Allison Park Leadership Podcast

How Do I Hear from God to Find His Will for My Life?

• Jeff and Dave Leake • Season 5 • Episode 17

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What do I need to do to hear from God? Does God have a specific will and calling for my life?

Dave and Jeff Leake explore these questions and the importance of discerning one's life assignment. 

Jeff shares his personal experiences of receiving life-defining words from God, such as planting 100 churches, and how we can go about seeking His guidance.

Lastly, they discuss the significance of partnership with God in fulfilling one's purpose and the potential for personal and spiritual growth.

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Dave Leake:

Today, we're going to talk about what it means to get a word from God. How do we hear from God? Does he want to speak to all of us, and about what sort of thing does he speak to us about just major life decisions, the small things, and how does one even begin to tap in to hear the voice of God for your life? If you'd like to hear more, stay tuned. Okay, Hey everybody, welcome to the Allison Park leadership podcast, where we have our culture, creating conversations as always. I'm one of your hosts. My name is Dave.

Jeff Leake:

My name is Jeff, and we're glad you joined us together today. We are father and son. We're both pastors at Allison Park church. Dave's the Northside campus pastor. I'm the lead pastor, and we are ready to do our next episode. Here we

Dave Leake:

are, and we have a couple of shout outs that we want to do, just to say thank you for some of those who have been kind enough, kind enough to leave us reviews. The first one was the one that you would have

Jeff Leake:

shown me. Amy baumerler left a comment that said, give you five stars. I'm learning so much from this podcast. So Amy, thank you for your appreciation. We appreciate that very

Dave Leake:

much so. And producer Matt, was there anybody else that I missed? And David vassal, David, cool. Yeah. Thank you so much for your kind reviews. And if you would like a shout out, we would love to give give you that as well. If you can leave us a five star review on whatever you're listening to, but specifically we can see your name and Apple podcast, that would make a big difference. Also, if you're watching YouTube, any comments would help us. If you want to tell us what you think about this, that'd be great. Yeah,

Jeff Leake:

we boy, we hit a zone, Dave in this month of August, the podcast we did on Christian nationalism on YouTube went

Dave Leake:

viral, viral for us, viral for us.

Jeff Leake:

But, I mean, as far as we're we're concerned, YouTube has been probably the least engaged platform of all the ones that we are on. But on the Christian nationalism episode, there was even arguments going on between different people who are commenting back and forth on things that we were not saying, but they were saying about the topic and Marxism as well. And I know we had like, 1000s of people watching that on YouTube. So wow, we that was both, I think, a timely, I guess you'd say issue of interest to people, maybe not enough people are talking about it. And maybe, maybe to our audience is just growing a little bit as we've stayed with us over over the years. It must be the new studio that Matt produced that must be the thing YouTube now looks way more attractive. To be

Dave Leake:

honest, producer Matt is killing like I was just looking at mention that's the current phrase, but, yeah, I was just looking at the on YouTube. It has, like, the little sections that tell you what part you're looking at. You

Jeff Leake:

can see that if you're watching right now, good little graphics to title each one of them, yeah, basically, he's

Dave Leake:

the reason little why?

Jeff Leake:

Yeah, really, it's been great. Thanks. Gonna bend his face, all right, anyway,

Dave Leake:

uh, today we're gonna talk about something a little less heated or controversial, maybe controversial for some people, but not so much like in that politicized type realm. Want to talk about, Does God still not just? Does God still speak? Today, we're going to talk about how to get a word and, like, what does the Holy Spirit want to talk to us about? How should we expect to hear God? Who can expect you from God, and on what? What topics? I guess that's kind of really the heart of it. Like, can I expect to hear from God? And if so, about what? Because you'd think that if you can hear from God on some things like clearly and on directional parts of your life, how to raise our kids, not just principles from the Bible, maybe even specific decisions or career decisions, or where we're moving, or ministries we invest into things like that, like, how do I hear from God? Not just about the general will of God for my life, but specifically and, yeah,

Jeff Leake:

I think this kind of is a follow up to an episode we did a number of months ago. It was right around the time when I was turning 60, and we did an episode on life, death and aging, and I was reflecting on my thoughts about the rest of my life, and one of the things I said during that particular talk that we did, Dave, conversation that we had, was I have a word from God for the rest of my life, right? I know what God has assigned me to do, so I think this is more than just direction. I think this is about assignment. It's both it's getting God's leading on direction. But this is not a how to get direction from God. Think there's life defining words, like words that God say to you, that sets a direction for you, that might give you information about the next few steps you're supposed to take, but sort of a overarching, life defining word. And I think during our lifetime, we probably get several of these, or can. And I remember when I said this in that particular podcast episode, you said, I don't think most people know how to do that. And I think you even said, I don't know if I've ever gotten that. And you said, when was the first time you got that? And I said, I think I was. Write about your age. I was probably in my early 30s, sure. So that's when we said, probably we need to do an episode about how to do that. Let's

Dave Leake:

make that the main entree. But I'm curious, just in general, about what your thoughts on are, on hearing from God as like a as like a consistent practice,

Jeff Leake:

yeah, so there is a little bit of controversy to this. So I remember seeing, you know, how you get these little real clips, R, E, E, L, on Instagram and your Facebook and other thing. And I remember, I am not a watcher of the view, but I know there is a program on one of the main networks called the view where there's discussion with, you know, Whoopi Goldberg and Joy Behar and whoever else is on that program, and they were talking about some Christian politician. They weren't really talking about his politics or her politics at the moment, but basically, Joy Behar voiced something that I think a lot of people feel in the popular culture. And that is, she basically said this, okay, it's one thing to talk to God. Everybody does that, like, if you're a person of faith and you believe there's a God, but if God starts talking to you, that's called mental illness. And I thought, yeah, a lot of people would see it that way. So a lot of how I live my life. People might see it as crazy, sure that God would talk back to us, but we really believe, but based upon what we read in the scripture, and based upon how the Holy Spirit works in our life, that God does talk to us, and so that little parentheses around the questions you're going to ask, but also,

Dave Leake:

there's a lot of things that we just take for granted that people would say are mental illness. If you think about the literal like believing somebody literally died and rose back from the dead, or the virgin birth, right? You know the miracles that Jesus did, yeah? Those are all like they seem almost fantasy, yeah? And if you take them in a very literal sense, which we do, of course, if you're from a scientific naturalistic perspective, where there can't be anything that happens outside of what we could explain the science. Well, okay,

Jeff Leake:

but those two do two words are very different words, scientistic and naturalistic. Scientific, yeah. Scientific is what you can prove by observing things and testing Sure, yeah. Naturalistic means that every explanation for what we see in the world has to be based upon a natural cost, not a supernatural cost, sure, but if you do believe that there's a God who created everything, then the whole world is supernatural.

Dave Leake:

Yeah, we talked about the impact of Christian scientists, yeah.

Jeff Leake:

So we don't to dive into that, but what I want to say is that believing in supernatural things is not for the unintelligent or unlearned. Yeah, right. It just is a different worldview. And we come from the worldview that believes that there's a creator god who's personal and wants to be involved in our life. I

Dave Leake:

believe it's more educated and authentic view of the world, actually, okay. I do because you have to ignore things like, you know, man, I really think to be a hardcore atheist, you have to ignore certain questions or make the assumption that someday we'll discover this. But for now, we don't have an Yeah,

Jeff Leake:

but there's a difference even between atheism and naturalism. Naturalism believes that everything has a natural explanation. There are actually Christian national naturalists who believe, how is that possible? Well, they basically believe that God set the world into existence, and that he he God helps those who held themselves, and that he doesn't really intervene much in the world,

Dave Leake:

yeah. But if God set the world into motion, that's not a natural cause. Okay,

Jeff Leake:

true.

Dave Leake:

But then after he did, okay, so did Jesus die and rise again well, so

Jeff Leake:

with some exceptional moments, right? They would. A lot of people live as if there's

Dave Leake:

no super that's true, that they're practically practicalists. Yeah,

Jeff Leake:

I think Craig Rochelle wrote a book years ago called practical atheists. Interesting, so, but All right, that's a little detour. Let's go back to our topic, right? Okay,

Dave Leake:

so we're talking about so why don't we start then with sort of that main idea of getting a word from God for your life. You talked about the word assignment. What do you mean by assignment?

Jeff Leake:

Yeah, so I believe every person is born into the world with a purpose that God created you with a specific thing that he wants you to do in this life. That's that skill, that's vocation, that's where you live, that's who you live with, who you do life with, what he wants you to spend your time on. There's an assignment that he gives you in life. So Apostle Paul said, I was called to be an apostle to the Gentiles. So it he describes himself in terms of who he was called to go and reach and what gift he was supposed to function in. That was his assignment, right? So everybody has an assignment in life, and finding that assignment the who and the where. And the what that is designed, designed by God, is a key factor in you stepping into the purpose, the full purpose that God's designed for you to fulfill in this world. So can we, can

Dave Leake:

we just dialog about this? This is going to be a, just a way for me to process so is that, is that, like, can you make a case for that in Scripture that everyone has an assignment? Yeah, because obviously there are people that have assignments. I'm not saying I disagree with you, actually. I'm just like, well, where would we Okay, so find that Ephesians,

Jeff Leake:

210 For we are God's workmanship created in Christ, Jesus to do good works, which he's prepared in advance for us to do in advance. Good Works in advance. So that's God. God has prepared a specific assignment work for you to do that. He's prepared in advance for you, it's true. And actually, every, every story that we read in the Scripture about someone that God interacted with, he interacted with him around their assignment. Yeah. And so who said this, I think, is it Mark Twain to two most important moments in your life, the moment you're born and the moment you find out why? Yeah, right. Okay, so a lot of people never find out why. Yeah, they they live without clarity on the big word for their life. So what gives me a lot of confidence as a 60 year old looking at the future is I know what my assignment is. I know exactly, with great clarity what my assignment is for the rest of my life. And I wake up every morning with anticipation for how God will use and work in my life to fulfill that assignment. I I can't imagine not living that way, like for me, that I've lived that way for so many decades. I long for that for everybody, yeah, that everybody would be able to discover their assignment.

Dave Leake:

It's it's interesting, because I think maybe most Christians and a lot of pastors wouldn't see it that way. So let me which I, I love that perspective. But

Jeff Leake:

what's the alternative? Okay, so

Dave Leake:

let me, let me clarify. So there's, there's two, like very simple theology terms, theological terms for the the general will of God and the specific will of God. We're talking about specific there's a specific assignment. We kind of have an idea of what that is. General would be principles of how to follow Christ, that everybody should follow. If you follow Christ, they're, you know, they're being conformed to the to the image of Jesus. You know, the transformed through the renewing of our mind, the fruits of the Spirit. And Galatians, five, like those kinds of things, are general will of God. God wants for everybody to be, you know, patient and kind and gentle, right? But specific will of God would be you have said you felt called to make an impact on the northeastern United States, right? That's like a specific assignment that you've gotten. So the alternative that I've heard a lot is, as long as you're living your life to honor God in a general will of God. Way that God works with the specifics out. You don't really need to worry about it so much. But what you're saying is that some, sometimes, if you seek God's specific will, like, what have you prepared in advance for me to do? It can give you confidence and boldness to step into what God's like. Specific assignment is, Am I understanding that correctly?

Jeff Leake:

Yeah. So to put it in order, I don't think you get a specific assignment from God until you answered the general assignment from

Dave Leake:

God. Okay, so, so what's the general assignment from God? Okay, so

Jeff Leake:

I was trying to find this. I think it's in the book of Mark. It's, it's where Jesus calls his 12 disciples, and when he does, it says he calls them to be with him. He sent them out with authority, and he asked them to preach the kingdom of God. Okay, so let's just, let's just break it into those couple things. One, he wants you to be with him. Yeah, so, so your first general assignment is to follow Jesus, intentionally, Jesus the person, not Jesus, the concept, but to follow Jesus personally. Second, that you would carry on your life his authority and and the identity of belonging to him. So you would consider being a follower of Jesus Christ, your first identity, and you would be doing everything you can do to imitate him in your life. And then third, that you would be seeking to serve His purpose on earth. Okay, so be with Jesus, to live into your identity as a follower of Christ, and to serve His purpose in the

Dave Leake:

world, right? A lot of people, which, in a general way, would be the Great Commission, yeah, making

Jeff Leake:

disciples, loving your neighbor, loving God with all your heart, right? It's, it's those things. So, I mean, that's a really poor way, I guess, of describing what it is to follow Jesus. But so here, here's what I discover. A lot of people in life want specific words from God without saying yes to the general uh. Most important overarching word from God Sure, which is to give your life to follow Jesus. They almost want Jesus, like to be a directional Genie, to show up and to give his approval or blessing to specific Crossroads decisions where they they get God's leading. And the thought process is and then, when I find this and follow this. This will make me happy. But this is really not about happiness, and it's not about just getting sort of a psychic opinion on your future. It's about it's about slotting into the direction that God has for your life. So first you got to say yes to the general. You got to say yes, Jesus, I want to follow you. Yes, Jesus, I want to be like you. Yes, Jesus, I want to do in the world what you want me to do to make a difference in the world around me. And so if you're saying, If you said yes to that, then once you get on the general pathway, then God narrows the direction for you and gives you a little bit more clarity on specifically what you're created for, and what you're supposed to do and what you're supposed to lean into. Does

Dave Leake:

that make sense? It makes sense. It's just, yeah, it I just, I, and I think you're right. It's, it's just like, it's not what you necessarily hear like from a lot of really great Christian leaders. I think I've heard, and I agree with you, by the way, but I've heard so many people sort of talk more about the general like following Christ generally, as long as you're doing the those things, that's the main thing, which probably is true. It is the main thing. But part it makes me wonder, like, I wonder like even for me, but in general, I wonder if a lot of us are missing out on what we could be stepping into if we heard the specifics, but So to review, you're saying, Okay, let

Jeff Leake:

me give you an example. Yeah, please. This is, this is what it says in John, chapter five, verse 19, Jesus explained, I tell you the truth, the son, meaning himself, right, can do nothing by himself. He only does what he sees. The father doing whatever the Father does, the Son does. The Father loves the Son and shows him everything he is doing. In fact, the father will show him how to do even greater works than healing this man, which had just, I guess, happened in the story. Okay, so Jesus said, I don't just go around do life. I wait for specific assignments from the Father, yeah, and I don't do anything without an assignment from the father. That's good. So if Jesus lived that way, and we're supposed to follow him, yeah, shouldn't we be looking to see what the father's doing in our life specifically?

Dave Leake:

Yeah, that's good. I was I think you were reading this too. Did you read that new book? Newer book by John Mark comer, following the way,

Unknown:

practicing the right practice.

Dave Leake:

He was talking about how discipleship is not just, you know, believing what Jesus believed. It's doing what he did, like following, you know, the practice. That's an interesting spin on that idea. So

Jeff Leake:

it's also doing it the way he did it, which is, so it's following Him, doing what he did, and doing it the way he did it, which was to discern what the father's up to and to then do what the father's assigned to you to do. Okay,

Dave Leake:

so every person starts with general will of God, which is surrender, yes, and it's becoming like Jesus, and it's laying down our

Jeff Leake:

personal agenda. Yeah,

Dave Leake:

our personal agenda our ability to make our own choices or define what's right and wrong for ourselves, or even to define who we are, we have to define ourselves through who Jesus says we are. So we start there with the general will of God's surrender that we get into the specifics we discern as the word crude

Jeff Leake:

illustration, God says, so let's use both you and I love football slash soccer. Okay, you can't world football. The coach is not going to tell you what position you play on the field until you're on the field like you're like, God, I'm sitting here on my couch, and I really want to know, am I supposed to play fullback or striker? Yeah. And God would say, get on the field, dude. Like, we'll worry about the specific position once you get generally into the right space. Sure. So a lot of people are sitting on their couch waiting for a word from the Lord to define everything for them, and really you're supposed to get up and move into the space where you know you're supposed to be, yeah, you know, right? You're trying to follow Jesus, and you're living in community with other people, and you're serving in your local church, and you're getting up every day to read your Bible, and you're involved in the right kind of relationships, and you're asking, God, what position do you want to put me on this field? But you got to get on the field first before you get the specifics. But a lot of people are on the field and they're just running around. Yeah, right. They don't know. Where am I supposed to be? What play are we running here? What position am I supposed to be in? What was I built for? What am I most gifted to do? That's then the space where you start to function and get that assignment from God. A lot of people never get that they're on the field, they're running around, but they never get that specific. On the

Dave Leake:

field me and they're following the general will, yeah, right, that's surrendered. They're trying to do the right thing, exactly. I haven't heard the specifics, by the way. Shout out to our football club, right? Or Chelsea, anybody missed that little easter egg? Okay, so then, how do we go through the process? You use that word discernment, of discerning. What does that look like to hear a word from God, that's a specific assignment. You said for you, it's for the rest of your life. That feels like a pretty big level. And I mean, I don't even think you had a whole life assignment until recently, right? Like you have no it's, I

Jeff Leake:

always say it like this, God gives you a big dream for your life, for the future, any, any, any, and he gives you the next steps of obedience you're supposed to take. So on the spectrum, you have this infantile and, you know, very small, specific next step that you're supposed to take. And then you have this huge dream that's sort of like a big picture of what the future is, and in between it's a lot of fog. So you take the next step, headed towards the big dream, and you get a lot of fog in between. So let's just we'll use you as the example, Dave. Let me flip the scales on you here. At some point you felt God assign you to go into ministry. Yeah. When was that?

Dave Leake:

Probably when I was like, 12. Let's say 12. Okay, so

Jeff Leake:

you're 12 years old, and God looks down at little Dave leak, well, you were big. You're actually bigger than most of your student friends. You had this one game in upward basketball where you scored 47 points because you were like a head taller than everyone else. Yeah, I

Dave Leake:

stopped growing 12 years old. No, I think actually ninth grade. I was, like, the tallest kid. I never grew an inch after that. Unfortunately.

Jeff Leake:

Okay, so, so, so God looked at 12 year old Dave, yeah, and what did he How did you know God spoke to you? I just

Dave Leake:

felt a really strong I was in a worship service, and we were praying, and I just felt like, yeah, just a really strong internal sense. I think I was asking the question, like, God, are you asking me to go into ministry? And I felt like, yeah. Like it was just clear, okay,

Jeff Leake:

so you were on the field, right? You were in the right general space as a 12 year old in a worship service, asking God, what do you want to do with my life? And God spoke to you an overarching assignment for your life that you've walked in for the last 21 years.

Dave Leake:

Yeah.

Jeff Leake:

Okay,

Dave Leake:

there you go. Perfect. Yeah. So

Jeff Leake:

that narrowed it down. It didn't tell you where you were going to go into ministry, yet it didn't tell you what you were supposed to do. Didn't tell you're supposed to be a youth pastor. Some people actually get that at 12. Some people get the fuck sure me,

Dave Leake:

by the way, quick, quick side note, everything that every up until now. So I've been in ministry for 11 and a half years. Everything up until now that's always been like, I think I know where I'm going, and then, like, because I have a long term idea of what it looks like, and then it's been a left turn, like God veers me into a different lane. And I've been sure each time that that's been my assignment. Like I never thought I was gonna do youth ministry, and I didn't wanna even apply. And you were like, I think you should. My friend Jordan Clark, who was the middle school pastor at the time, was like, apply. And I was like, No. And then I felt like I heard God prompt me so it shifted me there, okay? And then to Northside. You knew I was supposed to go there before I did. You were like, I'm pretty sure Dave. I was like, I don't think so, because at the time, I had a different idea of what the community would be like. You know, I'd seen other people who had been in urban settings that grew up in it, you know, I was in a gang and had this addiction background, and I was like, that's not my testimony. I'm not sure that I would fit there, but I prayed, and I felt like, I was like, you're supposed to go there. And I

Jeff Leake:

was like, okay, so you're getting, you're you're actually unpacking quickly.

Dave Leake:

I loved I'm so I won't, don't people to hear that think I don't love Northside. I love the fact that I'm at

Jeff Leake:

Northside. You just didn't think you were a fit for the north side. No, that you didn't want north side. Is that you felt like, I'm not sure if I would fit there. I thought they would accept me there,

Dave Leake:

yeah. And I thought I would be horrible there. I thought I wouldn't be able to reach people. And

Jeff Leake:

you've done great. Yeah. Okay, so you have what a lot of people never get. You already have more of an assignment than what a lot of people ever get. At 12. You've been walking in this call for 21 years, and then, yes, you don't get the perfect download of every detail of every job you're ever going to have and in your 30s and in your 40s, but you do get enough to take the next steps of obedience in the right direction, yeah, on the assignment you're given. Now, some people could tell that same story about I was called to be a doctor, or some people could tell that same I was called into education. Some people could tell that same story to say I was called to be a businessman. Like every every person has an assignment in life. May not necessarily be full time ministry, but everybody has an assignment. I know one of the guys that you and I both know and love very much, Harold McCamish, who built a great sheet metal company. Company here in the city of Pittsburgh, one point in time, ended up in San Luis Mexico. And while he was there looking at the crisis in that city of poverty, God gave him an assignment to build infrastructure to take care of the poor. He Harold McCamish and the people that have come along with him with caring hearts, have changed the city of San Luis, Mexico by schools for the blind and orphanages, and, you know, schools for places to live for teens, and feeding programs and ministering to the prison. All of that started with an abyss a businessman who said, use your wealth and influence to do something for the poor of San Luis. And now what Harold's in his 90s? Yeah, and he's been walking in that God given assignment for decades. That's what we're talking about. Yeah. Okay, so how does that happen? You said the Holy Spirit spoke to you like you asked a question. Oftentimes, this is what happens in my life, too, Dave, you asked a question, and God said, Yes. How did he say yes for me? Yeah. How did you get the Yes?

Dave Leake:

It sets your course? I was so for the North side one, I didn't, I really didn't want to do it, and so I was praying and fasting because So here's, here's the process. I knew I was supposed to leave youth ministry. I felt God stirring that probably for about a year before I left, like the season's about to come to an end. So I already knew, just like my sense was this is not going to happen much longer. That sparked the question, what's next? And I had a lot of options, and then you presented one that I didn't really want to consider. And so you said, Pray about so I set aside a week where I prayed and fasted, and then I felt like in that process, I Yeah, usually the word for me, it feels like I get a strong internal sense, you know, like, this is what God's asking. So it's

Jeff Leake:

almost like you think, should I do that? And you feel more peace than when you say, I'm not going to do that. Right? It's like you're measuring those two choices internally, and as you lean toward one, you feel like this impulse inside the Holy Spirit saying yes, yes, yes, yes, yes,

Dave Leake:

yes, yeah. It makes me feel like it, even if I'm not excited, I feel like peace about it, peace and I feel

Jeff Leake:

I feel terrified. Like, peace and and like, Oh my goodness. How am I going to do this at the same time? Because a lot of things that God calls us to are not easy, yeah. Like, so you feel like, I can't not do this, because I just feel so strongly inside that I'm supposed to, I

Dave Leake:

sort of feel like, Okay, God, God's like, you're gonna do this. Like, ah, all right, but so, but there's a couple of

Jeff Leake:

things that let's just unpack. Because I think you look at this, you and I, Dave, have talked about this multiple times, and you look at this like, somehow I have this otherworldly skill of discerning from God my assignment, and that maybe you're missing that skill, but you basically have unpacked how it works. In my life, too, there's kind of a crisis that goes on inside. I don't think I'm in the right place. I think I'm not supposed to be in youth ministry anymore. I don't know where I belong. Then you start to ask the question to God, in that crisis, God, what are you saying to me right now? I really want to be in the center of your will. Would you show me where I'm supposed to be? And then circumstances pop up. Someone says to you, what about the north side? Or how about this? And then you go to fasting and prayer, right? So the intensity of your desire to know increases. You set aside food. You're pressing in. It's not like again, you're sitting on the couch waiting for God to drop something on your head. You're you're pressing in. I really want to know God. I'm going to spend time to spend time instead of eating my lunch, I'm going to spend time worshiping and be in your presence. Because I really want to know what you want me to do, and you spend whatever time in that space of fasting and prayer and disturbed inside, seeking clarification. And I have been in those places where I spend three or four days and God speaks to me, and I've been in a place where I spend three or four months and God speaks to me, and I've been in spaces where it's been longer, where I've been carrying around this distressed sense that not everything's right with the world, and I that I need a new word from God, yeah, but I stay pressed in and trying to hear and fasting and praying, until you have that moment where all of a sudden it becomes clear, I think I'm supposed to do this, yeah? And when that happens, initially, there is this sense of peace. And I don't know, sometimes it feels like a fire burning in you, yeah,

Dave Leake:

yeah, definitely. I know that. I know you're talking about. And

Jeff Leake:

then you take that to people you respect and love, and you say, I think I heard from God. Does this sound right to you?

Dave Leake:

So does God only give you those kinds of words about ministry assignments, or is it about anything? It's anything,

Jeff Leake:

it's anything. So you're like, I'm thinking about going to college. God. What college am I supposed to go to? I want to go to the right place. Okay, so forget for a moment that I was headed to Bible college. I was searching and searching, and I went back and forth between two different schools. What was your other school? University of Valley Forge, which was closer to home, yeah, and central Bible college, back and forth, back and forth, back and forth. And then part of me thought, I don't want to go to a Christian college there. Christians there. I want to go to university where I can rub shoulders with people that don't know Jesus, and I can be a, you know, share my faith. And I had been in a public high school, and God had used me there. And I was sort of disappointed in some ways that I couldn't go to Penn State and get involved with Chi Alpha and be actively involved in winning people to Christ. So I was back and forth and back and forth. I was accepted into both schools. It was August. I had two weeks to make up my mind. Okay, so back and forth and back and forth. Then I thought, maybe today is Valley fortune, but the stronger leaning I kept feeling was central Robert College. Okay, so eventually, I was 70% sure that I was supposed to go to Central public college, and I went to Central Bank and and on the trip there, and when I enrolled there, it became 80% and 90% but then I had some hard moments, and I wonder maybe I made the wrong decision, right. But the the the thing grew into I grew into the decision as I walked in faith. Now let's say I'd made the wrong decision, and I, I believe the Holy Spirit could have shifted me back if he needed to sure to whatever direction he wanted me to go in. But you're never 100% certain. That's why you check with others, yeah. That's why you say I think God called me to plant churches. Does this sound right to you? Yeah. And the people in your life that hear God, that love you, that have wisdom confirm that assignment by agreeing with you that you're on track. Now they might agree with you and say, but you might also want to consider this, or they might agree with you and say, I think that's your future. I'm not sure that's right now, like you get wisdom along with counsel

Dave Leake:

with people that are already in the game, that submitted that you at respect

Jeff Leake:

as somebody that knows you, that thinks about you well, and that knows how to hear from God, good, okay? Because knowing the will of God is not a majority decision. Most of the time. If you take a poll, the majority is going to tell you to do the thing that God doesn't want you to do because, because if, if following God and His leading in your life was easy, everybody would do it, right? But this is more of a skill of the few than the many. So you want to go to the few that are proven in that regard. Is it so? Is

Dave Leake:

you more of a skill of the few, because people, it's only the few that get in the game to surrender themselves at the beginning, or is this, is this a harder skill? It's both, both. Okay, so

Jeff Leake:

there are few in the world that have said yes to Jesus's general assignment for their life, yeah. And there are fewer that are on the field playing in their right, right position under God's clear assignment, that have practiced discerning from God over and over and over, that have a skill set being able to recognize that. Okay?

Dave Leake:

So anybody can get this. Oh, so just God longs to

Jeff Leake:

tell you your assignment, like if you are breathing air, if God's created you, he does not want you to wander the earth. He wants you to live in your assignment. The Holy Spirit desperately wants to tell you what you're here on earth for. If you really want to know where you're supposed to be and what you're supposed to be doing in to be doing and who you're supposed to be doing it with, and you will cry out to God and ask for his clarity and discernment. He longs to give it to you. It almost feels like sometimes, with direction, that God's holding his hand behind his back and say, Guess which number you know two fingers or three wrong. Sorry, he's he's wanting to reveal it to you. But getting a word from God requires a different skill set than your natural senses. It requires spiritual hearing. It requires faith. It requires the context of pressing in, within the framework of Scripture. So you have to actually have some idea of what what God's like by reading the scripture. But it's, it's something he wants everybody to know. Yeah, that's good. So he wants to tell you, if you're listening to this podcast and you think, I don't know my assignment, he wants to tell you, so

Dave Leake:

can we? Can we? Let's, let's go more micro here. Here's a step that I think I find helpful, especially because I've been studying hearing from God a lot for a year, probably it's been the main thing. I've been studying how to hear from God, I think, in a more micro sense. So I guess I want to hear about what your practices are with this. But I've begun, I've begun to realize that I think, like a relationship with the Holy Spirit is one. So, you know, in Genesis, it talks about how God would walk without M and Eve in the cool of the day, you know that he was so in the relationship, where it's not like he would show up only at specific moments for important things, he just was with them, like just kind of do in life. And I think that's probably what heaven will look like, and I think the taste of heaven now, like the you know, I forget where it is in the Scripture, but it says the Holy Spirit is our down payment of heaven. Second

Jeff Leake:

Corinthians, chapter one, you're so good at that. Yes, it referenced crazy so it, it talks about the Holy Spirit is a guarantee of what's to come. It's like, it's like a deposit that you put down on something with a guarantee you're going

Dave Leake:

to be one of a different translation, yeah, regardless. Um, I think that the way that ideally, God wants to do life with us now is that even in small things that maybe aren't of massive consequence, theoretically, that he can talk to us. So do you have any practice of how you like listen to God?

Jeff Leake:

Okay, so because of my role in the world, my assignment as a pastor of a church, I have to discern all the time. So I get to discern what am I supposed to preach this weekend? And I gotta ascertain what's the series and what's the emphasis, and what's the structure for how we're moving forward, and what's the vision we should have. So I have to have discernment all the time about where I'm going. The way I get that discernment is I spend time every day in prayer. I actually say like this, I spend a lot of time every day in worship. Yeah. My personal practice is I will. I will turn on something on Spotify. I will pace back and forth, because I'm just the Pacer when I pray, yeah, I will sing along with the song. I will have a piece of paper that's blank sitting on the table. And as I'm worshiping and just interacting with God, I feel these promptings inside about all kinds of things, people God will prompt in my prayer time, a face of someone that I need to call. He will prompt something specific, like a verse that might fit into the message I'm going to preach. He might give me insight into some challenge I'm having with a relationship in my life. Yeah, it's not that I'm even praying all the time about that. I'm just worshiping, yeah, and then all of a sudden, stuff will just sort of come to me as the Holy Spirit just reveals some stuff to me. So my discerner is practiced. It's sharpened.

Dave Leake:

Side note, how off how much of that worship time is praying in your prayer language?

Jeff Leake:

I probably go in and out of singing and speaking in tongues. I would probably say 20% is my prayer language, and the rest of it's just singing. We're singing, singer, worship song, okay?

Dave Leake:

And as you're doing that, you feel like you started to get senses and yeah, yeah, okay.

Jeff Leake:

So you know, for a long time, as I was early in my relationship with God, the Holy Spirit would be speaking to me about me, yeah, like you shouldn't have said that, or you need to deal with this, or you need to repent of that, like, so a lot of it was personal work at first. So it was God giving me discernment about the stuff in my life that was broken and need to be fixed. But once I got tuned up in my life, spiritually, there was less garbage to wade through. Then he started speaking to me about things beyond me and the big assignment words in my life came at moments where I was desperate to hear God because I felt like I was stuck somehow. And it was then that God gave me. Okay, here's the next assignment, but it came in typically moments of desperation.

Dave Leake:

So I think probably a lot of people who have followed you for a long time have heard some of those moments of desperation. You talk about that one about God's problems. Can you just give us a quick I want to frame this for people. I think, okay, so maybe people are feeling a little hungry for this. Can you talk about that moment that you first had that big Well, let

Jeff Leake:

me give you the second one, because I had a second. Give me the similar, yeah, 2011 I had been at Allison Park church for 20 years, and I was starting to feel like maybe I had become stale here, like certain moments in your life that you wonder, Am I still supposed to be here doing the same thing? Is this it? Have I reached the end of my time in Allison Park? Is there another season for me? And this feeling inside of feeling a bit lost, was picking up an intensity. So I actually was on vacation. Mel and I were in Italy, of all places. We had just arrived in Venice. Okay, we get in this romantic little island place. We checked into the hotel. Should have been one of the best, freest moments in my life. I was miserable, like I said to her, I am not much fun to be around right now. I'm so sorry. Here we are in this one of the most romantic places on Earth, and I just got to hear from God. So I said I could pretend like everything's fine, but I need to take a walk, and I need to talk to God for a while. So I took a walk for a couple miles, and I'm walking across one of the bridges in Venice. And as I'm walking across the bridge, I was just there was no one around, so I was talking to God out loud, and I was like, God, am I supposed to be here? Is this Are you still want me to Nelson Park? Is there something else you have for me? I mean, what's happening right now in my life, and as. I was pouring out my heart to God like that. When I paused, I so basically asked this question, what do you want me to do? Like if you've ever been in that place in your life where you're just frustrated, God, what do you want me to do? I don't know what I'm supposed to do. And then I felt the Holy Spirit just whispered to me, what did I tell you to do last time? And I had to think, so Well, my last assignment was to be a lead pastor, but to plan churches. So I said, I said out loud, plan churches. And he said, Okay. I was like, is that all? I've already been doing that? I'm not satisfied with that answer. So I was having a very real conversation. I'm not satisfied with that. Okay, yes, plant churches. How many like I need something to grab hold of. So I had a goal before, like one church year for five years. How about 1010? In the next 10 years? God, are you pleased with that? Is that? What does that sound good to you and I, and I didn't feel anything. So I was like, All right, well, one of my, one of my spiritual sons, is planting. I think he could probably do one a year. We both did one a year. How about 20? God, 20 churches sound good. I was presenting things. Didn't feel anything. So I thought, well, add five. You know, that's that like bold faith, like 20 plus five. Like, we'll do 25 I'm a 25 guy. You want to play 25 nothing. So then I was like, Well, what do you want from me? You got to tell me, I I don't want to just do life. I want to do life knowing I'm in the spot you want me to be in and doing? So what is it you're saying to me? And then I felt him say, I want you to play 100 and I was like, No, that's crazy. 100 that's just not even realistic. God, are you sure? Like, I know it almost sounds like God and I are having a conversation. We were I was talking out loud. The Holy Spirit was whispering in my chest like prompting inside, yeah, and so and so. And here's how I proved it. Then, when I was I felt peace over that was like 100 This is crazy. I'm gonna be known as the guy who, for 20 years, planted churches, and they came up with this crazy number. And, you know, it totally failed. So I walked back to the hotel where melody was there in Venice, Italy. And I said, I think the Holy Spirit spoke to me. And she said, What did he say? And I took her through the process, and I said, I think he told me to plan 100 years. And she said, when you said 100 Oh, my goodness, I think that's it. And I was like, Oh crap. I was always that

Dave Leake:

person, just like she's she as soon as she like, lights up. Oh no, here we go. That's happened to me so many times.

Jeff Leake:

So then I took it to my board and other leaders at the church. And every time I would say the word 100 out they would it was like, it was like a Holy Spirit popcorn moment, like when I would say, I think we're supposed to plan 100 churches the next tenure. Everyone who heard that phrase, the Holy Spirit took that phrase, made it alive inside their chest, and they would say, I'm totally in agreement with that. Yeah. In fact, a lot of people, when they would hear it, they would be, Oh, you're so gonna do that. And I'd be like, Well, I'm

Unknown:

glad you're confident.

Jeff Leake:

I'm terrified and and so we that was my new assignment. Wow. So we started in the process, and in 2016 we planted our 100th church in a five year period of time, instead of 10. Yeah. And, okay, not, not all of us perfect. It had a lot of fallout. I can't tell you the story about the stuff that went wrong when you follow Jesus in your assignment. It isn't like you're on easy street or everything you touch turns to gold. I was obedient to God, and we did a lot of amazing things, and we learned a lot of things through mistakes that were made. And there were there were painful moments and there were betrayal moments. Being in your assignment doesn't mean you're in a bubble of blessing, sure, but it did set me on a course where we did some things that truly were supernatural, like, there's no way that happens. And they were all in the northeast, right? There's no way that that happens without that being a clear assignment from God. So that kind of a seminal moment has happened to me in my life probably five or six times I'm 60 years old. It's not like this happens every week, but there have been five or six times in my life where I've had a life defining, transformative word from God that set me on a trajectory that changed everything for me. And that assignment didn't live forever. That was 2011 I had another moment after that where I had to say, okay, that one's over. Now, God, what do you want me? So every season of your life has another question mark for you that you need to press in and ask, and your word that's good, your word won't sound like my word, and my word won't sound like your word, and you can't measure my word against yours or yours against mine, because God's going to say something very unique to you and and that's one of the problems, is we oftentimes compare what God's assignment is. For me with God's assignment with someone else, God's going to do something totally unique within the context of who He created you to be. It's good, yeah. So I don't know if I that was a really long story. No, that wasn't that

Dave Leake:

long, and that was helpful. I think let me, can I? Let me just give some. Reflections, and you can jump in if you want to, if you want to jump in and give your thoughts. I think, I think a lot of people listening to this right now are feeling hungry. I want that. You know what I mean? Like, even if they're not in ministry, they're doing, yeah, they're doing, they're they're a painter, construction worker, they're whatever they're doing. And so when I hear you saying this, a few things sound to me that getting a directional word is not for the casual. You can't just have a little bit of a direction war for your life and do whatever you want with your life like. So I think it starts like, and this is, this is kind of probably where it started with me. It's just like selling out like, God, you can have every piece you can I'm not going to hold anything back. Wherever you want me to go, whatever you want me. Whatever you want me to do, like I'll follow you.

Jeff Leake:

So because he he's probably not going to tell you something if he knows already, you're not going to say yes, right?

Dave Leake:

Because I heard Chris valkin Say, if he shares things with us, we're held accountable for them. So God actually spares us from extra accountability from things he knows we're not going to do already. Yeah, because we're going to be judged for those things if he reveals too much knowing our hearts already. But so we sell out. So we stop being casual, we sell out, and then you begin to seek God, especially whenever there's like a season of distress, distress, discontent, dissatisfaction, not big words in

Jeff Leake:

your life always show up in the spaces of your most distressful, discontented moments, because those are the moments where you feel enough wrestling inside that makes you press into him. So a lot of people, what they do is they miss that they live in depression over the fact that life doesn't feel right, rather than pressing in to get the clarity they need, because you might actually be inches away from a massive breakthrough in your life, and the discouragement that you feel has led you to a place where you're actually more ready to hear from God than you were before. But if you just think that God's going to drop it on you, you might miss it. You have to press in, and you have to sensitize yourself, and you have to fast. You gotta cry out to Him, and you gotta get real with him, and you gotta deal with the crap that's inside of you as he because a lot of times he's going to say, well, before I can give you a word, we got to deal with that bitterness you have, yeah, before I give you a word, we got to deal with the fact that you've been living in compromise. Before I give you a word, you got to treat your wife better like you'll unpack all kinds of other things to lead you up to the big revelation. Yeah. So it's not like you just, you know, let your finger stick it in the air, and all of a sudden the wind blows, and you're like, Oh, I'm supposed to go to the right. It's a whole life interactive moment where you rip your chest open and say to God, speak to me on every level. Yeah. And then once he gets through all the things he wants to say to you about you, he might also then unpack to you what he wants to say about how he wants to use you. But here's another thing, what he says to you will very rarely be about you. Sure

Dave Leake:

it's yeah, when you're talking about you're close to the edge of your breakthrough. I think often we think of breakthrough as being when the pain leaves my life, whenever I have provision, whenever I have, like, it's like, everything parts, and now I'm in peace again, and I press coast,

Jeff Leake:

and everybody loves me, yeah? But it

Dave Leake:

actually often breakthrough is into what, what the purpose you're supposed to be in, yeah? And then you actually have the other stuff fall off as you're going towards what God really cares. Think

Jeff Leake:

about this moment in Scripture. Paul is in Troas in Acts chapter 16. He's stuck. He's walked all the way across Turkey. He can't go any further because he's walked right into the ocean. And God speaks to him. In the middle of the night, you're supposed to go across to Philippi, get on a boat, go over there. That's your next assignment. When he arrives there, God starts to move in his life, but he ends up beaten with rods and thrown into prison. So his assignment didn't lead him into blessing like blessing with tons of more money and blessing with a lot of prestige. It led him into the clarity and certainty that he was right where he was supposed to be doing what he was supposed to be doing, and he was on a mission from God, and he and God were partners. And it was about the city of Philippi. It wasn't about Paul, but Paul was in the center of what God was doing there. And this is where real life happens. So when Harold McCamish gets the word about San Luis Mexico, this isn't to make his business more prosperous in the United States, although it probably was more prosperous because God blessed them, because they were partners together in this endeavor. Sure, Harold had to get on planes, go back and forth to San Luis and build infrastructure and care for people in a different language, in a different culture. The assignment from God has cost him so much in his life, but he has lived his life with purpose, so that when he one day gets to heaven, he looks back and he says, Thank you, God, you gave me that assignment for San Luis, because my business and my leadership made a difference in eternity, because I fulfilled what you called me to do. The reason why I was born,

Dave Leake:

I just, I just had a I preached on Sunday about Matthew five. Six the Beatitudes, reminds me of this where Jesus says, Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they will be filled. I never, kind of really knew what that meant, like, I sort of a obscure way of saying the point, blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they'll be filled. I studied it more, you know. And really, I think the idea of what he's saying there is not just like righteousness, like goodness, but it's really the things of God, the righteous things that God has for us,

Jeff Leake:

or to be rightly aligned with his character and his purpose. That's true. So it's almost like righteousness, like a plumb line, like you are. Your foundation is level. It's aligned properly. It can be built upon. And the word filled can also mean satisfied. Yeah.

Dave Leake:

Well, actually, well, actually, in First Corinthians, 130 it says it is because of him that you were in Christ, Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God that is our righteousness, holiness and redemption. So actually, Jesus is the righteousness of God. So the other commentary is talking about, well, hungry and thirsting for righteousness is actually to be with God that they'll be filled. And when you look at that, yeah, the word fulfilled is satisfied, satiated, there's it often means fattened like that. You have so much of it that. And so I'm studying this, you know? I think the In contrast, I think so many people are longing to be filled with something, and they their appetites never satisfied. I think when we're talking about like, why get a direction? Why did Harold go after this? It's not just because he had to. But I really think even with the challenges Paul faced in Troas or that Harold faced in San Luis Obispo or whatever, like, there is nothing like the satisfaction you get from being filled when you actually hunger and thirst for the things of God and you're in right alignment. And you get those things

Jeff Leake:

when you're partnering with God. You're partnering with him with not it's not just that when you're walking with God, that's one level, but you're walking with God in partnership to do something meaningful in the world. Yeah, that the two of you. So I remember, in 2016 Dave, when we planted the 100th church. We we went down to stage AE, which is a venue in downtown Pittsburgh, and we brought all of our campuses together, and we had a celebration of 100 churches. And I was backstage at stage AE, before that event started, it was just me, me sitting in the backstage room. And now stage AE is a really big concert venue. Concert venue, yeah, seats about what, 1500 people, yeah. And I was in the in the backstage room. I was just sitting there, and I was, I was just talking to God, thank you, God. What a celebration. This is, look at us all. All these church planters are in that auditorium out there that we got to help them get their churches started. I can't believe this happened in five years, and I was just sitting there, and then when I got quiet, the Holy Spirit said to me, look at what we get to do together. And I just wept. I was like, God, the God of the universe has viewed me as his partner in this endeavor, yeah, and, and whatever else happens with the rest of my life. I can say that God and I pardon on something together and and that so I am jealous, if you're listening to this podcast, that you would have that feeling in life. Yeah, do we all partner together in raising children? Yes, if you're a parent, absolutely, that's a partnership with you and God. We partner together with God in building our local congregations, whatever church you're a part of, but God has a very specific assignment. It's that San Luis Harold McCamish assignment. Brian Lippert, who is up on your staff at the north side and on the APL, a staff, got assignments from God about refugees that live in Pittsburgh. And for a while he was leading Cambodian refugees, it was like part of their families, just because he decided to hear from God and care about something God cared about. I think that's part of it. Your assignment in life will cause you to care about something that you don't naturally care about, and you will start to care about and invest in something and someone, yeah, that is outside of the scope of your normal worldview. And God will say, would you share this with me, this burden for the world, you know, San Luis, Mexico, the Cambodian refugees the northeastern United States. Would you share this with me? I want to invite you. Would you be a part making a difference? A lot of this has happened at Allison Park church with treasured kids. People have heard the vision and said, Will you share this vision and care for someone who's in foster care, who's in the system, who no one else cares for? And people have said, That's my assignment. I'm supposed to foster and adopt. That's what we're talking about. It doesn't have to be I'm called to plant a church or pastor a church. Just is that you feel God share with you a burden that he has where he is asking you to partner with him in the world, and that becomes your assignment. Yeah, so

Dave Leake:

I guess just, I want to welcome anybody to join this like we were talking about this earlier. And here's, here's, I guess what my sense is. Yeah, I think that whenever God gives you not just an experience like what you had, but the clarity to give language to it, that I think it's an invitation anybody listening to go all in with God, to surrender whatever you gotta surrender, and to step into that purpose, to actually begin to hunger and thirst for what God has for you, so that you can be filled, so that you can have an impact on the world. So the challenge I want to give is, you know, ask God, what are you doing in my life? Is there anything you're convicting me about that I've been ignoring? Is there anything that you told me was the last thing you know, you said? What was the last thing God spoke to you? Is there anything God spoken to us? Yeah, because he

Jeff Leake:

won't give you the second word until you did the first word, right, right? Like, if he told you do something before and you didn't do that, when you come back to him, he's mostly like, gonna say, go back. What? Do not pass go. Don't collect 200 yards. Go back to the space you were on before. Do what I asked you to do then. And then, let's build on that, right? So further revelation only comes when you obey the revelation that you already have.

Dave Leake:

Yeah. So the challenge is, ask God, what are you saying to me? Now, act on it immediately, and maybe just even in the next three to six months, begin to ask God, what's your assignment? What I want to hear? Well, my personal interest is, is, if anybody in the next few months feels like you begin to get an assignment from God. Maybe it's not even a huge, crazy, massive 100 church kind of thing, but it's like, oh, I felt like I heard God tell me this. That's a big step.

Jeff Leake:

Dave Lee, 12 year old word, yeah, right. Like, this, is this God? You want me to do this? Yeah, I do. That's all. It doesn't have to be the 100 church words. I'm so advanced, because at that point in time, I had really matured a lot of ways. Yeah, right, right. Most of the times it's simpler than that. So if

Dave Leake:

you feel a hunger on the inside, I believe that's from the Lord. That's not something that you can just get yourself. God has to give that to you. If you have a hunger, that's the Matthew five 600 hunger and thirst for righteousness. Begin to seek God. What are you revealing to me? And then God, what's your specific will for my life? And if you do hear this, we want to help you. One of the things that we do at Allison Park church is we want to help send and launch people into whatever God has called them to. Maybe it's just even you're here, staying in your local context, but it's something small, but you feel pretty, pretty darn sure that God said that. We want to help you step into those things. So my challenge, ask God revelation act immediately. And if you get an assignment or you're hearing a specific word of God, the specific will of God, please let us know we'd love to celebrate,

Jeff Leake:

because I just tell you my particular bent, because I know the amazing things that come when someone partners with God on a specific assignment. I get really amped to help anybody, yeah, to step step out. That's what. That's why I love church, buddy. Someone comes, I feel like, I feel like God's called, like, Colin Robbins, and just recently, was sent from our staff to go to New York City. I feel God's called me to go to New York and plant a church. Okay, come on. Like, I think there's a spiritual reward that comes when I help other people fulfill their assignments. Absolutely get my own. Yes, yeah, help other people fulfill theirs. Wow. This is the adventure. Now, one more thing I'll just add, Dave, before I know we gotta close here. Some of you are distressed about your direction. You don't know what to do, and that can be turned into hunger and thirst after righteousness, so you get your breakthrough. But in that space, a lot of times, the devil lies to you and says you're not going to ever get one. You don't deserve one. God doesn't care about you. There's no design on your life. And that lie from the devil keeps you trapped and keeps you back from hearing what God wants to say to you. You have to shake that off. You gotta break that. Yeah, he does want to speak to you. Yeah, he's longing to tell you what your assignment is. He so the devil will try to twist this against you. Don't let him do that. Let the hunger you feel inside to hear a word from God drive you to the place of dependence on him, to where you finally hear from Him and stay in the game and don't let the devil take you out

Dave Leake:

of this is a side note and a weird note to end on, but I just, I've been realizing this so much recently. I feel like, often, hunger is not something that we can actually generate. Like, I feel like it's a gift that God gives to us and we have to steward that. It's like a little flame that gets lit, yeah. Like, Oh, I feel bothered by this. I feel like

Jeff Leake:

and the world contributes that to that, because we get impacted by so many things in life that leave us feeling hurt or broken or alone, and that can be translated into hunger, if you let it be in

Dave Leake:

what sense translated into a good. Hunger is what you make, yeah, like we see what's wrong well,

Jeff Leake:

and we're impacted, yeah, somebody's done something to us, or we failed in some way, or we're standing over a mess we created, and we're like, how do I get out of this? Yeah, and that oftentimes drives people to coping behaviors, rather than letting that translate that into a spiritual hunger and intensity to say, God, what I want in this moment? Is for you to redeem the situation and take me from here so the pain of life can be can become a hunger that drives you to the answers you need, if you'll channel it in the right direction. Yeah,

Dave Leake:

yeah. But I even, even just off of that, regardless as to the reason why the hunger gets generated, I think we have to see that as the beginnings of God prompting something because hunger isn't really something that we can have in our dead spiritual selves. It's something that the Holy Spirit, that's that's how we come to salvation. The Holy Spirit ignites a hunger in us to be in union with God, and then we come to the saving knowledge of Jesus, I think for any directional thing too. Actually, it's like the Holy Spirit that triggers that hunger. It could be through a past experience or trauma or something, but it's not always, but it's someone to steward, so

Jeff Leake:

don't let it lead you to despair, yeah, let it lead you to discernment, yes, and to pursuit and to pursuit. Yeah? God, I

Dave Leake:

won't let go of this until you tell me what you want to say. And I think he loves that. Oh, yeah, come on, like stay with I

Jeff Leake:

think in the moments when we're driven to that place is the times we get to know him the most. Yeah, and actually, what he really wants to reveal to us is even more than discernment of our assignment. He wants to make himself known to us absolutely. He wants to confide in us who he is. Yeah, well,

Dave Leake:

and that, that's that translation of, you know, using First Corinthians, 130 of Matthew five, six, blessed are those who hunger and thirst after righteousness. If you use Jesus that, blessed are those who hunger and thirst after Jesus, after his presence, for they will be filled. I think that's the way to satisfaction. That's the way to purpose. He's

Jeff Leake:

an amazing person to get to know. Yes, absolutely is. And partnering with him in the world nothing better than that, I'll tell you what. It's the best thing ever. Yeah, live your life to partner with God. That's the best thing you can ever do. It is

Dave Leake:

and it's accessible for you, and it's God's will for you. You know, your past doesn't disqualify you. God's only looking forward into what he's inviting you into. So we probably gotta close. I can keep going on my passion right now, but listen, we just, we want to invite you to join God's adventure, to step into partnership with him. So if you hear God, please let us know, you know, set aside some time. What are you revealing to me? What are you asking me to do? What's the last thing you told me? Step into the partnership. If you hear tell us we want to celebrate with you. We'll help you. If we can. We'd also love to ask you can actually help us? People? I've met a lot of people that have been saying recently, I'm not even sure how to leave a five star review. Hey, that's okay. There's a bunch of ways that you can actually help us to spread the word. So you can, you can, you know, comment on YouTube, if you're watching there, like and subscribe. I can subscribe to it. You can share this. You know, often there's that little arrow button on the bottom of a podcast or video where you click that you can text to somebody, even just word of mouth. Obviously, if you leave us a five star review on Apple podcast. We will shout your name out, because we appreciate that. But any way that you can help us to spread the word, help us to reach more people and do our ministry. So we would love to invite you to help us as well. So but give us more

Jeff Leake:

topics you want to hear about as we go through the

Dave Leake:

rest of the fall, please do thanks again for joining us. We'll see you guys again next time you.