When the Messenger is Monique.

Ever questioned the value of your voice in a world that seems to echo with others' expectations? This episode turns the spotlight on the empowering art of personal branding, and the tenacity required to purge toxic relationships from our lives. Our narrative begins with the importance of inspiration, drawing from the negotiation prowess of my mother and the legendary ambition of figures like Michael Jordan and 50 Cent. We unravel the influence of assertiveness and the courage to carve out our own destinies.

Navigating the entertainment industry's labyrinth as a Black woman often feels like dancing on a tightrope. In this heartfelt discussion, we reflect on Taraji P. Henson's encounters with undervaluation, shining a light on the crucial role of a robust personal brand and an unwavering support system. I'll share my own trials of missed opportunities and the systemic challenges that dare to define our worth, but most importantly, how we must architect our own success stories in the face of these adversities.

 We spotlight industry giants like Oprah Winfrey and Elsa Majimbo, dissecting the complexities of mentorship under the limelight. From navigating professional pitfalls to celebrating collective triumphs, this is an invitation to manage your career with grace and confidence. So, tune in and equip yourself with the essential tools for a journey toward personal fulfillment and professional empowerment.

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:01

Walk away from anything holding you hostage physically, mentally and emotionally. Cut ties with bonds that require much more of you than you're capable of giving, and be sure to sever permanent ties with things that leave you with low spirit and bring bad energy. Stop allowing people to hush you out of your words. Stop allowing people to waste your time. Stop allowing people to be privy of your life. Stop giving people open spaces to walk in. Stop being so naive. Stop doing things you don't want to do. Please stop giving yourself to every individual who seems to need you. Walk away, knowing you're doing due diligence, cutting the string to the attachments people hold over you, cutting the bad habits and doing the work.

Speaker 1: 0:40

It seems we have loud mouthpieces declaring what we don't want and what we won't do, but the moment these things show up, our war is silent and we've stepped back from the promises that we have declared for ourselves. Attachment to people and their expectation causes us to fold and invite them every single time. The struggle is not new, but being assertive is. You don't owe anyone an explanation, but you owe yourself the right to dismiss everything that keeps holding you hostage. And I don't know about you, but no one will cost me my peace, my sanity, my life and baby. That is the law.

Speaker 2: 1:19

And that was from Instagram page. Home is when the Heart Is and, honestly, there. I couldn't have thought of any better way to open this episode than to play that to you, because when I listened to that spoken word if you want to call it it was so profound to me and I could resonate with every single word. Her voice is so calming, fellow black queen, and I love it. Hello and welcome to this week's episode of the Toyotalks podcast.

Speaker 2: 1:48

My name is Toya Washington and I am the creator, the podcaster and the founder of the Toyotalks podcast and platform, and we teach, guides and educate black women how to navigate the world of work safely and, in turn, highlight the path of our success. That's what we do here. So last week I was supposed to record and I just I don't know, I just didn't feel, you know, that my spirit wasn't aligned to, and partly because motherhood is mothering and my child comes first, but also because of where I was in my own mind and certain really important decisions I had to make, and I kind of felt like, in order to sit in those decisions, I just needed to remove myself from certain things, and the podcast happened to be one of them. Some of that will continuously, always give me comfort is the fact that we have over 150 episodes and for me personally, I feel like in order to learn, sometimes you have to really listen. Certain situation comes up and you go back and you look at the show notes and I feel like I have laid a really good foundation and a really good catalogue of support.

Speaker 2: 3:05

So I never really feel guilty more so that I know that there's people kind of expecting an episode and you never want to let anyone down. But as long as I don't let myself down, I feel like that's the most important thing. And I'm here to first and foremost, ensure that I am spiritually where I need to be and aligned with all the things that I do outside of my motherhood and outside of my friendships, outside of everything. What makes me me is being able to be spiritually at a balance and at peace with myself, to be able to make other parts of my life flourish, and I had to learn that. I had to really learn that. I didn't know that before, to be honest, partly because I didn't think I was worthy to self serve. We could talk about it. So in this episode I want to talk about a few things, because this.

Speaker 2: 3:58

So much has happened, but whenever I've been asked about who I look up to and things like that, I've never really given a solid answer and I think you can recall me ever giving a solid answer, and partly it's because I'm inspired by so many things and so many people. Someone who I really admire is Michael Jordan and I've got a podcast episode about him. I'm very much inspired by 50 Cent. These are all people that kind of influence how I have been able to interpret certain things and I've admired their ability to kind of, you know, cheer, determination and sacrifice to get to where they are. It's been harder, I think, with black females to feel inspired by black females and somebody could say, well, is it because you have your mother-daughter issues and I can sit here and say, not too sure, but I'm still inspired and I still admire certain things about my mum. So if you listen to the Negotiation Masterclass on the ToyTalkscom website, I talk about learning how to negotiate. The first understanding of what negotiation was came from my mum and every Saturday or every other Saturday, she would go to Dorsetown Market to get food for the house and I would often go with her dragging the trolley along in the puddles and in the puddles, in the rain sometimes, and often uneven floor, and I'd just be there in what I used to call the smelly fishmongers, but that's where my mum would go and she would sacrifice her time and she would spend the money that she had to, you know, feed her family. And I would watch my mum negotiate with the greengrocers and all these stalls I don't know if they're still like this, but all the stalls pretty much next to each other and my mum would use her ability to find a compromise that was also beneficial to her and she would be negotiating those prices and I'm telling you the satisfaction of my mum's face when she knew she got a really big like good deal. I would watch her for hours every week do that. And my mum was the first example to me about negotiation how to negotiate money, how to negotiate tangible terms that suit you. I learned that from my mum. So, in as much as I've never sat here and say I look up to, I, have been very much inspired and influenced by so many different people and, irrespective of what I've been through or seen or experienced, I can see him and tell you, with my mum, there was a lot of things I did learn from her and one of those things was negotiation.

Speaker 2: 6:42

But growing up, when people always asked about who they admire who they look up to. People would always talk about Oprah Winfrey, for example, whippy Goldberg, and these are the people that we would see on our screens and they would be. You know these people. We would hold them in such high regard because we know that number one there's not many of us and number two to have accomplished the things they have done. They're in a minority. But I never really felt that connection to Oprah Winfrey. I wasn't a fan of hers. I grew up watching the Oprah Winfrey show of course who didn't? But I wasn't a fan even when the colour purple first came out. I remember reading the book and I just never looked at Oprah Winfrey as somebody who I wanted to aspire to Also as well. I just want to point out we haven't seen Steadman in a really long time and I'm going to need someone to tell me what he's up to, because Steadman is steady, that one. Anyway, I talk about this to say that Oprah Winfrey has been catapulted again to the forefront because she's done. Basically, they did another movie on the colour purple and it was through her company, wetv, that did the production of that. And recently Taraji P Henson was on the press run to promote the colour purple because she's starring in it.

Speaker 2: 8:08

Taraji P Henson has to be one of my favourite female actresses. She's amazing. She actually embodies and encapsulates a character in a way that is just so authentic that you forget that it's Taraji P Henson and you believe she is whoever she is acting in a scene to be. Taraji P Henson to me stands out a lot because, number one, I've got her autobiography, which I think is absolutely brilliant. But also, as well, taraji P Henson was actually, I wouldn't say, recatapulted in Empire and she was paying a lead character, cookie Lyons, and she was fantastic, absolutely brilliant.

Speaker 2: 8:54

But Taraji P Henson, you would expect her to be a bit more far forward in terms of her career, with all the movies that she has starred in, and she's starred in so many acclaimed award winning movies, but as a personal brand, I haven't really seen it involved outside of acting. So, as Taraji P Henson's on her press tour, there's an interview that she has and she breaks down into tears. She fully breaks down. She said that she had to ask her team where are the deals Like? Where are the deals Like? What more do we have? Like, how are we leveraging all my success to have other forms of passive income? How are we making residual money? How are we allowing ourselves as a collective team to use what I have achieved and use my name to get me brand deals and endorsements? She says I have to and I'm power phrasing here, right.

Speaker 2: 9:59

But Taraji P Henson then goes on to say how do I pay my team?

Speaker 2: 10:05

Because everyone expects her to be a millionaire. But by the time she's paid everybody and what's left for her it's not looking at the millionaire status everyone's expecting her to have. And Taraji really breaks down and I really feel her. I can feel her pain. I can feel the ups to expect her as a black woman, the life that she had to get to where she is, the sacrifices and you know she was a single parent and she really documents how tough it was for her to provide for her son. So then, when she broke through the industry to become an actress, it really started to you know she really valued it on a different level, because it started to open up opportunities for her to live the life she knew that she deserved, but also to take care of her son. So for me, when I look at Taraji P Henson and you look at her in all her glory. We're talking about somebody who and I'm saying this in quotes because I don't know if she's a multi-millionaire but she's supposed to be.

Speaker 2: 11:03

Then she goes on to say that she sacked or she fired her whole team. She fired every single one of them. And then she talks about how, on the color purple you know she was there was nothing set up for them. They didn't have their own dressing rooms. They were asked to use their own transportation to get to set. This is the Taraji P Henson.

Speaker 2: 11:29

So before I get onto Oprah, I just need to deal with this. It made me sad in my heart because this woman is pouring out her heart and basically saying things are still hard. Then I have to question how much are you actually making from these movies? Like, if you can't trust your team to build and develop your brand, then I'm thinking you're continuously then being underpitched and not making that money. Bear with me for the color purple, she had to audition.

Speaker 2: 12:02

I'm coming back to Oprah. Follow me. I'm just dropping these things and I'm going to come back to Oprah because I don't even have bones to pick with her. I have a problem with Oprah. I have a problem with Naomi Campbell. Yeah, we're going to get into all of that. Two weeks I've been missing innit. Guess who's back? Toya's back, yeah, and I'm thinking how much, taraji, how much are you getting paid for these movies?

Speaker 2: 12:28

You're not anybody. You're not any small girl. You're not a small babe, auntie, you're a big woman. You've done enough in this industry. You blood, sweat and tears. You have had a number one running show in empire for years and then, 50th, ann came with power and it was. You know, I feel a couple of things. If you haven't seen that Taraji P Henson interview, I'll see if I can link it in the show notes, because it's something to be heard, it's something to listen to, because each and every one of us have been a Taraji P Henson or currently a Taraji P Henson, or we anticipate that, if we don't manage ourself correctly, we'll be like a Taraji P Henson, and this is what I'm going to say.

Speaker 2: 13:13

Taraji, you are the architect of your whole career. I don't need to tell you because, auntie, I know you know this, but I'm just reiterating it for myself to remember too. It is fully understandable, reasonable to have a team around you who are best in class at what they do to get you to that next level. And if it's brand endorsements, it's pitching opportunities or pitching opportunities to brands and creating those opportunities for you to be making additional income. But you're the architect of your career. No one's going to want more for you than you want for yourself. So this team that you sacked, they're not invested in your success the way you are. They're invested in getting paid, because you said that we said to pay them for the rest of the month, right, or pay them to the end of their contract, whatever the contract term says. So you're still bleeding money. Hair, makeup, clothes, premiers, press tools they all cost money. But I doubt whether they're negotiating this into their contracts because auntie is crying on the stage knowing that she still has to pay for that hair and makeup that she's crying into.

Speaker 2: 14:20

And it may be sad, because I remember Taraji P Henson did a collaboration on a lipstick with Mac and I thought why are you doing that? Why are you not coming up with your own collection with Fenty? Why are you doing it with Mac? Mac is so dated. I am over Mac, but I'm not over their core clip liner. I'm not over that, or some of their lip glosses I'm not over that. But I don't think any black actress of Taraji P Henson's calibre should be collaborating with a Mac. You should be collaborating with a Fenty who have the marketing budget to not only pay you but actually catapult you in the beauty industry in the way I feel like you could have been marketed because you have amazing skin, you have amazing makeup. Your makeup artist is clearly fantastic. A great fashion Taraji can dress. Her stylist is amazing. You could have done a whole commercial working with Fenty. You could have done anything. But you have the wrong team and they're looking at you in the wrong way. Taraji had this high when she was an empire and it was not utilized. And it's sad. This client that she's doing is because she deeply feels disrespected, because she's continuously being disrespected by the industry, that she has poured everything into the color purple.

Speaker 2: 15:41

Now press tour. Oprah Winfrey is there. Taraji is like oh pretty, know about this. She's saying all this stuff and I'm like Taraji, you had to audition for this part Already. There was a problem. Me personally. If I'm Taraji and you want me to act in your adaptation, I shouldn't have to audition. It should maybe just be a reading to see if there's a mutual synergy. But I'm not auditioning because I am the shit. But, you see, because she'd worked on her brand and they would know how to come at her. They knew that she needed them more than they needed her, and that is the truth of the matter.

Speaker 2: 16:17

I spoke about packaging. I've spoken about branding, I've spoken about being a subject matter expert throughout Toya Talks episodes, but we're now seeing live examples of things that are happening where people are not protecting, developing and actually putting some respect on their personal brand. You are an employee, you're still a personal brand and you have to elevate yourself so that you are elevated in the minds of people who interact with you and deal with you. That's the truth. I know who I am and sometimes I've often doubted especially in an industry that we as Black women are underrepresented. I've often had to question myself. Or when you've started a new job and you're having a meeting and everybody ignores you but talks to each other and you're talking. Or you've made a point and everyone ignores you. Even where I'm working now, they still do that. They still do that, but I've got nothing to prove because I'm bloody good at what I do. That's what I stand on. So when people say stand on business, I stand on the fact that I know who I am and I'll be damned if I allow anybody to make me feel less than, especially when I know I've sacrificed blood, sweat and tears to get to where I am. No nepotism, no handouts, no doors opened. I've had to figure shit out, and the people who eventually open those doors is because they have been convicted in who I am as a person. They've been convinced Okay, we know who. So they still had to be worked down to gain the trust of that person who's willing to open a door. But I have to do the work.

Speaker 2: 17:53

I think the saddest part about the whole Taraji P Henson thing is she hasn't said anything different to what Monique told us. Monique, this is my personal opinion about Monique. I think Monique is problematic because she's not consistent and I think that she's angry, but to a point where it is now interfering with her judgment and her credibility, especially what's happened over the last few days with her son, her oldest son. She should have dealt with that like a mother and she didn't. She dealt with it like somebody who was still looking for approval from an industry that has mistreated her. That's the truth. There was nothing, monique. Taraji P Henson said that Monique hasn't already told us and Monique talks about oh, it's the messenger. Well, yeah, it is the messenger, because Monique this is my view when Monique was talking about Oprah Winfrey and how Oprah Winfrey did her dirty which Oprah did and spoke about Tyler Perry and his messy ass he's messy she was right, monique was right, but you know how.

Speaker 2: 19:10

She had no strategy in how she was delivering that. I felt personally that she went on an interview and spilled her guts and she should have been strategic. I would have loved for her to do like on YouTube or something and said I haven't been able to do the Monique show for whatever because Monique used to have a talk show, so I'm going to do like a show on YouTube or I'm going to do a podcast. This is where she could have said it all here. She could have built this into her brand. She could have built this into a revenue receiving situation Still, shame them but done it in such a way that was so elegant that people wouldn't now be questioning her as a person, because now she's speaking about her son and that's a whole nother mess. And she could have handled that differently, because she was on stage yesterday and said F, my son, and I'm like girl, what are we doing? You're fighting this fire here. You're sitting this one ablaze. You're wrecking this one here. You're wrecking this one.

Speaker 2: 20:15

So when you're complaining about the messenger, the problem with you being the messenger, monique, is you are messy as hell, you're inconsistent in your approach. You are a queen, you are a gem, you are Monique, you are a household name. There was a point in your career where someone would say Monique, you're like oh yeah, monique, monique, now people are using you as opportunity to do caricature. They're laughing, so that's why. So Raji can say the same thing and people will be empathetic towards her in a way that they you may feel that they never showed you, but you haven't respected the situation enough to be consistent and focused. You don't have to address your son.

Speaker 2: 20:58

You could have given done a statement, said I will address issues with my son privately as a family, and I want to keep the focus on the things that I have spoken about my family businesses, my family businesses. Anything I've learned from what Oprah Winfrey did to me was that it is not only in my best interest but it's for my old mental health and for the interest of my family that I deal with family things privately. That's what she could have said, but she didn't do that. And the problem with Monique is because she doesn't do that. There's so many mixed messages coming from her that you don't even know what to focus on. But to Raji is unproblematic, hardworking, dedicated, honest and she's just herself. So that part of her personal brand is what you fall in love with. So when she's complaining about certain things, you're like actually, you know what. I remember Monique said it. Oh my God. I can see the legitimacy in what Taraji is saying. But let, if we're going to do a lessons learn. Let us learn that when you undervalue the qualities that make you who you are and you sell yourself cheaply to the highest bidder, there will be no respect in the end, you will be annoyed, you will be angry, you will be undervalued and you will feel used. And that's in all aspects of your life, every aspect friendships, relationships, work, career, everything. There is a lot of personal work that needs to be done in order for you to go out in the world, and the thing is with personal development is always a work in progress. You're always working on yourself, but you have to have the belief in yourself, and it takes a lot to have it. But you have to know that there's something special about you. It starts with just knowing that there is something. There is something.

Speaker 2: 22:49

When I was growing up, there was a point where I didn't even know what I wanted to do as a career. I was so confused. I just knew I didn't want to be a lawyer. But I knew there was something special about myself. I would say it, I would feel it, I would even say it to myself, even if I didn't believe it. I knew there was something, and what I wasn't believing is what it could be. But I knew there was something. And every time I put myself out there and every time I felt knocked back to I had a situation at work, I still believed there was something special about me. That was just something You've got to believe in your own source. You've got to.

Speaker 2: 23:29

You walk into a job interview and some of you are quivering, quivering, quivering. But you failed to understand a basic concept the fact that this person has shortlisted you for interview. They see something that could be a little seed, but for an interview process you're now watering that seed to blossom into something special. And that's how we are as humans. We all start off with something and we have to keep watering it until it blossoms and we have to keep it alive. And that's really hard, especially in a society where we are the most disrespected race ever, especially when we're disrespect and we're the most disrespected race and we're the most disrespected people Black women, we are the most disrespected. So it's really hard to keep reminding yourself that there's something special about you. But once you get to the point of accepting there's something special about you, you now have to put some value on yourself. That's why I say to you legitimize your credentials by going, doing that additional study, being a subject matter expert, whatever that entails. Go and do it. Stop cheapening yourself. To Rady P Hansen from the listen Kelly Rowland allegedly was supposed to hosta show.

Speaker 2: 24:49

Is it the today's show in America or what I don't know. It's a talk show. Allegedly, she was given a dressing room that was so small you could even swing a cat in it. She wanted a different one, because this is the Kelly Rowland here. Hello, do you know who this lady is? She is an. I don't know. I'm not doing that. You all know who she is. I'm not gonna be explaining who we are to each other. We know who we are. Jlo was doing a segment of that show and got a really nice big dressing room for her on to Rudge. Allegedly, kelly Rowland walked off and there's been so many stuff in the media. Bethany Merkel was that her name? Looking like a malnourished scarecrow, looking like a fossil fuel, is there talking shit?

Speaker 2: 25:41

Because whenever a black woman values herself, white women or non-black women usually have an issue with it, and they don't have an issue with it in silence. They have to open up the dating guns to come and tell us what their opinion is, and the word diva is so readily available to associate with us bullshit. Kelly Rowland knows her worth. You are asking and requiring my presence as the Kelly Rowland to come and co-host the show with you, and you know I come with not only a team, but I'm part of your team for the period of time that you have paid me to be available to do this show with you and you want to put me in a storeroom where I can't even swing a cat in it. But then you've got JLo in a room where she doesn't deserve to be because she's not doing it. She's not a host and she walks off and everyone's pissed off that she walks off.

Speaker 2: 26:30

When a black woman, when a black woman knows her value, she becomes a threat to those people who are committed to undervaluing her at all costs. When a black woman knows her value, she irritates and unnerves those who want to keep her boxed. When a black woman knows her value, she can achieve anything. Black women, my fellow sisters, it is time you understood what your worth is your time, your energy, who you spend your time with. Let me tell you I only have the weekends, and I barely have them.

Speaker 2: 27:12

Monday to Friday, I work full-time. My daughter's a nursery full-time. Saturdays I'm relatively free with my daughter, unless we have family plans, and on Sundays my daughter now does swimming lessons. I don't have a lot of time. So when I invest my time by spending my time with someone. It has to be number one, a value, a person who I value and values me, and there has to be a mutual exchange of good, positive energy. I don't have time to waste with people who do not add value to my life. I don't have enough time. This extends to my career. I will only go where I am valued and celebrated and I don't see it as a risk to walk away, because if I walk away and I close that door, not only one door open, several doors open, because I always create options, because there are opportunities out there that I can enjoy, where people understand the value that I bring to their organization.

Speaker 2: 28:10

There was a summercast, so on social media, and it said that if you are in a job for longer than two years, you already place yourself in a situation where you are underpaid. And what she's really trying to say when that woman said that is every two years, even within your organization, you should be leveling up. There should be a trajectory and objective for you to continue to grow, because if you're not growing, you're not making the money that goes with that growth. If you are not growing, you're stagnant. If you're stagnant, you are not growing. You're standing still and nobody grows standing still. You have to place value on what is uniquely special about you that you are now imparting to said other person or third party goes in a relationship as well. You have to know who you are. It takes time.

Speaker 2: 28:59

I did not know who I was until I was about 29 years old, and the most significant thing that happened that forced me to understand who I was is that my dad died, so 29 years and I did not know who I was. I felt lost. I had an idea of who I wanted to be. I had positive reinforcement from my father, but I didn't know who I was because the world seemed so scary, so confusing. I was just existing. I was, I was just existing and I was just, you know, doing my thing. I was African entertainment TV presenter. I was on Big Brother. I signed some deals in Nigeria. I was due to go to Nigeria and host and do all of this stuff. I was living my best. What I felt at the time was my best life, but I didn't know who I was.

Speaker 2: 29:44

I think I can look back and I can say the biggest lesson that I've learned that I'm gonna impart on to my daughter is the importance of identity and how you identify to yourself who you see yourself as and who you have been ordained to be. What is your purpose? And I'm gonna encourage my daughter to spend time discovering her purpose by creating opportunities for her to explore. I want my daughter to furnish every interest she has. I want her to be fearless in approaching things that are bit more challenging or with the focus of knowing who she is, because once she knows who she is and once she discovers her purpose, she will then be able to walk in that purpose not only majestically, but be walking in the purpose that has been ordained for her since the beginning of time. And once you walk in your purpose, every light starts shining everywhere. Lights up because suddenly you know who you are, suddenly you know your value, suddenly you know your direction and suddenly you create the boundaries that you need to to protect what you have spent so long discovering who you are.

Speaker 2: 31:07

When you know you are of greatness, you can't be running around on the floor with pigs. What you can't be running around on the floor with pigs when you know what your purpose is. You cannot be engaging with delinquents, no, and don't get it twisted. You will be tested, because the value of knowing who you are and the value of being convicted in your superpower and in your purpose requires challenge. It requires because you will have to place value on it and if it comes too easy, you will not know how rare it is to be able to have that blessing.

Speaker 2: 31:46

Some people spend years and I mean 50 year olds not knowing their purpose, and when they tell you about their life it almost feels like they're just trying to figure it out. Figure it out and mainly that's okay. But there are some people that need to be able to operate in their greatness for as long as possible. So part part of that means they need to know who they are, or at least discover part of their purpose to be able to go on the journey. I'm one of those people I know. Listen, I know somebody who's she's over 50 and she was. She said it to me and she'll stand and say to anyone I don't know what my purpose is, but I know that I'm here for a good time. I said to her maybe your purpose is just to have a good time. She goes well, until I feel otherwise, I'm gonna live my life to the fullest. This woman travels. There's not one country she hasn't been and she's content and she's happy.

Speaker 2: 32:37

I know, for me, until I knew what my purpose was, I was not content or happy. I was quite angry, uncomfortable, distressed, upset, like it was a lot. Then, when the light started to shine, I felt like I was operating in what had been ordained for me. It felt like home, it felt peaceful. Life was so uncomfortable and it was confusing and I just didn't know where I fit in. I was like I feel, like I always felt like this world. I'm just like an anomaly. I used to call myself a rock star, because that was the only thing that made sense to explain to people who maybe asked me certain questions or pointed questions and I didn't know how to answer it. So I deflect, so you can understand why.

Speaker 2: 33:25

When it comes to Taraji P Henson, I'm really passionate about what she shared, so bravely shared, but I'm really pissed off with people like Manik who do not know their greatness and then are just so willing to lessen themselves and cheapen their selves and cheapen their message because of whatever reason other than the fact that I feel like her and Taraji have said the same thing, but the reception has been different and Manik is not going to learn, she's not going to pick anything up from it. She sees it as being personal and it's personal because she allowed it to become that way. In my view and don't get it twisted Whoopi Goldberg said to Manik you should have come to me, I would have schooled you on basically how to do work for free. Whoopi, whoopi, you're always getting whipped by the whoopi. Don't let me focus on you because I'm still living my sister act too. Okay. So remember, you like that, not like how you have been running up and down, running amok for the last couple of years. So if you are interested, go ahead on YouTube and watch Shannon Sharpe's interview with Manik. And then if you type into Google or YouTube actually probably YouTube, taraji P Henson press tool, color Purple, you get to see kind of what she says, what she shares.

Speaker 2: 34:52

So my whole Oprah Winfrey thing I'm going to come to a bit later because I haven't forgotten her. But there's a reason why I want to. I want to bring it in later, Bearing in mind that Oprah Winfrey is the person who for a long time has joined the Costa Black Women Act in investment business. She's done amazingly. She's a billionaire. I think she's the first black. Is she the first black billionaire, female billionaire in America? I don't know, but she's a billionaire and she owns, owns TV, she owns a few publishing rights and she's Oprah. But we'll come back to her a bit later.

Speaker 2: 35:32

Do you guys remember Elsa Majimbo? Do you remember her? So Elsa got most of us, if not a lot of us, through lockdown. Elsa was the beautiful black queen from Kenya who would use her comic, her comedy, to kind of just. She was just, she was just hilarious and she had her glasses and her crisps and she would say all these things and she was just naturally just so funny. Have I wondered what happened to all those people that got us through the pandemic? No, because everyone's just living like on this quick, quick wheel of life where we just forget that a few years ago we was in lockdown and we were just trying to just get through the day and try to get toilet roll from the shop, from the shops that were sold out.

Speaker 2: 36:24

But anyway, I still follow Elsa, but that's because not only do I still enjoy her content, it's nice to see her evolution. She now lives in LA. Yes, she lives in LA. She's in her early 20s. I want to say she's like 23, but I think she might be a bit younger than that. But anyway, she lives in LA. She's had a lot of success off the back of a lot of her comedy skits on Instagram and she has really evolved and matured into a beautiful young lady and she is a comedian I would say a model, and I would say she's a content creator, she's an influencer, she's a personality.

Speaker 2: 37:11

Yesterday she shared something that was really concerning but so brave and I really thought it was important that I brought you here to the podcast. Elsa shared that people had been asking her about her relationship with Naomi Campbell and Elsa shared that she first met Naomi when she sent Naomi Campbell a DM and basically said you should love to meet her and everything. And Naomi Campbell effectively said she was already in Kenya and she'd love to meet her. So Elsa went and met Naomi and Naomi said you should come and spend the trip with us. So Elsa was so excited it's the Naomi Campbell. So she packed some of her stuff and spent the holidays with Naomi Campbell.

Speaker 2: 37:58

Now, during the course of this holiday, naomi Campbell had mentioned that it'd be really good for Elsa to do some type of a documentary about her life and Elsa didn't really take it too seriously. Now this is all alleged and this is what Elsa has shared, and I just want to caveat what I'm saying by saying that. So then Elsa, at the end of the trip, said they're goodbyes and she was just so grateful to have met Naomi, met so many different people as a result of meeting Naomi Campbell. So, fast forward, now she meets some people and they basically say, oh, you know Naomi Campbell. And then Elsa said yes and she goes oh, naomi Campbell told us that she made you, she literally created your career for you. So Elsa was like what? No, she didn't, and that's really important to note, because she didn't. We watched Elsa start her career in lockdown and I didn't see anyone knowing Naomi Campbell. We were following Elsa, but she didn't have 20,000 followers.

Speaker 1: 39:10

She's now in the millions.

Speaker 2: 39:11

I believe. Anyway, fast forward, a team of people reach out to Elsa and say we want to do a documentary about your life, kind of how you grew up in Kenya, your life in Kenya, locked down everything, and where you are now. She recorded it. Then she gets a call for a message. I believe it was a call from Naomi Campbell and Naomi Campbell was like I'm going to sue you. You took my idea, you're doing this documentary. And then she goes and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then. And Elsa's upset. She's confused, she doesn't understand and she basically apologises profusely to Naomi. She didn't mean it, she didn't mean to offend her, etc. Etc. Etc.

Speaker 2: 40:00

And Naomi cut the call and since then Elsa's career she feels that she's been blackboard. All those opportunities that she was having were no longer manifesting or materialising. Things had changed and the whole success that she had experienced was now plateauing and she put it down to be in blackboard, or allegedly being blackboard, or at least the influence of Naomi Campbell. Then she kept trying to contact Naomi. She kept apologising, sending messages and one day Naomi Campbell's message I said can you stop contacting me, I've got a child to race. So then Elsa knew some people that were holidaying or going to be, or due to be holidaying when Naomi Campbell, so she speaks to them and said listen, this is my situation. Please can you speak to Naomi? I just really want her to know. I did not do anything deliberately to offend her. I'm so sorry.

Speaker 2: 40:55

Long story short, naomi Campbell then gets in contact with Elsa and says why don't I hold grudges? Can you imagine the audacity? I don't hold grudges. What grudges are for you to hold? I'm not going to say something about Naomi, I'm going to leave that there Anyway.

Speaker 2: 41:15

Then every opportunity that then starts to materialise because once that conversation is had, things start happening again Restarted for Elsa. Elsa said that she confided in her mum that every time an opportunity now comes her way, she runs it past Naomi Campbell, every opportunity. And she was like this isn't normal, this doesn't feel healthy. I'm so scared of offending this woman. Now I tell her everything whether it has nothing to do with her, but now I feel like I can't take any opportunity unless I've run it through Naomi Campbell. Her mum's like no, that's not healthy, that's not normal. And Elsa withdraws. And yesterday Elsa shared that with us. Now that video has now been deleted off social media, and I'm going to encourage you guys to actually think about why.

Speaker 2: 42:12

Elsa has probably now felt that she needed to come out publicly and share this, knowing the consequences of what happened before, because before, when those opportunities started to dry up, she turned to drink and she was depressed. She felt like if she didn't try to resolve things with Naomi Campbell, her career would be over. So then she developed this unhealthy approach of telling Naomi everything in order to avoid offending her. Naomi Campbell has been problematic for a long time. You just, you know, you just write Naomi Campbell on the Google, and, whilst I believe there's three sides to every story, when Elsa was talking, all the hair on my body stood on end, and I tell you why. There was such an innocence in the way that she was talking. And the first question I said to myself was Elsa, if you saw the consequences, if you felt the consequences of what you have told us that were influenced by Naomi Campbell? For you to speak out openly, there must be something going on in the background that's causing you to talk. What are you suffering? What are you going through at the hands of Naomi Campbell that's now forced you to open up.

Speaker 2: 43:38

I thought it was brave, I thought it was bold, but I thought it was concerning. Can you understand what I say to you? When you're going to put your life into somebody's hands, you also put yourself at their mercy, and that ain't that. You see, when it comes to me, this is why I don't operate like them. No one and I mean no one can stand in my face and say if it wasn't for them, I wouldn't have XYZ or I wouldn't have a career, I wouldn't know one. No one can say that. I can acknowledge opportunities that have either been created but the catalyst is always the ancestors that have created certain things for you to create those opportunities. But I don't discount them or discredit them. But no single person can comfortably say that they made me or they made my career. That's crazy. That's actually mad. My parents did their best to give me what they could. They ensured that the foundation of my life was in education. They pushed me to be educated and I think at a stretch, my parents are probably the only people that can say because they made the life sacrifices. But outside of that, nobody can stand in my face and say that they made me because you didn't, and anyone that says that they made me. The ancestors are going to come after you because they want that glory for themselves, because they are the ones deserving of it.

Speaker 2: 45:04

I feel that Elsa was exploited because she's innocent, she's young, somewhat naive. I don't see the difference between what Elsa has shared and what Taraji P Henson shared, other than the fact that Taraji has been doing acting and stuff for a really long time and Elsa is very new to the industry. That's the only difference, and I feel as though Oprah Winfrey to Taraji P Henson is now only Campbell to Elsa. That's how I feel and I said it. I thought that Oprah Winfrey has never done anything tangible, especially for the black community, in the way that Tyler Perry has. Tyler Perry has his own problematic behaviour, but in terms of creating opportunity, you have cast Taraji P Henson in the colour purple. She had to audition already and then you don't have dressing rooms for the cast.

Speaker 2: 46:07

You are asking your team is asking them to find their way to set every day. How much did they get paid? Because no one wants to talk about that and people turn around and say, well, it wasn't Oprah. She has a team around her, but clearly the team reflect who Oprah is, because Taraji's experience in the same things that Monique did and Monique had direct contact with Oprah. So what's the difference here? Naomi Campbell, for me personally, I believe, is very problematic and if the allegations and the stories to be believed by Elsa, you're dealing with somebody who basically use their influence and use their power to blackball somebody not only younger than her but almost quite immature to the industry, just to wield some power, like to what end? I don't understand. Naomi, are you bored? I don't understand this. You are the architect of your career.

Speaker 2: 47:08

I've got a podcast called that, a podcast episode. You can't give people the pen to your life to write the story. It's your story to write is what I'm going to say. So before I close this episode, I want to quickly share something with you all, because I'm hoping that you can take some learnings out of this, and I've taken some learnings out of this, as I do every situation or any example of madness from fragile people in the workplace who seek to just wind us up for no reason or are threatened by us, so make it their sole purpose to make our jobs or our work life difficult. So where I'm contracting at the moment, the organization are really lovely. I've got to say that I've contracted in quite a few places throughout my contracting career and this will go up there as one of the most peaceful places I've worked.

Speaker 2: 48:09

No ag, they just kind of get on with it and I think part of it is also because they needed a subject matter expert for this project and they know that you have to value me because I'm good at what I do and also because I think I understand that If you want someone to continue on a project, you have to create an environment where they want to stay. So when I had my interview, there was three people. It was a one-stage interview and then I met the program director for the project. That was the second stage and then I was offered the contract. So in the first stage there was three people two men and a woman and I actually work with all three of them now. They're really nice. What you see is what you've got at the interview. They're lovely people.

Speaker 2: 49:01

So when I was airlifted onto this project, there's two streams of this project. One of them is a mess, but they have someone cleaning it up and is going to hand it over to me, and then there's another project which is fresh. It's just literally got signed off and it's good to go. So I get to contract manager and do the commercial assurances and stuff at the very beginning. So the first project that's a mess.

Speaker 2: 49:28

There was a lady on there and we're going to call her Morgan and Morgan her role was to conclude all the contractual stuff and when it goes into BAU then she sends it over to me. Now when I first met Morgan, I had a meeting with her and I met her. The first thing she said to me, her opening statement. I wasn't a part of your interview panel, but I'm told that you have the required expertise to do the role. Morgan is what? 25? The public sector would call her a fast streamer, because in this organisation that I work for she's like one of them. What do you call that? Graduates, that's it graduate scheme. So the equivalent is like a fast streamer in the public sector, but for the private sector she's more like gone through the graduate scheme.

Speaker 2: 50:24

I've got no problem with graduates, but the likelihood is that your in-person work experience doesn't match the amount of experience you have from education. So you've not had the ability or the opportunity to put all your academics into practice in life situations and you're coming into my face to tell me you wasn't part of my interview panel. I didn't say a word. You all know how I am. I didn't say a word. I'm just looking at you Because I'm sizing you up. You're talking too much. I'm sizing you up because I'm like okay, so I've gleaned from that that you're insecure. I've gleaned from that that I'm clearly a threat because they've told you about my credentials. That's all. You've seen my CV and I've gleaned from this that you've got a problem, that you wasn't part of the interview panel. But given that you are through the graduate scheme, the equivalent in the public sector is a fast streamer. It would make sense that you weren't part of the interview, darling, because what are you going to ask me? I don't understand that.

Speaker 2: 51:31

Anyway, anytime I ask for documentation from this woman, she'll ignore me, and on Teams you can see the little lie when someone's read. She'd read all my messages and just ignore me. No problem, I know how to be new. Ah, I was doing some reading, I was doing podcast stuff, I was doing toy talk stuff. That's your problem. You're paying me a day rate. You don't want to utilise me. You want to ignore me. I've got audit trial of me asking you questions. I've screen shot everything. So, if you like, ignore me for the rest of your life, I don't care.

Speaker 2: 52:07

Then we had a call with the supplier and I wasn't really happy with certain commercial stuff. So I said to them I need you to do this, this, this, this, this, this. So now I could see Morgan's eyes like prop up where she realised, oh, she can actually do her job. Then Morgan sent me, two weeks after I asked her, one of the four documents I asked her for, and the one that she sent me wasn't even complete, sounds like whatever. I was just listening. I was just doing the bare minimum at this point, because my thing is it's already been agreed that she would hand it over to me when it goes into BAU. What happened in between? That really has nothing to do with me, but for the purposes of my knowledge gap, I needed this document so that when she hands it over to me, I'm able to take it into BAU.

Speaker 2: 52:54

So then, a month later, she we're having a call, a scheduled call, with our external lawyers, and 10 minutes before the meeting, morgan's messaging me telling me she can't make it. Can I lead it? What exactly? I thought, okay, you know what cool. I said, yeah, no problem, bear in mind you don't respond to any one messages, but you know how to message me on Teams. Anyway, I let the call, asked questions and I leveraged the fact that I was new to get people to tell me what the issues were. Then I sent a summary email to the program director and to Morgan and said Morgan, please find below a summary of the call. This is my commercial issues and concerns. Unfortunately, you let me know 10 minutes before that you were unable to join the call, so hopefully you'll find my notes useful. Yeah, so I'm letting my program director know that she told me last minute that she wasn't on the call.

Speaker 2: 53:51

And, number two, I led that call. I don't need to confront her. I don't need to say nothing to Morgan. However she wants to manage herself is up to her. But me, I'm seasoned, I'm a seasoned professional and I can see a sabotage of my life and she's sabotage. So about eight weeks into it now I'm starting to finally kind of getting into the flow of things, just taking it easy, and I get a message from Morgan that she is going on international travel and she doesn't have the capacity to deal with this particular project. Can I lead it? Barely mind it's already been agreed and signed off that she would take it to be a you and then I'll take it over. And it's a mess, an absolute mess.

Speaker 2: 54:38

She used external lawyers for stuff that I could have just drafted myself and saved the company 10 to 15,000 pounds. But so when she sent me the message, I called her. I says before I agreed to anything, I need to understand why you've gone to external lawyers. She just confessed. She said I don't have the experience to be able to draw. I said, yeah, but I could have drafted at least two of those documents and even if we were going to give something to the external lawyers, you could have saved a company about 10,000 pounds by allowing me to draft two of those documents. And then I said to her I do not feel comfortable leading on this unless you sign off on everything, including the risk, because you have the background knowledge, because you were here. I wasn't here. I've only been here a couple of weeks, so I can take this where it needs to go, but you need to sign off on it and every document I send you will have that caveat. She said yeah, she swung off to America. Every email I sent her asking her, something she ignored. So I called Last week.

Speaker 2: 55:43

I had a call with the program director because she'd been away on annual leave and I said to the program director this is what I've been left with. This is not what we agreed. This is my plan. This is where I'm at now and unfortunately, morgan has not given me what I needed, so there's going to be delays and I need you to sign off on that risk. I also need you to accept that Morgan is going to sign off on every piece of document that has any historical knowledge or references, anything historical, because I can't put my hands on my heart and sign off these documents that have any historical information because I wasn't here for it. I can give you the commercial realities behind these documentation and the legal ramifications, but I can't tell. I can't, you know, talk about the history, because I was here.

Speaker 2: 56:30

My program director said Toya, I've seen the emails that you sent through and things you know for my information and I agree with how you've handled this and I want to reassure you that Morgan will sign off on every piece of document before it goes to the supplier because, quite rightly you wasn't here when some of these things happen. But I agree with you and your approach. Just take it as far as you can until it needs that sign off. But with the new project you can sign off everything, right? I said, of course, because I was here for them. Yeah, there's no problem.

Speaker 2: 57:07

You need to know when you're being set up and you need to know how to manage it. Some of you want to go all guns blazing and there's always more than one way to skin a cat. I've been doing this for a really long time. I've been a contractor for a really long time. I've been in my profession for a long time and dealing with people and understanding how people operate. I spend time watching people. If I was one of these people that didn't want to upset the Apple cart, I could have been signing off on stuff and exposing this company to risk that I had no business doing. That's number one. Number two I'm letting Morgan know I'm not a dumping ground for your bullshit. You want to escape this work. You're not going to escape it. You will have to find a way to find your frontier. Do you not allow people to set you up? And part of the setup is also your reaction to it. You've got to be strategic in everything you do. Everything needs an audit trail. Everything needs an audit trail. Take it off teams, put it in an email, copy and paste. If you have to do it, do it as an attachment, whatever.

Speaker 2: 58:15

As Blackburner, we understand the dynamics of how the world of work operates. We also understand the fragility of white women and their ability to tap into that fragility as and when they need to, in a way that Black women are never afforded the sensitivity or the empathy that white women are. All Morgan has to do is cry. I can see that Because once you say she's stressed, it was like oh please, girl, some of you graduates are fast streamers. You behave like this. It's like you want to be the bosses so badly and when you see somebody who's seasoned, you try to exert authority that you don't have Because you don't even have the experience. Anyway, you should be a student of life because at one time we're all graduates, we're all fast streaming. Anyway, me, I never did fast stream, but we're all graduates. At one time we weren't wet behind the ears, but humility is what's going to take you from A to B to C to D. You have to be a student of life and trying to set somebody up for your own benefit. I'm not a fool, but what I am is patient. Hopefully you've learned something from this that I've shared. And it doesn't remove the fact that the organisation working for the really lovely, really nice people they've already requested to extend my contract four times. I think they've sent the request four times to extend and I need to respond to them about that. But I think it's really important to understand the environment in which you work in. We haven't got a choice. You've got to because we spend time and it's really important to understand some of the things I teach her and share her on the Toy Tools podcast and knowing how to use and tap into certain strategies and apply it to your situation.

Speaker 2: 1:00:00

I'm going to leave it there. I'm going to thank each and every one of you for joining me on this week's episode of the Toy Tools podcast. I apologise that an episode wasn't available last week, but mum life and I want to thank each and every one of you for supporting me, especially on TikTok, ah, tiktok. They need to sort out this issue with UMG. They need to sort out that issue because, honestly, tiktok, your time is numbered if this UMG situation with the music isn't sorted. Anyway, I'm going to leave it there. Thank you so much for your love, your support, your DMs Please. If you are listening on Apple podcast or Spotify, please rate and review. Take the time if you want to participate in some of the polls that I have on Spotify as well. I really appreciate it. If you haven't already, then make sure you check out toytoolscom website I have put on there oh, how can I forget? The flexible working request should be now on the Toy Talks website and should be attached to every single masterclass, and it's a locked document. It's in it by example only, and it also has some guidance notes as well that I think you'll all find really useful.

Speaker 2: 1:01:10

If you want to follow me on any of the social media sites, I'm on TikTok Toya underscore Washington. I'm on Instagram Toya underscore Washington. Actually, no, my TikTok is Toy Washington, without the underscore, by the way. If you want to follow me on the Toy Talks podcast Instagram, it's Toya underscore talks. Of course, you can email in anonymously your work related or life related dilemmas. Email hello at toyswalkscom. In the subject box, just write that it's a dilemma and you can name the dilemma, anything that you think is more suitable. I hope that you've learned from this episode. I hope that you can pick some knowledge and apply it into your working life and into your lives, and I really do appreciate your love, your support, your comments, your prayers, your well wishes. Thank you so much. My name is Toya Washington and you have been listening to the Toy Talks podcast.