Corporate Influence in Bourbon: How Industry Giants Shape Your Favorite Whiskeys

How are major corporations shaping the bourbon industry, and what does this mean for your favorite pours? Discover the intricate dynamics of corporate ownership in the world of bourbon as we take you through the influence of industry giants like Campari, Suntory, Sazerac, Heaven Hill, and Brown-Forman. We’re celebrating our milestone of 50,000 YouTube subscribers by offering a deep dive into how these companies are guiding the future of beloved brands from Evan Williams to Elijah Craig. Your feedback has been crucial in shaping our journey, and we look forward to more engaging discussions with you.

Join us for an in-depth exploration of the histories and strategies of key whiskey brands. From Sazerac's pride in Buffalo Trace to Beam Suntory’s innovative blends, we discuss how tradition meets corporate strategy to create exceptional spirits. We shine a light on the importance of local grain sourcing and experimentation in Kentucky, bringing you closer to the heart of bourbon craftsmanship. Brown-Forman's contributions and the expertise of industry stalwarts like Greg Schneider are also in the spotlight, painting a vivid picture of the blend between old-school methods and modern corporate backing.

We also break down the complexities of ownership in the whiskey market, including Luxco's acquisition by Ross and Squibb and its impact on brands like Yellowstone and Rebel Yell. Explore the new offerings from Jack Daniels and Jim Beam that keep enthusiasts coming back for more. Plus, learn about the exclusive opportunities for collectors and the critical role of master distillers in maintaining quality amidst corporate shifts. As we wrap up, we remind everyone to enjoy bourbon responsibly and hint at future episodes where we’ll dive deeper into individual distilleries and their rich histories.

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:50

Hey Scotchy Bourbon Boys fans, this is Alan Bishop, Indiana's Alchemist of the Black Forest, so I'm tuning in here today to tell you all about the One Piece at a Time Distilling Institute channel on YouTube. If you're at all interested in the art of distilling whether it be home distilling or professional distilling, and the intense geekery that goes into that process, then check out the One Piece at a Time Distilling Institute on YouTube. I promise you're going to learn something you didn't know before about the arts.

Speaker 2: 1:21

We'll be right back and we talk songs, but we're telling the truth.

Speaker 3: 1:39

Yeah, we're the.

Speaker 2: 1:40

Scotch and Bird and Boys Raising the hail and making some noise. Yeah, we're the Scotch and Bird and Boys. We need to have fun and we hope you enjoy it. We need to have fun. Yeah, woo Woo.

Speaker 4: 2:27

All right, welcome back to another podcast of the Scotchy Bourbon Boys Tiny here tonight, here to talk about the corporate bourbon ownership that owns your favorite bourbons. There are so many different ways that this is happening, bourbons. There are so many different ways that this is happening, but I just wanted to. You know it's so what would you say, complicated these days, but we're also going to talk about coming up about how and why the corporations haven't racked. A lot of times when you go corporate with something that's a crafty type thing, it can rack. What's happening and, uh, what has happened in the bourbon world with corporations owning brands of whiskey? Uh, throughout from this, you know, throughout, you know time. I mean, uh, there are certain things that have been happening in the whiskey world and you just got to know that.

Speaker 4: 3:33

We're going to go over the different corporations and the brands they own. You might know this and you might not know this. There's a lot of stuff to cover, but we're going to cover the big guys. Now we're going to go over the general outline of them, but in the coming weeks we're going to isolate them on them, one at a time. Tonight we're going to kind of do the what would you say the layout or you know the storyboard on it. Talk about it a little bit, thank you Love the back shelf too. So tonight, while we're doing this, I will probably be sipping on a couple brands that you know that we're talking about and why we talk about it.

Speaker 4: 4:22

But remember wwwscotchiebourbonboyscom. For all things Scotchie Bourbon Boys I'm Tiny. For all things scotchy bourbon boys uh, I'm tiny. Uh, we also have glenn karen's for sale and also scotchy bourbon boy t-shirts, and we should be putting out, coming up, our next batch of bourbon balls. Contact me either through facebook messenger or, uh, send me a message on YouTube. That's great, I'll get back to you. We can set something up, we work it out. We send it shipping everything. It's kind of a cool thing. So then, also remember to follow us on all the social media formats Facebook, youtube and what the heck? Instagram. And then also all the major podcast formats mainly Facebook, youtube and what the heck Instagram. And then also all the major podcast formats, mainly Apple, iheart and Spotify. But Amazon has us and you also have what's the other one, pandora. So got that out of the way.

Speaker 4: 5:24

But make sure, no matter what, everything you're doing like listen, like listen, subscribe, comment and leave good feedback. Uh, we need that, especially if you listen sometimes on uh, if you're listening on apple, please give us some good feedback. That just helps more and more people find us. Uh, the one thing that did happen, uh, this week uh, we went to 50,000. 50,000. 50,000 subscribers on YouTube. A year ago I would have never thought this possible. 27.1 million views total between all of our media, between shorts and podcasts and special videos on the events that we do. So, you know, just check out the rest of the channel. That would be great. Yeah, all right, we got some good guys there Making some funny comments on YouTube. Let me check out. Okay, nice to see you, joe, thank you. And then also Timothy Winters A good bourbon to go with the Opus X.

Speaker 4: 6:47

I don't know opus x, I don't know the. I find that usually, when you're combining it, um, I would say that if you're talking about it, the general, I would go with woodford double oak with that. That would uh bring out the flavors that, um, I would I love in bourbon. I usually can't go wrong with that. All right, so with everybody out there, all the different brands, so many people have their favorite brands. Everybody has those recognizable brands Evan Williams, elijah Craig, the different brands that come from a specific company.

Speaker 4: 7:31

Now, when it comes to the major corporations, there are some really big guys, and we're going to talk about Campari. They make spirits. You're talking about Suntory. They're a worldwide company. Formerly just recently, it was Bean Suntory, now it's just Centauri. And then there is Sazerac, another family-owned corporation. So you've got Sazerac, centauri, you've got Campari, and then you've got Heaven Hill, which is building the brands like everything else, but they're family owned. This is a family owned Kentucky distillery that still has control over their brand. And then there's Brown Informant, and all of them, all of them create many, many different brands.

Speaker 4: 8:25

Oh, and then also, let's just go with the Bardstown Bourbon Company, because they're brands. Oh, and then also let's just go with the bardstown bourbon company because they're not only do they have their own brand, but they contract distill a bunch of brands. Now, that's a little bit different. They don't own them, they, they basically distill and age them for the people. Uh, and the different brands, and they do a mess of brands, um, at bardstown, but also, uh, they, they also own green river now, and green river does some contract distilling too. So you're looking at, uh, a brand like a bardstown bourbon company uh, contract distilling. But then they also bought the green river distillery uh, which was formerly ozzy tyler, and their stock, and now they're putting out the Green River brand.

Speaker 4: 9:11

Master Distiller is Aaron Harris. That's some fantastic bourbon I believe I did bring down. So you got Green River and then you've got the Bardstown Collection. This was the pick for the festival, but you got two different, you know completely different marketed bourbons owned by the same company, and that's what we're here to talk about. We're going simple here. This is a, but you know the company that owns that owned Bardstown Bourbon Company, the group. It's sold. And then I didn't go far enough in the ownership group. It's out of Illinois and I should just. Am I lucky enough?

Speaker 4: 10:06

Yes, I am, I'm going to grab my glasses here and see if I can pull out. I don't believe it. I don't believe it's on here, but it could be Owensboro Green River. Yeah, that one is not there. And is it on the Bardstone? Let's see, clever too. Barrels warning. I know the group, but it's not just, it's just not ringing about. Maybe they'll come up. I'll be able to figure that out as we go on the podcast. But so there's one example of different bourbons, completely different bourbons in my opinion Good bourbons, but owned by the same corporation. I should here. Let's just, I'm going to just look it up. All right, that's an easy one to do and I might as well do it. All right, here we go.

Speaker 4: 12:15

There we go. It is owned by Pritzker Private Capital. That's what I wanted to know, like I said, alongside members of Bardstown, and they've done a good. You know, ever since Pritzker's had it, I have not seen a. I've seen the high quality come out of Bardstown and then they purchased Green River. So there's, there's one example. All right, so I was able to get the Pritzker. Let's see we've got.

Speaker 4: 12:51

Yeah, all right, thank you for the stars, joe. I appreciate that. Then, yeah, anybody sending stars definitely appreciate. Now, I've got to get this on the YouTube. All right, we should be able to come up with I'm hoping for what would you say on the chat for everybody? We should be able to come up with, uh, the super chat coming up. I'm hoping for that. I'm trying to set that up. But now that we're watching uh youtube comments and also uh watching uh the comments on facebook, I, you know that's something that is new. So doing this myself isn't this isn't the funnest to do it. But here we go, all right, so let's take the next company Um, I'm going to get that right here and it's going to be the Campari group.

Speaker 4: 13:49

Now, campari is a worldwide owner of spirits, but they only own one spirit and and it is Wild Turkey. But your brands are of Wild Turkey. You've got Wild Turkey. You've got Rare Breed, which is a barrel strength. You've got Russell's Reserve from Wild Turkey, so you've got the full line of Wild Turkey owned by Campari. But Campari owns a Scotch, glen Grant. They own Canadian whiskey, forty Creek. They own some.

Speaker 4: 14:26

Campari owns Sky Vodka, the Kabu Wabu Tequila. They also own a sparkling wine, cinzano, and a Mondoro. So there you go. And then they own Rum, which is the Appleton Estate, kingston 62, lamoni, torrey's Rivieres and Ray and Nephew All different rums. And then they own a Mezcal, montalobos. And then they own liqueurs Amaro, ancero, cinar, frangelico, grand Marinere, uzo, 12. I mean, so you're looking at this company that distills. I mean you're talking about Grand Marininer, you're talking about Uzo, you're talking about Ancho, amaro, um, and then also they own Aperol. So, um, they own a lot. So this company once again purchased um and has owned wild turkey for a while, again purchased and has owned Wild Turkey for a while.

Speaker 4: 15:54

But what's the unique thing about owning Wild Turkey is they have not Naresh cheers, they have not seriously changed anything. You've got Jimmy Russellsell and now bruce russell, uh, overseeing the operations out of, out of uh kentucky. Now we're just gonna. We'll get into this in a little bit once we go through. So that's campari. Now, when you go to the next one, which is heaven hill distillery, um, heaven hill just purchased uh widow jane uh, out of new york, uh. They also produced the heaven hill brand, which they have bottled in bond grain to glass, uh.

Speaker 4: 16:28

And then they have the, their heaven hill heritage collection and then which is, I believe, that one, they've got heaven hill 17 years and they've, you know, they've got so many things through the Heaven Hill brand. But then you've got McKenna 10 year, you've got the Bernheim Wheat Whiskies, regular, and whatnot, and then you've got Rittenhouse, rye, larceny and also Old Fitzgerald, plus. Other brands that they have are Evan Williams, elijah Craig, mellow Corn. So they produce this company, this corporation, which is family owned. But you got to say that they've gotten into the corporation aspect. They had a fire in at one point where their rickhouse caught on fire. It trickled down, burned down the distillery and they've been distilling in Louisville ever since. But they've also distilling in Louisville, have now been building a distillery in Bardstown, been building a distillery in Bardstown. So if anything being owned, they've kept their ownership internal, you know between the brothers, and they also do the Five Brothers brand. If I'm not mistaken, that's another brand that they produce. Yep, there's Five Brothers. Like I said, elijah Craig, evan Williams, they've got all the different ones, single Barrels, Evan Williams, 1783. I mean, they've got so much going there.

Speaker 4: 18:07

The Heaven Hill brand is unique but it's run in a corporate way, probably because it's family-owned and been in Bardstown forever. They are almost run even stricter than what they would a normal corporation, because they don't have those corporate dollars coming in. Their money is generated from their business completely. There's not a lot of extra, uh you know, money coming from outside. So that's, that's the uh, the other big guy. And then there's the Sazerac brands. Now Sazerac is a really really, um, unique company in my opinion. Uh, they're, they're New Orleans based, but their, their main distillery would be Is Buffalo Trace. But these are the brands that they produce. And then they also own Barton's 1792, and that's their other brand. And we've had Ross Cornelison on the master distiller. There it's a little different. 1792 is not open to the public, but Sazerac has a Sazerac rye and a Sazerac cognac. But then they've got their Buffalo Trace brand. They've got their Wheatley vodka, eh Taylor. They've got George T Stagg, they've got the Pappy Van Winkle line. The Pappy Van Winkles are still directly related. They produce it there Weller's, the Weller line, and then they've got 1792 Barton's, which everything that Barton's produces, that's Sazerac.

Speaker 4: 20:00

Now we got the Blanton's and I'm going to pull this Blantons out. Blantons is produced and distributed out of Buffalo Trace, but it is owned by a different company, the company that Sazerac. That company, I believe, is it right here, um is age international, but originally, uh, it was a japanese company, um takaro's shuzo corporation ltd. Acquired age international and then took it over, so and then became age international. So that is actually the brand.

Speaker 4: 20:45

Now I could share the screen. Let's share this screen right here. All right, I should pick it there. It is all right, we're gonna go to share screen right now so I can show you, okay. So then that's what. That's what blanton's is, and everybody would think that Blanton's was owned by and I'm going to so one of the cool things.

Speaker 4: 21:08

So right now we'll take a little bit of a break and pull this out, because this week not only did we have this awesome event with Freddie last week, freddie Johnson coming up, but then on thatiday there was a drop in the state of ohio which consisted of blanton's gold blanton straight from the barrel and elmer t lee all sazerac products in the state of ohio. For the reason the state of ohio is on, what would you say, fire, um, you're looking at that. So there's the Blantons. I was able to pick up this Blantons straight from the barrel. So while we're going over this. I'm going to pour myself a little bit of it. Then there's, it also makes Sazerac, makes Southern Comfort.

Speaker 4: 21:59

You've also got the Buffalo, the Handy and Schiller. Uh, buffalo trace, pre-mixed, old-fashioned. You've got merchants exchange bitters. You have old fire, copper, vintage. You've got a rum, jung and wolf. You've got port whiskey, cognac, lib, legacy, defords, the last drop, distillers. So the last drop is like a blend, expensive bottle, expensive bottle. You've got eagle rare. You've got mr sam, which is a whiskey legacy, um, you've got caribou crossing, you got the sir, the barrel, select, and you've got the Legacy DeForge which is a vodka.

Speaker 4: 22:46

They also produce, I believe, sazerac Rye I said that and Sazerac Cognac. But they also make Rock Hill Farms. So they produce all this fantastic R brands. Is that what we're on? Let's see Sazerac, deforest, sazerac brands, let's just go, let's just go Brands. They're refined. I think that's exactly what I just went through I was looking for. So the company Sazerac owns Buffalo Trace. So, once again, why does a big company like this, how do they keep? You know everything the way it needs to be kept? Now there is the centauri company, which was beam centauri, which produces, um, it produces centauri japanese whiskey, um, very many um japanese whiskeys and I'm gonna switch over here real quick and I'll switch back. I'll just quick go to, is it?

Speaker 4: 24:10

oh I got yep, there we go and they, they basically produce all the jim beams, repeal batch, the bourbon cream, old tub jim beam. They produce bookers, they produce knob creek, the centauri group. But once again they even team up with uh the beam, uh, with fred and freddy beam, to make the legency brand, which is a combination of japanese and you know, fred and Freddy distilling how they go about things and how they age things and everything and produce a whiskey. That's a combination between the two. So it used to be Beam Centauri, now it's just Centauri. It used to be Beam Centauri, now it's just Centauri, but it is the ownership group. Basically lets the seventh and eighth generation of Jim Beam, fred and Fred. Fred and Freddy know, keep doing what they're doing now to do it with the corporation. Both of them will say it's not an easy thing, but they but they are of. Them will say it's not an easy thing, but they but they are. They know what their, what their great grandfather and great great grandfather wanted and they keep that tradition alive.

Speaker 4: 25:36

Uh at uh the beam company and they produced fantastic amounts of whiskey, uh, and built and remodeled and everything because they have the power of some Tory being some Tory behind them and, honestly, what they do there is is so it's just like what they do at Buffalo Trace. It's because the people that work there are Kentuckians that live in the community and have pride in what they do. Now they might have a lot more money backing them and they might be able to produce more, and they've got that set up, are part of history, uh, and then have been hired that have been trained um by former master distillers or former family members. I mean, the beans are and are are in almost every single distillery. Now, what you might not know is that centauri also owns maker's mark. Now, power. What is good for today is I'm having some blanton straight from the barrel. That's a good one, and then I might finish up with a beam product that I've got here. But so there you go with the with, with um beam, some tori, uh, they give them the power to produce, but they're producing. They're buying grains in kent, produce, but you're producing. They're buying grains in Kentucky. They know how to do this. They're growing their own grains, they're doing unique, unique whiskeys that they age and experiment in warehouses. They have the power and to go about doing it, but they also understand that marketing is still part of the foot, you know, putting your feet on the ground, going out and doing what Fred's dad and Freddie's grandfather did, booker, to revive the industry. They went around, they go around and talk, they do talks, they do dinners. They don't, it's a passion. They almost don't ever stop working. I mean they might go on vacation and that type of stuff, but they're never stopping working and they're able to keep doing this because again, we'll get to it in a sec.

Speaker 4: 27:53

Then you got Makers Mark, owned by the same company and the same thing. Makers Mark has the support. They've remodeled, they've done everything, they've got beautiful grounds, everything's been. But the Samuels are still involved. They make some really, really good whiskey and we got to when we were having dinner with Stephen Fonte in the I want to say it was the old Louisville area where New Lou was. In that area we were able to meet Bill Samuels and then also his son, and I'm just going to say the family aspect of being still involved isn't something that normally happens. When a corporation buys you up, the story might continue, but the people don't. But when it comes to bourbon, there's still a reason. Now the last one that we're going to talk about is brown and foreman. Now, greg schneider uh worked at brown and foreman. He was start with seagrins, it turned into brown and foreman. But let's just go over a couple things. Brown and forming is uh when it comes to whiskey.

Speaker 4: 29:06

There's so many things, but there are three different brands that are that you'll recognize woodford reserve, old forester and jack daniels. Jack daniels is the number one selling american whiskey in the world. The number one selling American whiskey in the world, the number one selling bourbon in the world is Jim Beam and although it's Jim Beam has closed the gap, it's still not really close but it's getting there. But that's what Jack Daniels is as far as sales of whiskey. But that's owned by Brown and Farman. But then you've got your old Forrester brand, which came out with their whiskey row and they've got all different expressions and they do. Now. I will have to say Jack Daniels wasn't really on the ball while all this was happening, but they are now. They've got 10 years, they've got 12 years. I mean, they've got single barrels, barrel proof've got, um, you know, single barrels, barrel proof. They've got a whole mess and they kind of do a good job. Now they got the triple, I believe. I actually, no, I might have put no. There, it is jack daniels and it's stop share. There we go, I'm back, we're, and then I can pull this up right here. Um, maker's mark is also right. James maker's mark is. We were talking about that now. Um, jack daniels, um, you know, produces now a triple mash and they produce a bottled in bond, all stuff that they didn't do before. So I mean, there's a lot of different type things that are going on. And then you got Old Forrester, and then Old Forrester, and then you've got Woodford Reserve. You know, you throw in Woodford Reserve, again all owned by one large corporation that's producing a lot of whiskey. Now, well, the last that we're going to talk about is we're going to talk about Limestone Branch and Yellowstone, and then Luxco, which is Rebel. Yell, it's Rebel, it is there's hold on. It is there's hold on Ezra Brooks brand, I mean. And then also they put out the Blood Oath, and Lux Roe is a great distillery, great place, but they're all owned by now.

Speaker 4: 31:39

This one I got to. I'm going to do this right now. I said I was going to do it. I know what it is. It's MGP, but MGP is now. Why is it doing that? I should be able to just go here. Am I doing something? Am I doing something? No, all right, plus, let's just go here, and then I'm gonna do this. Hold on, there's something going on that I can't well, that one's not working. So, um, I'll do this one. I don't care, that's crazy. Let's call it up here. I can do that there. It is right there. Uh, who makes who?

Speaker 4: 32:39

who owns luxco. Let's just go like that Luxco Return. Now here we go. It says MGP. That isn't even funny. Mgp. Wow, that is crazy. Let's say MGP, new name Okay, so they went back to their old.

Speaker 4: 33:14

It's called Ross and Squibb. I don't know why, I can't remember. And it's funny because that's where Ross Cornelison used to work, so they must've named it after him after he left. But anyways, uh, it's ross and squibb, uh, mgp. Now this is a channel I can get behind. Thanks, man, I appreciate that cool.

Speaker 4: 33:35

Uh, this is, uh, ross and squibb. They own luxco, they, they're MGP, so they also produce a lot of brands. There's a lot of MGP juice out there that they distill for. They were number one in bringing brands in where people could buy their distillate aged and produce a whiskey brand. They had programs for that to start your own whiskey brand, and a lot of people did. Penelope is one of them that hasn't since then been bought back by Ross and Squibb. Now, ross and Squibb was the original distillery before Prohibition and then, once Prohibition, they reopened as MGP and now they're back to naming themselves ross and squibb. All right, so that's ross and squibb is out of indiana. They purchased, they have been purchasing kentucky um distilleries. Uh, when you're talking about luxco pretty big that's, um, that's lux, row that's, and they've which then was owned. They owned let Co owned the Yellowstone brand that was made at Limestone Branch. So in that purchase it was all put together.

Speaker 4: 34:52

Now what is the key? There's a couple things. Why let's just talk about this and that's what I wanted to talk about tonight, what I want to cover we'll get this into more detail on thursday, into each individual distillery and a little bit of history behind each one. We'll do it with sazerac, we'll do with jim beam, when they were purchased by corporations and when they became what they were um, and whether they started that way, like what you're talking about, heaven hill in the 1950s and where there are. We'll just go into one at a time and cover their brands and do that. Now I'm going to have some fine Sazerac which is made by Sazerac but is also not owned by Sazerac. That Japanese company wants to make sure that enough of Blanton's goes over to Japan. That's why they bought it. Now this is so good. I'm just going to tell you I'm not a fan of regular Blanton's but the straight from the barrel, it's what I made bourbon for Now.

Speaker 4: 36:08

I believe Blandinson, taylor, colonel Taylor, which I love, have the same uh mash bill. But what's different about this barrel strength is it was in Rickhouse H but the caramel aspect of it and then the complexity and then the viscosity of this barrel proof was crazy. We are talking 128.8. That's like getting close to almost 130. This was put into the, it was bottled, it was dumped 10, 9, 23. So last october, um five. Let's see barrel 514, warehouse h, and it was. Let's see 31, 31. I need to look at this with my now. What's really cool. I really love the bag on this. It's like a leather bag. This bottle is not cheap. I believe it was $159.99,. 64% Rick, number 31, warehouse H, from barrel number 514, and the dump date was 10-9-23,. From barrel number 514 and the dump date was 10-9-23.

Speaker 4: 37:40

I don't believe there's an age statement on this Unfiltered, uncut and bottled straight from the barrel Bottle number 42. Sur surgeon general's warning. And let's see straight from the barrel bourbon. I'm going to look at a quick look at this. That is why it says that this wine measures each barrel until it is aged to perfection and is deemed worthy of Blanton's label. That is why our bottle carries no age statement, just the hand-marked information seen here, and that is why Blanton's is to the bourbon what the finest single malts are to scotch and rarest cognacs are to brandy a sour mash whiskey of a body, okay, and chart character unequaled by any other blends, you know, okay. So the straight from the barrel, though, is absolutely delicious. It it hits all the notes I want and has all the complexity that I need.

Speaker 4: 38:46

Um, yeah, geez, you're, you're, you're correct there. Um, gage, uh, they don't. Well, eagle rare 10, you know we could get into eagle rare has that age statement, uh, but, like you said, anything else, like taylor or you know they're, but you got the eagle rare. That does have the age statement, but they do. They don't put it on because they do a lot of heating and cooling of their distilleries, warehouses with steam heat, which is something that people would call rapid aging. They don't call it rapid aging, they just make good whiskey. That's what they do there. So the last thing let's just get into.

Speaker 4: 39:33

So as bourbon became bourbon, the United States government had classification of whiskey. They were classifying what is bourbon and whatnot. But in 1964, yeah, gage, I love Straight from the Barrel too. This Straight from the Barrel. This one was fantastic. I mean I just you know it's a single barrel, it's Straight from the Barrel and it's just. You can get some good and bad ones, but this one is on the level of almost perfect for whiskey, of what I love. It drinks the way I like it. It smells you pour it and you can smell it in the room. It's fantastic. But in 1964, congress got together and they did kind of get together because of what scotch and Irish whiskey had done in the past. It's like you can't have anything called scotch that's not from Scotland. So they wanted to say that bourbon had to be made in the United States. So they made a resolution saying that bourbon had to be made in the United States.

Speaker 4: 40:47

So they made a resolution saying that bourbon had to be made in the United States and then they gave some other rules of what made bourbon 51% corn. They said that it also couldn't come off the still any higher than 160 and it couldn't go into the barrel any higher than 125. Now it could come off the still at 125 and go into the barrel at 125. That's not a problem. It could come off at 115 and go into the barrel at 115. Those are no but. And then also it had to go into a new charred oak container. So it didn't say anything about how long it had to be in there. So to be bourbon. Now they caught, they threw this end. Uh, they made a kentucky straight bourbon and then they also have bottled in bond, and bottled in bond is got to be aged at least four years. It's a hundred proof. And it has to be aged in bourbon with the bourbon rules aged in uh bonded, uh warehouse that was stamp bonded by the government. Uh, that's, that's bottled in bond.

Speaker 4: 42:01

But um, the thing about that resolution is it saved the industry, in my opinion. For instance, I live here in canton, ohio, uh, okay, so gage is saying they make great whiskey, smells like a field of flowers to me and caramel sweetness and good buffalo trace rarely ever. Yeah, you're 100 right gage. Um, I'm glad that you're talking on on youtube, I think you're. This is now that we're doing this. It's really kind of cool.

Speaker 4: 42:33

Uh, jamie, have you? Did you get you? Did you get a straight from the barrel? I'm not sure if you did, but if you did, I'm hoping, because the state of ohio had some really unbelievable opportunities last week. Um, uh, freddie was up and there were bottles through lottery at five, six different uh locations across the state liquor stores and you were able to. A lot of people were able to get an eight thousand one hundred dollar that's including tax a bottle of the weller millennium or the $3,000 including tax. Uh, bottle of uh eagle, double, double eagle, rare eagle, double rare eagle, double eagle, rare. One of the one of those uh jb said he wished he could have. I mean when, that, when that, that that I was able to. I was so happy to be able to get that uh straight from the barrel.

Speaker 4: 43:32

Uh, when I found out about it, uh, that Friday morning, when that email hit uh, and then uh, so these, these, these rules that Congress made up, uh, which you know. It's really kind of cool because, as jimmy russell says, you could take a oak bucket, you could char the inside, you could fill it up with white dog distillate that's made properly with 51 corn and cereal grain at least 51% and then you could walk it across the room, dump it into a bottle and it's bourbon. Now I don't know how it gets young bourbon, but you wouldn't be able to use the bucket again. You couldn't then walk it across. It's got to be a brand-new oak charred container. The barrel is what everybody goes by. Those are. You know, there's huge amounts of barrel companies producing these barrels. There's just like, if you go to Kentucky, there's just so many rickhouses, from Bardstown Bourbon Company to Heaven Hill in the Bardstown area and Jim Beam plus Barton's. Just from 2019 till now, five years, the amount of rickhouses that are existing in the Bardstown area and then also into the Frankfurt area is just amazing. How much whiskey is being. You know they're. They're rising up to the demand, and then there's so many new places coming on.

Speaker 4: 45:09

But these corporations were buying the distilleries. They bought beam, they bought Buffalo trace, they based or started it. Heaven Hills held on to theirs. But you know, ross and squib came in and bought Luxco. Some people build them to be bought, you know. But at the same time they're all you know what they're they're making. They're buying these distilleries. One they're, they're from Japan. These companies they're, I believe, campari's, from, I want to say, italy. Uh, then you're, you've got all these international companies coming in and buying up the bourbon distilleries.

Speaker 4: 45:54

But they've got to keep them in the United States. They can't move them, they can't make it in China, they can't make it in Europe to be called bourbon and that's why they're buying them, because bourbon is the hot commodity right now. You've got to keep them right here in the United States. So with the aging climate of Kentucky you wouldn't want to move it.

Speaker 4: 46:19

So, like I was saying just before, here in Canton Ohio the Hoover vacuum started and became the number one vacuum in the world I mean the best quality made vacuum. People here were so proud of it but there was no referendum saying that vacuums had to be made in the united states hoover vacuums or whatever vacuums and they basically were bought up. Um, they basically were bought up by another company and then made in China. You buy a Hoover vacuum and it's not even close to what it used to be. And the thing is is by them doing that resolution saying it had to be made in the United States and it had to have these rules, they've kept the quality of the whiskey way up. Now I'm here to say that I think that the aging climate of the last couple years we've had cold winters, but not too cold winters, and we've had hot summers, so the hot summers really absorb, but we get cool nights and hot days.

Speaker 4: 47:29

Um, and it really, because what happens to bourbon in the really cold winters is it comes out of the barrel, it's not in the wood and it just sits there during that really cold time. So that is an unproductive time for a distillery. As far as in the aging process now, buffalo trace, sazerach, they basically have been heating their warehouses in the winter so that it's just not sitting there doing nothing. This is another reason why I really believe the quality of the spirit is is damn good, uh, but what you have now is you have these kentilleries. They ought to make a lot more. They're making it for the world and they basically have to get bigger and bigger, but they're maintaining their history. Even Harlan Wheatley was trained by Elmer T Lee, who was trained by Albert Blanton, who was trained by George T Stagg, who was trained by george t stay, who was trained by you know with um colonel, um taylor, I mean you just go right there down the generations, um producing fantastic whiskey and uh, you know, and the pappy van winkles, you know all that.

Speaker 4: 48:46

It's all still here, owned by large corporations. But it behooves the large corporations to not only keep the story the way it is but use the people who are making it. These people are proud of what they make. They've been doing it really well and that's really kind of a cool thing that they've got going on. And that's what I wanted to talk about.

Speaker 4: 49:11

You've got these corporations, but why haven't they wrecked bourbon? Now some will say they have. I mean, you're going to have some, but in my opinion, overall what's in the bottle is pretty damn good right now and I understand you taste stuff from the 70s. It's different. There's not much you can do about it. The corn's going to be a little bit different. The way they produce grain is a little bit different. They are producing on mass scale, bigger than they were, but at the same time we still have not hit prohibition production of whiskey. In the united states that it was pre-prohibition, so that's a really kind of cool considering there's only two billion people probably on the planet back then, and now we have about eight billion on the planet and they, they were drinking a hell of a lot of whiskey, that's for sure. So all right, uh, let's see.

Speaker 4: 50:09

Whiskey thieves. Bourbon needs winter as much as summer. I agree that it needs some winter, but sometimes when it gets really super cold, you know I, but I think that the winters in kentucky, now, those mild winters, they do the, they do the diligence that you need, but it's getting the aging process as far as the in and out of the barrel to do a lot more stuff. Let's see. I wonder if the angel's share is about the same. What happened there? How did I lose that? What did I do to lose that Right as she said that? How did I lose that? What did I do to lose that Right as she said that? Okay, I wonder if the angel's share is about the same with the cold, dry air. All right, so the angel's share?

Speaker 4: 51:02

I would say the people at Whiskey Thieves understands the angel's share more than us. There is a certain amount that evaporates out, either water, or there's a certain amount of water, but just think about it. Let's just say the longer that it. You know, you've got 20 year old barrels, 23 year old barrels of bourbon, in the Kentucky heat. Yes, a lot of it evaporates, either the water or the alcohol, depending on where you're storing it in the rickhouse. You can also store it on the lower levels, which basically gives it a little bit more time in that barrel to not absorb as much stuff going on. But just remember, those barrels are being tasted and tested all along the way and when you start out with 53 gallons in my opinion of distillate, you lose some of it.

Speaker 4: 51:50

It but all the angel share isn't always. I think it's partially. The angel share is the thieves, the whiskey thieves, uh. Then we have, um, them on there. Um, I think some of it uh goes by in the fact that you don't lose as much to the angel's share as you might think. A lot of it goes out a barrel, uh, through the whiskey thief while they're tasting, and you know setting those barrels up. I mean, when they send out samples of a barrel to people for barrel proofs, you know they're pulling whiskey out to do that, and then the same thing when they're testing it to see where they're those barrels are they got to pull some out and then the next year they test them as you go. So you're gonna lose some of that to the testing process, which is also considered angel share. So there you go, as far as that.

Speaker 4: 52:48

All right, try texas whiskey versus kentucky whiskey. Yes, um, there's no doubt there's a difference in that hotter climate, I still think, uh, and it's drier in texas, I mean, we have a certain amount of humidity. But I really think also in Kentucky. You're talking about the grains and you're talking it's not just the, you know the, the Vegas, the Vegas will suck it out so fast you don't even know. It also comes down to the time it takes.

Speaker 4: 53:23

You know six, seven years is the sweet spot for me, and you get in a little bit, you know, know you could go up to about 12 right there, and after that you start to get unless it's a spectacular barrel, you really start to get the woody, oaky tastes of those tannins and some people love that. I'm not saying they do or don't, but just like some people love scotch, I mean that smoky stuff isn't. Yeah, I mean that's just aging as fast as you can, no winter, I just you have to cut that off and the time spent in the barrel might only be three years to get to the same level in the barrel, that that those seven years were able to slower, give you more of the flavors of the barrel, opposed to the three years where it's just whipping out, whipping it out. I agree with what you're saying there.

Speaker 4: 54:21

So the fact that you know, that the corporations all were able to come in and do what they needed to do but then become an ally to the distillery and allow them to do things. I mean what the the beams are able to do with their new distillery, the james b beam distillery name, or the fred no distillery. They're now um revamping the booker no to have an experience down in uh boston and you got, you know the regular distillery and all the experience. This stuff, the amount of money you need to do this is enormous and you need that help to do that. So there you go, Great podcast tonight. I want to thank everybody for joining us. Look forward to talking again Thursday night at 830 Eastern Standard Time. We will be going live again this week and so make sure you're with us then we're what was it Okay, yes um, open-beescom, their bourbon raffle is still open.

Speaker 4: 55:38

I want you, if you get a chance, go get a raffle ticket because it helps the kids. This is a charity cause. Um, it is 100 legitimate. Christy has done a fantastic job with it. The bourbons you got to go to open dash beescom and look at their second annual bourbon raffle and see what's available. So you got a shot at some amazing, amazing. You know you got a shot at some amazing, uh, bourbon. But also you're going to be helping kids. So even if you didn didn't you know, didn't win bourbon, I'd still ask you to help the kids. But go there, check out that raffle. What Christy's doing is amazing. She helps kids with learning disabilities get the help they need to get their IEPs in school and get. I mean, there's so much that they do to help families and kids. It's amazing. So check that out, open-beescom and get into their second bourbon raffle. Um, all right, so let's see.

Speaker 4: 56:40

Uh, gage says take into account that year, that year of grain corn and the oak trees, how long the trees have been there to make the barrel. All these things may vary from year to year. Oh yeah, they do, uh, but the, the replenishing of the oak and what they do and how the those just they do. It is um an amazing process for those cooperages and they stay diligent and they season that wood. Some people pay for it to even season four or five years, not just months. I mean it's really cool how they make the barrels, there's no doubt about it, but it all affects it. But also, I mean we've been just having these fantastic warm summers, warm summers, and it's just been perfect aging, in my opinion, for whiskey in Kentucky and here in Ohio it's you know. I just think that even the bottom shelf bourbons are better these days than they were, you know, maybe six, seven years ago. They're just producing this and getting really, really good aging weather.

Speaker 3: 57:54

Let's see, hey hey, michael, good to see you Glad that you're watching.

Speaker 4: 58:06

So I think that's I got that covered, all right. So we did that first part and then we went to Gage, but remember wwwscotchiebourbonboyscom for all things Scotchie Bourbon Boys. And then also check us out on Facebook, youtube, instagram and X, and then also all the social media podcast formats Apple, spotify, iheart check that out. And then also all the social media podcast formats apple, spotify, our heart, I heart check that out. And then, um, real quick, gage says that he's noticed that, um, the whiskey is very good and sweeter and I would have to agree those those hot summers from 2015 to 2024.

Speaker 4: 58:48

Um, the carmelite, taste this, this blantons, like I said, not a huge fan all the time of blantons, I got a bottle of blantons that I do like, but I got a couple that are too oaky, whatever. They don't do it for me, but this straight from the barrel is fantastic. But then again, um, remember, I think I said apple I heart spotify. But remember like, listen, subscribe, comment and leave good feedback. That helps us out. And I'm gonna start it tonight. Uh, good bourbon equals good times and good friends. Uh, remember, drinkibly, don't drink and drive. And live adventurously.

Speaker 4: 59:39

Little Stevo is going to take us out.

Speaker 3: 59:56

Oh, show me the way to the next whiskey bar. Oh, don't ask why. Oh, don't ask why. Show me the way to the next whiskey bar. Oh, don't ask why. Oh, don't ask why. For if we don't find the next whiskey bar, I tell you we must die. I tell you we must die. I tell you, I tell you, I tell you we must die. I tell you we must die. I tell you, I tell you, I tell you we must die.