Heavenomics - To Die Is Gain
This podcast digs deep into the history of true Christianity and the documents it has produced to help believers understand the true cost of discipleship and how to be rich in God.
Heavenomics - To Die Is Gain
Love: The Essence of True Christian Faith
What if the key to bridging political divides within the church lies in embracing the transformative love described by a 17th-century theologian? In this episode, we promise to unravel Johann Arndt's profound insights on Christianity and how his emphasis on inner transformation remains deeply relevant today. Against the backdrop of the Reformation's turbulence, we journey through Arndt's work "Sex Buecher von Waren, Christentum," connecting his radical ideas on true Christianity with powerful biblical passages like John 3:16 and Romans 5:5. You’ll gain fresh perspectives on personal spiritual renewal and the self-giving love exemplified by Jesus' sacrifice, and understand how these concepts can guide us in navigating political differences within the church.
Join us as we explore the metaphor of a "theological puzzle box" and the importance of taking the time to unravel complex theological and political concepts. While answers may not always be clear-cut, we explore the hope for reconciliation that lies in allowing ourselves to be transformed by love and grace. We'll reflect on how this transformation can bridge divides and foster a more compassionate, understanding world, even amid disagreements. Remember, on this shared journey toward truth and love, the path we walk together is as significant as the destination. Thank you for tuning in, and we look forward to continuing this thoughtful conversation next time.
Wow, okay. So this time you've really outdone yourself. We're tackling a 17th century theological text with Johann Arndt's Sex Buecher von Waren, christentum, alongside some really powerful Bible passages. And to top it off, we also have a modern take on how to deal with political differences within the church.
Speaker 2:It's quite the combo, isn't it?
Speaker 1:It's a lot it's like. Are we time traveling through the evolution of Christian thought, or what?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and the funny thing is, even with all those different pieces, they all kind of weave together into one big conversation, like we're trying to figure out what's at the core of Christian belief, how far back does it go and how does it apply to well, to life today? The world's a pretty messy place.
Speaker 1:You know, to be honest, when I first opened up Arndt's book I was a little intimidated. That thing is dense, it's not exactly light reading. But then I got to chapter titles like A True Christian Must Hate His Own Life.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah.
Speaker 1:And I was like hold on, tell me more. What do you even mean by that, yeah? And I was like hold on, tell me more what did he even mean by that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that'll preach.
Speaker 1:Especially considering he's writing just after the Reformation.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:Which was like religious upheaval central.
Speaker 2:It makes you wonder, right, Like why would he choose such strong language? But to really get what he was saying, we got to go back in time a little. Imagine Europe in the 1600s.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:The Protestant Reformation. It totally blew apart the old religious order.
Speaker 1:Right. Everyone's arguing about the right way to be. Christian Wars are breaking out. It's intense.
Speaker 2:Exactly so. Here comes Arndt, right in the thick of it. He's like hold up everyone. Let's get back to the heart of what it means to actually follow Jesus.
Speaker 1:So, in the middle of all this theological debate, he was trying to get back to like the essence of the Christian faith.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. He was convinced that true Christianity wasn't about which denomination you belong to or perfectly following a bunch of rules. It was about this deep interchange, this personal experience of God's love that would then affect like everything in your life.
Speaker 1:It's interesting because that feels so relevant even today. You know, it's like people are searching for authenticity, for a faith that feels real and personal, especially in a world that can feel so superficial.
Speaker 2:It's that longing for something deeper, isn't it? And you see that desire, that search for a genuine faith running through all of these sources you've gathered. But getting back to Arndt and this idea of inner transformation, he talks about this incredible love of God being like the driving force behind it all.
Speaker 1:Right, and there's that one line of his that really got me. The sweetness of God's love is more pleasing than the whole world.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's a good one.
Speaker 1:It's powerful, but I got to admit I'm not sure I totally get it. What does it even mean for God's love to be sweeter than anything else we could experience?
Speaker 2:That's getting at something deep. For sure he's saying that experiencing the fullness of God's love, it's not just some fleeting feeling you know, Right right. It's this total game changer, like it can literally shift how you see everything. Think of it like tasting something so unbelievably good, so delicious, that everything else just loses its flavor. It's like that. It's about realizing that God's love, it's more satisfying, more fulfilling than anything else you could ever chase after in this life.
Speaker 1:So it's not just about feeling warm and fuzzy inside.
Speaker 2:No, not at all.
Speaker 1:It's about this like unshakable joy.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:That comes from being connected to something so much bigger than yourself.
Speaker 2:Exactly. It's like this deep abiding joy and that idea of love being so powerful it's almost beyond our understanding.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:Well, that leads us to another big thing in Arndt's work, this idea, that love at its core. It has to be self-giving.
Speaker 1:And that takes us to the ultimate example of love in Christianity the sacrifice of Jesus.
Speaker 2:Exactly, arndt saw the crucifixion as like the most powerful expression of self-giving love there is. You see, god's love. It wasn't just this passive thing, it was active outward, and it reached its peak, its climax, in that ultimate sacrifice.
Speaker 1:And you pointed to John 3.16 to show that.
Speaker 2:For God so loved the world that he gave his only son.
Speaker 1:That verse always gets me the image of giving your only son, holding nothing back.
Speaker 2:Huge right it's incredibly powerful. It just shows you the depth, the magnitude of God's love. It's a love that, honestly, it doesn't make sense to our human minds Right. And it's that sacrifice, Art would say, that makes it possible for us to experience the new birth. He talks about that a lot.
Speaker 1:So how does that work? How does this new birth connect to what Jesus did on the cross? What did aren't mean by that?
Speaker 2:OK, so for him new birth, it meant a complete spiritual makeover, like a total renovation of your heart and mind, and he wasn't talking about just being a better person like through our own efforts.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:It was about surrendering to this overwhelming love that came looking for us, even though, honestly, we were a mess.
Speaker 1:So it's less about striving for perfection and more about accepting this transformative power of God's love.
Speaker 2:You got it and that transformation. According to Arendt, it all hinges on Jesus's sacrifice. Because of that sacrifice, our sins can be forgiven Right and we can be reconciled with God.
Speaker 1:So this new birth thing. It kind of reminds me of that verse you picked from Romans, something about God's love being poured into our hearts.
Speaker 2:You think of Romans 5.5,. It says and hope does not put us to shame, because God's love has been poured out into our hearts through the Holy Spirit who has been giving to us.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's the one.
Speaker 2:And it fits perfectly with what we're talking about because, you see, this verse directly links Arndt's idea of being born again to the work of the Holy Spirit in our lives.
Speaker 1:So the Holy Spirit's the one who makes that inner change possible.
Speaker 2:Exactly. It's God's love flowing into us through the Holy Spirit that allows us to experience this deep inner transformation that Arne's described.
Speaker 1:It's like this incredible exchange of love. You know, god's love for us leads to this outpouring of the Holy Spirit into our lives and then, because of that, we can experience and be part of that love in a way deeper way. It's beautiful, but kind of hard to wrap your head around, you know.
Speaker 2:It really is. It's a beautiful concept.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:But it does bring us to another really important part of Arndt's theology, and it might seem a little strange given how much he talks about love.
Speaker 1:What's that?
Speaker 2:His writings about sin and repentance.
Speaker 1:All right, because we've been focusing on this amazing transformative love.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And now we're moving into some heavier stuff. That's true, we are. It's interesting, though, because sometimes the whole idea of sin and repentance, it can feel kind of I don't know contradictory to this idea of a God who loves us unconditionally. It's like if he loves us that much, why all the emphasis on our flaws? Oh, I hear you.
Speaker 2:It's a question people have been wrestling with forever, right? If God is all loving, then how come there's so much suffering in the world?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Why do bad things happen to good people?
Speaker 1:It's a tough one, it really is.
Speaker 2:And for Art see, when he talked about sin, it wasn't about like pointing fingers or judging people. It was about being honest, about the reality of well being human.
Speaker 1:So it's less about being bad and more about admitting that we're all a little flawed, broken.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he believed that ever since the fall, humanity's been well kind of messed up Like. We're wired for selfishness, greed, putting our own needs ahead of God's and everyone else's, and that separation from God, turning away from his love, that's what he saw as the root of sin.
Speaker 1:And you highlighted that part in wisdom where it sounds like God is practically begging humanity to come back to him. It's like he's saying, hey, I'm right here, I love you. What are you running from?
Speaker 2:It's powerful, isn't it? It is it really drives home the point that God, he, doesn't want to punish us for our mistakes. What he wants is for us to come back to Him, to be in a real relationship with Him.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:Remember, Arndt was convinced that true happiness, true fulfillment, it all comes from aligning our hearts with God's love.
Speaker 1:So sin, then it's not so much about breaking a list of rules, it's more about what, like missing the point.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Living out of sync with, like, what we're actually created for.
Speaker 2:Exactly. It's about being out of whack, disconnected from the source of real love and life, and that's where repentance comes in. That was huge for Arndt.
Speaker 1:Because it's about turning back towards that love.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:But it's not just about saying sorry, is it?
Speaker 2:You're right, it goes way deeper than that. For Arndt, repentance wasn't just feeling bad about what you did, okay, it was about making a U-turn, like turning away from sin and running back to God.
Speaker 1:So it's like hitting the reset button on your whole life.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like a total system reboot.
Speaker 1:You realize you've gotten off track and you consciously choose to realign yourself with that ultimate source of love and guidance.
Speaker 2:And for Arndt, that realignment, that journey back to God, it wasn't about mustering up enough willpower to do it on your own.
Speaker 1:Right right.
Speaker 2:Remember Romans 5.5, the one about God's love being poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit.
Speaker 1:Right, so the Holy Spirit helps us get back to that place of wholeness.
Speaker 2:Exactly. Aren't believed that the Holy Spirit living inside of us could give us the strength to say no to sin?
Speaker 1:and yes to God. It's like having this internal compass always pointing you in the right direction, even when you're totally lost.
Speaker 2:I love that. It's like having that constant guidance, that grace gently nudging us back to where we're supposed to be back to. That love that Arndt said is more satisfying than anything else in the world.
Speaker 1:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:And it's that love, that transformative grace, that Arndt believed could help us deal with even the toughest, most divisive issues we face today as individuals and as a society.
Speaker 1:Which brings us to that final source you had us look at. Oh, you mean the article about how to handle political differences within the church.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a hot topic these days.
Speaker 1:Tell me about it. It feels like we're more divided than ever, even in our churches, it's true. It's like you can't even bring up politics without it turning into a huge fight.
Speaker 2:Without it turning into a huge fight. So how our political views? They're not just opinions.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:They're tied up with our identities, our values, everything.
Speaker 1:And that's what makes it so hard. It's not just disagreeing about policies, it's personal. Exactly. It's like the other person is attacking your whole worldview, your understanding of right and wrong.
Speaker 2:A hundred percent, and that's where the article brings in this really helpful idea.
Speaker 1:Okay, what's that?
Speaker 2:It's about seeing the difference between they call them whole church issues.
Speaker 1:Whole church issues.
Speaker 2:And Christian freedom issues.
Speaker 1:Okay, I'm intrigued. Break that down for me. What are whole church issues?
Speaker 2:So those are the non-negotiables, right yeah, the core beliefs and doctrines that every Christian agrees on.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:They're like the foundation of the whole faith.
Speaker 1:So like believing that Jesus is God, the authority of the Bible, exactly, salvation through grace.
Speaker 2:You got it. Those are the essentials, the bedrock principles, and the article argues that if the church is going to function like it's supposed to, everyone needs to be on the same page about these things.
Speaker 1:Which makes sense. If you can't even agree on the basics, it's pretty hard to have a real conversation, let alone a genuine relationship.
Speaker 2:Exactly. But then you have the Christian freedom issues. These are areas where it's okay for Christians to disagree.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:Without it turning into a whole thing Right, without compromising their unity in Christ.
Speaker 1:So these are more like matters of interpretation, conscience, how to apply biblical principles to specific political or social situations.
Speaker 2:You got it. It's like what does it actually look like to live out your faith in the real world? And there are lots of different opinions on that.
Speaker 1:So like different views on the government, social justice, economic policy.
Speaker 2:Exactly, and the article stresses that there's no one right Christian view on those things. It's about recognizing that you can have sincere, committed Christians who come to different conclusions based on how they understand the Bible, their own life experiences, their conscience.
Speaker 1:I think that's so important, that distinction, because it changes the whole conversation. It's not about judging the other person.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:It's about trying to understand where they're coming from.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:Instead of assuming someone's less of a Christian because they vote differently than me, I can ask questions. I can actually listen to their perspective.
Speaker 2:That is key, that willingness to listen, to really try to understand instead of just writing someone off.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:That's how we start to bridge the divide. It's about remembering that, even when we disagree, we're still part of the same family.
Speaker 1:United by our faith in Christ.
Speaker 2:Exactly.
Speaker 1:You know, this reminds me of something Arndt talked about.
Speaker 2:Really.
Speaker 1:He really emphasized the importance of love.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he did.
Speaker 1:Looking at the world through a lens of grace.
Speaker 2:Right Seeing the inherent worth and dignity of every single person.
Speaker 1:It's like his writings give us a framework for how to approach these really tough conversations with humility, with compassion, being willing to see past our differences to that shared humanity that connects us all.
Speaker 2:It's amazing how these ideas from the 17th century are still so relevant today.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. It's like you said at the beginning. It's this theological puzzle box.
Speaker 2:It is.
Speaker 1:But it's one worth taking the time to unpack.
Speaker 2:For sure.
Speaker 1:And you know, even if we don't have all the answers, even if those political disagreements are still messy and complicated, maybe even for reconciliation Absolutely, and maybe, just maybe, if we allow ourselves to be transformed by that same love and grace that aren't talked about. We can start to bridge those divides and build a more compassionate and understanding world.
Speaker 2:A world where, even in the midst of disagreements, we remember that we're all on this journey together.
Speaker 1:Seeking that same light of truth and love. And, on that note, thanks for diving deep with us today. Everybody, we'll see you next time.