#17 Men and Connection: Finding an outlet to build community

Paul McLaughlin, a Marine Corps Veteran, Husband, and Father to 4, joins me on this episode to share his story of tranistion from military to civilian life. He had to find an outlet to fill social voids and build community that was lost when he left the Marine Corps.

Paul shares how he learned the value of community when he felt that loss after the built-in community the military life provides. He turned to hunting as a way to reconnect with himself, his friends, and family. 

It's time to recognize that men have social needs too!

Listen in and see how Paul's journey in the civilian life led to new relationships with community, food, nature, and his wife!

1:13 Meet Paul

3:17 Transitioning from a Military community to Civilian community life

9:16 Hunting: reconnect with family and friends

14:00 Solitude

18:05 How to make hunting a year-round activity

22:17 Kids, Hunting, and their relationship with food and nature

23:49 Connect with Nature

24:43 Understanding Conservation when hunting

26:42 Supporting your spouse's need for social time

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Transcript

[00:11] Speaker A: Hi, everyone. Welcome back to the Keep'em Healthy Podcast. This is your host Jami. On my most recent podcast episode, the Bump Date app, we focused on how important it is for women to have a community of people during pregnancy and motherhood. So now it's time to hear from the men. Men have social needs, too. They need high quality relationships outside of the home and workplace. Today, I have Paul McLaughlin on the show. Paul is a Marine Corps veteran, husband and father to four awesome kids. He shares a story about transitioning from military to civilian life and how he found an outlet through hunting to fill social voids and reconnect with his friends, his family, and himself. I think everyone will really enjoy his perspective and his message today. So without further ado, let's hear Paul's story. So punctual.

[01:16] Speaker B: What's up, Jami?

[01:19] Speaker A: We did it. 

[01:22] Speaker B: Scheduling nightmare.

[01:23] Speaker A: Oh, my God, you're tough, man. You got a lot of things and then sickness. Well, we got sick, too, so I can't blame you on that one when we get started here. Is this your first podcast?

[01:36] Speaker B: Very first. Privileged.

[01:39] Speaker A: Welcome. It's a fun world to be in.

[01:43] Speaker B: My goal is to just have you shut me down like you shut down Casey on that episode. If I get to that point, then that'll be great.

[01:51] Speaker A: Interject. Wait, she was with us last night. She's hilarious, that girl. Why don't we start with what your idea for this episode is about?

[02:02] Speaker B: Yeah. So I pretty much after talking with you and obviously listening to the other episodes, I'm sure you have some either you have husbands of listeners or you have actual some other husbands who are listening, but just really to use as an opportunity to, I don't know, maybe get people interested in something they would never look towards. And not necessarily hunting specifically, but just finding a different outlet to maybe fill a gap or void. Whether they've gone through, like, a transition like I have from the military to regular life, or maybe it's just been something else that's been going on in their life that's kind of caused them to maybe lose touch with. Either themselves or maybe a social aspect of their family or their friends and give them an avenue where they might be able to reconnect that.

[02:55] Speaker A: Okay, so let's kind of set the stage for that. Paul, so give me a snapshot of what you felt and what yeah, I.

[03:02] Speaker B: Think just to give kind of the backdrop. Right. So the military and not just the military, but I think there are certain professions where you spend a lot of time with your coworkers, and in the military, you're surrounded by a lot of, like, men and women that share the same passion for different things in the same social settings. And you see them a lot. You're with them at the chow hall every day. You're late nights, early mornings. Sometimes when you're deployed, they're the only people you have. So you're enjoying meals together and you're really getting a great balance of getting social interaction without any effort really put forward. It kind of comes naturally, given the scenario that you're in. And I did that for a long time, so nearly a decade, and went through a transition period with my wife and my family and decided to move back to the Philadelphia area where we're originally from and came to. A point where I guess I didn't give enough credit to the transition that I was going through as, like, my social transition, because you get to a point where it comes so naturally, but then move back to Philadelphia. Oh, everything will be fine. I know a bunch of people back there. I'll just reconnect with my friends and all the same people had before, but I didn't give enough credit to like, oh, well, I have to recreate friends at work, and not to mention the civilian sector maybe doesn't have the same have a meal together, every meal type.

[04:37] Speaker A: Mindset that the military does, and also schedule wise, right? You have your work friends, but let's just say you're like, oh, I have so many friends back in Philly. I can't wait to reconnect with them. But for you to meet up for lunch and all, it takes a lot of work. It is. You got to put in a lot of energy, and it takes time. It may take you weeks in order to sync up. And that's a difficult transition from going every day with people to forcefully having to make something happen at taking weeks. Right.

[05:06] Speaker B: Just think of your best friends, how hard it is to get a date on a calendar to meet for, like, lunch.

[05:14] Speaker A: Your wife and I, we book it way in advance. We make it happen, though. Christine, I know you're listening.

[05:21] Speaker B: She gave me some heartache because I stole a free time that aligned for both of you to take the kids to the playground.

[05:28] Speaker A: I literally I said to her, she's.

[05:31] Speaker B: Like, you're taking my time.

[05:34] Speaker A: I know. And I knew when she wrote back, because she woke back a couple of days later and I knew she was going to pick the same time I picked with you. And I was like, Christine, I'm so sorry, but I have to yeah, but anyway, we'll get it back. It's all good. So keep going. Okay, so now you're going to have to cut back to where we were. You're you're now in the workplace in Philly. Go, yeah.

[05:54] Speaker B: So fast forward through all the normal transition stuff, right? Buy a house, move back, all that good stuff. For me, there's a bunch of other things going on that I focused on first, which was kind of natural, right? Like your kids, you've moved your kids, they're older, they need a bit of your energy to help re reroute them, whether it's through sports or different activities or clubs. Then let's not forget, speaking of my wife, but like, spouses out there that have put their life kind of on hold a little bit, maybe they might be losing even more of their support structure. Then you kind of give credit, too. So she's going through the same things, trying to reestablish with her friends. Oh, yeah. Not to mention everybody has continued to live their own life for the last ten years, so everybody else is kind of busy as well. So all of a sudden, you fast forward and you just find yourself. At least for me, I found myself just going through the day to day not have one or two buddies at work at my new job, but I had lost a lot of that. Just to be frank, that male to mail, like, social interaction that was easy for me to fill and not also take time away from my family because I was just getting it at work in the Marine Corps.

[07:14] Speaker A: Right. And you don't really understand the value of that connection and that social time until it's gone. Right. That's a COVID.

[07:24] Speaker B: Yeah. I think a lot of people realize this story in COVID, but I had kind of maybe jumped the gun on it by, like, ten months based on just my own timeline was like, okay, and then COVID was like, another big shift as well. So long story short, I guess the last piece to add to that was it required some effort on my part to reconnect also with my family. They've always been supportive of my family. It's not like I was distant from them necessarily. But when you're not attending things, when you're not, when you're just physical distance has prevented you from being close. Like, I spent very few amount of times was I able to go hunting or even just have a beer or something with my dad and then same with her family, with my father in law and things like that. So by losing the built in community that I had, I definitely had to put forward some effort that I wasn't necessarily expecting to get back to where I felt good. You know what I mean? I'm kind of a social guy. I need the social interaction to kind of feel good.

[08:28] Speaker A: No, I completely understand. I think we have a similar vibe on that, and I think that's why Christine does well with us, because we both need a lot of attention and a lot of room to talk. Right. And Christine is cool with just, like, listening. Right. But I think there's something to be said about feeling lonely even though you have some social interaction, but we need this certain quality in it. And I can speak for myself at least, that I need a quality of connection, and I need that time built into my schedule. For you, Paul, you took on a different route that obviously I've never embarked on, but this is kind of where we're headed with this conversation is that you went to hunting to reconnect with your family and friends, right? And so let's shine some light on that because I've never hunted, so I don't really know what's going on with that.

[09:14] Speaker B: Yeah, so just to give a little bit of a setting the stage for that, my father, like, I'm a city kid, so obviously wouldn't naturally think that I'm, like, a lover of the outdoors necessarily. But my dad got into hunting, interestingly enough, from his work friends when he was, like, in his late 30s, early 40s, who just kind of, like, encouraged him to pick it up. And one thing led to another, and what I remember from my childhood was he would go they set a couple of weeks every fall, and they would go on a hunting trip, and all his work buddies and everybody would go up the mountains for a week or so and go out and hunt. And whether it was deer or whether it was a fishing trip, sometimes it provided a chance for them to kind of get together. It also provided them a chance to share in the harvest and things like that, which is always a lot of fun. So my dad got me into that when I was a teenager, but once I left for college and ultimately the Marine Corps, I had lost the ability to really do it. The way that I liked doing it. So much, for me, was more of, like a family connection. So I didn't do it for a long time, and I missed it a lot. And when I moved back and got out of the Marine Corps, because one of the things I really wanted to focus on was reconnecting with my dad and things because you can only spend so much time with them until you can't type thing. I think there's, like, a song about that, but basically I looked for that as an opportunity to reconnect. So long story short, I got back into hunting. I got my gear back set up, and started to connect with my dad and my father in law. Interestingly enough, I found something that both of them enjoy, and we started to get some more dates on the calendar and just kind of get back out there. And then that led me to think, hey, well, my dad always looks back on that time with his work friends and that social interaction at the Honey camp from his adult, mid adult years. I'm going to try to do the same. I know I talked with Matt a little bit and your husband, and we started to get together a couple of times, and then just recently, in the past year or so, I've been able to get some of my neighbors here in the neighborhood to take part in it. And I guess the last thing I'll say on that is just it is one of those things that you will never do unless you're encouraged or unless somebody else knows about it, right.

[11:53] Speaker A: That someone can guide your mentor you along. Plus, also, when you get a kill and this is only, from what I hear say, right. You kind of need help with carrying it or processing it or whatever the case is. It's more than just a one man kind of gig. And also it gives you a skill for the males out there to provide and, like you're saying, share in the harvest and work on this together. And I think that's what's really cool, especially in this technological world. And we go to the food store to buy our food. I think for us, from Matt especially, it was so cool for him to learn this new skill and to be able to use it to provide and stock up freezers in our house, which has been amazing. And he's so proud of that, too. So it's like a social aspect, but then it's also this natural aspect of his primal absolutely.

[12:42] Speaker B: Such as that primal part that's for me is like a huge part of it, which a lot of people, when they first start that I've helped out, they might not be interested in necessarily or think like, I don't know if I could do that. But once they start feeling that adrenaline rush and then if they are lucky enough to experience one, either themselves or someone else at the camp gets one and you start sharing it. I brought my meat back. I shared with all my neighbors. And that's like fresh Pennsylvania wild game. And there's just a different aspect of that that creates even more of a community aspect after you get out of the woods.

[13:24] Speaker A: And I think that's something that back in a long time ago, we're like hunters and gatherers. That was community building. Right. Like, everyone the men went out, or whoever went out got the kill, brought it back, shared with everybody and created this connection between everybody that we're all providing for each other and we're able to give and it feels so good to give and share your experience of how you got the kill. And that, I think, is also something that can really add value to your life. But I actually want to talk about something else different because you mentioned this, and so I want to touch on it. And I also noticed this with my own husband, that he goes out to hunt sometimes to have solitude, to kind of get away from the noise of the day to day and to kind of sit and just be present in the moment. So can you highlight that for me?

[14:16] Speaker B: Yeah. From my perspective, I think what it provides me is our houses are very similar. Jamie I have multiple kids, busy life, busy house, always living in a connected world, whether it's through work or anything like that. But I think there is a side of you that kind of comes alive by being alone in the woods. Like, it gives you a chance, one, to kind of get your thoughts together, but two, for me, it teaches me the same things that taught me when I was like twelve and 13 when I was out hunting with my dad. Patience teaches you never missing an opportunity to just kind of be quiet and listen. And that, I think, complies a lot in a lot of other places in life. And I also think by being alone in that type of situation, it also allows me to experience the adrenaline rush as well. When you actually see something and an opportunity presents itself to harvest a wild game in some capacity. And the excitement, no matter what, you just won't get that behind a computer screen or with a cell phone in your hand. That adrenaline rush you had when you were a kid playing sports or that fight or flight moment I feel like really comes alive when you're by yourself out doing something like this.

[15:52] Speaker A: So you're sitting there and the noises that you actually hear are super valuable. And like, where we're in this life of like, we, you know, a million kids running around screaming, like, I barely even hear my kids when they fall and get hurt because they drowned out, right? There's so much noises. There's things, there's beeps, there's timers, there's phone calls, right? But yet get to a point where you kind of drown most of them out because we are over stimulated. But when you're hunting and you're sitting out there and you're sitting and you have to be still and quiet, every noise that you hear could mean that a deer is coming and that it's almost exciting and you're like, oh, gosh, what does that mean? And then it gives a different relationship, I think, to the effect of noise and the effect of quietness and solitude. Not to mention the mental, just you're sitting in silence and to take that time, which a lot of people don't do. And I don't hunt, but I take that time every day and I do meditation, and it's giving me a nice balance with that high paced world that we live in. Right. And I think it's important just across.

[16:52] Speaker B: The board yes, to touch on the meditation. That's something that I've never been someone that meditates, but I've listened to you mentioned it and other people that have had success with it. But again, this was also something that I kind of lost from the military side when I transitioned out. You just don't get experiences where you can be like that in an office or working from home. So getting out in the woods and experiencing that, being in that ultra primal state and being quiet and just listening to what's going on is definitely a way for me to kind of reset at times.

[17:30] Speaker A: I think that's great. And the only thing that I think about, though, is like hunting. It's only certain times of the year, right? Like, this is not something you can do day to day. Right. There's a lot of rules with this.

[17:42] Speaker B: Excuse me. I just called it's.

[17:44] Speaker A: Okay. I can cut that out. I can cut that out. It's all good now.

[17:47] Speaker B: Keep it. Keep it. It's real, man.

[17:50] Speaker A: Let them know I'm sick.

[17:51] Speaker B: Yeah, let them know. All right. Yeah. The year round aspect of it. So what's interesting is you're absolutely right. There are seasons in particular, let's just say I'm just using Pennsylvania because of what I know best. It's primarily a fall. It goes for a good while. It goes from like, October through to January. I think it wraps up here in a week. I would say that it's less about specifically one animal, let's say, and more about you can fish if you start tying things together, right? Fishing. You have turkey season, which is in the spring, which is big here in Pennsylvania. You have waterfowl, so any type of birds and things like that. So, one, you can spread it out throughout the year. But to answer your question directly, it's definitely not a day to day thing. However, what it does provide you is, for example, me and Matt and my neighborhood had gotten into hunting this year. We started to add some morning hikes in to kind of get ready for hunting season. And then that kind of led to us maybe finding time in the summer one day here or there, to go to the range and practice with our bows or practice shooting. And it just gave a couple other little outlets of time to kind of experience some of that aspect. And then the last thing I'll say is, once you do get a harvest and you have that meat, we've already in fact, I got together with my family when my dad cooked his bear for the first time. So that aspect of the harvest kind of extending through the year. It brought everybody back together again as you get to actually put the meat on the table and feed your family with it. So definitely not you can't go out in the woods every day, but it gives you something that you can find nuggets of time that are valuable throughout the year, whether it's in preparation or whether it's handling the harvest after the fact well.

[20:01] Speaker A: And I like that because it gives other options, like you're saying hikes and things, but when it's only a certain time of the year, you have to be super intentional, right? Because if you've missed that time of year, you wait a whole another year, and it's like, that's a really long time. So I kind of like being forced to be intentional because there's 15,000 things that you could put ahead of it.

[20:24] Speaker B: I was just going to say, how many things in an adult life do adults practice anymore? So to your point on intentional. It is intentional. It's only one part of the year. So what you do leading up to that season is going to determine how successful you are. So for me, there isn't very many things outside of this. Maybe a few things here and there, where as an adult, I'm practicing. I'm trying to hone my skill outside of work, and I just don't think very many people have that in their life.

[21:01] Speaker A: No, I think that goes also hand in hand with that community of finding people that you can connect with and talk about this type of passion outside of the day to day grind of work. I think it gives you an outlet to be creative, right. And be creative in setting up plans and setting up where you're going to hunt and who you're going to hunt with. And then once you have a kill, who you're going to give to and celebrate the kill with. I think it gives a lot of value to things that are not natural in our day to day in our culture. Really? I wasn't raised in a family that hunted. Matt wasn't raised in a family that hunted. You were privileged to have that skill that you started as a teenager, but this is something brand new. But Matt and I both agree it's super important for our kids to learn because they should know the relationship between their food and nature and animals and to connect with that. Because we've learned there's such a disconnect, and we've seen it. And so we're, even as adults, trying to reconnect. Go ahead.

[22:08] Speaker B: I was going to say, I think the kid part of it is huge. I can't tell you how much my children, especially the older ones, when I go hunting and I do get something, their interest in the food is totally different than when I bring him something from the supermarket.

[22:25] Speaker A: There's like a ride.

[22:27] Speaker B: They're so interested in it. They want to know what it was eating. They want to know. And when we go back up, let's say we go to my parents mountain house or something, and we can walk around and we're out looking at different things like trees and leaves or even here at the park, they'll recognize things like, okay, there are different aspects of leafs of certain trees that deer elite or fish things that they do. So they are way more interested, and they're way more willing to try new. They've tried almost everything I've put on the table that's come from hunting season or fishing. And they like things that I don't think they ever would have thought they liked before.

[23:09] Speaker A: Right. Well, that's really cool. And I think that's an advantage of taking the time to teach your kids, like, oh, I went out. This is how I did it. This is the weapon I use. This is how I use it. Safety about the weapon. Safety and then respecting nature and that you can only hunt at certain times, and you can only get deer with certain qualifications, whatever it is. Right. And the respect of that too. And my podcast does a lot of talking about connections with people, and we highlighted that already. And then we kind of connected with ourselves with having times of solitude. But there's this huge lack of connecting with nature in our day to day. Every new technological advance in the stuff only pulls us inward towards a computer screen or indoors. And we fantasize that it makes our life easier. But what we're lacking is time outside and breathing in the fresh air and being out in the sunlight and paying attention to the animals and taking time when you're out hiking and stuff to be like, oh, look, a deer rubbed up on that tree and it's fresh. There must be a pattern here. Or look, that's fresh ****. I know, it's so gross, but my kids and I were like, we're going to help Daddy. We're going to go out in the woods, we're going to see where we can find the fresh **** and the fresh shavings on the trees. And it gives a different connection with nature. Whereas before I just look at trees and be like, oh, tree cool.

[24:29] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. I feel like not to get too off the rails, but for me, it's also helped me. A good, reasonable, safe hunter is also a conservationist at heart, in my view. So understanding how different seasons are, when they are, why they are, when they are, why there's limits, what the limits are, helps you understand what actually is best for the different herds and the different species and to know kind of why certain things are the way they are. If you did not have a healthy deer harvest, you would have a huge onslaught of diseases, like chronic wasting disease and these things that get into animals and really ruin food sources and total environments because certain animals are no longer around. So, like, that aspect of it, I also think is important for both kids and adults to understand that it's more than just the fun of the hunt. It's more than just getting food for the table. It's also preserving the full environment in which these animals are in and the herds themselves.

[25:47] Speaker A: Right. It's respecting that cycle and also respecting that we don't just willy nilly go out and kill and eat things. But as a child, I willy nilly went into the food store and I could pick turkey every day if I wanted to or drink every day if I wanted to. So that's a whole new concept for me. I appreciate it just because I appreciate learning and because it feels right for me. I don't know in connecting and knowing these things, because we are interconnected and if we do screw up and let everything go, wayside we can't eat, like, we rely on them as much as they rely on our respecting their time on Earth. So it's interesting how much you can learn when you finally step down and you're like, wow, okay, there's a rhyme and a reason, and we really should be paying attention, for sure. So that cuts to the last thing I really want to talk to you about, only because I'm so glad to have a male perspective on here. I mean, I've had Matt on here before too, but majority of the people who I'm connected to are women, naturally. And so because, Paul, you went through this transition and you realize how difficult it is to maintain relationships and whatnot aside from hunting, right? And it really made you recognize Christine's life and her needs and that it's so difficult for her to maintain her social health and all those things when you're managing the kids and whatnot. I kind of wanted for you to kind of give that experience of how you recognize that, because I think that's important for wives to hear, that sometimes when we give a little for the husbands, it gives them an understanding that we have the same needs. And when they find, like, ****, I really needed that, you probably need it too. It's like, AHA moments. And I think we have to partner together and help each other recognize that. So, Paul, why don't you just do a small story on that?

[27:38] Speaker B: Yeah, for sure. Definitely going back quickly to the military. I was obviously gone a lot, whether it was like deployments or just generally long hours. And my wife for sure, burdened the load of raising the kids and just dealing with everything else. And I think when I transitioned out, we both at the same time recognized that we were doing it to get closer with our actual family. And there was other benefits of just settling our kids down. But we also recognize that we both were losing support networks that were, like you mentioned earlier in the podcast, like they were built in, if you will, whether it was through spouses or just friends at work. And as I kind of went on this journey, I think it's done two things. One, it's allowed me by doing something like this, it's allowed me to get closer with her family, with her dad she can see her dad more, and her own family, which has been really good. But then it's also helped me recognize when I go on these hunting trips or when I go and do these types of things, it's time away. But I recognize that she also needs that, right? Like, she's around a crazy household of four kids and everything else that we have going on, and she needs as much of that time as I do. Now, maybe it doesn't take on the same obviously aspect of like, she's going to go out into the woods and start hunting, but whether it's a book club, whether it's going to dinner with her family, which she's. Really been able to do a lot since we come back. She helps organize getting all the granddaughters and great granddaughters to get together with her Nana, which is really important. And she gets her night out and goes and spends time with her family. That way she's been able to go and do things and it's allowed me to just more easily encourage it because I recognize that the value I get out of my time with social interaction with friends or my father is equally as important for her and her family and her friends. So it's almost like we've built it into where we both know the benefit it provides both of us to get some time in other settings, whether it's with friends or family. And what it does for our relationship is huge. Just being able to have that aspect of kind of breaking away and not just being stuck in the same house, if you will, or getting caught in the same motion, she can go out and experience what she wants to do and she knows what it provides for me as well.

[30:19] Speaker A: Right? And I think it comes down to just being respecting that. Just because you guys need breaks doesn't mean anything bad. Unlike the day to day, you guys have an amazing life. But you're right. You need to step out and go socialize other people. You need to step out and be creative with other people and experience things outside of the home. It's important to do that balance. But a lot of people almost feel shameful that they feel like they have that need, that they want to get away for a second. And I think a big point for this episode in general for me is that it's not shameful to have needs outside of your home and your work. It's actually super important. We are complex people and we have a lot of different needs that we push aside because we have priorities with our family and our kids and our work. And I get that. But when it's time to recognize like, okay, I am a woman that I like to read books, right? We do book clubs or I like to dance and I need to find time to do that. And Paul, you're like, I like to have that male interaction where I'd like to go hunting with them or have a beer or whatever that is. And it's worked to make time to do that. But what I want to urge is recognize your needs. And don't be ashamed that sometimes you're going to have needs outside of your immediate house, immediate job, and to make that time. And it might not be easy. Actually it's much harder because like you're saying, all these people have all these lives and responsibilities and to pull people out to connect with can sometimes be hard. But it also could be easy. You just don't know until you try. So that's my final push for that.

[31:52] Speaker B: Absolutely. No, you got to get out of your own comfort zone. And I think it's as much a part of a healthy relationship as anything else.

[32:00] Speaker A: Right. And also when you're happy, your partner is happy and vice versa. Right. There's that. And that is something that you have to be able to recognize as well.

[32:11] Speaker B: Same thing you tell your kids. You can have your best friends, you can have your family. No human is meant to spend every living moment with one other person. You need your breaks.

[32:23] Speaker A: Absolutely. Because we have complex interests and needs and stuff. You're not going to sync up with one person with everything you value and want to explore and all those things. I mean, that's just not real life. But like I said, I think for this episode in general, Paul, I appreciate your take and that men have needs, right, and social needs, and we think women have an easier culture of the chitchat and get together and the girl time and all that. But Paul, you're really proactive in your social engagement, but there's not a lot of people like you and you are kind of like the catalyst for a lot of things that happen with groups of people, maybe in your neighborhood or whatever. My encouragement is for those people that are normally more introverted and that maybe are feeling some social lacking and needs to approach them and take them on and find something to do with people that maybe you don't ever get to see, that you would really like to see. Whatever that means. Anyway, Paul, I thank you for coming on here today, and it was a very easy conversation. I'm not surprised. I feel like we could keep going because there's a lot I feel like in normalizing for men especially, I think there's a lot of social things that we could talk about, but we didn't go into that today because we were focusing on your experience with hunting and the Marine Corps and transition. But it's something to think about because I like your take on handling this culture and being a provider and a husband and a full time worker and all those things. So I hope you had a good time, Paul.

[34:04] Speaker B: No, this is great, Tim. I'm glad we were actually finally able to do it. Yes, we kicked this bucket down the road from all the way back to.

[34:13] Speaker A: Thanksgiving, I think it was a long time ago, but that's okay. Listen, it happens and I got you in and it's all good and we had a great conversation, so that's what matters. And at this point, I'll say goodbye and we'll hopefully maybe have you back for a different topic. You never know.

[34:29] Speaker B: Yeah, I would love to never know.

[34:31] Speaker A: I'll be knocking on your door being like, hey, Paul, it's time, right? And you know I will.

[34:35] Speaker B: I know. Absolutely.

[34:41] Speaker A: I want to thank Paul for coming on my show today and for his perspective on community building and how hunting gave him new relationships with himself, his family, his friends, and he found a way to build his own community and fulfilled the social voice that he felt after having a built in community in the Marine Corps. I hope that today we can take away some motivation. If you are a man or a woman who needs to start reaching out and building their own community or maybe you are a spouse that sees that your husband or wife could use a little push or a little support to find time for themselves and their hobbies and to build their own community. Thank you all for listening today. This has been fun and I hope to have you guys follow my show. I'm on Spotify, Amazon Music, Apple Podcast. Anywhere where you can have a podcast. And check me out on Instagram at keep Them Healthy With Jamie or my website. Keep Them Healthy with Jamie.com. As I always say you do, you stay well and keep them healthy.