Inclusion and peer recovery in the workplace (w/ Dr. Masica Jordan-Alston)
Sep 27, 2023Season 3Episode 4
DeAnn Knighton
In this week's episode, we connect with Dr. Masica Jordan-Alston of Jordan Peer Recovery. Dr. Jordan-Alston and her team have worked systematically to create change through diversity, equity, inclusion, and accessibility for all, starting with peer recovery training and certification in every US state and internationally. She also has some powerful stories to share.
Gaps in inclusion both in research and human services: Lack of cultural diversity in delivering services while neglecting marginalized groups (LGBTQIA, black indigenous people of color, and people incarcerated)
Peer support is growing and expanding, with a focus on connecting individuals with similar experiences and creating systems of support within communities.
Pay it forward: Masica shares her personal experience with diabetes, including diagnosis and treatment, and how she overcame the initial shock and fear to live a full life. Much later in life she connects with a young girl at the beach who is also living with diabetes, and offers words of encouragement and support, highlighting the importance of sharing experiences and empowering others in recovery.
Culturally responsive practices in human services: avoid assumptions and ask individuals what works best for them.
Organizations should prioritize setting up internal peer groups to foster better marketing exposure, customer service experiences, and community engagement.
Grief and loss with a personal story: Masicashares her personal journey with grief and loss, including the death of her father, grandmother, godmother, and brother, and how she turned her lived experience into a resource for others. This work aims to provide a safe space for people to process their emotions and find support through her lived experiences with grief and through the experience of others
In this week's episode, we connect with Dr. Masica Jordan-Alston of Jordan Peer Recovery. Dr. Jordan-Alston and her team have worked systematically to create change through diversity, equity, inclusion, and accessibility for all, starting with peer recovery training and certification in every US state and internationally. She also has some powerful stories to share.
Gaps in inclusion both in research and human services: Lack of cultural diversity in delivering services while neglecting marginalized groups (LGBTQIA, black indigenous people of color, and people incarcerated)
Peer support is growing and expanding, with a focus on connecting individuals with similar experiences and creating systems of support within communities.
Pay it forward: Masica shares her personal experience with diabetes, including diagnosis and treatment, and how she overcame the initial shock and fear to live a full life. Much later in life she connects with a young girl at the beach who is also living with diabetes, and offers words of encouragement and support, highlighting the importance of sharing experiences and empowering others in recovery.
Culturally responsive practices in human services: avoid assumptions and ask individuals what works best for them.
Organizations should prioritize setting up internal peer groups to foster better marketing exposure, customer service experiences, and community engagement.
Grief and loss with a personal story: Masicashares her personal journey with grief and loss, including the death of her father, grandmother, godmother, and brother, and how she turned her lived experience into a resource for others. This work aims to provide a safe space for people to process their emotions and find support through her lived experiences with grief and through the experience of others
Oh hello. This is the sober positive workplace series brought to you by show up and stay. I'm your host Deann Knighton. In one of my world famous UNsponsored plugs, I want to talk about a conversation I heard on the flourishing after addiction podcast, which is hosted by Dr. Carl Eric Fisher, who was a guest on this show, he was speaking with Dr. John Kelly. He is the first Endowed Professor in addiction medicine at Harvard. And he is also the founder and director of the recovery Research Institute at Mass General Hospital. And this conversation touched on a very important area of interest for me and for our mission at show up and say, to look at the recovery gap, and that space after acute treatment, where you've begun the process of healing from the substance to all of the pieces of the puzzle that are needed for long term recovery. When you hear discussion about recovery treatment, it really is two buckets that operate very differently. Research supports that essentially the 12 week model that we have in place in our existing healthcare system for encouraging early remission, helping someone through the first stages of withdrawal, potentially, and hopefully setting them on the stage for long term recovery. That represents about 95% of the standard treatments that are available for recovery. However, there are many significant landmarks in the process of long term recovery and sustaining long term recovery. And hopefully avoiding relapse mutual help groups like AAA and 12 Step programs have really been the go to for a good part of history. Those groups grew out of necessity, because the services that were needed to support individuals didn't exist. It's a story we hear time and time again. And although it can sometimes feel very disappointing, what happens is that these grassroot movements come out of the woodwork. Moving over to today's conversation, I wanted to have a guest that could speak to both the importance of considering how we apply the right amount of cultural sensitivity to the issue of recovery from substances and other traumas, but also someone who could speak to the importance of having safe networks, not only in our community services, but within our organizations. I needed someone with some hands on experience to help us understand some of the building blocks that would be needed for an individual or group looking to build up a peer driven safe network within their organization. This is Dr. Masika, Jordan, Austin and I, in my mind, think I'm 21. So I won't give you a year I was born. My father when I was born. He was a blue collar worker was sheet metals and the union. My mother and father. They lasted for years after I was born and got a divorce. My mother as she was a police officer, my father had some injuries. So he would use drugs. And he had some background to every single one of his siblings had a substance use disorder disorder, the funny words to call somebody that's struggling to live, they had these experiences. My father's father was a war vet and was addicted to alcohol. I remember him making moonshine in his bedroom that he would drink like tea every day, all day. And I love them all. But my father had double digit siblings, every last one of them had a substance use experience. One of them committed suicide when I was in high school. My father wants to die a slow death over a decade because he was diagnosed with pancreatitis and 10 years later, he died as his power of attorney navigating I remember showing up at a hospital room, middle of the night, nobody announces him. So I didn't, as Dr. Jordan Austin in the middle of an ER at nighttime, right? Like I just show up as a daughter. And I'm not saying credentials, etc. Because I'm not working in that capacity. I say my father's power of attorney, my name is messika because I would have pink sweat suits or whatever, in my hair in a ponytail. And they would give me the look of disgust is what I felt like because they got that I wasn't worthy, and my father wasn't worthy of better treatment. And so there were days that I had to say, I'm Dr. Jordan, and then automatically I would get a difference in their reaction. And I would speak their language and I would say I need this, this, this and this and the moment I showed up in a professional credential. I got the treatment I deserved, but it shouldn't have to be because not everyone shows up like that.
DeAnn Knighton:
I couldn't begin to read this bio to you today. But I am going to read a bit of it just to give you some insight into her amazingly rich background, not Drosten completed at all. Doctorate of Education and Counseling and Psychology in 2010. She is a Licensed Clinical Professional Counselor, a certified peer recovery specialist. She has many great accomplishments to know CNNs Lisa Lange interviewed her on her work to promote entrepreneurship and marginalized communities. You may have also seen her work featured in the 2010 documentary film Waiting for Superman. Dr. Jordan Olson is an example of one of those individuals I mentioned at the beginning, who saw holes in our system, and did the best that she could to try and fill them. In addition to her work as a tenured professor, she is the founder of Jordan peer recovery, as well as peer affinity LLC, which she'll talk a little bit about on this episode. She has assisted over 50 agencies in three countries in developing various clinical, culturally responsive trauma responsive and evidence based programs, including peer support programs,
Dr. Masica Jordan-Alston:
I'll start with an overview of the work that we are doing, I say we because I feel like I've built an army, there was a statement that there used to be a war on drugs, and it's not a war on drugs. But it does take an army to create change. And that's what we're doing systematically. Our focus is on diversity, equity, inclusion and accessibility for all so that all people can experience recovery, the way that we have done that, and the way we started doing that was through peer recovery training, just by definition for people that may be listening that do not know what a peer recovery specialist is, or a certified peer recovery specialist is in different states are called different things. If you go to New York, there's a title for it go to Northlanders. The title for nonetheless, we are in Georgia recovery is in every US state. So we did the work of getting approved through each certification board. Now, the technical side of this means the same way that a certified nursing assistant goes and gets trained and certified peer recovery specialist goes and gets trained along with their lived experiences, they're able to sit through an examination in our state or either at the national level that training was existing before we started, but what I would go into rooms and figured out was that their training was happening. But there was a lack of cultural diversity in delivering the services. So if you happen to not be a middle aged heterosexual white male that's in recovery, then some of the services may not have been written or developed for you. Now, that's not a slight against a middle aged heterosexual white male, they need services to anybody that is struggling or trying to recover from the substance use experience, they need support, but where the market and the industry of human services had done a great job in helping one particular type of person, they had not done so well, in terms of LGBTQIA. Plus, in terms of black indigenous people of color, it's bypass in terms of Latin x in terms of people that have been incarcerated, it wasn't done as well.
DeAnn Knighton:
When you hear the word peer support, or peer recovery, it typically does mean that there's been some sort of certification put in place for that individual to reach back to people at earlier stages within a crisis and support them through that. It doesn't have to mean that though. And many times that work is done without certification attached to it. This type of support is something that we see in Community Medicine and Human Services. But the idea and the concept is growing and expanding and is applicable to essentially any group of humans that wants to create some sort of system within that group to be able to support the needs of those struggling with substance use disorder or maintaining long term recovery.
Dr. Masica Jordan-Alston:
With Jordan peer recovery has done today is set up a nationally approved and now international peer recovery training so that individuals like myself, like my father, whether you have direct experience or lived experience can navigate the world of substance use experiences and connect with somebody that has a similar experience or similar story to yours. But we realized that some of the systems were not ready. And I'm not naming any specific hospital as the system was not ready. But they wanted to hire individuals with lived experiences, but they didn't have the structure in place to adequately supervise support etc. We started building infrastructure, whether it was fidelity measurement tools, we started to create accreditation standards so that there was quality and the work they would have this list of digital tools that we enable them with, we even created something with recovery on demand. So you could go through our peer affinity platform and log in and you can type you know how you doing check GPT where you can type in a topic before check GPT we created a system where you could go in and you can type depression or just lost my brother and in that topic, you will hear from recorded video peer recovery specialist and coaches telling you how they navigated without relapsing I got diagnosed with diabetes when I was 1010 years old. I show up in an era with my mom, I remember this lady who drew my blood. She said, I'm a diabetic. I've had diabetes since I was a teenager. And she said, I live a great life. Your blood sugar is really high, the doctor is going to talk to you, but I want you to not be scared. And I trusted this lady. I didn't know her from Adam's Eve, but I knew she knew whatever it is that I was going to hear. She knew about it already. So I walk into the office with the doctor, my mom sitting there, I've never seen my mother and pride day in her life. She looks concerned, but I can't discern it. But I hear the doctor saying, if you wouldn't have brought her in here, she would have died in three days. That's why I'm in a why can I see this little girl now the technology has advanced and I'm grateful for whoever created all this text to treat diabetics, right. I have something that's in my arm that has a sensor and also where insulin pump. And so I saw this little girl at the beach with her family and she looked like she was about my age when I was diagnosed. And I walked up to her and I said, Hey, I said Dexcom her parents get me because I would walk up to the child and start talking. She could see my arm. I said, Yeah, I've had this since I was 10. No, she was fine. Don't remember being a 10 year old. Then I remember my mother's face. And then her mom, he was like, were you able to have kids? I said, Yeah, I got three. She said Was it difficult for you get pregnant? Absolutely not. She's there. How's your health and I'm not offended at all. I'm there to serve because my heart opened up to her because I remember what it was like. You can put that same experience on top of anybody that has a lived experience was recovery and recovery from anything recovery from more recovery from addiction. And when you get to share how you overcame and how you survived not only empowers you, but it reaches back to the person who's scared. He was tearing up and I was like, It's okay, your daughter is gonna be fine. She's gonna be absolutely okay. We'll be right back. sober, positive workplace division of show up and stay is a nonprofit on a mission to help organizations bridge the recovery gap, a space that exists for individuals, between healing from a substance and healing their lives. We partner with organizations to build more inclusive environments that reflect an investment in sober positivity and awareness. These organizations are normalized errs, pushing back against stigma and doing their part to change the social consciousness. For more information, please visit our website at Silver positive workplace.org. Now back to the show. We in the world of Human Services and pay recovering golf and Human Services, you're not a clinician, but you still fall under the scope of Human Services, we have never been a one size fits all model. So a lot of times we'll go through these things that we call evidence based practices, we'll go to these EBPs. And we'll say well, this treats depression. This is the best ebp for someone that is struggling with addiction. The problem with that is the research that has been used to get us to that statement has not included a culturally responsive lens. The problem is when you have an oversaturation of one population, unless you state that that EVP is just for that population, then it's misapplied research, I run I run every morning. And if I go running outside, and I'm doing a couple of miles, my shoe size is an eight and women's, if you gave me a size nine shoe and you say I know it doesn't fit you, but we're gonna stuff tissue in the front of it and then let you run. I can't run it my full pace. It's not because the population cannot do well. And recovery is just that we put SAS tennis shoes and stuff tissue in the front. It is a challenge, though to say when you're working with someone don't start with the EVP that was a question that question is what works for you. I want to build a clinical report. If I'm a clinician, if I'm a peer, I want to build a relationship. Whatever report I'm trying to build with you, I can't build it on a notion that I know what works for you. We do family based treatments. And we've asked people to bring in their mom, their dad. But what if I got two moms, one of my best friends she grew up in the foster care system. When she got married. Her father had already passed and her mother passed when she was a child, but she had three women walk her down out. So we have to ask and not assume that we know what's best for people and that's called being culturally responsive.
DeAnn Knighton:
If you've been following the show, one of the things we've talked about is Salesforce and their creation of an internal peer group that grew somewhat organically. I wanted to get Dr. Jordan-Alston's suggestions on how an organization would get started setting up an internal peer group of this type.
Dr. Masica Jordan-Alston:
Yes, it is something that every organization should do and every organization should build into their budget to do. Regardless of what field you're in. What data says is that if you can globally know the EIA, you're going to have better marketing exposures, you'll have better customer service experiences, you'll have more returned and loyal customers, you'll have more community engagement. Overall, it's a business metrics. So the same way that we look at revenue as a key performance indicator, and a lot of businesses, you also have to look at DNI, as as a key performance indicator in any business if you want it to be sustained. I have another group to really focus on the EIA work, and it's called the equal people project, we have worked with a number of organizations, and we develop this plan for them that they can implement immediately. And when they implement the plan, we are there to coach them along the way. And part of that coaching is for them to establish a community advisory group, there should be people in your advisory group that has a real stake in your community and in the clients that you serve, allowed them to be a part and have a voice and I mean, Abro, meaningful seat at the table, create a table and create a seat at that table for them. You would start with assessing who you're serving, not every organization is by definition of service entity. When you mentioned Salesforce, you still serve your employees. And if you don't serve your employees, you're not going to hit yourself. And if there's any way anybody within recovery story can tell you this, sometimes addiction can get in the way of them being successful in their roles. There's accreditation, we actually offer it, it's called Jump and it's Jordan universal measures and practices, you would start with the the organizational Foundation. And I say organizational Foundation, because if you start something and you don't have the right foundations in place, then even though you mean well, you won't end well. A lot of times, unless you just have the internal capacity to do it, you might have to outsource some of that to get the foundation in place. But once that foundation is in place, you start to build your own peer treatment team, you can get people on the job and get them certified as peer recovery coaches, and then you know, create a community inside of your organization. And even if you didn't go all the way of getting them certified, you certainly can at least create a support group. And whether that's virtual or in person or hybrid combination, it's good to start again with the right foundation. But once that foundation is in place, I feel like that's something that can be self sustaining by most organizations. Our website is literally www that Jordan pepper company.com. We also have a couple of other grant related programs that entities that want to get people certified, they can either a become a community partner of ours, if it's community, or than when we have grants and things of that nature that we're using funding, they don't have to pay out of pocket for that they can just come in as a community partner and be included in the work that we're proposing to whatever the entity is that we're getting funding from.
DeAnn Knighton:
A big thank you to Dr. Jordan-Alston for the time she offered us, I asked her to close us up by sharing information about a project that is near and dear to her heart. This is the work she is doing related to grief.
Dr. Masica Jordan-Alston:
I do work in that space because of my own lived experience. So I approach it from the pit of recovery. My father died in 2018. My grandmother who was a third parent to me died in 2020. And then in 2021, my god mother died. And then two months later, my brother died. And then within 12 hours, my grandfather died. And at the end of that I wanted to drink. So I'm a person with the lived experience as well. I want it to drink and I never picked up the battle. I started documenting my experiences and saying, Okay, I was angry, I went through all of the different emotions that people go through and grief and loss. And I wanted to know how to navigate this as a trained clinician. And as a peer recovery coach, I found that a lot of the stuff that was out there at work some but it wasn't what I needed in the moment, I was going to crisis, and I needed some girls help. And so I started documenting my journey from email and I remember a friend of mine her mom died a few months after my brother died. And I got into the parking lot thinking I was going to be able to support her. And I hyperventilated in the parking lot could not breathe. And I said, Oh, this is Something's gotta give. And so I documented all of that me videos and all that started walking people through I cried out loud and gave permission for people to cry. And so I started recording crying sessions and I would say all right, but I'm not to go running, go running with me. I'll put all of that on demand and an animal in the barn and but I started documenting other people's lived experiences For more information, please visit our website, sober positive workplace dot for show up and stay.org This podcast is written Created and produced by me DM featuring music from the wickedly talented At hair