How We Retain Staff [EP:154]

Building a Positive Salon Culture: Insights from the Hello Hair Co Team

In this episode, Jen and Todd tackle a fan mail question about the challenges of retaining stylists in their salon. 

They delve into the importance of maintaining a supportive workplace environment, emphasizing respect, continuous education, and personal connections. 

They discuss their strategies for fostering growth, treating staff with dignity, and providing clear career pathways. 

The episode concludes with heartfelt testimonials from their team, showcasing the positive impact of their leadership and the unique culture at Hello Hair Co. 

Listeners will gain valuable insights into creating a thriving salon atmosphere and maintaining team cohesion.

00:00 Introduction and Greetings
00:12 Fan Mail Question: Struggling to Keep Stylists
00:40 Exploring the Intent Behind the Question
02:19 Opening Takes on Salon Turnover
04:05 Jen's Perspective on Turnover
06:29 Todd's Short Answer and Team Insights
08:21 Defining Salon Culture and Expectations
11:11 Treating Staff with Respect and Dignity
12:09 Adapting to the New Generation of Professionals
18:42 Providing Growth and Opportunities
24:35 Defining Your Goals Beyond Money
25:02 Understanding the Deeper Motivations
26:00 Personalized Approaches in Business
27:04 Challenges of Modern Salon Ownership
29:43 The Importance of Staff Relationships
31:39 Celebrating Team Achievements
35:24 Staff Testimonials and Feedback
48:18 Final Thoughts and Encouragement

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Transcript

154
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[00:00:00] 

Todd: What's up, everyone? Hello. What's up, Jen?

Jen: Hello.

Todd: Got some new lighting.

Jen: Yeah. I'm in our daughter's bedroom. Change the scenery.

Todd: Making it happen.

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: So, we got a question a text message, which is, they call it fan mail.

Jen: Love it.

Todd: said, do you struggle to keep stylists at your salon? So we're going to dive into that. I thought that was a cool sort of question. Like, I don't know that people phrase it that way. I think a lot of times you see people that are like, hey, I struggle to do this. know what I mean?

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: he asked, I was like, oh, that's a sort of in my head. I don't know why I don't think it's anything crazy. But I was like, it's, I don't know if it's, Ever been, like, asked that way

Jen: Yeah. Well, clearly they were direct for a reason, I guess. I would imagine like,

Todd: that was, that was my initial [00:01:00] thought, was, I, it's a direct question, but, like, what's the intent behind it? I don't know the person. It was someone, I want to say it was in Kentucky. Like, we can see a location, we don't get very much information. I don't know where the person's coming from.

Jen: okay.

Todd: one of the things that I thought about when we were planning the show was like, what's the intent?

Was, was it sincere question because they need help? Were they just curious?

Jen: Right.

Todd: and that would be like, you know, I wouldn't want to work for that guy. Or maybe they thought I want to work for that guy. I don't know. I have no clue. Was it sarcastic? have because sometimes I can be direct and or most times I can be direct. And I have no idea where the person is coming from. So, I thought we could just come on here and sort of explore

Jen: Cool. I think what you did with that question with our staff was actually really amazing. So I can't wait till we talk about that.

Todd: yeah. The other thing I thought was why take my word for it, right? Like was it LaVar or Lamar from reading rainbow? Remember that [00:02:00] show back in

Jen: I do. I don't remember the guy's name.

Todd: So I went ahead and asked some of our staff why they're with us or why they stayed with us or why they chose us. And I'll read through some of those answers towards the end, but first we're going to do opening takes. Do you want me to go first?

Jen: Cause I'm struggling with I'm good at being on the spot, but I don't know. This one's just, just get, get in my way here.

Todd: An opening take I think should just be, we just started this last week, I thought it would be fun to try out. We'll try it for a few shows, if you don't like it, we can remove it. But what I thought was we could have something that we don't talk about or some sort of just take that we share and then maybe it sparks a better conversation.

So I'll go first.

Jen: Okay.

Todd: My opening take based, I was been thinking about this question all week when we got it. Is this is only our way. This is things that we've implemented at hello, and it's not the only way. And it's probably not the most efficient or effective way [00:03:00] to be honest. I don't claim any of that stuff.

I know there are a lot of people out there with podcasts that are like, this is how you have to do it. And I don't subscribe to that. It's just, it's what's worked for us. And it's something that's constantly evolving and something that we constantly address. We were just talking about new hire yesterday who you're doing a little bit different of an onboarding process, right?

To test things out. And so we're constantly doing this. And that's why we don't have any sort of cookie cutter PDFs that you can download and, you know, enter your email and download this. Maybe in the future we'll have some stuff, but for now, This is us and this is what we do at hello. That's my opening take

Jen: Love it.

Todd: so take take what you can from it It's not stealing if you like everything we're doing word for word implement it who

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: yours change the names Don't be like I got this here who cares make

Jen: Yeah, you can have [00:04:00] it.

Todd: too many people want too much credit Just help other people right? So what do you got?

Jen: All right. So my opening take when I heard this question I guess I went back to. Being a salon owner like 10 years ago. So I think, I don't know where this person's coming from either, but my, my old salon, Jen, like Jen, 10 years ago, right. Would hate turnover, would struggle when people left, would think it was.

A bad look for the salon because people were not staying and then hiring. I think we just, I was never doing it. So people would leave and then we were in a situation like we need to hire like five people. How do we do it? And then we're bringing on five people that are not a fit. We didn't have a mission or core values or anything, but they still weren't a fit, but it was like, we need to fill these chairs.

Fast forward where I sit as an owner today, a stylist, whatever, whoever I am as Jen, a part of Hello Hair Co. I think turnover is a wonderful thing. I think salons need to be ready [00:05:00] to let people go or let people or let staff leave happily and realize it. Create such an amazing opportunity to put a new person in.

And if you're always innovating, like Todd said, we're always changing. We need new people all the time because we're adapting and then they'll come in and they'll adapt. And it does help the culture always keep pivoting and innovating with the new people. And it allows us as owners to always be changing the way we do things.

And I love that. And. As part of that, as people have come and, you know, Come and go. And there's been a lot some I, I missed at the time, but then the opportunity that arose over the next couple of months or years, I'm like, wow, that was meant to be. We're in an amazing place because those people left open doors opportunities.

We grew as owners and now we're able to hire staff in a whole different way than I've ever done in my whole career, which is like 25 years. So. I think learning how to hire, learning how to let people go that don't fit your team, letting people go when they leave and realizing the [00:06:00] opportunity it brings and having a mindset that's somehow, sometimes organic things need to happen.

You don't have to push the wheel all the time and realizing that maybe when those things are happening, maybe you feel salty, maybe you're hurt, maybe financially, it really hurts your business, but realize there is something better coming. Maybe not right away, but always, always something better is coming.

Todd: Good stuff. That was a good take. I, I didn't know how to approach answering the question either. That was another thing because I didn't know where the person was coming from.

Jen: Right,

Todd: I came up with was a short answer, which we posted on our Instagram. And the short answer is no. We do not struggle to keep stylists at hello.

Now, is that the same as, and you just covered this, so everyone already knows the answer. Is it the same as keeping people? 100 percent retention rate. it's not.

Jen: right. Thank you.

Todd: you just said, sometimes people move on. Sometimes people outgrow. I don't think we've quite had that at our space, if we're just being honest. [00:07:00] Sometimes people just make decisions and move on. And you know what? Good for them. I, I think, I think it, I think it all starts with supporting people and trying to guide them, but you don't know what you don't know. So like, I don't know why sometimes people are choosing to leave, but if they've made their mind up, we, I like, I don't, I'm not arguing with anybody.

I'm not trying to convince anybody to stay and I'm

Jen: Right.

Todd: I know what we bring to the table and recently I've realized over the last few months what our team brings to the table.

Jen: Mm hmm.

Todd: it's, it's now starting to be sort of a more complete. Hello, and we have staff that we're going to read some of their comments later, but we have staff that truly care about the business and I guess kind of stick up for it or,

Jen: yeah.

Todd: you know, sort of value every

Jen: Mm hmm.

Todd: says. And again, I'm not picking. I feel like I always have to say that because people are super sensitive, [00:08:00] but everyone says they have like a strong salon culture. how, like, how are you measuring that? It's like when people use the term luxury, you know, we're a luxury experience.

How are you measuring that? You know, there's no metrics for a strong salon culture. So it's just your saying what words that you heard someone else say.

Jen: Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

Todd: our culture speak for itself. I don't really even try to define it. I can tell you a couple of things like we focus on and we'll do that. Or let's just jump in.

Actually, we do hair and we have fun. That's something that really drives us. And that might sound simple, but it's by design. When you try to complicate too many things, I think it throws people off.

Jen: Absolutely.

Todd: to come in, they want to know what's going on. You say this all the time. You come in as a hair pro into hello, and we give you our rules and guidelines and you can pretty much do whatever you want within those, within those [00:09:00] parameters. And I think that's a big part of what keeps people happy. And it's a big part of what keeps us off of sounding boards saying. You know, this younger generation and all this stuff, we don't need to do that.

Jen: Right.

Todd: We, we, I don't want to say cater to it, but we provide the younger generation is looking for. If we're dealing with the younger generation, we have some people that aren't younger generation

Jen: Right.

Todd: what they're looking for.

It's about

Jen: hmm.

Todd: people as individuals. So if you're, which is another big part of it too, there's always gray area. And this was a struggle for me for years and years and years until recently. And you used to always say that Todd lives in a black and white world. So that's just how it is. I'm

Jen: Mm hmm.

Todd: anymore, but I was until a few years ago,

Jen: Right,

Todd: after we had hello, like when we opened, it was a pandemic and it was. The, these are the fucking rules because the state saying all

Jen: right,

Todd: It was very black and white, and then after that, I was like, you know what, screw, like, this is, doesn't work for me anymore, I don't [00:10:00] know where the light switch was, but I was like, there's always gray area, and we have to treat people as individuals,

Jen: right. They all follow the same rules and they all understand what they are and I think to what you're saying we keep the rules simple and Like not like lengthy, right? It's like here's our expectations. Here's what you're supposed to do And the reason for that is it's very easy to have accountability.

Hey, here's the rules like shoot. I forgot that Okay, got it on it. And then within that we want them to just be and feel creative They have a lot of staff that has come from other salons and they still have moments where they're like, I feel like I'm going to get in trouble. And like, I forget I'm here.

I forget that that's not what it is with you guys. It's a working relationship. I'm not in trouble. Like I'm a child. Like it's just, Hey, you forgot to do this. Do it next time. You're human. Cool. Now there's only so many times we're going to give you the, Hey, you forgot to do this thing, but you know, most people, they get right on.

And like, we treat them as adults, like figure out in your brain, how to remember to do this shit. Yeah. And do it, right? I'm not here to babysit you.

Todd: [00:11:00] sure, I, so, where I think we can go from here is sort of just run down some of the things that we do at Hello. Does that work for you? Cool.

Jen: Where do you want to start?

Todd: so the first thing I had on my list here was to treat people with respect and dignity. And from the first day assistant to the OG hair pro at your space, I think everyone being treated the same. And I just said, there's gray area and people are individuals, but I'm talking about the stuff that is consistent.

So our commission is one across the board. Are the way we handle whatever, look, look at all the little tiny stuff. Like the way we handle time off requests is the same for everyone across the board. I know it's easy to fall into. Well, this person's my favorite and you can kind of do whatever you want because I've had businesses and I've managed businesses in the past

Jen: Right.

Todd: I've watched that happen

Jen: Mm hmm.

Todd: it creates saltiness.

Jen: Right.

Todd: soon as that comes in, people are like, well, do I want to be here? And whatever. So I think just [00:12:00] treating people. With respect and dignity across the board is really important.

Jen: I think for me, what I Oh, sorry.

Todd: no, go ahead.

Jen: One of the things that I feel I had to change in my mindset, and you touched on this a few minutes ago, is, you know, these kids today, and I'm like, Okay, I need to work on this because these kids today is the generation of the future and they are truly whether you see them this way or they see themselves the young professionals that are coming into the industry or into any industry.

So I switched my mindset to these young professionals coming in today. Yes, they are. Coming out of different things, they want different things, but you can understand that and you can decide in your business, which ones you're willing to work with and which ones you're not. And once I started looking them as young professionals and holding the expectations up as they are young professionals, not these kids today and getting over my old self of like, well, when I was their age, I had to do this.

Like, cool. They're not me. They're never going to be. That's fine. And that's, what's [00:13:00] going to help drive our industry in wherever it's supposed to be today. And that's where our culture is always changing, but they are young professionals. And then as soon as you start calling them that, and they hear you saying that they will start to meet that expectation of you're right.

I am a young professional. I'm not just a kid because they have to change their mindset too.

Todd: Yeah. Three years ago when we started this podcast, we decided to name it Hello Hair Pro, and it was obviously a play off of Hello Hair Co, our

Jen: Right.

Todd: barbershop, but it worked because we want, we believe that we can. help professionalize an industry.

Jen: Mm

Todd: I see it all the time. Like we need to professionalize this or you know your worth and all that stuff.

And I'm like, how does this contribute just saying stuff? So I think through our actions, definitely demonstrated that our model Works. And I think that's another thing. With bringing people on and maintaining people is creating something that people buy into. We

Jen: hmm. Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

Todd: yesterday or [00:14:00] the day before, but when you have a real, it doesn't even need to be like strong, like you're not family, like, like there's a line, you know what I mean? You

Jen: Oh yeah. At

Todd: that we're family here. This

Jen: the end of the day, it's a business.

Todd: It's a business. You're not family unless you are family. Yeah. If you are family, that's different. But if you're just bringing random people into your business to work and calling them family, like, what are you, what is this, the Olive Garden?

Like, it doesn't make

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: don't get it. And. One of the things another thing that we do is that we're very upfront and honest with what we expect

Jen: Mm hmm.

Todd: So and I don't know how I just transitioned

Jen: That's great.

Todd: But you'll get what you put in from us like as owners as leaders Jen and I will Give you sometimes more than what you put in

Jen: Mm hmm. Mm

Todd: I think people I think it's safe to say that our staff knows that and when they put effort in, they see [00:15:00] results.

It's just like when you go to the gym. If you just show up and walk around, you're not going to really make any progress. If you put in the work, you're going to get busier or start retaining clients. Longer or be able to charge more for your services or whatever. I think that's I think just being honest and what you expect is, is something that people should maybe evaluate

Jen: hmm.

Todd: because I think everyone, I don't think anybody sets out to be dishonest, but I know a lot of people that will say one thing, but then it's different

Jen: So it's just, yeah. So our expectations are clear. I've actually had it some times staff that's still with us. Like, do you think sometimes your expectations are too high? I'm like, Oh no, I would like them to be higher. But right now this is the bar that I know that you guys can reach. And when we get there, they'll go up from there and like, Oh, okay.

But also it's our offering. We're very clear on what we offer at hello. And more importantly, Most important, we deliver on all of those offerings. So Todd and I reevaluate those offerings all the time to make [00:16:00] sure we're actually doing the things that we say we're going to do. So when we hire, we're like, we offer this, we do education, we do whatever it is that we do.

And then do we actually do those things? Because there are a lot of salons. I'm going to say majority that have a great offering. They look great on paper. And yet you take that job and you think it's a wonderful opportunity. And then once you get into that salon, none of those things are true. Or 99 percent of them are not true.

So now you just took a job that you thought was a great opportunity because on paper, they said they do all of these things and really they do none of them. I think that they wish they could do all of them. Just they're not there yet. So their offering probably should be three of those things and they can do them really well.

And then once they can do those, they could offer you more stuff in that offering. Our offering is very clear of the things that we will do for you at hello, and we do all of them. For everybody. All. The. Time.

Todd: Yeah, I

Jen: I'm proud of that.

Todd: say that I, I, I'm proud of that too. And it's, I think it might, it goes back to [00:17:00] treating people with dignity and respect. And, you know, we, we aren't just saying what we're going to do. Do and then not doing it. We actually do it. And you told the story last week, I think on the pod that was someone was like, Oh, we're actually going to do this.

And you were

Jen: Yeah,

Todd: do what we say we're going to do here. And they

Jen: we push our staff to grow to like, it's interesting right now. I have, we have a few stylists that I think they're ready for a new skill. So I reached out to them and I'm like, I think you three are ready to learn something new. What do you think? And they were like, okay, cool. Like, and I, some of them had asked me like a year or two ago, I'm like, you're not there yet.

Like you have to hone in on some of these other things first, but here's the other part. Like we will push people to do things that we know They're capable of. And then as they start to do it, they're like, wow. We have a girl that I noticed could do makeup. We were doing something for some teens and I'm like, can you help out?

And I'm like, you can do makeup. And she's like, well, I mean, kind of, and I'm like, you can do makeup. And now she's a rock star doing makeup at these weddings we're doing. And she's like, I can't believe I'm actually doing this. I'm so [00:18:00] proud of myself. And thank you for pushing me. And And I say that because I think we delicately push, we push when we realize they're ready.

And if someone's not, we push less, like we're able to really individualize. Like you said, like some people are a marathon and some people are a sprint and we understand who's playing in what field

Todd: I think people struggle with that too, because they want everyone to be pushed the same way or there. I see a lot of stuff. Like I have staff that just won't sell retail. And it's like, well, if that's not their thing, you should focus on what they do. Do

Jen: and then focus on the people that will sell it.

Todd: Yeah, like don't focus on what you don't have.

Focus on what you do have. It'll make your business a lot stronger. You were just talking about technical stuff. So I want to flip that for a second

Jen: Okay.

Todd: this is actually my next note is we focus on more than just technical ability. So what we're looking for to is to create an atmosphere or to allow like, almost like when you're doing a science experiment, you want to create an environment [00:19:00] that things can naturally happen in and sort of observe them and then you can make changes, you know what I mean?

Say you're whatever, it doesn't matter, but I think people will get the point there. But what we try to do is create an atmosphere in which the younger staff. Naturally look towards the veterans for guidance and it's more than just technical. It's like cleaning. It's helping others. It's being better at customer service.

It might be you know, our dress code is very basic, but it might be like stepping up your Appearance. So in you know, we're just talking about like clothing and outfits. I'm not, getting plastic surgery. That's not what I'm talking about, but it's just looking, it's just looking perfect. Well, you got to be specific in this industry. it's just stepping things up and realizing, I guess, what sort of clientele do you want to attract? And what, what do people expect? Like how we look at our staff and we're like, what do they expect? What do they want? It's the same thing when you're looking at your clients. You can teach people like, Hey, [00:20:00] clientele wants this. Oh yeah. Okay. I can do that. And now they're offering that and they're providing that

Jen: We give them that sense of awareness that they're not always going to see for themselves at the time.

Todd: Yeah, and it's much more than the technical ability. Like you always see every salon out there, not every, but the majority of salons out there are like education, education, education, we do education. Great. Everyone does education. What else do you do?

Jen: Right.

Todd: it's the little things. I think another big one is that, did you have anything on that? Or

Jen: No, I think it's perfect.

Todd: I think another thing is that people need a path. They need opportunity and they need. to see growth your walls or they'll be out. People will complain all day about losing people to suites and whatever. Well, you haven't done a very good job at providing growth opportunities for your team. So they're leaving.

Jen: Right.

Todd: They want to grow.

Jen: The other thing.

Todd: see the opportunity to

Jen: Right.

Todd: they're going to start to like, their brains turn. Think

Jen: Mhm.[00:21:00] 

Todd: right? If you're a salon owner and you're like, oh shit, I Like, think of yourself.

What do you want? You probably one day were like, I can't work here anymore because I've outgrown this place. You may or may not have outgrown that place. The leaders that came before you did an inadequate job at providing a path to what you wanted.

Jen: Right. I forget.

Todd: Okay. Silence.

Jen: over it and figure out, okay.

What can I change so that more people don't do that or do you need to maybe that person needed to go and you need To just get over it the point is is that you need to get over and quickly focus back and look at all the people that are still there and If there's not a lot and you need more then you need to look into the future And [00:22:00] how are you getting more people if you keep focusing on the past you will die in the past It is not a good place to sit and dwell on so figure out what you need to do Your time period and give yourself that and then move on and go in and focus on who's still there and who supports you.

Or maybe there's a learning that needs to come out of this, which is shoot. I'm still running my business. Like it's 10 years ago. Like I need to, to figure out how to arrive at today's world. That's not going to be easy. I'll repeat that. That is not going to be easy. Things are difficult, but if you can do the difficult things, then you're on the other side and you're in the small percent that's running a great business.

A lot of the stuff we do at hello, it has not been easy. We may, we may make it look easy. It's fucking hard. There are tears, there are arguments, there are exhausting days, but here's Why we do it. We can see where we want to be. I, I love, I know Todd loves, we love owning a business, leading a team, showing the opportunity for this staff.

That's not easy, but [00:23:00] we do it and we do it well, actually. But I think it's what you're saying. Opportunity for some could be technical, could be education or opportunity could be, Hey, like how much money do you want to make? Let me show you how to get there. Because just say, you're like, Oh, I need you to bring in this much a week.

That's it. That doesn't resonate for a lot of people. It could be like, they, maybe some of them need a game. Like you have to figure out what each, what drives each person and get them excited about it. Those people that leave for suites, I've said this in a bunch of podcasts. I talk with lots of them. And at first it's wonderful.

Everything should be wonderful in the beginning. And then before you know it, they're not progressing. They don't know how to raise their prices there. They feel lost. They feel alone. And they miss giving them a drive. They miss people helping them with their goals. They miss people helping them reach different things.

So realize they left for something, but there are misses that will either bring them back or maybe bring them into your life in a different way that they're looking for opportunity.

Todd: you, if you spent some serious time as an owner to hire people or hiring [00:24:00] people answering and thinking about this question. I think you'll do a lot better. And the question is, what do they want and how can I help them get it? And

Jen: Customer service, wherever you look at it,

Todd: that's not always super, super clear. The person might not even know.

I've asked people for their goals and they're like money. And I'm like, yeah, but what else? What? Like, okay. Let's do this. What are you gonna do with the money? You know, like, what are you really after? Because money is a problem solving tool. Money is

Jen: everyone needs money,

Todd: goal. what are you gonna do? Have stacks of money and just sit there with it?

Cool. I guess. If you want to sit around with stacks of money, that's your goal. You're a Like, why would you need that? Obviously, you want the money for a reason. Do you want to travel? Do you want to invest? Do you want to buy your first home? Like, We can help with that stuff too. And that might be outside of the scope for a lot of people.

But [00:25:00] you know, you've been in the industry for a very long time. When I had my gym, was evaluating why people wanted things in, you know, people would come in and say, I need to lose weight. And that's not good enough for me. That was never good enough. It was always like, why, why do you want to lose weight? I had women that would come in and their doctors would say, You have to lose weight, and I would still dig in. You would probably assume, most people, rightly so, would assume a woman needs to lose weight to be healthier. Well, when we dug in, it was really sort of a personal thing, and I remember some of the women that I helped were like, I want to get pregnant, and my doctor said I need to lose weight.

Well, that's a different thing.

Jen: right?

Todd: very different than just, our approach might be similar, but knowing somebody's why allows you to push or nudge them

Jen: Absolutely.

Todd: Are completely different than, you know, do you want to lose that fucking weight? Get down and give me

Jen: Right,

Todd: That's not what we're doing.

We're not

Jen: right.

Todd: bootcamp [00:26:00] over here, you

Jen: And you need to understand how each person under your roof wants to be treated. I'm very aware of the staff that's super sensitive that if they're sick, I know automatically they think we're mad at them. Now I know we're not mad at them. We're running a business. We're going to take care of it.

We're good. But I know how they feel. So I make sure I reach out like, Hey, hope you feel better. And I know immediately like, Oh, she's not mad at me now. That's their own reflection. That's what, that's their own anxiety. But I, I know like What's happening in their head. And that's important to understand for them also, maybe not always easy.

Cause you're like, wow, it's a lot of moving parts here. You're running a business. Of course there is. Remember that part I said, it's hard. I think too, to what

Todd: bad at that. And you

Jen: we're a good team though.

Todd: yeah. The other day you said something, you were like, can you reach back out to the staff? And I was like, Oh shoot. Cause I just jumped in and started doing what I needed to do

Jen: Because you did the business part and I was busy like going to clients and whatever and I'm like you just need to I know she needs an answer because I just I know her so it is what it is. But I [00:27:00] think to what you said, and I think this is really important if you're listening and you're like this seems exhausting.

When we opened Hello and started interviewing people and we're building a staff and whatever. And I'm realizing the wants and needs and where the future is going and what these young professionals are really looking for. I said to Todd, I don't know if I can own a salon in today's world. Those words came out of my mouth and I, I'm glad I had this realization because I had to really think like, how do I arrive as an owner, as a leader?

To the young professionals and what their needs are. And can I, because not everybody can do that. Like certain things that they want. Do I even, do we even want to give that to them? Like, I don't know if we can, can we run a business? That's run as a business and still meets their needs. And as we sat down and, and, and.

Brain dumped and did all these things and like, okay, yeah, if we do this and we have expectations here and we set the bar here, we can do X, Y, and Z and do it well and really offer these things and not be salty as an owner and then not have to change the business [00:28:00] plan after, like I said, we give them that offering.

These are what we offer and then have to change it. Now we really can't offer you that. So. You might need, if you're having an issue with staff and keeping them and hiring them, maybe you're not meant to own in today's world. Maybe you're not, maybe you need to change the structure of how you're doing things.

There's nothing wrong with that. If you are not able at this point in your career to pivot and innovate, you may need to think of it and look at it differently. It's just where it's at. There's nothing wrong with that, but maybe it's an inner look. That's like, I need to change or, or can I, and maybe that's even reaching onto us in a phone call, like I need to change what, what does this even look like and can you do it,

Todd: sure. I definitely agree with not everyone is cut out to be an entrepreneur. Not everyone should own a business. I've said that a million times and I'll say it till forever because

Jen: true.

Todd: I just saw something online, one of those like, You know, entrepreneurship things when I was scrolling through my phone yesterday, they were like, do you think anybody can own a business or be an entrepreneur?

And the guy that was [00:29:00] very successful, I think he had like 90 businesses or something like that, like insane billions of dollars and stuff like that. And he said, absolutely not. No, not everyone is the same. And that is something to be celebrated right there. You

Jen: Mm hmm.

Todd: When you figure out where you truly belong and where you want to be, things just kind of. When you force stuff, you're going to be like, how do you keep people at your salon?

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: You know, it's, you're, you're probably forcing some stuff. I think a major part of the equation too, is understanding that being of service doesn't really know bounds. Like it doesn't end at your clients.

Jen: Mm hmm.

Todd: hair and make people happy, but why would that change when it comes to our staff? It

Jen: need to be equally as happy.

Todd: Yeah. Or more.

Jen: Right. Yeah, true.

Todd: I think if we take care of your staff to the highest degree that you can, they sort of, they, once they feel that, like, I have someone the other day that was like, it's so weird when you have bosses that care about you, like, you

Jen: Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

Todd: first of all, we're [00:30:00] human beings, but second, we've been in this game for a while, decades, and we've run businesses and had businesses, Jen, you've been the independent, and, Renter, you've been the commission employee, you've been the commission salon owner, you, whatever, you've done all the things, so, you have that experience to share, and, you know, another thing that, sort of playing off of that same thing is, I remember when I had my gym, those were the happiest times when people would share their accomplishments. And I wasn't like, I'm the best coach. You wouldn't have done that without me. I was all, it's the same as I explained cooking. I love to cook. I don't want to thank you. I don't want help. I don't want anything. I just want to feed people because it makes me feel good. It makes me feel of service and it's something that I can do. I'm not. And that probably is easier for me than small talk like if I had a little tiny grill and I could go around just cooking for strangers instead of small talk, I think the world would be a better [00:31:00] place. I'm just not good at small talk, you know,

Jen: That's why I just want to do hair at parties because that's the only way I feel comfortable. Otherwise I'm socially awkward.

Todd: it's just no, it's just knowing what you're good at. I'm not saying I can't make small talk for someone sitting in my chair, but I definitely will change the subject when somebody is like raining out there, huh? And I'm like, Yep, I have windows. Like, I just don't, I don't get that level of conversation.

If you want to talk about a book or something you experienced or a trip you took, there's a lot of value there for me. But not just that little, I'm talking simply to talk.

Jen: Right.

Todd: I'm just Todd myself. I know I'm not good at that. All right. What else do we have here? Connection. We kind of, we kind of

Jen: Hit that.

Todd: Being part of something that's bigger than the sum of its parts, I think is very important for

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: People want to be part of something and they don't want it to just be like, you know, for us, it's building our team. It's building our business. It's building our [00:32:00] clientele. It's being part of the community. Those are things that are larger than just Jen and Todd open a business. You know, so it's, I had you had another owner say something like, I wish something like this existed when we were

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: and that meant the world when you told me that I was like, that means the world to me.

And

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: from somebody that's, you know, almost 30 years in the industry,

Jen: Owns her salon. Yep.

Todd: Owns a salon, comes into our salon,

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: to hang out and to help and whatever. But it's true. It's we've, what we've created and I'm not tooting my own horn. It's different than what other people are trying to create.

It's very different. I get it. But what we're trying to do is take. Instead of looking at all the negatives of younger people and all this stuff, we're trying to look at what they do bring to the table and, and polish that,

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: out. You know, I was going to, I almost said exploit, but that's not the right word there. Like, we're not trying to exploit anything, but I'm not trying to like, it's like when you think about school, when you're in school, not hair school, any [00:33:00] school, when you're in school, they try to, I feel like go out of their way to find what you're not good at. And they're like,

Jen: Right,

Todd: math. You need extra help in math.

Yeah. But if I'm really good at this other thing, am I even going to need

Jen: right. Maths might not be in my future in the sense of relating to my job. Obviously, math's always in your future. But so let's focus on what I am good at because that's the career path I should be taking or figuring out where that works.

Todd: Yeah. I, having a relationships, we talked about this, but having relationships with your staff is going to increase that buy in and that trust. So when we make changes to our business, our staff is a built in shore. Like we've never steered them wrong.

Jen: Right. They believe in what we're doing and they trust that we're doing it for the right reasons.

Todd: Yes, because they understand our core values.

Jen: They also trust that if it doesn't work, we're going to quickly pivot and figure out what's going on. So that, that's, that is really important too. [00:34:00] Yeah.

Todd: always going to do what's right for the business, but most of the time that's, and I'm sort of stealing this from a book I'm reading, most of the time that's going to be what's right for the staff. So by default, know, they win. And I think when you want to make changes to your business, you look at it and you're like, I'm going to get pushback.

I'm, am I going to get pushback? And maybe we had that in the early years we got pushback on stuff, but we don't now because people are like, okay, sometimes people are like, this scares the shit out of me, but I know you guys got us, so let's do this.

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: that comes with years of practice and working with people and having a relationship and a connection with them.

Jen: Right.

Todd: another thing is you have to learn how to lead. People should be able to come to you for anything they if they have something minor or something major going on outside of work in their life in work, whatever you should be able to guide them should be able to find them a resource if you can't, if it's something, you know, that takes [00:35:00] expertise, maybe you help line them up.

But and the other thing I would say is don't make people feel dumb.

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: That's a big one. People, because they'll stop coming to you.

Jen: Yeah, for sure.

Todd: have a disconnection. And then you're going to wonder why people are leaving.

Jen: Right.

Todd: struggling. Do you have anything else that, I think that covers it,

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: can go, we can jump into what our staff said.

Jen: Ooh, fun.

Todd: So, I'm just going in order.

Jen: So real quick, I just want to preface this. So Todd put, we have Slack, that's how we communicate with our staff. So he had reached out through our one of our channels, just like, Hey, we got this like fan mail you know, if anybody could kind of give some feedback so we can answer it really, really well, and I just assumed crickets.

Like no, one's going to answer it. They're like, yeah, cool. Enjoy your podcast guys. Like whatever I'm busy. And then incoming, all of these. Wonderful things to the point where I started crying. So I was like, you know, you hope you're doing great. And I, and people always tell us like that work at hello, like I love [00:36:00] being here, whatever, but saying it and doing it are very different.

And then when they came in with these responses, I was like, wow, they really get what we're doing. And I even was like, they see things that I didn't realize they were even aware of. So it was, it was just, it was very cool. I don't know. It just was, it made it even feel, you know, Like we're on the right path even more than I already know.

But it was, it's cool.

Todd: It definitely helped my confidence. I'll tell you that. I was reading the answers and I was like, Whoa, and then another answer would come

Jen: Yeah.

Todd: Wow,

Jen: really took the time and they, it was, it was neat.

Todd: interested in sharing their thoughts. And nobody told me I couldn't share any there was one thing that was like a funny comment.

They were like, leave that part out. So I'll respect that, obviously. Everyone was cool with me sharing these, so I'm just gonna share them, and I'll share their names too, because why would I not? So Lauren who said, Sorry this is gonna be sappy, but the hello culture is something that's hard to find in a commissioned salon. If I wasn't at hello, I truly think I would have given up on hair. That's horrible, but I get, like,

Jen: Yeah. [00:37:00] And

Todd: a team. I love that we can all bounce ideas off of each other and boost each other's confidence. all have hard days, but I always feel better coming into work, and I know I'm not the only one. just a plus that we have the best bosses. Love you all. Thanks, Lauren. Who was next here? I had Gianna next. Where is she? My, no, that's the part not to share. Okay. My real response you can share is hello. It's a great atmosphere filled with people who love and care about their career. Not only that, but they love and care for each other and every client that walks through the door. Everyone leaves happy.

And even if they don't, we make it a point to give back in some way, shape or form. That's another, Good thing right there. You'll always have a great experience here whether you're a client or an employee. The education never stops and you're learning from one of the best people, persons in the game. That would be you. It's hard to find a salon who will take someone on the newer [00:38:00] side and give them a chance to prove themselves because most salons look for at least two years experience. As Jen Ford always says, skill can be taught. And I think that if people are willing to learn and not just sit around and expect a full book of clients right off the bat, they'll flourish here. have fun, we all get along, we all help one another, and it's definitely more of a friendly environment than most. I remember turning down the only salon that offered me a job because I was hoping and praying Hello hired me, and they did the following week. It was a risk, but it was one I was willing to take, because from the moment I stepped in the door and talked to Jen and Todd, I knew this was the place for me. Sorry that's so long. I love it,

Jen: she's been with us for, I think, four years. Like I think she, or four and a half years, she came right, right after we opened, so pretty cool.

Todd: yes. So, are we? Okay, here. I'm jumping around because I'm going in the order they came in. This next one is Emma. I just have to find her. Emma's unique because [00:39:00] is your current apprentice. So, I haven't explored another salon as far as the apprentice, so I don't know. I don't have any other comparisons.

Sorry, that was rough. That's my fault. But I can honestly say that this is the longest running career I've had, and it's definitely because of the work environment. I don't know another company I've worked for that would pay for us to get free education whenever we wanted or needed, seriously takes in employees ideas into consideration, tries to accommodate all of its employees and their needs, and creates a work environment that is truly a community, and enjoys being around. Each and supports each other. Thanks, Emma. If you have anything to add with these, just jump in.

Jen: Okay. I think they speak for themselves. So,

Todd: yeah, this next one is Chloe. Chloe says I work at hello for the education. You guys provide a lot of my friends and clients ask me why I travel 30 minutes for work most of my week. And my simple answer is you guys provide a safe environment and one on one education with us. [00:40:00] I've worked in salons where they say education is important to them, but. Then let me go shortly after because they told me I didn't care about education, even though I was going to a barber a week later, maybe barber school or something like that. You answer all of our questions, stupid or not, and also care about our safety inside and outside of the salon. So definitely care about people inside and outside of the salon. And I don't think anyone asks any stupid questions. Chloe, they're all good questions. But I get I appreciate that. Who's next? Eva.

Jen: Oh, Ava.

Todd: All right. I stay at hello because Eva was one of your apprentices as well.

Jen: She was my first apprentice at Hello. Yeah.

Todd: Yeah, she's been around for a minute.

Jen: She

Todd: because

Jen: came from day one.

Todd: yes, before day one, she was at your last

Jen: Yes. Brookie.

Todd: I stay at hello because it's a place that you feel at home and you don't dread [00:41:00] going into work. The education that I received from Jen during my apprenticeship was top notch. I remember when Jen was leaving her previous salon in that I was a receptionist at and I was disappointed because I planned on apprenticing when I graduated high school, but I stayed consistent on bothering her almost every week, going to visit her at her new salon she was working at at the time. I'm so thankful that her and Todd took me on when they were opening a brand new salon and had so many other things going on. I will never take that for granted. girls that I'm surrounded by are truly amazing and I'm happy that I've made strong friendships with these beautiful women. I always feel supported no matter what stupid decisions I make.

Everyone at the salon is always there for me. It's important. You know, people make mistakes and people make poor choices and you got to have their back. You got to let people do that. where was I? I love when clients come into the salon and see how we interact with each other and it brings them joy because they are used to the typical catty salon. It's like a breath of fresh air, even for clients. There's truly no better salon to work for. Love y'all. [00:42:00] Thank you, Ava. Brooke is up.

Jen: I

Todd: is what?

Jen: said Brookie. Yeah.

Todd: I made for myself and my career. I used to have such anxiety with working in the industry and sometimes feeling like it was my, I was on my own and definitely was getting lost when it came to reason the reason of why I was doing hair. Coming into the hello crew helped me make a huge turnaround for myself. And as being a stylist, having a team where you can bounce ideas off of each other and just know that if you do need any help, you don't need to be ashamed to ask for it. We're all about collaborating and even clients love when you bring someone over to share ideas.

As our bosses, you guys help us make goals and make being in the industry so much more fun. Keep us on our toes and help me realize that it's not just about doing hair. It's about making those personal connections and helping people feel like they belong. have fun while making people feel amazing. [00:43:00] I say it all the time and I'll say it again, but I'm beyond lucky to be part of such an amazing team.

There's never a moment that you think, what do I do now? Because there's always something fun. You can jump in and ask questions and learn. We have a team that communicates and works well together. I even come in on my days off to get my daily dose of the team. When I need a lift up my happy place for sure. Brooke. I think this is helping people for sure. You know, listening. I think it helps owners too, because it's giving you a glimpse of a glimpse of what's important to a staff. That's happy from their perspective, their words, because I could tell you what I think people stay, but what better than them

Jen: Right.

Todd: So next up is gab. Gab's been with us for a while too.

Jen: Yeah. Pretty much. I think since the beginning, like four and a half fish, four years. Yeah.

Todd: almost

Jen: Her and Gianna are, well, and Ava, I guess longest. Yeah.

Todd: I originally found HelloHairCo on Instagram after leaving another salon. It caught my eye because not only it was a salon but a barbershop as [00:44:00] well, and I'm dual dual license scale, cosmetology and barbering. It seemed like a good fit. Little did I know it would be the best decision I've made in my career. Hello is the perfect fit. I've been at HelloHairCo for almost four years, so there you are. I stay because of the pure happiness the salon spreads. Whether you're sitting in my chair or someone else's, you will feel welcomed and comfortable. I get asked, do you ever get scared of having a new client? And the answer is no, because I know no matter what challenge I run into, I have a whole team of stylists to help me through it. The want for education is non stop here. We are all constantly learning from each other. And especially Jen Ford. My coworkers have become my best friends in and out of the salon. Truly no drama, just love for each other and the industry. I plan on being at hello hair co for a very long time because I want to feel, because I feel wanted and needed. And I know from experience, you can't just get that anywhere. That last sentence there is I plan to be here for a very long time because I feel wanted and needed. Listen to that owners. [00:45:00] Thanks gab for sharing means a lot. Jamie, we have two more left. So Jamie. Is newer consider newer? Yeah. Okay.

Jen: I'd say yes.

Todd: I

Jen: This year. Yes.

Todd: of I was thinking I wanted to quit the industry altogether. I talked to them and one phone call is all I needed to know that I wanted to work there. One of the other girls had here moved from our former salon to hello first and she encouraged me to give them a chance. decision I've ever made. I didn't believe a salon like this could exist. Off the bat, they believed in me. And even when I struggle, everyone is so quick to pick back up and help me. Collaborating with other stylists gives me such a wide range of knowledge and helps me grow even more. Along with easing the anxiety of trying something new. I never have to fear of being alone while doing anything. There's not a single stylist that's ever been anything but kind to me since I started. And it makes it even [00:46:00] a more enjoyable day. Every day I wake up excited to be here and ready to start my day. I think Jen and Todd do an amazing job at creating a salon environment that anyone would love to be. Clients of stylists. I feel so lucky to be part of the team and I can't imagine even thinking about leaving more salons need to be like them. Thank you, Jamie, you're the best. And then our final one is our most recent hire, Sarah. As a baby stylist, fresh out of school without any salon experience, I couldn't be happier.

I ended up at Hello Hair Co. Before graduating, I was so stressed out with trying to find a salon because I wasn't sure exactly what to look for or expect. Then, randomly, one day, Brooke, who we talked about earlier, ended up on my TikTok For You page, and I noticed that she was a New Hampshire stylist. I was curious where she was located and happened to be at Hello. I immediately searched up the salon and read a bunch of great reviews and set a date to Shadow. I shadowed three salons and they were all [00:47:00] completely different. But the thing I noticed about hello specifically was how clean the salon was and how I was greeted by everyone and welcomed right away.

I'm grateful. I ended up here and cannot wait to continue to grow as a stylist surrounded by the most supportive team. What did I see that I wanted to, Oh, how, so what, one of the things that was important to her specifically that she noticed was how she was greeted by everyone. You had a salon where you would bring people in and they were almost like scowled at by the, you know, senior stylists and meant to feel unwelcome from interview, which is just, that's crazy.

Jen: They went out of their way. Yeah,

Todd: at hello, and we can wrap on, on this if you want, but at hello, I think we almost have to be. Careful with our staff because we'll bring people in and I don't even know if the person's a good fit or not. I haven't met them, but the staff is grabbing them and they're like, Hey, you want a coffee?

Hey, come over here. Hey, check this out. What's your favorite thing to do? And like they're bonding [00:48:00] immediately. And it's just, that's just the culture that we've created. And again, I hate to use that word because don't know how to measure it or define it, but what's happening within our walls.

Jen: it's very cool.

Todd: it's a natural thing that does it on its own.

We don't need to push it. We don't hate, go say hello to this, this girl she's interviewing. Like it just happens, you know, do you have any closing thoughts? That was a long podcast. We're trying to keep these shorter, but that was a lot of information

Jen: think if anything, I hope it sparked some aha moments for people of like, maybe even where you are, maybe there's stuff you could be doing. If it's overwhelming reach out, we can kind of try to come up with an outline of certain things you could probably fix right away. And maybe some long term things to get you where you want to be, but if nothing Just keep an open mind and, and really focus on the things that are going well and how can you make those better and that will attract people and get out to people out there like, what are you about?

What do you stand for? What is your mission? What is your core values? You need to constantly be putting that out [00:49:00] on social media or in the schools or wherever it is, so that when stylists are looking for somewhere to go, they understand what you're about and it's clear to them what you stand for. If, if that is, if you're not clear on what you stand for, who you are and, and what your salon is all about, then you gotta like start there because.

You don't even know who you're hiring or what you're trying to curate under your roof.

Todd: Agreed. My closing thought is to just be more about others, be of service,

Jen: Love.

Todd: your mindset from they're not doing what I say to what can you do for

Jen: Right.

Todd: You know, and I think that you'll have find much more success in everything you do. know, I, I don't think there's anything in our lives that don't benefit from being of service to others. no aspect of our life that doesn't improve with being of service to others. So know, go do that. If you need help, reach out, jump on our email list. A lot of this stuff gets in there in short, really, really short, aggressive, kind of fun, sarcastic form. If you like that, jump in there. If you want to talk, click one of the [00:50:00] buttons.

If you want to ask a question that will answer, obviously like this, go ahead and click that fan mail it's called, but I think it pops up as send us a text message. So do that. It's private. If you want to let us know who you are you can, but if not, all we get is your general location and, and that's it.

So we will talk soon. Thanks everyone.

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