From Father To Son, With Connor Williams

Nexstar member Connor Williams offers his perspective on a subject his father Brian Williams talked about in an earlier interview with Jack. The two discuss how family dynamics impact business decision-making, and the importance of knowing how and when to separate business from family.

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Speaker 1 0:06

[inaudible] .

Speaker 2 0:09

Hi, this Jack Tester, and welcome to another edition of Leadership Lounge. I'm in Saint Paul, Minnesota, and I have got a young man sitting across the desk from me, Connor Williams from Vancouver. How are you doing?

Speaker 1 0:21

I'm good, Jack. Thanks for having me. You're onto it . What are you in town for? Uh , we're here for inside sales that with Lucas. So how's it going? It's, it's great. The contents really good. Never , um, never been through this one before, so I'm good to see it. And we've never had this position at our company there, so we're excited about that.

Speaker 2 0:41

Glad you're here. Yeah , me too . You know, about a month and a half ago, I had the pleasure of sitting across the same desk with an older Connor Williams is actually your father, Brian Williams. And we talked about the origin of, of Ashton Service company, how it's named after it town in England. He had to come up with a name, so I'll look at that, an atlas and found the name and it was an English name, so it was called that. Right. So we heard the history and you got a great business going and one of the things he talked about is a kind of how it works between father and son and some of the successes you folks had. And he was transparent about some of the, the head trash and challenges that he's had in his whole thing. And what I want to do in this podcast is flip the , flip the coin and look at this from the other side, cause it hurts from the old man. Now listen to the kid.

Speaker 1 1:32

Okay. Yeah, no, that's a , it's an interesting storyline. So we'll , we just jump into it.

Speaker 2 1:36

Well, what we'll do is tell us about , um, how you found your way , uh, in full time, in a full time professional position, if you will at Ashton. Cause I know you were in the business as a kid, you know, doing weekend jobs or summer jobs . Is that right?

Speaker 1 1:54

[inaudible] yeah, so I guess I started when I was probably 13 or 14. Okay. Doing construction and laboring. Um , and I registered as an apprentice , um, at 13, I think 14 I think was when we were legally allowed to register as child labor. My friend . Yeah, well nobody in Canada will hear that, so it's okay . Um, yeah , so then I, I did that during the summers and really wanted to go to university. Um, so I went to the University of Victoria, which on Vancouver Island and I thought I was going to be a lawyer. I didn't really, you know, adolescent kid, you know, you kind of , you're at odds with your parents and I didn't have any real interest in , in the BS Ashton you did? No, I mean, I enjoyed it, but I knew there was like a ton of pressure being , uh , an owner's son and I kind of had felt that when I was a kid and

Speaker 2 2:48

stop there for a second. What did you feel that back then when, when you said own it pressure, what does that mean?

Speaker 1 2:54

Well , um, being the only son you, you kind of feel a slight that they should get into it, but also being in a trade with, you know, these were men and I was a, I was a child essentially. And um, you know, they , you have to be able to take a ribbing as an apprentice, but as the boss's son, it's a little bit more , um, you kinda think about any, take it a little bit more personally. Um, so it was, it was a bit challenging to, to imagine myself in the business because I felt like I would be given something that my father and mother had to earn and I didn't. So , um, that was my biggest fear in it. It's a fort as a, as an 18 year old thinking about what to do. Yeah, that's what you were thinking, worried that um, that people would, would think that it was just handed to me. So I kind of wanted to go and forge my own way and do something different. And that's why I kinda thought maybe being a lawyer would be fun. I thought maybe I'll be a sports agent or something like that, but , um, that's cool. Yeah, that was kind of my, of course, the law in Canada, the only thing you'd represent are hockey players. So that would have been the drainer skaters . Yeah . Yeah. Well anybody that, that makes money would have been good to represent. But um , yeah, no, that was always the dream. Represent a hockey player. Yeah . So you wanted to do that. So you went off to school? Yeah. Yes , I did that for the first two years. I wanted to just get into a program where I could get really good grades. So I chose psychology because the exams are mainly multiple choice and I could cram and study for them and do fairly well on them. And the school I went to was for this before the a , the school I went to was , uh, two thirds women. Uh, and then the program psychology was even more so , uh , women. So a lot of my friends and I joined just for that particular reason. Right. A lot of thought went into this. Yeah . Yeah. So deep thought. Yeah . Great . Um , yeah. And then , uh , it turns out like I'm not that smart at school. Like I was okay. But I didn't, I didn't apply myself as well as the wildly, yeah. I was having a little bit too much fun. Um, and then I met my fiance, we're getting married this year. Graduations . Yeah. Thank you. Um, we met in the library very of all places. Kind of surprising because I didn't spend a whole lot of time there by its had been lost. One daughter was there, she was and I went to go to the social floor where my friends would sit and study and she was sitting at that table. And uh, so yeah. Anyhow, I met her there and she was in the business program and by this point in my university career I was about ready to graduate and I didn't really know what I was going to do cause my grades weren't really good enough to go to , to law school. Like I probably could've got into one and you know, came in Ireland. Yeah , some right. Not so great school. Yeah. And , uh, anyhow, I, when we started dating, I started to get a little bit envious of the program that they were in because they got to go on exchange to Europe and all kids had these, you know , cool jobs where they got to wear suits and go down town every day. And , um, it was Kinda , I kinda felt like I missed out on something maybe. And , um, I knew I was just as capable as they were of , of going to business school. So I graduated and I took a year off with her and I went on exchange with her to Europe and we spent , uh , I guess it was about six months in the Czech Republic and we visited I think 18 countries or something like that and had a really great time. And then I came home and worked in the business for a year just to save up some money. And then I went back to school. So I went to a school called BCAT . It's kind of like a tech school. Um, and I got a BBA, their bachelor of business administration. And , um, then I felt like , um , I could hang with my friends again, so, all right. Yeah. So that's kinda where that went and

Speaker 2 6:51

no , I'm seeing the world scene para [inaudible] as they say. Yeah. Right. You'd been around and uh , so what were you going to do then? Where are you going to become a business guy or this, when the agent thing happened, what were you going to do?

Speaker 1 7:02

No, I, I actually, at this time I spent the whole time at a BCAT . I treated almost like an MBA. Um, and I thought about how the application would apply to my family's business and I had made my mind up. She had kinda conditioned mind up one that I was going to go back and work and yeah. Oh really? Yeah. Um, what happened? I think she kind of convinced me that it was a good idea. Um, just the opportunity that was there and um, yeah, I thought it was, I'd be crazy not to give it a try. So,

Speaker 2 7:38

well, let's talk about, let's talk about how you felt going into college. You felt like maybe I'd learn something and then you felt that maybe you're getting something that was just kind of given to you at that time. Did your mind change in that intervening what, five or six years now? Is that right?

Speaker 1 7:52

Yeah. Um, yeah. I , I graduated from a business school in 2015 so , um, it's almost five years. Um, yeah, it , it, it changed because I felt like I had the confidence to do something that , um, to really make a difference in the business and that I, I had gone to school for something that would give me the credibility with the staff that, you know, he's, he's educated in this and he's making good decisions because he has this knowledge at least. So it gave me a bit of street credit, I guess.

Speaker 2 8:27

Okay. All right. Little confidence too for you, you'd accomplished a few things, right? You traveled a little bit, got a couple of degrees, now you're in , of course you didn't sound like you'd been in the business a little bit. Right. What year was this? When I, when you, when you went back, decided to go back in ,

Speaker 1 8:43

uh , 2015 is when I officially became an adult and went back to the working world. That's

Speaker 2 8:50

right. So , um, when you, when you came into the business w what

Speaker 1 8:55

were you assigned? What did you take on? What, what were your responsibilities? Well, coincidentally, when I graduated from university, the first time was the first time I met Keith mercurial. Okay . And at that time I was doing, I spent a year working in the business at that time doing marketing. So we had developed a, you know, a marketing campaign, worked on the website. We'd never really done a residential specific website . So I kind of messed around with that a little bit , um, during that year. And then when I came back the next time , um, they needed a commercial account manager. So it was completely unrelated to [inaudible] had to do with this. You mentioned Keith Letters . Uh, that's when I realized that residential was the way that we should take our business. Okay . So you went to a class or something? He came in and did an onsite with us. That's right. Yeah. Private onsite that you folks, and so you looked at the , you sat in that class. Yeah. And that's when I kinda realized that we needed to make a , a shift in the , in the focus of the business. Um , but it took a couple years before we got there and before I, I really got got to that realization, like it kind of took a bit of time to sink in. So that's where the kind of the , the seed was planted, so to speak. You know , then you went away again, finished school, came back and had this idea. Did your dad share that idea? Yeah, he did. Um, he'd shared it for 20 years. It just hadn't been implemented properly because your business was primarily a commercial service and new construction company, wasn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Nice one to big business. Yeah. It still is. Uh , all those things. Yeah. Right. Yeah . Right. All right. So you , so, so you came back and commercial sales guy. Yeah. Yeah . So basically a golfer. Yeah. I think that's why as your dad mentioned that you can mix it up as this young guy. You're , you're outselling old folks and entertaining and yeah, I still do a little bit of that actually. Yeah. Maybe not now, but yeah, no, I, I played a lot of golf when I first came in. Um, that was fun. But yeah , so they would give me, we had at the time, I think we had maybe 200 , uh, commercial buildings under contract and they gave those to me to go and meet all the strata councils or you guys down here, call them homeowners associations, hos. So I would go in there and I would look at their budget, what they spend with us last year and figure out how we can make the strata councils as they call . Yeah. That's what they could dominate. Yeah. Homeowners associate makes a lot more descriptive. Yeah. I'm sorry, go ahead. Yeah. The Americans have a different word for everything, right . You have to do so labor, right , too . Yeah . So, yeah. Well , yeah, a couple of other words too. Um, yeah. So I , uh, I did that for a couple of years. I enjoyed that. I still mix it up a little bit in that world. Um, but , um, our residential department was growing at that time. Uh, there was a guy there named Ron and Ron was a former airtime 500 member and he got hired, well, I was in, in school and um, he took the, the department from $200,000, like they had done virtually no residential work. Like that's not even a truck, but yeah , 20 different guys were running. Right . Residential Service call . Yeah, very inefficient. He took it from 200,000 to about two and a half million in a fairly short period of time. And he did it all himself , uh, you know, with the help of some really good salespeople. And he made some good install teams as well. Um, but we were losing focus on customer service and also on service technicians. They weren't following this service system. Um, our call center was combined commercial, residential construction. Everything was all in one. There wasn't dedicated dispatchers. It was kind of all over the place. And he , he didn't really have , um, control those areas of the business. I think it was just, he was getting stretched too thin. And so they asked me to go over and look after the call center folks and , and look after the, the service technicians. Cause we were, we weren't generating any leads. We were like a purely marketed, lead driven, you know, replacement business. It wasn't sustainable and it wasn't growing the way that we thought it should. So that's when I got in and, and drank the koolaid fully. Wow. Yeah. So yeah, we came here and did our business plan that year and that's when it kind of all started when I ,

Speaker 2 13:30

so did you ask your dad to get involved in residential service or did he put you there?

Speaker 1 13:35

I don't even actually remember. I think we were probably just having a conversation about how it wasn't going the way that, you know, it was going well, but it could have been going better. And I think we just all came to a mutual decision that this was the best thing for the company is for me to go over there. So,

Speaker 2 13:49

yeah. And so, so , um, did you have, as you've, and you've been there since when, when, when did that start?

Speaker 1 13:56

This would've been late 2015 I didn't do a whole lot of commercial sales. I maybe a year of it . Yeah. Maybe late 2015 early 2003

Speaker 2 14:05

years. Three years or so , roughly going at this thing.

Speaker 1 14:07

Yeah. Where's the business right now? Essential side. The residential side is about 4 million in plumbing and about 4 million in HVC . $8 million.

Speaker 2 14:18

Oh, so it was two and a half or so. Yeah . Right. Yeah , it's nice growth. Congratulations Connor. Yeah, it's been pretty good. Is that what you, is that what you're primarily focused in the business?

Speaker 1 14:28

Yeah, I spend probably 95% of my time on the residential side.

Speaker 2 14:33

Alright . Yeah . So let's talk of the , the, the million dollar question. Yeah . So , um, how involved is your dad been with you and how do you, how , let's talk about that dance between father, son working in a business, but you, what's different though, and I think this is interesting, is that you have a big business, you know, you still have a very needy commercial service and new construction side. I imagine that consumes a fair money. Your father's time. I guess maybe some other managers over there too, I'm sure [inaudible] right. But you don't have that, but you've Kinda got this thing that, did you kind of view this as your thing and the other thing was your dad's whole thing. Yeah. Is that right? Yeah. In a sense. I take ownership of it and, and feel like it's mine. Yeah. Okay. Um, yeah. Does your dad not come in there and, and

Speaker 1 15:22

no, he does. He, he's, he's fairly involved on the marketing side, so I don't actually get involved too, too much in the marketing side of things. He , he works on the brand and the , uh, the website. We have a fantastic marketing manager. Um, and the two of them spend a lot of time together. Uh, yeah . Busy. Yeah. They, they, they do a lot of that stuff. Um, he, he's very involved in the business, so he's not in his office a lot. Like he , he comes in maybe three, three out of five days that he's in town. You know, he's , he's, he's out on the road. He's, he's a visionary. He's, he's hanging out with, you know, some of our key , uh , corporate clients and visiting construction sites and, you know, he's, he's doing a lot, a lot of business development type stuff. Uh, but he's always on his phone. Um, I dunno if you follow him on like linkedin or Instagram or anything like that, but he's always commenting on people's stuff or liking people's stuff. And he's the same way with our employees with emails. He'll respond to every email within a few seconds. Um, it's , it's probably not the healthiest way to live your life because he never shuts it off. But , um, yeah, he's, he's very engaged and focused even though he's not sitting at a desk all day.

Speaker 2 16:40

Yeah. Well, it, you know, and I know that every family's got their issues and challenges and, and things, but it appears to be a healthy working relationship from my perspective.

Speaker 1 16:52

Yeah, it is. Um, yeah, it's, it's not always, it's not always roses. Like it gets a little rocky at times. Um, you know, when, when it gets rocky, it's usually at like a , we were following the eos system, right. So we have quarterly meetings with our facilitator, and at times it can get a little bit heated , um, between him and I, I'm a little bit , um, like at times arrogant , uh , overly confident , um, and, and forceful in my views . I'm a strong d and he's a little bit more, he's all , um, what's the right word? Not, he's not as, as forceful as I am. And he doesn't take criticism all that well, so he doesn't , he kind of shuts down a little bit and sometimes I can go after him , uh , and it , I can, you know, you can tell right away that I really hurt his feelings. Um, and he just, it doesn't go well the rest of the day. He'll , he'll, he'll push back, he'll pout a little bit or , but he'll, he'll snap back to good for him. Yeah. You deserve it. You're young. What do you know? Yeah, no, I deserve it , uh , most of the time. Um, but I do have like , uh , we, we , um, we have differing opinions on things and it's , it's a healthy conflict. We've just had to learn to be more, I've had to learn to be more respectful , uh, in the way that I approach it because I don't, it's not my intention to, to hurt his feelings. I just, I just shoot off the cuff a little bit too, too quickly sometimes.

Speaker 2 18:25

So your dad is , uh , uh, you know, is , is not as in not as massively d as You are. That's disc on the disc profile. That's the D it's d for dominant. Yeah . Right. Your Dad's more of an I s kind of guy. I think so. Right. Was influencer and yeah . And steadiness. Right. And great man. Right. Oh that's interesting though. Cause uh, you know, if I had to, if I had to do a prototypical dysfunctional father son relationship, I would reverse that and say that it'd be a real dominant dad and the kid would be the one that would get hurt and jumped on. And I wonder if one of your successes that's kind of reversed, that you've, you know, you're , you're in a more dominant person, speak your mind, your dad's probably probably gives you the space to speak it in a , in a different way and you're quick to take it, you know, ultimately he's the, the, the decision maker, I would imagine. Is that true at this point?

Speaker 1 19:26

Uh , well there's one person we're kind of leaving out of the conversation. My mother, right. She, she's uh , she's really the one who makes the final decisions. Oh yeah . She's our integrator. Right. So she's a , she's the tiebreaker . Um, very cool. Yeah. Very cool. So yeah, it's a , it's, it's an interesting dynamic for sure. So we should be talking about you and your mother right now. Is that we should be talking about, I suppose , um , on the couch right now. Yeah , no, Julia,

Speaker 2 19:58

he was amazing. And Brian talked about how , you know, her role and, and he shared a story about one time you guys were at one of these els meetings, if you'd call it right. And you both got at it and then you were leaving to go to a seminar and the seminar was, had something to do with family businesses, is that right? Yeah . She gave you both this speech before you get out of the car, like you guys better get this thing figured out or something. Do you remember that?

Speaker 1 20:23

I do tell you from your perspective. Well, I don't even remember what we were arguing about had to be important and it must've been important to the business at the time. But yeah, she, we , we both were real quiet and silky in the back seat while she was laying into us and yelling at us. And , um, we didn't say anything to each other. And then when we got out of the car, he just said, yeah, she's right. We're a, let's just move past this. And he hugged me and we, it was kind of , it was a, a nice , uh, father son moment. And uh, we moved on and we went inside and had a couple of vodka Martinis and had a nice night. It was fun.

Speaker 2 21:01

Well, how did you move on though? If you had a difference of opinion, what did them, cause sometimes you can say move on, but if there's a difference there, there's a difference there. What would you do?

Speaker 1 21:10

I kinda touched on it a little bit earlier. It was because I was, I wasn't perceptive to how I was making him feel. Okay. Um, and, and I realized that and I'm a lot better about it now. I don't, yeah, it's , it was almost like I was bullying him in , into submission into what I wanted and um, there wasn't the way to go about it. And so we , we make a conscious effort now to be United when we go into these things because ultimately we're, the three of us are going to be the only constants there for sure. Right? Like we , we believe in our leadership team, but things can change. Right ? Right, right. And so we have to be more United. And so we have to be United when we go into every single,

Speaker 2 21:58

when you say United, I mean you can have differences of opinion, but it if you, if you walk out of there and, and I'm sure you walk out of there at times not agreeing. I mean, not saying I will say to yourself, I wish we had done something different. Yeah. Right. I mean some it's gotta be that way, but then you just say, I'm going to , I might, you know, if , if my dad weren't here, I might've made a different , a different decision or my mom weren't here. I wanted a different decision, but this is the decision that, that seems to be the best right now and I'm just gonna accept it. Is that right? Yeah. Yeah. Once you, it's like the US method,

Speaker 1 22:37

right? You , you speak your mind and the decision maker will ultimately make, or the group, it's not group consensus. Right, right. Um , so you get your thought out there and if it doesn't go your way, that's you've, you've said your piece and you have to sign with them in a group of three who,

Speaker 2 22:56

well, it w who's the decision maker? Is it you? Sometimes it's , sometimes it's, when is it you,

Speaker 1 23:03

when I'm , when I make a compelling argument that is presented in a respectful way, ultimately, ultimately who would, who could veto ? I mean, you know, who has the , the real vote? Aye . Well , it depends, right? Like if it's something legally who is the real vote?

Speaker 2 23:23

It's hard. It's situational. All right . Okay. I'm not pushing it . I'm not gonna . Alright . Got One . Because anything technical in nature, my mom will defer to him. Okay. Right. She won't get involved in and just say, I don't understand that area of the business, so I'm not going to bother. I need technical issue. That would be product selection, your job, the bidding, a job, that kind of stuff kind of thing. Right. Yeah. Um, anything, personnel and relationship-based, she usually gets the final say you're , you're truly gets a vinyl saying . Yeah. And where usually, okay. With that. So what do you get at kind of vodka? [inaudible] vodka you're buying?

Speaker 1 24:00

Yeah, no , uh, they, they listened to me , uh, when it comes to ,

Speaker 2 24:06

um, things to do with my department. And , um, so on the residential service side, do you kinda kind of have in your way? I have a ton of, basically I have autonomy there . There really isn't anything that they sort of get in my way on. They'll question things from time to time, but , um, I've got a lot of freedom to do what I need to do over there. I see the distinction now. Right. So you've, you really do have, you know, you're going to info involve Brian and Julie in the , in the decisions as it relates to every quarter with the residential department. And you're gonna argue about it and you're gonna agree on things and then you're going to go forward and you're going to execute it every day and you're not running, you're not having, you know , your dad's aware, your mom's aware, but you're not checking in. I mean, they're not, you're not running things by them on a daily basis.

Speaker 1 24:50

No . And I've learned to keep certain things away from them, just not to bother them with them because if sometimes you're asking for trouble bringing them into it too , right. Like better ask for forgiveness. Yeah. Um, they'll, it'll upset. Like there are certain situations where you , you bring something to them that you shouldn't bring to them and then they get involved in it because they know they have an obligation to get involved in it and it just makes more work for everybody. So there's certain things that you just kind of , this is good judgment on your part, not kind of know when to yeah. You know when to, to share something with them and when

Speaker 2 25:27

to nod . Um, w do you have a talk with your managers now? Don't mention this to

Speaker 1 25:33

they're there. We have sort of like looks that we give each other, we know that there are certain things that you just don't bring up. Right. Um , if you do , if you want to get out of there today, [inaudible] did bring a change of clothes. Yeah, no , there's just, yeah, just certain, you know, the , the, all the very like really important things we bring to them for sure. But , um, certain stuff, you know, they just don't need to be bothered with it. It's just going to create stress in their life. Like they like to go on vacation to Maui for a month every year and very careful about what I tell them when they're there cause I don't want to ruin their day.

Speaker 2 26:10

Well, I get that right . But Day to day, minute to minute, you still are judicious and yeah . With not withholding, but there's just, there's things that they need to know. That's right. And you're talking about kind of the nice to know things. That's right. Right. Yeah. I wish we knew exactly where that line was. All right. Yeah. It's hard. Yeah . It's hard to figure out sometimes, but yeah. Yeah. Well let's, let's think about this. So , um, you've got this relationship with your parents you're involved in , or do you grow in a great business? You know, in a , in a business can't grow unless there's a healthy leadership team and you clearly have got one. I know there's other good people involved beyond the Williams folks there . Right. You know , um, somebody listening to this and they're uh, uh , son and they've got a father in the business and uh , what counsel would you give them, you know , about trying to make this relationship and therefore the business successful. What would you say? And a mother too.

Speaker 1 27:11

Hmm . MMM .

Speaker 2 27:13

You'd go maybe this way, going back to your, you , you're going to go back and talk to a young Connor , right? You're, you're a 23 year old Conner again and you're saying, what would you tell them ? Hey,

Speaker 1 27:25

well I'd make sure first and foremost that , that you're passionate about doing this. Very cool. Because , um , I don't feel like I'm working, you know what I mean? Like I love what I do and I love working every day at the, at the company. And that didn't start until I came down here and saw some folks. In the meantime I went next door. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, that's nice. And it makes me feel good. Yeah. I didn't, I didn't , uh, I remember I went to Philadelphia to the super meeting and that point I realized, you know, what a privilege it was to be in a leadership position. Yeah . And then I, that kind of shifted my , my psyche a little bit. And then I came here and I visited with , um, with MSP and um , with Hiro plumbing, with Josh and spent a couple of days just looking at these shops and dreaming of, of doing something like this at home. And yeah, that's when I, that's when it didn't feel like work anymore. It just, it just became something I was obsessed with. I don't stop thinking about it. It's just on all the time. So if you don't have that for the business, then don't get into it.

Speaker 2 28:37

So he didn't do it out of an obligation like a , I've got to do this as not only like a duty or something or, or this is, you know, I guess that's the job and it's a good one, right? It's more like, this is really cool. You'd have to jumped into the same parents. And no parents, no one, which, you know, in theory, in theory, right?

Speaker 1 28:53

Yeah. I mean I , it's unlikely I would have been introduced to , to this, this organization that way. But yeah. Um, that's what, that's what makes it easier, you know, being super passionate about it.

Speaker 2 29:05

Okay. So you , that's an advice you'd give some other young person be really passionate about. How about the relationship? So let me get , let me, let me jump in there though. But when you're passionate about it and you're excited about it in your, you could see , uh , a future that's very bright. Sometimes those irritations that are going to come up relative to the idiosyncrasies of your family or you know, the, the challenges in business sometimes if you're not enjoying it, those can look like rocks and big boulders in front of you. Right. For sure. Instead of something just a small obstacle that you've kind of put up with on the way. Yeah. Their there , I'm

Speaker 1 29:42

not gonna lie and say that it's been, you know, every single day I've, you know, been super passionate and that's what's driven me. It , it has over all , but there are blips, you know, within a year where, you know, you'll, you'll be either a little bit down or , um, just some , a tremendous amount of stress for a few weeks, you know, a tough situation. And , um, and then something goes wrong with, with the family, with, in terms of our communication. Maybe something on the personal side, maybe something , you know, cause those things happen. Sure they do. Um, and yeah , sometimes you wonder , um, you know, is , would this be easier if I just went somewhere else? Um, you know, I've had those thoughts for sure. Um, and the , but you have to, you have to figure out why you're having them, I suppose, and try to overcome them , um, and get to the root of why your , why you're feeling that way. Um, yeah, it's tough to tough to pinpoint how to fix it.

Speaker 2 30:43

Yeah. I don't, I liked that . I liked that question though. And uh , cause yeah, you don't want to have somebody who's kind of reluctantly entering the business, right. And , and , and a leader of the business can't be mediocre. They can't be lukewarm. You can have lukewarm days, I get it, you know, minutes or hours or a weekend where you're feeling a little pouty, you know, but to run a business and run it, well, you gotta be passionate about it. Right? Yeah . And oftentimes, you know, it's hard to, to, you know, a second generation or third generation often isn't born or doesn't have that same passion for the business that the first one did. So that's really cool. Cause I know Brian and Julie have a lot of passion for what they're building there.

Speaker 1 31:30

Oh yeah. No. Um, I , I wouldn't, I wouldn't get involved in a business unless you're super passionate. Yeah . The other, I guess, piece of advice I would give is , um, try your best to , uh, to keep them separate. The [inaudible]

Speaker 2 31:44

the two lives. So I'm Thanksgiving and of course you don't celebrate Thanksgiving like we do, but,

Speaker 1 31:49

well, we have our same day. Wrong Day. Yeah. Right. No football on no football line. Yeah. So,

Speaker 2 31:56

so after holidays on the weekends, when you see your Mar Pie , you don't say you don't talk about Ashton?

Speaker 1 32:01

No, we do. Um, but we shouldn't. Okay. So this is, it's, so what did you, so the advice you give and what do you mean? Well, it's a skill that I'm working on, but uh , it's still, it's not very polished. Um, there are other people involved in this, right? You have your siblings and you have your partners and , um, they don't want to hear this stuff. Oh, okay. So spare your wife and your, yeah. Your sister, now you're cutting into their time. Right, right. And that's really important time. And , um, so, you know, we can talk for hours sometimes if, if it's just my mom and my dad and I, like they just live down the street. I'll walk down and we'll talk for two or three hours and about the business and big picture stuff. Um, but can't let it ruin a vacation. You know, it's not that it ruins it for you guys. We're having a great, or for us, we're having a great time talking about it, but for everybody else, it's, it's, it's kind of annoying. Right? So , um, that's something that we're trying to work on, to keep it separate. And , and it , it doesn't, you're not dividing your time properly if you're letting it consume you all the time. Right. So that's, that's one of the disadvantages I suppose, of, of being in , in a family business is that it just, it can follow you everywhere.

Speaker 2 33:22

Got It. Got It. So I asked you the question, I said, what would you tell a young Connor , you know, it's going back five years and say, okay, this might be a little easier if I knew this then that, which I know now, right. The answer to a couple things is passion and separation, right?

Speaker 1 33:37

Yeah. Um, well, if I could've gone back further, I would've said dive in faster to , to the ritual that Joel Oh side of things. Um, you know, that that kind of , it didn't take too long to get down this road, but, but this, if I would've just started that immediately, it would have been a little better. I would have had a couple of year head start. You know, it's , it's the, I think it's the best way to run, run a business. Um, you know , you talk about it a lot, right? They do . No accounts receivable. Right. So is the big one. Um, you know, paid same days , really nice. And um,

Speaker 2 34:19

but a lot of your conversations as a family on receivables right now and the other part of the business, I would imagine so. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So that's a, that's why your dad's not in the office all the time. He's not collecting money. So that's kind of ,

Speaker 1 34:31

um, an interesting topic for us to talk about is , um, where this all goes. I don't really know where, where it goes from here. We're kind of, I'm kind of at a point where we haven't really talked about about succession yet, but I'm sure we will soon. But what do we do , uh , with, with the other divisions down the road and where do I end up? I don't know yet. So that's kind of, yeah .

Speaker 2 34:54

Probably want to talk about that offline so you guys could figure that one out. Right. But it's a good conversation to have, right? Yeah. And you've gotta do that. Yeah . Especially as the business gets bigger and more complex and all that. So I'll let you figure that out. But I want to ask you another question. So I asked you if there's sons listening to this thing, you know , um, tell us what you really appreciated from Brian and Julie that a father or mother listening to this would say, you know what, that's good advice. I can then apply that within my family business.

Speaker 1 35:27

The gave me a lot of freedom to , to do what I needed to do. Um, I think, you know, I gave him confidence that, that we were able to do this, but not , uh , not a lot of like I didn't show them too much. They were pretty, they were pretty , uh , uh, but went off a little bit of blind faith and just let me, let me try it. So they gave me a lot of rain to do stuff. Um, so that was, that's good. If , if they had been micromanaging me at every , uh , pointed in the road, I don't know that it would have been as enjoyable.

Speaker 2 36:02

Let me ask you a question though, is I think about that because you came in and shortly after being there, you got on the residential side, which was never the cash cow at Ashton [inaudible] . And so you were kind of starting something that if it didn't go particularly well, wasn't going to necessarily tank the ship. Right? Yeah. I wonder how they would've been if you'd have gotten jumped right into the commercial contract business or jumped into the new construction side. So I, I guess the lesson may be in this thing is, is that is good advice, but you are doing kind of a new endeavor. Does that make sense versus something,

Speaker 1 36:40

or am I off on that? Yeah . I wouldn't know how to answer though , where I would have , you know, what they would've been like if we had gone the other way. But yeah. Um, it would have been different, I suppose. Yeah . It is a new endeavor and not as much. That's too much risk. Right? Yeah, no , that's fair. You know, let's let him figure it out for a year. And what's the worst thing, you know, he'll be, we break even on the thing and, oh well, you know, we're right where we were in counters , learned a few things, but it didn't work that way. We're good. Right? It worked out well, you know? Um, yeah, it was kind of like we were always, our department was always kind of like the underdog in the company. Right. We'll kind of looked at us. That might have fueled you a little bit to way it did. It did. Oh, it doesn't meet a Canadian born here wearing a tuk to [inaudible] . No , that, that definitely fueled me. It still does. Um, there is a little bit of like Inter Department rivalry , uh , which is, I think it's healthy fun for you. It's really fun. I had a guy since you caught up to him. Well, I had a guy come to me the other day. We had a breakfast meeting. It was for w we , we did 800,000 in June. Um, and that was, that was a really nice month for us. And so I , I had breakfast for the crew and one of the guys that used to work on my side , uh, he came to me in the parking lot and said, whoa , what was the breakfast about? I said, oh we did 800,000. And he was like, holy cow, what? That's, that's quite a bit. And uh, he said you're going to be catching the commercial department soon. And I was like, Benny, I passed too , like two, three months ago. He didn't know. Right. Cause they don't, they're not as numbers focused on the commercial side or collaborative and team and we're the more sales focused . So, but yeah, they, they don't, they don't all know yet, which is kind of interesting that, that it's bigger to make sure they know. They'll know sooner . I don't need to go around bragging about it, but it made me feel good. Yeah . Cause he was just, cause he looked at me with, you know , this , this look of like pride because he used to work with me. Right. And he was Kinda , he was happy to see that it was doing so well. So, going back to this question that we had a nice little scat there. That's cool and all, it's all, it's all that I took you off there too . But since idea of, of what advice you'd give a father or mother, right? Who had a child in the business like you and the one was, they gave you a what, not advice but, but what did you appreciate? That was another way of putting it. So it's really looking at the qualities they had and that what that, which they displayed with you in the things that you really found helpful, which was to kind of give you the reins . You have a lot of trust, not micromanage, give you something , uh , with, with, with authority and broad lines of responsibility, right. Not micromanaging what else? Uh, the training , um, nexstar helped a ton. Um, so being, they were very supportive of whatever I wanted to do within Nexstar. So spending, you know, the formula of, you know, having passion and having parents that let me do whatever I wanted led me to spend a lot of time with people at Nexstar and different nexstar courses. And so I absorbed as much as I could from, from everybody around me down here. And that's, I think that's a big reason why we've built what we, what we have. Um, so that, yeah, some support your, your, your children in , in taking whatever classes and uh , things that they need through your dad. Let me ask you this question. Or Julian and Bryan , they didn't come to you and say, you need to go to this class. You came to them and said, I'm going to this class. That's right. Right. There's a big difference there , right? Yeah. You know, they didn't say, well, we can't afford it. It's not in the budget or, you know, do this first or stand on your head and you know , saw the importance of making the investment. We were strategic. Like he wasn't just reckless about it and it wasn't a big party 40 here. Now I'm getting [inaudible] not showing up there. You know, some days are more painful than others. Sometimes by I get , um , yeah, no , uh, he was, they were both very supportive of that. The other thing, I actually just thought of this. The other thing is they're really focused on helping me maintain the culture of the company. So eos was very important. And My mother, she spent a lot of her time keeping me focused on, on the proper , uh, eos procedures, like the quarterly check ins and , uh , um, the stuff that I'm not overly good at. I'm not a details person. So she did a really good job of making sure that we kept a good , uh , communication rhythm with our , um, with our staff, with regards to core values and things like that. So the , she was, they were very good about that. Helpful for you. Yeah. Yeah. So they gave you the structure to, to work with them, right? Yeah, they help . They held me accountable cause I didn't really have a boss other than them. Right. It was just me. And so , um, if it wasn't for her holding me accountable to, to, to that aspect of it , uh, I don't think it would've gone as well. Very good. I like it. Yeah. Um, and then in terms of culture, Brian's very involved in , um, making sure that he still knows every employee, right? They , they're very, they're very involved in people's, in people's lives. They know when, you know, dance recitals are when kids birthdays are, and they've taught that to me and I'm getting better at it. I'm not as nearly as good as they are, but that, that was kind of the glue that was , was helping hold it together. Right. They , a lot of people are employed with us because of how great my parents are to them. Right. They, you know, they enjoy working for me and I'm helping them build a nice life through our pay plans and sales and things like that. But , um, if you ask a lot of the employees, it's probably just because of how good at people they are. So , um, so these are good attributes they brought into this thing to help you out. Yeah. I wouldn't have been able to, to do it without it. Like our, our retention rate is ridiculous. We don't, we don't lose people. Um, you know, sometimes we, we have to let some people go quickly once they come in and we realize they don't fit, but we don't lose people. And I think a lot of it has to do with with them. So that's , that's I guess a good piece of advice for parents is if your kid is focused on one particular department, think about focusing on the, the big picture culture of the company. Cause you can still control that even though you're not bright in the day to day. Oh , that's a good point. Yeah. There's a broad, a broad structure this fits within. Yeah. They're not reporting to you, but you can, you can control what you spend money on, right. What events you're throwing for them. Um, you know, how the , how they feel in general being at, in your company and your culture. Got It. That's good advice. That's good counsel. Well, congratulations. Be a while to get there, but are you, I mean, how long are you poor guy, you know, I mean, invite conversation. It took me a while to dig out. Um, you know, it's, it's interesting. I've , I haven't really reflected on it. So no, I get it. And you know, people, you know, when we do these, these podcasts, we don't talk about this stuff. You know, I sat and grabbed you at the , in a class, hey, you want to do a podcast when we talk about you and your dad, the way I look at tear . So No , you're going to, cause I knew what we had talked a little bit about again, about you and your relationship with , with your father and mother and how that works. Well, right. And, but it is, and I tell you

Speaker 2 44:32

what's interesting in this is , um , um, you know, our industry, the , the great part about our industry is that there's so many family businesses that's also a bad thing about the business. Cause a lot of them are challenged, right? And it takes a lot of work and it takes good people and a takes a lot effort, I know. And a lot of forgiveness and a lot of grace and a lot of , a lot of swelling or you go from time to time on both sides of this thing, you know?

Speaker 1 44:58

Yeah, I have a bit of a chip on my shoulder about that because a lot of people , uh , think that that it doesn't work. Like it won't work. Family business. Yeah. Yeah. There's people who have that view and um, I don't f , you know, I don't want that to be true because I love what I'm doing. Right. So I, I, I want to break that stereotype. People say what the first generation builds it. The second grows at the third ruined zones . Yeah . That might be true. I Dunno, but it's ridiculous.

Speaker 3 45:28

Yeah. I've seen a lot of first generations ruin it. Yeah . I'd say that right now. But yeah, I , I want this,

Speaker 1 45:34

this to work. I mean, this is, this is my life at this point, right . And I'm really enjoying it, so I want to , I want it to be successful. So, and it's so far it's been pretty good.

Speaker 2 45:44

Well, you know, I think the, the, the great thing is, you know, in a family business, I mean, when you did step into it and I'll, I'll say this very respectfully, it was a great position to be, you know , not a lot of 20 somethings get that opportunity to come into a a well run business with a healthy culture, start a new division, you know, get that going . Credit Card to spend credit card spend, go to Japan, Bass fishing, whatever you do, right. You're living a life. Right. You know, and, but, but you know what I've seen though is that yeah, you did get a lot of advantages and I don't, and don't feel bad about that, but you took advantage of them, right? You didn't squander them. You didn't, you know, just ride it out. You didn't, you don't want the Tommy boy here taken advantage of it. You know, you did a great job and you've grown a great department. Now it's the biggest one in the company as of June, which is cool.

Speaker 3 46:35

Yeah. I think you need to wear to charity breakfast for the other departments is what I think you need to do. Oh, don't let them hear that you get beat by 20 year old. They'd be tougher on me. No, you're adulation . And

Speaker 1 46:49

so, yeah, no, thank you. It's , um, it's, it's been good. And um, yeah, the, I, I'm a really like, I , I want to build this thing for, for them. So when I think about , um, you know, people saying it's been handed to you or it's been given to you , um, that, that's okay . They can say that. And, and I, I've got it . It's , it's on me to earn their respect and, and I know that people are going to say that , that it's okay, but what really want is to take all the positive momentum that they've built over the years with the , the brand and the strength of the brand that they built and actually build it to a point where they can feel like they've, they're financially free and yeah , they're receiving all the benefits. They , they dreamt up because the reality was my dad went to QSC before next star . He was on the board there and they didn't, they didn't get to that point yet. Like it was, it was kind of spinning. The service division had spun its wheels a little bit until we found Nexstar. And um, once, once we implemented the right procedures , uh, it, that's when it started to gain a lot more traction than the service and replacement business. So I think, I think that I have an opportunity to, to give them what they, what they always wanted to build.

Speaker 2 48:10

Yeah. Well just go on with what they did. Yeah. Right. That's good. You know, and again, I wouldn't, you know, your , your , your , your parents build something amazing and they really did. Yeah. Well done. And , uh, you know, one of the reasons I did that was, was for the family. Right. Right. And so they have opportunities that they can just not, not have , take it easy, but just, just step off from there . Every parent wants that, want their kids to have it better than themselves. Right. And have different opportunities than they've had. I want that. And everybody wants that. So , um, feel good about that. And you've done a great job, so congratulations Connor . You're a great, it's great to see at events. You're here all the time. You know , I see that in the back of the class often cause you've been to classes, you're bringing employees here and growing your business and I think, well done. Thank you. Well, well done. And , and Brian and Julie, if you're listening. Well done too well done. Good story. Good story . Thank you for your time. Yeah, no worries. Thanks for having me . You coming in here and again, congratulations. And uh , if you see Connor Williams , uh , he's a good looking guy in the back of the class here. You'll see them all the time and uh , pick his brain. He has a lot to offer and thank you all for listening to this, another episode, Leadership Lounge . Jack tested with Connor Williams and catch you next time .

Speaker 4 49:26

Thanks so much.