Find love in Greece and become a photographer with Natalie Gushchina 💞 📸

🇷🇺🇮🇪🇬🇷 We sit down with Natalie, a Russian expat now thriving in Athens. After moving to Ireland to learn English as an au pair, Natalie has spent the last four years as a professional photographer, capturing the essence of her models' lifestyles and exploring new photography genres. Tune in to hear her fascinating journey and discover the art of storytelling through photography!

Follow Natalie on📲:

https://www.instagram.com/natalie_in_athens
https://natalieg-photography.com

Transcript

It was my first trip ever, outside of my hometown, without my parents, without anyone else.
And it was one of the best things I've ever done in my life.
And we started to chat. And I mean, it wasn't even calling, it was messaging, like writing letters.
It was long letters. And this is what I loved about our beginning of the relationship.
I learned to know him as a person. So it started to become like a really adventurous kind of game.
You know, like when your mind is always working, it's like, "Okay, I would like to do this."
"I would like to do it with this person." Like planning the photoshoot.
You know, Athens, when we came here, it's like a huge playground full of new toys for me.
Because here it's more urban than Crete. But from the beginning, I knew that I don't really want to work with professional models.
I'm drawn to real people. And I'm drawn to the stories maybe even behind those people.
[Music]
This is Expat Experts.
[Music]
Welcome to Expat Experts. Today we are recording from these amazing tourists in Haalandri, Athens.
With kind of some wind, but Natalie just provided us the amazing space today. I'm really happy to have you as a guest.
I'm very surprised and I'm very happy to be here too. Thank you.
Natalie is originally from Russia, lived in Ireland as well. I can recall now living in Athens since quite some years.
Yeah, I've been here since 2013. Okay, that's... almost a decade. Well, okay, yeah, not bad.
So yeah, I think just before we go directly into the episode, as always, remember to follow social media.
All the things, Instagram, Facebook and all of the kind of things. On top of that, of course, following Spotify and YouTube and the streaming channels.
That's just where we really appreciate your follow at the end. We're trying to look cool, but it's impossible because the wind is really strong.
We always look cool. That's alright. So yeah, without further ado, I would say that we enter directly into the first part. Let's do it.
[Music]
The Expat, episode 7 with Natalie Gashina.
[Music]
As I said, you are originally from Russia... where in Russia actually?
Well, usually when I call the name of my city, a lot of people would be like, "Okay, anyway, it's called Dzevsk." Okay.
We are famous for Tchaikovsky and for Kalashnikov. Kalashnikov is actually from my city. Okay.
And Tchaikovsky was born and, you know, lived the whole life in the village nearby, so this is like two things I try to point out and people are like, "Oh, okay." They can relate to. Okay.
Where is situated in... Oh, my geography is not my best thing but I think it would be something like northeast from Moscow. Okay.
And if now people from Dzevsk are watching, they're like, "Shame on you." But, well... There is not much northwest of Moscow, I think, no? In Russia, like...
It's a big, yes, it's a big country. So at the end, I suppose distances here are small compared to distances in Russia somehow.
It's very different to get used to the distances in Greece exactly like because, for example, when we travel back home, we would take a train to go from Moscow to my city and it takes 18 hours. For Greeks, 18 hours is like, "What?" It's like going to another country.
It's like taking the train in Greece also. The only train that they have in Greece.
Yeah. But it takes you how many hours to go to the north? Like four or five?
I think it's four hours. Something like this. So, yeah, I mean, of course, compared the sizes and this is always something typical also when you speak with Americans or Chinese people.
Yeah. From a bigger land. For them, like the trips here by car are like, "Okay, that's just like crossing two or three states." So, yeah, it's not so difficult.
It's very true because we moved to Athens very recently from Crete, where, for example, for us to go to another city would be an hour and we're like, "Oh, should we go? Should we not?"
Whether here, for me to go to the photo shoot, for example, in the center, it might take an hour. If it's at the seaside, it could be an hour and a half one way. So like it all depends really.
Yeah, Athens is not the most comfortable city to move around, I would say, like when you compare it to other places. And here, like from the very north to the very south of the city, it can take a very long time. And if you rush an hour, even worse, I would say.
True. I don't have much experience, you know, because my city is relevantly small for the Russian standards. When I lived in Ireland, also the city was really small, you know, as you can imagine. So Athens for me is the biggest one I lived in.
Okay, so far. And it took me a lot of time to get used to this, like big time. Okay. You said you moved to Ireland when exactly? I moved to Ireland when I finished college. Okay. I was trained as a teacher of English. So after I finished, I was like, okay, now I would like to speak, you know, at a certain level. So why not go to Ireland with the most complex accent on the. It was actually absolutely like random choice. It was available at the time.
It was a trip to go to Galway to learn English in the language school, but you would be a au pair, like kind of nanny, which lives in the house. It was an opportunity. And I went. I was 20 years of age. It was my first trip ever outside of my hometown, without my parents, without anyone else. And it was one of the best things I've ever done in my life. The first trip like not even for visiting other countries or like? Yeah. Before that, like until the age of 20, we would be traveling.
I was traveling to the south of Russia where I have some relatives to some other areas but never outside.
Not even like... back then it was like, summer holidays in Turkey or Egypt were famous but we could not afford it.
You know so it was like I was on my own for the first time in a foreign country and imagine like back then...
We didn't even have mobile phones.
So my parents did not know absolutely where they're going to send me.
It was just like, okay, let's hope you know like you will call us in four hours when you land in Dublin.
And it was... I still feel really thankful for them not to you know being afraid and saying, no we would be worried.
We would be, you know, we're sending you alone so no you're not calling.
They let me do it and it one I'm telling you it's one of the best things that happened to me.
Well it's really cool. I mean how worse... how is it for you like feeling wise because if you've never like...
like live your country or like never like traveled abroad even though you had probably a good level of English...
if you studied English in university.
I thought I did when you know I came there. You're right like Irish accent is a different story.
Yes.
But I think when you're young, you are more crazy and you do things and then you think about it.
Maybe like now I would be overthinking.
So yeah just saying that maybe you didn't overthink it too much.
You just like had the opportunity and you just took it and you went there.
Exactly.
Where does this opportunity come from?
When it happened. When I found the whole thing.
Yeah how does it come that you do university in Russia and then suddenly out of the blue you have an opportunity to go to Ireland.
Look for some reason since I remember myself like I always wanted to speak English perfectly.
Like I listened a lot of music in English when I was growing up. Like Backstreet Boys, Spice Girls, all this kind of 90s thing you know.
I was memorizing the lyrics, I was trying to google the translations and at some stage I remember it my last year in college...
and I'm riding a tram to go to home probably and I see this ad which is saying you know like learning English abroad,
au pair, blah blah blah, I don't remember exactly but I was like cool. So I take the phone number, I call them.
And the chances that I can go there were actually so small because I was not from the wealthiest family.
Like it was really a big amount of money that my parents had to invest.
And I come home and I'm telling this to them they're like okay we will try to figure out something.
And I'm just still surprised that they never said like no like are you crazy what do you want to do?
Like I'm the first person from my family who went abroad from the country. They were supported all the way.
So like slowly slowly we found money. And I remember this process of you know gathering the papers because we had to do the visa.
We had to find a family which was like some papers you know for me to write like letters and to do some other presentations.
Yeah and then the next thing is like papers are ready and I'm it's August and you know like I have the ticket and I'm flying into nowhere.
Like I had no picture whatsoever of the country like I knew the Thailand, the capital is Dublin, they speak English, it's green. It rains a lot and that's it.
Like that was my knowledge of the country. Yeah and it was interesting experience for somebody who was like like virgin to all of these things.
Okay and originally we talked a bit before starting recording but you said that you were originally going theoretically for one year.
Yeah like imagine coming from a conservative family with quite strict parents where you would be like mostly said no to a lot of things.
And then suddenly you turn out to be on your own. You make your own decisions. You taste new things. You see new places.
You have so many people from all over the world because Galway is an international place. Like it's a place it's called the student city.
So I have suddenly friends from Spain, from France, from Italy, like from Ireland. And when the year is over I'm like I don't want to go. I don't want to leave all of that.
So basically I decided to stay. I returned the ticket and I spent there six years. Six years. But that's five years more than the original plan.
It's not easy to say. Like what did you do? Like you just continued doing opera? You continued studying English? What was the...
I liked the family because you know like it was good for some time but then you know you're also like you're a part of a family.
So they kind of control your time. You have to babysit the kids which was not the best the worst part. But I wanted more freedom.
So at some stage I found a job in a supermarket as a shop assistant. I continued studying just to extend my visa because as a Russian citizen I had to be you know in these conditions.
I found a place. We were sharing a house like in the very outskirt of the city with other five people. Great guys. And that's it you know. Like I was doing my own thing. I was working on my own. I was earning my money.
I was spending the time whatever I wanted to do. It was independence. It was freedom. And this is what I didn't want to lose. I just wanted to go home. Nice. Oh. You want the jacket? No I'm alright. I'm starting to get cold. I'm also nervous guys. So this is why. Oh. Feel free. So at that point of time you started like you jumped from being on a family doing opera but then start working in there.
I suppose you started meeting people like having friends having a circle there. Absolutely. Did that influence the fact of like. Because if you want to say I stay a little bit longer maybe you stay three four years but six years it's quite a long time. It's like defining your 20s actually like if you. Yeah. That's what my 20s actually like. It was my crazy 20s like. At least you know the level of craziness that you know was for me.
I got friends there. I got relationships there. I was changing the jobs moving apartments. You know like I started to have a life of my own there. Again I think it's like back then in Russia the situation with the work and the money was quite difficult. OK. And working in Ireland in a supermarket I could support myself. I could support my living. I could travel. OK. So this is what I didn't want to change. Then I met a guy. Nice. Yeah.
So yeah I met my first husband there who was from Chile. OK. I got married and at home stage you know after some years they have changed the laws. When it comes to the students in Ireland it became much more difficult. So I decided to leave. And you know we had a plan you know to separate for a while but then come back together which never happened.
And basically that's it. Once I left Ireland I could not go back. OK. All of this time you were in Galway or you were in. Yeah in Galway. It was all time in Galway. Dublin seemed to me just a big very big city for me and Galway was beautiful. It was cozy. I had friends there. I don't drive. So for me it was like cycling. All the place was just perfect. Yeah. And getting wet under the rain every day. The funny thing is you know I don't remember recalling like.
This anger for the weather like obviously it was raining all winter long. And you know like the Irish way something rain is something different. It's not just like pouring sometimes it drizzles sometimes you know it's. Just like mist. Sometimes it pours like there are some like 50 shades of rain over there. But it never seemed to bother me. I always think that because I was young. And when you're young you take the things differently. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. It was just perfect.
So, in that time, you met this Chilean guy and then you just like had already been there six years on a visa of students.
So you were studying these six years continuously?
I was studying, but you know like when I say studying, I was trying to take different courses,
which were not so expensive in order just to extend my visa.
But it was all related with with languages or different stuff?
Different stuff. I was studying tourism, I was studying computers, I was studying programming, I was studying more language, you know,
because basically in English you can have this different level of language.
So I took my first certificate and then it was more advanced. So you can do this for quite a while. Yes. And that's what I did.
No, I'm asking because we haven't talked about it yet. But you are currently a professional photographer, which is a little bit far away from from from this,
like, linguistics approach or lifestyle. And we will definitely talk about the photography in more detail in the second part of the episode.
But it seems like you were like gathering a lot of like different knowledge and like taking a little bit of like path. Wasn't it like so convincing that the idea of like becoming an English teacher?
Or were you not like hundred percent sure of what to do at that point of life? Good question. I did work as a teacher when I came back from Ireland to Russia.
OK, because obviously I had a really good level of English, which is hard. At that stage it was hard to find in my city, you know, because a lot of people would call them teacher.
But their language was more how would you call it? Like I could talk in English. They could they could teach me English.
They could teach you English, but they could not teach you the conversation, you know, which I had. So I started to do the private lessons.
So they didn't speak any English, like in an English way, like exactly. So like I was teaching people, you know, how to talk, because like most of the time the problem was like I know English, I don't speak English.
And this is why they would come to me. We would have conversations, you know, I would give them different tasks. So I was for that purpose. I was trying to make them talk in English.
Yeah. Never school though, because I'm a person who hates systems, who hates rules, who hates all this, you know. Yeah, hate rules.
You know, so I was private all the time. I wanted to do it on my own terms, on my own way, where what I want, teach what I want. So nice.
So you always did like private teaching, school private teaching. I should have the microphone. Forget that you have a microphone. That's all right.
What did your parents think about like you suddenly, theoretically, your parents, your family in general, like suddenly we sent our daughter like for one year abroad and she stayed like six years.
How did you handle that situation? Look, they were sad. Like they were sincerely sad because we were attached. We had really like they were strict parents, but they were really loving parents as well.
We had great relationship, but what they always did, they never stopped me from doing the things I wanted to do. They would always be so supportive.
You know, now that I'm a parent myself and I think about these things, they would be like, if we can do this for you, if we can help you, we will do it.
We will never tell you no or like we will give you our points of view, but we will never stop you from making your own decision.
That's nice. And it's very supportive in a time that you I mean, because right now you live abroad and you have like phones and you can do video calls every two days like Internet is there.
Like there is a distance, of course, that the face to face never can come up.
It can never be substituted in any in any way. But. But the communication, it's easier.
The flying is also easier. The traveling is also easier, I think that that moment. You're right.
I remember back in Ireland, for example, it was in 2004. We don't have mobile phones or like I had this Nokia 3310 which didn't have what you could call and send messages to.
So I would buy a card and I would go to the center to find the phone booth and call my parents like once a week.
We would like set a time and imagine like if I don't call it like panic. So like I had to make it like life or death. I had to be there and we would talk.
Then the Skype came into the stage. So we were Skyping from the Internet center. So I don't know if you remember, you pay by hour.
Oh, I don't know if it's me because I'm nervous or because like the wind is really not good.
But we can go downstairs also if you prefer and do it inside.
Let's see that a little bit more like we were seriously waiting for the wind to stop, but it's not even flying.
Not really. But if you want, we finish this part and then we go downstairs.
Yeah, let's do that. So you said that then you went back to Russia due to the fact that Ireland was changing laws,
was changing ways of doing and then suddenly you were kind of like it was really complicated to accept the visa.
So I had to go back. Yeah, because I remember the papers going to the police station and the questions.
It was it was stressful all the time and I decided to go back.
My husband at that time, he was planning to fix the things, maybe to find a job and then to bring me as a part of the family, which never happened.
OK, yeah. Well, life, I suppose. Oh, yeah.
That's what I learned is like, you can plan all you want and the things happen the way you don't even expect them to happen, which most of the times for the better.
So you went back to Russia at that point of time and you start doing private lessons of English.
Exactly, to adults, kids or I tried both and I love both. I worked with a very small kids, like from three years of age, which was really fun,
because this is the best age to learn the language. You know, they learn so fast that you don't have to explain to them any grammar.
You just talk to them and they start talking back to you at some stage.
And the adults, they were different ages as well. OK, that was I think more difficult because I had some really like guys of the years like 50, 60.
OK. Yeah. So like, yeah, it was a bit harder. Interesting.
How for how long then you were before coming to Greece? How does Greece happen? When does it happen?
Well, when I came back to Russia after, you know, like my first failed marriage, I tried to connect to the Russian guys and it didn't happen.
Like I went on the dates. I was, you know, trying to meet people and just, you know, like this something special never happens.
I was like, OK, I'm almost 30. You know, I don't want to end up being a single woman for the rest of my life.
I should do something. So I create a web page on a dating website and I start looking for a husband at that time.
My aim was Spain or Italy because I spoke Spanish thanks to my ex-husband.
And somehow the odds were in favour of a Greek guy. OK. Yeah. So that was completely unplanned.
And as I said, you know, like whatever you plan never happens. You know, like, yeah, I met Kyriakos online.
We started to chat and I mean, like it wasn't even calling. It was messaging, like writing letters.
It was long letters. And this is what I loved about our beginning of the relationship.
I learned to know him as a person quite well before we even Skyped first for the first time.
And then a few months we were just, you know, like Skyping, video messages. At some stage, he was like, let's meet in person.
We go to Istanbul. We spent great ten days. And since then, you know, we were officially couple. OK. Wow.
So you ended in Greece due to the fact of like entering a dating site.
Interestingly enough, like the episode third, the third, I think, 30th episode of this year, the fourth episode of this year,
I talked with Alina, which is also a Russian girl living here in Athens.
She's teaching Russian languages online, like I'm doing like content.
And she was saying that she was planning to do some kind of course for Greeks to learn dating words and related dating words in Russian,
because it's a kind of common topic here, like that they are really interested in like.
Oh, it might sound really like funny, but indeed it's like it's really very, very common.
Even nowadays, like I end up getting messages from the guys which would be like, so like, hi, how are you?
I'm like, guys, I'm sorry, I'm not interested in any relationship.
And they're like, can you introduce us to Ukrainian or Russian friends? So like, apparently we're in the big demand.
OK, yes, I'm not surprised. So I hope Alina, your plan is going to work out.
It's curious. It's curious. So at the end, you met like Kiriakos for ten days in Istanbul.
And you said and then from there? And then there was a year and a half of the back and forth going to Greece, going to Russia.
OK. And then at some stage I was like, OK, you know, like we should either figure it out, whether we are continuing it, you know, seriously, or it's just wasting of time.
I think Greek guys are famous for the fact that they're trying to postpone the fact of the.
Committing. I hope he's not going to watch them kill me for this.
So I kind of, you know, ask them, you know, like, you know, where are we standing?
And 2013 in May, I'm coming here to Greece and since then I'm here permanently.
OK, so it's going to be in a few weeks, exactly ten years. Ten years. Nice.
You lived in. Well, it was before coming to Athens or you came before.
It's a really complicated story. I married a military guy.
Kiriakos is the Hellenic army. You know, I always forget his rank.
Anyway, he's in the army and due to that fact, we travel a lot.
When I came, we were in Athens for two years, then suddenly he has to move to Rhodes.
So we go to Rhodes for two and a half, then it was Crete, where he's originally from, which was maybe one of the best times of our lives.
And last year we find out that we have to move back to Athens.
That was shock, that was really unexpected, you know, like news for us.
And since October, we are permanently in Athens. So you've seen Greece.
You lived in quite some places. Yeah, and I've seen the best part of it because like Rhodes and Crete, they're like one of the most beautiful places.
Very cool. Yeah. Do you miss the islands? I would say it this way.
Once you live in Ireland, you are living in a completely different like bubble.
It's a different life. It's more slow. The distances are slow, smaller.
The people are friendlier. I don't know, like the whole life. It's different. OK.
So this is why I was laughing when I just came to Athens, like I'm a villager coming to a capital city, you know, because for me people, the pace of life, the traffic, the whole atmosphere is just like go, go, go, go, go.
Where in the islands you're like just relax, take your time, let's go to the beach, let's take a coffee, let's do it tomorrow, this kind of mentality.
More chill, everything. Nice. And more safe, you know, because I remember walking in Crete at 10 at night, it would be at 12 at night.
It would be nothing special, where they carry nothing. So I would think twice what I would like to walk somewhere. OK. On my own. Makes sense.
So when you came here, you maybe building a bridge between this and the second part of the episode, then we can talk about it more in depth.
I know that you were not a photographer until coming to Greece. So what did you do, like when you arrived, like the first things that you like you tried to teach also here or what was your...
I haven't thought about this, but you know, because I spoke languages back then, you know, Russian market was quite big because we like Greece had a lot of tourists from Russia and the Russian speaking countries like Ukraine, Belarus, Kazakhstan and some other, you know, ex-Soviet countries.
I found a job in a company in a tourist company and I was in a customer service, you know, providing the service for English speaking countries and for basically Russian speaking countries.
Once we had to move, though, that was a problem. And this is why I started to think about a job which I could do no matter the place.
And it's in roast that I had this thoughts that, "Hmm, why not photography?" It was, I cannot say it was like out of nowhere thought because at the moment when we came to Greece, we were traveling a lot.
And I took all this, like this little point to a very old Olympus camera. I was taking photos of the places of myself, of my husband.
And I remember like this, like analyzing the photos and like, "Oh, I like this photo. I don't understand why but I like it." And this one, I like the lights and this like a composition.
So I started to think about maybe some details of the photography. But once we were in the road, I was like, "Okay, what can I do? Photography. Okay, let's do photography."
And I go by my camera and I guess you can start, you can say this like a starting point, you know.
Interesting. I would... So sorry, like very unusual because a lot of photographers would be like, "I was dreaming about photography." Yeah, it's like a passion thing, normally, no?
Yeah, since I'm like a kid, I had my camera when I was six. For me, it was nothing like this. I have never thought about being a photographer ever. If you asked me 10 years ago, I would be like, "What?"
Why? Yeah, okay. And here I am. That sounds nice though. If you are cold, I would say we stop now this part and then we come back for the second? Let's go.
The Expert Becoming a Photographer.
Change of scene for the second part. Beach the wind and the cold.
And the cold, yes. Being able to look and not to worry how you look, which is very important.
For a photographer even more, I suppose? Very much. You're never in the sight of the camera, so how is it going? How do you feel?
This is a very new experience for me. Like, really, I've never done anything like that. I'm anxious now. I feel more relaxed because I got to know you because we have already done part one.
But in general, I like to control the process. I want to be there, see what's happening, give the orders what to do. So this is an out of comfort zone experience.
You sometimes have to push yourself to be there. This is great because this is how you grow. This is how you learn new things. There's no other way.
So, you became a professional photographer pretty recently, you said? Like, actually when you came here to Greece while being in Rhodes.
This is where I took a decision. Yes, it was a spontaneous thought. Like, why not to become a photographer? And, you know, like calling myself a professional photographer took me a very long time.
Because there was always this thing like, what if I'm not good enough? What if my pictures suck? What if... it's like, you know, like always second guessing.
So, like even now when I introduce myself, I still feel a bit shy saying a photographer, but it's been now full four years which I was doing this for.
Like it was commercial, it was actually a lot of very happy customers, wonderful customers who, you know, left their reviews saying that they loved the outcome.
So, I guess like I can exhale and say, yes, I'm a professional photographer for the last four years.
Nice. You said it came with like an inspiration, let's say like this, or also the need of like willing to do something due to the situation of moving around a little bit and finding a job that allowed you to do that.
It's really difficult now to recall how it all started, but no, I've never dreamed about this all my life. I was never drawn to it when I was a kid or nothing like this.
But, you know, once in a row when I was thinking like, what if I became a photographer and I got my first camera and I started to take photos of my family or my friends? I got into this.
I had this little desire to become better. For example, I would look at the photos of some photographers which I admire and it's like mine are not like that. Why? What should I do?
So it would be always like, get better, you know, like change things, I don't know, like figure it out. So it started to become like a really adventurous kind of game, you know, like when your mind is always working is like OK, I would like to do this.
I would like to do it with this person, like planning the photoshoots, seeing some pictures that you would like to create. It became actually a passion. OK.
Yeah, so now I can say that I'm fully living this experience, you know, like I could walk in the street looking at people and like it's not about beauty or anything is, like, you know, interesting face, interesting, I don't know, movement or something.
Some things exactly like I would photograph you or like, you know, you would see a spot and you're like, oh my God, you could take such a great photo here and you start having the little picture in your head.
I think my husband would be like, come on, let's go, because I would be, you know, like stopping on each corner like Athens when we came here.
It's like a huge playground full of, you know, like new toys for me, because here it's more urban than, you know, than Crete. Crete is more about seaside, about beautiful old town, but here it's just, you know, structure, buildings, roads, blocks.
Like all this shitty graffiti, all these ruins, this is what like moves me now, you know. It's a kind of playground for photographers here.
I mean, you need to be very much into the urban scene and like liking, like, more artsy in the sense of like street art and this kind of stuff and putting the environment around it. It's not so like, I don't know, nature here it's basically.
Nature not, but you know, Athens is like it has so many faces to this because you go to an aphiotic area and it's really island-like looking houses.
You go through these, let's say, hills which are close to Acropolis. So you can have there olive trees. It's a bit of like nature. So you can have absolutely different photos there.
Then you go into the streets. Then you have, you know, the buildings, the lines, the all this geometry, which I also love. And then you can go to the sea. It's far, but it's not impossible.
Then you have, you know, the water, the sand, nice sun. It's a fantastic place to be a photographer.
You said you like it started becoming like a passion and you started grabbing references from other photographers and like things, but did you study photography at some point or it was all self thought on trial and error? How was your process of like?
Both, because at the beginning when I just took my camera, I was like, I'll figure it out. So I started to look, watch a lot of YouTube videos, obviously a lot. And you know, I wish I didn't because actually when I took my first course with one Russian photographer, which style I admired.
This is where I saw a huge improvement and I saw that my pictures now look the way I wanted them to look. So I would definitely say that, you know, it was both. But you know, courses from a particular people that were inspiring me, they boost my, you know, my portfolio and the way my photos look now.
So you very recommend like to rather try to get to, I don't know, some courses from good photographers rather than trying to figure out things.
Absolutely. I'm sure there are some prodigies, you know, which they have their own thing from the beginning and they know what they're doing. I was not. I knew what I wanted my photos to look like. But it took me quite a while to come to this point.
But, you know, I look at my photos and say, I like what I do. I love my photos. I like what I produce. And this happened when I started to, you know, to learn from the other photographers like this particular way, how to take the photos or the style or like. Yeah.
How would you describe your own style of photography?
I call myself lifestyle photographer. And I guess and I heard this a lot when people look at my photos, they say they look like, you know, a print screen from a film.
Okay. So that it has some movement in it or like. It definitely has the movement because like for me, motion in my shots is important. I don't like static. I don't like this, you know, artificial pose and all those kind of things. It's not me.
I like a person who looks at my photos, had this feeling of presence at this exact moment in the picture. It's like, you know, you're watching some people doing some private things and you're like spying on them or something like that.
If you if you know what I mean. So this is why a lot of my photos, people don't even look at me. They're doing their own stuff. They're in their own world and their own moment.
And I'm just, you know, capturing what's happening at this moment, which does not mean at all that they're doing whatever. I still direct the process like it's actually a lot of recommendations and then maybe like fixing stuff.
But the results would be like that. It's a frame from a film. It's the candid, very intimate life.
You know, something that makes you want to look at the photo, think what's happening, why they're doing this. Something like that.
How does the process normally work? Like someone contacts you, they want to photoshot, it's you finding someone. Did it ever happen that you find someone in the street and you stop them and you say, sorry, you have an amazing face?
I did this once. I did this once at the very beginning of my career in Crete. We went to this fantastic beach called Balos.
It's famous for its white sand and blue waters. I've never been there. If you're ever in Crete, you have to visit because it's nothing like anything else.
Anyway, I took a camera with me and I remember seeing this couple. They were Italians, really pretty. I loved the way they were interacting with each other.
And I was like, guys, you know, I'm a photographer. Would you like me to take your photos for free if you don't mind? And they were like, sure. Do it.
And I was at the very beginning. I wasn't really, you know, aware of the things I'm doing and how I'm doing this. But I remember the result was like, wow.
You know, because sometimes it depends a lot on people who are in the frame and they obviously were not new to that thing.
So, like, imagine all this fantastic surroundings. This was an overcast day, a mountain on the background, this blue water and this like gorgeous people with nice tan.
You know, like, I still have these photos on my profile, I think. So, yeah, I did it.
And then I did other couple of times. But now, being four years in photography, I definitely prefer to plan things.
I'm the person who has to have the mood board, which is some kind of references. At the beginning, I was in writing, you know, what we're going to do, where we're going to go.
Like doing this little pictures, which I will then take. So, yes, I'm.
Do you go from the process of having an idea of what you like and then finding the people or the people contracts you in the way of, like, I would like that? Or what is your preference?
I mean, like, it's like idea or people like idea first or people first. It depends sometimes.
There are, you know, things which I see a person and then in my head I start building this puzzle. Like, what would she wear? Where would it be? How would it go?
Or it could be an idea. And I would be like, so who is want to see in this frame?
Usually this happens for the photoshoot, which I do for my portfolio or like some ideas that you know, I have, and I don't kind of do this for the clients.
So then I would be like looking for a particular person and look maybe, you know, like lately I was drawn because I'm like I'm forty two year old person.
You know, like I can more relate, probably easy to the women of my age, like thirty five plus.
So I and I like really I'm looking at women, which now forty and older and seeing them beautiful and still young.
You know, I mean, like when you're twenty, you think that at forty life is over.
But when you reach that point, you actually feel that, you know, like everything is just beginning.
And I think I really want to show this with my photos of taking of this, like, you know, ladies who are in their forties and fifties, but they still look wonderful and they still, you know, and they can look wonderful.
You know, kind of like promoting that.
That sounds really like entering into like a new scene of things like you.
I suppose you need to reinvent yourself also through years and through time, like to find, OK, I've done so much of this that my portfolio looks too much like that.
Or like, I mean, you need to find new things to do or does it happen often that you are like borned by a topic?
For example, I don't want to do this anymore. I want to try something that's really different.
I think photography is like anything in the life. You know, it's like it's a process.
It's never like, you know, a destination. So you grow, you learn, you change yourself and what you want to see in your photos changes, you know.
So, yeah, like, I think I find this quite at least once a year when I come to the point and it's like, I'm not happy with my photos.
Something is missing. I'm not satisfied anymore. And then I either try to shoot for myself something creative in order to figure out what it is that I want to see.
Or I go to do some course with some other photographers, which I again, like I want to reach their level.
So, yes, it's like it's I think if you are stuck in the same, you know, like face where you were three years ago, four years ago, there is something wrong with you.
It cannot be static. OK. That makes a lot of sense. I think. There is a few jobs where you can really, like, this that you can never improve,
because if not, you are like in a same state to all the rest, and maybe you're very good at a single thing.
But if you are a creative mind and you try to push a little bit further than that, you will always try to improve some things. Exactly.
I suppose. So how much right now it's of your job. It's like getting clients, because I suppose that when you create, like, portfolio pictures,
some of the clients that you might take pictures for clients might be useful for your portfolio.
Some others are photos that will go to the client, but will never be in your portfolio, because maybe they are not what you are thinking inside of your portfolio.
Yeah, not everyone allows you to post the photos. Of course, also that.
How much of this percentage is like right now doing photos for your portfolio versus doing client job?
Look, the situation has changed quite a lot since I came to Athens. Athens is like a huge sea full of fish, especially nowadays.
Photography is such a common hobby for many. And like being in a big city, obviously, like the amount of great photographers is quite big.
And I'm new here and photography is the business that actually, unfortunately, takes time to build.
Because, you know, you have to build a new portfolio based on the location. You have to build a reputation. You have to stand out because like there are so many of us.
And I think I'm still in the process like am I at the point where I'm like happy? No.
Maybe like lately I'm like even experienced a lot of maybe like more downs than ups.
But, you know, it's life. So at the moment, I try to find any opportunities to photograph, like not even clients, you know, just like offering photo shoots.
Like I have an idea or like I have a location I would like to add to my portfolio.
I would just go to some communities in Facebook and I would look for people and say, hey guys, want to photo shoot for free?
Want to be my models? And yeah, it's a little bit of both at the moment.
Nice. Have you ever shoot with professional models? Because that that like that kind of circle seems absolutely different from from doing photo shooting with normal people, let's say like this or street people.
Yes, you know, it's very true. But to tell the truth, it's been only once.
It's like the once that I contacted the agency and asked if I can shoot with a model, which was obviously, you know, like a piece of cake, because.
What, you know, differs a model from a normal person? You know, they know the thing.
They are really fluent. Like it's like it's just about, you know, constantly moving.
So it's always like face expressions, relaxed hands, like super nice movement.
It was really easy. But from the beginning, I knew that I don't really want to work with professional models.
I'm drawn to real people and I drawn to the stories, maybe like even behind those people. So for me, it may be more challenging.
But I prefer a hundred times working just, you know, with a random person I meet in the street on a website or like a client who bothers me then, you know, like, these the models, they look pretty.
Like they what attract, you know, people, maybe sometimes to your profile.
But I like it the hard way and more interesting way and more maybe like human way or something like that.
Now, I mean, I think it makes a lot of sense.
And then you need to have your vision and that vision passes through capturing normal lives, normal things of whatever, whoever is in there.
That doesn't pass normally through a model who is a professional because they are faking.
It's like it's like photo shooting theater. The actors are acting and they are in a paper that it's not their life.
Therefore, they are putting it. Don't get me wrong. I think photo shoot sometimes is some kind of acting, you know, because like.
You put people in a situation, you ask them to do things in order to capture.
Like, I sometimes feel that I'm a director who is directing a movie and this is how it is, but I'm just, you know,
like taking the little snaps of the moments of the things that they do.
Models are OK. But my portfolio is not about, you know, the pretty girls, the perfect girls.
I want it to be about real people like me, like everyone else.
I want people look at it and say, you know, like, I don't have to be perfect in order to be photographed.
I can be me. This is what I want to show.
Like a person. She's who she is and she's still, you know, beautiful.
You don't need to be in this. What society is defining as a standard of beauty to be photographed. Absolutely.
That's nice. I think it makes it more close to to everyone and more democratic in that sense. I suppose also when you talk about these parts of directing for anyone who has never done a photo shooting.
How does it work? Like you you get a couple, for example, and you say, OK, I have this in mind or they have something in mind, like a location or even a concept.
Maybe they are like, we want a photo shooting that reflects whatever you said before that you do mood boards.
You do like what are the steps to do the photo shooting?
OK, like, yeah, in your case, of course, like it's not always like this, you know, because sometimes like a client contacts me and they just like,
you know, like we meet and we do something spontaneous. But if I shoot for myself and like and with some clients.
Yeah, the mood board is important because I guess I want to show you the the mood of the how it's going to be like what I want to get from you and what you will get when I take this photo.
So that will be one thing. Then obviously, I really like to put the attention to what people wear. Which is an important part.
Or what they don't wear, like if you go the other way around. But how do you choose that?
Do you go to their place, open their wardrobes and say, this doesn't this or?
Sometimes I really ask, like for me, I told you, like I'm a control freak in a way.
So if we sometimes, you know, chat, you know, via Viber and they send me photos and it depends on the location, you know, because, for example, at the seaside,
let's say, imagine like you're at the beach, white looks great, like plain white flowy dress looks great.
Whether if you wear something really tight with like flower prints, which you cannot, like properly move because it's so tight like it reveals the things you don't want to show.
It will look completely out of concept, you know, you can do this, but the result will not be the same.
So I always try to put in my mind the place, the occasion, you know, the weather, obviously as well.
But in general, I'm a really simple person, like I like comfortable.
I'm not about glamour. I'm not about, you know, like over makeup, super, super fancy clothes.
I always say dress simple. You have to like yourself. Try to avoid the prints.
Earthy colors like, you know, like browns and beiges and like whites and blacks, neutral colors.
They always work perfectly because the less loud your clothes is, the less it takes attention from the people who are in the picture and people is my main subject.
So at any rate, I want, you know, people to try to look at their clothes and not the, you know, the characters on the photos.
So we discuss this. Yeah, like makeup.
I like girls without makeup or like a little bit makeup doesn't matter as well.
So we usually discuss this, you know, and then how I would direct. You asked how I would direct that.
I have this thing, you know, I can switch. No, no, no. That's exactly what it focuses about. Point of the question.
Directing. I always tell them that, you know, if you never done any photo shoots, you probably will feel quite uncomfortable first, like 15 minutes in front of the camera because it's a...
-Voila! -Yes, the point is proven. Yeah, because it's awkward.
Sometimes I'm a stranger, they see for the first time, so we take some time to learn. I take the time to learn how they are because I like to watch their little, you know, like maybe movements,
how they, if it's a couple, how they interact between each other. If it's a girl, some little gesture that she does, I know when she like fixes her hair, maybe like she's moving her dress.
As I said, they're not about posing. I want the person, you know, I want the photo to be about the person. So I observe those and then slowly, slowly, you give them some directions, you know, even for example, just, you know, like, you know, little touching, always moving.
Never still, because as I always say, if you freeze, like if you just stay still, it's just one frame. So whatever you do, move it, move it, you like touch each other, move, fix your hair, touch your face.
Like all these little things help you to catch those beautiful frames, which at the end, you know, create a story.
That makes a lot of sense. Like, I think it makes a lot of sense, the fact of like not posing as the idea, because I assume a lot of people come to misconceptions of what a photo shooting is, like a little bit like the top model thingy. I have a pasarela and I just like show a little bit of that.
Yes, it's really cute because some people come to me and they're like, you know, this is our first photo shoot and we don't know how to pose. And I was like, thank God you know how to pose. Because it means you won't do these ridiculous things which look unnatural because like a lot, very few people can pose naturally.
And in general, like I'm not trying to judge because, you know, if some people are into more like glamour and fashion that might suit really nicely, like posing, their style. But because I'm a lifestyle photographer, it means I want it to look as natural as possible for me is a no.
Please go.
Yes. So like, this is why like if you do not know how to pose, this is fantastic. You don't have to pose. You just have to be yourself. And that's it. The rest I will do. And a lot of people always you know, for example, think that photography is just like me standing in front of them and like clicking at the camera where in fact, I would be.
20 cent like in 1920 with the camera. It's not like this at all. I try to capture as many angles as possible, which means like I would be lying down on the ground, I will be climbing the things I would be, you know, like literally moving a lot. So I usually say you like you enjoy relax and have fun and you know, like I will do the rest. Nice.
I don't know if you can really compare because at the end you started here in Greece, but at least between the photo shootings that you were doing in Rhodes and in Crete and here in Athens, I think I've seen a couple of photo shootings that you did with foreigners, also like people who are not really living in Athens, but they came like for some days.
Most of my photo shoots are actually with tourists. Greece is a really funny country when it comes to photography industry. I don't know if you if you know, I don't know if you know, your viewers know. But let's say back in Russia, photography is a big part of our life. We don't only photograph weddings and baptism like they do it here. We would maybe like go and photograph the Christmas photos or it's like just, you know, you take your boyfriend, you go for a love story photo.
You have a baby or you're pregnant, you know, you capture this moment anyway, like we photograph and here in Greece, sometimes I laugh and say it's a wrong country to be a photographer because they photograph only weddings and baptism, which I never was really interested into because I find it really it's a procedure.
You know, it's a standard procedure which you have to follow the steps. Photos with the bride. Yes, like where is the creative part? Where is the spontaneous thing? Where is this? I don't know if you know, you speak Spanish, but I know that you speak Spanish, but I don't know if you know that we call it the BBB, like the Bodes Mautizos y Comuniones, BBC, like the TV channel thingy in Spanish for both musicians and photographers or filmmakers.
We say that you if you are like not, you don't have enough money, you then fall down to the BBC, which is Bodes Mautizos y Comuniones, which is weddings, baptised and the confirmation of the Catholic Church. And it's just like, okay, you fall into that because it's not really artistic, but you need the money.
Look, therefore you do it. But that's the thing, you know, this is the place where like this is the area of photography, where it has, which has money increase like and really good money. Also very good competition, but it's a different story. But yeah, I'm struggling to find the moment myself and you know, like what I can photograph because I really like those little just, you know, like people's moment, you know, people life's moment, for example, a woman is pregnant and they want to picture that moment or.
The baby's born and he's just a couple of days old and he will grow and he will change and they want to take that photo of him. Just, you know, like this tiny first stage or. And it's not in the culture of Greeks. All the photoshoots, which I've done of this they were with people from abroad with people from the States, from Australia, from other places in Europe. But unfortunately, Greeks are out of my league when it comes to that. And so far.
I don't know. I hope maybe one day it will change because now in Greece, as you see, there are photographers from all over the world. We have a lot of Russian and Ukrainian photographers from other European countries and I think slowly that, you know, the culture will change. Hopefully. We'll see. Hopefully for you. Yes, of course. Yeah.
What about event photography like because that's another big scene I think like going to concerts, festivals, theater, this kind of stuff, it's still capturing a moment of life, but it's it's more like imposed.
So, you know, again, the thing is being a control freak, it's something I cannot control. It's a journalistic genre, which I do use sometimes because, you know, it's one of the way how you can photograph the things and you just, you know, let the thing go and observe.
But in general, this is something I have never been interested into. You know, like business portraits, not my thing, concert or some, you know, events. Neither, plus you have to be really like, you know, a person who likes, you know, all this like communication and stuff. I'm a low profile. Even though I'm I love connecting with people. I prefer it like that, you know, private, maybe some slow music. Nice conversation. I am not a party animal or like big event lover. So not for me.
That makes sense. I mean, I think it's good that you have so clear your own profile of what you want to do. That's, that's very nice. Like, at least, you know, where you want to shine, because I can assume that a lot of people loses themselves in trying to find this photography to very broad field, you can be doing like, I don't know, landscape photography. It's very different from, I don't know, business portrait, you were saying.
Oh, it is like. I don't know if it's actually, you know, like my strength or it's my curves, because I see here some photographers doing everything they would do, couples and weddings and baptism. And then they do the events and the product photography. Like they do everything, a bit of everything. And I mean, it's money, but how much of at the end of the day, people go to photography, I guess, because they want to create, you know, it's a really, really, really creative.
You know, kind of things. And if it becomes generic, then it loses the whole, you know, meaning of it. And I'm happy for them that they can do this. But you know, I don't know if I would be able to do that.
But it doesn't define you that much, no? I mean, if you're capable to do everything, maybe you're not doing everything at the excellence level. You are just like doing a little bit of everything and nothing.
I agree. I agree. You cannot be good at everything because, for example, even like now I know my strength and I'm offered sometimes, like, for example, photographing an event or photographing, you know, the things which are not my standard thing. And I tell people, guys, like, I would do this. Will I be good at this? Maybe not. You know, so maybe like you better.
You don't expect don't expect to see the same results that I have in my portfolio if I'm doing that, because that's not the same thing. I assume it's also like setting up your boundaries in what to do and what what to accept and what not exactly.
And I like to be honest with people, you know, like I cannot tell everyone. Like I'm great at everything. I usually like maybe they say maybe like it's stupid, you know, but I would usually, you know, inform people.
Let's say the first time I was offered to photograph a wedding, it was a couple which I photographed as a couple. It was the first reunion in Crete. And they contacted me a year after and like, Natalia, we are going to come to Crete. Do you want to photograph our wedding? And I'm like, guys, I have never done this. Like, I've never done this. And it's like, it's OK, you will do this. Like, guys, are you sure? Like, I mean, this may be stupid. Another person would say that, take the opportunity and do it. But I want to deliver a hundred percent.
The result that people will be happy with. Like, I'm not OK with just giving them something. So this is why, like, I make sure that they know. At the end of the day, it was actually a very amazing experience. But, yeah, I want to let people know that, you know, I'm not very good at that.
Makes sense. Right now, are you seeing, like, next steps in your career? Is there something in your mind that is, like, boiling in there?
In fact, it does. I don't know if you've noticed, like, lately, I've been drawn to a new genre, a nude. You know, I have been, I think I have been drawn to this from the very beginning.
And, like, looking back at my old folders, I find some photos of trying to photograph the boudoir style, which is women, like, partially naked or completely naked, which was, like, ridiculous at the time.
Now, with my experience and, you know, like, my values and the way I am now, I really think I can create this boudoir style for the girls.
You know, as much intimate as they can go to because, you know, there are different stages involved. And also for the couples that I've discovered this lately, you know, like, not just to photograph your little walk on the beach.
What if you go into your bedroom? What if we take a little bit more close? What if you get a bit more intimate?
Like, to have it more about, you know, the body contact, about the this whole sensation of this erotic, very intimate moment between two people.
So this is what I'm really passionate about at the moment. It's not easy to find people to practice on, obviously, especially those who want to agree.
And make it public.
Public, exactly. But I'm not giving up on this idea. So we will see.
It's interesting at the same time, probably very complex to find people.
And also that these photos can enter your public portfolio because people are in a society like the Greek one even more because these kind of topics are still very much taboo.
So let's say we're in the capital. So it's a little bit more free. In Crete, where, you know, it's like a village society, village mentality when everyone knows everyone.
I couldn't even dream about it because everyone would say like, "Mathalia, no."
So in that sense, at least Athens has brought maybe competence and has brought like more fear of people being in the market or whatever.
But at the same time, it's opening some other doors.
I always like I was, like, thinking when, you know, when we were on the edge to move to Athens.
And I was really upset because I was like, you don't want to go out of your comfort zone, you know?
Like I was happy in Crete. I had my clients. I had my routine. I had my income.
And I would have to quit everything and start like literally from scratch. I mean, not completely, like, start from scratch.
And I was afraid, like, what's going to happen? How am I going to do it? Will I be able to do this?
I still have some questions left, which I have no complete answers to, but it's definitely, it's growth.
It's growth in many ways. And I think, like, you know, everything happens for always for good reasons.
Even if it looks bad at the beginning, it's always for good.
Nice. What's your equipment? What do you use as equipment?
Equipment, I'm a Sony shooter. It was my first camera that I got. It was mirrorless, really, really cheap one.
I don't have it. And, you know, once you start buying glass, the lenses, it's very difficult to change.
OK. So literally I had the second camera and now have the third one and the fourth.
And they're all Sony, a little bit better, a little bit more advanced. But I'm happy.
The thing I'm not happy is that the Sony glass is really quite expensive compared to the other brands.
But a part of that, it does the job. You know, I'm familiar with the equipment because also, like,
as artistic and creative I am, I suck when it comes to the equipment.
Like, I'm literally struggling to figure out the settings.
Cameras are really complex. I'm sorry, but pushing out to whoever is a camera designer, guys,
simplify the interface. It's really complex. Like, there must be a way easier to simplify these menus.
Like, sorry, but it's not easy that the combination of buttons is you touching three buttons that are positioned in the camera.
It's that horrible.
Especially, I think Sony has this reputation for horrible menu interface and it does.
And I mean, like, they say that you're a photographer, you should know your camera, like, inside out.
And here goes one sponsor. Sony going out.
I know some buttons, which I use regularly. And if I don't, I just like YouTube and I find answers there.
God bless YouTube. Another sponsor coming. And you wish that they pay.
So in general, like, you feel more, like, tight to do photography with people, of course, like capturing moments of life.
Have you ever done animal shooting?
Apart from the cut of mine. No, like landscapes. I remember at the beginning, when I was still trying to figure out what I want to photograph.
I was trying to do some landscape that was in rodents.
And then whenever I looked at the photo, it looked so crappy compared to the result of the original one.
I was like, there is no way I can make my picture look as beautiful at the real, you know, scene. So I just gave up.
But class, you know, like I love human interaction like I'm all about people.
I like, let's say, female body for its beautiful structure. Exactly.
I love people a relationship like whether it's mother and child or it's like a couple because of this.
Like sometimes, you know, like I like analyze like I'm proud and I'm very privileged to witness this little moments of that personal interaction and be a part of it.
You know, like, imagine people, proposal, you know, I've done a couple when I was back in Crete.
It was a secret one. So it was just a couple and me.
And it would be like at sunrise in the old harbor when, you know, the guy would go on his knee and propose to the girl and you photograph this.
And then they're crying and you're crying as well because it's overwhelming. It's so beautiful.
It's so personal. It's so private. And like you're a part of it.
I always like, I don't know, thank God, thank universe. Whoever is responsible for everything that's happening, that, you know, I can do this.
It's inspirational.
Maybe the last two questions before I do a little bit of a game that I do at the end of the episode, which is always a these or that let's say like this. What about the editing part? How much do you edit the pictures that you take? How do you do that?
Not much at the beginning. When I started photography, I thought I can take a photo, but there is no way I can learn Photoshop Photoshop because for me it was something so complicated.
It was so overwhelming.
Another incredible interface of buttons.
I was for a very long time afraid to edit because I was like, I won't be able to do this. As I said, like I'm I suck when it comes to technology and other things I just do not comprehend it.
And then I discovered Lightroom and it made my life easier. In general, I really do not like much of the like I would never edit you looking like you're not you, which some photographers do and it's okay. It's just not my thing.
So once Lightroom came into my life, you just create a couple of presets that you know match your style and just adjust, you know, the most difficult part of editing is actually selecting the frames that you want to leave.
And shooting for one session like a thousand let's say per hour, it could be a thousand two hundred thousand six hundred and then you have to narrow it for a hundred.
That's where the challenge comes. The rest is easy.
That's a 10% Yes.
Okay, take into consideration that you know some frames are just like this.
Yeah, some frames will be moved we'll be not focused when whatever that's the easy discard but at the end probably we'll have like what 600 700 frames.
Usually you know like I know there are photographers which would be like, you get 30 images and then they charge for the rest. I never do that maybe it's a stupid thing to do but usually like I try to give all the good frames, and you as a client would be the last one like you can have all of them, I will edit all the good frames and send it to them.
And you know you can have all of them, or you can you know just download the ones you love. But let's say, if it's a solo session I would end up like 160 frames per couple it would be 200.
Because you know what I have noticed,
a photographer choice never matches the choice of the client.
Let's say I worked sometimes with a couple of brands I photographed for them. And then you know like they would tell me like so edit that and that and that and I'm like, I would have never chosen that frames ever, like, I think this is so much better and this one is so much better.
So, you know, to avoid this kind of thing, just like, have it all guys I don't mind. Yeah, but it's, it's again, probably going back to what we were asked what we were saying at the beginning no it's a photo shooting for a client or it's a photo shooting for your portfolio then the end user, if it's for your portfolio
is yourself. And of course, the persons who model it would like to have the frames. But it's for your portfolio, if it's a client, bringing actually it's an intelligent thing to do like bringing the perspective from the user much easier, much faster or sooner, and let them choose the photos that you need to edit, it's actually intelligent because it's like putting the interest of what it's not always.
Look, I thought about this you know like, showing them all the frames and then let them do the final pick. But at the end of the day it might last forever because you know, if you're quite busy with the sessions, just like editing time is so short, you don't want to go back and opening the same folders and edit and read it because at the beginning I would you know do this like I'm edit in color and black and white because I'm personally pro black and white.
Some shots can live only in my opinion black and white. And then the customer will be like, you know, Natalia, I like it a lot and black and white but can you please convert everything in color because I like and it's like, sure, okay, you're the client.
So, like nowadays, I would probably just for most of the people, I would do everything in color, and then for my portfolio. I would convert some shots in black and white.
Or, you know, there are people who say like you know, we like the black and white, we want the black and white, give us both. And then I know with them, I will have no problem you know the going back and forth and converting and re editing and stuff like this so.
That's what I was going to say at the end, you open Pandora's box if you give the option of choosing the user sometimes it's just like, it might maybe extend your, your time and your dedication too much for for it.
And it might sound you know like something really easy and just like people in general think that you know photography is just like, it's an easy thing you just press the button you notice and produce fantastic images.
I'm a designer, they think I paint and call and brushes and pencils still I haven't touched a pen in the last, what, 10 years maybe.
So, I feel you.
So, yeah, like there are some, you know, things that you know we're keeping as the professionals.
But...
No, no, it just maybe giving too much choice to the client over complicates the whole process. It makes it too long, it makes that.
Also the clients, it's not their job.
This is why you know like because I can do them 200 frames, I will give them 200 frames.
And you know, they might not want everything, but at the end of the day, they might want everything. So this is how it goes. And I really never had to complain like
as far as it's been you know working for me, I will do this and you know, and we will see.
Okay, last questions before I do the these or that thingy.
Have you ever thought about like more going into videography or anything? Have you tried ever like going into video?
I have tried videography recently so really confusing at the beginning because I do not know what I'm doing.
You know like I started to record this little video portraits maybe like for 20 seconds of some girls.
It's exciting because it's something new to learn. But I feel that I cannot at any rate called myself a videographer because I don't really know what I do.
Whatever I do, it's more like intuitive and spontaneous more than technical and professional,
but it's fun because it's a different kind of visual content, you know, that some things which you can show only when it's moving, plus you add the melody,
you know, so like it's more components which affect your perception of the thing, which is great.
So definitely, yes, I would like to learn more about this, but would I like to switch to videography?
At the moment, I would say no, but you never know.
Sounds good. I mean, it's a thing when you do, if you ever switch the equipment required for doing videography increases a lot.
Also, on the other hand, I can still, you know, like I mean, like now I'm recording the videos with my cameras, which is totally fine.
So like I think you can still deal with what you have because Sony is a great camera.
So, yeah, literally, I just need one lens because I have 50 millimeters, which is a little bit more narrow than what I would like it to be.
So 35 millimeters and I'm ready to go, I think.
And you need to fix camera because then if you need to stabilize, you know, gimbals, you need to...
See, I told you, I'm not really familiar because I saw some people having some frames.
Yeah, like that's a stabilizer, keeps the camera moving and these things are expensive.
Like when you enter videography, it's where I suppose the hole...
So I guess I will keep it for now as a little extra.
Like trying things out.
Yeah, like I'm still offering, you know, sometimes like I have this one package which I like offer a little video because, you know, it's social media nowadays that rules the world.
And we like all want the content or just we want to post something, you know, to show people where we were, what we did.
So this is great addition. But yeah, like I will stick to 20, 30 seconds no more. Nice area, but maybe not yet.
I lied. I think now you just say package, the word packages and you triggered me.
So let me ask another last question. So you offer like bundle packets, for example, of like of what you will offer to your clients or like...
I will tell you something. At the moment, I'm still trying to figure out, you know, like how it works and stuff like this.
But basically, yes, like one package is just a lot of people, a lot of people had previous experience with photography.
They kind of used to this time frame packages, you know, which for me and the way I shoot like 30 minutes for me is like literally it's just the time I get to know the person.
So like one hour is the least for me, like amount of time that you can get some great images.
My best, probably like preferable time frame is one hour and a half because literally like people don't get so tired of you and the whole process,
yet they open and they become acting naturally without, you know, like being aware of the fact that they're being photographed and feeling awkward.
So now I'm just offering, let's say the same time frame, but you know, one has less photos and another one has more and has a little video.
Nice. So, yeah, just to close the episode, I do these kind of questions where I'd say if you need to choose yes or yes one or the other, let's say that.
I'm not very good at that.
That's the whole idea of it. Nobody's good at it. Like when you put some two choices on this, it needs to be complex.
Let's start with an easy one. I think you've already said the preference, but color black and white.
Black and white all the way.
Okay. Analog or digital photography?
I have to be truth. I have never tried film photography ever. So let's stick to the digital, but I would definitely like to get into this one because the film photography has this whole special feel about it.
The digital can have only with some heavy editing.
Okay. So yes, one day I'm definitely thinking about giving it a try.
Nice. Shooting with one person or with two persons? Like a couple shooting or single?
This is a difficult one because it's really, really different. I would say couple. It's easier because, you know, the person, when the person is on their own in the frame, it's more awkward.
There is nothing to interact with. You don't know what to do with the hands. So it takes more time to make it feel a little bit more going.
Whether it's the couple, because they're two, they're supporting each other. They're both in this thing. So yeah, couple. It's just because it's easier.
Yeah. People interact between them if you're alone like watching this.
Yeah, even the hands. I do that even like when I'm talking with people. So I'm like moving my hands randomly. So imagine alone.
No, that is a really awkward thing. Like a lot of people don't know what to do with them. This is why it's like I always like, you know, put your hair, fix the clothes and you look cool and relaxed.
Shooting in the sea or shooting in the mountains? Like seas.
Yeah, I would say sea. Even though I'm a mountain person, there is something about sea that I like. And especially, you know, like getting people wet all the way and then working with that.
This is a lot of fun. And the sand is everywhere. Like you come from the photos from the beach and you're, you know, throwing the sand from every single pocket, from every single place in your clothes you have, you get wet.
But I don't know, there is something beautiful about water, you know, and how it glistens on the skin, you know, when the skin is wet and how the sun reflects and, you know, like, yeah, the sea, a hundred percent.
Male or female models?
Ladies. I am a ladies photographer for sure. I have been photographing a lot of guys lately, which I enjoy because it's like, again, it's like coming out of your comfort zone. But I'm definitely like ladies is my choice of subject.
Nice. I was going to ask tripped or not tripped, but I think you responded to that, like you move with the people. So I don't think you are going with the tripped with it, no?
No, I told you I have this tripod. I've never used it ever. Like I had it as a present and it's been in my closet for the last four years.
Okay. Hopefully the person who will give it to you doesn't hear to this.
Yeah, but you're the first one, by the way.
Nice. Okay. Now it's used.
Because mine collapsed.
And maybe let's do one last these or that question. It would be selecting the clothes for your models or letting them bring whatever they want.
Hmm, always, always have a control of this. And even if they bring their own clothes, I would probably still, you know, do some adjustments because people think that something is beautiful and probably it is, which could be completely inappropriate for the situation or surroundings.
And I mean, like, I guess you don't think as a photographer, unless you ever done this. So people think from one perspective and I always think from that perspective. At the end of the day, I'm right. But sometimes, you know, like, they were like, look, you know, why can't I bring this flower dress?
It's like, because, just trust me. Yes. So, yes, always having control of it.
Nice. Thank you so much for recording, for accepting the invitation to the podcast, for sharing all your experience in photography. I think there is a lot of people who's either from a hobby perspective or trying to build a career in there that you definitely be happy to hear your experience.
Thank you. When you I got your invitation, I was like, scared and excited at the same time because like I told you, I've never done this. But it's amazing experience like thank you. Thank you. I'm very happy.
Thank you. I cannot say anything. Like, maybe just before we close the episode, I think, maybe we promote a little bit your, your social media as in your portfolio if you want like, I know you have a website.
It's Natalie. Oh my I guess like my social media is easier. My name on Instagram is Natalie in Athens. Really easy because I was a big fan of Emily in Paris. I was like, when I knew that I'm moving to Athens, like it's Natalie in Athens.
Okay. Now I get the name. That's a good one.
Yeah, if you're ever been interested in having a photo shoot in Athens. If you ever wanted something more personal like a boudoir style for yourself or your couple, which I'm the area I'm trying, you know, to get very good at now.
Check me out. I'll be very happy, you know, if you follow, if you contact me. You can also find my website there and I'm definitely trying to, you know, create more photos.
But say you know like that. How do you say that, like make people say like wow.
At the end of the day, every artist wants to be, you know, do a wow effect. Yeah, I don't I cannot say like admire it and like look up to but you know like you want to leave your little imprint in this world and this is like what I'm trying to do.
Makes a lot of sense. Links on social media will be of course, as always, the description of the episode and in our social media also so as always, don't forget to subscribe and check Natalie.
Natalia profiles webs and everything. If you're coming to Athens and you want a nice photo shooting, just contact her. Now you have a photographer, you know, exactly. My style is something that, you know, makes you feeling something, then it is. Why not.
Sounds good. Thanks again. Thank you, Mark was really, really a pleasure.
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