Honoring Our Veterans: Unveiling Memorial Benefits

In this episode, Rich Bennett sits down with Jane Babcock to delve into the often misunderstood benefits available to veterans and their families. From the intricacies of pre-need cemeteries to the specifics of funeral honors, Jane provides invaluable insights to ensure that veterans receive the honors they deserve. Whether you’re a veteran or a family member, this episode is packed with essential information you won't want to miss.

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Transcript

Rich Bennett 0:00
I am sitting here with Jane Babcock again. You all heard her on the one episode we were talking about that good old French flavored water, the Camp Lejeune, you know, water and everything that's live the Marines and everybody is going through. But this time I have her on because we're going to be talking about survivors and memorial honors benefits because a lot of people don't realize let me rephrase that. A lot of veterans and their families don't understand. I and Jane, if if I'm using the wrong term, correct me, but everything they're entitled to as a veteran, Right. When it comes to the survivors and the memorial honors, because I know a lot of people feel that 

you've had to either retire from the military. 

Jane Babcock 0:58
Or. 

Rich Bennett 1:01
Be killed. 

Jane Babcock 1:02
In service. 

Rich Bennett 1:03
Yeah. Yeah. Or die in service in order to get a lot of these memorial honors. But that's not the case, is it? 

Jane Babcock 1:11
No way. 

Rich Bennett 1:11
Okay, That's what I thought. Let's. I want to. Let's just start from the top with the cemeteries. pre-Need cemeteries. Explain to everybody what they are entitled to. I would just go right down the line because I know. Just give you an idea. I know in my. And this is recently my best friend's father passed away and he was a veteran. And even I know you're going to teach me a lot that I didn't know, but they asked me about because he wanted to be. They wanted him bearer of military honors. Who could they contact? My first thought was VFW or American Legion. 

Jane Babcock 1:52
And that's true. Okay. In some very remote areas. But generally speaking, your funeral is going to take care of getting those arrangements done. Our homes have a list of all the different organizations that do military honors. You know, they could do the 21 gun salute, the taps, the folding of a flag. Some families can handle taps. You know. 

Rich Bennett 2:18
That's hard. Yeah, I. 

Jane Babcock 2:19
Know. Yeah, They want the flag to be presented to the widow, but they don't want 

the I guess, you know, the. Yeah, the full ceremony, right? Yeah. So they have a list. And of course, if the veteran was a member of the VFW, that's the first organization that. 

Rich Bennett 2:40
Okay. 

Jane Babcock 2:41
If the veteran wasn't a member of a poster or chapter or anything, they will then go down the list. Oh, who's the next organization in line? And because they can do 21 gun salute, those posts can submit usually to their state for a reimbursement card, or they get the blank ammunition from their state. 

So it's not incurring that expense to them other than their time. Right. Okay. So the family, the funeral home says, you know, he's a veteran. Do you want this honor? Yes. Okay. Which ones? All of them, that kind of thing. And then they make arrangements with those local posts and chapters that are trained to do funeral honors because it takes a while to learn how to properly fold a flag. Oh, yes. Come out to be a triangle. Yes. Yes. A proper. 

Rich Bennett 3:35
Triangle? 

Jane Babcock 3:37
Yes. A proper triangle. And then, you know, a lot of places will be in contact with a place that makes and or where you can purchase the funeral flag box so you can get that kind of information from your funeral home or your veteran service officer. Your accredited veteran service officer. We used to actually have a guy that made flag boxes and we sold them right out of our office for exactly what it cost him. So. Wow. Yeah, it's it's nice and it's something you could pass down. And if you do have the 21 gun salute, which may or may not be full 21 guns, depending on where you live, you know, usually it's not 21 guns. It's usually three volleys of seven. Mm hmm. But in our very rural areas, there may only be three guys that do it. And they do three rounds, but then they take three of the cartridges of the left over from that, from the firing, and they place them with the flag. Yes, I that I didn't know. Yeah. I used to know what that meant, but I can't remember the story behind those. But and then they present it to the to the family. 

Rich Bennett 4:51
Now is there anything that would where a veteran would not qualify to get any of this, like whether it be a designer or all this arrangement? Things like that? 

Jane Babcock 5:04
Yeah, that kind of thing. You have your service has to have been honorable. Now, honorable also includes general. Oh, because general is considered honorable, it's not a dishonorable discharge other than honorable and dishonorable. Yes, I consider discharges. Now, there are the early separations, the trainee separations. Again, Unfortunately, that usually occurs before they finish their AP. 

Rich Bennett 5:30
Yeah. 

Jane Babcock 5:31
Yeah. And or basic training, which means they have not yet qualified as a service member. Right. Okay. Okay. 

Rich Bennett 5:39
That's what I said. 

Jane Babcock 5:40
And those are. You're still going to disregard services because you have not qualified as a uniformed service member. 

Rich Bennett 5:48
So anybody that's even served two years, four years, 20 years, as long as they have that honorable discharge or general discharge, they qualify. 

Jane Babcock 5:58
Yes. And reservists and National Guard members have completed their military service. So they may have only done four months. 

Rich Bennett 6:06
Okay. 

Jane Babcock 6:07
But then they wouldn't complete their service or or God forbid, they die in service. 

Rich Bennett 6:14
Now, what about the memorial cemeteries, though? 

Jane Babcock 6:17
Well, there are federal national cemeteries and then there are state cemeteries. Okay. And like here in Wisconsin, we just opened another one recently because one of ours got full and another one is getting while. So they opened up another one. And you can go and request a pre-need. You know, your veteran is dying or maybe he's single and doesn't have any family to take care of the issues afterwards. He can go through an accredited VSO or a State Department of Veterans Affairs and they will help him fill out the paperwork so they can say, okay, we're only going to need one plot or the veteran is buried. And they would like to have two plots. A lot of cemeteries will allow you to have your spouse either next to you or in the same plot. 

Rich Bennett 7:07
Okay, good. 

Jane Babcock 7:09
So especially if the the the spouse is has predeceased the veteran, maybe he's kept her ashes. Right. He can notify them that when he passes that his remains come there that he would like both placed. Okay. And that way they can make sure that the headstone is proper. The headstone will be in most cemeteries, will be a stand up white marble like you see in the. 

Rich Bennett 7:33
National like in Arlington. 

Jane Babcock 7:35
Yes. I don't I don't think I've ever heard of a veteran's cemetery that requires the flat stone. There is a flat stone. Yeah. Cemetery requires flat stones. That's one of the types that you can order. 

Rich Bennett 7:51
Okay. 

Jane Babcock 7:52
So, you know, and I had a gentleman came in my office, and he wanted orders headstone to get it placed because he was terminal. And I was like, Well, we can't really schedule that. There's another number we got to put up there. I said, But I could do all the paperwork with you. We could pick out the kind you want, your religious symbol. Is there any information? There is a remarks line where we can put out, you know, Purple Heart recipient or things like that. Or if the spouse predeceased and they're going to be at the same plot, they can put her name and her dates, things like that. And we'll get everything all ready and we'll have it in the file. Then when you do pass, we'll just have an okay now. 

Rich Bennett 8:35
Because we've been told more or less what will be covered is the honor. So yeah, with the flags are the 21 gun salute. I know of my father's. We had somebody there playing bagpipes. 

And even I don't want to say the color guard, but, you know. No, they were probably veterans that came and did. And I know a lot of your funeral homes. Did you know, have the veterans on hand or whatever. But what about as far as cost? Is any of that covered? Because I know. And you covered it, huh? 

Jane Babcock 9:12
Yeah, everything is covered except for if you do order a military stone from the VA, whether it's a stand up and there are several different varieties granite, marble, different shapes, there are, you know, flat to the ground. Right. I had a family that couldn't afford a headstone, so it to save them money. And it was a particular cemetery that was real restrictive about stuff. At first they were actually charging veterans for the bronze marker. Not telling them. Yeah, not telling them to come to my office and get it free. Wow. So 

we had them just cover the cost of putting in a small cement slab. And then we got the bronze marker and it was placed on that cement slab. 

Rich Bennett 10:01
Okay. 

Jane Babcock 10:02
So that it was as economic as possible for the family. 

Now, the only cost is to have a headstone put in place because every area of the United States, the companies about do them do the different charges and the cemeteries have different requirements as far as how deep the stone has to go and things like this. So that cost of actually placing a stone is covered by the family, but the stone itself doesn't cost anything. It's ordered through the VA. 

Rich Bennett 10:34
Wow. I didn't realize that because I know the stones can be expensive. Mm hmm. They're not cheap. 

Jane Babcock 10:40
Yeah, and the getting them inscribed is not. 

Rich Bennett 10:42
Yeah. So when they say the VA will cover the inscription as well? 

Jane Babcock 10:47
Yes. Because the stone is not produced until the veteran passes. So they will go ahead and and it's very basic stuff that you can't have. You know, they're not going to do a picture of the veteran. They're not going to do a long poem or something. Right. 

Rich Bennett 11:05
Not a quote or anything like that. 

Jane Babcock 11:07
It's basic information with one line for remarks. Like I said, Purple Heart. Oh, they like that. 

Rich Bennett 11:12
Okay. Still, though, that's I mean, that's pretty pretty good. 

Jane Babcock 11:18
Oh, yeah. Yeah. We could save a lot of money. 

One of my veterans we couldn't find family in the local community took care. The local veteran community took care of the cost of cremation. Right. And then we mailed him to the cemetery where they took care of all the rest of the expenses of placing him and putting up a stone and everything else. 

Rich Bennett 11:41
Well, but the plot, the plots not covered. 

Jane Babcock 11:44
Yes, it is with me. If it's not, if it's in a military cemetery. 

Rich Bennett 11:49
All right. What about a regular cemetery? But they have I know some cemeteries will have, like a a military area. Mm hmm. Well, it's not necessarily a military cemetery. 

Jane Babcock 12:01
Correct. Okay. And some there are some cemeteries will have a scattering area. Mm hmm. Where if the veteran is cremated and then sent to them, they will scatter the ashes. They will put up their bronze marker or the small one or the big one, or even add them to a list that they may have already have a stone that they add the list to, and that may cost them nothing. Or they may say, okay, we're going to set aside so many free plots per year so that if we do have a veteran that doesn't have family. 

Rich Bennett 12:37
Right. 

Jane Babcock 12:38
That doesn't have a pre-purchased plot, or maybe the family has said, look, you know, he never buried, never had kids, we're going to place him with mom and dad. Mhm. And then add the bronze marker to their headstone. Wow. Lists his name, his service and his dates. So there's a lot of ways that we can help families 

reduce the expenses that they're going to experience. Again, you're going to pay to have that bronze plaque put on the stone. Right. Because they have to drill the stone. And so there's a small insurance policy that goes with just in case we crack the stone. Oh. 

Rich Bennett 13:21
Oh, I didn't think about that. 

Jane Babcock 13:23
Yeah. Yeah. Wow. So that's that little charge, which when I was severe, so I think it was like 100 and some dollars less. That's $45 to get the two holes drilled in. 

Rich Bennett 13:36
See, I'm glad we're talking about this because I know with funerals, you. I mean, God, the casket alone, which has to go into a vault, can be $10,000 plus. You know that Everything else for the funeral. You're talking you're talking basically the family taking out a loan. Several, you know, a lot of times. 

Jane Babcock 14:03
Oh, definitely. And we definitely. 

Rich Bennett 14:06
As I'm sure I guarantee you, I guarantee you, a lot of vendors did not know that a lot of that stuff is covered. 

Jane Babcock 14:17
Wow. The plot and the burial and the funeral expenses for a veteran that is with the VA. They're not with the VA. They don't get this. But they're and and unless that death is service related, okay, there is a funeral stipend. You know, a lot of people know that there's the $245, I think it is from Social Security. Mm hmm. Well, VA has the same stipend for a non service connected death. So if the veteran is receiving any type of disability, whether he is at 0% for service connected hearing loss, maybe he was the artillery guy. Right. And he goes in and he gets his rating and they say, yes, when you entered service, you're hearing was this good and when you got out it was this bad or you spent 20 years in the reserves and we've shown that you were exposed to hearing loss potential because of the bad hearing. You are hearing plugs that they gave us before you filed so that you fired so many rounds that there was a can't remember. They were National Guard and Reserve unit in the county where I worked and we got a lot of the guys service connected just based on the number of years they were in the unit and the extreme number of rounds and constant pounding. Wow. They would go off to their two weeks in the summertime and every day they were out there firing one on five howitzers and other weapons like that. And there's no way you could stand near one of those and not be impacted by that. 

Rich Bennett 15:57
Oh, God, no. 

Jane Babcock 15:58
So we were able to show that, especially since, you know, I mean, if you're an account and you're sitting in a quiet office. Okay. So we were able to get them service connected, some of them at 0%. Yes. There's a shift in your hearing, but it's not dramatic enough to impact your life at this point. Right. So they would rate them zero. Well, that spouse is entitled to that 245 or $200 stipend no matter what. He died. Huh. Now, if you are an Agent Orange guy and you die if one of the 38 cancers and I don't mean that has to be direct cause. Right. It's a contribue rating factor. My veteran died of pneumonia, but he couldn't fight the pneumonia because he had such uncontrolled type two diabetes and his neuropathy was up past his knees so he couldn't get up and walk or exercise to help fight the pneumonia. 

Rich Bennett 17:01
Which is caused by the Agent Orange. 

Jane Babcock 17:03
Right. If you hadn't had this, you might have been able to do that to prolong your life. Okay. Couldn't happen. So that was a service connected. That which meant the spouse was entitled to a 

$2,000 funeral. Burial allowance. 

Rich Bennett 17:22
Interesting. 

Jane Babcock 17:23
So that. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 17:26
Something you said in the beginning there was that as long as you're a member of the VA, I take it once you get out of military service, you're not automatically a member. 

Jane Babcock 17:36
No, no. On 400. And in order to receive the stipends, the financial part, you have to be rated at some level, like I said, zero or greater. 

Rich Bennett 17:48
So how does somebody become a member of the VA then? 

Jane Babcock 17:51
Well, in order to get into VA health care, every veteran could just simply apply. Okay. Today, they automatically open a five year window on them and say, okay, because they really want to encourage the guys to come in because they are experiencing cancers and neurological conditions. I mean, there was sarin gas not in a lot of places, but it was there. And so these guys are coming down with all sorts of neurological conditions that were in that particular area. 

So they want to catch these things early. So when they go in and get their annual physical, the doc asks them a whole bunch of questions. Yeah. How do the tips of your fingers feel? You know, how is your grasp? Have you lost any muscle strength in your legs? You know what's going on. But they wouldn't typically ask a 22 year old at a physical. Right. So and that window is open for five years automatically with them at no cost. So they might come out and, you know, might have been a reservist, did their one year in Iraq and came back, went back to their $100,000 a year job, which normally would mean you're going to pay co-pays. But for the first five years, they're not. 

But if someone in their forties who hasn't served in 20 years goes in, they're going to say, okay, well, what is your household income? Mm hmm. Oh, your household income, 120,000. And it's just you and your spouse and she doesn't have big medical bills and you don't have big medical bills. We're going to put you in category eight unless you can file a claim to the VA for any condition that's potentially service connectable. And even if that comes back at zero, you are now officially rated. 

So then everything goes on, the standard of copays, income. 

Rich Bennett 19:56
Okay. So an Oh, go ahead. 

Jane Babcock 20:00
If that if that rating is for something and say it's rated ten, 20%, you need to take medication. That medication will be free. That physical therapy will be free. Wow. That emergency room visit for a bad knee that's rated 20%. And you you know, and all of a sudden you tear it. They're going to cover that image. Zero, Bill. Things like that. So that's where that percentage of rating and whether or not it's service connected or not service connected. So back in 2003, the VA made a horrendous mistake without thinking about the business owner and or farmer. They went, oh, well, we're going to look at because we need to slow down the rate of people coming in and we can't serve everybody. Mm hmm. We're going to look at income and assets. 

Rich Bennett 20:58
Oh. 

Jane Babcock 21:00
So all of a sudden, every farmer out there that owns more than an acre land, every businessman that had business assets, he was making a profit, but he had physical assets. 

Wow. They went, Oh, oh, we're. We're going to this now. You can't come in unless you have a service rating. 

How prejudicial is. 

Rich Bennett 21:26
That? Yeah. 

Jane Babcock 21:28
So I want to say it was almost four years later, you know, because it didn't take them long because they got all the complaints in the world at the. 

Rich Bennett 21:37
Good and they should. 

Jane Babcock 21:39
Yeah, but Washington takes a while to process things, the right things, negotiate things, and then bring it to the floor. And then most bills and whatnot, you see their written and then it's okay. Now, six months from now or a year from now, this will take effect. 

So they then went, okay, we're going to eliminate the asset need. But those guys that got turned away for those three or four or five years. 

Rich Bennett 22:10
They may not know. 

Jane Babcock 22:11
Oh yeah. And they were so angry with the V.A. that they're like, you know, 

the VA. Right. Yeah. Who wrote? I can't say how they're. 

So they, you know, they don't come back and check. Yeah. Because they. 

Rich Bennett 22:30
Feel like. Yeah, they feel like they were given up on. 

Jane Babcock 22:33
Yeah. Wow. Oh, I am. Good luck. Sign is they used to call it during the Cuban crisis. 

So you know what I'm talking about. But a lot of those guys are extremely eligible now, especially since a lot of them are retired now. Right. You know, 20 years later, now you're retired. Your income has gone down. So maybe you're actually at the level where you're not going to pay the specialist co-pay. You might still pay the pharmacy and the doc, but not the specialty co-pay. So there's a lot out there that could be eligible. And people say, well, you know, I got insurance have or I've got Medicare and I've got a supplement and blah, blah, blah. 

Rich Bennett 23:19
You should still register, though. 

Jane Babcock 23:22
Register. Also go to that annual physical. Mm hmm. When you go in there. Good. Well, a good VA doctor is going to be much more conscious. And, you know, they're like any other doctor. There's the 10% that graduated the bottom class, So they're not going to be as attentive. But most the time, there are certain things on your chart highlighted, like Vietnam, Thailand, other places like that. And they'll say, Oh, okay, when I do his blood tests, I got I do extra blood tests looking for these specific markers that might mean early cancer 

or oh, you know how you do doing with swallowing. You have this little tiny muscle in your throat that closes the flap so you don't get water down when you're swollen, you don't get it in your lungs. Yeah, well, that is such a defined, 

controlled action in your body that a lot of times it can be the first sign of a neurological disorder. Your brain is saying close up lab, but the muscle that necessary message doesn't get there. Mm hmm. 

Oh, okay. Let's look at Parkinson's. Let's look at ALS. Look at other things that might be going on that the average citizen wouldn't worry too much about. Right. But since we're twice as likely all veterans are twice as likely to get ALS. Hey, if we can catch it early. 

Yeah, there's no real treatment for it, but there are things that they can do. Exercises and everything else that you might be able to start doing to strengthen things. Mm hmm. So, yeah, your military or your VA doctor is going to look for things your civilian doesn't, so go to that annual physical. The other good thing is that shows VA, Hey, wow, look at this. All sudden, we've got all these guys that were stationed at wherever. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 25:26
Yeah, well, listen, I mean, that's one of the prime examples. People started having problems. 

Jane Babcock 25:32
Mm hmm. Yeah. And unfortunately, it was something they knew about for decades. Yeah, because because of the birth defect and miscarriage rate down there. But that was the spouses. That wasn't the veterans. So they didn't. 

Rich Bennett 25:49
They didn't. 

Jane Babcock 25:50
Yeah, they. Yeah. Giving weight to the veterans that the way they should've. Mm. 

Rich Bennett 25:56
So wish I have a funny feeling we're missing something when it comes to the service of memorial honors. But I don't know what. 

Jane Babcock 26:07
Yeah, there's a whole bunch of other things. Of course we get a flag. 

Rich Bennett 26:11
Right? 

Jane Babcock 26:12
And everybody goes, Well, where I come from. Oh. Oh, yeah. The funeral home. And even if you're going to be cremated and placed in an urn, they'll provide a plate, but they'll fold it and place it with your urn. 

Rich Bennett 26:26
Something I found out about that, too, which I think is pretty cool, because our one of the legions around here, they have a mailbox out front for people to drop off their old flags, which in turn they take to the funeral home. And if somebody is cremated, then, yes, the flag is put in with them to be cremated as well. I never knew that. 

Jane Babcock 26:52
Well, most of the time the family want to keep the flag so they don't have it placed with the veteran while he's been cremated. 

Rich Bennett 27:00
Well, maybe. 

Jane Babcock 27:01
He made it placed in an urn. They'll have one at the funeral. Right. To symbolize the service. 

Rich Bennett 27:07
But that's a name. 

Jane Babcock 27:08
For through the ceremony. Yes. 

Rich Bennett 27:10
Yeah, I think is. I think what they're doing is just the old use flags. 

Jane Babcock 27:14
And that may be true at some places, depending on the state and all that stuff, because that's all guided by state regulation. But yeah, people will say, well, what do I do with an old flag? And some people, God forbid, throw it in the garbage. Oh, God, no, no, no, no. You can usually call your police station. The military posts around you and stuff. Our AMVETS, they have several old post boxes. Mm hmm. That they've painted red, white and blue, and very distinctly flags only. And they have places around town like this one down by our fire station. There's one by our police station. Lowe's store here. And I'm assuming it's a national thing. 

Rich Bennett 28:01
Right. 

Jane Babcock 28:02
Has a box in the law store. I'll be darned. And I noticed they put changed it and just put in a new one. It actually as the five branches of service symbolized on it. 

So it shows that there's, you know, a flag receptacle and then the local posts come and they gather them up and they take them and do the ceremony, removing the stars and stuff like that. Yeah. Burning the rest of the flag. 

Some polls have taken the stars and the old flags and put them in with a small saying about the star and the symbolism of each star. And they actually give them away or they'll give them back to the family. Right. If they brought the flag to them. Funeral flags, if they're in really good shape, a lot of the 

like the state veteran's homes and the state cemeteries and things like that will take those flags and display them when they have a ceremony, when they have the internment of a veteran. Okay. The 4th of July parade is going on. They'll have them lining the roadway in front of there so those flags can be reused. Please don't ever just toss one. No. And please allow the local post. Generally, in a lot of places teaches the Boy Scouts. Mhm. So when they have a flag ceremony of burning of flags and things like that, they'll invite the folks to come 

and you know, the Boy Scout troops to come. Right. And learn what the proper procedures are. That's how they run their flag. Yeah. Button or whatever they put on their uniforms. 

Rich Bennett 29:54
I love that more people do they need to be taught flag etiquette, but that's another story. 

Jane Babcock 30:00
Yes, it is. 

Rich Bennett 30:01
So I said a funeral provides the flag, which is then usually presented to somebody from the family. What else are we missing here? We talked about the medallions. We talked about the headstones. 

Jane Babcock 30:15
Yep. There are three different type of attachments for the headstones. There's medallions and then there's markers. 

Rich Bennett 30:23
Markers? Okay. 

Jane Babcock 30:24
Yep. There's a large bronze marker, which is a one by two, and it has, you know, branch service and, of course, name and branch of service. It might have a Purple Heart recipient on it and things like that. And of course, their dates. But it can have a religious medallion on it. It can have a, you know, a cross Christian cross. It can have the Jewish star of David, whatever your faith was, if the family chooses that. And then there's the smaller one. 

And forgetting the dimensions. But I want to say it's eight by 12, but I'm not sure on that. That often is requested to be placed on the back of a stone, say a son is buried in mom and dad's plot. 

Rich Bennett 31:07
Oh. 

Jane Babcock 31:08
If there's enough space on the front, they might put it on the front or they'll put it on the back of stone to show that he is there. Okay. Okay. Now, a veteran gets cremated and puts in a columbarium. There's no room for either one of those on his space. 

Rich Bennett 31:24
Right. 

Jane Babcock 31:25
So they have a medallion that's actually three different sizes. And it says, What branch of service? Huh? So that can be placed. We have a cemetery where if you're placed in the scattering gardens, they have a wall on the inside that they will put these 

markers, the smaller marker and or a sweat or a stone slab with the medallion on it, with the person's information that they're located in the scattering garden. 

Rich Bennett 31:54
You say scattering garden? 

Jane Babcock 31:57
Yeah. If you're cremated, some people prefer just to be 

tossed to the wind. 

Rich Bennett 32:04
Right. So I've never. 

Jane Babcock 32:06
Had good. 

Rich Bennett 32:06
I've never heard of the term their scattering garden. 

Jane Babcock 32:09
Yeah. We have a veterans memorial that is more than ten acres of. And I don't remember exactly how many. It's quite a large place. Right. And there's a scattering garden there. So people will want to be placed at that veterans memorial rather than in a cemetery. I'll be darn. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 32:30
I'm surprised that something you don't see in communities a lot more. 

Jane Babcock 32:36
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 32:37
Because it does. I mean, scatter and garden, I would assume. Doesn't have to be that big. 

Jane Babcock 32:42
Well, I don't know. I mean, and again, it's by the state laws. Yeah. Some states may not allow it, but other states are in especially, you know, the old poppies. Great theory If they can't find someone that they're a relative that will want to come and see them and stuff like that, or they get the relatives say no. He always like our particular cemetery that has the scattering garden is way out in the country. Mm hmm. And it really is a beautiful place. So they have that area. And some will say, you know, he was an outdoorsman and he didn't want to be buried. 

Rich Bennett 33:23
Oh, you're giving me ideas. I got. Look into that. I want to find out if our county has anything like that, because I would something like that would be beautiful in a park, as beautiful as parks are. 

Jane Babcock 33:35
Yeah, well, there's, you know, especially state parks. Yes. You know, if you grew up by Collins, Wisconsin, which is right next to the Collins marsh, which is a state park, 

if the state allows it, you might want to be scattered there, but you might want to get a marker of some sort. Maybe they have an area with markers. Right. Maybe your local cemetery will allow the family to place it just as a place for people to connect. 

Rich Bennett 34:09
Yeah. A nice memorial scattering garden. 

Jane Babcock 34:13
Hmm. Yeah. So? So you have those options and those different ways of marking places where you want your remains to be or where your family can go and have a gathering spot in. One of the other things that families are entitled to is called a presidential memorial certificate. Yes. Now, generally speaking, like in our office, we watched all of our obits that came out in the newspaper and we checked. And a lot of times people say, you know, served in the US Navy or whatever. Right. Or we'll look up the person in our state database or things like that, and we'll say, Oh, we didn't know this person served in the Navy. It wasn't mentioned in his obit, but he did. So we will order a presidential memorial certificate which is mailed to the surviving eldest surviving family member, or the most appropriate, I should say. Mm hmm. You know, might be the kids as opposed to the older uncle. So they will automatically send one. But families don't know that they can request more than one. 

Rich Bennett 35:24
Oh, I didn't know that. 

Jane Babcock 35:26
Yeah. And if I'm not mistaken, the only cost is, is the shipping is the postage. I'm not sure. It might be a couple of dollars per certificate. But still, if there is. 

Rich Bennett 35:39
I know we got one for my father. 

Jane Babcock 35:42
Yeah, there's five kids, and the oldest son gets one because Mom's deceased or divorced or the other siblings might like to have one, too. 

Rich Bennett 35:51
Well, in any day, you think about it. Look at it this way. Because I know if my father, I was presented with the flag, which means my other two brothers and my sister, you know, really didn't have anything. But if they could have gotten that. 

Jane Babcock 36:07
Hmm. 

Rich Bennett 36:08
Oh, I'm going to have to make a phone call if it's. 

Jane Babcock 36:12
And this will have a stamped signature of the president in office at the time of the passing. 

Rich Bennett 36:21
Right. 

And not from when they're not from when they served in the military. That'd be kind of hard. 

Jane Babcock 36:28
So, yeah. So, again, you're accredited. VSO can request that with no problem. And, you know, if there's a cost, they can help you write out the check to it or whatever. 

Rich Bennett 36:43
Right. 

Jane Babcock 36:44
But they can they can help you take care of that. Wow. Now, we talked a little bit about the burial and a little stipend thing. Mm hmm. 

When we knew there was a surviving spouse, 

the VA automatically. And if the VA, of course, if you're rated for any kind of service condition, they're going to know generally that a spouse exists. Right. As long as you notified the VA because too many guys will either file a claim figuring, okay, I'm going to get ten or 20%, in which case I don't get paid to pay on my claim. So they don't even bother telling the VA they're married. 

Wow. And it's like, No, no, you got a spouse and kids. We're going to put that in your file. At least in my office, it was an automatic. You're married. You have children, dependent children that may or may not qualify for a benefit if you suddenly fall over from ischemic heart disease as an ancient order guy. Right. So there's no time to do paperwork then. So we automatically when whenever we sent in an initial claim, it automatically went with the marriage and children's certificates and stuff. And my office, we used to tell them, look, nothing changes but you. We want you to come back in in five years just so we can update you on the VA changes more if your condition has worsened enough. Let's look at the charts and say, Oh yeah, you know what? You should be rated higher on that. Let's send in that newer that upgrade. But we always put those in there because the VA will automatically allow a funeral burial stipend to the widow 

that 250. Yeah. It's nowadays it's supposed to be set automatically as long as they know that that spouse survives. And if it doesn't happen or if the death is in service connected, we just get them to sign for the higher amount and we send the evidence to the VA so we can get that higher amount for her. And or maybe the children paid for the funeral costs. Mm hmm. In which case, whoever filed gives us the receipt and we send it. You know, whoever paid for it sends us receipt in with their paperwork, and they can get the funeral stipend right. 

Wow. Now, if it's service connected, that there's no time limit. Oh, so maybe a veteran dies. And then ten years later, they put it on the presumptive list. They can still file for it because it now when on the presumptive list, it was denied on the not being presumptive. But if that veteran died of non service stuff, he's in a traumatic car accident and his only service connection was hearing loss. 

Then there's a two year window. Oh, okay. To file for that statement. 

Rich Bennett 39:51
Interesting. 

Jane Babcock 39:53
Okay, so service connected is automatic, but. Right. You have to define it to the VA. If it was service connected or if there's no, they only know that they're supposed to be a widow. But she's deceased. They don't know if they're kids, if she never sent in those birth certificates. But that can be really important. I had a young lady well, to be young lady in the office, and she said, this guy called me, said he was from the VA, and he had all this information about my dad and his Social Security number and all that stuff. And she goes, Then she started he started asking me about my information. She goes, I was real uncomfortable. So I hung up on him and I said, Well, let's check and see if he was with VA, because if they made a call to you, they've got to log it in. Mm hmm. So we called and gave them all the information on the veterans so they can open his file and say, Oh, yes, there was outreach done to the family member because he filed for this condition ten years ago. It was now placed on the service presumptive list. 

Okay. And he died a year plus after that filing was denied. We owe him this much money, 

but we couldn't find the wife. Is he divorced or is she dead? And she had passed. So luckily, she was already born when they filed. So he had sent in the birth certificate, 

but her two brothers weren't so. Oh. The VA came back, said, Oh, we owe him $9,000. 

And by inheritance rights, that would have gone to the children. 

Rich Bennett 41:48
Okay. 

Jane Babcock 41:49
So they each received $3,000. 

Again, this is why it's important to have the VA fully informed. Just as important as, Oh, I got divorced. I need to tell the VA. Yeah. That I got divorced because I'm receiving Dependent pay and AP baby. Five years from now, they catch on. Go. Oh, Oh, you are. Five years worth of dependent pay back because you've been divorced for those five years. 

Rich Bennett 42:19
I got a lot of work to do. 

Jane Babcock 42:23
And they want their money. There is no. Okay, well, we'll get to it eventually, too, to pay you. Oh, you owe us money. Call us right now, or we're going to take some of your tax return or whatever. You know, things that they can do to guarantee money. But if you call them and working through, obviously, and you're able to outline your income and your expenses, and then there's a percentage of income that you're allowed to have as entertainment money or, you know, miscellaneous. Mm hmm. Well, you only have $25 a month left over. After that, we'll set up a $25 a month payment plan for you. 

Rich Bennett 43:05
I 

Something tells me that veterans need to make their veteran veterans services officer their best friend. 

Jane Babcock 43:17
Oh, yeah? Yeah, Because oftentimes it's something that the VSO can take care of. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 43:26
I don't know if you can answer this, but how, on average, how long does one person stay as a VSO? 

Jane Babcock 43:35
Hmm. Well, I was 11 and a half years. 

Rich Bennett 43:38
Okay. All right. So it's not like rotating, like, every four years or whatever. 

Jane Babcock 43:42
No. Okay. I would say most likely the ones that leave fairly early on. Mm hmm. Are ones that just can't handle the intensity of it. 

Rich Bennett 43:54
Oh. 

Jane Babcock 43:54
Because even after 11 and a half years, I was learning things. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 44:00
Well, everything's always changing. 

Jane Babcock 44:02
Yeah. That's why you have to go to training every year. 

Rich Bennett 44:05
Right. 

Jane Babcock 44:06
You don't go to training. You lose your accreditation. Oh, wow. So that's why it's important to ask. Are you accredited? Mm hmm. So because that means they went to training every year. Right. Okay. And, you know, like every profession in the world, there's people who give a damn about their job. And there are people who more care more about their paycheck. Right. So but generally speaking, people that stay in the VSO career path do it because it's important for them to serve the family. 

But it is an ever learning process. I remember after a couple of years when I first figured out how to change a death certificate in order to get the DSC for the spouse, the veteran of a dead for ten years. Right. So I figured out what the process was to get the coroner to do the paperwork that would petition the court so that they amend the death certificate. And then I use that to then get her the benefit. 

Rich Bennett 45:09
Okay. 

Jane Babcock 45:11
A lot of the other CSOs who'd been in the career field who ten plus years before me went, what made you even think about doing that? Wow. Because they had never thought about changing the destiny. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 45:27
Wow. See, you have a true passion for it. From what I can tell. Which makes a big difference as well. 

Jane Babcock 45:35
Yes. Well, behind me on the wall, you can't see it, but I have my grandfather's picture from World War Two. He also served in World War One. My dad's from World War Two. My picture a few years before I retired from military. Mm hmm. And my grandfather's World War one purple heart. 

Rich Bennett 45:57
Wow. 

Jane Babcock 45:58
Lady Columbia certificate. So it's. It's definitely a family thing for me. Yeah. And I just look at it as helping the other parts of the family. 

Rich Bennett 46:12
Yeah. And I want to thank you for that, because it's. God. We need more people like you, you know, looking out for us. 

Jane Babcock 46:21
Well, we really need is the VA to get on national television, like PBS or NPR or radio. Because where I live, NPR is, you know, I get in the car, I go click right. I listen to the grain prices and, 

you know, I know it has nothing to do with my life, but I know that after the grain prices, they're going to have the national news, local news, and they're going to have, you know, reading of a book or whatever going on on NPR. 

Rich Bennett 46:52
So I'm surprised they do. 

Jane Babcock 46:55
Oh, God. Could you imagine what would happen to the VA. 

Rich Bennett 47:00
If they had their own show. 

Jane Babcock 47:02
If they even went out there and said, okay, we know 600, that less than 600,000 widows are receiving benefits, but we estimate that it's over 2 million that are eligible. 

Rich Bennett 47:15
Yeah, they would have to hire a lot more people. 

Jane Babcock 47:18
And they would have to get a lot more accurate. 

Rich Bennett 47:22
That's why that's why they're not on television or radio. 

Jane Babcock 47:26
Yeah. Could you imagine? Even if they just got their standard of denial and and whatnot, correct. Mm hmm. So that they didn't have appeals processes that take 3 to 5 years. Mm hmm. So you may take a claim. It may take eight months to a year. You get a denial, then you turn around. You said in your first appeal and you get that six, eight months later, and then you turn around and you submit the higher level appeals, say, to the Board of Veterans Appeals. There's multiple stages in between. And now you're going to wait another two plus years. Mm hmm. And then they're going to come back and say, okay, we finally got it right. 

Got it. As a CSO, I still to this day know how to go on and look at all the Board of Appeals decisions. And it's amazing how many get remanded back to the regional office that processed it because they're like, Yeah, guys, look at the evidence again. We're going to give you the chance to rewrite this and get it right, or they'll say, Okay, this would have been great bull. If you know, then that tells them there's a certain amount of evidence that could have been presented. But it also tells the veteran that, hey, do you have this? Can you send us this proof that we need to decide in your favor? I mean. 

Rich Bennett 48:58
Wow. 

Jane Babcock 48:59
A case can be won if there's good reason. A veteran from my county got brain cancer. Agent Orange, Vietnam. This was back in 2019. We filed under the terminal status and was able to expedite. Two weeks later, we got the denial. We knew we would. Mm hmm. And then two weeks later, we got the denial on the appeal. And then I handed him to a special VA lawyer that I know that teaches at our national CPA. So conferences. 

Rich Bennett 49:34
Oh, and. 

Jane Babcock 49:34
Teaches appeals and how to talk the VA language. And she had a genetic oncologist 

that proved that this man had absolutely zero cancer risk factors in his body. So it had to come from an outside influence and that being his greatest exposure. And there are studies being done all over the world, not just in the U.S. In fact, you know, not many in the U.S., but he took all those things, put them all together in the guy was awarded his brain cancer two months before he died. So his wife got DACA. Hmm. Not a lot of living veterans will win cases like that. Yeah, but and, you know, people say, oh, well, it's not presumptive unless you're going to lose. No. Depends on what you did in the service, because maybe the chemicals you work with or the jet fuel that you got doused with bullets as you were fueling jets or, you know, cleaning weapons with that dunk tank they used to use. 

Rich Bennett 50:44
Oh, I forgot about that. 

Jane Babcock 50:45
Yeah, the solvent they used to kill other Wow. Components and whatnot like that. Mm hmm. So those you know, it's a matter of showing the VA. Here's this chemical I used regularly in service. Here's the breakdown of it. And here's the known 

cancers or neurological conditions that come from that. 

Rich Bennett 51:09
Wow. 

Jane Babcock 51:10
And then the VA can go, Oh, right. 5050. Okay. Your go ahead. Mm hmm. 

It's not an absolute science. It's a can you put those evidence on the scale at a 5050 balance? Because if you can, then the VA must lean in favor of the veteran. Right. 

Rich Bennett 51:35
So are you listening? All you veterans listen. Listening. And those survivors of veterans? 

Well, veterans, especially if you have a registry with the VA, do so. 

But any by anybody, if you have any questions, reach out to your VSO and let me know, too, because when Jane comes on, I want to start giving Jane some questions from you all listening. So send me some questions because this will give us an idea of what else we can talk about in the future. And there's a. 

Jane Babcock 52:11
Lot a lot. 

Rich Bennett 52:13
To talk about when it comes to the VA. We haven't even touched me. God, we're still we're still starting at the bottom of the barrel right now, aren't we, Jane? 

Jane Babcock 52:25
Oh, yeah. 

Rich Bennett 52:25
And be there is so much more to cover 

it. Wow. 

Jane Babcock 52:33
Well, let's talk a little bit about DC. A lot of people know depended indemnity compensation. 

That doesn't really tell those people anything, Right? But that's what the VA calls it. I refer to it oftentimes as death compensation. Mm hmm. My veteran passes away from something service related or the complications contributed to his not being strong enough to survive whatever he did die from. 

So see now is over 1600 dollars a month tax free for the surviving widow. Wow. 

There are also dependent the. I see it's a lesser amount, but one of my very. Yeah, one of my veterans passed away. He left a five year old. He was divorced. 

So the widow wasn't the excuse me, the surviving spouse who was not his widow was not entitled to DC, but the son was. Wow. Which also meant that that child will have Chapter 35 education benefits. He will have his own VA version of a GI Bill. 

Rich Bennett 53:48
Really? 

Jane Babcock 53:51
He's also entitled to check the VA, which is very similar to TRICARE insurance. 

Those can stay with him until he is 26 years old. If he's single now, if that child is determined to be disabled prior to his 18th birthday, all he'll be entitled to if he's not able to work is SSI, which is nowadays, I don't think it's $900 a month. Yeah. So he will be able keep his dependent PFC 

and his champ VA workers education benefits potentially. So depending on the circumstances. As far as the education benefits go, why you skip it August 2nd of 2022 with the package passing. Mhm. There was an expansion of Agent Orange stuff. So there are some people out there that are DACA eligible that were previously denied or maybe the veteran never submitted because it's not on the presumptive list. I'm not going to bomb. Right. 

So there are conditions that have been added. There are also places 

sorry, used to be in Thailand, you had to show you were on the perimeter of the airstrip. Mm hmm. Or that you could get somebody who could attest to. Oh, no. We sprayed it near this building. And this is the building he worked in. So. And that was really hard to do. Find people that. Yeah. Alive, especially if they use the stuff. So that expansion means there's a whole lot of more widows out there that are eligible 

and there's a whole lot more children. Well, the pesticide on the children were still at home. 

Rich Bennett 55:47
And a lot of them don't have a clue. They have. 

Jane Babcock 55:49
Oh, they didn't file before, so why should they file now? They don't know. And DC also has a rule if the spouse is receiving DACA after the veteran passes. It used to be a 55. If they married at 55, they lost their chip VA. If they and or excuse me, they lost their 

DACA. If they married before they were 57, they lost their champion. And so a lot of widows did marry, you know, a few years after the veteran passes and they had their VA DACA cut off. Well, they don't know that if they become single again, either through death or divorce of the second spouse, they could go back and claim. 

Rich Bennett 56:38
Oh. 

Jane Babcock 56:39
Because odds are, especially if they're in the sixties now and maybe not working. But you know what? Ery comes low enough. That could be a lifesaver for you. Yeah, but they don't know. They can go back and reapply. 

Rich Bennett 56:55
Wow. 

Jane Babcock 56:57
So first, there's all the widows out there. Who's my first? One of my veterans had his first heart attack in his late twenties or early thirties. Oh. Ischemic heart disease. 

Now, if he hadn't managed to survive the five heart attacks during his working career and had then lived long enough to see Calamity Ischemic List. The presumptive excuse me presumptive list? Mm hmm. 

Why would his widow think that there was an. Hmm. 

Wow. So if your veteran passed away from any kind of complications of anything chemically oriented from his military service, it's worth making looking into that CV. So office and or vessel office and talking to them or doing research on the Internet and, stuff like that, Know, it's amazing what you could find on the Internet. 

Rich Bennett 57:55
Yeah, No. And worst case scenario, you're just going to they're just going to say, no, you don't qualify for anything. Yeah. Worst case. 

Jane Babcock 58:04
You know. Yeah. But then again, they may say, Oh, yeah, there's nothing we can do about the benefit you've already missed out on, but we can go from today forward. 

Rich Bennett 58:12
Yeah. 

Jane Babcock 58:14
You know, okay. Unless I put a lot of widows on a list cause they ran ads in the newspaper saying, Hey, this is now presumptive. If you're a veteran, died of this, come see us. And I would do it every day and usually get two or three widows and or veterans either suffering with it or that died of it. Oh, yeah. My veteran died eight years ago. I'm sorry, honey. They put it on the list four years ago. You didn't see my other ads. But from today forward, we're going to get you this benefit right? 

Rich Bennett 58:44
Which is still better than nothing at all. 

Jane Babcock 58:47
Mm hmm. Wow. Hmm. Oh, yeah. 

$600 tax free education benefits and champ VA health care. So you don't have to buy insurance. You don't have to buy a supplement to your Medicare. I mean. 

Rich Bennett 59:05
Yeah, there's. Yeah, there's a lot of veterans and their families missing. Missing out on a lot of stuff this now. So, ga Jane, I'm glad you got in touch with me because I'm learning a lot. I'm being blown away by already from the last episode in this one and I know, God, there's there's so much more to actually what are we going to talk about next time? 

Jane Babcock 59:34
Well, if you want to go a deep dive on the on the pension program, we didn't really just talk about that today. And maybe education benefits and home loan benefits. Actually. 

Rich Bennett 59:47
Go ahead. 

Jane Babcock 59:47
Yeah, the education one is a little confusing in that it's variables between Montgomery GI Bill and the 911. Mm hmm. When you can 911 allowed veterans or military to give away their benefits to their children. 

Rich Bennett 1:00:02
Okay. 

Jane Babcock 1:00:03
But when or when you can't do that and whether or not you have to extended service. And just the general difference. 911, you have to have an honorable discharge. You can't have a general. That's the first benefit that I know of where they distinguish between honorable and general. All others are other than dishonorable. In other words, right or dishonorable. This is the first one I've seen where they actually separate the honorable, which means you did your job and you did it well and you didn't get in any trouble. And the general, which might be 

okay, you were not you were kind of lazy in service. You didn't do anything outstanding. You may have had little infractions like being late for work sometimes. And, you know, you might have gotten a slap on the wrist with an Article 15 or something like that. Nothing serious. But you weren't 

really what we consider, you know, ho kind of material. So we gave you a general discharge and okay well, all the other benefits that still could be classified as an honorable discharge. Yeah. 

This loan and all that stuff. 

Rich Bennett 1:01:27
For the next one. Because I. 

Jane Babcock 1:01:29
Would. Hmm. 

Rich Bennett 1:01:30
God, because each category could be its own separate episode. It what? The way the housing market is right now. Let's talk about the home loans on the next one. 

Jane Babcock 1:01:41
Okay. 

Rich Bennett 1:01:42
Because I, I, I do know I don't I guarantee a lot of realtors don't even. Well, I guess it's not really the realtors responsibility to know about the value be more or less the mortgage company, right? 

Jane Babcock 1:01:58
Yes. And actually, I work with a mortgage company out of Milwaukee. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:02
Okay. 

Jane Babcock 1:02:02
And I've gone down to Milwaukee. They do classes every year. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:07
Okay. 

Jane Babcock 1:02:08
And I go down and I talk about the VA benefits, especially pension, because our older veterans, a lot of them are going I can't afford to stay in my house because my spouse says medical bills are getting so big. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:23
Right. 

Jane Babcock 1:02:24
Oh, I served during the war time and I could get some supplemental income. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:29
Wow. 

Jane Babcock 1:02:30
Or the state benefits here in our state, the veteran that's other service connected or unemployable can receive property tax reimbursement. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:40
Really? 

Jane Babcock 1:02:42
Yeah, I teaching about those things. A lot of real estate agents. What? Oh, now this guy can afford to stay in his home. Yeah, well, we can buy that home that, you know, he was going to downsize, but so much of it was going to go to medical bills that he couldn't afford a new place. Oh, now he can. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:04
We'll talk about that. The next one. We'll talk about the home loans. And basically, I would I don't want to say home loans, home benefits because from what you just explained, there's more to just getting the VA, the mortgage. There's a lot more. 

Jane Babcock 1:03:19
Yeah, well, yeah, well, yeah, that. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:21
On the next one. Anything else to add for the services? A memorial? 

Jane Babcock 1:03:26
Yes. Okay. Survivors. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:28
Survivors? I'm sorry. 

Jane Babcock 1:03:29
Yeah. Survivors are entitled to Apply for VA pension. If they're veteran, served during wartime. If they serve active duty, federal active duty during wartime and basically, it means you'd make a list of all your sources of income interest from the bank, which. 

Yeah, it's just other accounts and any other income you have. And then you subtract off your medical expenses so your pharmacy, even an allowance for things like protective undergarments. If the spouse is in and assisted living or paying for in-home care. Generally speaking, that means the household income for her is upside down. She's probably paying out. Yeah, most of, if not all of her income plus over savings. 

So if her liquify valuable assets not including the home, the car or personal belongings unless they get sold. Mhm. 

Then if those are less than 150,000 she may well qualify for about 16 or 1800 dollars a month 

to slow down. She's taking out 20 $500 a month from her savings account to pay for that assisted living. Well now she only has paid out $700 a month for assisted living to include with the pension. Yeah. So it's going to slow down. It doesn't preserve the savings, it just extends them longer. So instead of those savings being gone in two years and now going on to Medicaid. Mhm. Maybe they'll last for four plus years and baby out throughout her life. Yeah. Oh wow. It just allows better options. 

Rich Bennett 1:05:32
Amazing. 

Jane Babcock 1:05:32
So basically you make a list of all the incomes, make a list of all the medical expenses that they're paying out of pocket. Right. Insurance premiums supplement Medicare premium, 

all those kind of things. Any health related insurance, dental insurance and stuff like that. So that's being paid for. Plus the cost of pharmacy, plus the medical bills you paid last year. Maybe you got dentures and paid $5,000 or whatever. 

Now, we could look back one year or look forward if that veteran or spouse is suddenly going into assisted living or suddenly having this reoccurring doctor says, you know, you're not allowed to shower or bathe by yourself, you're out. You need help getting your shoes on, maybe car accident, whatever. And this is permanent. Right. So, okay, over the next year, you going to $20,000 worth of medical bills that you didn't have last year and it's going to go out for the rest of your life. So they allows you to look back and forward depending on the situation. Maybe last year you paid a lot of medical bills or maybe next year you got some permanent medical bills that are going to go up. So we can be I can look either direction, 

huh? Yeah. So if if you're a veteran in assisted living or paying for big in-home care or if you're the surviving spouse of a war time vet excuse me, if you're the surviving veteran of a wartime period you didn't have go combat, you may have been supply guy at Fort Knox, Kentucky, 

but it was during a war period. 

And if you're over 65, there's no work requirement. If you're under 65, you have to show the VA why you're not able to work. Right. Okay. Maybe a car accident. Nothing to do with the service. The youngest guy I put on it was 22. 

Rich Bennett 1:07:36
Wow. 

Jane Babcock 1:07:38
He had a motorcycle accident. He'll never work again. 

Wow. And being as young as he was, he didn't get Social Security disability. He just got SSI. So we got more money from the VA pension program to go with that SSI than what the SSI was. 

But he is definitely going to be permanently disabled. Right. 

So make those three lowest income medical expenses and liquify valuable assets. That's where VSL comes in because they know what's considered to be liquid viable assets. Right. When you invest money into an account and it's going to have to stay there for ten years to be worth this much money, but you have to take it out at eight years. So your penalty is that you only get this much. 

It's the this much that you get. Yeah, that's countable because the VA is saying if tomorrow you had to liquefy, what would you put on the kitchen table? 

Rich Bennett 1:08:39
Makes sense. 

Jane Babcock 1:08:40
Which also means that if you owned farmland, that's considered a valuable asset toward this program. Just just the first acre of land counts. 

Rich Bennett 1:08:53
Just the first acre. 

Jane Babcock 1:08:54
Right. That's considered your resident. 

Rich Bennett 1:08:57
Okay. 

Jane Babcock 1:08:59
Now, that also means that, you know, a lot of people, they didn't used to have a look back. Right. You didn't look back to see if you gave the property away to family. Mm hmm. Now they do. And it's a three year look back. Medicaid has a five year lookback, so you may qualify for VA if you don't qualify for Medicaid. 

Or even if you're on Medicaid, you may still qualify for VA in that there are certain circumstances when you're on Medicaid where you're allowed to keep only $45 a month spending money from Medicaid. But now through the VA, you're going to get an additional 90 that Medicaid can't touch. Mm hmm. So your monthly spending money just went from 45 to 135. Wow. 

Wow. So, you know, I mean, after all, if you're a resident in a nursing home, $45 doesn't, give you a phone and cable in your room. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:00
Now, in nursing homes are not cheap at all. 

Jane Babcock 1:10:03
You know, but if Medicaid is paying for the nursing home, VA will still give you that spending money. Yeah. Again, wartime veteran. Certain health requirements under 65. No requirements health wise, just numbers, right? 60 pack. And for a surviving spouse, there is no age cutoffs, no health requirements. It's just. What are you living off of? What do you have? That's lack of viable assets and what is your expenses going out? Okay. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:37
So I still have it written on my mirror to contact my VSO, which I have not done yet. 

Jane Babcock 1:10:44
So would you put your hand up out, slap it 

so well, my. 

Rich Bennett 1:10:49
Wife keeps getting on me about it, and when I tell her about what we talked about today, she's going to tell me to get off my tail and get it done. So I definitely And all of you listening, have you ever done it, get it done as well? Without a doubt. Jane, I want to thank you so much. I just include this. You want me to include the same links as last time, right? Because all those links are relevant. 

Jane Babcock 1:11:16
Yep. And LinkedIn, if you want to find me, I'm on LinkedIn every day, right? 

Occasionally on Facebook. But I don't do a lot there. Or just go out to YouTube and Facebook and these other podcast type platforms put in Jane Babcock and you'll find a lot of videos and a lot of audio broadcasts like this that I've already done. So you can listen to those. 

Rich Bennett 1:11:45
You know what you should do, You should start your own webinar series. 

Jane Babcock 1:11:50
Yeah, but see, that gives me such a small, limited audience. I don't want one audience. I want everybody else's audience. 

Rich Bennett 1:11:59
That is true. So never mind her that way. Yeah. Like I said, so you just got to keep coming back on here and teaching us more. 

Jane Babcock 1:12:06
Yep. And then they go ahead. The ultimate goal is TV, PBS, NPR does.