S05E15 - PTS Growth - John Giampino (Ive got your 6 IGY6) pt1

In this episode of the Invisible Injuries podcast, host Andy Fermo sits down with John Giampino, a 31-year veteran of the Royal Australian Corps of Transport and an ambassador for "I've Got Your Six." John's extensive military career began with his enlistment in the Melbourne University Regiment and transitioned into full-time service in 1985. He shares his experiences from initial training at Kapooka to various deployments, including peacekeeping missions in Bougainville and East Timor.

John's vivid recollections paint a detailed picture of life in the military, from the rigors of training designed to build resilience and condition soldiers for the demands of service, to the challenges and camaraderie of operational deployments. He discusses the unique aspects of water transport, including the critical role of teamwork and the necessity of being self-reliant while at sea.

A significant portion of the conversation focuses on John's deployment to Bougainville during a time of unrest. He describes the initial shock of landing in a conflict zone and the importance of building trust with the local population, highlighting an incident where his quick action helped rescue a helicopter crew from a crash. John's accounts underscore the unpredictable nature of military operations and the resilience required to navigate them.

The episode also delves into the importance of self-care and mental health for veterans. John discusses the necessity of support networks and the role of organizations like "I've Got Your Six" in providing essential services to veterans. His insights into the mental and emotional challenges faced by service members are invaluable for both veterans and their support networks.

Throughout the episode, Andy and John maintain a conversational tone, balancing the gravity of the topics discussed with moments of light-hearted banter, reflecting the close-knit community within the military. This episode is a compelling listen for veterans, first responders, and anyone interested in the lived experiences of those who serve.

Contact -  John Giampino
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/igySIXfoundation
Website: https://igy6.com.au/
Help Lines Open Arms (VVCS) | Lifeline | RedSix app

"RESPECT, NO POLITICS, WE'RE VOLUNTEERS"

Disclaimer: The accounts and stories are "Real lived experiences" of our guests some of the content may trigger Post Traumatic Stress (PTS) symptoms in some of our audience. Feedback regarding other organisations, courses and initiatives remains largely unsensored. Whether its good or bad they remain the OPINION of our guests and their experiences it is important in building an accurate statistic on what really happens. 
During the course of our conversations sometimes sensitive information may be accidentally mentioned, as such, Invisible Injuries respects the law and sensors any information that may breach Operational Security OPSEC

Transcript

Claire Fermo: 0:04

Welcome to invisible injuries podcast, aimed at bettering the well being and mental health veterans, first responders in their immediate support experiencing post traumatic stress. By sharing the stories of the lived experiences of our peers, or support staff and the clinicians, it's our aim to make sure we can have a meaningful connection with our audience, and give them the ideas for their own self care plan. If you do like what you're hearing, subscribe to the channel and share it with your friends. Lastly, these stories may be a trigger for your post traumatic stress. If your PTSD is triggered, we have links to support in the description. Or if it's immediate, please call lifeline on 1311 14. Here's your host, Andy fermo.

Andy Fermo: 1:03

G'day everyone, and welcome to the invisible injuries podcast. In today's episode I have I've got your six Ambassador John, John Pino, who is also a 31 year Army veteran was with the Royal Australian corps of transport said, Thank you so much for joining us on the podcast today, John,

Unknown: 1:25

thank you for actually inviting me on board. Yes,

Andy Fermo: 1:28

mate. And it's good stuff that you're doing as an ambassador with I've got your six and we'll speak to that and unpack the amazing work that you're doing with them, as well as what you've been doing with your business. I can fix that, and how that's helping veterans as well. And we'll unpack that in a bit. But before then, right, let's learn a little bit more about John. So what was it 31 years in the military? That's a bloody long time. So what was it that drew you to joining the army in the first place, man, okay,

Unknown: 1:57

pretty much back in the day when I did decide to join the regular army I was in the army was right a man's love the job. I was with the Melbourne University regiments I was an Infantry Regiment, and loved doing what I was doing with them so much so that I thought that by love doing the reserves, I'm gonna love doing the regular army. So at the tender age of just under 19 years of age, I joined up which was back in May 85. Wow. Isn't a long time ago. Yeah,

Andy Fermo: 2:29

no. 85 made it? Yeah, we do. And so it was to be able to stay. There's so many of the even like with some of the contemporary veterans there in the audience. And 1985 There was a well before their time. But so can you paint a bit of a picture of what when you joined what the military was like, or even going through? Kapooka? Yeah, for

Unknown: 2:51

sure. When I joined up, it was actually I was recruited by army recruits the rewedding to the recruiting station, there was no such thing as civilians. Back then it was all done by our Defence personnel. And of course, your weight through your bigotry, testing and whatnot all sudden got the letter in the mail probably about a month later saying yes, you've passed her assessments and you can marching to Holland Street and from there will catch a bus over to Kapooka. There was none of this waiting for 612 a day in our mouths. Literally, I was on that bus heading towards Kapooka. Yeah. And once we arrived, that's when everything just hit us all at once. It was sprained the hobos jumped on the bus, told you what to do? How do I line up when basically told you to shut up? And so they do. And that was the intro to the defence poles. So we lined up there in three rounds. And we tried to march down to the lines. And literally, it was non stop for three months. So it was all to do with conditioning. Because you know, since everybody's civilian when they jump off that bus and they want to get rid of that civilian aspect of that person's life. So I literally as you can appreciate, they'll break you down right down to where you're almost broken. And from there, they start building you up the way they want you to become an act. So literally, they're building up a soldier. Yeah, I was three months who Kapooka completed all my assessments. The one thing I didn't want to do is be back squatted. So I studied and played Dow assessments marched out and I marched out riding to Australian quarter transport water transport section.

Andy Fermo: 4:39

Right so with that, I know that you've been to that Kapooka experience as they were breaking up because that's a long time 12 The 12 week format when you as a choco always a reservist sorry, when so as a choco and when you got to Kapooka as changing over to become a full time Sahaja was your experience from being at the university regimen lot more different to your expectation?

John Ciampino: 5:07

Oh, listen, because people will call it nowadays they've got an anchor they will it's bastardization it basically new join the regular army, but it isn't. It's called conditioning. Yes. Because everybody's the people that join the Defence Force realise, at the end of the day, you're training for one thing and one thing only, and that is to defend Australian, an Australian territory against the presses. So they need you Trank they need to train humans certain aspects, you need to have a little bit of resilience about yourself. Don't take this path, it is what it is. A poor are not going to sign apologise your alarm, sorry, I'll just waiting to get into cupboard before I start firing you again. No,

Andy Fermo: 5:54

that's what I love. And that's why I asked that John, because I really liked that. It's the, when we talk about resilience, which we will really unpack with your work with, I've got your six in on what they're doing. And you as an ambassador for that organisation, is that word resilience. And conditioning is part of that right? As opposed to the bastardization and that mindset shift straight off the bat. And there is a purpose behind that. And we'll talk to purpose as well. It can be rough in and in the 80s as well, you still would have had of all the old Vietnam era hard bastards Renea banquet

Unknown: 6:32

has gotten appreciate when you go into an operational environment when you can make different than everybody else's challenges. But now you've changed, you become harder, a lot less softer towards people's feelings only ignore because in the end, you're in a very stressful, demanding environment that requires split second decisions. And is that 90% of Australian people that may even listen to this podcast, will not realise unless they actually put into that situation?

Andy Fermo: 7:04

Yeah, yeah. And that's the thing is that, I think a lot of the time, is, unless you're, if there's that saying, and if you've been there, until you've been in that situation, it's really hard to be able to make comment from the outside people who've actually been in that situation. And our audience listeners, whether they're first responders or veterans had that sort of similar experience as well of having been signed up on the dotted line. Now, you mentioned as well, that when you marched out into water to get into water transport, corps transport, was that something that you put your hand up for? And was that the

Unknown: 7:39

home? Definitely. When I joined Kapooka, I didn't realise he had boats. And when they offered the position, I definitely put my hand up for and fortunately enough, there was two of us we both got it. It was different here. It was an eye opener. Initially after rocker panel, initial employment training straight over to Sydney straight to 30 private transport squadron in village and going down the village dock and all of a sudden seeing all these boats, it was just the massive Eye Opener I'm thinking oh, this is going to be fun. You'll be sad driving these boats around. It's gonna be great. Yeah, that'd be far from the truth no far from the term that the first week they handed me a grinder and a nail gun and said okay, go start chipping and painting I'm thinking what the hell is chipping and painting? And of course they gave me a quick soldiers by the one I had to do it. Yeah, I went in there and started doing it. Until I was until the Asics enemy ship cost came up. So I was basically their labour Gopher, so to speak, learn a little bit about the trade before I actually stepped into maritime school to learn the trade

Andy Fermo: 8:51

proper. Right. So when you did that bit of labouring beforehand while you waited for that course to start, or was that a try service course with the maritime courses? It was at a separate military one, there was

Unknown: 9:03

definitely army run and for Army personnel only. Those are such things back then as try service courses. As you can appreciate army does things a lot differently to what Navy does. Yeah, as far as operating watercraft, and how they run their business and how they run the day to day activities. I've worked on Navy ships, most of my life as well being water transport, we had to be taken to in from operational areas and of course exercises. Yeah, understanding how the Navy works and operates. You scratch your head. Sometimes I'm thinking I'm so surprised we can actually get the shit out of poor. I know. It feels so disjointed. Yeah, when we give our Corporal a lot of responsibility, they die. Their officers basically had the responsibilities and anybody under Have a petty officer rank petty officer just, yeah, labourer do this do that duties do they don't think they sell, they take a boat out, there'll be an officer on board telling him what to do. With us. It was completely different. The Corporal was the man in charge, he operated the craft and he was the one responsible for the crew and the cargo. And

Andy Fermo: 10:22

a totally, totally different role as well. As you mentioned before we hit record of the different types of craft that you did operate. And I do love that sort of that dig as well that intercourse or inter service. rivalry, talk about the resiliency and conditioning to our Navy audience out there. So please don't be offended. We're just laughing at a joke. And we try and keep things a little bit. I know we're talking about some serious stuff. But it's also good to have that little bit of banter. And I think that's part of the the military way to have that. Exactly.

Unknown: 10:56

Part and parcel of being new in the Defence Force Navy's always going to dig it army being mangos. Navy hates army army hates Navy and Navy and Army just doesn't get on well. No big

Andy Fermo: 11:10

shout out to our Air Force. Jon's gonna be getting a lot of messages. There are a lot of

Unknown: 11:19

spirits. Now you know what it's like everybody knows where everybody stands in the defence force. But when it comes to the crunch, we rely on all elements Army, Navy, and Air Force. Because without that you can't do the job. Ground Forces rely on Air Force to provide air cover Navy rely on Air Force to support them. Army rely on both air force and navy wanting to get them there and to provide cover. Yes, it's an intricate part of the holder of vegetables. Yeah, that's right. We banter a lot, right? And we do we rub people up the wrong way. But when push comes to shove, we're one team. That's

Andy Fermo: 12:02

right. And and that's what I love to hear about this sort of thing. You know, like each element, when you sign on the dotted line has a particular role to play within you don't need to be at the pointy end of the stick to be able to have part in the whole machine that contributes to that part of the military as a water transport II. Was that the first posting in Sydney or did you do your trade school and then head off straightaway? Well, guys,

Unknown: 12:26

straight to our trade goalie in the middle of Australia into 30 Barbara transport Squadron which was in Sydney will inch at Village. Yeah. And that was the start of my water transport. career. And

Andy Fermo: 12:41

then so what did that look like as a young digger, come coming into the unit? Jays,

Unknown: 12:46

I'll tell you what, there was a lot of things of course, they're gonna target you. There's your young diga on the yeas and whatnot. But it was good. Listen, there was a hierarchy there. There was a bitter bullying and whatnot. But that was part and parcel about chopping yourself up and getting into the pain of being in water transport. But just as good appreciate you're working on a boat II can be at 2030 nautical miles offshore, travelling up and down the house, there's four people there on the boat. And those four people have to rely on one another to get their watercraft and the crew from one area to another. There's we can be extremely jovial. But when push comes to shove, and we need a job, we do the job well. And unlike vehicles, you can't pull over if something goes wrong. You're out there in the middle of the ocean, you the only place you can go to is to a safe harbour. And that can be 456 hours away. So you have to have a lot of resilience about yourself. You can't just give up. You may be you may be tired, seasick or whatever. You just got to keep going until you reach safe harbour.

Andy Fermo: 13:58

Yeah, the resources as well. And I'm sure that back then you had to be you had to have those skills to be able to fault find and rely on each other's trade skills to get by and because there's no one to exactly come in to the rescue. Should you be out at Ledisi Well, that's

Unknown: 14:17

right. The you're out in the ocean and you're by yourself that you're abiding by civil laws and whatnot being reopened. But again, out in the ocean, when you monitor your radios, those not only your craft, or other crew members get into a bit of strife, but any civilian craft out there gets into a bit of strife. You need to be on your game and you are required by law to render assistance and build Now

Andy Fermo: 14:47

it's interesting that you've said that and just to paint a little bit more about like daily life in as a as a water transport in the army. Did you have to was there many instances where you've you had to answer those Stress calls

Unknown: 15:01

several. Hola. I'll start with one Paul A who placed airwing helicopter will sailing out the harbour. And we looked behind us in the engineer on our Bogle behind us we well look at that helicopter, it's a bit low. Oh, he turned around and as we turned around the helicopter hit the water. And so we which we done an about face with the LCM. Both LCM is that we're going in and we rush at best speed to the crash shot. We secured the helicopter alongside the watercraft before it sank. And we also had to assist the crew and one crew member was actually injured. Yeah, I jumped on a small boat that was out there went over and literally with almost straight and the adrenaline was pumping through my body before the toolbars to get out of the water straight into the body. And he's strapped to the LCM as was they rebuilt Polly though the helicopter it took a couple of years. Yeah, we were tremendous on our quick action. So that was pretty good. And that's where brining definitely came in to a picture

Andy Fermo: 16:14

was that one? So what was it like when you said training came into that picture? Well, you know, everything

Unknown: 16:21

was just instantaneous. Yeah, it was literally you just went in there and you knew what to do. I only done a quick ma even though the helicopter crew was I dare say adrenaline was then shock hasn't said in because a message can't helicopter into the ocean is just Yeah, it's the furthest thing from your mind. But they do act. Broadly, well kill the line. So we can vent her chopping from actually sinking. And then we will pull the crew members out. One of them screamed out and said he's injured. And that's where we basically look what was around us saying as more boat from India that went over the injured crew member pulled him out and told him he was going to be okay. And of course took them to the LCM when we're going to show where the ambulance was was

Andy Fermo: 17:16

a desirable result. And when you do that choice of training with the choppers and you have to do that, who at training think Ah geez, why are we going back underneath? Why is this thing rolling. But when you describe what happened there, out in the ocean, I think that an airframe is going to sink pretty bloody quickly once it fills up with water. So you really want to get out of that. It's more than a rock that's tied to your foot. Oh,

Unknown: 17:40

literally pause you had to pull one of the crew members back in because he was trying to get out of our doctor while the WISE was high job. So he died. Yeah. And again, it was the most back then there was no such thing for us. I was a digger back in he was 8889 in the year when this incident happened. And yeah, everything was just instantaneous. She didn't have time thing. Or it was just going there to get the job done skill what he could get the crew out. And then from there, think about leaking and do after everything was healed.

Andy Fermo: 18:17

That's a testament to the training there. And then cutting things coming in you train how you train how you're going to react. And in that particular case, that was what was happening on that daily life they came in. And in the 80s. People mentioned say to me when we were talking with different veterans from that era in particular, they stated that there was a peacetime army, but it seemed like there was quite a lot of stuff happening. John, can you speak to that a little bit more?

Unknown: 18:42

What's the peacetime army back in the timer I joined Vietnam war finished in 93. And 12 years later I joined so pretty much it's the same as what people are soldiers nowadays the loss of Bernards with canister his ankles literally, yet, we were at my mom's ba the training came from Vietnam era and style even though every word peacetime army, they didn't look at me as that. They said, listen, eyes because you never know what's gonna happen around the corner, we need to bind you up at a specific way. And this is probably where the hard line came in. Because in this thing is a massive thing, because you can't fold under stress. You've got to work your way through it. And this is part and parcel of how they conditioned us which fortunately, doesn't really happen within defence today.

Andy Fermo: 19:38

Yeah, that's a big topic that we can that can be unpacked there, though about that today. So fast forwarding, John, you had a massive Korea 31 years in the Army and you did have some deployments as well speaking to that time in that era, there's a little bit more peacetime but you've already got

Unknown: 19:58

actually it was just for tea mostly, as tables started, I was been deployed to Bowdoin but yes, as peacekeeping over there and I turned around and my boss and said screw dragon bill, I want to go to team or and he looked at me laughed and said, Sorry, mate, you're going to bug and Bill names already out there. You're heading up next week. And I watched my whole unit pack up to go to East Timor. Then the boss turned around, threw me the case and said, mate, you're in charge of the barracks now. You're the commander in charge of the Beirut, when they all marched out straight to our team all housed for another week before we poured our lights to what I can film, literally my whole year shut down. Because we're working on to operational funds being Bogum Ville and East Timor. Wow.

Andy Fermo: 20:49

And so that's a go from that time there to then stand up a lot of those assets because Loganville, East Timor them got says that there is border, so all those resources would have been allocated from your unit. Right? Yeah, literally,

Unknown: 21:02

not only from our unit from water transport through getting down on as well, because they stood up for East Timor, as well with their two watercraft. So in essence, pretty much all our watercraft were involved in one operation or the other. And

Andy Fermo: 21:20

what was it like when that call came in the call to action? Basically, after all that Bowgun Ville and then team was happening? What were what were your thoughts? My thoughts?

Unknown: 21:31

We're going to do our job now. Oh, was it saw it? It was like you've been training all these years or the peacetime army and all of a sudden you've been deployed, and you're thinking, Oh, your Chinese band is going to accommodate to this one period. And that was certainly overseas, because in the end, it's not training. So you make mistake, it could be detrimental to our whole on the crafting crew. Yeah. Download was, listen, there was an air of excitement, anticipation, one, how everybody was going to react and whatnot. So I was really looking forward to it.

Andy Fermo: 22:10

And that was that when you landed in Vogon Ville? What was that sort of expectation versus what was happening on the ground

Unknown: 22:16

when we landed in Burgerville? Well, of course, we wore our yellow T shirts, our yellow hats under our DPC years, got to well how, where and I was at Port, their network will station the watercraft station, and straight into yellow T shirts and shorts. And yeah, started doing a tasking, which really hit the ground running the army, the crew that we're replacing, we're going to be for an adult Wait, so we can do a proper Tai Chi over and we can understand the why they'll operating and from there straight into it. That was exciting. It was a really different I'm thinking as the new foster Paice. You know, it was it was quite slow and deliberate. But it was enjoyable, nevertheless, because we're in another country.

Andy Fermo: 23:05

Yep. And peacekeeping operations, there is a different part to that as well, it is very important to be able to do this. Can you just share with our audience that Bowgun Ville law, what was the mandate there for you guys to be able to do and you come into the ground, hitting the ground running involved? Okay, so

Unknown: 23:22

pretty much when we hit the ground running a bill was the only operation that we actually attended where we went round. So we relied heavily on the locals to make sure everything was done right. In they knew that well, they're unarmed for one reason, one reason not only to get both anvil up and running again and hand it back to the locals. So as the Brigadier said wouldn't listen, were unarmed look after my pay. And they did they done a great job. We had a couple of incidences where a couple of locals quit drunk and got a hold of an SLR and started shooting around our low area, and of course, the whole point of the lockdown until that was resolved. But the next day the person's doing all the firing and whatnot came over and apologised profusely for his actions. Yeah, that with bone bone, it's no secret the boating billion people didn't like Papa New Guinea at all. Because in the end, all of the royalties and whatnot that's coming out at Bangalore is getting straight to pop when you get in. Yeah, so it was there was a bit of conjecture there but working with the local, absolutely fantastic, beautiful people. Unfortunately, the war for them back to the Stone Age, right from the infrastructure. They had, literally gate when we arrived there. They had nothing. The hospital was gone. The power station was gone. The courts were gone. All the machinery was destroyed. They were areas well plus waters knife wise ions just did fly with Ally doctors, the they would have shadowed us yet there will be areas big circles big red areas needles pumped out commonly around the mining arrogance where they will no fly zone is but apart from that was the first time I actually saw active Volk greener thing is pretty low. Yeah. And knowing that one of the things they tell you when you're driving up and down the roads is whatever you do not run over a beat. And if you run over a pit don't stop. Because not only do you have to pay for that pig you've killed but the offspring that take my paying for like future royalties pigs are in boating Ville are a big deal to them, because I mean, it's part and parcel of their staple diet. they've acquired valuable so

Andy Fermo: 25:52

called cultural difference there and it's nice to be able to hear someone who was deployed to Bergen Ville, and how that difference was especially the anon bit where you'd actually have to a lot of it then came down to communication, and hearts and minds how you would be operating. Wouldn't it really be

Unknown: 26:10

lovely? It was trusting the locals being in La La Ho. We did have a hospital there and patients did arrive there at night and that the patients had her wounds, machete wounds and whatnot. So the surgeons sometimes had to amputate and in the morning, of course she see all this black smoke rising and literally what they do is throw through the remains in a one the buckets for these massive dump truck. endow just put, have gas in there and stop burning because it was biohazard. They they disposed of buyer had we had other things that we had to be mindful of knowing that there was chlorine guests in there as well. So everybody had to carry around gas masks. And trust me those gas masks, the gas alarms tend to go off and the most inopportune time. Yeah. o'clock in the morning.

Andy Fermo: 27:07

And all those things said it was only really it was a full operation except for the weapons. It's interesting to be able to hear what it was like it still had to deal with stuff. And it's it goes on to that cultural difference. In Port Moresby, and I'm thinking about boeken Villa and they're sort of their conflict with the Papua New Guineans at the time, their tribal laws, and it can be a pretty violent place when people say they're still really tribes out there that are not really conditioned to humans. And that tribal law is much different to what we see in a western society. It can be pretty rough. And when you're in some of those villages, even in Port Moresby, it was one of the places there there's not been many places that have felt unsafe, right, because I can handle myself and quite aware, but when you're there by yourself, you go, is this can turn south now. real nasty real quick. And that's what I'm getting at with what you're describing. Like that's it all came back. It could go like that, as it

Unknown: 28:04

definitely ain't had times it did. Bloody pig John. Yeah, it was we went out to the outposts were there see where and where the other members were operating out of here on the ground, you're seeing nothing but all these explosive materials like electronic electrical detonation caps, they're just scattered everywhere. The explosive compound all in that two foot long tubes. There's hundreds of them literally scattered everywhere and gone. What the hell Bear HEY, it's identical played I opened and you speak to the guys I say how come you haven't disposed of ladies? I said all we did we ask that nobody's promoted disposal yet. So we went back to low low. Say you need EOD out there to mid a week played out EOD went out there, collected everything. dug a big hole in the sand. Blow it all up. Yeah.

Andy Fermo: 28:56

So fast forward in from that experience. John, did you end up getting a Guernsey to team or after that we

Unknown: 29:02

did three months after returning back to Australia. Dry it on the plane. dairies team on now was three months right after spending several months over and bagging mill so there was no reset back then. Because the operational tempo for us was extremely high. You're on either one operation or in the other being water transport. We only had to pay a boat that they say had we spread it out. You had to spread the love our Yeah, that literally there was a lot of us just jumping from one operation to the next from

Andy Fermo: 29:36

going three months. No decompression we can we could speak to that afterwards. And because you just spoke with that with the resources and then that includes manpower.

Claire Fermo: 29:47

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