Howard Mattson: Plan One Financial Group (Woodbury, NJ)

Today Ete sits down with Howard Mattson, founder and owner of Plan One Financial Group.

These days researchers are finding that there are specific characteristics that help people to succeed in life, in business, in everything. You've no doubt heard about the importance of "grit," and having a "growth mindset," and realizing "post traumatic growth." Howard Mattson is the poster boy for these qualities/skills, which becomes apparent when you hear a few of his life stories.

As a teenager, Howard ended up in a coma, nearly died, and missed his senior year of high school. But he counts the accident as one of the greatest "blessings" in his life because of what it led to. Howard wanted to learn about investing, so he "bugged" someone in the business until that person finally relented and agreed to show Howard the ropes. Confident that he could do this, confident that he could learn whatever he needed, he threw himself into this work and realized he loved it. Despite doing all the right things, working hard, having success, and investing all his money into the company, this unbelievable (but true) story ends up with Howard making the choice to walk away with absolutely nothing. The injustice of what actually happened is heartbreaking and maddening. But what does he have to say about the events? He explains why these crazy events turned out to be beneficial in the long run. When asked about difficult times, Howard tells us that it was difficult to come up with one, because he "couldn't think of one struggle that wasn't followed by tremendous growth." Is he delusional? Is he in denial? Not at all. This is who he is. And we hope this comes through in the show. Howard has consistently decided to move forward with genuine optimism and gratitude no matter what has been thrown at him.

Howard's unique strengths and abilities are no doubt a major part of why, today, he finds himself running a highly successful business, a work which he absolutely loves, while living a rich and fulfilling life outside of business, full of family (he takes Friday - Sunday off and uses it exclusively for family time) and music and art and books and travel. He's built a life around his values and desires, and it's certainly worked out for him. "I pinch myself every day," he tells us.

Lest you think that this episode is all about life lessons, we must say that Howard dishes out some meaty, very-worth-a-listen insights about business in this conversation. Though he doesn't toot his own horn in this episode, Howard's company, Plan One Financial Group, is very impressive and very successful. He knows what he's talking about. If you want to build a brand with a stellar reputation this episode is a MUST listen. And take notes. From forming real relationships with clients, to what creating the right team has done for him, to finding mentors (including a different take on what they can teach you), to getting involved in coaching programs, to the 3 rules of starting and running a business that stand out to him, check out what Howard Mattson has to share in this episode of The Company Next Door.

Transcript

Ete : 0:17

Hey, what is up everyone? It's Saturday with another episode of The Company Next Door. I'm excited today because my my last guest was Megan with Trail Talk who, as you've heard was from South Jersey and my guest today is also from South Jersey. So I got a little lucky there, it doesn't. It's the first time it's happening. So I'm going to put them put them back to back for you. But today joining me here visiting, visiting Park City, is Howard Mattson of Plan One Financial Group. Howard. What's up, man?

Howard : 0:47

Ete, it's good to see you, brother.

Ete : 0:48

It's been a minute.

Howard : 0:48

It has, yeah.

Ete : 0:49

Yeah, we just realized it was 20–and–

Howard : 0:53

11.

Ete : 0:53

11. Since last time, we saw it last time you were here.

Howard : 0:55

That's a long time.

Ete : 0:56

At the Montage.

Howard : 0:57

Right.

Ete : 0:57

And you know, some work, work rewards. I don't know what you want to call it in your world. But you guys were here, we went bowling–

Howard : 1:04

Yes.

Ete : 1:04

–at the bottom of the Montage, because for those of you haven't been to the Montage, try to get in there somehow. Just sneak in there. It's a pretty sweet place. And anyway, so he's back in town and I heard he was coming through. Wanted to have him in this show because he's got a really cool business, he has built a great company, a very successful company. And I'm anxious to hear more about the workings of it as much as we can talk about. Now, I will get this out right up front. There are some things that we, some details we will not be able to discuss because of the industry.

Howard : 1:34

Sure.

Ete : 1:35

And so we will hopefully be able to get good content, make it interesting and keep Howard protected in the way that he asked.

Howard : 1:42

That works. Great.

Ete : 1:43

So I told him if I, if we go anywhere we can't go, just kick me and we'll figure it out. But one thing, I'm excited to learn about this business because from my opinion, actually, I'll just jump in right here and then we'll backtrack. Howard, from my viewpoint and watching you and your business over the last twenty–

Howard : 1:59

–five years.

Ete : 2:00

25 years. And what are you, 28 years old?

Howard : 2:04

I wish. I'll be 45 next month. So a little bit less than 25 years. But we're, we're averaging up, right?

Ete : 2:11

So from my perspective, I work in the service industry, it's very reliant on a lot of volume and a lot of technicians and people. And I want to ask you this. Is your service, as reliant on that? Because it looks really simple to me. Not not your skill–

Howard : 2:29

Sure.

Ete : 2:30

–but the operation of the business. Am I missing that? And is it simple at all, or no?

Howard : 2:34

You know, I guess, I guess you can make anything simple if you do it long enough, right?

Ete : 2:39

Yeah.

Howard : 2:39

You know, and, and sometimes I think when you've been doing something as long as a couple of decades, you almost seem like an overnight success, right? And so, that overnight success is 25 years in the making. So is it simple? You know, I think that, you know, we're in a people business, right? So, the conversations that we have with folks is, many times, about the most important topics in their life to them, right?

Ete : 3:08

Yeah.

Howard : 3:08

So if you're genuine, if you're sincere, if you're open and honest, if you treat them as you would want to be treated in that situation, then in that way, it's simple. I mean, but there's all this stuff on the periphery that takes a technical expertise and–

Ete : 3:24

Years and years of development.

Howard : 3:25

–a bank of knowledge.

Ete : 3:26

Yeah.

Howard : 3:27

You know, experience that probably only time could bring, right?

Ete : 3:31

Yeah. And you've got a team now.

Howard : 3:33

We do.

Ete : 3:34

So you said you have five or so.

Howard : 3:37

There are five of us total.

Ete : 3:37

There's five on your team. How long have you, have you, always had a team for the last 25 years? Or was it taking you a minute to build that up?

Howard : 3:44

Oh, yeah, definitely. I mean, we brought on people as we've needed to, you know, and I think that we'll continue to bring people on as we need to. You know, at this point, with our firm–and one of the reasons why we named it what we did–and I'll kind of share with that with you further.

Ete : 4:03

Yeah, please.

Howard : 4:04

So Plan One, right? So the one side of that name, the O-N-E, has a very specific reason for that.

Ete : 4:12

Okay.

Howard : 4:13

The O is for the objective advice that we give.

Ete : 4:15

Yup.

Howard : 4:16

The N is because it's based on a comprehensive needs analysis. And the E is an exceptional customer service experience. So whenever we bring in a customer, we make a commitment to that customer to see them, you know, for the lack of a better analogy, sort of like a dentist's office. So whenever you leave my office, you leave an appointment to come back in a six month timeframe. So we're always in front of those people that we've made that commitment to. So any advice that we've given them we're accountable for, because we're going to see them on a regular basis.

Ete : 4:47

Because your talking–But you're not as painful as a dentist?

Howard : 4:50

No, no. Hopefully not, right?

Ete : 4:53

So you're building relationships with clients.

Howard : 4:55

Yes.

Ete : 4:55

And and how long do clients stay with you? Because I know, as we were talking before, I think you had over a thousand clients?

Howard : 5:01

Yeah, so we're right around 1200 now, right, so, so obviously, we would rather that a client never leaves us, you know, but, you know, you have situations where, because we're dealing with people, a lot of times in the later stages of their life, they may pass and often their kids and grandkids end up working with us as well. So, we hope clients never leave us and, and I've had clients still, from the day that I started my practice back in 1996. That are still with me today.

Ete : 5:28

So 25 years.

Howard : 5:29

Yeah. Yeah.

Ete : 5:31

So which is awesome, because your E which is exceptional customer service–

Howard : 5:34

–Customer service experience. Yeah. That's right. Yeah.

Ete : 5:36

That's the proof right there.

Howard : 5:37

Yeah.

Ete : 5:37

I mean, if you, if you can keep a client 25 years, which is older than some of our listeners, you're doing something right.

Howard : 5:44

You know, and a lot of these people become like family. You know, if you're in that relationship business, you can't help but love some of the people that you've known and worked with for decades, right.

Ete : 5:54

Have you ever been invited to one of your client's, family event or something?

Howard : 5:59

Sure. Sure.

Ete : 5:59

Really?

Howard : 5:59

Yeah, yeah, I have a client, clients that do those sort of things. I have, you know,

Ete : 6:05

A barbecue, or...?

Howard : 6:05

Yeah, sure. I get invited to a client's family reunion, you know, that he does every year out by the Jersey Shore. So...

Ete : 6:12

Down the shore?

Howard : 6:13

Yeah, yeah.

Ete : 6:14

Wow. That's, that's awesome. And I love that because it seems in 2020, the client, the customer experience has become less and less a focus, focal point for many businesses with automations, with bots and all these things, which is great. But I really believe what you're saying is, at the end of it, you've got to have a great relationship between the customer and the company. Now, do these 1200 clients all have a relationship with you? Or is it your team? And how do you–Do you break it out so one team member is responsible for these 400 people or how do you work that through?

Howard : 6:46

Yes, so the way that we do it in our firm Ete is, is each person on the team has a very specific, very defined role. So primarily, I'm dealing with the clients that need my level of expertise and that have, that I've made the commitment to continue to work with them.

Ete : 7:06

Gotcha.

Howard : 7:07

You know, and then we have in our office, other licensed advisors who work with other clients, and we have an administrative team there as well.

Ete : 7:15

So for the most part, if I was to walk into your office–and you just got a new building. Yep. We just bought a building. In Deptford or is that in West Deptford?

Howard : 7:21

It's in Deptford.

Ete : 7:22

Deptford. It's got, it's got more space than you need.

Howard : 7:24

It does. You know, so right now, I mean, we occupy the, the main and the upper floor, you know, and there's actually some finished office space downstairs, that you know, where we could spread out even further, but you know, who knows that may get rented at some point. Yeah, we're still–

Ete : 7:39

Yeah. So if I was to walk into your office in Deptford right now, chances are probably would not sit down with you, unless there was a special request or we had some type of relationship. I would sit down with one of your peers?

Howard : 7:51

Well, it depends. I mean, so. So my clients, you know, one of the big ways that our firm has grown over the years is through the people that are satisfied with our service.

Ete : 7:59

Sure.

Howard : 8:00

So those people, so really the, the folks that come to me really come from two different places, they either come from another client whose friends or family members or colleagues are looking for the same level of attention they're getting.

Ete : 8:12

Yeah.

Howard : 8:13

Or they're another financial professional, maybe like an accountant or an attorney or a CPA who sees that we have a specialty that they don't. So when those clients come to me through one of those clients that I have, then you bet it, I'm meeting with that client. I'm not turning them over to someone else. They have my attention.

Ete : 8:31

Yeah, because their friend recommended them.

Howard : 8:33

Absolutely.

Ete : 8:33

You got to go talk to Howard and, okay.

Howard : 8:35

I wouldn't have it any other way.

Ete : 8:36

I love it. So do you have to advertise then? It's been 25 years?

Howard : 8:39

I don't adverstise. No.

Ete : 8:40

Have you ever?

Howard : 8:41

We, we really don't, no.

Ete : 8:42

Ah man, that– By the way, when I said simple in the beginning, I was kind of meaning more of this type of work.

Howard : 8:46

Sure.

Ete : 8:47

In my industry, it's a massive effort and expense to constantly advertise.

Howard : 8:50

Yeah.

Ete : 8:50

So that sounds amazing.

Howard : 8:51

Yeah, we don't advertise. I mean, obviously, like other businesses where they have to have a huge inventory that's stored somewhere.

Ete : 8:56

Yeah.

Howard : 8:57

You know, we're lucky enough not to have that. The strategies that we quote, unquote, sell are the processes that we built over that 25 year period. And it's all, it's all brainpower, you know, it's all strategy that way.

Ete : 9:13

So you've been building this, and we will go deeper into these. This is kind of my overview. You've been building this company for 25 years.

Howard : 9:20

That's right.

Ete : 9:21

And so today, 2020, what does your day to day look like?

Howard : 9:26

Yeah. So my schedule personally–

Ete : 9:28

Yeah.

Howard : 9:29

You know, because I do have a family at home.

Ete : 9:31

Yeah.

Howard : 9:31

It's Monday through Thursday.

Ete : 9:32

A big family at home.

Howard : 9:32

Yeah, yeah.

Ete : 9:33

You've got five, six?

Howard : 9:35

We have six kids, six kids in total.

Ete : 9:35

Yeah. That's awesome.

Howard : 9:37

So my schedule, personally, is Monday through Thursday. And Monday through Thursday, typically, my first meeting is at 10am.

Ete : 9:43

Okay.

Howard : 9:44

Gives me a little time to prepare for those meetings. And my last meeting might start at 7pm. And I'm doing that Monday through Thursday. And then my commitment is, is to my home to my family Friday, Saturday and Sunday. I have zero appointments those days.

Ete : 9:57

I love that boundary setting.

Howard : 9:58

Yeah, yeah.

Ete : 9:58

That's actually really hard to do as an entrepreneur. What if you get a call on the weekends? I mean, have you taken it? Or–

Howard : 10:04

You know, my team is just great at that part of the service end of it, right? I mean, they know. I mean, obviously, every once in a while I have to get involved–

Ete : 10:12

Sure.

Howard : 10:12

But it's so few and far between.

Ete : 10:13

Oh, that's awesome.

Howard : 10:14

Because they just handle things as well as they do.

Ete : 10:15

So your weekends are just committed to your family.

Howard : 10:18

They are.

Ete : 10:18

How important is that to you? I mean, you've got six kids.

Howard : 10:21

Yeah.

Ete : 10:22

You guys– Yeah, like I mean, obviously, that's gonna help you balance your, your work life, but, but how did you get to the place where you're like, you know what, Friday's off. This is family time. Were you forced into it? Like, were you working so hard in the past? And your wife's like, "Hey," Michelle's like, "Hey, you know what, we need you at home?" Or was this always how you did it?

Howard : 10:40

You know, it's, it's been this way for a few years. And I think it was a test case that we did one summer. We said, you know, I'm not going to work any Fridays this summer. And that worked well. Just the–

Ete : 10:51

You or the whole team?

Howard : 10:52

Me.

Ete : 10:53

Okay. Gotcha.

Howard : 10:53

Yeah. So and, and to be clear, so the office is still open Monday through Friday.

Ete : 10:58

Sure. Gotcha.

Howard : 10:58

It's just I'm not in the office on Friday.

Ete : 11:00

Your schedule. Okay.

Howard : 11:00

And, and that summer, just the connection that Michelle and I had, my wife and I had, was just fantastic.

Ete : 11:07

I love it.

Howard : 11:08

So, so we made the decision to take Friday's out of the equation for, for business and just focus on the family.

Ete : 11:15

Wow. And I bet, I bet the kids love that too. They know Friday they got Dad.

Howard : 11:18

I hope so. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's great to see them. And then obviously, you know, they've, over the 25–or it'll be 25 years in, in April to be to be exact–over those years, the way that I've watched my children grow, because I was able to be there–

Ete : 11:34

Be with them, yeah.

Howard : 11:35

–on those Fridays, Saturdays and Sundays, I wouldn't trade that for the world, right? So there's no level of success that I would take to exchange that time with family. I wouldn't change, I wouldn't, I wouldn't change that in any way.

Ete : 11:48

Yeah, we need to put that on a bumper sticker right there. But no, I think that's such a, it's such a hard thing as an entrepreneur cuz it's fun to build something.

Howard : 11:56

Sure.

Ete : 11:56

And like you're saying there is no level of success... I mean, you can have all the monetary success you want, success you want. But at the end of the day having a happy family life–

Howard : 12:06

Yeah.

Ete : 12:06

–and kids and a wife that can count on you and know you're there for them. Not just like physically but emotionally–

Howard : 12:12

Yeah.

Ete : 12:13

–that's, that's everything. To me.

Howard : 12:14

Sure. And I can't take all that credit, right? My team is just fantastic.

Ete : 12:18

Yeah, of course.

Howard : 12:18

So, so them being able to be there on the Fridays when, even when I'm not, you know, they're, they're due all the credit. Definitely. And they're they're phenomenal at what they do.

Ete : 12:28

Awesome, man. That's, yeah, I love that. So you were born and raised in South Jersey area.

Howard : 12:33

I was, yeah.

Ete : 12:34

So you're like Jersey Jersey all the way.

Howard : 12:36

Yeah. Right.

Ete : 12:37

And you don't have any intentions of leaving anytime soon.

Howard : 12:40

You know, before all this COVID stuff started happening, I was probably traveling once a month.

Ete : 12:45

To?

Howard : 12:46

I'm, you know, I do some, I'm part of an industry coaching program. I sit on the board for a company that's out in Phoenix. You know, we do our normal family travel. So on average, once a month, I was going somewhere.

Ete : 12:59

That's awesome.

Howard : 13:00

But yeah, always returning back home to South Jersey. So I, we moved in to the property that I live on right now back in 1979. And then I bought that property from my father. Michelle and I, my wife and I built a house on it in 2008. And it's our–

Ete : 13:15

That's awesome. And you said you just bought the property next door?

Howard : 13:17

We did.

Ete : 13:17

So you've got three acres.

Howard : 13:19

A little over three acres.

Ete : 13:19

And, it's very, it's a cool area, guys. It's a, it's just woods. That's not really a word here in Utah but, woods is like forests, you know, it's like– That's a South Jersey, you know–

Howard : 13:28

Yeah.

Ete : 13:28

There's woods everywhere. There's just a lot of trees. There's, you know,

Howard : 13:31

Sure, you can be in our backyard and not see anything but our house and our pool and trees. That's it. Yeah.

Ete : 13:34

That's awesome. That's awesome. So growing up, now I remember and I don't remember all the details. Maybe you could share it with us–

Howard : 13:41

Sure.

Ete : 13:41

–but I know that you had an accident.

Howard : 13:44

I did. Yeah.

Ete : 13:45

Can we talk about that?

Howard : 13:46

Sure. Yeah.

Ete : 13:47

That was so interesting to me.

Howard : 13:48

So, so all throughout school, you know if you would ask–I'm talking about high school–

Ete : 13:59

Sure.

Howard : 13:53

–grammar school, elementary school–if you had asked me what my, what I was going to do for a living, I was either going to be an artist or a musician.

Ete : 13:59

Love it.

Howard : 13:59

They were the loves of my life.

Ete : 14:01

But you decided to make money. But no, gotcha. Yeah.

Howard : 14:04

And then I was 17 years old. I was driving with a friend of mine. He was in the driver's seat. I was in the passenger seat. And he, he was an inexperienced driver. He was actually, he had a permit. So he was a novice driver. And I was actually the licensed driver in the car. And he took a turn a little too tight, during sort of a treacherous turn out in the woods area of South Jersey. And he ended up hitting a car. We spun around and we hit a couple of other cars. And that night I was, I was ejected from the vehicle. So I don't remember that day, Ete so, so–

Ete : 14:40

Just blanked out?

Howard : 14:40

–Just getting in the car. Yeah, that, so, you know, there's that, probably in that period where you're, you're in a dangerous situation, sort of, parts of your brain just I think click off.

Ete : 14:52

Yeah, for sure.

Howard : 14:53

Just to kind of keep your, your your energy in the right place.

Ete : 14:56

Yeah.

Howard : 14:56

Yes, but I was medivaced to Cooper Hospital.

Ete : 14:58

Wow.

Howard : 14:58

I stayed in Cooper Hospital for a month. I was actually on my way out of the hospital to go back home, and then my throat closed up. So actually from them putting the intubation tubes in, they scarred up my throat, and I had to have an emergency surgery to take out the scar tissue. That didn't work and they had to do it a second time. So when they sent me home, they sent me home with a trach.

Ete : 15:20

Wow.

Howard : 15:21

Yeah.

Ete : 15:22

17.

Howard : 15:22

17, right.

Ete : 15:23

So like a junior, yeah.

Howard : 15:25

Missed my senior of high school. Ended up going back the year after. So I had, all my friends had graduated at that point. You know, it's one of those blessings in life because that's how I met my wife and a lot of my best friends in the world came from me going back–

Ete : 15:38

Yeah.

Howard : 15:38

–even though all my friends had left. But long story short, when I was 20 years old, I got an accident settlement. Now from where I grew up, sort of in the, the rural area of South Jersey. It wasn't very white collar. It wasn't very money oriented.

Ete : 15:55

Sure.

Howard : 15:55

It was a blue collar–

Ete : 15:56

Yup.

Howard : 15:57

–farmy area–

Ete : 15:58

Yeah.

Howard : 15:58

–and all my friends and family members had all these great ideas about how to spend the money that I was getting.

Ete : 16:04

Bet they did.

Howard : 16:04

But ideas like, bet football games, buy buildings, support my friends' music efforts, you know. And I actually thought long and hard about it and made the decision that I was going to invest every dollar. Literally at 20 years old, I didn't touch a dollar of that money that I received. And I was just so intrigued at that point, about the ways that you could grow your money, that I bugged the guy that I ended up investing that money with, to the point where he said, "Howard, if you want to know so much, come and work with me." So that's what I started doing at 20 years old. And then within six years, around 26, I became a partner in that firm. I was the youngest person on the team there. And you know, fell in love with the business.

Ete : 16:54

Let me ask you this. So you were, you're going, because I'm missing something here. You're going through high school and like you said your, your brain was like mine. It's all about music and art, right? That's what you want to do and you have this accident. Fast forward three years, you're 20, you get a settlement. And there's just like maturity that you have somewhere gotten to invest it all. Because no 20 year old would ever do that, right? I would have invested it in my guitar collection.

Howard : 17:18

Sure.

Ete : 17:19

So did something happen? Was it related to the accident? Did you have to, did you rethink the way you thought after the accident? Or no?

Howard : 17:28

You know–

Ete : 17:29

What was the impact of that accident, I guess, on your on your, your emotional, mental state?

Howard : 17:34

You know, so. So I love my parents, right? My, my parents are fantastic people. But I guess earlier on in life, I was able to notice that some of the reasons that they were in the financial situation that they were in was because of the decisions that they had made. So really what drives me even today is to help people get out of their own way financially.

Ete : 18:00

Yeah.

Howard : 18:01

Right? Because there is sort of a clear path to success.

Ete : 18:04

Yeah.

Howard : 18:05

But it's a path that's not often taken, right? Or at least, there's, I think once you have that knowledge, you start down that path. But a lot of people don't gather that knowledge maybe until it's almost too late, right, till till way later in life. So, I know, I and, and for me music and art is still a part of my life.

Ete : 18:26

Sure.

Howard : 18:26

It doesn't have to be a business.

Ete : 18:28

Yeah.

Howard : 18:28

Maybe that's a bit better that way, because I get to still enjoy that. But you know, do what I do and, and enjoy that as well.

Ete : 18:36

Wow. So, so you literally get a job just by asking questions and being like, super curious?

Howard : 18:43

Yeah, I guess I mean, I, I would imagine maybe there was something that he saw in–

Ete : 18:48

Yeah.

Howard : 18:49

–my passion for it, right? That, that kind of pulled him in that direction.

Ete : 18:53

Well, I love that because you know, I think, and this is a conversation I've had with other entrepreneurs, but you know, we talk about the value of have college education, the value that our society puts on it, the expense of, the crazy amounts of debt.

Howard : 19:05

Sure.

Ete : 19:05

And we, I believe that for some it's fantastic. For others, I don't know.

Howard : 19:10

Yeah.

Ete : 19:10

But I love what you're saying. Because you're saying just pure passion and curiosity.

Howard : 19:15

Yeah.

Ete : 19:16

Because that's probably what he saw, you know, wow, this kid is more interested in, you know, so I think there's a, I think there's something there, you know, with just being curious about something. And finding your way into things too.

Howard : 19:28

Yeah.

Ete : 19:28

You know, it's like, sometimes it's, it's, it's about how you go about things, not so much the degrees of things you have. I don't know if that makes sense.

Howard : 19:34

Sure. No, it does completely. And I guess, you know, if you were to look at your own business, and if you saw a young kid who came to you and said, "Ete, I want to know more about what you do," right? "Show me."

Ete : 19:43

Yeah, I would take them under my wing. And yeah.

Howard : 19:45

You'd love that.

Ete : 19:45

Yeah.

Howard : 19:45

Somebody has passion for what you do.

Ete : 19:46

I think that, so anyone who's listening, if you really want to have some success, there might be a route just through that.

Howard : 19:51

Sure.

Ete : 19:52

Find someone in the area that you're really fascinated in. Just bug the heck out of them like Howard did. So you get in there. He gives you a job. Within six years, you're the youngest, but you also, you're rising up through the company.

Howard : 20:03

Yeah.

Ete : 20:04

And you make this decision, somewhere around there, I've got to go out on my own.

Howard : 20:07

Yeah.

Ete : 20:08

Walk me through that timeframe. What what sparked that decision? And what was the headspace going into it? Some of the fears, some of the excitements.

Howard : 20:15

Yeah. You know, that probably in my career was one of the toughest things I'd ever gone through, right?

Ete : 20:22

Okay.

Howard : 20:22

But it's something that I would not change even by one measure. So, at that point, you know, the firm was, was successful. And then we had an issue in the economy that really sent it into a tailspin, right? Just that firm, or everybody? Well, every–we had 9-11, we had the technology bubble, we had all that stuff going on. And at the same time, my partner had a congenital heart issue that put him into the hospital for a period of time. So, and at that point, I ended up exploring and found my faith and those things kind of collided. So this guy came back. The, the faith that I had committed to, the faith that he had, he felt were at odds with each other. So actually, I was sitting in his office one day, and he said–it's kind of a weird story and it may, it may be more of a gloomy–

Ete : 20:45

No. I like gloomy.

Howard : 21:22

–sort of perspective then you might want for a podcast, but–

Ete : 21:26

Nope.

Howard : 21:27

He said, Howard, you got two choices. You can repent and come back to the church that he and I were going to, and we can continue the partnership. Or you can get an attorney. I can get an attorney. We'll see whose God win's was his. his moment so I actually, Ete, gave up–

Ete : 21:44

Awesome.

Howard : 21:45

–gave up the ownership in that partnership–

Ete : 21:46

You did?

Howard : 21:47

–and moved on. Yeah.

Ete : 21:48

So okay, we got to dig into that man.

Howard : 21:50

Sure, sure.

Ete : 21:50

Unpack that. That's crazy.

Howard : 21:51

Yeah.

Ete : 21:51

So make sure I got it right. You guys were of the same faith at the time, or the same church?

Howard : 21:56

Correct.

Ete : 21:57

Even...and then he's like, this isn't gonna work. He's saying you need to repent. I mean, whatever your new thing is, that's wrong.

Howard : 22:03

Yeah.

Ete : 22:04

And you're like, and gave you an ultimatum.

Howard : 22:06

And his own way, you know, he felt all the stuff that was happening in the economy was God punishing him in the business for me going in this different direction, right?

Ete : 22:17

Wow.

Howard : 22:17

Pretty, pretty strange stuff.

Ete : 22:19

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Howard : 22:19

But, but that's exactly how it happened.

Ete : 22:20

That's how it was.

Howard : 22:21

Yeah. So, so I left and you know–

Ete : 22:25

Was that a big like, I mean, I'm just, you're, are you, how old are you at this point roughly?

Howard : 22:29

I was 26.

Ete : 22:30

Okay, you're 26 years old. So–

Howard : 22:31

So the way that our that our business worked, is that money that I got as an accident settlement, I gave him to buy into the firm. So I was a partner in the firm–

Ete : 22:42

Gotcha.

Howard : 22:43

–based on the money. So everything that I had received from that accident settlement–

Ete : 22:47

Was in this business.

Howard : 22:48

–was now in this business.

Ete : 22:49

And now he's giving you this ultimatum because of this new faith that you found

Howard : 22:52

Right.

Ete : 22:53

Wow, that's..

Howard : 22:54

Yeah.

Ete : 22:54

There's something there. But...

Howard : 22:56

Yeah.

Ete : 22:56

Anyway, so...

Howard : 22:57

So, so he comes to me with that ultimatum. You know, after thinking long and hard about it, praying about it.

Ete : 23:04

Yeah, like is this a matter of days. I mean, I just can't imagine a 26 year old in this situation. Everything's on the line.

Howard : 23:11

Yeah.

Ete : 23:11

I can't imagine the head just spinning like...

Howard : 23:13

Sure.

Ete : 23:13

How did you, how did you walk through this decision?

Howard : 23:17

Um...

Ete : 23:17

Can you remember back, or?

Howard : 23:18

Yeah, I can, you know, and obviously it wasn't an easy decision–

Ete : 23:22

Yeah.

Howard : 23:22

–cause it was everything that I had wrapped up into that business. But just something about it felt like I was making the right decision. Right, I had made a commitment to that, to, to my wife, to the faith and felt like continuing the way that we were wasn't the right thing for me–

Ete : 23:44

Wow.

Howard : 23:44

–going forward. You know, and, and so, you know, I respect this guy who's, who's at this point passed on, right, so I don't want to say anything negative about–

Ete : 23:53

Sure.

Howard : 23:53

–him either, because, you know, he really gave me the, the gateway into this thing.

Ete : 23:58

Took you under his wing.

Howard : 23:59

Sure.

Ete : 23:59

You got all this knowledge.

Howard : 24:00

He was like a father figure to me. So you know, he's a guy that I love.

Ete : 24:03

Which makes it even harder though when he comes to you–

Howard : 24:05

Sure. Sure.

Ete : 24:06

–with that ultimatum.

Howard : 24:07

Yeah. So. So, you know, he hit me with that ultimatum and I had to make a decision whether to stay or go and I made the decision to go. Now, it's interesting, you know, in the way that the world comes full circle. At that point, our firm probably had 21 other advisors that we were working with.

Ete : 24:24

That's big.

Howard : 24:24

Yeah, right. And a couple of them had heard that I was leaving, and then asked if they could come with me. So I end up moving on.

Ete : 24:31

Okay.

Howard : 24:32

Some of those that–

Ete : 24:32

So what, so clearly there was something that they were seeing in you because I'm just picturing myself. I've got two options. How old was this, this, this guy at the time, roughly?

Howard : 24:44

I would guess he's maybe that maybe he was in his late 40s, early 50s, something like that.

Ete : 24:47

Okay, so you've got a guy who's in late 40s. Anyway, more experienced than–

Howard : 24:50

Sure.

Ete : 24:50

–a 26 year old. Got 20 something advisors.

Howard : 24:52

Yeah.

Ete : 24:53

Gives you this ultimatum. You decide to walk. But people follow the 26 year old.

Howard : 24:58

Yeah. You know, I guess, you know, at this point after the fact. You know, you can have a mentor that you learn a lot from.

Ete : 25:06

Sure.

Howard : 25:06

You can also have a mentor that when you step back, maybe a lot of what you learned was also what not to do. Right?

Ete : 25:15

Yeah.

Howard : 25:15

And so this guy had a good mixture of both of those things.

Ete : 25:18

Gotcha.

Howard : 25:18

What to do–

Ete : 25:18

Sure.

Howard : 25:18

–and what not to do, right?

Ete : 25:20

So you're 26. You're like, okay, I'm gonna go here. How many people decided at that time to come? Just one or two others?

Howard : 25:26

Yeah, so actually, it was the majority of them. So maybe three or four stayed behind, and the majority of them came over with me. So in our business, I was running sort of the the advisory team that we had the relationships with those advisors. So I had built concrete relationships with them over the years. And, and I think everyone else had recognized some of the same faults that I had in this other advisor that I had moved away from.

Ete : 25:55

So let me ask you this. When you left because you said, you know, all your money was tied up in this business. Two questions.

Howard : 26:03

Not only that, Ete. So the income that I was earning was–

Ete : 26:07

Was, that went away?

Howard : 26:07

–that went–No, well that actually went into the firm pot, right?

Ete : 26:10

Oh.

Howard : 26:11

And he had control over that checkbook as well.

Ete : 26:13

So are you leaving with nothing?

Howard : 26:17

I am.

Ete : 26:17

Everything.

Howard : 26:17

Literally left with zero. Yeah, I left with with absolutely nothing. Yeah. So I decided to move on. And it literally was a fundamental moment in my practice.

Ete : 26:30

Sure.

Howard : 26:30

Because it helped me be the professional that I needed to be without riding his coattails, right? So–

Ete : 26:38

Yeah.

Howard : 26:38

Everything I did at this point was my process, my brand, my responsibility. So, so I had to start from square one.

Ete : 26:48

So you had to put on your big boy shoes now.

Howard : 26:49

Yep.

Ete : 26:50

You had no, you had no college experience–

Howard : 26:53

Yeah.

Ete : 26:54

–in business. You didn't go to–

Howard : 26:55

No.

Ete : 26:55

–Harvard or MIT? Okay.

Howard : 26:55

No, I started doing this you know, luckily right out of high school.

Ete : 26:59

So you knew... You got the six years, obviously, you moved up. So you got good at the industry.

Howard : 27:03

Sure.

Ete : 27:03

But that's just one part of running business, right? Then there's that little whole, like, you know, running a company.

Howard : 27:08

Yeah.

Ete : 27:08

Building a company. What was, how hard was that? I mean, yeah.

Howard : 27:11

Yeah. I mean, it's still, it's still a learning process, right? And obviously, you know, we're, we're in a, at a point where there's a rhythm that the business has, and a success that it has that, you know, where we're going to hope continues that way, right? But, but industries change, economies change. You know, obviously, this whole COVID thing is that is a big change that we're all going through. So, our business will always be evolving. I'll bring up something that's helped me along the way.

Ete : 27:38

Sure.

Howard : 27:39

You know, I'm an avid reader. I literally–

Ete : 27:40

Me too.

Howard : 27:41

–try to read at least–

Ete : 27:42

Me too.

Howard : 27:42

–one a month.

Ete : 27:43

I read like crazy.

Howard : 27:44

And I'm often even at a better pace than that. But one of the books that I often go back to is a book called The E Myth.

Ete : 27:50

Yeah, oh I talk about that book. I recommend that book to many people.

Howard : 27:54

And so what I got from that book personally, is, is two things. One, well, you know, The E Myth, for those of the audience that may not know, the E is entrepreneur, right? So the, the the gist of that book is that you can be great at a certain task, you can be an excellent technician in something, but that doesn't necessarily translate to the business behind it, right?

Ete : 28:20

Exactly.

Howard : 28:21

So the business and the task are two separate things. So, the E Myth sort of gives you an outline of how to build a process within your business, so that the business can sort of run itself, so that you can work on the business rather than in the business, right?

Ete : 28:38

A hundred percent.

Howard : 28:38

So that was sort of bullet point one that I got from it. The other bullet point was, you know, often when we're doing something in, in, in our industry, in our careers, in our business, we're always thinking, well, how do we get to that next level? And that's good to a point, right, because you always want to be moving forward and working towards those goals. But The E Myth sort of spins that around and it says instead, Let's look at your business when it's complete, right? When your business is finished, Ete, what does it look like, right?

Ete : 29:06

Right.

Howard : 29:06

What pieces are there when you've said, wow, this is exactly what I've dreamed of this business becoming, right? And then now that you know that that picture, what that is, how can you build backwards from that point to where you are today, right? And so, to me, that was just another one of those fundamental shifts in my process.

Ete : 29:25

That's huge.

Howard : 29:26

Yeah.

Ete : 29:26

Because real quick, because you're right, no one ever thinks there's an end or there's a cap or there's somewhere we're going it's just growth, growth, growth. Go, go, go you run till you die, we get, always get bigger. But when you put a cap or this is what it's supposed to look like, a picture, that changes everything.

Howard : 29:41

Sure. Yeah. Definitely. Yeah.

Ete : 29:42

So you read those two, and you're just having this like, aha moment?

Howard : 29:45

Yeah. Then again, it's, you know, I think if you're not moving forward, if you're not learning, right, then you're either stalled out or you're moving backwards, right. So I always want to be learning. So there's always different aspects of the business that, you know, I'm, I'm trying to get a greater grasp on, a greater knowledge, right? And when you're looking in the world of finance, you know, taxes are important, estate planning is important. You know, there are all these different nuances that even, even themselves as a body of knowledge, there are so many different trails that you can go down, right? So that to think that you would ever know everything, you're probably kidding yourself, right?

Ete : 30:22

Yeah.

Howard : 30:22

So, so we're just increasing that knowledge bank as much as we can for as often as we can.

Ete : 30:29

Yeah, and I love it. And I agree 100%. Like, I spend more time learning and reading now at 37 than I did, ever.

Howard : 30:35

Sure.

Ete : 30:36

And I and I also feel like I'm further from becoming an expert in anything.

Howard : 30:40

Yeah, yeah. Because you can always learn more.

Ete : 30:42

Yeah, you can always learn more. So do you remember when you branched out, you took off, you left? You started Plan One. You've got a, you've got some people with you. So you got a team. Do you remember your first client?

Howard : 30:53

I do.

Ete : 30:53

And do you remember how you got the first client?

Howard : 30:54

I do. Yeah. So my first client was, you know, going back. I was wish, I wish I had a video of it, right? Because it was probably just the worst performance in any, anyone could ever give. And you know, when you're doing something early on, you're, at least I was, there was a certain amount of information that I wanted to make sure that I provided. Right? And to make sure that I provided that information in a way that was concise and, and, and straightforward. I had rehearsed what I was going to say, to deliver that knowledge. And the two clients that I said, the two potential clients that I sat in from across the table from was, the one was a math teacher, and the other was an English teacher. So here I am, at 20 years old, sitting across from two people that, you know, I had graduated school just just a year earlier. So I felt like I had the two biggest potential critics I could have at the table with me. You know, back in the day, as I was growing the business, a lot of what I was doing was in people's homes. You know, rather than having an office were they, well, we had an office, but it was just easier to build the business, go into people's homes and make it convenient for them to meet with me.

Ete : 32:08

Sure.

Howard : 32:08

So we were sitting often at people's kitchen tables. Yeah. So I remember these clients very well. And it was a math teacher, and an English teacher. Yeah. So.

Ete : 32:16

And you're sitting at their kitchen table?

Howard : 32:17

But they became a client. Yeah. So they must have saw something in me, too, that that worked out. And I'm grateful for them. You know? It's sos so the, the way that I was trained early on, was because we had this large firm with all of these advisors. Every so often, we would have an advisor that left the firm, maybe they retired or something. And we had a box of orphan clients. They were clients that had different things with us. But no one was assigned to their account. So it was one of those sort of Staples kind of cardboard boxes–

Ete : 32:53

Yeah, yeah.

Howard : 32:53

–filled with files and this partner that I had originally said to me, Howard, here are the orphanages clients. If you can get a client from this box, that's your client–

Ete : 33:04

You keep 'em.

Howard : 33:04

–right? And then I got one and two and three clients from it, maybe four and five. And he came back to me, he said, Howard, if you get any more clients from this box, then let's split them. There'll be clients that we share 50/50. So I got a seventh and an eighth and a ninth and a tenth client. Came back to me he said Howard, getting more clients, because they're the firm's clients, let's keep them the firm, and we'll make sure that you get paid for the relationships. Right, so one of those things early on that now I'm looking back, I'm like, okay, you know, I can see how, you know, maybe a lot of what this guy was doing was maybe more in his interest than my own. But yeah, just...

Ete : 33:43

So because getting clients in most businesses is, is the hard part.

Howard : 33:48

Sure.

Ete : 33:49

Many people can build a business you know, throw social ads, etc. great ideas, but they can't get clients They can't sell. Yeah. Why are you having, like, why were you having success at such a young age and continued through 25 years. What has been your secret to getting clients? Like how are you doing? You're not marketing, you're not advertising.

Howard : 34:07

Yeah.

Ete : 34:07

What are you doing? Because we need to know.

Howard : 34:11

You know, Ete, I mean, I feel like I have a bank of knowledge and expertise, right. So, so, but what we are in is a relationship business. Right. So a lot of what we're doing is managing emotions and expectations–

Ete : 34:25

Sure.

Howard : 34:25

–right? But we're just treating people the way we would want to be treated.

Ete : 34:29

Yeah.

Howard : 34:30

Right? So I'm drinking the Kool Aid as well. So any advice that I would give anybody else? It's the same advice that I would give my own self, right? So. So I really believe in the aspect of being a fiduciary. It's the driver of my practice, right? And so for me, a fiduciary means that I have not just a, a, a moral obligation, but also a legal obligation to tell you what's in your best interest.

Ete : 34:55

Gotcha.

Howard : 34:56

Now, I realize that, you know, if you're coming to me, you may be coming with your lifesaver.

Ete : 35:00

Yeah.

Howard : 35:00

And you're gonna make the decisions that you're comfortable making. But I do have the same obligation as your doctor or your attorney or your CPA, and then I have to tell it like it is.

Ete : 35:12

And you take that very seriously.

Howard : 35:14

A hundred percent.

Ete : 35:14

Gotcha.

Howard : 35:15

So that means that if there's good news, I'm gonna tell you that there's good news. But it also means that if I'm looking at your situation, and there's not good news, I just want to make sure it's okay to bring that up to you, right?

Ete : 35:24

Sure.

Howard : 35:24

If there's something you should be, there's a red flag in your planning. And so it's those people that we can help that we help them see maybe that direction that they're on, that's not taking them to the best place.

Ete : 35:38

Right.

Howard : 35:38

And then we give them that bank of knowledge to show them hopefully, how to get back on track.

Ete : 35:42

So you know, 1200 clients, it tells me two things. One, we've talked about, you know, your exceptional customer service is that's, that's, that's important to you. But secondly, you've got to be getting results because you are and correct me if I'm wrong, I don't fully understand the world of finances and all that, but your client comes to you, I guess that maybe if I could walk through this experience, it'll be helpful to me. So I show up to you and I say, hey, I've got, you know, $100,000 in my bank account, I'd like to do something great with it.

Howard : 36:16

Yeah.

Ete : 36:16

I'd like to make more.

Howard : 36:19

Sure.

Ete : 36:19

And then you've said earlier that you'll meet with them. But you also said when they leave, you'll set up another appointment.

Howard : 36:26

Yeah.

Ete : 36:26

So, so it's an ongoing relationship. So can you walk me a little bit–

Howard : 36:30

Sure.

Ete : 36:30

–through that experience, especially for anyone who's listening who may be like me going, hey, I need to, I need to get ,get planning a little smarter than I am.

Howard : 36:38

Yeah. And there's, there's a process that we follow, right? And it makes sure that we have all the information that we need to make sure that the advice that we're giving is, is the right advice.

Ete : 36:49

Sure.

Howard : 36:50

So the first meeting for me is just to get to know someone, right? I honestly want to know, everything I can about them. I want to know what planning they've done to this point. I want to know about their family. I want to understand what legacy they'd like to leave behind. I want to know technical aspects about things like their specific tax situation. I'll often connect with their CPA or their attorney, and understand what the dynamics of their family is, what ultimately they want their future to look like, whether it's their retirement or their kids' college. And then what I'll do is I'll step back, and my team and I will build that an analysis looking at what ultimately they're describing their goals being and where they are today. And what their, what gap there is between those two things.

Ete : 37:35

So take all that, you'll just basically take all that data.

Howard : 37:37

Yup.

Ete : 37:37

And you'll kind of build a custom, tailored path for them.

Howard : 37:40

That's it. Specific, yeah, absolutely. That's a good, good way to say it. So we build a tailored path for them–

Ete : 37:42

Yeah.

Howard : 37:45

–to reach those goals that they had. And then when someone makes a commitment to be a client of ours, yeah, we see them on a regular basis, right? So.

Ete : 37:55

It's kind of a maintenance tune up check in.

Howard : 37:57

And that's sort of the business aspect of it, right? But, but one of the ways that we've been able to sort of build our business is by building those strong relationships with our clients. So we're not just seeing them at those meetings. You know, we're doing things outside of those normally scheduled meetings to connect with them as well.

Ete : 38:16

Gotcha.

Howard : 38:16

You know, we three, we throw a couple of big events throughout the year–

Ete : 38:19

Yeah.

Howard : 38:20

–just for our customers.

Ete : 38:21

You still? I remember years ago used to do that.

Howard : 38:22

Yeah, so.

Ete : 38:23

So tell us a little bit about, because that's, we call that sometimes nurturing the client?

Howard : 38:26

Sure.

Ete : 38:26

What, what are some of the events you've thrown?

Howard : 38:28

So, so what we like to do and again, COVID has changed a lot of this, but typically, we'll do whatever big summer blockbuster, family oriented movie is out, we'll rent out the entire movie theater and invite all of our clients and they invite their kids and grandkids. So if you're a client of mine, Ete and said, hey, I want to bring eight or nine of my family members. You got 'em.

Ete : 38:50

That's cool.

Howard : 38:51

So we, you know, typically Saturday morning, open up the movie theater just for our clients. See the movie. It's just a great way for us to bring, you know, my wife and my family to meet my client's families–

Ete : 39:04

And connect. Yeah.

Howard : 39:04

–and just do something that's social. So we typically do that at whatever sort of holiday movie time that maybe early, early January, and then we do it during the summer blockbuster. I think last time we did it, we did one of the Star Wars films that I think we had maybe 170 people show up for it.

Ete : 39:21

That's cool.

Howard : 39:21

So it's a great event. We also do a couple of educational events throughout the year where we're not inviting people that we don't know, they're just our clients who are coming.

Ete : 39:32

You said education. How much of your time with each client is spent educating?

Howard : 39:37

Oh, yeah. To me, you know, a good financial planner has to have the heart of a teacher. Right, so if people aren't leaving my office, knowing something that they didn't know before they came in, then I haven't done my job, right. So. so much of it is. Yeah.

Ete : 39:52

So I got to ask this, especially because the phrase you just used. Dave Ramsey?

Howard : 39:56

Dave Ramsey is, yeah, I'm a big fan of his.

Ete : 39:58

Okay, you are a fan.

Howard : 40:00

To me, you know, Dave gives a very concise process on how to, you know, there are those foundational–

Ete : 40:12

Yeah.

Howard : 40:12

–steps that he has people go through.

Ete : 40:13

The Baby Steps.

Howard : 40:14

The Baby Steps, right, the seven of them.

Ete : 40:16

Yeah.

Howard : 40:17

To get people to a point where they don't have to worry about some of the stuff that people that aren't doing those things would have to worry about, right? So yeah, I'm a big fan of Dave's. Let's face it, there's two ways to build your wealth. Way one is by growing your assets, way two is by getting yourself out of debt. You know, and to not have a mortgage payment, to not have a credit card payment, to have the ability financially to pay for the things that you need out of your own pocket rather than having to borrow money to do that. There's a great feeling, there's a great weight off your shoulders if you're able to do that.

Ete : 40:52

I got two questions here. One is when you have, when you have clients that come in and sit down and let's say they have 100,000 I'm just gonna make something 100,000 in savings–

Howard : 41:03

Sure.

Ete : 41:03

–they'd like to invest. And let's say they have some debt. Is one of your goals to help them, like part of your path to help them, get the house paid off? And then do this. Like, you go that in depth?

Howard : 41:14

Absolutely. I mean, you know, let's just say that you have a massive credit card debt, right? And we all know that credit cards, interest rates today are maybe 19, 24, maybe 29%, right? So if you're holding a balance on that credit card that's cost you 24% a year, and you have money somewhere else that's earning zero or maybe in a money market account earning 1%. Well, that you're losing money there, right? Because you're paying 24% on one hand, and only earning a small fraction of that somewhere else. So it may, in your situation, be a better idea to get rid of some of that credit card debt rather than holding that money in your mattress which is earning nothing.

Ete : 41:55

Sure.

Howard : 41:56

Yeah.

Ete : 41:56

And what about Are you a fan of taking money, borrowed money, and making other money, other people's money. Cause I know Dave is not, but I know, for every Dave Ramsey, there's 1000 other financial guys that will say this is the way to success.

Howard : 42:11

Yeah. I've never found that to be successful. So I wouldn't I wouldn't that to my client or nor would I do that myself.

Ete : 42:17

Yeah.

Howard : 42:19

Yeah, again, there's, I'm sure there's a bunch of other people that may disagree with me on that. But, you know, in 25 years, I've never found that to be a successful process.

Ete : 42:27

Awesome. Awesome. So cool. So 25 years in and you've been building it, and growing a family, obviously, six kids along the way. So you've learned a lot and yeah, and I want to, I'm wondering, has there been any times during that process where you're like, ah, this is awful. Like, has there been just a dark hard time that you didn't know, on the business side, if you could push through it?

Howard : 42:51

Yeah.

Ete : 42:52

As an entrepreneur.

Howard : 42:53

You know, it's funny when we talked about doing this podcast and I had a conversation with my wife and I was, you know, Ete's probably gonna ask me about the struggles that we've had in our business.

Ete : 43:01

Yeah.

Howard : 43:02

And I couldn't think of any struggles Ete–

Ete : 43:05

Wow.

Howard : 43:05

–that weren't preceded or that weren't followed by a, by just a tremendous amount of growth, right? So they were always times that I was pushed into a point in my career where I had to push forward in a way that I hadn't to before. And we talked about the transition of, of our firm, you know, from the tiny office that we had, to the building that we just bought. And I can remember, the first time I was sharing office space with another CPA, and, you know, we had made a decision to move out of that building, and I wasn't paying rent. I was actually working together with him on his clients. So the revenue that we were generating was enough for him to give me the office space that we were, that we were occupying. And, you know, I was growing to the point but but wasn't able to do some of the things that I wanted to do in our practice because we needed a bigger space to do that, a more professional space.

Ete : 44:12

Sure.

Howard : 44:13

So we ended up starting to rent a building, a nice office space with another CPA. And so that was a big step for my career because there was money that I was going to have to kick out every month that I wasn't sure that I, that I–

Ete : 44:28

A little more risk too.

Howard : 44:29

–could afford. Right, yeah. And then we got to the point where we outgrew that but what, but first, what happened, let me step back a little bit. That CPA was I think, transitioning back to the home office that they had. So while we were sharing rent, we now we're going to have to cover the entire rent for both of the spaces that we occupied–another big hurdle financially. And then you know, buying the building. So they're all those things were some of those decisions I'd made. Some of those decisions were made for me where people were moving on. And if I wanted to stay where I was, I was going to have to pay for what they were responsible paying for. The other big commitment I think that we made in our practice that was a financial hurdle. I believe it's so important to have a mentor, right?

Ete : 45:22

Yeah.

Howard : 45:23

So if you don't have someone that's looking at your business, who has done it before successfully, and is able to give you some sort of direction, on how you can build upon what you have, whether it's a coach or a mentor, then I would recommend that you find that person.

Ete : 45:42

Love it.

Howard : 45:43

So I remember when I was younger in the business, I was sitting in a team meeting we had. You know, this national meeting where our firm had brought, you know, a bunch of people together. And they brought the top 25 advisors in the nation up on the stage to recognize them for what they'd done. And I think, Ete, 12, or maybe 18 of them, were part of the same industry coaching program.

Ete : 46:09

Ah. So you started seeing that pattern. You're like, whoa, get me in.

Howard : 46:12

And I decided that day that whatever it cost, I was going to be part of that coaching program. And I still am today.

Ete : 46:18

I love that. I think you might be one of the first, I don't know if I've had this conversation, but on mentorship, yeah, but it sounds like it's helped you a ton. And you're recommending to everybody.

Howard : 46:28

Definitely, yeah. And so, so, you know, obviously, we see the growth in the bank of knowledge that we have, with the service that we're able to give our clients. Certainly from a revenue standpoint, you know, the growth of our firm is just multiples and multiples of what it was before we started that coaching program.

Ete : 46:47

So to the young entrepreneur who is going I don't know if I can afford that expense of a mentor. You would say...

Howard : 46:54

I didn't know if I could afford it either. But I realized that if I was going to be on that stage, like those other 25 advisors, you know, that was something I had to make happen, right?

Ete : 47:04

Wow. So how long have you had a mentor or coach?

Howard : 47:07

So, so that was back in 2009 is when I started the coaching program. So I'm still doing that same coaching with the same team that I'd started with back in 2009. So it's, you know, I guess what is it 11 years in.

Ete : 47:22

Clearly you're getting results, otherwise you wouldn't be spending that kind of time–

Howard : 47:25

Sure. Sure. Yeah.

Ete : 47:25

–and money for it. What has been the, I know you've had a chance to do some really fun and exciting things, travel some cool places because of the business, you know, some of the benefits of, of, of getting, of success. What has been some of the highlights or just something that you were like, you're like, yeah, this is, this is great, man. This push more than I ever pictured as a 17 year old musician.

Howard : 47:49

Yeah, I mean, you know, I feel literally, Ete, like I have to pinch myself, right? So even just being able to be out here visiting with you, old friend, and still having my business be able to be running while I'm doing that.

Ete : 48:06

Yeah.

Howard : 48:06

You know, well, what a great reward that is. My wife and I are staying in a very nice place, you know, because we're able to take time away from the office because our team has things locked down right there. They're really still continuing to do what we do for folks, even though I'm out of the office. That like I talked about before, having the time to be home with my family on Friday, Saturday and Sunday, without having to worry about, you know, doing the day to day. It's just a great reward. I mean, obviously, you know, we've traveled the world. We've been to nice places. We were able to do some great things. But just having that freedom to be able to have a social schedule time with my family–

Ete : 48:47

Yeah.

Howard : 48:47

–while things are running.

Ete : 48:49

Awesome.

Howard : 48:49

Yeah, I wouldn't give that up for anything.

Ete : 48:50

And you've said this 50 times already, but it seems so much, so crucial to this whole, this whole successful picture that we have here, is the team.

Howard : 48:59

Yeah.

Ete : 48:59

I mean, you've I mentioned how great your team is and how, yeah, just you couldn't do it without them. And I just, I'm just emphasizing that for those that are listening, you have to build a great team. It's, the people are everything.

Howard : 49:12

They are. Yeah. And, and if you're lucky enough, if you're blessed enough to find people that buy in, that are committed to your clients in the way that you are, wow, just pay them as much as you can. Because they are, they are such an important part of your business. You know, the last thing you want to do is to leave someone that buys in the way that you buy in. Yeah.

Ete : 49:31

Yeah, I mean, you've been doing this for a while. 25 plus years, you know, basically supporting yourself and your family.

Howard : 49:38

Sure.

Ete : 49:38

That's, that's, that's pretty awesome.

Howard : 49:41

Thank you.

Ete : 49:41

You know, businesses don't, that's a long run.

Howard : 49:43

Yeah.

Ete : 49:44

And I know you've got a lot ahead of you. So I guess my first question is, well, we'll start here. Can you give us a piece of advice, you've given us plenty of advice, but for a young entrepreneur, maybe listening to the show right now? What would you say to them?

Howard : 49:57

Wow, you know, so whatever you do, I would just start by doing it the right way, right? I mean, the, the, the, the that service attitude, that willingness to do for someone, the thing that you would want done for you is just going to go so far. You know, so from the standpoint of an attitude of, of the business, that service mindset, that, that service mindset that, that giving your all to someone in the way that you would want someone to give their all to you, I think, is sort of rule one, right?

Ete : 50:34

Okay.

Howard : 50:36

Number two, whatever it is that you're doing, find a coach, find somebody that's done it before you in a successful way that you would pattern your career after and just do what they tell you to do, right? And, three, find the way to build your business in a way that works for you long term. We can all work 80-90 hours is a week and just, you know, give our lives to our business and not have time for anything else. But I think eventually that's gonna, there's gonna be some wear and tear there that you're not gonna be able to get away from. Right? So, so find, I don't like the way I don't like the word balance. Because it's this sort of idea of multitasking and balance it. there's, it's not really a true thing, because you really can't do two things at the same time well. But instead, focus the time on your career, your business, your practice, your whatever it is that your building 100%, right? But, but also, if there's some other passion in your life, whether it's your music or your family, you know, find time to give that that same 100% effort. If that makes any sense.

Ete : 51:49

Yeah. No, that makes a ton of sense.

Howard : 51:50

Yeah.

Ete : 51:50

That's perfect. What's next for Plan One? What's next for Howard? You know, you've been building, building, building and you've got, like you said early on, you've got a well oiled machine. You've got a great customer focused team, a great product. What do you want to do?

Howard : 52:06

Ete, my, I–

Ete : 52:07

Take Thursdays off now?

Howard : 52:08

No, no. You know, my best years are ahead of me. You know, I still feel like I have so much more–

Ete : 52:13

Really?

Howard : 52:13

–to offer, right? I still love what–

Ete : 52:15

So you're still excited about all this?

Howard : 52:17

A hundred percent.

Ete : 52:17

All right, so.

Howard : 52:18

A hunderd percent. Yeah, so.

Ete : 52:19

Tell me what you want, where you want to take this, but also tell me, what are you even exc–, like, what excites you 20... How do you stay excited about something for 25 years?

Howard : 52:28

So. You know, I want to build a firm that is so important that if we disappeared tomorrow that it would leave, Ete, a gaping hole, right?

Ete : 52:41

Huh.

Howard : 52:41

That would be so hard to fill.

Ete : 52:42

Yeah.

Howard : 52:43

So I just want to be the go-to planner for you know, people, man, I just want to help people get to where they want to be in the future. I want to you, and yeah, my best years are ahead of me. Definitely. I see myself doing this for decades, right? So no desire to stop or retire, yo move on. I love what I do and want to continue to do it.

Ete : 53:03

But what are you excited about? Right? Like, how are you still excited? How have you maintained that enthusiasm because people get so burnt out. Obviously, you build a good team, and I get that. That's taken so much off. But you're not burnt out, man?

Howard : 53:15

My typical day, Ete, is maybe somewhere between an eight to ten appointments, right? Usually every hour on the hour. So I'm meeting with people all day, people that have made the commitment and have a confidence and a level of trust in me, right? So to talk to those people that appreciate what we do, that see value in what we offer, that trust us with their life savings. Man, you know, to have constant conversations with those people all day long. I could do that forever.

Ete : 53:47

That's awesome.

Howard : 53:48

Yeah.

Ete : 53:49

That's awesome. And I guess, I guess it also stems back to just I mean, it's gotta be something, I mean, clearly you love it.

Howard : 53:55

Yeah. Definitely.

Ete : 53:56

At the core of all this you love you, love the financial side, but you also love the service, helping people side.

Howard : 54:02

Definitely. Yeah. And you have to, I mean, if there was someone on our team that didn't love it in that way, they wouldn't stay part of our team, right?

Ete : 54:09

Yeah.

Howard : 54:09

So I think one of the reasons our team is as solid as it is, is because I think everybody has that, that that service mindset.

Ete : 54:15

So you want to just just keep going–

Howard : 54:17

Yeah man. Definitely.

Ete : 54:17

–You want to just keep doing this.

Howard : 54:18

Absolutely.

Ete : 54:19

The kids are, you've got one in college now. Maybe two?

Howard : 54:22

Yeah. I got one in college, one on her own. So our oldest daughter is living in the city. She's, our oldest son is just starting college this year.

Ete : 54:32

And then you've got even as young as a 4 year-old?

Howard : 54:35

So we, so we have, our oldest daughter is 23. Our oldest son is 17. Then we have a 14 year-old, a 12 year-old, a 4 year-old and a 2 year-old. Yeah.

Ete : 54:44

So on the high you got a 23 and on the low, a 2.

Howard : 54:47

Yeah.

Ete : 54:47

I thought I was impressive. I have a 2 year-old and a 10 year-old but..

Howard : 54:51

You got a good start, man. Keep going.

Ete : 54:52

I think I'm done. Maybe we should we should be a show about parental advice. Man, I'm still sleep training 2 year-old, man. We're not even sleep–, I don't know.

Howard : 55:04

Yeah. And obviously, you know, you know, talking about teams, while my wife is not a team member, she's doing the heavy lifting at home. She's just phenomenal in that way and and wouldn't wish for anybody else to be my partner. You know, she's just doing a fantastic job with the kids while I'm at the office, when I am.

Ete : 55:22

Yeah, she's so dialed in. I feel like she's, she's a strong woman.

Howard : 55:27

She is, yeah. And a huge part of what we do, right, even though she may not be in the office. She's just, she's another sounding board and mentor and decision maker in the business and just has an important role even though it may not be wearing a suit every day.

Ete : 55:42

You know, and I was just thinking about that the other day, I was thinking about some, because we're on Season Two now thinking about some ways to expand the show dimensionally. And I was actually considering like, you know, because as I talked to people, whether it's men or women, you know, they talk about their wives or their husbands. You know, often I've noticed like the entrepreneur, entrepreneurs, or the creators, the musicians, we get, people see us succeed.

Howard : 56:04

Yeah.

Ete : 56:04

You know, and so we kind of get some praise. The world gives us it but then you've got the spouse at home who is doing all the really important stuff.

Howard : 56:11

Sure.

Ete : 56:12

The kids, the house and like you said, even a sounding board and helping us not lose our sanity.

Howard : 56:17

Yeah.

Ete : 56:18

And I always thought, man, it'd be cool to start interviewing the spouses, because they're such a key part. I'm glad you brought that up, because I'm just thinking about last night in what we do.

Howard : 56:27

Yeah. Right. So–

Ete : 56:27

So like, you couldn't, without Michelle, you would not, I don't think you'd be where you are.

Howard : 56:32

Right. A hundered percent I would agree with that. And, and she's not getting a lot of that credit that it's due, right?

Ete : 56:39

Yeah. They don't.

Howard : 56:39

Yeah. She's not getting the reward.

Ete : 56:41

Yeah.

Howard : 56:41

She's not getting the accolades–

Ete : 56:42

Yeah.

Howard : 56:42

–that I might be getting, but she's definitely a big part of it. Yeah.

Ete : 56:44

That's awesome. So my last question, what are some of the things that you are doing for fun? What do you love to do with your, your spare time besides building the company and helping people?

Howard : 56:56

You know, obviously my, my number one thing is just being a dad, right? So I love my kids and they're my world. You know, hobbies, you know, I love to play the guitar. I love to read. We travel a ton. Tennis, you know, so, you know, we just try to do, you know, a little bit of everything, try, try things new, right? So whether it's being out here and hiking or kayaking.

Ete : 57:20

Yeah.

Howard : 57:20

We just want to explore, man. We we just want to have new experiences. We just want to be out in the world and just having a good time.

Ete : 57:28

Just enjoying it.

Howard : 57:29

Yeah.

Ete : 57:29

And you can because you built this great company. And that's one of the coolest, you know, there's the freedom that this has offered you and your family, is really spectacular. And I think that's the fun part of being an entrepreneur. It comes with comes with stress and weight like nothing else, but man, when you win, you win big.

Howard : 57:48

Yeah. Yeah. And yeah, we love it. Like I said, I pinch myself every day, you know, as as we get, you know, another day to do what we love. It's just a dream life, man.

Ete : 57:59

Awesome. So, you guys, thanks for tuning in. I love some of the things that that we've discussed today. You know, I love the story of, you know, where he was, given this ultimatum by his partner, and he has to walk away from me. That's a really, that's a crazy story. But I love that and we didn't talk too much about your faith, but I love that you just found something and you just knew inside it was right for you.

Howard : 58:23

Yeah.

Ete : 58:24

And you were willing to, to follow that.

Howard : 58:26

Yeah.

Ete : 58:27

And, and it's interesting, because like he was saying, you know, your faith is bringing the cursings on our business. But yet when you look at it, you followed what, what seems right to you, and you've done well, and you've been blessed.

Howard : 58:39

Thanks, Ete.

Ete : 58:40

I think that's cool. And I love, I love the fact that you read so much and I, and I'm the same way. The E Myth. There was an E Myth Revisited that came out years later.

Howard : 58:48

Yeah, read those all.

Ete : 58:48

Great books. I listen to Dave Ramsey's financial podcast every day.

Howard : 58:52

Yeah.

Ete : 58:52

I don't miss an episode. And I can't say I practice everything, because I'm a dummy, but I do most of it.

Howard : 58:59

Good.

Ete : 58:59

I love those Baby Steps.

Howard : 59:00

Good.

Ete : 59:00

I walk through those steps. But anyway, just some great lessons, man. I appreciate you coming in, spending some time on your vacation here in Park City. So thank you, Howard.

Howard : 59:09

Thank you, Ete. I love this. It was a great opportunity, man. Thanks for having me on. Awesome.

Ete : 59:13

Awesome. Awesome. And thank you guys for tuning in. Again Howard Mattson with Plan One, and we will see you on the next episode of The Company Next Door.