of like I'm not listening to you because I know that you're one person and there's there's countless others that it's. It's got a very, very positive you know effect happening to them and if, if you're going to choose the negative for whatever reason, maybe you don't like my hair, maybe you don't like my, maybe you don't like my words, maybe you don't like the typewriter I don't. I don't know what it is, but I don't care. You know what I mean. It's it's it's it's weird that that that hate is projected like it is and it shouldn't affect people.

Speaker 1: 36:14

That was something that I actually had to learn. I am deeply sensitive, so putting this podcast out is absolutely terrifying because you open yourself up for feedback that may be unwelcome and you have to be prepared for that. And I remember I had to learn how to be okay with putting something on the street, because in a place like Shoreditch things get dogged so quickly. It's really heartbreaking. But I remember the first time that I had a piece ruined it was my unicorn and I put it up. It was the first unicorn that went up and it was on Calvin Street in Shoreditch. And I went back the next day to take a picture when it was dried and somebody had got a set of keys and scored through the middle of the unicorn and I was devastated. I felt like somebody had scored my heart with their keys. I was so upset and I was saying to my boyfriend I quit. And who would do that? It's a unicorn, who would do this? And I took it so personally.

Speaker 1: 37:10

And then I had a conversation with another street artist, a mutual friend, and he just gave me a real pep talk and he was like get over it, basically. And he was like you put this into the street and it is the street's art, then that's literally street art. You put it out there for whoever wants to interact with it, in whatever way they do. That's what you're giving. He pointed out and I see it all the time. Now some people use Sharpies and kind of comment and interact with the art. And now I love it because it's true, I'm putting this out there for it to hopefully have an impact on somebody. And maybe somebody is letting out some anger about something else, maybe they hate unicorns, I don't know, but it's still interaction and that's what street art is all about.

Speaker 2: 37:55

I agree with that and that's the only stance, that's the only reaction you can have. But I kind of like what you said. I kind of like when people like whatever they do, comment or interact or add to it or just it's fun. It's like the streets can be very, you know, fun and creative and responsive and I love that. You know what I mean. Again, sometimes it's frustrating, but nothing lasts forever. That's just part of the romanticism of street art that pieces won't last forever, they will weather and that can be a beautiful thing to see and experience and then come back and do another piece, even if it gets destroyed or keyed. I think you should have slapped another unicorn right up top.

Speaker 1: 38:35

Oh, I did. I put it right on top.

Speaker 2: 38:38

But it's just part of it. But I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna be deterred, I'm not gonna give up.

Speaker 1: 38:42

So that's it. And the thing is, the streets belong to all of us. But yeah, so you gave me the excellent advice, so do it, and I did, and here I am now talking to you. I think sometimes you just need to hear that little vote of confidence from somebody. Go do it. Was there anybody who was a mentor to you or who inspired you or gave you any advice?

Speaker 2: 39:08

Absolutely. The impetus of Wordsmith was all on my own. It was I've loved street art for a long time and I didn't think I could do it. That's part of that bitten by a radioactive spray, can realization. But I didn't think I could do it. But but, um, I knew I needed an active hobby. Um, I wrote a novel and and that was that period of time where I was spending so much time sitting in front of the computer again, uh, doing what I love. But but I knew I needed something that got me, you know, out of the seat. So so doing the street art, or starting to do street art was a, not an accident, but it was a, it was a choice, it was a hobby, it was something I just did for me, for fun. But it was that idea Like, and I didn't think I could do street art. But when I said maybe, if, maybe I will, maybe I'll do stickers, and I knew it would be word-based, so I thought I would just have words on stickers. But then I'm like, oh wait, what if it's an image of a typewriter and the page is coming out of it? And I've said this in almost every interview that I've done. But it's so true, the moment I thought of that, I thought it was so simple and it combined two methods of doing street art. It was a stencil painting the typewriter and then we pasting a page. That's, that's the smaller pieces. That's how I started, that's how I still do. You know smaller pieces, um, but, but I had to research if anybody had done that before, cause I'm not also not going to be that guy that if somebody has you know a typewriter and page, it's like, okay, I'll think of another idea. The you know a typewriter and page. It's like, okay, I'll think of another idea. The moment I discovered nobody had, I was like motive. I was like shot out of a cannon, I'm like I want to, I want to mark my territory on this idea. So, relatively quickly, I taught myself to make stencils and I wrote up a bunch of words and I was out there wheat pasting you know very small pieces. But that's when the bitten by a radioactive can of spray paint happened and the rest is history.

Speaker 2: 41:00

To answer your question, when I started doing street art, I thought it was going to be all secretive and competitive and the. It was the exact opposite. The, the welcoming by the street art community or just things that happen, whether it was at events or shows very early on. And there were some, you know, very influential people that that when I said, hey, I'm wordsmith, and I kind of whispered it, I was like, oh, they were like Do you do art? And I'm like, oh yeah, I'm wordsmith, I do the typewriter. And people would be like and there was one individual his name's teacher. Oddly enough, he's just a great guy and he, he just loves to like teach and he leaned in he goes you're wordsmith, holy shit, I love what you're doing. And it was. It was like inflating a balloon, like it's what I needed to hear at that time.

Speaker 2: 41:50

It was very early, you know, in my street art career and I just walked away with more confidence and and he even said he started the mantra of you got to get bigger, you got to get higher. And that's what any artist, once you start this, you know, will tell you. You go down that road of I love what I do, I'm going to do this and I'm going to do it and start to do it larger and start to do it bolder and, and you know, your confidence gains with the confidence of your pieces. So it was beautiful and some of my closest friends are in this world and that's an amazing thing. Like I, have reinvented myself, you know, several times, from the advertising world to writing scripts, to writing novels, and all along the way. There were great groups of people in all those walks of life. But the street, art and the artist community, or my group of friends, my tribe, are just some of the closest friends I've ever had in my life and that's amazing.

Speaker 2: 42:46

I'll say one thing about this. I realized it a couple of years ago and I've been saying it in conversations like this. I used to think that the bond was art, it was just creativity. But I realized a couple of years ago no, those people that are my tribe, those people that I hold closest with, they've reinvented themselves several times and to me that's exciting. I love hearing their stories, I love hearing their evolution. But those, the people that I could if I was in a room with my tribe, I could tell you all their stories of reinvention, and that's just something I completely gravitate toward because I don't know. I've said I'm the poster child of reinventing myself, so so I gravitate to look to those type of people.

Speaker 1: 43:31

I have never thought of it that way, but I really think that's actually it. What's so incredible about street art is and I'm sure it's the same for you I have friends who I have never met and I don't know what their real name is. I know that they've got some crazy street art name and that's all I know them by, and I love them for their art and the connection that we have. Who knows what that person is like outside of this life?

Speaker 2: 43:58

They've reinvented themselves into what they really want to be, and that's incredible yeah, it really is, and uh, and yeah, I have a lot of people like that, are they? There's a lot of people that I know. You know them just by their art or just the community, even the online community, um, but the great thing is, like I travel and and when I am coming to that area, that that person that I never met is whether they're an artist or a photographer or this or that. I'm like, hey, I'm coming, and it turns out to be the best experience. They're like, oh, I'll meet you, I'll get you paint, I'll show you where to you know, and it just and I do that, and that's something that I do and I pay it forward all the time.

Speaker 2: 44:35

If anybody ever sends me a message about you know my techniques or or how I do things, I tell them everything. And if they're in the area, I'm having a person come tomorrow with their son and I'm going to teach them how to make stencils and use spray paint, and I, oh, I love to pay it forward and and I, and again, I hope I'm inspiring people when they're walking down the street and seeing my work, but if they reach out and there's a way to completely teach them and help, pay it forward and start somebody down that path. I take the time to do it all the time Because to me that's as satisfying, as almost as satisfying as doing the art painting, getting paint on my hands and doing walls, doing the art painting, getting paint on my hands and doing walls.

Speaker 1: 45:23

Well, you are absolutely inspiring and it definitely sounds like the people who you're interacting with in person can be even more inspired. So a few things I would love to touch on, because time is sadly running out. I never have enough time. I could talk for hours. I love chatting, but you've mentioned the book that you wrote, and that's obviously a very different process from being out in the streets and creating on the streets. Like you said, it's sitting down at a desk, but can you please tell us a bit more about your book, the process of writing it and what it means to you?

Speaker 2: 45:50

The book means a lot to me. It was my firstborn and it's a tale that I still look at time of my life and a tale that I still look fondly upon. It came out under my real name and that was great. It got published. Nobody knew who I was, so not a ton of people read it at the time. It got really good reviews and it won some awards and it was a very satisfying time. But again, that led to the street art.

Speaker 2: 46:18

The cool part of the story is several years ago I don't know how many years now I approached the publisher and I said, hey, what if we re-release the book under the authorship of Wordsmith? And we did that and so many more people have experienced that story and that novel of mine and that's thrilling. Now there's that following or that built-in audience, so I do love to talk about it. It's something I'm very proud of and at some point I'm going to find the time or the balance in time to get back to long form writing. But this is my first book. It's called the Holden Age of Hollywood Holden as in H-O-L-D-E-N, the Holden Age of Hollywood and all I can say is it's set in Los Angeles. It's a crazy tale. It's like a mystery and an unexpected love story and a thriller all combined and it's set in Hollywood. But everybody that seems to read it really enjoys the ride and I'll recommend it to anybody. I mean, again, it's my firstborn. And if you do dive down that, if you do crack it and read those pages, I'd love to hear from you. I mean, again, it's my firstborn. So, and and if you, if you do dive down that, if you do crack it and read those pages, I'd love to hear from you.

Speaker 2: 47:22

I always say that you know, just like the art, I love talking to people about my book, even if you hate it, I'll probably get more from somebody that loved it. So it's like it's always fun to have those conversations. But and the crazy thing is, or it's fun because I re-released it under Wordsmith and because I had the following Now I get messages and I have meetings with people in Hollywood that talk about optioning it and maybe making it into something. And that's amazing because I started when I moved to Los Angeles writing scripts and playing that game and now I'm back as an artist, that's a writer, so it's kind of fun that it came full circle and people are entertained by that or that notion of making it a movie or a limited event series. So it's fun and you can get it on my website. I mean, I'm not a big sale guy, but wordsmithcom has the book for sale and it'll lead you to whatever you want paperback or Kindle or whatnot. So that's it.

Speaker 1: 48:14

Amazing, and it's wordsmith without any vowels. That's it.

Speaker 2: 48:17

Amazing, and it's Wordsmith without any vowels. W-r-d-s-m-t-h Wordsmith with no vowels.

Speaker 1: 48:21

Well, you heard it here. This is where to go and get the book for yourself. So, wordsmith, I would love to hear what is next for you. I believe you're coming back to London. Can you tell us a wee bit more about what's next for Wordsmith?

Speaker 2: 48:35

I am. I am coming back late July and I was just in London and I was painting in the Upfest Mural Festival in Bristol and that was great and I put two weeks together where I was there for five days and the rest of the time in London. Similar I'll be painting in another festival in Cheltenham.

Speaker 1: 48:54

Yep perfect Cheltenham.

Speaker 2: 48:55

Yeah, and they have a mural festival that I'll be painting in, and then I have about a week in London after that. So there's going to be more work and there's a big tease. I think a huge piece will be showing up. In shortage, I do a lot of six foot pieces and smaller pieces and stuff like that, but it looks like I have an opportunity to get like a 12 footer 13 footer up and that'll be awesome. So that will be popping up on my feed, hopefully, if everything goes right. If not, I might do a 13 footer renegade and or I might do both. So but yeah, I love coming back to London and painting and I have some plans, some walls that I saw made note of, and now I'm going to come back with some words.

Speaker 1: 49:43

Amazing. Well, I can't wait to see that. That's really exciting.

Speaker 2: 49:44

So for the people that want to see that. Can you please tell us where they can find you on socials? Yeah, again, if you type wordsmith with no vowels, you'll find me. It's on Instagram. I'm on what used to be Twitter threads. The website is wordsmithcom W-R-D-S-M-T-H. So you'll find me. Instagram's my bread and butter. Even though it's changed over the years, I still post almost every piece that I do in some form, whether it's a reel or a picture, just to document it. And I repost photos all the time, especially on stories, and that's beautiful to be able to see what people, like I said, react, and the art happens long after I put a piece up in the street, so that's always great to see those photos, and those are a constant, daily thing happening in my IG stories.

Speaker 1: 50:29

Fabulous. So, wordsmith, that is just about all we have time for, but I do have one more question for you, if that's okay. I love the podcast Diary of a CEO. It's a guy called Stephen Bartlett. He's incredible and he's a fantastic interviewer, and he has this thing that I am shamelessly stealing, where at the end of every episode, he gets the guest to answer a question that has been left for somebody before them and they don't know who it is. So I'm going to ask you to give me a question for the next person that I interview, and I have a question for you from the last person that I interviewed. So the question is what in your life do you need to work on that? You're avoiding Quite a deep one.

Speaker 2: 51:11

Do I need to work on that? I'm avoiding. I got two things. So my 10 year anniversary was last November and I want to do a coffee table book. Um, and I've been putting it I don't know for whatever reason on the back burner again and again and again I started going through photos and it's not overwhelming. I know it's something I'll become obsessed about, but I can't believe that. That the book isn't, you know, more structured, or or I haven't gone through all the photos, but I think at some point in time again I'll fall down that rabbit hole and you might not see me for a month or two, but I'm going to dive in it. But it's not like me and for some reason, I think there's maybe a fake thing that I'm not realizing at this point because I never put stuff on the back burner like that, but I have.

Speaker 2: 51:59

And the other thing is, as I approach walls this is exciting. As I approach walls and do murals, you know I can always do what I do a very large typewriter plus page, and it's what people expect. But as I approach murals, I kind of want to evolve into something that you know it's me, you're going to know it's me on first glance, but it's something more than the, just the typewriter with a page on top of it. So I have this idea that I'm playing with and learning techniques to make it a reality, and I'm excited about that. It'll be just another thing in my repertoire of of doing more muralesque kind of um kind of approaches to walls, and that's very vague, but at some point in time you'll see it and I'm going to scream it from the mountaintops that this is the idea that I had that I finally made into fruition.

Speaker 1: 52:47

Well, everybody is going to have to watch this space. Go follow Wordsmith on Instagram and check that out when it finally makes it into the world. So, wordsmith, I am so grateful for your time today, and not only for your time, like I said, thank you so much for that bit of encouragement. When I met you that first day, the first day I ever sprayed a spray can and here I am now and it's just one faithful encounter after another, and now I'm doing something that I really love and I just want to say thank you sincerely. It was a pleasure to talk to you. Thank you so much for your time.

Speaker 2: 53:20

Thank you, it's great. It was great talking to you. It was a great conversation.

Speaker 1: 53:23

There you have it. Thank you so much for tuning into this episode of this Is Disruption. If you enjoyed today's conversation, make sure to follow the podcast and never miss an episode. You can find us on all major podcast platforms Apple Podcasts, Spotify, etc. Also on YouTube. Stay connected with us on social media. You can find the podcast at thisisdisruptionpod on Instagram and TikTok and you will find updates and snippets of upcoming shows. Until next time, keep challenging the status quo, embracing your creative spirit, and be brave. Go and create. Thank you and see you in the next episode.