S4E170 11 Reasons Why Empty Nesting Hasn't Been As Traumatic As We Thought It Would Be

In this final episode Bonnie joins me on one last episode in our series on Empty Nest Homesteading .  We expected this transition to be far more traumatic than it has been.  While we understand that everyone's journey is different, on this episode we share 11 Reasons why we think we've been able to make this transition so smoothly .

Enjoy!!
Brian

Transcript

Brian: 0:02

I'm your host, Brian Wells, and I'm a fourth generation homesteader. Since 2008, my family and I have been homesteading here in beautiful upstate New York in 2019, I launched the homestead journey podcast to help people just like you get started and find success. On their journey towards self sufficiency, self reliance and sustainability. This is the Homestead Journey, and this is season four. Well, hello everyone. And welcome to another episode of the Homestead Journey podcast. My name is Brian Wells. I am coming to you from 3D Farming Homestead here in beautiful upstate New York. This is season four, and this is episode number 170. On today's episode, we're going to be wrapping up our series on empty nest homesteading that we started a long time ago, way back in the spring. I think it was that we started that series and now here it is. Bonnie and I are pros at this empty nest thing. We are eight weeks into it. It's hard to believe, but it was eight weeks ago tomorrow that we dropped our baby boy off to, college. It's hard to believe that it's been that long, but on this episode, we're going to share with you 11 reasons why we believe this transition was less traumatic than we thought it would be. And folks, this is certainly not the episode that I thought we were going to be doing. When I had planned this out in my head, I really thought that we were going to be spending some time talking about how sad and how bad and how lonely, we have been and while we certainly have missed him at times, and it's not always been easy, this certainly has been a much smoother transition than Bonnie and I ever believed Would take place. And so we wanted to share with you 11 reasons why we believe it's been that way, hopefully to help those of you who are going to become empty nesters and the not too. Distant future to help you have a smooth transition as well. But before we head into that, I did want to give you a little bit of a podcast update. So, thank you very much for your patience in there, not having been an episode. The last two weeks. Now, two weeks ago, Bonnie and I were over at Gordon for parents weekend. And so that's why there was no episode that weekend. And then last weekend I went to record it and I just had one of the absolute worst migraine headaches. That I think I've ever had. I would close my eyes and it would almost look like there were fireworks, uh, with my eyes closed. So, uh, certainly I was not in the space to be able to put together any kind of, uh, cohesive thoughts, even though probably sometimes it appears that I'm struggling with that even on the best of days. But, uh, that certainly was the case last weekend. And so thank you very much for your patience in that regard. But the other thing I want to let you know is to prepare you for the end of season four. So we're going to be releasing this episode this week to wrap up our series on empty nest homesteading. And then next week we are going to release one final episode here in season four to really wrap up the season of change that has been 2023 here on three B farm and homestead. And then on next week's episode, I'm also going to lay out for you my vision for season five. So I am planning on coming back for another season next year. It's going to look a little different than what we've done. Up to this point. And so I hope that you will enjoy the content that I am planning on providing starting next year, but more about that to come on next week's episode. So with all of that said, let's jump on over to this week's homestead happenings, and I'll bring you up to speed with what we've been doing here on 3B farm. So in the last couple of weeks here on the homestead, much of what we've been focused on has been garden, garden, garden. Now we are getting quickly to the end of the gardening season here in beautiful upstate New York. In fact, our first average frost date here is October 14th, and it does look like the first frost may hold off for a little bit that we still have some semi warm temperatures here in the horizon, but certainly we are much closer to the end than we are to the beginning of the gardening season. And so I have been Hmm. Putting up some of the bounty from the garden, the main focus the last several weeks has been on the pepper harvest and the pepper harvest. Well, not great. It certainly was much better than what I actually thought it was going to be. In fact, my jalapeno peppers did much better than I thought they would. And my green peppers did. A little bit better than I thought they would, although certainly my yields were down a little bit, but the last couple of weeks I have been focused on doing some fermented hot peppers, and so I have some lacto fermented peppers in the jars right now doing some habaneros doing some jalapenos and doing some Thai chili peppers. And so I've got those hot sauces fermenting right now and looking forward to seeing how all of that turns out. But then last weekend, I spent quite a bit of time just canning up peppers. I made some more of my pepper relish, which came out very, very good. little zing to it because I threw a few habaneros in there, not too many, but just enough to give it a nice heat. But there's a sweetness to it with this recipe that I really, really like. And so I was very happy with how that turned out. I also did another batch of cowboy candy. And then I did up several batches of pickled peppers. And so very excited about that. We also have been enjoying just eating right out of the garden. So that purple cauliflower that I've been telling you about, we really have been enjoying that so much this past week. We made some cauliflower and chicken soup. We've been enjoying roasted cauliflower. We've been enjoying steamed cauliflower, just. So many different ways that we have been enjoying that. Not only is it very, very pretty when it grows, it's actually kind of a very pretty, interesting, different color vegetable than what you're used to having on the table when you cook it up, it kind of cooks up in this bluish purple type thing. And it's just very, very interesting, very pretty. And so we've been enjoying that quite a bit. Also, I have had a few more cherry tomatoes come on and I absolutely love this cherry tomato pasta dish. It is very, very simple. It's really just cherry tomatoes, garlic in olive oil. You cook it down and you put it over pasta and it is. Just so good, very, very simple, so easy to make, but it's so tasty. And so I have been making that. I think I've made that three times in the last, uh, three or four weeks and just simple, but delicious. And one of the things that I really, really love about it, and it didn't really sink into me until I think it was about the second time that I made it and I was eating some leftovers is how much it. Reminds me of a dish, uh, a spaghetti based dish that we used to get when we lived in Brazil. It just really reminds me of that. And so I mean, you know to kind of give you that throwback uh to Fond memories of growing up in Brazil. I certainly have been Enjoying that as well. So that's what we've been up to here on 3b farm and homestead over the last several weeks Keep an eye on the weather. I know that frost that first frost is right around the corner And so when we see that for sure I'll be doing my annual run out there at night with a headlamp and pick everything that you can pick and get it indoors Because well, that's just how I roll. All right, that's it for this week's Homestead Happenings. Let's jump on over to this week's Charting the Course. podcast studio. None other than my lovely bride, Bonnie. Welcome back to the show. Thank you. It certainly has been a bit of a hot minute since you've been on here, but that was by design. We wanted to get into this empty nest thing a little bit. And now that you and I are pros. At this professional, professional, yes, absolutely. Eight weeks in almost. It's a long time. It's a long time. So we did want to share with everyone, though, kind of what we've discovered in the, in this first eight weeks. And when I had originally envisioned this episode, what I had in my mind is much different than what we are going to talk about. Today, this transition for us, and I want to emphasize for us has been much less traumatic than what I think either one of us thought it would be, right? It has certainly not been without its moments when you and I have both missed Brian J. That's certainly it's natural

Bonnie: 10:45

to

Brian: 10:45

miss him. It is, but it has not been. As traumatic, no, it's not been as emotional, it's not been any of the things I don't think that you and I thought it would be. No, no. Now, again, I do want to emphasize on this, that this has been our experience and everyone's transition into empty nesting is probably going to be a little bit different. There are a lot of things that play into this. Whether or not it's your first child or your, your fifth child, um, you know, everyone's family situation. Everyone's family dynamic is different. You as a parent may not be happy with the College that your son or daughter has chosen to attend, and that would play into it. So there's a lot of things that go into this, but having said that you and I have reflected on this quite a bit, and we have, I think, come up with 11 reasons why we believe that this transition into empty nesting has been much less traumatic than what you and I both thought. Would it would be. And so today our goal is to share that with everyone. Hopefully you'll be able to glean something from this. If you are a parent that is getting ready to head into the empty nesting thing, then hopefully you'll be able to learn from what we feel like we did right. And it will help you transition into the whole empty nest thing in a much less traumatic way than what. Other people have experienced, and the other thing that we would also challenge anyone that's listening to, if you know someone who has young Children, send this episode to them and ask them to take a listen, because while we are going to talk about some things that we did in the past year that we believe has helped us make this transition much less traumatically than we thought, but it would be, there are also a number of things that you and I have done over the years decisions that we made it. Literally decades, almost two decades ago. I mean, it's hard to believe he's going to be 19 next week. Um, but, but there are decisions that you and I have made over the last almost 20 years that have also played into this. And so if. If you do know someone who has young children, I would encourage you that you share this with them so that hopefully they can glean a little bit from us as well as far as some of the decisions that we feel like we made in a very positive way that have led to them. Thank you. A, a, an easier transition than either one of us ever anticipated. So let's jump right into it we're going to start by looking at some of the things that we did in really the last year, decisions that we made, things that we've done in the last year that have really, I believe, helped us in this transition. So the first thing that came to my mind is that we were very intentional. About this process, you and I recognized from probably about the time that we visited Gordon for the first time, Oh my goodness, this emptiness thing is coming our way very, very quickly. And so we were very, very intentional in this process as we have gone through it, we identified it as a major transition and we have really put a lot of thought effort. And I even think that talking about it on this podcast and coming up with some of those episodes really has helped us as well as we've really processed. I think both of us, um, some of the things that we thought would come as a result of this empty nest thing.

Bonnie: 14:59

And just, putting it into words like he's going to be going to college and we're going to be here on the homestead, by ourselves managing the homestead, not having him living with us on a full time basis anymore. so just, identifying it, talking about it, that we're going to be, empty nesters and, there's going to be one less person in the homestead to lend a hand. That has helped us along the way.

Brian: 15:25

Yeah, definitely. I really agree with that. I think along with that, as we have really tried to prepare for this event, we really tried to avail ourselves of as much information. As, as we could, um, the college that Brian J went to Gordon had a number of webinars over the summer and we attended just about every one in the ones that we weren't able to attend in person, we went back and we listened and we took notes and those webinars were, I think, helpful in helping us prepare him, which I think took some of the The scariness of the whole transition out of the, dynamic for us, which made it a less of a traumatic type thing, but they also, I think we're very good at helping to prepare the parents.

Bonnie: 16:20

Yeah, helping, saying, you know, don't baby them, in the process, start if you haven't already started to teach them to do things for themselves and not holding their hand and, not emailing the professors, not contacting the college, all those things, let them them. Yeah. Do it for themselves.

Brian: 16:39

Um, yeah, definitely. There were a lot of things, a lot of pointers that were given that we really have tried to apply. And I, and I think it has been very, very beneficial for both him and for us in this transition. There's a website that Gordon introduced us to called Grown and Flown. That is something that's been very helpful to you as well.

Bonnie: 17:04

Yes, it's helped me in the transitions like prepare for the next step. So the step was there and telling me about, um, each step at, before I got to it. So it was preparing me for what was going to happen next and different, um, parents saying their experiences and it was really helpful.

Brian: 17:26

The other thing as well is Gordon had a lot of in person, sessions. Except in students day and just a variety of different times when we were over there. and even a couple of weeks ago when we were at the, Parents weekend. There was a session on, again, helping your child in this transition. And I think us attending all of those and leaning into those as well and really trying to equip ourselves as best we could has all really, really aided in making this a success. Thank you. A much smoother transition than either one of us thought, because we really have taken the tools that were given to us and we've really tried to put them into practice. So not only were we intentional about it, and not only did we really try to equip ourselves as best we could, but we ran across a concept in the midst of all of that, that was actually shared by the president of Gordon. Um, his wife shared a book called. With open hands, I, I can never get there because there's a, there's a book called open hands. We actually bought the wrong book, which we bought and it actually, it actually was good. It was very good. It was

Bonnie: 18:44

along the same

Brian: 18:45

concept, very much along the same idea, but the book that she was referencing. was with open hands. Now we are people of faith and and so this is going to come from a perspective of faith. But I think the concept of having open hands with regards to our Children really applies whether or not you're someone who adheres to Christianity or you're someone who does not. In this book that she referenced, it really is a posture of prayer that we are opening up our hands. And that we're releasing the things that we've clenched and held on to tightly, and we're giving those over to God. We're just releasing those things into God's care, understanding that these are things that are of His responsibility. And so, in that vein, the idea is that up to this point, we've taken very seriously the, the nurture. Uh, of our child and trying to raise him up to be a young man with morals and faith and, and, uh, character and respect and yes, all of those things. But now our job in that regard is done. And so, and not that, not that your job as a parent has ever done. My mom and dad invested me to this day and I'm almost 50 years old. My mom and dad still invested me. Um, but that, that area of responsibility as being the primary caregiver, that's over. And now we're opening our hands and we're releasing this child into God's care, into God's protection and saying, okay, he's yours, God. And not that he ever wasn't. But it's just that idea of that, that releasing of him. Now, if you're not somebody who is a person of faith, I still think that concept still is very, very valid that as parents, we we've got to let our kids go as much as we want to hold on to them. And as much as we want to keep them, we've got to allow them the opportunity to grow and to flourish and to be gone. And, and to become the individuals that they're meant to be. And, and so that releasing that opening of the hands, that thought of, okay, we've got to let them go. We've got to let the little birdie fly. Yep.

Bonnie: 21:21

Open their wings and fly and practice or put into practice all the, all the things that we have taught them.

Brian: 21:30

Yeah, definitely. Yeah, definitely. And, and that is that, that really probably was the singular most helpful. Concept. And I know it's a very, very simple one, but sometimes it's the simple things that can found the wise, making me feel like I'm the wise one. Uh, and I'm not, uh, as you well know, but, uh, that's neither here nor there. This, this concept that was so very, very helpful to me that, you know, we, we have to let them go. And, and we, as you said, we've tried to invest in him, all of that, the character, but now it's up for him. It's up to him to own that and to put that into practice. And, and we understand that we know full well that he's going to make decisions, that he's going to do things that we wouldn't necessarily agree with. Right.

Bonnie: 22:22

He's not a

Brian: 22:23

perfect kid. No, he's going to make mistakes. And sometimes the things that he's going to do that we wouldn't necessarily agree with are things that are going to work out great for him. But that's part of him becoming the person that he was meant to be. And so that idea of, of opening up our hands and not clenching onto that, I think has really been very, very freeing. In this transition and helped make this transition into being empty nesters much less dramatic.

Bonnie: 22:53

That was one of the first things I had trouble with I had said to myself right after we had. dropped him off or left him at college. like, he's my child and I'm supposed to be taking care of him. But then I said, no, I need to let him use his wings and fly. I can't be there for every. little thing anymore. I'm not going to take him home with me. We're just going to have to, deal with this.

Brian: 23:23

Definitely. And, you know, to be honest, we have been in the process of opening up our hands for a while. We just didn't realize it. And I, and I don't think we had thought of it in those terms. And we're going to talk about that here in a little bit, as we talk through some of the decisions that we've made a while ago. So I think that that process was already starting to happen, but when we became more aware of it, more mindful of of that process, it was just so Freeing to me, and I really have been very appreciative of that. Not only were we intentional about the process, not only did we try to prepare, uh, as best we could, and not only have we tried to have open hands, but another key decision that we made in a very intentional decision that we made was. To establish boundaries as a family, to sit down and really have a conversation with regards to what we were going to do and what we were not going to do. And I think that's been beneficial for him and for us.

Bonnie: 24:38

Yes. Yes. I'm one of the. First things we had said to him is, we're not going to be calling you when you start classes to wake you up. You have to figure out how to set the alarm, get yourself across campus and to class on time. Because he's been known for getting, squeaking in like three minutes

Brian: 24:59

late. Yeah, definitely. His track record last year getting to school. It wasn't that he never skipped school. He didn't, you know, it wasn't like he was showing up to school a half hour late, but he really struggled to show up to school on time. Now we've since found out some of the reasons why. And while I don't necessarily agree with him showing up late, I do understand why he showed up late and, uh, and it is what it is. But yeah, we definitely said to him, um, You've got to figure out how to get to class. We're not going to be doing that. You're going to have to figure out how to feed yourself. We're not going to be making sure that you went to lunch, that you went to dinner, we're not going to be making sure, you know, that you've washed your clothes and that you have combed your hair and taken a shower. Like you've got to figure out how to manage all of those things without mom and dad looking over your shoulder. And one of the things that he said to us. When we were over there two weeks ago for, um, parent day is he said, mom and dad, thank you so much for giving me my space and for giving me the independence to figure this stuff out on his own because he has classmates that have not had that opportunity, that their parents have really been doing the whole helicopter thing and, and he's seen, uh, first and kind of how that's affected some of his classmates. Yeah. Not only that, but we also established some boundaries with regards to communication. So we're not calling him every day. Right. You know, we text him every once in a while, Hey, how's it going? Check in here, check in there. But we're not, you know, we don't have life 360 on his phone. No, never did. Never did. But we don't now. We don't track his every movement. You know, we don't, we don't worry about that. We have a semi. Establish time for a phone call once

Bonnie: 26:57

a week. Yeah, I mean, that was one of the things we had. That was the boundaries expectations. And because I'm not going to be texting you every day, calling you every day, I do at least want to hear from you like once a week, that's, that's the least of my expectations. Um, that's, you could give me that much or Fill me in

Brian: 27:22

exactly. And it, and it's not that during that call, it's the grand inquisition, you know, we, Hey, how's it going? How are things going? You know, yada, yada, yada, yada, but it's not like we grill him. What grade did you get on your test and, you know, how did you do on your quiz and, and all those kinds of things. I mean, we'll ask him generically, but it's not like, yeah, yeah, no, we're not doing that. It's, it's, you know, we're interested in your life and, we've made it very clear to him. If he has problems, he can always reach out to us. He can always let us know that we're, we're here for him. Um, but we've also tried to encourage him to advocate for himself. That was one of the things that they were very, very, um, pointed on during the whole process is that your child needs to learn how to advocate for themselves. If they have an issue with a professor as a parent, you don't contact the professor, if they don't know how to. You know, reach out to the professor, help them draft an email, certainly, but you don't email the professor as a parent, um, you know, understanding what resources are available for them if, if he's, you know, struggling with depression, there's counseling available, there's the, the chaplains that are available, there, there are RAs. So one of the things that they had, they were very, very, uh, pointed in is, is making sure. That you don't jump in and try to fix everything for your, your student, but that you allow them the opportunity to, to do those things and to develop those skills. And so I think really establishing those boundaries as we sat down as a family and we said, we're not contacting your professor, there have been a few times when there's been some issues. And he's, he's talked to us about it and we said, okay, so what have you done to fix it? Um, and he had reached out to the professors and he's reached out to this one or that one when, when he's needed to. And, and it's awesome to see that as a parent. And I think that also plays into this being less of a traumatic transition because you can see your child really starting to, to grow and to flourish. as an individual.

Bonnie: 29:50

It's almost like a chain of command, if you would want to refer to it as that. if your child should have issues, this is where, they should go. This is how they go about, um, approaching their personal issues. But if you as a parent feel like they are having issues and they're not resolving them, and you as a parent feel like you need to step in, don't... Do it for them. This is the person that you contact. They have a, a liaison for the parents. And you try to work it out with them, like unbeknownst to your child. and then after that, they have wellness checks and they were very intentional. Don't do it for your child or whatever. You need to contact somebody, this is who you contact. Oh, and then also for, you know, the students. This is what you tell your student to do. Um, It's to enable them to do things on their own,

Brian: 30:43

right? So for if there's academic issues, this is where they should go. If there are, you know, um, personal issues, you know, personal conflicts, this is where they should go. If they're having a mental health crisis, this is where they should go. Uh, and, and so making parents aware of the resources, but the idea is that you, instead of doing it for your, your son or your daughter, you. Encourage them to do it for themselves. Now, certainly if there is some kind of a safety concern, that's, that's something totally, totally different. It's not that they're saying, Oh, you know, your, your, your child's suicidal. We'll tell them to go figure it out. No, no, no, no, no. That's not it at all. But In the vast majority of situations, that's not what we're talking about, right? We're talking about things that the kids can resolve themselves. And so you, you establish those boundaries and you've really encouraged them almost insist. And dare I say, force them. Yeah, to do it themselves. And I, I certainly think that that has been very, very beneficial for us. So not only were we intentional in the process, not only did we try to prepare as best we could, not only have we tried to have open hands and establish boundaries, but one of the other things that we've done. Is we've kept busy and I don't think we've kept too busy and I don't think that we have just gone hog wild overboard with just okay. We've got all this free time. We've got to fill up every minute of it. I don't think that's been the case at all, but the weekend that we dropped him off was the weekend just before the fair. And initially I was very, very upset about that, but having the fair that next week. We were so busy with the fair, we didn't have time to really miss him. I mean, it really was that.

Bonnie: 32:39

You couldn't help but miss him because since he's been four, he's been going to the fair with us. But yeah, it kept, it kept us busy first, you know, first going into the chicken bar. And I'm like, yeah, I was approaching and I'm like, I don't know if I can do this. I don't know if I want us. Hang out here all week long without him, but you know as I did it I did my initial walk through whatever it you know I was okay Yes, that initial am I going to want to be here without him.

Brian: 33:09

Yeah, I think I think that's fair, But I also think that, you know, just the busyness of the fair and so many of the things that we were involved in, I think also really helped contributed to that. And then the weekend after that was Labor Day weekend. And we did some things together. You and I, the weekend after that was homesteaders of New England. The weekend after that, I was at a men's retreat. And so there were really a lot of things through that. That really just kept us busy. And I think kept our focus off of, Oh my goodness, the bedroom at the end of the hall is empty. You know, uh, community choir started back up both in you and I sing in the community choir for, for Christmas program. Uh, your Bible study started back up. So there were a lot of things like that, that I think have helped contribute to us. Um, having a much smoother transition, not that we were trying to fill the void and avoid our feelings, right? That wasn't it at all to your point at the fair. We walk into the chicken barn for the first time. He's not there It's like oh my goodness. I feel that You know, we went to the 4 h building and you know, he none of his stuff was in there, you know Oh, you feel that we went to the pig barn. None of our pigs were there. You feel that and so You know, I think it's it's very important to Own your feelings and to feel the feelings And it's not that I'm suggesting that we've filled up all of our time so that we didn't have to deal with that, right? But instead of us sitting around in navel gazing, you know, just being in the molly grubs,

Bonnie: 34:48

right? All, you know, all the time in the molly grubs, forget the navel gazing.

Brian: 34:53

No, but it really wasn't. And so I think that's been, been very, very beneficial because if we were just to sit at home and mope. Right. And, and, and just focus on, you know, all of the empty room, the, the, the lack of a plate at the table and so on and so forth. It, it would have been, I think, a much different transition than it has been. And so I definitely think that that's something that, um, is beneficial as well. But I would also say don't get too

Bonnie: 35:24

busy. Right. Or even, you know, I mean, Try new things because you don't, you're not taking your, maybe your child to a sporting event. Your whole schedule doesn't revolve around your child as much. You might have things you go to at college, but you know, even, you know, try new

Brian: 35:43

things. Yeah, definitely. That's one of the things that has been, uh, I, I certainly have found this whole process very, very freeing. Just not. You know, quite frankly, it's one less schedule that we have to work around and for the last 18 years, our schedules pretty much ever revolved around him and his activities in an intentional way. And we'll talk about that here in a moment. But now, all of a sudden, we don't have that schedule. I mean, we do, you know, there's, there's a little bit of that, but it's certainly not to the extent as to what it was. So those are the things that we did within the last year that I believe helped us in this transition and help this transition to be a lot less traumatic than we thought it was. But there are some good decisions that I believe that we've made in the last. 18, almost 20 years that I think have also contributed to this. And I really strongly believe that we are reaping what we've sown in the last almost 20 years. The first thing that comes to mind. Is that from a very, very young age with our son, we established boundaries, we established expectations, um, and we tried to instill in him character, morals, respect, uh, and so on and so forth. And as a result of that, I really, really believe that that's helped us in this transition because. Those things have taken

Bonnie: 37:14

right. And he has shown us that he can handle the independence and that he is respectful. Um, and we don't have to worry about, at least I don't. I mean, God forbid, I hope he's not bamboozling me. I don't think he is. Um, or he would have started that a long time ago. Um, But I don't lay awake at night wondering, you know, like, what time did he go to bed? Is he out doing something dumb?

Brian: 37:46

And, and, and to be frank, he may be out doing dumb stuff, and my, my guess is he probably has done some dumb, dumb stuff. Just don't text me and tell me you did. Well, exactly. Um, but, but that's not even necessarily the point. Uh, you know, whether or not he's out late or he's, you know, he's, he's young, he's, I mean, this past summer, there were some nights when he didn't get home until ridiculous hours and we're like, come on, bud, this is just nonsense. but I, I do think the, the level of respect that he has, the character, the morals, uh, the faith that he has, um, all now to your point earlier. He has to take that stuff as his own, and he has to live that out. we can only provide that to him so much, and then it's a matter of, okay, you've got to take this and carry it on. So I really strongly believe that a big part of the reason why we've had a, a smoother transition here goes back to some of the boundaries, the expectations that we established when he was young and the character and the morals, um, that we instilled in him along the way

Bonnie: 38:57

and the way we were intentional about, um, uh, manhood. Um, having other people in his life, give him the opportunities to spend time with his grandparents and being with other people in the community that we respected and he could look up to. Being in Boy Scouts, um, definitely going to church, um, going to Young Life, letting them speak into his life. Because there comes a point where they don't hear you. And then somebody else that speaks into their life, whether it be a relative, their pastor, Youth pastor, they say it and it's like a whole new thing. Like you never even said it

Brian: 39:43

100 percent and that that great segue to kind of the next point here is that we tried to put him in positions where other people could speak into his life and that really has paid huge dividends. We have been very, very blessed with people throughout his life who were willing to invest in him. Who were willing to take an interest in him, but we were also very intentional about putting him in positions where those people had the opportunity to speak into his life we understood to your point, there are times when they just do not hear from mom and dad. And the fact that he's at Gordon right now is a great example of that. I had, when he first started the college search, I had suggested him, Hey, there's this college over north of, of, uh, Boston called Gordon. Uh, why don't you check it out? Now, Gordon is a sister college to Gordon, the, uh, Gordon Conwell theological seminary, which is actually the seminary from which our former pastor Steve graduated. And so. I had suggested Brian take a look at it, and it was just kind of like, yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever, and it was kind of like in one ear, out the other. At that point, he was focused on Robert's Westland over in Rochester. He sat down with our pastor. And he comes home and he was all excited. He said, dad, dad, I was talking to pastor Brian and pastor Brian told me about this college north of Boston that, uh, pastor Steve graduated from the theological seminary there. I think check it out. It's called Gordon. I was like, Oh, it is really. Well, I think, you know what? I think that's maybe you should check that out. He had never heard me say it. But because we had put him in positions where there were people that could have influence and impact on his life in a very positive way, I really believe that's why he's at Gordon today and

Bonnie: 41:46

we, and we had to make some really tough decisions early on, um, when he was getting into his teenage years. Are we going to, um, you know, stay in a church where there are no other young people, no youth group, or are we going to switch to a church where there is young life? Um, and that was by no means an easy decision, but where we ended up, it was the best thing we could do for him and for our

Brian: 42:20

family. Yeah, definitely. And for those of you who aren't familiar, Young Life is a, uh, a national, might be even an international youth program, a youth group program, church based youth, youth group program. And there's a Young Life group that meets at our church. But that, that's a great, that really is a great, a great point is that we made some very, very difficult, emotionally taxing, um, decisions, uh, in order to be able to ensure that Brian J was in a place. Where he would have, um, friends, his age, uh, positive influences in his life and, uh, and that certainly I believe has paid off so not only did we establish boundaries a long time ago, and not only did we try to put him in two positions, uh, where other people would have impact in his life, but we also. Um, tried very, very hard not to helicopter parent him, um, from really, as, as he started growing up, we really did try to start opening up our hands. Um, and as, as he got older, we gave him more areas of responsibility and greater independence and. With that certainly came and a sense of responsibility and he didn't always make the right decisions You know, he didn't always do the right thing But we allowed him to face the repercussions and the consequences and the consequences of his actions And I believe that that is something else that really has helped This be a smoother transition because we did not do that helicopter parenting thing.

Bonnie: 44:09

No, as I mean Did I want to yes, was it natural to helicopter? Yes But what I did what was best for him and to help him gain a sense of independence and Sense of consequences for his actions,

Brian: 44:31

right? And, and, and obviously those consequences go both positive and negative. You know, there are times when you do the right thing and you, and there are positive outcomes and there are times when you show up late consistently for school and you end up with lunch detentions on a weekly basis. I mean, you know, and he never seemed to learn, learn his lesson there. But we, we really did try to make sure that we, you know, we allowed him to fail, fail safely. But to fail and to learn from those mistakes so that as he, you know, goes into college, there's going to be times when there's going to be failure, you know, he's probably going to flunk some tests. He may even fail some classes. Who knows? But hopefully, the fact that we've given him a sense of, Um, what, what it means to go through those things and how to move on and to carry on and to bounce back and to have resilience in your life, I think certainly has aided in this smoother transition, um, for both him and for us.

Bonnie: 45:35

And I think, you know, the independence with, if you can accept the responsibility of the independence, we give you more independence, um, even, you know, when he first got his car. Um, if you can res, uh, accept the responsibility of having a car and you're not going to drive fast, you're not going to stay out all hours of the night when you're supposed to be getting up for school in the morning, um. You get, you know, you build the trust and you get more independence.

Brian: 46:08

Yeah, definitely. And with great power comes great responsibility. And, and, and hopefully that has paid off. It, I, it certainly seems. And certainly six weeks or eight weeks, whatever, eight weeks, I guess we're eight weeks into this, um, it's a small sample size, but already when we were over there two weeks ago for parent weekend, he articulated to us how much he appreciated the independence that we had given him and how much he felt like it had prepared him for this transition. There

Bonnie: 46:45

was thank you for, you know, getting me into young life. And. You know, I had the opportunity to be do training for young life. I was going to do that, but it just didn't fit in my schedule right now. So, you know, it was, it was good to hear that. You know, your adult child feels like, you know, you did something, right?

Brian: 47:06

Yeah, definitely. So not only did we establish boundaries, not only did we try to put him in positions where other people could speak into his life, not only did we try not to helicopter parent him, and not only did we increasingly give him independence, but we really... Spent time with him and what I mean by that is we don't sit here now with regrets looking back and saying, I wish I would have spent less time at the office and more time with him. I wish I would have instead of going on that guy's weekend, I would have gone to his ballgame. We really did our dead level best to spend time as much as we could with him and. I want to be careful here, because I understand, number one, We only had one child. When you have a lot, when you have many kids, there are times when you have to make tough decisions. And you have to divide and conquer. And there are times when there can be hard feelings as a result. And I experienced that myself growing up. Um, where, you know, my mom and dad couldn't come to, when I was running cross country, they couldn't come to many of my cross country meets. When my brother Keith was playing basketball, they went to every basketball game. For a long time, I harbored some, I don't know if you'd say bitterness, animosity, because I didn't understand the situation. Now, I understand why mom and dad couldn't come to all of my cross country meets, and why they had the time available to go to my brother's basketball games. But in that moment, I didn't understand that. So I say all of that to simply say the fact that we were able to be available was in part because we only had one child and so we weren't being pulled in multiple directions. But I would also say that the reason why we were able to be available and present was because we were very intentional about being available and present and we made sacrifices in order to be available and present. You. Quit teaching so that you could be a stay at home mom so that you would be available and present in this

Bonnie: 49:21

life. And not that everyone is going to do that or want to do that. You know, if you don't want to do it that way, you know, that's fine, but that's a choice that I made that we made and made sacrifices for it so I could be with my son. And I think it goes back to. It was, my mom did the same thing with me, um, and I didn't, I felt like I never had to come home to an empty house, and I didn't want that for my son.

Brian: 49:56

Yeah. So that was something that was very, very important to both Bonnie and I was the same way. My mom, um, for the most part, uh, was a stay at home mom the entire time I grew up. Um, but along with that comes certain sacrifices that you make. You know, financially you make sacrifices, you know, we didn't go on a spring break vacation and a summer vacation and this vacation and that vacation because we couldn't afford to do it. And I'm not saying that to cry the blues. It's just the reality of it that we made certain sacrifices along the way to ensure that we were able to be. Together as a family that we could spend time with him and invest in his life. And I really honestly believe that that's also paid dividends in this transition because we're not sitting here saying, Oh my goodness, life passed us by. I missed out on so much because I was too busy working. I was too busy this. I was too busy that I was too busy. The other

Bonnie: 50:57

thing.

Brian: 50:57

And we together made a lot of decisions like that. And these are choices that we made, decisions that we made, sacrifices, some might say. Now, I don't look at it as a sacrifice because I, I sleep well at night knowing that I made memories with my boy, that we made memories together as a family. And no amount of money would ever, ever be able to give that time back or to replace those memories. Um, and so I am at, at peace with the decisions that I've made. Um, but I also believe that those decisions that we made, those sacrifices that we made as a family, as a couple, uh, certainly have. Helped make this transition much less traumatic. Definitely. The last thing that, I want to suggest that helped make this transition much less traumatic is that you and I stayed connected as a couple. Now, that's not to say that we were as intentional with regards to taking date nights as we should have been. That was,

Bonnie: 52:13

in part, my fault. Because I... I had a hard time leaving Brian J. Um, Um, but you know, I did, um, and I got used to doing that and it was a good thing. And I learned the importance of him spending time with his family. And, and it was definitely important for us to spend time together and go out on dates and make connections. But at first I, at our time with it.

Brian: 52:41

And, and even, even beyond that, even as he got older and when he could, you know, kind of maybe stay home by himself we still probably weren't as intentional in that area as what we could have been or should have been. But having said that we did. A lot of things together as a family, we did a lot of things together as a couple, and I think homesteading was one of those things. You know, the, uh, the family that grows food together, stays together, the family

Bonnie: 53:09

that skis together, stays

Brian: 53:12

together, stays together. They got me on board. That's right. Well, we got you on skis, not on a board. You weren't, you weren't woman enough to handle a snowboard. So no, but we did all of that to say that there are a lot of people when they're, they're either their first child or the last child goes off to college and they're empty nesters. They look across the living room and they say, who in the world is this person that I'm married to? And you and I don't feel that way. I don't. Okay. Well, I don't feel that way. No. I

Bonnie: 53:47

don't feel that

Brian: 53:47

way. No. And you know, we, I, I certainly have enjoyed spending more time with you. I certainly have enjoyed doing things with you and I anticipate that that will continue. It's, it's been a lot of fun again, going back to the fact that this has been a bit of a freeing thing where you and I, Oh, Hey, let's go out for breakfast Saturday morning. Oh, we can do that. We don't have to feel guilty. We don't have to worry about anybody else's schedule. Don't need to worry about where Brian J is. We just go out for breakfast. Oh, hey! Let's go kayaking. Okay, we'll go kayaking. Oh, hey! Let's go to a yard sale. Okay, we go to a ya Hey! Let's go to a estate sale. It's, like, it's just, uh, let's stay home. And we do that. Um, and so I really think that staying together, connected together as a couple has really, really paid dividends and helped this to be less of a traumatic, uh, transition because we were intentional, not as intentional as we should have been. But we still were intentional, but

Bonnie: 54:47

yeah, thank goodness we are still friends and we, we know each other. I mean, there's always things to learn, surprise each other and, you know, um, but you know, we still are friends.

Brian: 55:00

We are. Yes. And, and so for that, I'm very, very grateful now. That's not to say that we have not missed Brian J. That's not to say that there haven't been moments when we've been sad, when we've cried. We've experienced that. So I'm not saying that this transition has been, uh, without it's emotional, the emotional rollercoaster. It's not like this has been easy street. Um, that's not it at all. You know, there have been several moments. There are three moments that come to my mind where it really just hit me in the face that Brian J wasn't here. The first was a couple of weeks ago when I was out in the yard with the pullets and I'm looking down at, we've got a cockerel there in the chicken yard. And I'm thinking. Frankie, our rooster, he's a little long on a tooth. I think we've had him for about three years. Maybe it's time for us to move him on. And this new cockerel might be able to take his place. Well, in the past that the naming of our chickens has always been Brian Jay's responsibility. And now all of a sudden I'm standing in the chicken yard, looking at this cockerel saying, okay, well, what's your name going to be there, buddy? You've got to have a name. If you're staying around, you've got to have a name, but I have never named a chicken before. I don't think I've ever named a chicken. We don't name our food. We don't name our food, but we name our breeding stock. So he's potentially might be breeding stock. And so as I'm looking at him, I thinking about it, I really was missing Brian J in that moment because in the past he's been the one that's done that. And so. There was kind of like this sense of sadness that came over me as I'm standing there looking at this cockerel thinking, I really need to keep you and I need to come up with a name, but this really should be Brian J doing this. I powered on through it. I'm trying to think, okay, well, we've got Frankie, which is short for Franklin. I'm thinking, well, what else could go with Franklin? I thought, ah, Benjamin Franklin. I thought, well, what if we shorten it to Benny? And then that song. That Elton John hit Benny and the Jets. And I'm like, Benny, Benny, Benny and his hands. And so we have Benny now, but yeah, uh, I will quit my day job, but certainly Brian Jay, not being here to name him. I felt it in that moment. Now, uh, I've also felt that at church, you know, Brian Jay has played saxophone with me on the worship team now for. Um, probably five years, six years, something like that, been a long time. And so not having him next to me playing a saxophone every Sunday morning has certainly been a time when I really, really missed him. And then a time when you and I really, really missed him was last weekend when we went up to Aunt Vanessa's house. Yeah.

Bonnie: 57:50

Yeah. Yeah, when his, I mean his chair was not there, there wasn't that extra seat for him, there wasn't the place sitting there, and I think that was one of the very first times we've like ever been there, besides a visit, like sitting down for a meal that he hasn't been there with us.

Brian: 58:08

Yeah, and I think the reason why that was so... I hate to use the term traumatic, but it was so in your face versus us sitting down to dinner here at the house is because over the summer he was working two jobs. And so we would go many, many days without us sitting down and eating dinner with him because he would have to eat before he left. And that was before I got home from work. And so it wasn't as a parent. Now for us here at home sitting down to a meal and him not being here as it was there when we were so used to Us going to Aunt Nessa's having dinner and there being a place setting for Brian Jay And now this time there wasn't. And so certainly that was another moment where it was like, wow, I really miss this guy. But for me, those really have been the three key times when I feel like I've, I've missed him. And not to say that I don't miss him on a daily basis. I certainly do, but it's not been that sharp kind of in your face. Kind of thing like those three situations were for me any other ones come to your mind as far as when you've really missed him

Bonnie: 59:25

Yeah, when um, I think it was the week It was about a week after he had been gone, um, and we went antiquing, um, at his favorite antique shop, and it was where he'd gotten all of his records and, or most of his records. It was really, it was really hard to go there without him. Yeah. But we made it. We made

Brian: 59:48

it. Got through it. We got through it.

Bonnie: 59:50

Yeah, but yeah, we, I did miss

Brian: 59:51

him. Yeah. And so, and I'm sure there will be other moments like that, that, that will pop up. I mean, it's certainly, you mentioned going into the chicken barn at the fair. And him not being there, us not having chickens there, going to the pig barn, not having pigs there and so forth. So certainly there have been those moments where we've... Um, it's kind of been that intense, that intense thing, but by and large, um, it has been much less of that than I thought there would be. Now I wanted to wrap this up by coming back to the homestead and just really talking a little bit about how him being gone has impacted our homestead. And I think there's really three main areas where it has impacted. What we're doing here on 3B Farm and Homestead, besides just naming chickens.

Bonnie: 1:00:39

Just sitting around all day naming chickens, or,

Brian: 1:00:41

yeah. The first thing is, is that it really is going to affect, and it already has started affecting, the quantity of food that we raise and grow on our, on our homestead.

Bonnie: 1:00:51

Yeah, when you have one less person there, it's, you're going to want to reduce the amount of, you know, animals you raise, um, food you grow, um, you don't need quite as much. Of course he's going to come home on breaks and things, but it's, we're not feeding. We don't have another mouth to

Brian: 1:01:10

feed. Yeah, definitely. I think the other thing that, as well as it's really, um. Caused us to reevaluate our priorities right now. And, you know, there were some things that we were doing and that we have done because he enjoyed them because he liked them, uh, and, and because of his involvement at the fair, um, so, you know, the way that I bred pigs. To make sure that I had pigs in the spring for him to show at the fair, uh, how we have ordered chickens, the types of chickens that we have ordered, the quantity of chickens that we have ordered. Um, a lot of that has been. As a direct result of his involvement in the homestead. And so, you know, that really has caused us to reevaluate some of those things. Obviously we've gotten rid of the pigs for more reasons than just the fact that Brian Jay was leaving. We talked about that on another episode, but as we've thought about next year and thinking about the chickens that we're going to order. You know, are we going to get, uh, turkeys, you know, just different things like that. Um, it's really caused us to reevaluate our priorities.

Bonnie: 1:02:26

Yeah. And you will. I mean, anyone who doesn't have another, uh, that mouth to feed or where you're not, um, you don't have that person there. There's, we're down to two now instead of three and you're, you're going to, um, you might not need as many chickens.

Brian: 1:02:42

The last way that it's affecting our homestead is that we're really trying to keep things simple right now. And what I mean by that is, we, we're trying to keep things on the homestead such that if we need to go to Gordon for a concert, uh, or an emergency, We will have that freedom to be able to do so. That was a part of the reason why we got rid of the pigs is because that nailed us down so much that if we needed to head over there, like we're going to have to this weekend and next weekend because of his car situation, um, then we would be able to do so and not have to worry about So, yeah. being home at a particular time or having people come in and care for our animals or do certain things. So definitely, I think simplifying our homestead, at least for the near term. Has been another way that this has affected us here on the

Bonnie: 1:03:41

homestead. And as you, you've already said, like, we are enjoying the freedom when we want to enjoy that freedom some more. Like, let's face it, this is the first time in our lives we've had, you know, all this time on our hands. And, you know, we want to be able to be spontaneous with that time for the first time in our lives or in our married lives.

Brian: 1:04:04

Yeah, definitely. It will, will, you know, next year we're hoping to do a little bit more camping than that we've been able to do, uh, in the, in the, you know, not too distant past. And so that probably means that we will continue to keep things simple or simpler here on the homestead. Um, Whether or not we get meat birds and turkeys next year, time will tell, but definitely we will continue to keep things, I think, a little bit more on the simple side, at least for this first year as we're getting adjusted to this and we're really trying to, even though we've maintained that connectedness, really trying to reconnect together as a couple and trying to really understand what it is that we want. From life moving forward, and certainly it's not that we're leaving homesteading behind the homesteading is a part of who we are raising and growing food will always be a part of who we are, but it's just a matter of at what scale are we going to do that right now and then as we move forward in the future, how is that going to look? So hopefully you found this helpful. Let me just run through one more time the 11 reasons why we believe this transition has been less traumatic than what we thought it would be. The first is we were very intentional about the process. The second, we tried to prepare as best we could. The third is that we've tried to really lean into that concept of having open hands and allowing Brian J that freedom to grow into who he needs to be. The fourth, we established boundaries as a family. Number five, we've stayed busy since he has headed off to college. And then thinking about the more long term decisions that we made. Number six, we established boundaries and Establish expectations and try to instill in him character and values, morals, respect from a very young age. Number seven, we tried to put him in positions where other people could speak into his life. Number eight, we did not helicopter parent him. Number nine, we increasingly gave him more independence. Number ten, we spent time together with him. And as a family and number 11, we stayed connected as a couple. Now again, I want to be very, very clear on this, that everyone's transition is going to be different. And if you go through a more emotional transition than what Bonnie and I have, I, I don't want anybody to go away from this episode thinking that somehow you did something wrong. No, I mean,

Bonnie: 1:06:49

it's. Everyone's different. It's normal. Like, feel the feelings.

Brian: 1:06:55

But, I also do want you... To set yourself up for as much success as you can. And so if you're closer to the end than you are to the beginning, maybe you can't do some of the more long term stuff that we've done. But you certainly can try to equip yourself as best you can. You can really try to be intentional about the process. You can really lean into opening up your hands and allowing your child to grow and to flourish. There are so many things that you can do that I think can help set you up for success as you transition into the empty nest, uh, stage of life. If you are somebody who successfully made the transition into empty nesting, I would love to hear what worked for you and kind of what you believe helped contribute to your success. And if you're somebody who maybe didn't have as successful of a transition, I'd also love to hear your story as well. Reach out to me, brian at the homesteadjourney. net is my email address or you can find us via all of our social media accounts. The links are in the description below. Before we sign off. Anything else that you'd like to say, Bonnie? I think I'm all set. Well, then I'm all set until next time. Everybody keep up the good work.