Keeping Your Head In the Game, With Ted Fox

Jack talks to Canadian Nexstar member Ted Fox, who joined Nexstar in December of 2016, just before a series of missteps crippled his business. He tells Jack how Nexstar’s approach of getting everyone at all levels of the company to return to fundamentals helped him right the ship.

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Speaker 1 0:09

Hi, this is Jack Tester and welcome to another edition of Leadership Lounge. I'm in Saint Paul, Minnesota. Sitting across the desk from me is a familiar face in next door to these days. Ted Fox. How are you doing ted? I'm doing well. Jack, how are you sir? What brings you to town? Uh, next, our service manager training. Okay. You're here, you've been to a lot of nexstar stuff and we're , that's part of your story and we're going to tell, but thank you for coming man. Yeah. And do you have some people here? Yes, I brought a , brought while our one current service managers here. Okay, so you came round of to learn with him. Yes. Yeah . No, I was, I was actually, there was a peer group I was going to attend here. Um, and when that cancel I'm like, no, I gave me the opportunity to get a flight already, so let's just do that. Yeah . Well I would rather have been here with him, but I, I wanted to hit that peer group. Yeah . Um, but , uh, so, so when the opportunity came that I could come. Yeah , it was , it was great. Fantastic. Well, tell us about the name of Your Business and where you're located. Uh , well recently changed. We , we've been Fox and sons plumbing, heating, cooling and electrical for awhile . We just literally changed the name to Fox plumbing, heating, cooling, electrical from a small town of 70,000 people, including surrounding area and in British Columbia it's called Vernon. Okay. Kind of a , the tropical center of Canada and the banana belt of Canada. Exactly. There's, there's vineyards there and stuff and they, they do let the grapes freeze and make dessert wine out of it, but it's, yeah, it's, it gets hot there in the summer and cold during the winter. So it's a pretty great place to live. Okay. Very, very nice. And just so people will know your business right now, just give us a rough size of your business and kind of what trades you do. Sure. Um, we, we're , we're around 36 employees in total. Um, give or take a couple depending on the day. And uh, uh, we're gonna we're set to close out the year somewhere in the 6.5 to $7 million range. Okay . That's a nice business in a smaller town. Yeah, it's , it's, it's pretty good. All Service replacement, all service replacement, 100%. And uh , we do plumbing, heating, cooling and electrical, electrical , fledgling for his attendance. It's, we're in our second year there and we did expand into a, a neighboring town, but it only accounts for about 9% for business currently. So the majority of it is how long have you owned it, ted? Oh, I've been, I bought 50% of it from my dad in 2008 and been full owners since 2012. Congratulations. Oh, thank you. All right, well you've got an interesting journey. First year. You're a popular guy here at next nextdoor I mentioned I'm going to talk to Ted Fox all. He's a good guy. So I always hear that from the staff and we see a lot too. You're always very complimentary and thank you. You're easy to, to , to help and like here, but you have got an interesting story and I think that story really started from when you joined. And I think there's a lot of lessons that we can pull from there . So , um , you've, you've agreed to do this and um, I'm going to talk about some of your recent challenges and some of your recent successes. Is that okay? It sounds good to me. So when you joined nextdoor , what year was that and how big is your business? Uh, I joined Nexstar in , uh , December 23rd or 22nd, sorry, 2016 right before the date. Yeah. I just remember that was, that was the day that d we decided we were going to do it. I'd seen, I had a trade show in Vancouver, it's called side effects. I ran into the next door booth and , and Lisa was , uh , was awesome. She just, she kind of got up, got up in my face in a nice way and uh, just started hammering me with questions about the company and , and I answered them with what I knew and she told me about the, you know, how'd you like to have a roadmap? And it was, it was just, it was really good conversation. I went home and set it to the side and spoke with my wife about it and just came to a conclusion like, how could we afford not to do this? Like it just looked so good. All right . So how big was your business when you join that? At that point we, we just closed out the year at about 1.7, just , just a little bit above 1.7 million. Okay. So you kind of been in the business since 2008 and kind of grew it to that point that that's right. Yeah. I worked at the business since 99 so it's kind of , there've been there a long time, but one of the sons I take it, yeah, I was, I was the son of, of the sons that ended up in the company. Got It, got it. Alright . Well tell us about what happened in your first year, so about how big you were at the end of the first year. Remember? For sure. For sure. Um, so the first year we went from uh , we basically doubled in size. We went to just over, I think 3 million from , from 1.7 so the growth was staggering, but we had been in a, how do I put this, the first 15 years of the company that I was in it from 99 til 2012 basically we, my dad and I were in it. It was just the two of us for the most part. And we wrote a $300,000 a year company, 400,000 time a material kind of company, 2013 forward. I'd grown it and kind of tried to take on some of these practices. And so I experienced some large growth seemingly, but then when I joined with Nexstar the processes and getting my mind wrapped around what I needed to do to go where I wanted to go, as my mind started opening up and I started making these changes, the growth just, just went like we , we doubled in size and um, but uh, but I've watched my net slip away from me as it was happening. That's the story here, right? Cause I think you had a pretty, if not a high flying, at least a sturdy business, profitable for a lot of years. Probably some retained earnings. Not a lot of debt. I'm assuming before you joined Nexstar no , none. Um , I actually, when my, when I bought dress up from my dad, I , uh, closed down the line of credit at the bank and just said I was going to do it on my own. None of that stuff. And when my wife and I, we , we worked , um, sue that we, we work hard for a few years, but we managed to , yeah , to build up a little nest egg there. It was good. So Nice. But you joined Nexstar, you doubled the size of the business within 12 months. You actually less than that cause you joined in end of January. So you just really stepped on the gas. But you , you didn't make any money. No, it's true. And I'd say that most of, most of the reasoning for that I can, I mean there , there's a couple of things I could make some excuses. I could say that one we had, we had a , um , an accountant at the time or a bookkeeper who was 10 months behind in our books. So we were making reactions on numbers that we were told are accurate, but what , we're 10 months old and so I kind of operating out of your, your bank account, just kind of looking at your cash and that's right. Yeah. And, and w and that, that, I mean, I am , uh , I learned by experience. I , I don't know that stuff very well, but my coach Jamie is an accountant. Uh , Jamie Robinson that he, he was telling me what to do. Like, he really was a, you know, like w we went through the Prophet pricer and this is what it needs to be. And, and I was sure he was wrong. That's positive because, you know, hey, like the book , Say I'm making money and it's, and uh , he's like, we're looking at , I'm supposed to be at $400 an hour and I'm going, well, maybe he really meant 200, so spend a few months there and then a few months back . And, and it was very clear if I just, if I just stood down and listened more, it would've been better. Right. I would've, I would've done, I wouldn't have been in this pickle that I was in by the end of the year. Um, but by the end of the year, Hey, my prices, I won't ever know . He's smiling right now. Yeah. Right. So at the end of the year, you know , you had grown the business. Uh , you didn't, you were Kinda operating blind of sorts financially. Yes. That's what we found out. Yes. And, and another, that's another advice I'm going to , Kudos out to Jamie. Uh, replace your bookkeeper as quickly as possible. So as quickly as icing possible was about a year and a half later. And so I quickly in the United States, ted, just letting you know, quicken. So there's wine country in British Columbia. I'm sure they'll trust me. It's worth laughing about now. Uh , we, we, yeah, we knew things were , were going that way, but it was um, it was something that, was this a long time employee? It , was it a family friend, was it? No , no, it was a recommendation from our accountant that this person was top notch and um, and when, and she was with us for a little while before and she , she was good, a wonderful lady. Um, but we out paced her like we just outpaced and we didn't know how far behind she was cause she would say that she's, everything's good. Did you have just one person in your finance group? Yes. So when you doubled in size, your transactions, everything doubled in the Ed . One person trying to do it all. Yes. And she , and at that, and she wasn't the type of person I found out later to say, hey guys, I fell behind. Yeah . It was just kinda covered up, covered up, covered up. Right. So that, that really hurt. So first 2017, we , uh, you know, I, I was, I, I was into Nexstar I love everything about it. We're into it next door. Yes . You came to almost everything. Yeah. I, I liked to, I really like a lot of people here. I love to learn and I, and I think education just, just makes so many, so much easier for everybody. And , um, and I didn't, when I was looking into next , I looked at it closely and I didn't see anything about it that I didn't, that didn't align with my, the way I believed or the way that my value . So I just, I thought it was a really safe place , um , that way, like to , to take information back. And , um, so by the time the fall came around of 2017, 2017. Yeah. Thank you. We , we did , um, our first BPW and that business planning workshop that's due to Kinda creating a business plan for the next, the next fiscal year, which would be 2018. Right then this would be my first one ever of any kind in any sort of business planning event in your whole career. I have ever , ever. And so, so Shane here, he uh, he started digging through my financials to help your accounting coach. That's right. To help build , help build us cause we needed numbers to build this plan off of. And so between Shane and Jamie, we tried putting these numbers together. Pardon me? And eventually went, you know what? Hey good enough. We're gonna use benchmarks because it was just too messy. Like what we have, you could message it , step off your last year's financials into the next year. You just know cause they were, they were 10 months behind at that point. So we were dealing with, it was crazy. So I still went ahead with the BPW didn't back out cause I thought I've got to start somewhere. And then I started keeping separate books from my bookkeeper and I kept the , I filled out to my , my plan every month. And, and that plan ended up being way more accurate than my company books were. Um, which was the sad thing. It's bizarre. I, you know , no , no fence . Just so everybody's listening. Jack's got an eyebrow raised, a mirror and now there's a separate set of books. Uh, it was the owner. Yes, it was. Um, it was like that. And my wife who, who was home with our , our new baby, thank you very much. She was wonderful, both of them. And , um, we were , uh, I'd go home and it'd be like, well, you know, this is, this is how we did and this is what the, what the bookkeeper says we did, you know, like, and so we kind of would take a blend of I'm going to get some things wrong and she, and [inaudible] and kind of beaten in the middle, cause that what you're doing it to try and go, no, it's true. And it was to try and find out where we were as an accurate science. Dead. Really? Yeah. I see what it's, you know, it's not like marketing, which is a bunch of wild guesses. Oh , what do they call them? Bean counters then? Cause I just, I don't know the word sarcasm here. No, it's perfect because by that time we hit it , we had started the process to , to replace our bookkeeper. Like we , okay . I was actually on , I was trying to find somebody you know , that we could trust in and that we, that we could bring in and do this and um, and I did find that person and then we were waiting to get them started and that took months to get that person in and in place. And then they had to start cleaning up the mess that was left behind. So welcome. We're into 2018 now. Midway through school , Kinda flying blind. Yep . But not, not near as much. I've got the business planning workshop and I'm keeping my own books now . Right . You're kind of tracking your revenue in your head now. And I , I've got, and I've got regular meetings with my accountant and I'm pulling these things together and um , but we didn't back off on next door at all because I, cause it wasn't, it wasn't a blind faith that everything's just going to work out, but it was, it was clear that this was the way, if I , if I gotta jump a hurdle here and we're going to be in the good light later. So we, we've got an a new financial controller in place and he started cleaning things up. Um, and it was almost magical in a way to , to me. Um, I, I do, I do understand my p and ls and all those things, but you, but I did have other people providing them to me before . So, so when you're getting your P and l and your butt , it's wrong, but you're told it's just, it's a bizarre thing, right? No, it's right. Yeah, exactly. And so now it's, so then once we hit that, then we were really able to see where, where's our baseline, where are we, how, how efficient are we all these things. And then you're , then now you're going, okay, well our, our HVAC Department is 11% efficient, you know , or, or whatever it is. And so then we started focusing there and that really led me down the path of do I have the right leaders in the right seats, are the, you know, are are the people that I have. And this is in 20, 2018. So what have you heard of the year? Was this? Um, books were cleaned up by end of me . Okay . So, so yeah, this would have been summer of last year about this time, but a year ago now . Okay . All right . And , um, so everything's rolling pretty good. And we, we had , uh, we had, we had a loss in the first part of the year, which was fairly standard for us. We had our , our busy time tends to be September, October, November. Um, cause that's when most of the Igloo building happens in Canada and freezing grapes. Yes. So , uh , so I , um, so we , we were going through that period of time and we actually were looking, looking pretty solid that we're going to close out in profit last year. Um, and then that's kind of the other turn of the story I guess is, is because of timber. October, November are our busy time. I booked a bunch of training in including like the BPW, there's the super meeting there was, and then I had a couple of other ones up , sewer sales. Um, cause we, we see where department going. So there was three or four important kinds of trainings that I booked in that time thinking, okay, I've got a busy busy time here. My people that they know their processes, we can get this going. And um , during a stretch of a couple months there and between September, October , um , early November, there was, while I was away that the business just tanked, the , the phone stopped ringing. Um , I mean it rang a little wee bit but not enough. We didn't have a flyered ad campaign. Like, I normally, I normally have my marketing under wraps, but I didn't on purpose cause I thought the weather was gonna be there for me, which was a big mistake. And , um, and I was away. And the , the people that I had left in charge while I'm gone on, I'm in contact with them and everything else. They, I didn't, I didn't support them enough, I guess to know that , um, that they'd let me know if things were actually wrong with getting a police report or anything like that out of these folks. Any kind of daily revenue, no tracking or anything cause you could have seen it, right. Yeah. So that , that's right. Exactly. So I would call in and find out going give you Joe's . Okay. Yeah . That's exactly, exactly showed up today. Yup . No, and I, and , and I was talking to one person. Yeah . Not The whole team. Yeah . So that when I was away, I had one contact person who was my GM at the time. And , uh, and he , you know, good , good worker and everything. But when I, I knew that things were going down when I was watching the bank account and I was watching our service titan and I'm like, you know, things aren't, things aren't, they're not okay . But I knew I had a couple of days left of this last training to get through. So I got through it, focus there, came home, and when I got in the door , um, we were, we were in a , in a dark spot and we had gone from being okay and looking like we're going to make some profit to , I dunno , I can't even remember. It was around $400,000, just gone to two suppliers or to whatever, just gone. Um, it didn't disappear, but we just didn't make any. So, so you ended up in a, in a struggle there. So I arrived home at, do you want me to keep talking about ?

Speaker 2 17:26

Sure. This is the only piece that I always like to spare. So this is fine . Oh, sure . It was a wonderful man. Well, so couple months , month , you're flying high next to our events, high five and lots of stuff. And, you know, and we're, we're good spirits and yeah. Meanwhile, the good folks are back home. Yes. How's it going? Good. Yep . Yeah . And we're,

Speaker 1 17:50

and worst in the time of year where money just flows in, right. It gets , it's not at all. They just stopped. So I w I got home and I'm [inaudible] I start work at five in the morning and uh, so that I'm on a better time with you guys here. Of course. So , uh, I get in, I get in and I went through the bank account and I went through what jobs are coming up on the board, which there weren't any, no installs, booked, no one , like just , there was nothing. I'm looking at k today, we've got think two service calls on the board and we're, we're at this point, we're about a four and a half million dollars we're doing that year. Okay. So, so we needed more than two service calls. People to feed. Yeah. And , and I'm looking at , everybody's coming into work according to the thing like theirs . So what are they doing exactly? So I , um, I sat and I started digging through and looking at , okay, what can I do? So the first thing I did is I brought in my general manager and I sat him down and I said, listen, like we're in a pickle. Obviously we're in a bad spot here. And I said, I just, I need to know what you've done, what actions you've take here, here, even in the last few days so that I'm not doubling up on something you've already done. Cause I gotta do some crazy things here to survive. And um , man, I've known a long time, shrugged his shoulders and said, phone's not ringing. He said, we followed the processes. So I just, it was a , uh, it was a lightning bolt to the face. I just, I knew that the person who I had put into that position was the absolute wrong person. And no matter how good he was at processes, he was either lacking in the , in the capabilities or just the heart to , to do something here, which is of course comes back on me. So , um, so I told him , cancel, cancel all the trainings, cancel, like, cause we do daily trainings and weekly trainings with people and as a cancel all the meetings, cancel everything and uh, start looking, start pick out your phone book, let's start calling, let's get some calls. And I just started giving out tasks and um, and I said, and what I want you to do is I just want you to, to , uh , I had some reports I needed filled out and things like that. And I , and I just said, as of today, I'm effectively taking over. So, so I said, so just all, everything comes to me. Um, so I had the morning huddle and got everybody going where they should go and everybody was kind of fired up and amped up then. And they, they went to work. And , um, I sent Jamie Robinson a, a message that said, I really need to speak with you. And I went home, which I know sounds kind of funny, but I had to, I had to leave and had to go tell my wife that, that for the first time, the first time ever, I didn't know if we were going to make it. Yeah. Um, I really, I was their first day back if you had to go back and say, oh my gosh. Yeah. And , and it was a bleak enough picture that I looked at how like, how long it would take to pay back at to pay back suppliers and pay back these things. Like I , it was a shock for one to know that you could go down 400 grand in , uh , in a matter of 2030 days. It makes total sense that you can, but when we hadn't had a slump like this and at a time a year, it was just, it was a , it was a shock for sure. And it shouldn't have been. I should have been. It's, I should've been on it, but , um, yeah, I went and did that conversation go? Oh , it was , um, ah , it was pretty wonderful. Honestly. Uh , it's, it's the something everybody wishes they could do at one point in their life. I , I, I went home and I, and I just said, I really need to talk to you. And , and we, we went through things and she, and she or things that have you called Jamie? And I said, yes, I'm waiting for call back. And , um, and she said if it was at any other time of year, I would say that we need to start looking at what our other options are. But she said, you know, it's, it's November, you can do this. And um, so we sat and I was pretty upset and she kind of calmed me down a bit I guess. And um, and then shortly after that I got a call from Jamie and we started going through, he said, okay , like you said, you lost it this quick, you can make it that quick. And, and, and he just, we just went through, what are the processes, what do we need to do? I felt I felt good in a way that that first initial meeting I had in the morning and doing the morning huddle , I had started these things in motion. So I had made the right decisions for the most part. But Jamie , Jamie gave me some, some other advice as well. Um, just on leaning on the suppliers of bed , you know , some, some bigger, bigger picture stuff. So Jack, in the end of that day, I had three days of installs booked, three days, three crews. And um, we had service calls coming in and we went, I mean we were by that point, maybe 10 days into November and we ended up, ended up closing out in November in a profit . And , um , I'm breathing a sigh of relief right now. I can see it. Yeah. Cause uh, that was , uh , that was a tight , uh , tight moment. But I don't think there's ever been a more magical moment that the company then recreating that everyday for the next month and a bit that, where all the leaders would, would come in and the people and we , and I'd say the weather hasn't changed. We don't have any marketing going. Like we didn't throw any money at it. We just, you didn't launch at it. Yeah, no, we just worked. Yeah. And focused and, and um, and we filled the board and we filled the days and we started and we had the best December we've ever had by far. Um, which is never a great month anyways for us. We can't compete with Santa Claus, although I wasn't going to be beat this time. We did installs on Christmas Eve and we did installs on boxing day. So it , uh, I , I was picking up furnaces and, and air conditioners on boxing day at six in the morning to put in from the supplier. Uh , for the rest of us that are aren't an English colony, what is boxing day? Boxing Day is just like a free holiday. The day after Christmas, you call it boxing day, what do you call it here the day after Christmas? It's not holiday . Canadians got heritage day and oh , it's bird . That's and family day. You guys hadn't had a lot of things . I like France and northern France. I got in big trouble. Jack people had been coming into my office and I have a daily calendar and whenever there's a stat, I draw little skull and crossbones on it. So I know and I, there's a stat, a stat, statutory holiday. Oh, so boxing day is not a stat, although many people in Canada think it is a , it's not required. It's not required. But they have, we've got one almost every month now. It's great for business. Yeah . So, so I was picking up those things. So we did it anyways. We fought through, we got that stuff done and survived. Um, and uh , we didn't, we didn't, we're , we're not able to pull back a profit out of that year, but I was able to survive and uh, so we sustained a pretty decent, a pretty decent loss again then in 2018, which, you know, hey, I mean, I don't know this , but there's an award for that. Maybe. I Dunno, you weren't as ugly as you thought you were. Yeah.

Speaker 2 25:48

No, there is a reward for that. Cause you know, you can't, you know, the , the reality is you can't change yesterday. Right. So when you rolled back in the business early November, you know, yeah, you had done some things and the business had kind of been an autopilot yes, on a slow decline and you weren't getting good information and you didn't have systems that give a good information. So we'll talk about what you learned from that, but, but, but you know, you , you recognized it. And what I love, what you did is you just, you know what I see Ted? Um, a lot of times companies when when something bad happens , uh, they lunge at the problem. They say, okay , I've got to spend. So now they're, they're behind the eight ball and other guys spent a ton of money on marketing and they spent a ton of money on marketing. If that doesn't work, now there really bad trouble. Right. That's kind of a, a real issue. And you just went back to the fundamentals, right?

Speaker 1 26:39

Totally. I, I looked at and I thought, I'm too close to Christmas, I'm too close to it. And like there's just no, there's no way. And I never write , don't believe in advertising afterwards. And you can't get it going quick either. Right. You can't advertise at 10 in the morning. No, you could have paperclick but right. Stuff like that. So that kind of stuff. And to be fair, we did have like our Internet was going, we had pay-per-click funds, but , but we just were at a size. It wasn't, that's not enough for that kind of thing. And , and we didn't need it. It was very clear we didn't need to, it was the work that we needed to do. And the end , the work showed up. It wasn't magic. And I would come into the office and say it , like I would shut my door and I'd get on the phone and I was calling people. Cause at that time I was sales manager. Um, I handled sales, sales management and marketing and um, and I'd come out of my office and we'd have nine sold days or eight sold days. And it was just day after day after day it during that time. So, so we did it. And then I did have a big marketing thing going ready for mid January. And so I just, I still worked on that and went, yeah , we'll hit that, but it , we'll struggle through and we'll do this and get there. And um, and so that, that came, that came along and it was , was a smashing success for it . But the real task was getting surviving to that point. Right. And then the struggle that that leads to, like this year 2019, we're, we're in a far better situation. So are you thinking we're in a far better situation? Um, and, and we're not operating in losses and, you know, but there's a fear there that I know how quickly it happens , so I'm always good and oh , it is good. But I, I've used up my nest egg, so I need to build that. And that's taking more time than what I like it to take.

Speaker 2 28:25

You know, I was reading a book on it . Tell you this with what they call , I'm sorry to interrupt. No , no, please . You know, we're, we're just, we've been really , uh, using a lot of Jim Collins content as we would run up to super meeting and he talks about this amazing quality. These, these internally great companies have, which is called this productive paranoia, which is they always are fearful right there . They're not living in fear, but there they're never content. They always think that the other shoe will drop. You know, that is some force out there that's chasing them even though it's not. It's, it's , uh, but I, but I, but I, but I sense when I listened to you is that you remember how close you were and you remember how quick it can turn if you go away from these fundamental activities. Is that fair?

Speaker 1 29:11

Yeah. I'll never forget it. Yeah, that's a good lesson. No, they didn't kill Ya . No , it is the, I think it will be the strongest moving points in my, in my business career. Like as far as me and I, and it could be wrong, maybe there'll be more like other ones, but yeah. But that one I get, it was right to the core cause it was really real. It was like, it was no, there was no, and , and I've had to live there for quite a while now because you, even though you survive it , um, you're still , uh, like until we have a few smashing months, you know, that financial reality is there too. And it also left my leadership team who's been revamped and reworked in like, we're, we're working together and I've got a really great team now. Really Great. It's left them nervous anytime I go away. And that was a , that was an obstacle to overcome in itself that, that , uh , when I'd go there , there was a panic that things were going to fall apart while I was gone. And it hasn't happened this year. That hasn't been a thing. It's, it's , um , I'm way more involved when I am away with home. I want to talk about that. Yeah, for sure. But I'm sorry to finish your thought going . I don't want to interrupt that. Oh No, I was just , uh, that I guess, I guess that was about it. Alright , well let me, let me, let me ask that question then, because you're here. I am. Right. And I don't know that I see you as much as I saw you during that time where you were, you know, kind of a nexstar junkie and now you're gone a lot. And clothes . All right. It's close. Not Quite as much though. Okay. So what, what, give me the difference today when you're gone. Okay. And the difference from a year ago when you were gone, when you came back to a mess, now you're not going to come back to a mass because of fill in the blank either . I, I'm not a junkie though, next to our fan. So , um, last year, the difference, the main, I think one of the main differences is I still, I still am present for the morning huddles. Every time I'm away. Um, you phone in, I phone in and if I can't get it by phone, they, they do the huddle and they send me all the info and then I go back and forth with them , with the managers once I'm done. OK . So driving the business kind of remotely and you're still plugged in. Do you know how many calls are on the board? You know, how many you sold yesterday? The whole routine. That's right. Okay. I know I, and I know it down to a , there huddle is, is a at eight 45. Okay, so that's 10 45 our time. Yep . Okay . Yep . Very. So 45 your time, of course. That's what time it is. Yeah. So in first thing in the morning, what I do when I'm away is cause I'm , I'm an early riser. I, I'll get up and I'll actually fill the pace, report out with the best knowledge that I have based off of our CRM and whatever else. I'll fill that all out. So if for some reason somebody's got questions or whatever, I got a good idea what happened yesterday, where we're pacing all those things first thing in the morning. You do that? I do that. Okay. They do it as well, but when I'm away I do that. So, and then when , uh , and I do it when I'm there too, but I just keep that to myself. And it helps me keep everybody honest, I guess. Um , no, it keeps you your head in the game as what it does. That's way more accurate. So yes. And it keeps your head in the game. No , and yeah. Right. Yeah . And uh , so I do that. Then once huddle happens and yesterday was a failure because I wanted my numbers in the morning when I [inaudible] and didn't get, didn't get a response for awhile . They were, they were out busy doing things, but the numbers came in over the course of an hour or two and I said, did you guys hold the huddle? And they absolutely, they held the huddle. They did just service manager stand in with out on ride along and , and I said, well, holding the huddles one thing, but getting me the numbers as the other, like it has to happen. It can't be today. That was yesterday. So , so today I'm going to find out, but they assured me last night that , uh , that the numbers will be at w will be in my hands by 10 o'clock their time or sorry, nine o'clock their time. It's 11 o'clock or 11 o'clock here. I'm going to check in on that. Um, so that's, that's been, that's a big difference. And now I find that when it's almost been a victory for them when I've gone away almost every time, save one this year, which has been a , I think I've been away seven times and total s yeah , six or seven. Um, all but one they outperformed on the weeks I was away. Okay. They , they, they had better than the number that we had, more green days than red days, you know, like it was, it was, it was good stuff more when the days and so I'd come back in this kind of a bragging thing going like, you should go away more often. And I'm like, don't do it that , no, don't do whatever . No, no, but I think that that uh, the attitude is better. It's getting better, especially, but it's still this particular one coming to service manager training we were taking, we were taking our main service manager away and myself and so, so there was a that fear again. So it had a pre, a pre leaving meeting with managers that we, we , uh , and we talked about it , but what and what I expect and what the focuses are and what they need to do. And then we just check in on it every day . Accountability. And so far they're doing fine. Like the numbers are, the numbers are fine. We're, we're doing it . It's , it's the end of summer up there. It's a little bit slower on the boards, but they're working hard. They're doing the outbounds, they're doing everything they can do. And I know, like I , I can tell you, I know that yesterday they were all working hard. I know they were, because I can tell by what they did. Wasn't a green day though. Yeah, it was good. It wasn't green day firsts . Yeah , it was great. So , um , the day before wasn't okay . But yesterday was, so it surprised me that they didn't put those goals up cause the goals was pretty good.

Speaker 2 35:09

That's what's dipped at , it's one of the things that's different now when you're away, you know, I've heard a couple of things. One year you're phoning into the huddle yep . In it to the extent that you can, and if you're in a class where that's a really a problem to do a, you're filling it , you don't, but you do get the information [inaudible] you actually complete a paste report yourself. So you're aware and owning those numbers. Lax , is that right? Always. Yeah. So you're doing that. Anything else? Um, and, and you're doing a pre Ted's going away. Yes. Call.

Speaker 1 35:38

Yeah . Yep . Meeting for sure. Those are responsibilities. Yeah. Um, I guess the other I also really looked at how do I, how do I go away less? Like I , I do see a real value in being here to support whoever's going. It's a major value there for sure. Um, but you can't do it at the expense of everybody else's expense of the business. Right. So we did two , uh , private training events this year. Like we have one in April, we've got one coming up in September , um, and uh, which is fantastic. So we're able to train a train a lot of people in stay home, stay local. Um, so my plan is next year to make it a couple less trips again. Um, and I'm hoping to have my leaders at a point where where they can go with people. And I do think I've got a couple of them there at this time. Uh, but I think that's, that's the, that's the biggest struggle for my company I think at the moment is, is that all the leaders are in training. We're , we're all including myself, but they're all in training and, and some of them have been there for awhile and are really good now. Um, but we have a great team on there. So, so I know Jamie and I were speaking and we're kind of on a precipice at the moment of, in his words, you're about to fall, you're about to stumble and fall into some wealth because we just finished July out in July was the same as November, where we expect July to be a peak season for us. But it was in Celsius. Everybody 15 degrees below seasonal norms for the month of July. Convert that to American for me. So it would have been, we're normally around a hundred degrees between 90 and 105, somewhere in there. 105 in Canada. Yeah. Aaliyah wine comes . Shoot is , I know it's hot where we are. It's amazing there. But uh , except for this year. And so it was sitting more around 70 degrees. Um, so you didn't have the weather slam that you might've expected in July. Our biggest sale in July was we sold a double furnace system because the pilot went out and they were cold. So, so it was, it was interesting, but it was another one of those things where I, we were counting on that weather now and that'll being said, we didn't hit our gross budget and that was the first month of the year that we hadn't met or exceeded our budget. So I was feeling pretty, a little bit of failure there on that. And we missed it by a lot. It was supposed to do about 600 and 600,000. We did four 72 or something, the big miss. And um, but we worked hard. We didn't like, we were just grinding and working at and uh , and we closed the month out with a, with a small profit I made, made, made some money there. Um , and that was what Jamie and my takeaway from was was our, our baseline, we considered July to be a pretty garbage month for us. It was the first month. We hadn't had installs in the board since November , um, for, for a few days. But our baseline now and a junk month, we're in profit. And that's a , to me that's a huge,

Speaker 2 38:52

got it. So , okay. So if you do 600 debts, then percent gross margins in other $100,000. Yeah . You got it. So, so, so although we're, we're waiting for, we're waiting and working towards those larger months.

Speaker 1 39:07

Um, we've managed to take the company from place where a garbage month means you're going under to a garbage month means , uh, we're, we're alive and we're, we're kicking. Sorry. So let's say it's been a, it's been a hell of a year.

Speaker 2 39:20

Yeah. Well, it , let's talk about that. You know, I appreciate what , what's different about you when you're gone versus before and what I'm sensing from you is you, you understand the value of presence to that. It's not just about you out learning the business. You also have to be there. You have to be, you don't have to be a eyesight of folks and you don't have a huge business where you're the CEO on high , you know, you're a still inactively involved. Absolutely. Manager, owner in that business and presence, leadership presence. This is important in a service business, right? Yes. So you get that. What else have you learned, Ted, from this? The struggle that you can share yourself by your team about the industry, about anything

Speaker 1 40:03

that that's, that's good. I definitely, it does you no good to bury your head under a rock. Um, you gotta face, you gotta face your adversities head on because that definitely was the temptation when, when, when stuff hit the fan, the temptation was , uh, you know, to, to, to just fold up, maybe maybe cry in a corner somewhere and that only lasted a few seconds, but it was there and I remember it and it was a long, few seconds, still tell him really went slowly. Oh Man. But , uh, you know, if just knowing that, knowing that you can, that you can do these things, I mean , or that, and you're not doing it alone, but , um, I don't wanna I don't want to sound too philosophical or anything like that, but uh, but it, it, it truly was a, it was a measure of, well, it was a measure of all of us at the company. I felt like , um, I really didn't want it to be about me being away was the reason that everything tanked. But at the same time, I think generally it comes back to that, that that's, that's what it was. And it wasn't that I didn't want it to be about that so that I could go away more. It was more so that I didn't have to own it 100% myself. Um, but in reality, that's, that's where the buck stops. And , uh, so I'm, I'm fine taking that responsibility on, but now it feels my responsibility to never get there again, ever. And , uh, and the funny thing was if I was out, if I had gone to Vegas or Hawaii or gone and had some fun somewhere, or when I come to these next door events , um, if I was out just goofing off and having fun, that's not my style. I'm here to work and I'm here to try and better myself and better the company. If I was doing all that goofy stuff, then I think it's an easier, it's an easier moment to say like, well, you can't do that. You gotta be working. But I was working in the wrong place.

Speaker 2 42:17

Got It. That's so good. Yeah, that is so cool. So when I just heard right there. Oh Wow . Thanks. You don't, you know, cause it's easy. You know , you can just, you can point fingers and say it's their fault and you or you could or you could, could , uh, you know what you , what you're saying is that you could have rationalized and said there's nothing I could've have done cause I was still working. Right. I was still in a class and I'm , when you're in a class, you're in class, you're not out drinking, you're not out. Carousing you're out in here doing the work. Right. You're here early and stay late and you're engaged. And you can rationalize that, that, you know, a lot of people work hard and still fail for sure. Right . For sure. They did what you said you were at that moment in time , um , you didn't have the business set of what set up where you could be gone so much. Absolutely. There might've been, let me just say this, ted , um, there might have been a little bit of an indulgence on your part cause you like next door and you're like , you like come in here and you like going to our training and you're good at it. And it's like, well, this is fun too . Right . And maybe a little fun and be at home, not at home with your boyfriend.

Speaker 1 43:20

Yeah . That's your home that you don't want . I'm saying no. Yeah , no, it always seems that that's very true. It is. It is intoxicating getting , um, getting educated. It just is. And going home with tools like, and have fun. It is,

Speaker 2 43:34

we'll let you got in the class there is like , God, it's just inspiring, right?

Speaker 1 43:38

Yep . And going home with those, I always want to go on with those few, few big takeaways, a few big things that you can do and, and yeah, no, it's, it's totally , uh , uh, no , I said intoxicating. I am a Junkie Jack , you know , worn it our , except your Paul . Okay. I apologize. It's intoxicating. It's right. Yeah. No, it's uh , no, it's, I guess I see the value in it, but I , and I seen more value there than, than my presence. And I thought I had set everything up so that I could and let make no mistake, I don't want to be here all the time. In fact understand and in fact and know no offense to you at or any of the team. They're amazing here. But last year when this was going on, I was tired of it. I didn't want to be here anymore. But there was a few things like sewer sales was, that was really

Speaker 2 44:32

a big push I've been doing. I'm a plumber, I've been doing plumbing forever. Never dawned on me to replace a sewer pipe unless it was completely collapsed. And it just never dawned on me. And it's like , well, this is where everybody's gross margins are. I need to get into this, we need to know how to do this. And the only, so I didn't really, I was using some of these things to be like, okay, well we need to get that set up and that set up and that's it. I know there's a reason. So it felt important, but it was not the right move. It was not the right move. Too much, too soon. Absolutely. Too much at one time. Yep . There's a digestion. Every business takes right. How long they can do, how fast they can do stuff. Right. And I, I do like to do things fast. I get it. And uh, and that , that's not always, that's calendar. And it's like, well now we're never, I can go get her done. It's three days, but that's three days. That's a lifetime. You know, like if you can, if you're thinking that's nine missed installs for us, for a small company. Right. I don't even like to think about it. That's so cool. Well man, this has been great, ted. Thank you. You know, I saw you this morning and I didn't, when I woke up this morning, I wasn't planning to do this podcast and I , I, I was either was, I know, right? And so we did literally, so I know I was traveling yesterday and I came in and one day into the service management and we're sitting there greeting people that came in at Ted and I thought , oh, wait a minute. I remember hearing from Jamie or somebody also bought kind of the challenges you've been through in the last year. And you know, we've talked a little bit, you know, we're friendly but I don't know your business. Um, and I said, well, maybe this would be interesting and this has been wonderful. What a great story you gotta tell here. Thank you chuck . I hope it maybe it'll help somebody or make them feel a little better. Um, I really didn't think you'd want to , you'd want to talk with me. I'm not, I'm not much of a success story yet. We're normal . We're working there. You've got the right trajectory going for sure. And , uh , you're very transparent and willing to share. And I gotta tell you that your story is not unusual in the history of next door . Now, oftentimes, I don't think that the, the reason owners kind of pull up , they would, the owners have a little bit of success in the business. Like you had doubled the business, got some things going if you look at it. So this business looks dramatically different than it did five years ago or three years ago. And when an owner steps away without processes, without people like for whatever the reason, whether it's coming to the next, our venture going golfing or fishing or whatever, sometimes there's, there's less worthy endeavors they do. Um , your result is, is very common, but it was a , I think it's a safe way to tell the story because you did it for the right reasons yet it got the wrong result. Absolutely . Right. So there's a , I can learn a ton from this. I can learn a ton and I tell you, I hope, I hope there's some young folks out there listening like you that have got their business to a point where it's doing pretty good, better than it was. And they're tempted to do some different things because the round is what got you back to where you are. Ted is what's going to keep you where you are. Right. These processes I'm talking about. Absolutely. You know, these disciplines you've put in place in a business, you know, and , and I know it's a lot of work and you wanna you want to grow up a business to a point where you're not having to be the magician every day touching everything. But that'll happen over time. Absolutely. It just can't happen too early. Does that make sense? No, that makes total sense. Thank you. So congratulations. Well , thank you Jeff. This has been fun. Yeah, no, I appreciate it. Well, you know what, and I want to keep you to this because we started this at nine 30 central time. Okay. And we're going to get done just before 10 30 central time. Nice. Which is eight 30 Pacific time in your huddles . Pretty quick here in 15 minutes. So we want to get you to that, right ? Yeah, no, I'm going to get there. Thank you so much for this time. I sure appreciate it. I hope you folks out there learned a lot from Ted. I sure did, and we'll catch you next time. Thanks so much.