Girl Means Business

257: Are The Days Of High Priced In-Depth Courses Over?

• Kendra Swalls • Episode 253

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Are large-scale, big-ticket online courses a thing of the past? As a seasoned photographer and business coach, I've ridden the waves of creating my own courses and have come to question their efficacy.  I debate whether these digital behemoths deliver the expertise they claim, or if we're witnessing the rise of a new era of learning—more focused, less costly, and far better at keeping students afloat.

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Speaker 1:

Hey there and welcome to the Girl Means Business podcast, the show where we're all about helping you feel confident, both as a mom and a business owner. I'm your host, kendra Swalls, mom of two, former teacher and full-time photographer and business coach. Each week, we'll discuss the challenges, success and secrets that make you say I can do this, because you absolutely can. So pop in those earbuds, grab your favorite snack and let's dive in, because this girl means business. Hey there and welcome to the Girl Means Business Podcast. Spicy take edition. In case you didn't notice by the title of this week's episode, I've got some hot takes and we're going to talk all about it today. When we're diving into the idea of are courses dead to me, because I kind of feel like they might be? Let's talk about it. Okay, a few weeks ago well, actually, the time this comes out this will have been like maybe I don't know two months prior to this recording I have been kind of dabbling over on Instagram threads not really to the point where I'm going to like say, you need to be on threads, but it's a fun place to hang out sometimes and go see what people are talking about, and one of the people I follow over on. There is actually a friend of the podcast, jessica Stansberry. She has been on the podcast. I love her content. I love following her on social media and she's got great content for creators. She posted on threads back in March and I was like, yes, girl, I feel you, I hear you, like this is all the things I'm feeling too. This is what she said. I said I'm kind of overselling big strategic courses. Nobody finishes them, very few actually implement and selling them feels like pulling teeth. I'm all for selling very. I'm all for selling small, very tactical courses. Think a whole course teaching you how to grow and scale on YouTube big course versus how to edit with iMovie small tactical course. If you're a course creator, how are you doing out there? So this got me thinking because I was like okay, I feel this and I would like to talk about this, so let's talk about it.

Speaker 1:

Courses I, for a long time, have been on the fence when it comes to my feelings about courses as an educator, as a course creator who has created courses in the past. To sell it is one of those things where it's kind of the go-to way to dip your toe into education and I have even said on here when it comes to like passive income and income streams like courses are a great way to, you know, get your information out there in a concise way to your audience and, because they've been around for so long, they're kind of this tried and true staple in the world of education. So if you're someone who is like thinking about crossing over into educator role and you're like, hey, I, you know, I like the idea of diving into starting to teach people, um, I don't know like really what I want to do yet. So, of course, seems like an easy way. You create it one time, you add the content and then you sell it kind of as an evergreen option. It's good for that. However, the spicy take here is that I am just I'm over it. I'm I'm kind of over the idea of courses. I'm over the the cost of some of these programs and courses. I'm just kind of over it and I want to talk about why and I want to talk about what I'm leaning into going forward.

Speaker 1:

So my experience, my personal journey with courses, looks a little something like this when I started running my photography business and I was like I don't know what I'm doing, I don't know how to take good photos, like I need to learn all the things. Courses were the way to do that. There wasn't a ton of free content. There wasn't really like YouTube was around, but it was more like I don't know. It was not where you went at the time to find kind of information and content around what I was looking for. And, you know, facebook groups weren't really a thing, it was just there wasn't a whole lot out there, and so courses were kind of the thing people were leaning into, and so I bought into several courses on, you know, editing and shooting styles and how to use manual mode on your camera. In fact, I think that was one of the very first courses I ever purchased was like how to start shooting in manual on your digital camera, and it taught me how to do all those things. And there are still pieces from that course that I find myself like falling back to. When I go into you know, photo sessions, I'm adjusting my settings like, oh yeah, exposure triangle, all the things, and so for that purpose they've been great.

Speaker 1:

The problem I got into with courses and where I've kind of gone off the rails of like I'm done, is that, well, okay, a couple of things I'm like trying to organize my thoughts on, like, how do I want to approach this and what order? So, first and foremost, I feel like the price point for some of these courses has really become astronomical. I have seen people selling courses for thousands of dollars and I'm like, okay, I get that you have all of this expertise behind you, but asking people to pay two to $5,000 for a course that they're not even going to really get support from you on seems a little bit ridiculous, and I'm not like trying to call people out here, but there are some big name people in the education, the marketing, the business space that are charging thousands of dollars for courses which I have bought into some of these courses. You guys, I had the amount of money I've spent on some courses would blow your mind and I found that it was not information, that was this gold mine I was expecting for the price point, and that's really frustrating.

Speaker 1:

It's frustrating as a consumer who's like I am saving my money. As a consumer who's like I am saving my money. I am putting this on a credit card. I have like set aside my hard earned money to pay for this course that you are telling me is going to be a life changer for my myself, my business, whatever. And then I get into it and I'm like, well, like it's just not, it doesn't live up to the hype. And maybe it's me. Maybe I'm like, well, like it's just not, it doesn't live up to the hype. And maybe it's me, maybe I'm you know, just, I'm looking for something in the wrong places. Maybe, you know, there's a lot of things that could go factors you'd be talking about in this case of like, well, maybe I, you know, should have been looking for something different.

Speaker 1:

But ultimately there are a lot of people buying into these high ticket courses and then not getting the results they're looking for, and it just feels icky. It feels like the people who are selling these courses at this higher price are benefiting off of those of us who are so desperately looking for the thing that they are promising that they don't even necessarily care that we're not getting that thing as an end result. And there are probably people who do get that thing, otherwise they wouldn't keep selling it. But the majority of people I have personally talked to or that I have seen sharing their thoughts on this online lately are of the school of thought that these high ticket, general kind of broad topic courses are just not hitting the mark anymore, and so the other thing that's really frustrating for me, that I have again experienced in my business, is that I will buy into these courses and then I never actually do anything with them because there's no support system in place to help me go through the content or to help me implement the content.

Speaker 1:

I think about it as a teacher and I come at this from a kind of a teacher perspective maybe, in the fact that when I'm in the classroom, if I teach my students a lesson, if I stand at the front of the room and I say, okay, no questions, you just, you just listen. You don't get to interact, you don't get to engage, you're just going to consume my words and what I'm telling you and then you're going to take it and do your own thing with it. So if I were to stand in front of my class for 30 to 45 minutes and just spew information and then look at them and go, okay, now take everything I just told you and go put it into practice on your own. I'm not going to help you, not going to answer questions, you go do it on your own I would not have survived in the classroom, my kids would not have performed well in that classroom, I would be out of a job, I would have parents complaining, I would have administration all over me, I would have other teachers looking down on me, because that's not how people learn, that is not how our students learn. So in the classroom.

Speaker 1:

The way that classrooms work successfully is if it is a conversation style teaching strategy, if I get in front of my students and I say, okay, we're going to have a conversation about multiplication today, I'm going to teach you how to do two digit multiplication and we're going to walk through this. But as we go, you are going to have opportunities to try out these strategies, ask for feedback, get your questions answered. You're going to have someone guiding you through the process. So we're going to do step one. Step one is you take your two numbers. You stack them on top of each other. Step two is you start with you know the right side number. You multiply it, times both numbers on top. So you multiply it by the right number, you multiply the left number and you get your answer. Okay, you take your problem and you do the same thing with your numbers now. Okay, now. Do you have questions for me? Did you struggle with this? Let's see if you made a mistake somewhere that we can correct before we get too far into the process.

Speaker 1:

That is how good teaching works. It's an interactive journey. It's not just sorry, my dog just barked. It's an interactive journey. It's not about me lecturing at you and then hoping you understand it enough to do it on your own. That rarely happens.

Speaker 1:

And yet that is what all of these courses are doing. Is it is saying I'm going to stand up here, I'm going to give you all the steps in one teaching lesson and then I'm going to assume you understood everything I just said and you can go now implement it in your own business? The likelihood of that actually happening is probably very, very low. And then you add on top of that the fact that most of the time, these courses sit inside of your files or in your inbox or on the platform, and I think the statistic is like only I think 45% of most courses get completed, and maybe closer to 60. I can't remember, but it's a pretty low amount. And when you think about the fact that you, as a course creator, have just poured all of this time and energy into these products, into your course, and people are not even finishing half the program. Like that's disheartening and that's been a struggle that I've had personally when I've created courses is. It bothers me to no end that I've created this course, that someone has invested money to buy the course and then they don't even complete it.

Speaker 1:

And now, like I'm like, well, what do I do? Like is it? Is it the content? Is it me? Did I do something wrong? Not no, I didn't do anything wrong. I just did not have all the pieces that that person needed to be successful in place. And so, for that reason, I have been on this like mental journey of like okay, well, if it's not courses, then what is it? Because one of the things, okay, again, I'm just kind of and I feel like there's a better way to do this and I feel like I want us to be on the same page that there's a better way to do this. So when I started building out my signature course, which is the inbox, insider email marketing program, it is my what I call my signature course, because it teaches sort of the foundational marketing strategy, which is email marketing, that I fully believe every business owner needs to have in place in their business.

Speaker 1:

And again, when I was building out this idea, courses were the end all be all. It was like you create a course, you sell a course. It's an evergreen sales process, sales funnel. You don't have to do live launches if you don't want to. You don't have to like come up with something new all the time, like you just create it, kind of set it and forget it. And at the time that sounded really appealing. I was like, yeah, that's great, I create this thing, I put it out there and I sell it on repeat. Let's do it.

Speaker 1:

But again the teacher in me was like, oh, but I want to help them find success with this. To help them find success with this and by me creating this course and just putting it out there and going, okay, good luck, I hope you find what you need and I walk away. That was hard for me. So the whole time I was creating this course I'm thinking, okay, how can I add in more tangible things? How can I add in support? How can I add in like checkpoints? How can I add in things that are going to make this an implementation of an implementable that's a word program, because I want you to go through it, start to finish, implement it and find success with it. But what I found was that very few people were actually going through the entire course and even fewer were actually seeing results from implementing it, because they didn't have the support they needed, and that did not sit well with me, so I kind of pulled back, I stopped promoting it, I stopped marketing the course. I was like until I figure out how to make this actually work. This is in it and I've got to figure out what that is. So I'm just going to kind of like put push pause on this thing for right now.

Speaker 1:

So I've spent the last year like really looking at okay, what is it that I want to do and how can I do it in a scalable way? Because ultimately, yes, one-on-one coaching is awesome and I love one-on-one coaching. I love the intensity of it, I love the connection that you get and I love that you get to. I get to be in your business, with you, I get to help you from the inside out, whereas with courses, I'm kind of like on the outside, just sort of like waving at you inside the window, going good luck while you're doing all the work, and so I love that, but one-on-one coaching is not scalable. I only have so many hours in my day that I can devote to one-on-one clients, and so I was like there's gotta be something in between. And so I was like there's got to be something in between.

Speaker 1:

And one-on-one coaching is not cheap because you are getting someone who comes into your business with you. You are getting someone who's giving you a ton of time and attention. That comes with a pretty hefty price tag. And if you are new to business or you have left a nine to five and you're starting your business to have income, you don't always have that kind of money to invest, just like you're not going to have two or three or four grand to invest in a course. So what's the alternative option here?

Speaker 1:

So this is where I found myself a year ago. I was like, okay, I want to be able to create content that people benefit from. I want to create content that people will consume and actually do something with, and I want there to be support. I want there to be this feeling of like I'm not in this on my own. This is something. We're all going on this journey together, and if I have questions or if I need something, then there's someone there I can turn to. Or if I get into this and I go, oh, I really would, it would benefit me to have this tool or this as a template, or you know this explained in a different way, then I could provide that for that person without it having to be a one-on-one type thing. That is where I found myself a year ago and that is when I decided that the new way that I was going to be able to provide this and I think I'm not alone in this feeling, I think there's a lot of people out there who are doing the same thing um is through memberships.

Speaker 1:

Here's the thing with memberships and here is why, if you are listening to this this is not just me telling you like this is what's happening in my head. I'm selling something to you. If you are listening to this, either as a content creator and going, yeah, courses are not working for me, either, like I'm not able to sell my courses the way I want to, or I've created courses and I'm not happy with how they're turning out, then this is for you. And if you're someone who has bought into courses and felt disappointed, let down, frustrated, or like you didn't get your money's worth. This is for you as well, because this can help you figure out what it is that you actually need to help you grow your business at a more affordable price point and in a way that's a little bit more implementationable. Again, these are words I'm making up. I think. I don't think implementationable is actually a word, but we're going to roll with it.

Speaker 1:

So, memberships here is why I feel like the future of online education is a membership format, and I know that this is not a brand new light bulb revelation. Memberships have been around for a while. Obviously, they work for places like Netflix. You know. There's tons of memberships with like food shipments, holofresh, all that kind of stuff. Those are all memberships. Gyms are memberships. This is not a brand new concept.

Speaker 1:

However, in the world of online education, I'm not seeing people moving towards that as quickly as they did the courses, and I think there's some reasons why, but I want to first start with why I think this is the better alternative to using courses as a way to educate ourselves and our business. One is they can be a lot more cost effective. So if I came to you and I said okay, you can either spend $2,000 on this course and then you're on your own, it's yours, you take it, you run with it, or you can come spend 40, 50, $60 a month with me for as long as you want. You get the content, you get the content, you get the support. You get the implementation aspect of it, where you get help with implementation, and then you can leave when you're done. Or maybe it's a 12 month commitment, but either way it it creates more value for you and it's a little bit easier on our pocketbook, because we're not like, oh my gosh, I got to hand over $2,000 for this thing that I don't even know is going to be worth my time or my money. Or I can invest a little bit each month and even if it's a 12 month or six month or 12 month commitment, I know that there's an end result, I know there's an end game, or I can opt out whenever I want to, and so it makes it a little bit more palatable when it comes to our financial investment. And then the other aspect that I think is so powerful with memberships is that you have the support system, and I cannot stress enough that I really honestly believe the difference between education of the past and education of the future is support.

Speaker 1:

People want to have the support that they need in order to make something work for them, because there is no one size fits all, and that is what these courses are doing is, they are saying here's the one size fits all, and you have to figure out how to make it fit for you, and if it doesn't fit for you, then there's something wrong with you. That's not the case, though, guys. There is no such thing as one size fits all, or even one size fits most. When it comes to building a business. It's very much a custom journey. It's a personal journey of what is working for you, what's working for you now, what fits best with your audience, your business, your brand, your service, your product. There's so many factors that go into that, and so, when you take a course that is a one size fits all or one size fits most, versus a membership that is more personalized, a little more customizable, the membership wins out every single time.

Speaker 1:

In my book, the other thing about memberships that I feel like are a little bit more long like lasting, I guess, or have more lasting staying power. Staying power that's what I'm looking for is the fact that they are not so much a fire hose of information as more of like a steady flow of information. So another problem I've always had with courses is that I have seen these courses that get advertised or, like you know, people will consume all of the content in one sitting or in two days or in one weekend, and then they have the rest of the time to implement the things they've learned. Guys, that's a lot to take in at one time and, like the example I gave with the classroom situation, if I stand at the front of the classroom and I give you all eight steps to solving a two you know, two digit multiplication problem, the likelihood that you're going to actually remember all eight steps and remember exactly how to do them properly is slim, whereas if I go, step one, now you try it. Step two now you try it. Step three, now you try it. That is more sustainable and you're going to get better results. That way, you're going to get better lasting results, and that's what memberships do. It's not the fire hose of information and then you walk away drenched, going what the heck just happened? It is a slow, steady stream of information going. Okay, here's step one. Now take some time to figure out how to implement your business. Step two now take some time to implement that into your business. That is what's going to help you find more success than if you just kind of take this fire hose of information.

Speaker 1:

So what's the purpose of this episode? Well, it's twofold. One I felt like it was important for me to share kind of the thoughts that I've been having around the state of online education as a whole, because I do think that there are still people and again, if you're someone who is a content creator or a business owner who has thought about or has implemented courses in your business, and you are feeling the frustration and you're or you're like, is this the right thing for me to create? Feeling the frustration and you're or you're like, is this the right thing for me to create? Yes, there is a place for courses out there.

Speaker 1:

I think, going back to what Jessica said in her post about gone are the days where these big, broad, overarching courses and programs are going to be effective, and if you're wanting to do more courses, I think it needs to be strategic, one singular, focused strategy. You know she gave the example. Instead of saying, like how to grow on YouTube, it needs to be how to edit a film on iMovie, and then the next course you create could be a smaller strategy of like how to optimize your YouTube videos with SEO keywords and I'm using that as an example because that's what she teaches is you know YouTube and content and things like that. But I think gone are the days where you can create this broad general course with 10 topics and hope that people consume it and implement it. Well, the future is going to be memberships small, strategic mini courses and bite-sized pieces of content that people can consume and implement right away. That is my prediction.

Speaker 1:

That is the trend that I'm seeing, and so if you are either a creator, that's the direction you need to go, or if you're a consumer, those are the things I think you need to be looking for. I think if you are someone who's, like I, really want to learn how to better edit my photos instead of buying an entire Lightroom or Photoshop course, I would look into. Is there someone that offers a membership where I can like learn little pieces at a time? Is there someone that's offering small, bite-sized mini courses of how to do specific things inside of those programs Like? Those are the things I want you to be looking for, as opposed to these big, high ticket items that you may or might not actually complete, or my not actually complete.

Speaker 1:

The last thing I want to say before we wrap up this episode is that if you are someone specifically in the photography industry and you are looking for a program or a membership where you can get the support that you want for your business to help you grow, to help you get more clients, to help you put in place some marketing strategies that will work for you, I would love for you to take a second to click down in the show notes and check out the membership options I have available for you inside of either the Focus Photographer Lab or a couple other membership ideas that I have kind of in the works that are coming up that you can access as well. And if you are a content creator or you are a business owner who is wanting to add memberships or small mini courses to your suite or to your product suites things that you offer and you're wanting maybe some insight or any information on that, you can also go down to the show notes and check out my resources that will help you, that have helped me. That, I think, will help you to decide which type of program is best for your audience and for the content that you want to share. All right guys. Thank you so much for being here, for listening to my Soapbox Spicy Take episode when it comes to courses and the future of education in the online space. I hope you enjoyed it. I hope you found it beneficial, helpful, all the things.

Speaker 1:

If you have questions, if you have thoughts, if you have ideas about this topic you want to discuss or share or tell me about, please feel free to head over to Instagram at girlmeansbusiness, send me a message. I'm always open to chatting. I love hearing from you. I love having conversations and debates about these kinds of things. So please hop over and say hi and, as always, if you liked this episode or you want to share this with other people you think someone you know might be interested in this take a screenshot, share it to your social media feed.

Speaker 1:

Make sure you tag me at girl means business. I greatly appreciate it. Thank you so much. I hope you have a wonderful week and I will see you back here next week. Same time, same place. Thank you so much for tuning in this week. If you enjoyed this episode, I would love for you to take a screenshot, share it to social media and don't forget to tag. Girl means business and, as always, we greatly appreciate any reviews you leave for this podcast. Thank you so much for being here and we'll see you next week.

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Kendra Swalls

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