Fascinating Insights into Loving Adoptees Well w/ Dr. Laurel Shaler

When the journey of adoption winds its way into the heart, it brings a story rich with emotional hues and intricate bonds. Dr. Laurel Shaler graces us with her dual perspective as both an adoptive parent and a professional, weaving together the tender narratives of her own experiences with the insightful applications of the Five Love Languages in the world of adoption. Listen as we traverse through stories of unexpected blessings, the pangs of loss, and the nurturing touch that transforms an adoptive family's life.

Understanding the emotional landscape of adopted children is no small feat, and this episode offers a compassionate road map drawn from both personal anecdotes and Dr. Shaler's professional wisdom. We discuss the delicate process of setting boundaries in gift-giving, the sensitive nature of a child's attachments to their possessions, and how observant, intentional parenting plays a crucial role in connecting with a child's unique love language. Prepare to gain insight into the art of nurturing these precious connections through acts of service, quality time, and the careful calibration of gift-giving.

From the poignant moments that define family ties to the subtle shifts in open and closed adoption dynamics, we illuminate the evolving relationships and the importance of integrating an adoption story into a child's life narrative. With gratitude, we acknowledge Dr. Shaler's contributions and encourage our listeners to delve into her book "Loving Adopted Children Well," a guide that promises to enrich any heart touched by adoption.

Dr. Laurel Shaler's Favorites
Book: Loving Adopted Children Well
Website: www.drlaurelshaler.com
Bible: 1984 NIV
Journaling Supplies: Highlighters
App or Website: YouVersion Bible App

Transcript

Ellen Krause: 0:04

At the Coffee and Bible Time podcast, o ur goal is to help you delight in God's Word and thrive in Christian living. Each week we talk to subject matter experts who broaden your biblical understanding, encourage you in hard times and provide life-building tips to enhance your Christian walk. We are so glad you have joined us. Welcome back to the Coffee and Bible Time podcast. This is Ellen, your host.

Ellen Krause: 0:32

You know, building a family through adoption is a monumental choice that offers invaluable rewards, from the fulfillment of providing a loving home to the joy of parenthood. Adoption can also bring tough challenges, as sometimes love and bonding don't happen naturally and that can lead to emotional distress and frustration. Well, joining us today is Dr Laurel Shaler, who is very familiar with adoption and has a strong passion for adoptive families. Dr. Shaler has joined forces with Dr. Gary Chapman in the release of their new book Loving Adopted Children Well: A Five Love Languages Approach. Dr. Shaler is going to be sharing with us how the five love languages can help adoptive families implement practical strategies to foster love, hope and attachment during a time that can present unique struggles to families.

Ellen Krause: 1:32

Dr. Laurel Shaler is a National Certified Counselor, licensed Marriage and Family Therapist, licensed Professional Counselor and a Licensed Social Worker, she is a professor at Liberty University in the Department of Counselor Education and Family Studies. Dr Shaler is the author of Relational Reset Unlearning the Habits that Hold you Back and Reclaiming Sanity, hope and Healing for Trauma, stress and Overwhelming Life Events. Please welcome Dr. Shaler.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 2:05

Well, thank you so much for having me.

Ellen Krause: 2:08

I am so excited to talk to you today. You know this is a topic that is very, very dear to my heart, because I actually come from the flip side of not being an adoptive parent, but I was actually given up for adoption when I was a baby. So, as I was reading all of your information, it really forced me to take a deep dive and assess how my parents did in this process, and I have to say I'm amazed at how loved I felt. So it's exciting to see that adoptive children can be loved so well, but, as you mentioned, it can also be a struggle. So why don't we just start out, Laurel, with you telling us about your personal journey to motherhood and your own experience with adoption?

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 2:55

Yeah, I'd love to, and I so appreciate the fact that you're having me on your program, and especially in light of the fact that you're an adopter yourself, and especially in light of the fact that you're an adopter yourself. So we certainly, as parents, have a lot to learn from folks like you about your experience. So I really value hearing from those that have been adopted and so we came to parenthood through adoption. I like to share the fact that we did not know about our infertility before we pursued adoption. Adoption was God's plan for our family. We can't always understand adoption, because certainly it's frequently said it's a place where joy and sorrow meet, and so it always starts off with loss, and we have to acknowledge that loss, and yet, at the same time, there is a lot of joy and fulfillment as a result. So we pursued adoption.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 3:49

It took us many years. We had many bumps in the road, we had false starts and we had failed adoptions and no child that ever came into our home but I mean there was, you know, a birth mother would change her mind, or we would maybe get to a point where we were almost selected and then somebody else was chosen, or something like that. We had a number of those instances and it took about five years. And one night at my childhood church, my Sunday school teacher came up to me and said I know somebody who's looking um for some help. She has custody of one of her relatives and is looking for an adoptive family. And you know, things don't necessarily work out like that in the adoption world. And so I I was hesitant but I just went ahead and said, sure, you can give her my number. And a couple of days later I got a phone call and two days after that we met a child that would become our child. It was really a remarkable story and how the Lord just used his people to bring about this relationship and we were able to help.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 5:04

Our child was in a kinship care placement with a biorelative, and so we helped that family with, you know, with the caregiving, until we were able to get custody and then move forward with adoption, and so that process took about nine or 10 months and we were able to sign on the dotted line and the judge banged the gavel and said it is so ordered. And those were beautiful words, music to my ears, and so we were able to begin our parenting journey and we weren't sure if we would be parents of an only child or if the Lord would bring any more children into our home. But a few years later he did. And as long as our first adoption took, our second adoption happened in the blink of an eye because we got a call from the adoption attorney who helped finalize our first adoption.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 5:56

And he said Laurel, I know this young lady who is eight months pregnant and she's looking to place her child for adoption, and I don't know if it's a boy or a girl or anything really, but are you interested? And I said yes, yes, yes. And he said well, do you want to ask your husband?

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 6:14

The answer is yes, and so, thankfully, I knew my husband Now we've been married almost 21 years, so I knew him well enough to know that he would say yes, and so we once again were able to pursue adoption. But this happened very quickly. So about a month later we got a call the little baby was actually three days old at that time and so we immediately went to the hospital, signed paperwork, took custody and of course it took a few months to finalize the adoption. But we had our little guy from the hospital and again thought, well, this could be it, and we're so blessed and we have a son and we have a daughter, and this is wonderful. And then the Lord said you're not done, you're not done, you have another bedroom and you need another child in that room.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 7:02

So we just prayed about how the Lord might further our family, further build our family, and he totally blew our minds by revealing to us that we needed to pursue embryo adoption. And so our third child came to us through embryo adoption, came to us through embryo adoption, and so I for those that don't know what that is I am my child's birth mother and adoptive mother, but not biological mother, and so embryo adoption comes to be when another couple has in vitro fertilization and they have a remaining embryo that is frozen, that, for whatever reason, they're not able to have transferred into the mom on that end, and so, instead of having the embryo destroyed, they choose to place the embryo for adoption. And so we received this embryo and I had it transferred into my womb and I got to carry my own child or my adoptive child and give birth, and so it's really remarkable. So I have a four month old baby, and so that's how our family has been built, wow.

Ellen Krause: 8:15

That is so beautiful. Laurel, you have experienced multiple different ways of doing adoption and, honestly, when I was reading about that, it had never even occurred to me that embryo adoption was a thing. I mean, I just had no idea, but it is absolutely incredible. So you have lived out all of these different types of adoptions. Tell us about your experience learning and attaching to each of those three children, and then I'd love to have you get into why it was you wanted to write about it.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 8:54

Yeah Well, you know, first, I love that. You said a few moments ago that you felt so loved as a child, and that's really my heart is for my children to never feel less than to never feel. Second best to know that that, even though I can't completely explain it, that God's plan was for them to be in our home and to be raised by us and for me to be their mama and them to be my children, and that, though it's not always going to be easy, that that, this is, this is what was meant to be, and so I just want them to feel loved, and I just always felt so strongly about that. And you know, truth be told, I've really had the great fortune of the moment I've laid eyes on all three of my children, of falling in love instantly, and that doesn't always happen, and that's okay if it doesn't happen and I don't take it for granted that it happened for me and for my heart if it doesn't happen and I don't take it for granted that it happened for me and for my heart but just because my children were adopted very young, that doesn't mean that they don't struggle as a result of their experiences, and so some of it has to do with pre-birth.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 9:58

I mean, things can happen when you are in your birth mom's tummy and she's going through a stressful time. You're going to experience that stress. If somebody is placing their child for adoption or if somebody's having their child removed from their care. There's stress there. There's something going on. Obviously that's resulting in the need for that to happen. Sometimes they make choices that result in harm to the unborn baby, and so those are things we can't minimize.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 10:32

And then, as I mentioned earlier, every adoption starts with loss. So even if you had a birth mom that took great care of herself and had as low stress as possible I mean obviously it's still a difficult experience, but had as low stress as possible and everything went as smooth as possible there's still loss because on both ends right, the bio mom has lost, that. She's been separated from her child. I mean how heartbreaking. And then also likewise, for the child has been separated from the only person that they've known. It's like they're literally inside of their mom's body and they can hear their mom's heartbeat and it's gone, and that is painful and it's not always realized by a young child, but it is a loss that we can't ignore. So I think it's really important that we recognize that even children who are adopted very young can go through loss. That is not to say that every child who has been adopted feels this deep sorrow or deep longing or has you know, is not adjusted or not attached. I'm not suggesting any of that, because everyone's journey is different, but we do want to recognize some of those factors and so, for me, a part of it.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 11:42

It was just I just know, because of my background as a clinician, like there could be some stuff that comes up and I want to be prepared and I want to love these kiddos to the very best of my ability. Okay, so how did it come about with the five love languages? Well, I had been reading, doing lots of reading about parenting and how to parent. Well, and you came across Five Love Languages for Children. So I'd read the original Five Love Languages. It's been around since 1992. It sold millions and millions of copies.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 12:19

And then the book with children with Ross Campbell. Dr Gary Chapman collaborated with him and I was reading that book and as one of my many resources and as I was reading through it, I thought, oh, this is awesome, this is so helpful, and I wonder how this might apply to an adoptive family, or, oh, I wonder if maybe there's something that could be added here that maybe would be helpful. And so, as I was thinking through those things, this idea came to my mind. Well, fast forward.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 12:50

I'm at a conference with Moody Publishers. I had published a book with them, I was doing a book signing, and I was there. That book was Relational Reset and Learning the Habits that Hold you Back. And I met Mr John Hinckley, who was the acquisitions editor for Gary Chapman, and we got to talking and he liked the idea, and so he agreed to approach Dr Chapman and pitch this idea, and we moved from there. I was able to meet with Dr Chapman and talk through my ideas, and he shared some of his ideas. And, you know, we just felt like it was something that would be beneficial, that this would be a helpful resource, and so we moved forward with this project, and so now we have the book. That's so cool, laurel.

Ellen Krause: 13:34

You can just see how God has orchestrated your entire story. Well, let's talk about how adopted children experience the love languages, perhaps differently than a biological child.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 13:51

That's right. Yes, yes, that's actually a great way to look at it. Well, the one that I almost always go to first, because I think it's the most clear example, is with physical touch. So I think we have to look at what may have happened in a child's life before they came into your home. And even for a child like mine, who, who two of my children were never they came to us from the hospital and one was in a very loving home before coming into ours, so there was no, no harm in that regard.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 14:23

But even those children might respond differently. They they may find that they need more physical touch because they find it to be reassuring that that they feel like, like that they belong, find it to be reassuring that they feel like that they belong, that they're supposed to be here. When they start to feel discomfort or worry, that like, oh, this helps me to feel reassured that I'm loved. But if a child has experienced harmful touch or no touch at all because they were neglected, then approaching them with touch is going to take some caution. So it's not that you rule out physical touch, but you want to be cautious.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 14:59

I recently had the opportunity to actually hear Dr. Chapman speak on five love languages in the workplace, which is really interesting to think through. And he said you know, sometimes human resources will say let's not talk about physical touch, we don't do physical touch at work. And he says wait a minute. It may not be anybody's primary love language in the workplace, but that doesn't mean that we should ignore it. Like some people benefit from a handshake or from a pat on the back, we just have to know what's appropriate and what somebody's comfortable with and what they want, and so, with our children, we have to think through what may have happened that could be resulting in them being hesitant. Is there a way to approach them in a way that's a little bit more cautious? A few examples that I can give you.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 15:47

One I was chatting with another host and she said you know my, and she gave me permission to share their story. And she said my kids never wanted to be hugged, but they love to have their feet rubbed, and so that was the way that she connected with them. Is that she would rub their feet, which you know I love that. I love that that's so sacrificial especially if you don't like touching somebody's feet really sacrificial. Or it could be something as simple as when you're swinging a child on the swing or when you're putting their shoes on. Even though that's an act of service, there's also physical touch involved. So looking for ways to physically connect with a child that maybe doesn't love it can be a way that you're demonstrating hey, we're not going to just, you know, kick physical touch to the curb, but we're going to start to introduce touch, and that's so healthy for the child because they can begin to learn what safe, healthy, nurturing, loving physical touch looks like and feels like.

Ellen Krause: 16:44

That's so interesting. I know. For me, physical touch is definitely one of my love languages. If my husband and I are watching a movie, for example, I just want to be close enough where I'm touching him, like my leg is touching him or we hold hands. I also love his foot rubs, so it's just thought provoking that even as an adult, it kind of carries on those things can make us feel so loved. So tell us about one of the other love languages.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 17:19

Oh sure. So another one that I'll share is on gifts, and one of the things it's so important that we always talk about and Dr. Chapman talks about this even with the book just for all children is that all children need to receive love in all five of these ways. So we're never saying that just because they prefer one that you ignore all the others like, just because your child's favorite love language or top love language isn't receiving gifts, doesn't mean you should skip out on a birthday present or Christmas present, like you should still, you know, give them gifts because you know, more likely than not, they're still going to like them. It just may not be what really lights them up, like some of the other things would. But one of the things that I think about with gifts and in my own personal experience, is I've always tried to like.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 19:00

I found myself trying to compensate or overcompensate for some of the loss that my children have experienced by just giving, like giving things to them. You know, maybe I mean we. You know we've got lots of toys and puzzles and stuffed animals and all these things and sometimes I found that it's not always helpful to them and it's not really loving to them. So I'll give an example where I didn't have good boundaries and I'll give an example of where I have had a good boundary in gift giving. Um, I remember I had a I had an experience with my oldest child where we were going to a consignment sale um an estate sale really at somebody's home and they had some lovely old dolls and they were porcelain and she was too young for a porcelain doll but she loved them and I wanted her to have it and I didn't want her to miss out on something, and so I got her this porcelain doll and like the next day she broke it and it was like, oh well, I shouldn't have done that. So I needed to like deal with my own you know issue of trying to like just make her happy, and so you know, I recognize that. So where I've set the boundary in gift giving is I um was given a dollhouse when I was a little girl that my daddy made for me and I've had it restored for my daughter and I haven't given it to her yet because she's just not at the point where she can? Um handle it, and so I don't want it broken, and so I and I think she would be sad if she broke it, because she knows how meaningful it is, and to me as well. So sometimes gift giving is about setting boundaries and not just, like you know, oh, let me just overcompensate, you don't have anything, let me just give, give and give and give.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 20:41

Last night I was at a training for volunteers for a local organization that helps to create spaces inside of social service offices for kiddos that are there and awaiting a placement, and so it's a really great ministry, and one of the things that we're talking about is, like you have to be so careful if you're going to move anyone's belongings, Like if you're going and you're even just cleaning up the space, you don't just pick up a kid's stuff and move it. These children that you don't know who, what's in that bag might be the only possessions they have in the world and it's so valuable to them. And you want to be really careful with those items and make sure that you recognize that possessions can be very meaningful to some kids, especially if they've had loss. And so I know that for my daughter, like she has a really hard time getting rid of anything, and I firmly believe that a part of the reason is because she's experienced loss in her life and it's like I don't want to let go of anything.

Ellen Krause: 21:43

he opposite. my goodness, I know I'm cringing because I feel that way. I never really knew why, but maybe can you elaborate on that a little more. That's so interesting?

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 21:57

Yeah, for sure, for sure. Like in our experience, and some of what my oldest child has experienced isn't just because she's been adopted, but she's experienced other loss in her life. Because she's been adopted, but she's experienced other loss in her life. In the first few years of her life, my brother died, my father died and she also the relative that she lived with when she went home from the hospital also died, and so she experienced a huge amount of loss by death. And then also we moved and there was a period of time where my husband was deployed, so she was without daddy, so it was, so there were some hard times, and so I've just discovered that with her, she just doesn't like to let anything go. It's like you, just it all signifies a loss in some way.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 22:41

So I've discovered that usually I have to like, give it some time, like, even if it's something that to me is clearly trashed I'm not talking about like a candy wrapper, but you know something that, like, you know, oh, all these scraps of paper that are left over from a project you made and we can't really do anything with these teeny, tiny little scraps, let's put them in the trash, like for her. No, I have to save everything, every note that she's been given, and some of it. It's not really genetic because we're not biologically related, but it's kind of it's kind of nurturing, because I keep like cards that people have given me so I get it. It's not to say that just because you are sentimental and you keep things, that it's like a trauma response, but it can be a trauma response and so I think that that's something to recognize with gift giving like that. It can be really meaningful to be given gifts, but at the same time we want to be conscientious about what we give and the reason behind giving it.

Ellen Krause: 23:35

Yeah, that's so true, and I think about myself growing up during the teenage years. We didn't have a lot of money, but one thing that I feel like my parents did really well was if I only got like one thing that was maybe a little bit more expensive, it was always something that I was really hoping or wishing for and that I loved. So I remember one Christmas I got roller skates and I mean I was on cloud nine. I rode those things till the wheels broke off in my basement because we had this unfinished basement and I would just fly around there with these roller skates on. I loved them so much. I just remember it was the best gift and they knew that I loved roller skating because I would go to the roller rink. So I think just being sensitive and observant about your kids and what they would really, really love makes such a big difference.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 24:39

Yeah, and you said a really important word. You said observant. And even when we talk about the love languages, sometimes people ask well, how do you know what your child's love language is? It's really, you just observe, like what really lights them up. You know you may have a child that if you pick out that special gift like that is super meaningful to them and they could just thrive on that.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 25:02

But another child like, oh well, that's nice, but what I really would love to do, instead of being given this really great, you know, basketball, basketball, goal what I really want is to play basketball with you, like it's, let's spend time together. It's that quality time and trying to figure out what's really the most impactful to them. I've discovered that with my kids, like acts of service, it's super meaningful to them. My four-year-old can can put on socks and shoes, but sometimes it's just a matter of connection. I want you to put on. Will you please put on my socks and shoes for me? And there's a reason for that because it's meeting a need, and that need is for connection.

Ellen Krause: 25:41

I read that in the book and it just warmed my heart so much that you picked up on that. It's not that they couldn't do it, it's just that they wanted you to be part of that moment, which I think is so awesome. Well, dr Shaler, I wanted to talk to you about one thing that you briefly touched on in the book a little bit was open versus closed adoptions and how that kind of plays into the whole background of a child's adoptive experience. Back when I was growing up, it was a closed adoption, so tell us a little bit about the different kinds of open adoptions that there are now and how that impacts a child.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 26:33

Right, right. So historically adoptions were closed, meaning that the biological parents and the adoptive parents don't know each other and they can't get in touch with them. And sometimes, you know, the placing parent might know who the adoptive parent is and just never disclose themselves. I mean my own. He was my step-grandfather. My grandfather died when my mother was a teenager and on my mom and dad's wedding day my grandmother met a man in the grocery store. She stopped by the grocery store on the way home from the wedding to pick up cat food and she met a man and got remarried, and so it was really kind of kind of sweet that they met that way. But my step-grandfather Frank he was was just left like in the back of a police car. So I mean, you know obviously his, his birth mom, who left in there. I mean, you know, she could have been observing, she could have been keeping an eye on who picked him up and where he went. I don't, we don't have any idea. They didn't even know exactly how old he was, so he never knew his exact birth date and all of that. So sometimes that but that could be the case, but typically closed is nobody knows who the other one is, and in those cases oftentimes the child was not told that they were adopted, um, and so sometimes there's there's there's times in the past, um, where they never knew, or maybe they found out later, which can be really difficult. I mean, as I'm sure, um, you can imagine, listeners can imagine, you know, let's say you're, you know, 14 years old and you're looking through some of your parents' stuff and you find something that indicates you're adopted. I mean the shock and the broken trust that can happen as a result of that, of some of the research that clearly indicated that this was not helpful.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 28:35

There was a move for semi-open adoptions and even open adoptions, and a semi-open adoption is where you're going to go through a mediary like an attorney or an adoption agency, so the adopting family might write letters and include pictures and give that to the agency and the agency might then give it to the bio mother. An open adoption is where you just all know who the other one is and you can communicate openly. Our situations are a little bit unique With our embryo adoption. It's completely open and that's wonderful. That was our third adoption. With our second adoption I met the bio mom and we haven't had any communication since, but met one time pre-birth, and with our oldest child it's more open, certainly through some of the relatives because of that connection that we made with them. So we don't go through anybody to communicate.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 29:41

You know, oftentimes adoptive families have to determine what's safe and in the best interest of their child. I mean, that's the priority, it's the child or the children Like what is in their best interest. And so sometimes that means we can't have any communication with bio family. And sometimes you can, and sometimes it can change, like because people change and so somebody might not be safe and then they may get the help that they need and they may become a safe person, a stable person, and maybe there can be some connection. Other times, when the child grows up, you know the adoptive family will give the information and then the child seeks out and pursues a relationship.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 30:22

Oh man, I can just think of so many stories through the years as I've talked with people about what all this looks like and the impact, and it's hard. I can think of one young man who shared with me that he was seeking out his bio parents once he was an adult and bio mom just said I don't want to have anything to do with you. I don't want a relationship. I placed you for adoption for a reason and I just can't go there. It's too painful, which just added more pain, you know, to him and to his heart, so you never know what that might look like. So this is some of the stuff that kiddos who have been adopted have to grapple with, even if they were adopted at birth.

Ellen Krause: 31:06

Yes, absolutely, and that's exactly what happened to me and something that I didn't expect at all. You know, I had kind of glamorized the whole process. I thought it was going to be like a TV show. You know where I'm going to meet my biological mother and it's just going to be this wonderful, amazing thing, but it just didn't turn out that way. However, with my parents, they did such an amazing job because I don't even remember them sitting me down and telling me I was adopted. I always knew, I just always knew.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 31:43

That's the best way. That's just the best way that it's just incorporated into a child's life and story, to where they don't remember being sat down, being shocked I'm adopted, no, it's just part of their life, like there was never a time I didn't know.

Ellen Krause: 31:58

Right, right. You know, being adopted isn't something that I told a lot of people about, and I can remember back when I was in middle school, my best friend and I. We were driving one time with my dad and she and I were in the back seat and my dad was in the front seat and I remember her looking at me, looking back and forth at him, and then me, and then him, and then me, and then finally she said yeah, I think you do kind of look a little like your dad. And I just remember my dad turning around looking at me in the backseat and giving me a wink, and it was just a moment that I'll cherish forever. I didn't think it was important that my friends knew that I was adopted. I just wanted them to know that this was my dad and I loved him and that's all that matters. Yeah.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 32:53

And that's why we have to be so careful. I got a. I was on a call and show recently and somebody called and said, why are you saying adopted parent, adopted children? And I said, oh, great question, it's solely for clarification. Like, because in real life I would, I would never do that. You know, adoption is not anything to be ashamed about. My children can tell whoever they want. But like I, wouldn't, you know, even accept. If somebody said this is Laurel and her adopted children, I'd be like, whoa, these are my children. Yes, they did come to me through adoption, but these are my children.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 33:25

Now, sometimes I'll say, with the embryo adoption, people are so fascinated by it that sometimes they'll share you know with people because they think this is so neat, isn't this neat? And they know that I'm open about it, and so that's okay, as long as it's set in a spirit of like, education and respect and even joy, but but not in like a oh, I want you to know these kids were adopted. I've got some friends that have adopted a solo parents and even in this day and age they have found that sometimes their relatives will make it clear to others this is, this is my daughter, so and so and these are her adopted children. Because they don't want people to think that she was divorced or that she had children and she wasn't married. And it's like you know and my friends have said, I don't want people to do that Like I don't care what people think. The Lord knows, like the Lord knows, it doesn't matter what people think. These are my children. So I think it's really important that we recognize that.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 34:16

So I appreciate that story and I know I remember sweet moments with with my daughter, where she, you know she'll talk about us being twins and you know we're so much alike. So we have brown, we both have brown eyes. Mama, like we're twins. I'm like I know, isn't that? So isn't that so neat that we both have brown eyes? Um, and I always tell people like, cause they? They comment and they say our children look like us and they do, and that's, that's beautiful and that's sweet that the Lord did that. But even if we didn't look alike like that, that's okay too. That's great too. Like it's just. However the Lord puts us together, you know we're, we're following through with his call on our lives and it's okay whether we look alike or whether we don't look alike.

Ellen Krause: 34:54

So yeah, yeah, it is, and love surpasses all those things. I think of my brother who also was adopted and he has blonde hair and blue eyes. My mom and dad both had blue eyes, so I was kind of like the odd one out having brown eyes, but my dad loved my beautiful brown eyes. He used to say but that was his way.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 35:26

Oh, that's a word of affirmation that's so beautiful. He wanted you to know. Hey, your eyes are different than our eyes and they're beautiful, and you're beautiful and I see you and I recognize you and I love you. So that's so awesome.

Ellen Krause: 35:40

Well, my goodness, Dr. Shaler, I could just talk to you all day, but I know we both don't have time for that. So, as we wrap things up, tell us about how your book differs from the five love languages for children and why this will help adopted families.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 36:01

Yes, for sure. So I appreciate you asking so. First of all, I share a lot of stories from those that have adopted and from children who were adopted, so adult adoptees. I think that's really important, that we hear stories. I think that that can be super helpful. It tries to be an encouragement.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 36:17

The book is an encouragement for families that are struggling maybe with connecting with their children, with connecting with attachment, connecting with feeling loving. That's not to say that they don't love their children. Dr. Chapman always says that the question isn't whether or not you love your children, it's whether or not they feel love. So we start with the presupposition that you do love. You don't go into adoption without love, but do your children feel loved?

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 36:43

And then also there's chapters that are specific to unique challenges, like I mentioned, solo parents. So if you're dealing with solo parents, if you're dealing with a husband and wife that are not always on the same parenting page and I share some examples in that chapter, even from me and my husband and we look at how to get support, you know this is such an area of need. Every parent needs support. Parenting is hard and, like, this book is not saying that if you're parenting bio children it's not hard that's not the point but that there's some unique challenges with parenting children who have come into your home through adoption and it's really vital that you get the support that you need, and so we talk about how you can get support. So those are some of the unique factors about the book. Certainly, you can ask for this book at your local bookseller, or you can order from amazoncom, or you can check out my website, drlauralshaler. com.

Ellen Krause: 37:36

Awesome, and we will put all of those links in our show notes, so if you're driving, don't worry, you can check it out later Before we go. I want to ask you some of our favorite Bible study tool questions that we ask all of our guests. So what Bible is your go-to Bible and what translation is it?

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 37:54

So for a very long time I have leaned towards the 1984 NIV and now it's become the Bible that I mostly just take to church because it's so filled with highlights and notes and it's falling apart. I love the expression of Bible who was falling apart usually belongs to someone who isn't Um, so it's falling apart but that's my go-to. But another Bible that I'm working through right now is a chronological Bible and it's also a coloring Bible, so it's been really neat to like. You know it's. It's not. It's not a Bible that you can use as a study Bible specifically, like I can't look up a chapter and verse necessarily because they're not right next to each other always, but it's, it's chronological and it's really really neat to explore it sure is.

Ellen Krause: 38:39

I love the Chronological Bible too, because there are parts of the Bible that are in different books, but they happened at the same time, and so the Chronological Bible just ties it all together. So that's such a great suggestion. Okay, Do you have any favorite journaling supplies or anything you like to use to enhance your Bible study?

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 38:59

Well, just recently. I'm a big highlighter and just recently I was excited because I was at Hobby Lobby and I saw a highlighter that was specifically made for Bibles because it's like for thin paper, and so I haven't used it yet but I'm super pumped to try it because I always find like just the highlighters kind of bleed through. And I definitely love to journal. You know, as a clinician I've always been a big journaler and I've always suggested journaling to folks and I've done a lot of that and I don't necessarily have any specific suggestions except to just do it. Like you know, I like to have a pretty journal. You don't have to have a pretty journal, you can have a notebook, you know, just a regular old spiral bound notebook and a pen. But journal, because it can be so therapeutic to like get your thoughts out on paper.

Ellen Krause: 39:48

Okay, last question what is your favorite app or website for Bible study tools?

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 39:54

Yeah, I just love, you know, the Bible app. I think it's super helpful. Some of my colleagues and I will sometimes jump on a study plan. I also have a couple of study plans that I've written that are in the Bible app. So that's my go-to. I mean, there are so many wonderful websites. I mean, my goodness, in this day of technology, there are so many. We do have to be discerning and make sure that what we're reading really lines up with the Word of God. So that's really my only other suggestion. But the verse of the day, like have it just sent to your email and just start right there, like, just get that, even if it's just that one verse first thing in the morning to get you going, yes, that's a great tip.

Ellen Krause: 40:33

All right, we will put a link to the Bible app in our show notes For those of you listening. We also do have a Coffee and Bible Time devotional on the YouVersion Bible app as well. Dr. Shaler, thank you so much for taking the time to be here today. I know you are very busy, so I certainly appreciate you being here. This is a topic that's very near and dear to my heart, and your heart as well, and so many of those that are out there listening. It's been a joy to share this with you.

Dr. Laurel Shaler: 41:06

Oh yes, same here. Thanks for having me.

Ellen Krause: 41:09

All right, and for our listeners, if this is a topic that resonates with you, a friend or perhaps a family member, be sure and pick up a copy of Loving Adopted Children Well. W e will have the link available in our show notes for your convenience. All right, we thank you so much for being here today. We love you all. Have a blessed day.