Behind the Scenes of Audiobook Narration with Gabi Epstein and Rebecca Soler

Marissa and Joanne are joined by Rebecca Soler and Gabi Epstein – the narrators for the LET IT GLOW audiobook (You may also recognize Rebecca’s voice from most of Marissa’s other audio books!). Discussed in this deep dive episode all about audio books: the similarities and differences between audiobook narration and stage acting, how much interaction narrators have with authors and co-narrators, the process of recording and editing, what typical recording days look like, narrator voice tips and tricks, narrator pet peeves (hint for writers: read your books out loud!), how song lyrics work in audio (includes a behind the scenes [not] fun fact about the song in LET IT GLOW), how to get started as an audiobook narrator, and so much more!

Ahab voice collaboration website: https://www.ahabtalent.com/ 

Thank You for Listening: https://libro.fm/audiobooks/9780063095588 

Mark Thompson’s audio catalog: https://libro.fm/search?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=Mark+Thompson 

The Happy Writer at Bookshop.org
Purchasing your books through our webstore at Bookshop.org supports independent bookstores.

Amplify Marketers
Our mission is to help your message rise above the noise so it can be heard loud & clear.

Red Herrings Society
Use the code HappyWriter at RedHerringWriters.com to try the first month for free.

Disclaimer: This post contains affiliate links. If you make a purchase, I may receive a commission at no extra cost to you.

Order The Happy Writer: Get More Ideas, Write More Words, and Find More Joy from First Draft to Publication and Beyond https://bookshop.org/a/11756/9781250362377

Find out more and follow The Happy Writer on social media: https://www.marissameyer.com/podcast/

Transcript

[00:10] Marissa: Hello and welcome to the Happy Writer. This is a podcast that aims to bring readers more books to enjoy and to help authors find more joy in their writing. I am your host, Marissa Meyer. Thank you so much for joining me. One thing that is making me super happy this week is that I am actually recording this from writing retreat. I am at this kind of wacky, weird B and B Airbnb actually with some of my closest writing friends and we're spending the weekend here trying to work on our novels. And I am busily plowing away on what I hope is going to be the final draft of the House Sapphire, my creepy bluebeard retelling. And I really hope, hope, hope, hope, hope that by are listening to this, that book will be off with my editor. I've got big aspirations for this writing retreat. I'm working very hard except for this next hour in which I am here talking to you and talking to my awesome guests. Speaking of my incredible guest, today I am joined by three. This is our first time. We've got four of us all here in conversation. So today I am joined by once again, the lovely Joanne Ledge, one of my favorite people in the world, who happens to be my co author of Let It Glow, the Holiday Middle Grade that came out this past October. We also have Gabi Epstein, who is an actress, singer, and if you live in the Toronto area, you can also catch her in numerous theater and cabaret shows. She is also an audiobook narrator who has worked on Broken Strings by Eric Walters and Kathy Kayser and the Many Mysteries of the Finkel Family by Sarah Kepit, among many others. And last but not least, I am also joined today by Rebecca Solaire. She is an actress, a voice actress, and an audiobook narrator, and I know many of my readers will recognize her as the voice behind the Lunar Chronicles, Heartless, Gilded, and more. She has also narrated the Caraval series by Stephanie Garber and more recently, Fourth Wing by Rebecca Yarros. They also happen to be the narrators who voice Holly and Aviva for the Let It Glow audiobook, which is why we are so excited to talk to them today. Please welcome Gabi Epstein and Rebecca Solaire.

[02:55] Joanne: Hello.

[02:55] Gabi: Hello.

[02:56] Rebecca: Hey. That is an intro.

[03:01] Gabi: So good.

[03:02] Marissa: It was hard paring it down. You are both so accomplished.

[03:07] Rebecca: Amazing.

[03:08] Gabi: We do well.

[03:08] Rebecca: Welcome.

[03:09] Marissa: I'm so, so excited to talk to you. Joanne and I have talked about having a special episode about audiobook narration for over a year now, and so this felt like the perfect time to do it. I'm a huge fan. We're so thrilled that the two of you said yes when we asked you to be the voices of our protagonists. Yeah. And I'm just so excited to talk to you today.

[03:36] Rebecca: Thank you for having us.

[03:38] Gabi: It's so nice to actually to meet Rebecca, the narrator, because we. We didn't really get to meet very much in the process. So this is fantastic.

[03:49] Rebecca: Yeah. It's such a treat and I want.

[03:51] Marissa: To know about that. But we're going to come back to that because I am curious about, like, co narrating something that seems like it might be harder than just being the only narrator, but putting a tack in that, because first I want to know your origin stories. You'll have to decide who wants to go first here. But how did you get into audiobook narrating? How does this become a thing?

[04:16] Gabi: Becca, you go ahead.

[04:18] Rebecca: All right. Well, so I went to school to study acting and then actually studied musical theater at Carnegie Mellon, graduated and then moved to New York City. And then we sort of joked about this offline, but I just started auditioning for everything and anything and was introduced to animation first within voiceover. Got a voiceover agent and they found out how much I loved. I was an avid reader and my agent introduced me to audiobooks and actually really coached me on how to be a better narrator. She stuck me in the booth and worked with me on my auditions so that I could understand stylistically how it varied from the other types of acting and voiceover work. And I just, you know, it just stuck because it was everything that I love, getting books from authors that I'm obsessed with early getting to read them first, wrapping them. So it was just a lot of fun. That's how I actually got into audiobook narration. What about you, Gabi?

[05:25] Gabi: Well, we sort of have a lot of similarities, but. But I. Because I also studied acting and music and went to. Went to McGill for music school and then came back to Toronto and was auditioning for just sort of anything and everything as. And have been working pretty steadily as a theater actress mostly for the last decade or so, but also did a little bit of animation when I first started out, which of course, I think lends itself to the YA and middle grade audiobook narration that I do mostly. But this sort of whole audiobook narration chapter of my life only started during COVID because obviously everything was locked down. I'm connected to the writing world a little bit because my mother, as you were saying before, is an author. Her name is Kathy Kacer, and she has written many, many, many ya, middle grade and one adult book as well. And she was working with an audiobook company that wanted to record one of her books, but they needed it to be a home record because everything was shut down. And so she asked me if this was something that I could possibly do. And of course, because it was Covid and there was nothing coming in, I said, sure, and I would figure it out as I went. And that is just what I did. I got some audio tech friends of mine to help me out, lent me a microphone, and then because it was Covid, the company actually really helped me out and coached me through that first process because they just wanted it done well. And so after that, I became a person that had a home studio and I was off to the races. And that's sort of how it all started on my end.

[07:04] Marissa: Okay. I think that's so cool. And I love that you both come to it from acting and that you both also have some background in animation, because it just kind of shows that there's these skills, certain skills that just lend themselves to so many different passions that a person can get into. Rebecca, I'm curious. You mentioned that when you first got into doing audiobooks, you had someone who kind of helped to coach you and show you how is it different from doing other types of acting or other types of voice work. So my first question is, how is it different? What. What is special about doing audiobooks in particular?

[07:50] Rebecca: I think it's that, well, especially now, we are as basically inside people's brains when they're listening to us, because most people are, you know, have an earbud at this point. So the need to project in any way, shape or form isn't there. The microphone is inches from your mouth. And so I think, you know, initially, you know, having a theater background, I was projecting to the back row or to the mez or to the, you know, the upper mes, you know, belting out a tune. And even with some animation, it can be very action packed and loud and bold. And it's just understanding you can make all of those bolder choices, but the person listening to those choices is at times like a milliliter away from your voice so that you don't have to project as much. It can be a more intimate journey with people.

[08:53] Marissa: Gabi, what about you? What do you think is one of the major differences or some of the major differences?

[08:59] Gabi: You know, there are certainly sort of technical differences, just like Rebecca was saying, where you can get sort of the difference between. As theater actors, we probably more so in a general sense, people, theater actors are dealing with sort of Television acting versus theatrical acting. And the idea that just a little, just a little movement of your eyebrow or a little smirk on your lips can read volumes exponentially more expressive when there's a camera right in front of you versus doing that on a large stage. So that's sort of where I see the differences. And even just the way that you breathe, the way that you talk, whether it's here or for example, if I can get really intimate right here, you know, just even those, those, those, those differences can really make a difference when you have the, that, that mic technique that Rebecca was talking about. But, but what I love and the reason that I still continue to do it is that at the end of the day it is just acting and it is character work still. And so in finding those voices there are all of those technical things that you definitely think about and take into account. But at the end of the day, I just love finding these voices for these people and bringing them to life. It's really exciting. And then. And you sort of take it from there. It's been really wonderful to use this thing that we are so passionate about, which is acting and specifically theater and singing and being theatrical and everything and bringing it to a more intimate space that still has just as much storytelling involved.

[10:41] Rebecca: And if I can dovetail onto that, there's also the fact that in. This is the only place, truly the only place where we get to play a whole bunch of people we would never play in any other format, you know, even any other format of voiceover. I do a lot of film and television voiceover as well. And you know, I'm brought in to sound like a woman or a child or to speak Spanish. But I'm never going to be someone's grandfather, right. And so that's also kind of delicious. And it just allow. It gives you a freedom because you can't possibly actually sound like a 70 year old man. But it's the freedom to pretend that you are that is super exciting and nuanced. With audiobooks.

[11:24] Marissa: No, I love that. I love that idea that you have so much more. Oh, I don't know what the word would be, but where you can really kind of experiment and explore so many different characters within this.

[11:35] Gabi: Well, what's great about a lot of audiobooks, especially the ones for young adult in middle grade. Like, like, like I personally do a lot of it's from. Even though we're playing multiple characters, it's usually from the perspective of the, of the main character that you are voicing. So even though I still Definitely want to sound like that person's grandmother or grandfather or whatever relation to that person. It's still always through the lens of the main protagonist that you are narrating and embodying. So there's also, you know, there's interesting things like how a grandmother for. For example, in our book in Let It Glow, how, you know, Aviva's grandmother would sound like. Is Aviva's interpretation of what her grandmother sounds like? Not necessarily. Exactly, you know, what her grandmother would sound like. But it's. It's in Aviva's world, it's through the world of the person that you are taking on, usually for an entire book, for hundred of pages. So it's really fun to sort of go at characters through the lens of really the one person that you are embodying and that you need your audience to be on board with.

[12:51] Joanne: And can I say, just for the record, Gabi, you did an amazing job with Aviva's booby, who is basically my mom. So that's who I hear in my head when I read the book. And you just did a fantastic job. So thank you for capturing my mom.

[13:06] Gabi: Oh, my gosh, my pleasure. Wouldn't be the first time I voiced a Jewish grandmother.

[13:19] Marissa: Joanne, did you want to ask one of your questions?

[13:21] Joanne: Oh, yes, please. So this is for both of you. Gabi, you can go first if you want. Does it feel more like performing or reading when you're doing it? Because I guess when you're voicing it, you're also putting in the dialogue tags and observations and things like that, which I guess wouldn't be the same as performing or being on stage. So do you have to get into sort of a different mindset when you're doing audiobook narration?

[13:52] Gabi: That's really interesting. That's a really interesting question. Cause I think it's sort of a little bit of both. You are, of course, you are performing. Whenever you're playing a character you are performing, you have to make believe and make your audience believe that you are this character, or else it won't be a captivating audiobook. It won't. Won't be worth listening for, you know, hours and hours. But at the same time, you have to be aware, like Rebecca was saying before, of the medium that you are performing for. So it wouldn't make sense. It would feel very phony and not truthful, necessarily, if I were performing the same way as I would be on a stage. And so. And also to add to that, one of the biggest. One of the comments that I get from directors or people or engineers or people in general. And I think this goes for theater people in general is people say to me that I'm a great reader, not necessarily an audiobook narrator, but just that I read well. And I think that that comes from a theatrical background, from the idea that we have to, for a large audience in a large space, be really specific with what we are saying and make sure that the story is still being told properly and clearly. And so I think that we're able to sort of channel that, bring it down to a much smaller scale. And by that I mean a little booth and a microphone and be able to bring the largeness of this world that you want to create and then. And then minimize it to this very small little space that still has as much impact, but is not as grand as if you were to take this stage to a stage or a film or something like that, because you also want to leave room for your audience to imagine what's going on. Of course, that's the same thing with books as well. So this helps a little bit. But so I. So in a matter of speaking, I think it's a little bit of both.

[16:04] Joanne: You know, that's great, Rebecca, Same same experience for you?

[16:08] Rebecca: Yeah, I would say my goal. And I prep a book really an unbelievable amount of times. And that's because no matter if it's in first person or third person, I want it to feel like one long monologue, even if it's chapter one, they ran into the room, or, you know, it's much easier to feel like one long monologue when it is in first person, because it is, in essence, something that you could perform as like, you know, a solo woman's show if you had an insane memory. But so what I try to do is make it feel as lived in as possible and drive the pace that I think, you know, the words need and drive the emotion and set the nuance as much as possible, so that, if anything, it doesn't feel read to them. It feels lived in, and so they can just be along for the ride. That's my goal. I mean. I mean, that's the utopian goal, whether or not I'm successful all the time. But that's what I do. And so that's why I read the text so much, and I mark the heck out of my text so much in order to. To remind myself, okay, today I'm going to be tackling these chapters. I've got to get through here, here, and here. I'll write huge notes to myself, like pace or Sotto voce, crescendo. Like, I use actually music terminology to help remind me what I want to do in order to make sure that I am moving at the pace that if I were just reading the book, I would be reading the book at instead of like, my worst case scenario is I am narrating at a much slower pace than the audience wants me to. So I really try to gallop a pace. Fiery footed feast steeds. Yeah. As much as possible.

[18:05] Gabi: And in terms of prepping, like, and like, sort of getting into characters. Well, the nice thing, and this doesn't happen all the time, but the nice thing about recording as opposed to a live performance, this is, you know, a really nice plus of this is that sometimes I find that, you know, it takes me a couple of chapters even on something just to. Sometimes I find myself like half an hour or whatever into our session. Then I'm like, okay, this is. This is where I want to be. So let's go back. We're going to go back now. We're going to start at the top again. Just record those first 10 minutes again because. Because I'm. I'm in it now. This is. This. I've sort of found. Found the pace and the voice and the. And the, the world of. Of today. And so it is a. Something that I've done before and can really help to the fact that it. That it is. That it is recorded, that it's not a live performance. Now, live performance is incredible. And that's just the magic of where you are in the room at that time and everyone's experiencing it with you. But when you have that luxury, it is nice to have that option if you want.

[19:08] Marissa: So while we're talking about prep work, did the two of you have any interactions before you started recording? Nope.

[19:20] Joanne: No.

[19:22] Marissa: How does that work?

[19:24] Rebecca: It's. You know what, it's so funny because it really depends on the project. Sometimes I will know ahead of time who my co narrator is. And then if I've worked with them before or I, like, can reach out to them, we will, you know, we'll work together and be able to, you know, kind of scope out what. But sometimes we don't get our copies until like the 11th hour. And then what I've taken to doing is just making notes of. I will ask, like, who's recording first? Okay, can you tell me these are the characters that overlap? Can you tell me what their choices were for this, this, this, this and this? Or can you put pins in so I can hear what they did so that I can maintain consistency. You know, actually, Marissa, for the Renegade series, Dan Buettner and I had a great shorthand. He's a buddy of mine now, but he would be like, okay, this is my Harrison Ford, but Harrison Ford as Indiana Jones, not as Han Solo. And I was like, okay, great. This is my Maggie Smith, except she is in her 60s, not in her 80s. And he's like, got it. Got it. We were just, like, talking and trading notes that way, if you. If you know what I mean. But sometimes you just don't have the opportunity or. Or actually, no, I've never met Gabi. Gabi, just now. We're set up for success, for all future partnerships.

[20:48] Gabi: Yes. Sisters.

[20:51] Rebecca: But, yeah. Yeah, we're not in control because sometimes also, we're actually not encouraged to reach out to the authors as well. We're supposed to, like, go through our people. To get to your people, to, you know, and I understand, to maintain, like, your privacy and to not feel like you're being stalked. But obviously, you know, Marissa, I, like, I think I DMed you on Instagram, and I was like, hey, Carol.

[21:13] Gabi: Hey.

[21:13] Rebecca: I'm going to be reading your book. Have some questions.

[21:16] Marissa: Yeah, no. And I personally, I hate that the publishers do that. They do it with illustrators also, like, writing graphic novels. I get virtually zero connection whatsoever with the illustrators. And I'm like, but couldn't we work better together to create this thing if we were communicating? But publishers are weird about kind of keeping the authors separate for some reason.

[21:37] Rebecca: Well, it's also, I think, you know.

[21:39] Gabi: Like, we obviously, I had to audition for this role, and so once I sort of sent in my, you know, my tape, my take on Aviva, which was approved. Then after that, I just know this from working on some of my mom's audiobooks, that she actually, in talking to her, of course, I had a very, very close, personal relationship with her through the process, and when she listened to it for the first time, she kind of said, that's so funny. That wasn't at all how I pictured this character's voice. It was still great, but it wasn't. It wasn't initially in my head how I wrote it that way, you know, or just. You know what I mean? So that could have maybe gotten into my head. Who knew? You know, who knows? If. If I had known that and trying to be a version that didn't feel true to me. And so at some point, I guess if it's been approved, if we, quote, unquote, got the role, then you sort of trust that that's the way that everyone wants it to be. And then we sort of have license to put our own little stamp on it that hopefully any performance, you sort of get licensed to do that, any role that you take. And also for Rebecca and I working together, it would have, I think, been one thing. If we had sort of chapters together, if you wrote it that we were sort of talking, actually as each other back and forth, then I think it would have been really beneficial for us to sort of record together. But again, because these chapters are separate and through each other's worldview and through each other's point of view, that it was okay that I heard Rebecca's character references for some of these people and then could bring Aviva's interpretation of these people as well, with a little nod to where Rebecca was going first, because that's actually how it worked with our process. Specifically, Rebecca recorded first and so sent. The publisher sent along a few of her character references, and so I could sort of use those and filter them through the Aviva world when I recorded.

[23:48] Marissa: Oh, how interesting.

[23:50] Joanne: That's fascinating. Yeah.

[23:52] Rebecca: What was your. I know we're not supposed to interview you, but what was your process in working together on this? How did you, you know, collaborate?

[24:00] Marissa: We'd never talked to each other before. No, I'm joking.

[24:07] Joanne: Who is this?

[24:08] Gabi: What?

[24:10] Marissa: It's a very different collaboration than your collaboration. I can say that. Joanne, do you want to talk?

[24:19] Rebecca: Sure.

[24:19] Joanne: Yeah. I mean, for the actual process. So we worked together on an outline, but when it came time to actually writing it, we wrote together in a shared Google Doc, sort of alternating our chapters. Like, Marissa would paste in a chapter and then edit mine from before, and then I would edit hers and paste in mine, and we would sort of. I call it sort of leapfrogging forward. But we were definitely in each other's pockets for the entire time.

[24:51] Marissa: Yeah. So now we were. The whole writing process, we were getting constant feedback from each other. And so if I'm writing a scene from Holly's perspective, of course there would be dialogue from Aviva talking, and then Joanne would come in and, you know, tweak all of Aviva's dialogue to make sure she was keeping it in the character that she was envisioning. So I'm just fascinated by, like, knowing how you guys work together that you don't have that. It seems like it would be so hard to maintain that consistency. But I think it's fascinating that, you know, with Rebecca recording first and then, you know, could the producer or director, whoever sent on some clips. I just think the whole thing is really interesting, the behind the scenes and.

[25:36] Gabi: So, I mean, a testament to how. To the consistency and writing of the book. The fact that, like, we could work separately and it still felt like it was in exactly the same world.

[25:50] Rebecca: And I think, like, would, you know, we're both theater actresses. Would I have loved to be able to chat, you know, with Gabi for a couple hours before and be like, how are you? Because especially with, you know, I would have preferred for Gabi to be able to set Aviva's family, you know, and for. For us to be like, how do you feel your family sounds? And how do I feel my family, you know, and really just kind of like have that sort of, you know, lovely, empathetic listening journey with each other, you know, and sometimes there's the space for that, and then sometimes sort of the publishing entity is larger than any of us on this call, and we just, you know, try to bring our A. Graham and to take as many notes as possible and to. And to send what we can. So. But yeah, I think the way that you guys architected this book really lent itself quite lovely to having those two distinct POVs, and they were quite complimentary.

[26:53] Joanne: Thank you.

[26:54] Marissa: Thank you. Joanne, did you want to ask the next question?

[26:58] Joanne: Sure. So just sort of on the technical side, do you. Just about how audio book narration works. Do you edit your own work and then send in your files, or does the publisher do the editing?

[27:13] Gabi: Rebecca, I'll let you go first because I think you have a little bit more. You've been doing this a little bit longer than I have, so you can sort of go first and then I'll chime in after.

[27:22] Rebecca: Sure. So I tend. I live in New York City, so I have the luxury of most often going into a studio and having someone record me and someone edit me so that my sole responsibility is just the performance, which is quite decadent and lovely. That being said, during COVID I certainly, you know, I have my own set up in my apartment. I do live directly across the street from a hospital. So that's always exciting in the middle of the session to hear the realities of New York living in the back. But oftentimes if I. If I am recording myself, so there's two different ways that you can record, and one is called punch, and one is just called open roll. So this is super technical. Joanne, just get ready.

[28:07] Joanne: I love it.

[28:08] Rebecca: So. So open roll is literally someone presses record, and then you just keep talking and talking and talking and talking and talking. And every time that you make a mistake, you stop yourself, you go back to wherever you want, you keep recording, and someone else takes notes every time you stopped on their own script. And then someone else goes back and edits everything. Punch is now most often used. And that's. Let's say I make a mistake in the middle of the sentence, they'll stop recording, we'll go back in to wherever I want to start it, and then they'll play the end of the previous sentence and I will follow my own voice and begin again. And you know, in essence, I'm making air quotes. You can't see me punch in the rest of the performance. So generally punch is what's done even in studio. And then at home I have the highly technical thing where I will punch myself, but I will make really high bird tweet noises to show myself on the audio file where I messed up because I can't take notes at the same time that I'm recording. And so I will just go back and watch for the peaks in my own recording and then edit myself chapter after chapter. But Gabi, you are probably far more adept at your home records than I am.

[29:36] Gabi: Gosh, I was going to say bless you for doing your own punches at home, because I've done it once. Usually, even if I'm doing a punch and roll myself, I'll usually be working with at least an engineer, not necessarily a director, but at least somebody on the other end who will do those punch ins for me. But the home records, I find what works best, what I prefer to do and what works best for me is that open roll. I love to call it clap and roll, because instead of the high tweets, what I do is I clap. Because then on my file there's just a really, really obvious high peak. Something that is not even, you know, looks like just a sharp straight line on my audio file. It's really obvious to know. And so that is usually what I do at home. There's actually one of the engineers that I that to my open roles quite often one day, I don't know why this is the only time it's ever happened, but one of my neighbors was playing some kind of a very loud brass instrument. And like, I don't. They've never done it since and I don't know what was going on that day, but I just had to stop and kind of just talk into my microphone and just because I thought it was going to end soon enough, that it would just be a short thing and then be done. And so this poor Engineer just kind of had to listen to me, be like, I don't understand what's going on. This has never happened. This neighbor is playing. Is it a bassoon? Is it an oboe? I have no idea. And then the engineer actually ended up emailing me like a few weeks later saying, I'm at this point in the recording. Did you ever solve the mystery? I have to know. So, like, created our own little story. But I sort of, I go into the studio about half the time I'm in Toronto. And because once you say you have a home studio. Oh, is your home studio ever so desirable by some publishing companies? And so, you know, there are pros and cons of both. I love going into studio as well, but honestly, I'm a freelance performer most of the time. And so I love being able to just make my own schedule and be able to do it from home. And if I want to record for six hours, eight hours on one day, if I'm on a roll, I can do that. If I start and after one hour I'm just not feeling it or my voice is tired or something, I can stop then as well. So there are, there are certainly pros and cons to each, but a lot of pressure when you've got your own studio because of course, you just want it to be excellent and you, you know that the quality is obviously of utmost importance. So again, you just sort of have to trust that what you are putting out there is working for everybody. 

[ADVERTISEMENTS] So you want to write a book, but you just don't know where to start or the process feels overwhelming. The Storyteller's Weekly Journal is exactly what you need. Designed to walk you through idea development, all aspects of the writing process, and the creation of pitch materials, the Storyteller's Weekly Journal is a planner, craft book and a guided journal all in one. It's the writing coach, teacher and companion you need at your side every story, every time. The Storyteller's Weekly Journal is available wherever books are sold.

What do readers look at when they're considering whether or not to buy a book? The book's summary. Right. But did you know that the formatting of your book's description is as important as the words themselves? Shoppers tend to ignore large blocks of paragraph text, but that's how the majority of book descriptions on Amazon and other shopping sites are formatted. Help your book stand out from the rest by applying a simple summary template that is snackable, skimmable and scannable. The right balance of bold font, bullet points and italics can guide a reader's eye through the important keywords and all the way to that Buy now button button. Learn more about writing dynamic book descriptions in session five of Amplify Marketing Services Author Advantage series. Find both the video and a downloadable companion worksheet@amplifymarketers.com authors and start crafting better book summaries today. So kind of on that same level, I know a lot of people are curious about how long it takes and obviously every book is different. A little middle grade is not going to take the same amount of time as a huge epic fantasy. But for an audiobook that maybe turns out to be say 10 hours long, how many hours are you recording for? And how many hours will you record for a day?

[34:49] Rebecca: That's a good question. It depends on the font size. So what I will say is the larger the font, the faster the record. Even just logistically like Old Lady Rebecca, like I make less mistakes if it's a larger font. It's very forgiving for me in my eyes. But so for something like Rebecca Yarris's fourth wing, I record about 300 recorded minutes a day. And that was me being so what that's like five hours of. So that. That's a punch, right? So of all the times that I made a mistake and all the times that I had to restart over, what they kept was 300 minutes. So to yield 300 minutes I was there from 10 to 6 took basically maybe an all in maybe an hour and a half with lunches and breaks and you know, all that kind of good stuff. So I don't know, do the math. I'm an actor. All of that to yield that. And I would say in general I do about 100 to 130 pages of text a day in like sort of a, in a non middle grade I would say more either older YA or just like more adult fiction sized fonted book, if that makes sense. What about you, Gabi?

[36:16] Gabi: Oh geez, I wish I knew. I sort of, I know that usually I have a goal. Like I find that after, you know, like if we do an eight hour session, that's, that's about, that's a good day. You know, you don't usually want to do more than that. I find that also I probably record about 100 pages. Like I, you know, I sort of like track myself and I figure out how much time they've allotted for this book to be recorded. And with that I sort of, you know, just sort of have goals through the day and if we need more, then we Take more, and if we need less, we take less. But, you know, I've never. Other than just sort of my own daily goals of what I need to get done, because fonts are different and pages are different and, you know, book lengths are different and all that stuff. I've never actually sort of sat down and actually done the math of how long it takes me to do something. I know how long it takes me per project, you know, and I know that generally after a few hours, I get tired. But I also know that I'm a fast reader again, because we're sort of theater people, and by a good reader, that's sort of. Again, what I mean is just that we pick up text pretty quickly. And so, yeah, I sort of have never actually really done the math before, but I seem to always get it done. And isn't that the most important thing we gotta do?

[37:41] Rebecca: We start at chapter one, and we get all the way to the end.

[37:45] Gabi: Yes.

[37:46] Rebecca: Although we never really actually get to say the end. And it would be so satisfying.

[37:54] Marissa: I don't know, Joanne, at the end, when you're writing up a manuscript, do you type the end? Because I always type the end, even though it doesn't actually end up in the finished book. But I have to type the end.

[38:05] Joanne: Oh, never, never.

[38:07] Rebecca: You never. Isn't that so interesting?

[38:10] Joanne: Never.

[38:11] Marissa: That's funny. I have to. It doesn't feel completed if I don't.

[38:17] Joanne: So those are pretty long recording days. How do you save your voice?

[38:22] Gabi: Well, this is where our nice sort of theater and singing, you know, training comes from. I know it's not every single audiobook narrator that has a background in music and singing and sort of a more classical sort of theater background, but that certainly helps doing specifically musical theater, which is why I love that. That was sort of a big theme in the book. You know, I was like, I'm channeling. I'm channeling you, Aviva. Right. That. You know, when you. When you work in specifically theater and musical theater, you're doing usually eight musicals a week. Eight. Eight shows a week. And so being in this industry, I have learned to use my voice very efficiently. I. As I said before, I studied classical voice, and so it comes from my classical training, and it's something that I've been doing since I graduated school. And. And I also. I also. One of the other many, many freelance jobs that I have is I teach singing lessons. And so I'm sort of always practicing what I. Hopefully practicing what I preach a little bit, but just sort of the general things for Singing definitely applies for narration. Just making sure that you're extremely hydrated. Making sure that, you know, it's tough sometimes because these apartments in these cities are sometimes very dry. So it's important to make sure that, you know, in the night before that. I sleep with a good humidifier. I have a nice vocal steam or something like that, having the right liquids in my setup. And then. And then there are some little tricks, you know, like some people eat Granny Smith apples to take some of the saliva, that sort of sound out of your voice that starts to creep in later on in a record. And just, you know, making sure that if your voice starts to feel a little bit fatigued, that you are supporting your sound for singing from your core, you know, making sure that you're breathing properly and. And just being aware of your. If you're feeling physically tired, then your voice is probably going to be tired as well. So just being self aware, which is something that theater actors tend to do all the time anyway, certainly applies when you're narrating a really long book and have a long day.

[40:41] Rebecca: Yeah, I think I do all of those things. And what I also try to do from a technical perspective is. And it's why I do so much prep, is when I'm mapping out the various characters, I try to be kind in my vocal choices for the people that talk the most. So my narration, obviously, like the main protagonist, is generally the reason that Gabi or I will get the roles, because we sound closest to that person. Right. But also, you know, and this is just from trial and error and many years of doing this. Like, I will try not to have a choice where one of the characters is just. Just on their chords, low gravel, bleh. Like, where it's gonna kill me if I have to sustain it for hours on end, you know, and then sometimes that's what it takes. But if I know that ahead of time, I will make those vocal choices, but I won't try to project as much. I will have it be a softer but fiercer tone rather than a very aggressive, louder tone to protect the vocal cords, in addition to all of the herbs and spices that Gabi described in terms of our neurotic, like steaming preparation, Granny Smith apples, all of that stuff. Yes, I echo that.

[42:03] Gabi: I totally agree, though, that this is the. Maybe this you'll start to pick up on this, that the raspy voice kid is usually the friend of the protagonist and not the protagonist themselves.

[42:14] Rebecca: Correct. Unless you have that voice naturally. You know, I always joke, and in commercials, I am the Barbie Dream pool you can win. Like, that's me, right? And not L'Oreal lipstick. You know, can I, can I get it down? You know, if I have to do something like that, I actually do the opposite. The night before, I drink a glass of red wine. I don't. I don't vocalize, and I am as low and warm as I possibly can. And then I get just like Gabi did earlier. Like, I get inches away from my mic, and then I just don't project. But then the. Really, you mean, to be fair, like a woman whose voice naturally sits in that spot is going to get that role, you know, and should, you know, they, they have that warmth, they have that texture, they have that gravitas. But yeah, yeah, it's. It's the opposite. For, for all of this, the younger stuff, it's hydrate, hydrate, hydrate. Caffeinate, Caffeinate.

[43:16] Joanne: That's so fascinating.

[43:17] Marissa: No, it really is interesting. Honestly, I relate so hard to the idea of the Gravelly character because I, I just. Two days ago, so I read a lot of books out loud to my kids and we spent the whole day, six straight hours, where they just wanted me to read the Sherlock Society by James Ponte. And I read to them all day long while they were like crafting because they've got this Etsy store and they were crafting all day and it was like, one more chapter, mom. One more chapter. But there is like a grandpa character that I like, started reading with this like, old man gravelly voice. And man, did I regret that because he turned out to be like a really important character.

[43:58] Rebecca: Yeah.

[43:59] Joanne: Couldn't you just get them the audiobook, Marissa?

[44:02] Marissa: You know, that never crossed my mind. Jay, reading to the kids is like my number one mom pleasure.

[44:08] Rebecca: Yeah. I mean, that is amazing.

[44:12] Marissa: Yeah. But I'm not you. I'm not you. I clearly need to hydrate more. I learned that, that.

[44:18] Rebecca: Yeah, we. Well, now you know, so the next time you're. You're just gonna sort of flip a few pages ahead to understand just how, you know, present that character is. Before that, I kind of actually, on a personal note, I have a 4 year old daughter and, you know, she was born during COVID and we spent a lot of time locked in a New York apartment together. And so I started playing with her and each of her stuffed animals had, you know, a different voice. Right. Because what else are we doing? We're stuck inside. And then I realized, like one day that just bit me in the butt because apparently, like, I like brought out a bunny. Named Raul. And she was like, that's not Raul's voice. And I thought, oh, man, I don't remember Raul's voice.

[45:03] Gabi: What are they doing?

[45:04] Rebecca: The last time, it was just. I was like, why did I do it? I had all this time. There were hours and hours to kill. And I created an entire world. 50 stuffed animals. What is Raul's voice?

[45:16] Marissa: Oh, that's so funny.

[45:18] Rebecca: I digress. Sorry, guys.

[45:19] Marissa: No, I love it. The secret behind the scenes of Audiobook Narrating the one thing I really want to know as an author, I'm curious if you have any pet peeves. Things that writers do that you wish you wouldn't. We wouldn't do, or things that you wish that writers knew that could help you do a better job or things that could make your job easier.

[45:47] Rebecca: Oh, wow, that is really interesting. Well, I will say we get to catch a lot of. Because we say all of the words. I can always tell when an author has had a really strong editor help them in their process or they haven't because there will be repeated phrases over and over and over again or words that they use over and over and over again that maybe I'm the only person that will clock how frequently it's used or just certain descriptors like gold deflect eyes or steely ice blue eyes. I wish that that is what I would. The only thing that I would say is if there is another way other than gold flecked or icy steely blue to describe eyes. Because I will say across the board. But that has, you know, it doesn't impede my job. But I will say, like, is it something that I've seen a lot of in reading a ton of content? Yes, I will say that.

[46:54] Marissa: Okay. No, I think that's a great tip.

[46:57] Gabi: That's really interesting. I sort of haven't really ever thought about that. I mean the one like this is not a pep even a book. Because when you, when you, when you read it in your head versus reading it out loud, there are inherent differences. For example, when we, you know, usually lays throughout the book is a character will say something and it will be followed by my mother said or my grandmother said, or I said or I replied. You know, I guess in a perfect world of audiobooks, there's an audiobook version where. Or maybe those don't have to be included necessarily or it's just the characters can just speak back and forth and hopefully you've done a good enough job that with the character voices that you don't have to say I said, or I reply, you know, it's different if it's. I hesitated or something like that, you know, that informs how, you know. But I sort of, at least up to this point, I've sort of approached most audiobooks that I've narrated, kind of like a mini play. And so just sometimes those things that you are reading, because it is an audiobook versus a play, are maybe at some point, maybe in the future, there can be an audiobook edit so that it can read more theatrically than things that are maybe redundant when you're reading it out loud.

[48:29] Marissa: No, that picks up. Good point. Because I have wondered again, in reading books to my kids, I often will omit the dialogue tags because they don't. I'm. I'm reading it out loud. I'm doing the voices. They don't need those. Are you required to say every single word in the manuscript? Do you have any flexibility?

[48:49] Gabi: 99% of the. 99.9% of the time, we. We read every word.

[48:54] Rebecca: Yeah. And it depends. There's also, like Penguin Random House has something called Listing Library, which is. Has to be word perfect because it's also for being utilized by people who are visually impaired. So it really depends. Also, actually, the younger the listener, the more word perfect because oftentimes people listen along with the text. So we're. We're helping them learn how to read by reading along with them. And sometimes you get more liberties, you know, where it's. It's okay if there's something slightly different, but for the most part, I mean, and this is my feeling on it, you guys spend, you know, days, months, years working on this. I better say the words exactly as you read, though. I am not the writer. You guys are the writer. So what you say goes.

[49:45] Gabi: You know what was really fun to do and just sort of like this, it felt like dissecting the code a little bit was the sections of Let It Glow when we were exchanging texts.

[49:54] Rebecca: Yeah.

[49:55] Gabi: And we sort of had to read the text messages out loud to each other and making and saying things like smiley face emoji, which was not written out. The words smiley face emoji was not written in the book. But that was sort of what we decided was the most clear and the most, like how, you know, natural for how to read those parts out loud. So that was actually really fun every time sort of taking a. Figuring out what would work best for them, those sections.

[50:27] Joanne: That's so fascinating. And it's something that, as writers, you don't necessarily think about as you're Writing it is how it's going to translate into audio. I've noticed.

[50:38] Gabi: And that's not, that's not your goal, that's not your job, really, you know.

[50:42] Joanne: Yeah, but it's, it's just interesting to see how stuff like that plays out. And like some audiobooks I've listened to where even name names sound the same but on the page they're spelled completely differently. And I've actually started thinking about that as I'm writing. Like, okay, it looks completely different, but in my head and on audio, would it sound the same enough to change it?

[51:10] Gabi: You know?

[51:11] Marissa: Yeah, no, that's a good point.

[51:12] Rebecca: Yeah, that's super interesting.

[51:14] Gabi: Well, how many people pronounced the name Hermione before we all found out it was pronounced?

[51:20] Rebecca: I did, I did.

[51:25] Marissa: I also think it's interesting, the emoji conversation because when we wrote the book, we put in brackets, smiley face emoji, and then it gets emoji for the document and then you guys have to change it back.

[51:42] Rebecca: Yeah, it's really, it's funny because you know what? And it's such fun. Like the layout of this book is super fun. As a reader, I mean, I'm not saying don't listen to us. I think Gabi and I did a fantastic job. But I do think just sort of like the artistic layout of it is super fun. But even it's kind of like how do you address an all caps versus a normal versus like. And then do you say like BRB or you know, know, do you say be right back? Like you have to figure it out and just sort of pick a lane and sort of. While the sort of the gold standard of how to pronounce something is the Merriam Webster dictionary. It's kind of like known across narration world. There is no like kind of gold standard for texts.

[52:36] Gabi: Not yet.

[52:37] Marissa: Not yet.

[52:37] Rebecca: But there will be eventually.

[52:39] Gabi: But yeah, well, well, you know, something that also this is just making me think about. Sorry, it's a little bit of a tangent, but just because we are both, a lot of the times for these sort of long form audio narration books that we do that even though it's all in our voice, even if we are narrating and then speaking as ourselves out loud to a different character, there is narration voice and there is out loud voice which sometimes can be a little bit different. So even for example, it was the text conversation that was making me think of that, you know, how would I be tech, you know, what would be my voice when I'm texting? Texting, you know, like this as opposed to narrating thinking inside my head versus talking to out loud to a different character. So there's. So there's a lot of room for play and a lot of room for interpretation of what you guys have laid out so wonderfully. That allows us to really think about, okay, how would I just talk to myself versus talk to somebody else versus text versus talk to this person versus, you know, it's really, really fun to have all of these different elements when you have. When you're the sole voice of these POV chapters. It's really fun. And so especially to do those text convos were really, really fun to recommend record.

[54:03] Rebecca: Oh, you know what, Marissa? I just thought of one thing that you guys can't change at all. But it is the. The one area that we cannot do anything about as audiobook narrators, and that is, if you quote lyrics from a song.

[54:18] Marissa: Oh, we.

[54:20] Rebecca: We cannot sing them.

[54:22] Gabi: Ah, good point.

[54:24] Rebecca: Because we do not have the rights. So even I will never forget. Like, there was this one book that had, like, a substantial chunk from Bonnie Raitt's angel from Montgomery. And I was like, make me an angel that flies from Montgomery. Then I was like, oh, I'm speaking it in tempo. This is terrible. Like, I had to figure out how to get around it. Now, that being said, I've also done a book where. Where the author E. Lockhart, wrote a song. And then I reached out to her and I was like, does this have a melody? And she was like, no, make one up. And so I. I made up a melody and I sang it, but it was because it wasn't a real song. And she said, go for it, but song lyrics we just have to read.

[55:11] Marissa: Yeah, no, that's so interesting. And I'm thinking back to Instant Karma, which, of course, Rebecca, you did for me. And, like, the catalyst scene in that is Prudence singing karaoke and doing John Lennon's Instant Karma. And I haven't listened to it because I don't listen to my own books on audio, but I can imagine that that was probably pretty awkward.

[55:33] Rebecca: It was just like, are we sure? They're like, we do not have access to.

[55:37] Marissa: Oh, that's such a shame.

[55:40] Rebecca: I know, because it also. And I was like, well, can you embed it? Like, you know, obviously, you know, it doesn't have to be me, but, like, could they even, like, with sound design, you know, sometimes. But anyway, y. That was something that just was fresh in my memory.

[55:56] Marissa: Yeah. Yeah. Joanne, do you wanna talk about our song copyright history?

[56:02] Gabi: Oh, yes.

[56:02] Marissa: No, no, it's still a sore spot.

[56:06] Rebecca: Oh, poor Jenny.

[56:07] Gabi: I tried so hard.

[56:09] Marissa: Yeah. So for people who've read the book, toward the end of the book, the two characters Holly and Aviva perform at the holiday pack with this song that they have written called Let It Glow. And originally, Joanne and I had written it in the tune to Let It Go from Frozen. And we were so proud of this song and we just loved it. And then, Gabi, wasn't it you that recorded the song?

[56:37] Gabi: It definitely was before I was even associated with narrating the book.

[56:41] Marissa: Oh. And it was so good. It was beautiful. And we were so excited to use it in promotions for the book. And then Legal shot it down. Can't do that. That Disney will come after us with everything. The power of Disney. And so we had to change the lyrics and we were really, really sad about that.

[57:00] Joanne: But if anybody from Disney is listening and wants to purchase the movie rights. Yes, There you go. We could go back and Gabi's song could be in the movie.

[57:12] Marissa: So true. Dream big. Dream big.

[57:15] Gabi: I'm available for more recording.

[57:19] Marissa: So my last question before we move on to our short little bonus round. If someone is listening to this and they would love to do what you do, they think that narrating audiobooks sounds like the funnest thing in the world. How do I get paid to do that? What advice would you give them?

[57:38] Gabi: Okay, I guess I'll go first. I. So, okay, first things first. If you do have someone that knows a thing or two about any kind of audio, the audio world, audio tech world in your life and can even just point you in the direction of a decent microphone, this was something that a lot of people were doing during COVID a lot of. And there are some very affordable options for things that you can do that you can start experimenting with on your own for not that will not set you off too too much price wise. There are also a couple of databases online. There is one called Ahab that we use a lot where it is an online database where you can upload samples of yourself. You don't need representation to be on those databases. And sometimes publishers or even individual authors can go on and listen to samples on there and they can send you direct, direct messages from there. You know, this is where sort of the online and social media world is really useful that way where you can connect to people like that. Those are sort of some of the things that I would say just off the top of my head. Oh. Also I would say if specifically audiobook narrating is something that you're really interested in the next time you read a book or go back to one of your favorite books and read it out loud, read a section of it out loud, experiment with different characters and that's just the absolute best practice that you can use. And get that hopefully rather inexpensive mic and record yourself doing it and listen back to yourself and go from there. That would be my advice.

[59:35] Rebecca: I think all of us, well, unbelievably broad statement, but I say many of us, most of us have some sort of acting training and I think that's critical because you are bringing characters and worlds to life and that. So I've had many people that have like super interesting voices say I've been told to get in, I should get into voiceover. And they do have a very interesting voice, but that doesn't necessarily mean they would be the most compelling performer. So. So I think having some sort of acting training is very, very helpful to understanding how to build world. And then exactly what Gabi said. You know, despite the fact that my equipment betrayed me earlier tonight, for the most part, you know, a laptop, a decent mic and some soundproofing. But soundproofing can actually. I am sitting in my closet part of myself, soundproofing right now is my winter coat that I'm looking at to.

[01:00:36] Gabi: Be an old comforter for me.

[01:00:37] Rebecca: Yeah. And so I do have egg crates on my ceiling. I have, you know, and I. And having people that are editors listen to your setup and tell you, you know, do tests and say is this quote unquote broadcast quality until you get the setup really well. I have this panel that is 6ft tall. It I pull it out and open it up and it envelops me like a cocoon. And it just will allow you to be in a space that you know, when you do capture the brilliant performance that you will have that the quality will be good enough that they can use it because that's sort of the other thing. And I think just practice reading aloud as much as possible and actually, actually try to understand what your type is. Just sort of as I joked about being the Barbie Dream pool. Understand the types of voices that feel like they're in your wheelhouse so that you can go after appropriate material. For example, I'm not going to probably read any non fiction accounts of like the Spanish American War. Right. That's not the tone of voice like with my higher pitch register that I'll be hired for. Right. I tend to lean into fiction. YA and even younger, you know, early elementary books. So if you can understand kind of Tonally where you, you would be typecast, that's also helpful. And then there's another website, voices.com where there they have a platform for you to be able to upload your material. And I think to get super technical snippets should, if it's like a commercial voiceover, it should be a total of one minute and maybe, maybe five, six, seven different types of commercials within that one minute. If it's audiobook narration, I would do like 90 seconds and then label it like fast paced thriller or you know, coming of age story. So that if an author is looking because they've written a fast paced thriller for you know, someone of your vocal type, they can hear a style that is similar to what they would be looking for instead of imagining what this, you know, young adult person would sound like if they attempted their thriller.

[01:03:01] Gabi: And if you're, and if you're uploading snippets as well, try and in, in your little sort of excerpts, try and pick excerpts where you are voicing different characters or using different parts of your voice. Ideally you want sort of the most bang for your buck in that, you know, minute to 90 second clip because obviously, you know, people are just going to be listening to this really short amount of material and so you want to show them a full range of what you can do in a really short amount of time. And also listening to other audiobooks I would say is key as well because then you can, it's so valuable to listen to how other people voice voice books or voice, you know, a book that you may know already. How does somebody else interpret this and how is that different than how you would, is really informative for how you would go about narrating something new.

[01:03:53] Rebecca: Yeah, absolutely. And then unapologetically have a POV on the material that you are doing. Don't worry about being sort of benign like be bold, have an opinion, be the character. Because that is so much more interesting. You know, I, I always say that I'm cilantro and you either love me or I taste like soap. Right. But you like I am definitely fresh cilantro. So if you are making a pecan pie, yeah, I, I should not be a part of that recipe at all. But there might be some other things that like having that distinct POV will serve you for decades of your career than worrying about pleasing ever shape shifting yourself into every character. Bring yourself. That's what I would tell like young little Rebecca, just graduated, moved to the big city. Like trust the inner voice. Do that inner voice and it will take you farther than any time you attempt to try to be anybody else.

[01:04:59] Gabi: There's a line from a. From a really specific, really specific musical. And the line from one of the songs is, I'd rather be nine people's favorite thing than a hundred people's ninth favorite thing. And it's just. It's just one of my absolute favorites. And it's just, you know, exactly what Rebecca was saying. Zero into what makes you unique and do that.

[01:05:22] Marissa: I want to put that quote on my wall.

[01:05:24] Rebecca: Isn't it great?

[01:05:25] Marissa: It's a good reminder for writers, too. Like, don't try to please everyone.

[01:05:28] Gabi: Totally.

[01:05:29] Rebecca: You can't. You can't. And you'll find your people. And we, you know, just sort of, you know, just. We'll stalk you until you get the early copy and then ask, what's going on? I am you. And say, how could you? I mean, just theoretically not. Not that I've ever done that before.

[01:05:48] Marissa: Right. Yeah. Joanne, do you have any other questions you that we didn't get to?

[01:05:54] Joanne: Well, you got. My biggest one was how to get started in audiobook narration. But here's a teeny tiny one that we can add to the bonus round. I'm just curious if either of you have listened to. I guess it would be a rom com. Julia Whalen's. Thank you for listening. It's a fun book about an audiobook narrator, written by an audiobook narrator and then narrated by an audiobook narrator.

[01:06:18] Gabi: Oh, my gosh. I have not. But it's going on my list.

[01:06:22] Rebecca: I have not. But I love Julia. I think she's phenomenal. And if you are trying to get into vo, definitely listen to her because she's truly, truly magical as well. And another person that I would recommend listening to is my good friend Mark Thompson, who does all of the Star wars audiobooks. And so fun. He is just a savant when it comes to those voices. Like, it's incredible. And. Yeah. But I just literally jotted it down, Joanne, so that I will listen to that next. Thank you.

[01:06:56] Joanne: It is so fun, and she is just fantastic. I mean, she's just so good in it.

[01:07:02] Rebecca: Yeah, she's so great.

[01:07:05] Joanne: That's it. That's it for me.

[01:07:06] Marissa: Joanne, do you want the honor of asking our first official bonus round question?

[01:07:11] Joanne: Well, if you slipped me a note telling me what you wanted me to ask, I would. What book makes you happy? You know, it's not like I don't listen to the podcast.

[01:07:21] Gabi: I know.

[01:07:21] Marissa: Not like you haven't heard the last 212 episodes. I know, I know.

[01:07:26] Joanne: Ladies, what book makes you happy? Rebecca, you go first.

[01:07:29] Rebecca: Oh, my gosh, this is so tricky. Okay. The things that I have read multiple, multiple times that make, I don't know, like, I've read Memoirs of a Geisha by Arthur Golden. Yeah, like, a bunch of times. Jane Eyre is probably one of my favorite all time, all time, all time books. Anything by Margaret Atwood. My God, you mean. And I'm not naming any of the authors that I have narrated because I will not pick one of you. But. But I don't know. I'm a. I'm a very big rereader of books, so I love it. I love, love this world. I'm so grateful that I get to be a narrator and be adjacent to you writer types, because I desperately need you to expand my knowledge of what the world is.

[01:08:25] Gabi: That's a great answer. I was thinking about this question because I think, like, I was like, what book makes me happy? And that can be, you know, like, I'm like, is this my favorite book? I don't think it's my favorite book, but it just makes me happy, you know, because I was. I worked on a cruise ship early in my career, and this was, I think, around the time that this book came out, and I was sort of going through a little bit of a hard time. And reading Eat, Pray Love made me happy. It was my escape. I just. I, like, I found myself needing to read the chapters three times slower just so that I could extend my time, that I could live in this world when I was you know, just sort of having a great time and meeting wonderful people on the ship, but wanting, you know, this is a book about finding yourself through travel and love and all of this stuff. And it just. It was everything I needed at that specific moment in time. And I bawled when it was over. And I, like, you know, just so when I was really thinking about what book makes me happy, I think that that's. That's. That's the one I landed on.

[01:09:33] Marissa: Okay, and next time, for whatever shameless self promotion, what can you tell listeners about what you're working on or something that you have coming up?

[01:09:43] Rebecca: I cannot tell you anything about it, but I am deep in the heart of the third installment of the fourth Wing, you know, series by Rebecca Yarrows.

[01:09:54] Marissa: And everyone just squealed.

[01:09:56] Rebecca: And I will tell you that, like, my copy is watermarked. That's. And it says, this is Rebecca Soler's copy. I had to have special passcodes to be able to actually download it. To make edits onto it, you know, and to mark it up because they wanted to just have me have it only as read only. And I was like, I cannot do my job read only. I need to mark it up. So that is, I'm still doing like another round of, you know, quality control fixes and yeah, so that, that's, I'm thick in it. Thick in it right now.

[01:10:34] Gabi: Yeah. And I continue to sort of work freelance in theater and I'm in the middle of a few projects right now. But the one that I will shamelessly self promote is at the end of, at the end of December. So in about a month I'll be in a production of into the woods here in Toronto at one of my favorite halls, Kerner hall downtown with a full orchestra. I'll be playing the Baker's Wife in that. And other than that, I'm gonna shamelessly plug my website, gabiepstein.com and Instagram @ Gabi Faye Epstein on Instagram where I am very often shamelessly self promoting all of the things that I've got going on. If you do live in the Toronto area, as Marissa was saying before, I am a cabaret performer so I oftentimes do sort of one night concerts and cabarets around the city. One of my absolute favorite things to do because I get to combine singing and storytelling and so keep an eye on that for more.

[01:11:41] Marissa: Awesome. Rebecca, how about you? Where could readers track you down and follow you?

[01:11:46] Rebecca: So I'm at rebeccasoler.com RebeccasolerVO on insta and I am probably shuttling my daughter to and from Pre K in the West Village. No, I. Yeah, and I'm working on a lot of. Of voiceover for film and television and there is a really. I just will have a recommend which Jon Hamm is in a new series called Swipe that I've gotten to work on a number of episodes of and I think it's going to be really great and I think it's coming out. I think that's Apple TV and working on. Yeah, a few other more secretive projects that they will never hire me again if I say what I'm working on. But yeah, anyway, check it out and thank you Marissa and Joanne for getting down into the details.

[01:12:44] Marissa: Thank you. This has been such a joy. I have enjoyed listening to you guys. I definitely feel like I could talk to you for another two hours, but I won't keep you. I know we're all so busy, but this has been such a pleasure. Thank you so much for joining me and Joanne.

[01:13:00] Joanne: Yep, thank you so much. This has been fascinating behind the scenes look. And thank you for doing such a great job with Let It Glow. Thank you.

[01:13:08] Rebecca: It is a gem.

[01:13:10] Gabi: It's such a gem. And it was just nice because we recorded it in the summer and now that it's come up for holiday time, I'm like, it's per. It's just perfect. I just love that we can, you know, just on a. On a personal note, my husband is not Jewish, and so we celebrate Christmasakkah together. So this really felt like life imitating, you know, art imitating life and just getting to have a little token of something that feels really personal. So it was just a joy to record and it was. Thank you for having me and us today. Yes.

[01:13:41] Rebecca: This is so delicious. And we never get to speak to our authors. So truly a treat. Thank you. Thank you. Without your words, we literally don't have jobs. So thank you for being on your retreats and thank you for all the quiet time when you're alone and making up entire worlds that we just get to play around in.

[01:14:02] Marissa: I love that this is just like a big love fest. We all just love each other and admire each other so much and appreciate what we do. Readers, we hope that you will check out Let It Glow, including the incredible audiobook voiced by these two incredible, incredible narrators, along with all the other fabulous that they have narrated, which can be found wherever you get your audiobooks. Please don't forget to leave us a review and follow us on Instagram @happywriterpodcast and also check out our merchandise on Etsy. Until next time, stay inspired, keep writing and whatever life throws at you today. I hope that now you're feeling a little bit happier.