Up My Hockey with Jason Podollan
Up My Hockey with Jason Podollan
EP.144 - Brad Lukowich on Teamwork, Trades, and Triumphs
Join us on a captivating journey into the world of hockey with NHL veteran and two-time Stanley Cup champion, Brad Lukowich. From his early days with the Kamloops Blazers to his transition into coaching youth hockey, Brad shares insights that paint a vivid picture of the sport's evolution. Listen as Brad recounts the unique camaraderie within the Blazers, the strategic maneuvers of NHL trades, and the challenges young players face in today's competitive landscape. His reflections on embracing various roles on a team provide valuable lessons for aspiring athletes and hockey enthusiasts alike.
Through engaging anecdotes, Brad's experiences highlight the importance of teamwork and the impact of strong mentorship in professional sports. Discover how a winning mindset and the relentless spirit of the Kamloops Blazers fostered lifelong friendships and shaped future NHL stars like Jerome McGinley. Brad also delves into his post-NHL life in Dallas, where he continues to contribute to the local hockey scene, sharing updates on new arrivals and his personal passions beyond the rink.
Whether you're interested in the strategic intricacies of hockey trades or the personal growth journey of a professional athlete, this episode offers a rich tapestry of stories and insights. From navigating the rollercoaster of NHL trades to balancing personal passions with a commitment to the sport, Brad's narrative is both inspiring and informative. Tune in to learn how resilience, teamwork, and a strong player identity continue to drive success in hockey and beyond.
I think the amount of players that are out there that can play at a high skill level now is incredible. What you don't see as much is them playing together as a group. There's a lot of individual play, a lot of onus on the one guy, the top player, but that's how it is at the top level. Who's the best player? Toronto Maple Leafs they're going to spit a name out over here, so you've got your top four guys.
Speaker 1:A lot of guys are just really focusing on being in the top four versus trying to focus on back in our day, like I had no problem, focusing on being a role player guy, a guy that hit, like to fight, like to like to block shots, like to make passes, like to be a skill, like to set up the skill guy and be there for him. They don't really have that. Now it's I want to score every shift, I'm on the ice, I don't want to play defense, so my preparation is that way, and then when we put them into a challenging role of something that they're not generally used to, it becomes quite chaotic actually, that was two-time Memorial Cup champion and two-time Stanley Cup champion, brad Lukowicz, and you are listening to the Up my Hockey podcast with Jason Padolan.
Speaker 2:Welcome to Up my Hockey with Jason Padolan, where we deconstruct the NHL journey, discuss what it takes to make it and have a few laughs along the way. I'm your host, jason Padolan, a 31st overall draft pick who played 41 NHL games but thought he was destined for a thousand. Learn from my story and those of my guests. This is a hockey podcast about reaching your potential. My guests. This is a hockey podcast about reaching your potential. Hey there, and welcome back to the Up my Hockey podcast with Jason Padolan. I am your host, jason Padolan, and this is episode 144 on the docket and we are speaking with Brad Lukowich.
Speaker 2:Brad Lukowich is a long time NHLer, 658 games to his credit. He did win two Stanley Cups, one in which he got his name engraved on it and one in which he didn't yet still played eight games that season with the Dallas Stars in 1999. That was when he was first getting his feet wet in the league, and he went on to play for the Tampa Bay Lightning where he won his second cup. He also went to the Islanders. He was with the Devils, he was back with the Lightning, he was with the Sharks, had a cup of coffee in Vancouver and then ended his career back in Dallas. He also spent some time in the IHL and AHL and maybe as notable as his NHL career was his junior career with the Kamloops Blazers, where he was a part of the dynasty of major junior hockey that went to three, I believe three cup actually won three in a row. I don't think he was part of the first one. He won in 94,. He won in 95,. The likes of and we talk about it a little bit on the discussion, but Jerome McGinley might be a name you recall, shane Doan might be a name that you recall, darcy Tucker might be a name that you recall, and others Tyson Nash, jason Holland, strudwick, lukowicz himself the list goes on as far as the types of names that were on this Kamloops Blazers squad during that time when we were trying to win points off them in Spokane and quite a special thing they had there. So we talk about that time in Kamloops.
Speaker 2:Brad is now also a U15 head coach for a double A team outside of Dallas that is traveling across, you know, western North America. They were just up at a tournament in Vancouver. So now he is wearing the coaching hat after his years and years of experience as a player. He doesn't have a player on the team, he's just doing it for the love and wants to give back, and we definitely dip our toe into the waters of youth hockey and development and his philosophies and strategies around that, while we intertwine his career and some of the lessons he learned with that. So yeah, luko is a great guy. He's one of those teammates that everyone recalls fondly maybe not so fondly if you were to play against him. He always played a hard-nosed game and made you earn every inch, and I think that was one of the things that was really respected about him throughout his time in the NHL and as a pro, and one of those things that he does recall as a Kamloops Blazer that was taught to him early how to provide value and how to gain self-esteem in knowing what that value is. And that was one of the undercurrents of our conversation here today Lots of lessons for the amateur player trying to get somewhere.
Speaker 2:Lots of lessons for the parents on the call, as usual, and hopefully also for coaches out there on what to place your emphasis on in your strategies in developing players these days. So not often you get a two-time Stanley Cup champion on the show, not often you get a two-time Memorial Cup champion on the show, and even rarer to have both combined in the same package. I wonder how many players in history have been able to do that there. Sure as heck can't be very many. It would be a very short list. So, yeah, feel grateful that you're here to listen to some lessons by Brad Lukowich, two-time Memorial Cup champion, two-time Stanley Cup champion and player of 658 NHL regular season games. Brad Lukowich, coming at you now.
Speaker 2:All right, here we are for episode 144, and I don't know what to call you. I mean, definitely a buddy, but an old adversary for sure. I mean, we battled in the corners a few times, but either way, friend and foe, brad lukowicz, welcome to the pod partner. Hey, thanks for having me. Man appreciate it. Yeah, tons of fun. We tried to do it. Like I said before we got on here. I forget, at some point it never worked out. And we've been, uh, we've been going back and forth on text messages, uh, and I was like let's do it. And it worked out today. So cool, yeah, um, so you're in dallas right I am.
Speaker 1:I'm down in dallas.
Speaker 2:I live just up north, about 45 minutes, in a little town, salina cool so Cool, so you decided to call Dallas home after you finished your career there.
Speaker 1:Well, when I married my wife back in the day, it was kind of one of those ones where you know there's a chance you can travel. But you know, being from here, I love Dallas and if we do leave we'll always have an opportunity to come back. So at the end of my career I really didn't know where to go and we decided to come back down here and fulfill that promise. And she's doing good and I'm doing good in the hockey world.
Speaker 2:So so glad we came.
Speaker 1:So she's a local dallas girl then she's from about 80 miles out, a little town called jacksboro um, because her dad still lives up there and uh yeah, so it's as far from drive from us. Our hour and 20 minutes we can be there, so cool how's the alumni community there?
Speaker 1:the alumni community is slowly growing. Actually, obviously, the, the timing of the of the years, right. So now that it's been there for 30 years, a lot of those guys that first came here went right home. Now, the guys that have made dallas a home of you know, that were kind of the original members. There's about 15 of us here, and then we also extend that out to the, the guys that didn't just play in Dallas, but maybe we're, maybe we're from here or played from another team and married a local girl or something like that, so they also are here.
Speaker 1:So we have also our, our NHL alumni guys here that we kind of share the space with, and then you know it's growing. We got a couple new guys, a couple new dads that have some kids in hockey with hammer, uh, alice hemski, and, and now with jordy ben kind of just hanging them up we've seen him at the rink. We got little, uh, justin cortenal here in town now too. So so those are the three newest guys. We got blake como recently, uh last year, you know, and then. So those are kind of our newest members right now.
Speaker 2:So if anyone wants to play us, we've got a few ringers, so it's uh, we're still, we're still, we're still pretty competitive right I was going to ask you, like some of the names that that are there, so those are a lot of names that people would recognize. Um that are kicking around and I and uh, I know because we talked before, but for those at home, you're supposed to be on a pickup game right now. So most of those guys.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they're out on the ice right now. I took I won the kind of like on the injured reserve. I guess I'd get fined if it was for real. No, I have a friend of mine that I'm very blessed to be buddies with. He works with Metallica, so he's he's kind of busy all the time and when he's home he does tattoos, so our schedules just kind of like with us. We had a chance where they crossed paths and I jumped in the chair and, not knowing, we had a skate today, so I'm just taking the precautionary. You know it's not a long-term injury, it's just a couple of days. You know, as you're older you got to take care of yourself would that be considered?
Speaker 2:uh, would that be considered a lower body injury or an upper body?
Speaker 1:it was a lower body. Uh, I've got a whole uh leg sleeve that I've been working on for about two years. So, um, I finally got her. I finally got a chance to. We're almost there. We got about probably one or two more visits.
Speaker 2:My buddy hammer uh, he does a heck of a job, so we're excited to get it done here, hopefully, hopefully the next next couple months so I had no idea we're going to talk about tattoos, but I do have to ask you. So I uh, 16 years old, playing hockey down in in spokane I don't know how or what, but like they let me go into a tattoo parlor and and got two tattoos. Actually one was sean gillum, after we won the gold uh for the world juniors, and then an ankle one, um, like typical at the time, right, like it's uh, holding the holding the hockey stick, right, you know so. But the one on my ankle, like I remember, was, I mean, I'll call it excruciating, like it was. It was a painful thing. The one on my thigh, not so much like anything for you there, with, with, with the leg tattoo, any areas more sensitive than others.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the back of the knee is a scorcher, uh, front of the knee is a scorcher, uh, and then that ankle area is really, really tough. So, like it was this, this was the the ending of mine. It was, uh, the inside of the, the calf and uh, and my shin, all the way down to the ankle, a couple turtles on there and it was uh, I felt every little bit. It was like they were, they were they're eating me, man it.
Speaker 2:that was a rough one real tough one today, crazy okay, so I'm not alone in that. Then I haven't had many tattoo discussions, but I just remember being like grabbing the, grabbing the, the uh place that I was lying on there and it was. It was tough, the ankle was, was, uh was a good one. Yeah, sure, that was right. Um, all right, man, you know what I want to start? I love going back. I do this every time, like I.
Speaker 2:You know, when we were younger, we didn't have a chance to look at anything online because there was hockey db never existed, or elite prospects or any of these scenarios and and so now you can go back and and look at players like yourself and see where you actually were and where you went and what the journey was like and um, pretty exciting, I mean, once we cross pass. I don't mean know how it was with you, but junior we were all together, we were all fighting for the same stuff and, you know, playing each other all the time, and then all of a sudden we turned pro and you kind of lost track of everybody. Really, you know, um, let's talk about that, the camels blazers, because we'd be stupid not to uh, it was probably one of the biggest destinies, or dynasties, I should say ever. Uh, and you were a part of it. Uh, just straight up, what was your first memory of that group and your time there in Kamloops? That?
Speaker 1:team. It's just such a special group. I remember all the stuff off the ice but a lot of times you say you don't remember the on-ice stuff. I do remember a lot of the on-ice stuff about how amazing Jerome was, how incredible Shane Doan was. Not only were they good, but they were tough, they were so focused. Doan was not only were they good, but they were tough, they were so focused.
Speaker 1:Like everything about that team. You, you kind of if anything was to be. You're not supposed to use the word perfect when you're a coach, but man, that team was perfect. There was everything about it. We were tough, we were fast, we were we. We loved each other, we were relentless. We do anything for one another. I mean, to this day, you know, give these guys a phone call, you know that the next guy would be there for them. Um, it was just, it was such a brotherhood. We always hung out with one another, we always stick up for one another. Um, just, a very, very special bond that you have and winning teams have that moving forward when you get into to, uh, to winning, even at the higher level.
Speaker 1:It's different at junior because you're going through a lot of things in your life in that time. You know there's a big transition, you know, obviously with just becoming kind of a celebrity in your hometown. You know you're a pretty big deal living in Kamloops. That team, that is a very coveted team by the city. It's owned by the city, so you're representing a lot more than just the just the Blazers, right? So Blazer pride meant the whole city was behind you and I when I mean that I don't people think people understand what that really means took down to the billets, to the Zamboni drivers, to the police officers letting us scream by to make sure that we're not late for practice, because if we were, then Don Hay was going to sit out, some of the best players, because he would do that. So you know, like, well, I hope that was so-and-so, because if not we're going to be late and the only light give a little little flash of the lights and we just keep on going and maybe nine guys in the car making sure you're not late for practice. But those are those things, those team bonding things, that now you, just you, you, every now, and then I'll just chuckle like how was cameron's like? And all this laughing, wait till I tell you this story, you know, and it's just those funny little things that happen, that they're just so awesome.
Speaker 1:And then it there's no doubt in our minds there was better teams, probably on paper that year in 94, because really ultimately we were building for 95 portland had a killer team, spokane had a killer team a little bit older than us too, right. So there was that kind of like, well, maybe maybe these guys are going to be good, but maybe they're just not there. And then in 94, at christmas, when, uh, when it all clicked for us and the guys from world junior came back and we kind of saw what we had in front of us, we just just kind of focused on ourselves, how we focus, on how we can make each other better. There's that friendly competition that you talked about earlier, that we had not even playing on the same team. Well, that resonated inside our walls where, you know, if I did 10 pushups, jerome was going to do 11. You know. And if Jerome did 11, then Shane did, you know, 12,. And as you're leaving the room, you look over your shoulder and there's Jerome McGinley making sure that he's doing two more. So he did 13, you know.
Speaker 1:So there's always that constant competition which you saw that and you wanted to be better. You also didn't want to let each other down. So to me that's what Cam's taught me, it's what drove me to be a winner and I believe that's why teams in the future wanted me around. That's where I learned it and it was just ingrained in me, like put the team first, team first, team first. Then think about yourself, because if you're not thinking about yourself and being the best part of your puzzle, then the team doesn't work. So that was kind the ingrained at a young age. Through, you know, I can go back to colin patterson and then don hay, through tom renny and all those guys. That was that blazer pride culture, you know. Moving to kalamazoo, hitch was a coach there so he brought that culture there then into dallas. So for me my transition that way was actually quite, quite easy right, wow, yeah, you touched on it.
Speaker 2:I'm making notes here as you go, like that, you you don't know what I assume I mean you you said there that what you had was special, right, and and it was. It turned out that it was, and it turns out that it was a gift of a lesson and all these other things. Yet at the time you, you weren't like, hey, this is a dynasty we're on right now or this is, you know, like you don't really recognize what it is until sometimes when you leave. And I know a lot of guys have come on and said you know, once you've seen that you want to replicate it, or at least you have an idea of it, but it's not the easiest thing to do, and there's so many factors that come into developing a culture like that in Kamloops and there's so many factors that come into, uh, developing a culture like that in Kamloops. And one thing I'm gonna I'm gonna trigger you with a little bit is when I was talking with Jerome on this podcast, where he was talking about his first year as a 16 year old there and uh, and how, at Christmas time, he he said he really did want to go home at times. You know, uh, he said the way that the culture was there was kind of the only thing that kind of kept him there, but it was also the thing that wanted him to leave, meaning that he had a hard time getting into games.
Speaker 2:You know Jerome again the future Hall of Famer I'm sure he was really good as a 16 year old, but he only played games. And he said there was a thing with Hazer that you know he'd maybe get three shifts in the in the first and two in the third, and then if, if, or two in the third and then if, or two in the second, and if the game was close he probably wouldn't play in the third. So he wasn't playing much even when he was in the lineup. Now, that was part of the ecosystem there. Right, that was part of of how the system worked, uh, and maybe that was part of the way that you're saying hey, team first, you second, like it's, it's brought in, push from within, all this stuff. But did you experience that as a defenseman as well? Like was there? Was there a, you know, a gestation period? Let's call it for you to become a, become a regular in that environment.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, he came in as a 16 year old and ultimately it's it's. It's actually quite understandable that a 16 year old would maybe take take a little longer and pay his dues a little bit longer. Where I came in as a 17 year old, so we were rookies together. I'm a year older, uh, but coming in um I. I went home as a 16 year old cause I wasn't going to play at all, so I went back to to Cranbrook, played there. So really, instead of sitting on the bench and doing that, I went home, played ton of ton, got a ton of points, got a lot of of fights, learned how to play a little bit against the older guys. And then when I came back, you know I'm I'm expecting to play 30 minutes a game, say three shifts.
Speaker 1:Like what is this? Like, dad, this, this is not fun. I'm not having a good time at all. How are you guys doing down in cranbrook right now? Oh, we're in first place, probably going to win the win the league this year, chance of going to the nationals. Like, well, you know you guys need a d-man like I. Come back there and light it up down there.
Speaker 1:No, no, just pay your dues. You know, just bide your time, things are going to be okay. This is all part of the process. Trust it, trust it, trust it. So you know, I think we all had those, those moments. But then again, those those moments that we had on the bus together, just talking to each other, it was just like man, let's just stick this thing out and see how it works out. Obviously, at the end of the day, it pays out for you. Now it's a little bit different. Now we all want the, the quick, so the quick fix.
Speaker 1:But that's kind of that what we went through. We still wanted it. We, we wanted the quick fix. We wanted to go in and play for Kamloops and be playing 30 minutes a night and be the ultimate, the best player on the team.
Speaker 1:It didn't happen like that and it was an understanding of that that some guys, some guys Park, come in first round pick oh, he's going to be something else and he walks in and you're like that kid, wait till he has to put some work in and see what it really takes. And ultimately, what is going to happen when he's the first star on Friday night and he only gets two shifts on Saturday. Let's see how he reacts to that. Some kids never come back from it, some players never come back from it. Those guys like yourself that make it through. That's the. That's the true test. So it was. It was very tough on on all of us at the beginning. We like and we had a bunch of jason holland was a rookie, struds was a rookie, I was a rookie. We're all trying to be in the lineup and the camels plays. We're all defensemen, all in our draft year, all trying to compete for that one position. So talk about hunger and then being a healthy scratch. It was pretty intense, extremely intense culture there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I love that you talk about what you just talked about, because the transition from that and embracing that culture, accepting that culture, is hard to do as a player. It was hard to do in 1995, it was hard to do in 1995 and it's hard to do in 2025. But now it seems like it's even harder for the players to really buy into that. Now, what's your philosophy on that? Just in general, like, do you think should a player be playing somewhere else and playing higher minutes, getting more touches, or should they be playing at the highest level they can be and fighting their way into that lineup? Is there a broad brush that you could paint with that?
Speaker 1:it's so situational. I mean for my, for my experience, it worked out amazing. For me. I mean, I went back to cranbrook, but look at the variables that are attached. It was my hometown, so I'm living at home. I've got, you know, the the support of the city that wants me to see me go forward. You know I played there in the past.
Speaker 1:I got an opportunity to be a number one guy, and also the guys that got sent down from kamloops that was back when the rocky mountain junior hockey league had an affiliation agreement they all came from kamloops. So the guys that got sent down from Kamloops that was back when the Rocky Mountain Junior Hockey League had an affiliation agreement they all came from Kamloops. So the guys I had to beat were right there. They're sitting right in the same room as me. I know those are the top prospects. They're the same age as me. I got to be better than those guys. So for me it was be better than him every night. So I loved it. I embraced, knew where the guys were, I got. It's tough. When you're looking. I wonder how so-and-so is doing in saskatchewan right now. You're not even playing against the same guys. There's no, it's now. You're looking. You're leaving that up to the scouts to to convince the general managers. Now it's up to you to go on the ice. Your competition's sitting right in front of you. Go, be better than that guy. So that's what I learned from it and and, to be honest with you, I kind of got lucky back then because a couple of the guys that came down from from uh, from cambridge to cranbrook they didn't like it too much, they didn't like being in cranbrook. They pouted a little bit, to put it that way. I mean, it's pretty typical to be to be let down, so maybe that's a better. They were a little bit let down and didn't just jump right back on the horse.
Speaker 1:Well, I remember coming back, we played the creston valley thunder that night and I lit it up. I think I had a hat trick and a couple like so it was right there like I'm gonna go, like I'm gonna be down here, I'm gonna be the best, I'm gonna score goals, I'm gonna fight, I'm gonna do everything they asked me to do and then I'm gonna go up there. So next year they can't put me on the bench, which they ultimately still do, but that was. It was great for me to go back. Now. Those other guys they came back to camp next year.
Speaker 1:I remember I remember 17 year old who were the first two guys I went after camp. Those two defensemen they were on the other team. I was on red, they were on green. I was going straight across the light, drop my gloves, grab the guy and just started pounding on him because that was my competition. Yeah, you know so that for me it worked.
Speaker 1:It was better to go back, play, get tougher, learn, learn the game versus sit in cam loops. Maybe, you know, be a grocery stick. You know, maybe I'm in the lineup three or four times a month and then when I am, I'm just a grocery stick sitting there. Now my confidence gets down. Maybe it's now it's the coach's fault, now it's, uh, maybe that someone else is on the team's fault that I'm not playing. Um, maybe it's my grades. I start making the excuses versus trying to find the solutions and answers.
Speaker 1:So for me, I was put in a perfect situation. It worked for me. It doesn't work for everybody. It doesn't work for everybody, but for those players, in my opinion, if you're one of those guys, that can ultimately, if you're a cusp player and you're going to be like, say, a seven and you can go down and be a one or a two. You go down and be that one and two and just dominate. Treat it like you're playing at that level Every time you go, prepare like you're at that level, eat like you're at that level, recover like you're at that level, focus and prepare. You do that. So when you get into that training camp next year, no problem. And that's how it was for me. It kind of happened naturally for me with the people that I was surrounded with Right.
Speaker 2:No, that's fantastic, and I like how you distinguish, because it is like there isn't. I mean, I asked you that, wondering what your answer would be. I don't think that there is one way to handle it. It definitely is, I think, personality dependent, you know. I think it's organization dependent too. Right, like, how do they handle their young guys? Like, what is the development path? Do they have an actual plan for them path? Do they have an actual plan for them? Is this something that they do consistently, you know, bringing younger guys? They have, they have a development plan for them and they always are playing a bigger portion next year.
Speaker 2:I think there's a lot of things you need to look at, cause, like you said for yourself, as a 16 year old, it was perfect to go back, but as a 17 year old, it wasn't. That was the time to step forward and that was the time to time to you know, to put, jump in the deep end and make it happen right and it worked out for you. Uh, I do believe that sometimes we rush and maybe we'll take it a step back to, maybe more like younger ages. I know that you're coaching now at a u13 or u15 level, uh, and parents are seems like they're always trying to catapult their kid into that highest, highest level. And sometimes when you're playing as a young guy with the older kids and you're not a top dog, I think, like at those younger ages, I'm like I don't know if that's the right call. Like I think if you can be in that top half, you know, when you do go up as a young guy, awesome, do it.
Speaker 2:But why? Why fight? Is my opinion at that age right? Like, grow the confidence, grow the touches, grow the swagger. There's going to be lots of years in hockey where it's going to be tough. You know what I mean. What's your thought on that? Do you think that sometimes we're chasing it a little too early?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean with the birth of these awesome hockey academies and you've got to give them credit. They do an amazing job. I've coached at them. They're fantastic. We've played against them. They just do an amazing job. You see how the players are getting together. We talked about that team bonding. You see that on a lot of those clubs now and I love the way it looks.
Speaker 1:For us down in Dallas area, something like that, we have a lot of kids that are chasing it outside the Metroplex trying to get that triple a, that extra letter, because we only have the one team here. We have the Dallas triple a and it's all of Texas. So a lot of people have the just from social media, from watching whatever they hear someone up in New York have the opinion of hey, if you don't have triple a by 14, you're never going to play. Well, I disagree with that. So what I try to do is give our guys the development, take them to different areas, take them to some spots that they haven't been seen before and give them an option or the opportunity to be seen by new scouts. So we just recently went to Vancouver knowing full well that we're a AA team going into a AAA. Well, we have a couple of AAA players. There's just well that we're a double a team going into a triple a. Well, we have a couple of triple a players. They're just not enough spaces for them but thankfully they do stay home, they do stay back. They stay back for us. They give us an opportunity to play at a really competitive level, especially locally and at the state level. We go to tournaments. We can be competitive at tournaments. What we'd like to see is these guys, more of them, staying home. That would be ultimately the best. You don't have to chase that, that triple a. Uh, we're going out and playing the same addict academies that people are leaving our hometown for and we're, you know we're competing against them. If we, if you, would have stayed home, we probably would have beat that team. So you know, like those are those, those are those attitudes like that we have here is stay home as long as you possibly can.
Speaker 1:If you have a good program and then support those programs, find out how you can help. If there's a way to volunteer, the way to improve the program like there's a lot sure, there's a lot of people out there with a lot of complaining stuff If you have some solutions and a way to help that program, then I, then I, then I think, as long as they're there, the development is the number one priority, then stick with it. If it starts to become a bit more of a, as long as we have 20 kids on the ice and we're paying our coach this, we're paying this guy this and we're going here, we're only going one tournament a year, but hey, we've got a great marketing scheme, we've got merch, we've got this and it becomes more of a brand versus a hockey organization or development, then I think you've got to maybe think twice about it. But there's so many good ones out there, man, there's some really good ones out there and some new ones that are starting up. That in some new towns, that CSSHL I mean you're up in the middle of it.
Speaker 1:I was in Coeur d'Alene there for the one year. I would go back there in a second. I absolutely love that league. It is. What they're doing for those kids is amazing. I love it.
Speaker 2:Awesome. Yeah, I know it's a great perspective there and I, I agree with you. I I'm personally still connected to community hockey, you know, I think it's a good thing. I think it's good for the cities that you're in, you know, I think it's good for the kids and the connections. I even it's good for the rivalries, right, I remember growing up and you know, being from vernon and wanting to beat kelowna and wanting to beat kamloops and, uh, you know, and just being connected to that whole idea of of, you know, being a hockey player from, from my hometown.
Speaker 2:I, I do like that. I think it's become much more regional in some ways. It's good right, because you have to have these zones and you draw from other, from other places. But just the idea about, like, hopping around and chasing the best team in some regards, which means the most wins, I just think that's not really the right way to go about it. If you are just trying to, you know, become a better hockey player, like that, uh, that always isn't the isn the quickest road. So we got to be careful what we're wishing for sometimes.
Speaker 2:Just going to take a short break from the conversation with Brad to say thank you to all those who reached out who are interested in becoming an ambassador or an affiliate for the Up my Hockey brand. Uh, it's an exciting time, uh, for me with the growth of up my hockey and with the willingness and desire and, frankly, the incapability of just myself to reach everyone with the ideology and philosophy of what up my hockey is, which is give players the mindset skills required to be the best versions of themselves on and off the ice and you will have better hockey players as a result. Super exciting, as I am at capacity and I need help in getting this message out in the geographic areas of North America, of North America. If you are a coach, if you are someone who has a network in an area that has influence, that wants to be a difference maker when it comes to the development of athletes, and you think it is the perfect time to get involved with mindset, you're passionate about hockey, you're passionate about people becoming the best versions of themselves and the best hockey player they can be, then by all means send me an email, jasonmyhockeycom, and see if you are somebody that should join my team.
Speaker 2:There are two ways to do it. You can either be an ambassador, that is, somebody who would understand the programming, someone who believes in growth mindset, in the personal empowerment of individuals to be their best, and you would be promoting the up my hockey programs in your geographic area. That is one just being an ambassador, talking about the brand, providing introductions and referrals. That is a great way to get these athletes to be the best versions of themselves. The other way is to be an affiliate, to be a coaching affiliate, to actually getting to work with me and to be able to coach the programs that I have developed to help the players yourself in the area. So there are two ways to do it. One is obviously a bigger investment and a bigger commitment. One is investing. Do it. One is obviously a bigger investment and a bigger commitment. One is investing in yourself. One is strictly investing in others around you, but a willingness to do that is welcome. I would love to hear from you Once again, jason at upmyhockeycom, and perhaps there will be a great fit Again. Check marks are a hockey network passionate about the game, wanting others to be the best versions of themselves and wanting to make a difference on this great game of ours. So if you have those qualities and if you have those differentiators, by all means I'd love to hear from you, and let's get back to the conversation with Brad Lukowich.
Speaker 2:And let's get back to the conversation with Brad Lukowich. I'm going to switch it back just to Kamloops a little bit. You mentioned Donor and Iggy and obviously those are two huge names that were there then, both Hall of Famers in their own right, but, goodness gracious, darcy Tucker was around there 700 game NHL yourself. You already mentioned Strudwick, jason Holland, nat Domicheli was like one of the top point guys in the entire league that didn't have as robust of an NHL career for whatever reason, but was an amazing junior like did you like, if you were to go back at that time, did you think that that donor and iggy would have been the players that they were then? Like over all the rest of that, you were surrounded by?
Speaker 1:I put bomb gartner in there too. No one about bomber was so good on the back end. It's unfortunate that his shoulders, you know, like they. He had that bad year and man, he was something else. All right, you can just go like he just did. You go through our whole thing. I thought all of these guys were going to do amazing things Randy Patruk, incredible goalie, steve Passmore, even like Brancher, you know. Then you got Bomber Fergie, keith McCambridge.
Speaker 2:Holly Shreds.
Speaker 1:Aaron Keller, tucker, nash, dooling, huska it just makes you laugh. I mean Louis Dumont, I mean there's so many guys that just were so good. And then so when, like I said, the 94 team, we knew we were good, but the 95 team, we were just like, oh boy, like this is something else. And then when we added players, we were like, but the 95 team, we were just like, oh boy, like this is something else. And then we actually, then when we added players, we're like, how do you, how do we do this? And when they came in, because you, you mentioned something there was a we, we were, uh, ranked second.
Speaker 1:Detroit was ranked first because they had, um, brian, berard and Allison, so they had a really good team and I think Hodgson was the goalie, so Ticker, yeah, they had Ticker in that. So they had a good group and that was kind of the team that everyone had their eye on. That everyone thought was going to knock us off. And then even in our league they had you know, there's some players like McCabe. You know like they put all that group together think it was in brandon that year they put a heck of a group together to try to with morrison and all those guys. So you think about the actual teams that played in that memorial cup and the players that played in that end, and the 95 team. Like darcy tucker, you love playing against him, didn't you? Yeah, she was unbelievable. You know like. And then come out of the penalty box and fight the next guy, trade tyson ash.
Speaker 2:The same thing, like we had guys that not only did they have the over 100 points but over 100 pins almost our whole lineup was that way right, yeah, yeah, it was definitely a definitely a crazy, crazy time for you guys, and it's interesting to look back and see how many guys actually played games like that. And that's the thing, too, that I think people well, maybe they know, maybe they don't know, but major junior hockey is obviously very, very good hockey, yeah. Yet when you take the players from the major junior like it's not like just because you led your team in points, will you play in the NHL. I mean, that's kind of like the way people think of it. It's not the case, right, like there's a lot of other things that have to happen. But then for you to take this one team, this one snapshot in time, and to go down the list and to have multiple digits of players that played NHL and actually had careers is like crazy.
Speaker 1:You mean shell and actually had careers, is like crazy. You mean, that really is craziness. Uh, I got a question. I got a question for you. What was it like playing against us? Like what was going through your head? Like you're like, oh my gosh, like there's this one team where we we would probably be the top team in the league because you guys are there, you guys were good. Yeah, if it wasn't for these guys, like, how was that coming in every time?
Speaker 2:well, yeah, I mean, and then for me it was a little different on a personal level because camels was the closest town to my hometown, right.
Speaker 2:So I always had, I always had a ton of people in your building, uh, watching us and and you know it was yeah, it was, that's a great question, because it kind of changed, you know, I mean, especially as my trajectory with the chiefs changed too, like we started to get a little bit better, uh, you know, and we were the guys that knocked you out, like of the playoffs there the last year, right. So we kind of had, at least personally, a little bit of the last laugh, right. But yeah, I mean, there were battles. You know there were always battles and that division was crazy back then, right, like Tri-Cities with Lankow and Terry Ryan, and like those teams were tough and Portland was good and Seattle was good with Marlowe and the players they had there. So I mean that whole division was hard and you guys were obviously the cream of the crop for a while and we definitely got sick of that song, you know, I think a few seasons taking care of it.
Speaker 1:No, no, no. Victoria doesn't like that at all. I don't.
Speaker 2:I think it's bad on the radio stations there um, you know what, the one, but the one I mean this is kind of funny because you maybe remember it, maybe not, but like from coming in there and I think probably obviously losing more than we would have won in in cam loop.
Speaker 2:So over overall we were down six nothing to you guys in in one game of one season, in after the first period and Brian Maxwell came in and, you know, ripped us a complete new one. So it had to be actually my first or my second year, uh, because he left after that and it was totally maxi and I remember. I remember, like us just being essentially petrified and then we ended up it was my draft year actually. Now I remember, because joe cartereo was on the team, because he actually scored the overtime winner, but we came back and ended up winning seven, six and it was like the the biggest comeback ever against, you know, your team at home and and it was like a really big bonding experience for us to be able to do that against you guys. So you do, you do remember that that moment yeah, yeah, there was.
Speaker 1:We had like a, a tv show that they would do weekly and I, I, I remember them showing the goals and then they showed the titanic. So the titanic sinked right after that and then the chiefs showed up. Yeah, I totally remember that. Yeah, that was that was the last beatings I think we took until you guys knocked us out in the playoffs a couple years later.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah definitely some good times actually I have a darcy tucker question for you, because as good as he was and he was totally, I mean super and tenacious I don't remember him being tough in junior, like I don't remember him fighting or like being intimidating to me. I even remember like asking him to fight in Spokane one time and he didn't want to, but then he went to the NHL and he became like a killer. Like did I miss something in junior? Was he kind of a killer already or did something happen to? Something happened to him at the, at the NHL level, where he became sort of a new version of himself.
Speaker 1:No, he, I mean really he kind of threw pillows in junior Like I, we'd fight and like everyone did in junior in in practice and stuff, yeah, and he'd hit you a couple of times and they wouldn't be that hard, probably threw as hard as I did. I threw pillows too, and uh, you know, but he, what, what? What was so crazy about him was like he'd go after like the toughest guy on the team, so like he'd go after, say, he'd go after Weimer. So he goes in Portland, he goes after Weimer. Weimer would just turn around, knocks him down, goes out five for five and they come, Weimer would come on the ice. Well, tux would come out of the penalty box with his gloves off like, hey, weimer, let's do this again. Come on, I'm like hey, like you. Okay, it didn't work out so good five minutes ago, bro. Yeah, we were turning around like, okay, he just bang and hit him again and it going, and tucks would be chirping him in the box like just, I'm gonna get you, I'm gonna kill. So there was just something, something missing there.
Speaker 1:It wasn't that he was tough, he was nuts. He was literally nuts, he, or else he'd come in Junior. It wasn't that he was tough, he was nuts, he was literally nuts. Or else he'd come in in the center of the ice and then he'd turn and he'd go go get it. And he'd turn and he'd take the puck and he had that jaw thing. He'd go like this jaw and he'd dump it in your corner and he'd slow down and go go get it. He'd run you, he'd run you. But.
Speaker 1:But, like you said, and all of a sudden, junior, we were playing in Toronto, I think I hit Sundin pretty good. I probably shouldn't have hit him as hard as I did in the middle of the ice. And here he comes and I didn't know it was him, but he hit me about five times before I even got my gloves off. I was like damn, and he hit me pretty good. I was like bam Tux, you got a little spunk behind those things now, I think for sure like a bunch of tough dudes too, like some bonafide tough guys that did really good where you're like there's no way Mick Magoo still kicked him, kicked his ass pretty good.
Speaker 2:But yeah, so okay, so he always had that. He definitely had that edge, like that competitive area, I mean that squirreliness to him, but I think he obviously, I mean I think he was probably 150 pounds in junior, like he wasn't a big guy, yeah, and then he got bigger, he definitely got stronger. So that was probably part of it too, of his evolution anyways. Um, so you mentioned, like what you know, learning, learning how to win and learning what it takes to be a team, and then, and then, like your first, your first couple years pro, you're in michigan you mentioned being there with hitch and then then you're in d Dallas and, lo and behold, you get to play eight games in the Stanley Cup finals that year and win the freaking cup. Like did what was the perspective like as a young guy, being a pro and being a part of being part of that so early on in your career?
Speaker 1:that whole one is like and it kind of works out kind of strange like I didn't get my name on the cup there, but it's almost like it didn't get my name on the cup there but it's almost like it doesn't wasn't really I don't want to say deserved at the time, because I think once you go into the stanley cup finals you deserve to have it on there. But it was like being in the front row like we have reality tv right now like if I was the guy that could have held a camera the whole time and just kind of gone around the room and been in the room and kind of been a fly on the wall. That's how it felt like to hear the conversations that were had the. The way that these that they they respected one another as teammates, the respect that they had for the coaching staff. The way that the management had such respect for the entire hockey department just to leave them alone, let them do their thing. The way that the management had such respect for the entire hockey department, just to leave them alone, let them do their thing. They got this. They're kind of a special breed of group here. We'll keep doing the stuff to kind of keep growing hockey in South Texas and do that thing on the outside. We'll get them out in the community when we can, but we're going to leave these guys alone. We're not going to tell Hitch what to do do we're not gonna tell those guys what to do, too much, let's, let's, let's leave them alone and that the group. Just we kind of moved around and this kind of wolf pack and just kind of did a thing.
Speaker 1:Every city we were in, we were always together and I'd never it being in cameloops like we were close, but I'd never seen anything like this before. And you know, you finally have a couple moments with the guys like Craig Ludwig and you're like so, like what's up with this? He's like this is all Montreal Canadians, this is all Bob. You know, this is that's how it was in Montreal. Read the old stories about Montreal. They lived together, they, they stayed together, they all.
Speaker 1:There's five apartments. They all lived right by each other when they went all those cups way back in the day. And then when they moved out of apartments, they moved into the houses and so they were just very we and I was on the outside of it. I was living in a hotel they'd come pick me up at the hotel every day, like just you're part of this, you're, we're not going to leave you out here, and they'd pick me up, they'd take me home and I was just the new kid on the block and and so to be part of that, it felt like I was a part of it the whole way through. I got my day with it. But just to see how that group the Kirk Mullers, the Ludwigs, all the Guy Carboneau, holly Mo, like how that group, just the puzzle, it's like that's the way I look at it as a puzzle that no other pieces of any other puzzle fit on that in that group, it's right, the picture is clear.
Speaker 2:When it's that group, you take one piece out and it's just, the whole thing goes to a mess yeah, the, uh, it's interesting you mention, you know, the, the montreal canadians, because, like two episodes ago or three, I had on brian screwedland, who was my captain in florida, right, my first pro, and then he came over there with um, with who, who was in that trade. Now, uh, oh my gosh, why am I drawing a blank? It should be right in front of me anyways. Uh, multiple stanley cup winner, like a glue guy, super respected throughout the league, came over from montreal with him and like that was kind of like the final pieces of the puzzle that that they sort of added, and screwy was, you know, he talked about what he thought he brought to that team and it was more like a dressing room kind of levity sort of scenario.
Speaker 2:And and obviously his work, ethic and character oh, mike Keane, that's who I'm thinking of. So, mike Keane, and and and screw, and, uh, screwy, come over and and then there's also Gilchrist, I think, was on that team, right, like another Montreal guy. And so you had these Montreal guys that were there and and what a, what a group you know, like, what a, what a talented group and and to have that seat at that, at that table, and really to be a part of it, boy, that must've stuck with you for the rest of your career even like how to treat a younger guy coming in.
Speaker 1:Well, perfect name to say is screwy, so screwy actually, saskatoon blades. I used to go to the saskatoon x blades hockey school when I was just a little gaffer and, uh, I remember screwy doing this backhand shot where he hit a, hit the water bottle from the other side of the ice and I was like, wow, this is an NHL. So I wound up playing with them. Well, they trade for him. I hadn't met him because there was no training camp or anything. I haven't seen him since that. But I get on the ice and it's like one of the first practices. I'm up and I was like again, I'm a young cocky kid leading the team down in kalamazoo, one of those guys that came up very happy to be there. Um, and I'm on the ice and maybe the night before I had maybe taken it for granted a little bit, I don't even remember, but I remember. I remember the lesson I got the next day was being on the ice and we were doing like one-on-ones in front of the net and screwy beat the living crap out of me. He cross-checked me, two-handed me on the back of the leg, pushed me down like, and I got up and I kind of laughed a little bit like chuckled, like that's kind of yeah, you're beating me, but and he cross-checked me again, he said start fighting back. And he dropped his gloves and he's like gonna pound on me. I was like whoa, and the rest of the guys were like hey, that's how we need to start playing. This is over over, the joke is over. You got to start going to work and I was like oh wow. So he picked up his gloves, he goes you ready. And I said yeah, and from that day on I have never taken a shift off Ever since that. Like he, that was one of those ones I would think if I would have went the other way, I don't think I would have, I would way, I don't think I would have. I would have been go pack your bags and go back to kalamazoo. I think that was a crossing of the guard for me for that one. So I have a lot to screw it and screwy always for the rest of my career like that that when we played together, always check in on me, make you make sure I was always working hard. So guys like that, you can totally tell what they when you say what did they bring? They brought that. They brought that you.
Speaker 1:Every single mike keen would skate by you in practice in any time, and he'd try to knock your stick out of your hands. Just skate by and knock your hand, just so you're on. You're aware on ice awareness of where is he at. You'd see him coming. You know you're squeezing your stick a little tighter with what with keener's around and he would do it up. So he's always keeping you focused, always, and walking. He'd do it while you're hitch is sitting there talking to you, telling you something like this. All of a sudden you get up right behind you, knock your stick out, you can get you and you turn around and give you a look. You're like like it was, it was on and you never, ever could take a shift off. And you but we learned that in practice make sure you're focused, make sure you're ready to go what a freaking lesson.
Speaker 2:I love that story, that's so. I love him screw. He said in his interview and I mean I'm going to paraphrase him, but essentially he said the one thing that he learned early, whether it was in junior or pro. Uh, he said that his, his hard hat always went on before his skates and that, and that stuck with him for forever. You know, and and that was, that was the one thing that I really remembered about him even.
Speaker 2:You know, in my brief time with him in florida, there was that, yeah, he wasn't the most talented guy, um, which is interesting too, because you look back in his stats in saskatoon or whatever. I mean, this guy was, you know, a point producer, but he freaking showed up like if the boys went out the night before, he'd be the first one there, he'd work his bag off. You know, like he was always the guy that was working hard and and uh, and really taught everyone around him how to be a pro right, like how to, how to get it done, and I love when he challenged you like that, like that's, that's an old school way of doing it. I don't know how much that happens now. Do you think that happens today in in practice in an nhl rank I think the old guys are around to do it.
Speaker 1:I don't think they do it in as much much in the physical sense. I think there's more of the hey man like uh well, after practice, why don't the two of us go out and play some xbox somewhere in a in a xbox cafe or something, grab a latte or something like that, where back then it was just all right hitch would bring somebody in teach him a lesson. I don't care how you do it, the kid's not getting it, he's not. It's not getting through.
Speaker 2:So go teach him a lesson right, and they did, and you learned it like you said it could have gone either way for you there too, and I like, I even like how you remember, like the, like the laughy, like oh, this is sort of funny, and then it, then it really hit home when it wasn't, like he wasn't meant to be funny, like this is for real.
Speaker 1:This is this is funny until I saw his eyes. Yeah, he's like oh, this is he's. He's pissed, like this is, and he's, and he's telling me and he's teaching a lesson right now and like that, everything else went away. It was just me and him.
Speaker 2:It was like oh, okay, yeah, you brought up fighting twice now and I don't want to make it to be like, uh, you know, back in the dinosaur age, but like you talked about. You talked about training camp where you went across the ice and you wanted to show everyone on both sides of the team and the goes watching in the crowd, that you were ready to take this guy's spot, that you wanted it more than him. Uh, and the scenario in the practice, in nhl practice, where you know screwy, essentially, you know baptizes you into nhl pro hockey, how you have to be. There's multiple junior camps now where it's actually not even allowed right, like you're. They've, they've told kids that they'll be kicked out of camp if they fight.
Speaker 2:I, I personally have an issue with that. Like I don't understand why. Why that I mean we don't have to celebrate the fighting, but like there should be a way to separate yourself and your want and your desire, in that sense that you're willing to do something that maybe other guys aren't willing to do. Why do you think that's being taken away?
Speaker 1:Oh man, I don't know. I really don't. It's always been part of the game. I mean the most celebrated sport. How many people turned off Netflix the other night when Mike Tyson was? It's a spectacle, it's part of the game, it's fun. We sign up, we know what we're doing.
Speaker 1:Now is there those ones where the finesse player shouldn't be fighting against the boogeyman? Of course not Like those are. Those are scary for everybody. The boogeyman, those guys don't want to be going after those little guys either. So there is a respect out there.
Speaker 1:But when it comes to training camps, you know, there there is guys that play a certain way. It's it's like if it's a part of your, it's a part of your tool book. So for me, that was one of my tools back then is my story is, for my dad was try to find a way to get onto the score sheet one way or the other. So on the back of my stick I even have it on the one I coach now so I can show kids I needed to get one goal, one assist. So that's two points. I needed to be plus one. I need to have two minutes or five minutes. I had to, whatever way. Those are all the spots. Those are all the spots that you can get on there.
Speaker 1:So you've got to go find a way to get involved. If you're not involved, you're not part of the game. So if you're a finesse guy and the scout's up in the stands, then why would you go out there and run around and get in a fight? That's just stupid. But if you're a checker guy like myself, main three things move the puck, make a good first pass, make sure you're blocking shots, make sure you're being hit or getting a hit. That's it. There's my whole game. Well, how am I going to go out there and and if and play my game and be that physical force with the repercussion in the back mind if a guy turns around and punches me that I can't offend myself. So you're going to play a little lighter, so you play a little bit back, you open up your gap. Personally, I think that you're kind of hurting the kids opportunity to play his full, full game.
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah, I mean, especially when you're talking about roles. Now, real, specifically, I'm, I wasn't I'm. My pain point is even from the idea of let's effing compete, you know, like who's got the fire. Like I would never claim to be a tough guy anywhere, but I did fight and I would, you know, and there were scenarios where that served me really well as somebody trying to take advantage of me, trying to make a team, trying to let somebody know that I was willing to do more than this other guy who wanted to do it right.
Speaker 2:Like I thought that that was a differentiator and I was proud of that being a differentiator, right and I think that like I don't know, like again, whether it's a part of our game, like in the nhl, and you're allowed to do it.
Speaker 2:I do think that's something, I think there's a fan piece of that, but I just think, like the guts and the lack of a better word balls of the player, like I want to know that and I think if I'm picking a team, I would want to see the guys that are willing to show me in some capacity that they are willing to be a Camelot's Blazer or they are willing to be a Tampa Bay Lightning, you know, and anyways, in camp of bay lightning, you know, and uh, anyways, I went, I went to a few camps this year and stuck my head in.
Speaker 2:I was just, I was a bit disappointed, to be honest, just with it like, just with like that level of compete and I think it was almost like it's not encouraged at all and and it's almost like distant. You know it's not encouraged. So I don't know, I, I, I wanted to, I wanted to dive into that with you and see what you, what you think. How do you approach it at the U15 level when it comes to? You know even the physicality of the game now, where they're introduced to hitting. How do you handle that?
Speaker 1:I try to promote them to be as physical as possible within the rules. You know, even like a saying that Hazer stuck with us is is be tough between the whistles. You know, don't be tough after the whistles, all that pushing and shoving. We don't be tough after the whistles, all that pushing and shoving. We don't need that stuff. That's what slows down the game, that's what gives us a bad name. Play tough between the whistles.
Speaker 1:If you can play tough within the rules which is hard checking hockey stick on puck, if you follow through with the check, make sure that the guy's not in a vulnerable spot, then that's good, clean hockey. It doesn't, it doesn't penalize us. It still intimidates them knowing that the man this team can play physical, we're going to get hit and we're not going to wind up on the power play. That's a pretty, that's a pretty tough team to play against. So and and punching guys in the head, nobody cares about that. All you're doing is giving them the advantage. So we we don't have any of that retaliation stuff with our squads. It's actually been really good for our group here the last couple of years and then kind of just cap it off kind of jokingly, like if you guys really want to do something. It's kind of fun. The thing my my old man would tell me is take his number, guy smashes. You just kind of take a look at him and be like see it.
Speaker 1:See that, uh tack, uh, camp this summer, yeah like oh, and then when he comes to the, the u15 camp at the end of the summer and he sees you looking across, give him this one like coming for you, I'm gonna get you. Those refs aren't kicking you out of games in those boys, so they all go. They get a little chuckle. So I mean then just, or you'll see them in a junior camp down the road, pro whatever, but right now getting back at someone, everybody knows you're going to try to get back at them, so just park it, save it for another day yeah, yeah, that's great.
Speaker 2:Maybe that's a good segue into even some of the stuff we've been having discussions about offline and the. You know the mindset of the game and and I think that it's become I think it's become more relevant in recent years because of some of the stuff that we've already talked about, like the attrition of being a player and and how, how, like the coming of age and, and there's a broader bandwidth of players that are playing the game now, I think from a personality standpoint. So there is, there is more people at the party right From different backgrounds, different whatever, right, like there's just more people there which I think tends to being I don't know if that's a good connection, but there's more going on that kids can't handle. It seems like right now, you know they don't have the tools to do it you talking about looking somebody in the eye and like letting them know that you're going to get them, like that's pretty rare to be seen these days and that would happen all the time.
Speaker 2:Back in the day, that would be a question at the dinner table. So what do you see in today's player? Obviously, I mean I would assume you agree that you know the skill. The skill is high, the speed is high. These players are better at their age than they were, than we were at our age. What do you see differently from that aspect of a mental game?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I got to agree with all that. I think the amount of players that are out there that can play at a high skill level now is incredible. What you don't see as much is them playing together as a group. There's a lot of individual play, a lot of onus on the one guy, the top player, but that's how it is at the top level. So you know we've got who's the best player, but that's how it is at the top level. So you know we've got who's the best player. Toronto maple leafs they're gonna, they're gonna spit a name out you over here. So you got your top four guys.
Speaker 1:A lot of guys are just really focusing on being in the top four versus trying to focus on back in our day, like I had no problem, focusing on being a role player guy, a guy that hit like to fight, like to like to block shots, like to make passes, like to be a skill like, like to set up the skill guy and be there for them. They don't really have that. Now it's I want to score every, every shift. I'm on the ice, I don't want to play defense, uh, so my preparation is that way, and then when we put them into a challenging role of something that they're not generally used to. It becomes, uh, quite chaotic. Actually, it's a their. Their whole game is off, their prep is off their, their, their mindset was like why am I playing with this guy? I should be playing with these guys because I I mean I could score goals. But I know you can score goals. I'm trying to teach you how to play defense, because you imagine if you're a two-way player versus just this one trick pony. So we're trying to do those.
Speaker 1:But they get these mindsets of social media. I want to be like this. This is who I am. I think I'm like this and I need to do it this way. Well, everybody wants to be that guy. I mean I wanted to be bobby or too, but it's just. You know, real realistically, these are my attributes. These are the best things for me. I'm going to focus on those three things and become really good at those.
Speaker 1:And if we can do those excellent, then we grow from that position and start to like build that nice base. Then we grow, build that, that base becomes stronger. Then we grow from there and you just still, and then, by the end of it, you've got this foundation. It's not a base anymore. You've got a foundation and once that foundation is built, then you can play any role. A coach can come up and tell you I need you to do this, I need you to do this. That puts you in any role that you want.
Speaker 1:It doesn't matter who you're playing with, you're just robotic. I need you to run the left of player, you just go out and you do it. There's no extra thoughts. It just becomes robotic when, right now, it's like the opposite. Everything's like well, I got this going on. I didn't eat right. Who is in the dressing room first and how come I'm not wearing a letter? Why is he wearing a letter? There's so many distractions. It's just, it's very, very. I kind of envy them because they're growing up in a time where they have all these tools but there's so much information. How do you pick the right stuff? So on that side, you kind of give them the man. I feel sorry for you guys too. So for us, I'm trying to keep streamlined, just listen to one voice, try to stick on this path. Let's just try to stick and play this certain way and focus on our team, focus on ourselves. Whoever we play is whoever we play I love.
Speaker 2:Uh, it was a note that I wrote all down already. I said your value as a player. Uh, also has value for the team and you touched on it again, like the, the three things, and why I I like that so much is because a group that I work with every two weeks called my inner circle. It's a, it's a graduate group that's taken my program like. One of the things that we've really focused on in the first half is, for lack of better words, player identity, and lots of times people will put like player identity and they'll think that there's like some type of a ceiling when it comes to a player identity, and I don't think of that way at all.
Speaker 2:I think of it, as you already said, as like this foundation and if you can be really clear on your foundation as a player and what I mean by a foundation is exactly what you said is how do you provide value? Like what are the things that you do better than most other guys, right? Like why are you on that team in the first place? And most players don't? They can't answer that question or if they do answer it, they answer it incorrectly and so, like I think it's so wild when you can get clear on what that is. And I impact the game you said by, for simple first pass, battling in front of the net, getting shots through from the point. Let's say those are your three things. If you do that consistently, every game, you have provided value to yourself and to the group. I can recognize what you are as a defenseman, as an evaluator, as a coach. The trust is built.
Speaker 2:And now from there, yes, you can expand from that base. But if you can't check those three check marks at the end of the game, you've done a disservice to yourself and to the team. Clarity helps a lot of times and, like when I use the word mindset, like to me, player identity is a mindset. You need to understand it so you can go out there and do it. And I love that you're talking like that, because I'm sure you're helping your players understand how they provide value and that it's not a disservice to think that getting the puck out is a small thing or it's because I'm not told to score the goal. No one's saying don't score the goal, we're just telling you to take pride in getting it out right. Like can you speak to that maybe a little bit more, like how we can expand from these bases yeah, you know, actually that's a good point, even for myself.
Speaker 1:You're triggering some things as, yeah, you do have to break it down to those small little goals. You know, we all we call the goal that's when the light goes on at the end. But really there's small goals as you break it down. When your face off, just win your face off. Well, if you're not the guy taking the face off, you got to win your battle on the wall to to into support or into your first. Your step, first step into position. You know then what then? You're, you're, you're. Did we win it? Did we lose that battle? Where's our reaction time to that?
Speaker 1:So, where we're, we're losing our, our step on a lot is is the inability to just understand our role in the moment. Where we're, we're going like, what am I going to do when I shoot the puck down there? Well, how are you going to? There's all this, before we get to that shot that we have to do before that, those small win the battle. So, if you're the centerman, win that faceoff, get low and slow in the middle, receive that puck in the middle, move it quick to the outside, drive the net. Don't go all the way down the ice. Now he gets to you in the slot. Grab, receive that putt, put it on net. And actually put it in the net, don't bury it in his chest. There's so many different variables that you had to control in that little short amount of time.
Speaker 2:To be you have to be prepared for yeah, I know I love that the uh, yeah and even like the goal scores. Like the guys in my group that would consider themselves offensive players which which is great, let's say traditionally at the start of the season or throughout their career, they've been like, if I didn't score, I have now been, I've had a bad game, right, or I haven't been productive and I'm not confident now because I haven't scored, like when that's the goal, we get in trouble. But if that player let's say that player x is a, is a bigger body, plays heavy and he hasn't been to the front of the net in three games, and I'm like, well, isn't that where you score most of your goals? Like, shouldn't your? Your intrinsic value to the team is that you're bigger than other guys and it's a hard area to go to, so why not go to the front of the net? And so if you go to the front of the net more often, I bet you your goals are going to come. Or you know why are you giving the puck up on the half wall when you should be having it below the goal line, like that's where you get create all your offense. From how many times have you touched the puck below the goal line. Oh, I haven't touched it at all. Well, there you go, right. So now you're not using your player identity properly, right, and you're wondering why you're not getting it done. So sometimes we work backwards from the performance aspects that we want. Understand, you know how we provide value in a game and, generally speaking, the production in this case would come so like. I love that, and sometimes it's like a massive light bulb for players right to be like oh, okay, yeah, and that's a simple thing to understand too.
Speaker 2:Going to take another short break from the conversation with brad lukowicz to remind you that upmyhockeycom is your place for mindset development. Whether that be a team or whether that be an individual, or whether that be an academy or an association as a whole, there is mindset programming, mental fitness programming, available to you. I have a rotating guided mission that is on throughout the hockey season, meaning you can join other players from across North America on a guided mission where you get to have coaching calls with me as a group while you take the curriculum online, the lessons online, or you can have your whole team registered. It is a great way to grow a culture and to finish the second half strong. I love working with entire teams, and if you are an association member, networker or decision maker and you have not brought mental fitness training or programming to your uh, to your city, by all means let's have a conversation.
Speaker 2:I provide programs, uh for your association that the players can grow. Uh, they can grow their mental fitness as they grow with you. So as they grow through the age ranks, there will be bolt-on mental fitness programming available to them. The game has become much more holistic in its development approach and if you are somebody that is not providing mindset programming for your players, you are missing out, and this could also be a reason why players and families may stay with you if you can provide some good mental fitness training to the program. So if that's something that sounds like a good idea to you, by all means. Lots of reasons to reach out. It's either at upmyhockeycom or an email to Jason at upmyhockeycom. Both places you will find the information you need, and I would love to have the discussion on how to make your player, your team or your area area better. So now let's get back to the conversation with brad lukowich and I got one for some, some feedback for you.
Speaker 1:So we have our f3 guy is a common theme for him. I like to be you, you're and you're that guy. You're, you're that forward, you'd like to stand on that f3 you. You had that really nice shot and you did a really good job of being patient up in that area as a defenseman. When I would see you up there, it makes makes me very nervous. But there are shifts that I'd be standing in front of the net looking up at you. You wouldn't receive that putt for a few shifts, you know. So maybe I float into the corner that one time. Now you do get it and you score.
Speaker 1:Where I'm getting, um, some feedback not only from my kids but some from some of the parents looking down at the ice going, hey, you know, his buddy's working on his butt off in the corner, and then he turns around and he's not getting it to him and all I can see is my kid standing in the slot. I'm like, yeah, well, he's doing his job, though that's the thing he's actually doing, his job. Well, it sure doesn't look like it. You know, maybe he should be down in the corner helping him out. And I'm like well, do you see how we're kind of abandoning our process, we're abandoning our job because we're not getting immediate success, we're not sticking with the process and we're not actually letting that guy in the corner. You know what? He has a job to do. His job is to get that puck and get it to him.
Speaker 1:So if all of a sudden we start skipping that and he does get the puck and and our guy standing right beside him, now we don't have our guy up top, so we're kind of the times we do win it there's no one available right. The time that he's available we're not getting the puck. So sometimes, like like in a perfect world, everything's right goes in the corner, turns up, there's that3. We pass to him, the guy roofs it, goes bar down, everybody's happy. But in the real world, nine times out of ten I got my f3 standing up there. How do I get the mindset of the player to be patient up in that area, to just relax and rely and trust his teammates that this is part of it? I have to stay here. I have to do my stuff, play my role on the ice, shift to shift, not only season to season and day to day.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, a hundred percent. I love that, and probably a better understanding by all three players on the ice and why they're a group together and put on a line together in the first place would probably help them understand, right that that, that ability to do that I mean. Another thing just came to mind as you were saying that, like one of the one of my clients, last year, I was watching them, watching them practice at the junior level and they were working on, you know, like one timers again and again, again for off the flank, right. I mean it sounds like a normal thing and a good thing to work on after practice. I've never seen him score a one timer in my life off the flank Right, like I just never have, and I don't think I might have seen him once get a one-timer off the flank in a game. So we had a conversation after. I'm like, where do you score? Well, I score on deflections and usually on rebounds and tight or net drives. I'm like, yeah, so don't you think that that's probably where you should be practicing? That should be the area that you own.
Speaker 2:Every team maybe has some Ovechkins.
Speaker 2:I mean ovechkin, every team wishes they had an ovechkin, but something that would score on the power play in that spot, right, but like that, that person's spot, that's where they get comfortable, that's where they're going to, where they're going to gravitate to more often in a game.
Speaker 2:Some players need to go to the front of the net to score a povelsky, for instance, right, that's where he scores, right, like so he's understanding that is is right and owning an area is good. Can Pavelski score from the high slot? Of course he can, but it doesn't mean he can't, it just means that he understands where he needs to go to be successful. And I think when players do understand that, even as young athletes, boy, being able to watch a player and knowing what they do, when you think about as a coach aspect, or if I'm a WHL scout or an OHL scout, like isn't that a great attribute where when I show up on a weekend, whether it's in January or in March, I see the player play the same way, I know what box he's going to fill in that puzzle piece you're talking about Like pretty big advantage for athletes, isn't it?
Speaker 1:It really is. It really is.
Speaker 2:that's what we want as a coach, as we're trying to build that picture yeah, 100, and you're building your own resume on that and everybody wants to build their resume off, like what these goals and assists stay at the end of the day, but everyone needs a brad lukowicz, right? I hope so. Yeah, 100, and the proof is in the pudding, right? You know what I mean. Like, you need somebody that's going to do that and that's a very, very valuable thing.
Speaker 2:And I think, as coaches at least, I see that as the younger levels that some parents will think, well, you're putting a ceiling on my kid. No, there's not a ceiling here. Like you can, you can become anything and you can grow from anything. But if you don't understand what it is that you are, you're having a hard time like on, is that you are, you're having a hard time like on on your own development curve and I think coaches I mean I think you probably may, maybe I shouldn't assume, but that can sometimes be a challenge, right, like what a player wants to be, or think they is, compared to, maybe where they are and and having the process and the mindset required to to grow through that yeah, and I'm in that 12 to 14 year old window where you've got certain kids one month ago were 5'6", now he's 5'9".
Speaker 1:These guys are just growing up. They're shooting up and some aren't. So even the players they're playing against that they could get a step on are taking two strides and are lifting one stick. It happened to me. I didn't understand that when I was I had to have that talking to because I was a late bloomer. The guys I would dominate at the 12? U level all of a sudden at 14 were catching me, knocking me over with one hand and I'm like what is? I'm just awful, I'm terrible that self-confidence is gone. No, no, this is just a growth thing.
Speaker 1:Focus on your game. If you focus on your game and then you grow, you're going to be unstoppable. So that's the focus I'm trying to get with a lot of these guys right now. We have a couple smaller statured guys that are battling the puck a little bit right now focus on your game. Don't focus on anything else, but try to work on your game. Get better, get faster by moving the puck quicker. Work harder, because your legs are a little bit shorter, so you got to take two more strides than the other guy work into place, be prepared when you get there and execute, and then when you grow, this game is going to become very easy for you. But when it becomes easier for you, then you got up your game again.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh, what great stuff there. I love that you touched on that. The small player, adolescence, you know, not being through puberty yet like it can be a game changer. Well, it is a game changer, I mean for a vast majority, especially the late birthdays that I find like that's where they get, they get picked over. I'm gonna give you a small stat.
Speaker 2:So I geeked out on the draft for like two years whl draft, you would think I mean theoretically. Theoretically, in a birth year there should be equal representation from the quadrants right From, like, january through March, the middle bird and then the end. But we all know that that's not the case, right? And so when I actually looked at the numbers both years in a row was almost exactly the same that I crunched the numbers on the like, the second and third quadrants of the year had what you would think they're supposed to have, like the 25% representation from players. But on the first and like from the front and back ends of the quarters of the year, the backend lost a lion's share of players. So they only had 10%. 10% of the draft goes to the last three months of the year and that all goes to the beginning three months. So what's that? 25 doing my math like 40, so it's 40. In the first three months, 10 of the draft happens from the boys born in uh, october, november, december what does that right?
Speaker 1:what does?
Speaker 2:that they didn't grow right, like that's the only thing. There's no way there's not as talented players in that group, it's just that they're not as big. So how do we stay relevant? And, uh, and to your point, like you just said a lot of things that were awesome there, like if you can stick around right wherever it is that you're sticking around right, you can make double A.
Speaker 2:Or if you're lucky enough to play triple A, or if you can play prep as a late birthday, a late developer, you are going to be forced to learn the game better than those guys who develop earlier. That's a massive advantage right, moving pucks, being more aware, being able to have better reads, scanning now you have to get better at. You're going to be forced to work out in the gym and try and get quicker. I mean all these things. But, like I, if you can have that mindset as a younger any younger players out there listening right now, like the things I just said, like take immense amounts of pride in that and just recognize that you will grow at some point and you're going to have all these distinct advantages over the guys that right now might be passing you because they're stronger, bigger, because they have hair on their legs Right.
Speaker 1:Pretty much really. Yeah, you're right, I mean it it's just. It's just a they get content. We've seen all those guys and and while you're working out and they're they're just naturally growing and just kind of getting their natural growth. They're not putting in the extra effort, you see. That's, that's where that little you see guys pass and lap guys in this, in this, in these next three years the 12, 13, 14, 15, like those years right there tons of exchange in talent levels and where you can assert yourself yeah, well, because and like you said, like so there is a complacency, I think.
Speaker 2:So those listening that are early growers that are having success, and if you can look around your team and recognize that you're bigger and you're stronger, right, so you have a natural advantage right now. Not, it might not necessarily be because you're more skilled and know the game better, right? So, like, having the self-awareness to recognize that, hopefully that'll help those players now go to work. Yes, but there's that side of the game knowledge that I think people overlook a lot too. Right, like, if I am big and strong and if I can skate the puck past somebody or through somebody lots of the times, that is like my first option, right, I can do that. The smaller player can't do that. So now they have to devise a plan, a strategy, understand the game to be able to get the puck where they need to get it to. If that bigger player never is forced to do that until major, junior, let's say, and sometimes that's where it happens, right, and now you're trying to learn the game because you're not as big and strong and can't skate the puck past people, you're at a distinct disadvantage and it's hard to catch up in that environment.
Speaker 2:So I think there's good lessons for both sides of it. Listening here, right, like you know there could be glory days right now, but like, recognize, you know, if you want to work at your game, you can still do it. Moving the puck past people and using your teammates is a huge thing, right, even if you're the best player on the team, it helps your development. God, I just can't stress that enough. I get super passionate about it because it's like God, like, yeah, moving pucks. Like when you said play quick.
Speaker 1:Like that is how you can play quick. Right, you have to move that puck head man. That all those old sayings that were around when we were kids move that puck, play with pace. You all move, you, you. The less you have the puck, the more effective you are. Like just all those little sayings like move that puck and then move your feet so you can get the puck back.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, and you even the stuff you talked about being in that high zone and playing in soft areas, like learning how to play without the puck and support people, is such a big piece of the game. And the last one I'll just say is, like, if you are good right now, like being great means making people around you better too. Yes, so yes, it is the instagram era and it's to highlight real error and, and you and you see guys going end to end and that's what gets put on, put on all these tapes and on your television feed. But the guys that are like like the sydney crosby's of the world, like that make everybody on his line always better, is like that's where the juice is like, be that guy, you know, be that guy, make everyone else better.
Speaker 2:That's my, that's my wish for anyone listening right now is that you take immense amount of pride in making your teammates better and you are actually making yourself a better player in the process of doing that too. So, okay, stopping with the uh, with the lecture on on youth development, we're gonna go back to you and I want to talk about the second time through it. Actually, you know what I want to talk about, because it's a it must have been a big thing for you from a mental side. Was the trade from dallas to minnesota, back to dallas, without even going to minnesota, like how was that experience, coming back, being in the locker room, like, talk to me about that as a as a young, as a young pro?
Speaker 1:it was pretty wild because it was basically I didn't know what was going on. It was it was just a move to get us away from doing the getting getting taken by columbus. Oh, so there was that draft, right. So Columbus had already kind of mentioned you know, there's a chance that we may take him showed some interest in me. Minnesota was like, well, you know, we're interested, but we kind of like this other guy. But Dallas was ultimately like, well, we don't even want to lose him. So what if we do that?
Speaker 1:So then it was just kind of one of those ways back in the day. But I knew nothing about it. So as soon as it happened to me I was like getting rid of my car because I had a two-wheel drive, so I wasn't going to work in minnesota. So, getting rid of my apartment, I flew home, told my parents and I flew back to dallas to get out of my apparent apartment. And like the next day I was like, oh, hey, by the way, you, the way you're back. I'm like, oh, geez, okay. So that was it.
Speaker 2:So did they tell you after the fact that that was the plan all along, or did they just leave?
Speaker 1:Oh, they did. Eddie actually told me after Eddie's like we were dying to tell you. Remember, when we were out at like the Big Apple, I'm like hey, we were about to tell you. I was like, ah, we could have gone, oh, we would have got in trouble, like okay, well, whatever, it was really why you guys were like making sure I came back to town and weren't, weren't letting me do that. No, no, no, don't move your stuff, leave it where it is right, wow, okay, so all right.
Speaker 2:So that wasn't what I thought it was. I thought that would have been, like you know, a reconsideration. Then you're coming back to a place that maybe you thought never wanted you in the first place. Right, like it was all a master plan to keep you. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they liked me.
Speaker 2:Sounds like you got some guys coming back in there. Is that the?
Speaker 1:Yeah, some guys are starting to pop their heads into the old alumni room.
Speaker 2:So the pickup game's over? Well, maybe we'll. It's been an awesome chat, but I did want to talk to you about the Tampa Bay one, because you were yeah, you know, obviously you had the eight games and we didn't really talk about that. I don't know why eight games in the Stanley Cup Finals isn't enough to get you on the Cup when the whole team only played 23 or 24. Let's not focus on that. Let's focus on the one where you played 18, tampa Bay 0-4, marty St Louis. I mean all these guys like that whole group coming together and winning one and obviously probably feeling like you're a way different piece of that puzzle, like how does that? How did that one settle for you?
Speaker 1:Yeah, that one was unbelievable, you know, came in in, got trade on our wedding day, so it was an adventure right from the start. And then a month in, my wife announces she's pregnant. You know we have an awesome first year. I had an amazing uh partner with dan boyle, had a great first year. Uh, we bowed out in the second round to New Jersey where we thought we were like we may be on to something here. We came back the next year. We thought Tortsen pushed us hard one year but we went even harder, please, geez. And so we thought Tortsen pushed us hard one year, but the second year we won, it was, it was another animal like he, he up, the kept, held us to another level of accountability with one another, with him, and it just wound up being incredible season for us. And you know, being down in tampa, it was perfect. We were kind of out of sight, out of mind and we can kind of go about about ourselves. And at the end of the year people started noticing man, this Tampa team is kind of for real, they keep doing their thing. But then there was this team over on the West Coast, you know, at the end of the season started upping their game with Calgary. They were pretty nasty so it was knocking off.
Speaker 1:All the number ones Got a little bit nerve-wracking for us. We were watching them. Number ones got a little bit nerve-wracking for us. We're watching them Every time we're watching games. We're seeing how they're playing and we're like, ooh, there's some similarities here. About defense first, hockey is actually being played out west instead of this run and gun style, so this could be an interesting go for us. So we'll see how it all comes out. And it was exactly as advertised Defense first a bunch of guys trying to kill all comes out. And it was exactly as advertised defense first bunch of guys trying to kill each other. And it was a blast.
Speaker 2:How was that coming back? And you mean from your own mutual relationship with jerome, like so now you're, you're playing jerome, obviously. I mean it's it's probably a lifetime it would have felt like, since you were in the blazers together, but but that there is still a connection there, I'm sure, and he was, he was the big piece of that puzzle yeah, and it was tough to hate him.
Speaker 1:It really was, but I mean, he he was. It was really tough. He made it a little easier after him and vinnie went out at all, because that was like, oh boy, and he's my boy, buddy, the pretty good scrap.
Speaker 2:So that was a great piece of that. That was one of the best pieces of that series with those two, yeah, going at it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, of all the battles, that was the toughest one, because not only do I have the utmost respect for jerome as a junior player, but in the nhl like honestly, he's, if not the best player I've ever played with, it's him and mike madano right, like him and he's unbelievable. And as a person, there's no one in the world you don't want to see not have a sound of cup like jerome should have a sound of cup. Right, let's get him out of retirement. Let's send him somewhere so he can have a cup. Like I love the guy to death. So that was probably the hardest part of the whole deal. I was so happy to win and to get that, get it there. But just looking over and be like man, you deserve a cup. So bad, you played so hard. If anyone deserves a cup on that day it was him all right, yeah, what a great.
Speaker 2:Well, that's a great place to leave. I know you got some guys in there and thanks for for telling them to be quiet, but uh, maybe we'll do part two and we'll get into torts, because I love that idea too of holding guys to a high standard and what you would have learned from that. You've been super gracious with your time, man. Thanks for sharing all your ideas about development and sharing your stories along the way. Is there anything you want to leave my listeners with as parting goods?
Speaker 1:I don't know. Happy Thanksgiving from the States Coming up here this week. So, uh, no, just keep, keep working hard. You know, just silence the doubters. Anyone tells you you can't do it. They're, they're full of it, man, you can do it.
Speaker 2:I love it. I love it. All, right, man. Well, uh, that's it and uh, until next time. I I appreciate you coming out, you got it, buddy.
Speaker 1:Talk to you later.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much for being here and listening to the conversation with Brad. Lots of good stuff. You know the one that sticks out to me as I just reflect on what we talked about. Well, two things actually. Player identity is massive. Like I said, I've been working on it with my inner circle group about them being able to embrace and understand who they are as players and how they provide value, not only to themselves but to the team. This is something that you have to get clear on. You have to understand the ways in which you can impact a game positively and to do it as consistently as you can. This helps you be understood by coaches and by evaluators. It also gives you a framework to feel really good about yourself and to grow confidence around. By all means, this is conversations you should have with your family, if you are a younger player, or with your coach, if you are confused at all with what attributes you bring and how you provide value. Have that conversation, ask questions and then dive in to the execution of that. I love that piece of the conversation, and the other one I'll double down on is the idea of small players in youth hockey. If you are a smaller player, especially prepubescent. If you've not gone through puberty yet and you're seeing people get bigger and stronger around you, hang on, you will grow. It will happen.
Speaker 2:Do not get discouraged. Find it and view it, in a growth mindset capacity, as an opportunity to improve where others aren't. So, yes, you aren't as strong in the corner. Yes, you might not be as fast right now. Yes, you may get knocked off the puck, but you can learn to move pucks. You can learn new ways to attack the game, to get in and out of trouble, to make players better around you, to understand your ice awareness and to make your reads better All these things that you could be doing like you're essentially being forced into doing it or you need to go away, right?
Speaker 2:I don't want you to go away. I want you to view these things as places where you can improve and you can still impact a hockey game. And once you do get the growth spurt, and once you do get the growth spurt, and once you do, uh, start to get stronger and bigger muscles, now you're going to have all these other areas of the game that are going to be an advantage to you. So do not get discouraged. Stay positive, stay in the fight, work your tail off to get better, to get stronger, to be more knowledgeable of the game, and things will work out for you. I promise, promise. So I think that's a great way to leave. Thanks, brad, for being with us. Thank you for being with us and until next time, play hard and keep your head up.