Ep. 43: Kristen Gilbert

Can you imagine working alongside someone who you later discover might have been secretly killing patients? In this gripping episode, we sit down with Christine and Jessie from Dark Mysteries to explore the terrifying world of true crime and serial killers. Together, we highlight our shared obsession with the macabre, introducing you to some of our favorite—and often overlooked—female serial killers. We take a chilling deep dive into the life and crimes of Kristen Gilbert, a seemingly competent nurse at the VA Medical Center in Northampton, Massachusetts, who is believed to have killed up to 80 people.

As we untangle the threads of Kristen’s sinister double life, you'll hear about her alarming shift patterns that coincided with a spike in patient deaths, her affair with a security guard, and the tragic stories of veterans like Stanley Jagodowski and Henry Hudon, whose lives were cut short under suspicious circumstances. We also delve into the meticulous investigation led by vigilant nurses who noticed inconsistencies in the hospital's epinephrine stock, ultimately leading to Kristen's arrest and life sentences. This episode promises a detailed and unsettling exploration of how trust in a healthcare professional can be weaponized to deadly effect.

Join us as we navigate the dark corridors of the Leeds VA Medical Center, detailing how Kristen's behaviors raised red flags among her colleagues. From her bizarre actions like bomb threats to suspiciously high patient mortality rates during her shifts, we unravel the psychological and procedural complexities that make it so challenging to stop medical professionals with deadly intentions. Tune in for a harrowing tale that serves as a stark reminder of the thin line between healer and harbinger of death.

Source:
https://allthatsinteresting.com/kristen-gilbert 
https://cache.boston.com/globe/metro/packages/nurse/part2.htm
https://vamalpractice.info/vaprovidershsllofshame/kristen-gilbert-the-angel-of-death/

Transcript

Local Serial Killer Podcast Discussion

Speaker 1 0:05

I get really hangry if I don't eat they get grumpy they both do.

Speaker 2 0:10

Hannah does too if they do not have dinner before we record.

Speaker 3 0:13

We normally start recording at 7. And sometimes I don't eat until after, Because if I eat before, all of a sudden my stomach's making noises and I'm like I hope my mic didn't pick that up.

Speaker 2 0:23

Oh, that's way too late. I mean, mine has been doing it all night, so hopefully the mic doesn't pick it up.

Speaker 1 0:30

Yeah, we always record either at 5 or 6 o'clock our time and we used to eat after. Because I own my own landscape company and I get home at all different times of the day and sometimes I'll get home. We set up real quick and we start recording.

Speaker 2 0:50

But we've made it a mandatory thing that we have to eat before.

Speaker 3 0:53

I don't want to put up with their shit. I I get super hangry, it's true so does my husband, trust me, like you know what you need a snickers bar.

Speaker 2 1:00

Go away until you eat that yes, like, don't talk to me until you have some food in your stomach.

Speaker 3 1:08

Yes, you've seen them.

Speaker 2 1:10

Yes, okay, hi, I'm Jess and I'm Hannah. Join us as we delve into true crime, paranormal encounters and all things spooky.

Speaker 4 1:31

So grab your flashlight and get ready to wander into the darkness with us.

Speaker 2 1:52

This is Wicked Wanderings. All right, hello, hannah.

Speaker 4 1:56

Hello Jessica.

Speaker 2 1:57

And do I dare say, hello Rob.

Speaker 1 2:00

Hello.

Speaker 2 2:03

And we have some special guests tonight. Woo-woo, we have the girls from Dark Mysteries, have christina and jesse joining us today. Hello, thanks, guys. You get to hear about me, ramble. Thanks for having us, of course, anytime, like I said every week and yes, people, we have other friends, surprisingly. Somehow it just happened. All right, let's get going. Got a good one today and it is local.

Speaker 1 2:41

How local?

Speaker 2 2:43

Northampton.

Speaker 1 2:45

That's really local. That's like 30 minutes north of us.

Speaker 2 2:49

Yes, so I know, as podcasters, we all love a good serial killer story, right? Yeah, oh yeah, yes, definitely. I know, hannah, you love some Ted Bundy.

Speaker 4 3:00

I do like some Ted Bundy.

Speaker 2 3:01

Yes, I don't know. Is it weird to ask if you guys have a favorite?

Speaker 4 3:05

serial killer.

Speaker 2 3:08

There are so many to pick from.

Speaker 3 3:15

Yeah, I serial killer. There are so many to pick from. Yeah, I think well, out of all the cases we've done, I think peter suck cliff has been my favorite.

Speaker 2 3:18

Oh, I don't even know who that is.

Speaker 4 3:19

I don't think so he was the yorkshire ripper oh okay I know the yorkshire ripper I just didn't know his real name he was brutal, very brutal yeah I don't know what attracts us to.

Speaker 3 3:31

The more brutal the better. I don't understand it.

Speaker 2 3:35

And then we listen to it before we go to bed and sleep like a baby.

Speaker 3 3:39

Oh yeah, right, Yep, that's what I fall asleep to.

Speaker 1 3:43

I never listened to any of this stuff before we started doing the podcast back in September. And now Hannah says oh, yeah, I turned you into a monster because I'm like, oh, did you hear about this? Did you hear about this one? Oh, my god.

Speaker 3 3:55

We do have a lot of friends at work and stuff that since we started doing this, they definitely hey, you should do an episode on this and you should do this.

Speaker 2 4:03

Yes, yes.

Speaker 4 4:04

Always love a good recommendation, yeah same.

Speaker 2 4:08

I always liked to learn about them and why they did what they did personally, like how they became who they became, but for the most part, a majority of the serial killers have been men. Hannah, can you name one serial killer that's female? I don't think so I'm so disappointed in you. Do you guys know I'm like I got one, all right? Um, what about lillian fisher? See, I do, I wasn't even thinking of her. Who?

Speaker 4 4:34

are you thinking of?

Speaker 2 4:35

eileen warnos oh yes, she worked as a prostitute and killed seven of her clients okay, yep, that's the one I was gonna say yes wow, I really am very disappointed in myself.

Speaker 3 4:48

I am too have you seen that movie with charlie starrett?

Speaker 2 4:51

yeah, monster I. I think I saw a long time ago, but oh, monster that had um chris charlie's yeah, but hold google yeah go ahead.

Speaker 2 5:04

Okay. I'm like, do I need to wait? So I have a story tonight that is about someone who could quite possibly be the most prolific serial killer of all time. Authorities believe that she that's right. She may have killed up to 80 people, but she was only charged with three counts of first degree murder, one of second-degree murder and two counts of attempted murder. Oh, and a charge for falsifying a bomb threat.

Speaker 3 5:37

Oh, I'm so curious.

Speaker 2 5:38

Yeah, throw that on there. Yeah, this woman, she was a little unhinged, let's say Christina Ricci.

Speaker 4 5:45

Oh, I was going to say oh, is this the movie?

Speaker 2 5:49

Yeah, yeah, I didn't even know if she was in it. Oh, I think she plays the girlfriend.

Speaker 4 5:54

Yes, and didn't the main character. She had to gain a lot of weight to do that movie.

Speaker 2 5:59

Oh, probably, and he's fun fact. Fun fact. I love fun facts, I actually do, anyway. So this woman is a piece of work and she did it in our own backyard and I've actually been to where she committed these murders and didn't even know it. Shit, wow, where.

Speaker 4 6:18

Northampton.

Speaker 1 6:21

Yeah, really, you said where I'll get there.

Speaker 2 6:26

Who is this murderous Douchette canoe, you ask?

Speaker 4 6:30

I do ask Douchetteous, douchette Canoe, you ask? I do ask.

Speaker 2 6:33

Douchette Douchette. Her name is Kristen Gilbert, a registered nurse who worked at the Veterans Medical Center in Northampton Massachusetts.

Speaker 1 6:42

My stepmother works there.

Speaker 2 6:44

Does she yeah? Where does she work?

Speaker 1 6:47

The VA.

Speaker 4 6:48

The psych department.

Speaker 1 6:49

In.

Speaker 4 6:49

Northampton. She's in psych.

Speaker 2 6:52

Oh, oh jeez. Anywho, I may have run into her because I was just there the other day. Anyway, moving on, kristin was born kristin heather strickland, in november 13, 1967 in fall river, massachusetts. Fall river, yes, next River Massachusetts.

Speaker 4 7:08

Fall River yes, next to Lizzie.

Speaker 2 7:09

Borden. Mm-hmm, I did tell you that there's a small link to Lizzie, I know you are.

Speaker 4 7:15

Oh yeah, I'm a big Lizbeth fan, Big Lizbeth.

Speaker 3 7:20

Us too. Yes, we just haven't done an episode yet.

Speaker 2 7:27

Yes, so interesting. Maybe you guys can come out to Massachusetts and we can go do a live episode at that house overnight.

Speaker 3 7:34

That would be awesome. We definitely. We've been talking for a while about traveling and doing episodes at different locations like that.

Speaker 1 7:41

Yes.

Speaker 3 7:42

You guys can come here and we'll go to the Stanley. Yes, yes, we're only like 45 minutes away.

Speaker 2 7:49

I'm a huge Shining fan, so that just we can, southwest has cheap tickets to Denver. Just saying, throwing that out there, sold, sold, yes, okay.

Speaker 1 8:01

Didn't you do an episode at your restaurant?

Speaker 3 8:03

Yes, we did, and we do have a few different ghosts in our restaurant and we get activity on a daily basis.

Speaker 2 8:13

Yeah, Okay, so we have to come see your restaurant too.

Speaker 3 8:15

It's kind of a little unnerving sometimes to be by yourself.

Speaker 2 8:18

Oh, I can imagine. Oh, my gosh.

Speaker 3 8:20

But I've worked there for 18 years so I'm used to it, but it's still not fun.

Speaker 2 8:26

Interesting. I want to go to your restaurant too. Okay, I get sidetracked so easily. So she was born in fall river, massachusetts. She was a gifted student and a member of the math club. Apparently, that's important information. In her teens, however, she became known as somewhat of a habitual liar and was prone to some neurotic behavior. It was during this time, hannah, that she used to tell people that she was related to Lizzie Borden Really, and she loved the like, the attention that brought her.

Speaker 1 9:01

She would tell people she was related to Lizzie Borden.

Speaker 3 9:06

Interesting.

Speaker 2 9:07

Yeah, but there was no record of her being related. Yeah, she obviously wasn't related to your Lizbeth. She graduated high school when she was 16 years old, which is impressive Okay.

Speaker 3 9:22

Yeah that is impressive.

Speaker 2 9:23

I'll give her that.

Speaker 3 9:27

I mean math club, Come on.

Speaker 2 9:28

Right Good point Good point, Good point. She first went to Bridgewater State College in 1984, where she experienced a couple psychiatric episodes and she made violent threats to others but also threatened self-harm. She once left an ex-boyfriend a note claiming to have eaten glass and lied about a suicide attempt. I mean, that would be the first thing I would think of to do to get back at a guy Right, Eat glass. I'm going to eat glass and make him come take care of me.

Speaker 3 10:00

Not painful or anything he's like. You need to go to the hospital.

Hospital Ward Angel of Death

Speaker 2 10:05

Yeah, no man is worth eating glass, no. So we are already seeing in her late teens and early 20s a pattern that would continue through the rest of her life. Kristen then continued her college career at Greenfield Community College in 1988 and became a nurse. She then met her husband, glenn Gilbert, around this time, and they ended up getting married in 1989 and started working at the VA the same year, and the couple would go on to have two kids Tender.

Speaker 4 10:36

Heart emoji.

Speaker 2 10:39

The VA in Northampton or Leeds, massachusetts if you want to get technical has served the health needs of veterans since 1924. The whole compound resembles a military base rather than a full facility hospital. So one of the sources I used for this episode is the book Perfect Poison by M William Phelps, who was the same author you used for your last episode. Yeah, good writer. Yes, so if you guys want a full view of how crazy this woman was, read that book, because I wanted to talk about it all in this episode, but we would be here till midnight because she literally is crazy and she had access to medication and, oh my, god yeah yeah bad

Speaker 2 11:26

combination made her crazier so definitely read perfect poison by m william phelps, and it was published on do it. It's also on kindle unlimited. I'm sorry, what's it called? Again, perfect poison. Okay, thank you, and it was published in 2003, so some of the information regarding the facility and the specific building is going to be different. It is currently being remodeled and I was there the other day and half of the bottom floor, which was the like emergency portion, is blocked off. So who knows what's what it's going?

Speaker 2 12:02

to look like yeah, but the ward that we're going to talk about and the ICU is no longer in that building anyway. So sorry about that little rant, but the hospital at the time provided tertiary psychiatric and substance use services as well as primary and secondary levels of medical care to the veteran population of men and women in Western Massachusetts At that time of 85,000 men and women of Western Mass and 600,000 veterans statewide. That was 12% of the population of Massachusetts at the time and they had 197 bed medical center that specialized in PTSD and chronic mental illness and they even still to this day have long-term placements for veterans there as well. Just for a little insight to what we're looking at. And, like I said, kristin started working there in 1989 and she was considered one of the most intelligent nurses on the ward. That's scary, yeah, and aren't the crazy ones.

Speaker 3 13:02

A lot of times they're pretty intelligent yeah, oh yeah it's like look, it's ed bundy.

Speaker 2 13:08

I was just gonna say that guy was brilliant. He was. She was the best that the va had to offer as far as codes and or cardiac emergencies were concerned. But I mean, I'm I'm pretty sure she did love to tell people that as well, because when they were in she was a habitual liar.

Speaker 2 13:28

Yeah, and possibly narcissistic you know she likes the grandiose and talking herself up but she did build a stellar reputation for being the go-to nurse, and many co-workers even said that she excelled during medical emergencies, that she had no problem keeping her mind focused during the chaos. However, kristen was about to fuck that all up.

Speaker 4 13:57

I guess we wouldn't have an episode if she didn't Also true.

Speaker 2 14:00

Also true. In the late summer of 1995, some of the other nurses began to notice that there were a higher number of deaths during Kristen's four to midnight shift. They jokingly began to call her the angel of death, which I don't know about you, but I would not want to be called that, even as a joke, especially in a hospital.

Speaker 3 14:24

I'd be like, yeah, so don't fuck with me, okay, yeah, exactly fuck with me.

Speaker 2 14:36

Okay, yeah, exactly, but I don't think they knew at that time how close they were to the truth. The va medical center had many different wards throughout the complex, and ward c, the ward kristin worked in, was in building one, which is the main building. So I should have drawn you a map, because I know you love it.

Speaker 2 14:51

I know you love visuals, but the entire ward was shaped like the letter T. The top of the T had a four bed ICU and a short hallway between the ICU and the L shaped nurses station. So have fun figuring that out. So Ward C had about 30 beds and it was split up into teams and the workload was divided among the nurses. At one point during her career and this was after she had her second child, Kristen began an affair with one of the security guards, James Peralta.

Speaker 4 15:29

La-di-da.

Speaker 3 15:31

Scandalous. That's where all the problems always start, mm-hmm.

Speaker 2 15:36

It started, as most affairs do, with innocent flirting at work, drinks with co-workers after work, drinks alone after work, a stolen kiss here and there, and then the point of no return. I wrote that and I was like like it sounds like I'm talking from experience. I was in the military and I was around it a lot, but I'm not damn it. Good thing my husband doesn't listen to it because he'd be suspicious.

Speaker 4 16:09

We love you.

Speaker 2 16:09

Dave, don't be suspicious.

Speaker 1 16:11

Don't be suspicious.

Speaker 2 16:14

Anywho.

Speaker 3 16:17

They're never coming back on our podcast, oh my God, I love this, so we're going to do this next week, right? Yeah, every week now.

Fatal Medical Malpractice Murders

Speaker 2 16:38

Anyway, her marriage to Glenn was going downhill and they were headed towards divorce. No what? Kristin would eventually move out of the home she shared with her husband and two kids and get an apartment closer to pearl. Where did her kids stay with? With her husband? He got custody.

Speaker 3 16:53

Adultery is a crime.

Speaker 2 16:55

Yes, especially in the military. You're going to get in trouble Really For adultery. Yeah, are you serious? I'm dead serious 100%.

Speaker 1 17:06

You didn't know that.

Speaker 2 17:06

Are you guys messing with me? No, no, I'm dead serious. What kind of trouble. You could lose rank.

Speaker 4 17:12

Really.

Speaker 2 17:14

Yeah.

Speaker 4 17:15

Huh, I didn't know that Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2 17:18

So the beginning of her downfall began with 66-year-old Korean War Army veteran Stanley Jagodowski. He had a reputation of being a pain in the ass, according to Phelps, imperfect Poison. That is not my opinion or my thoughts. In the eight months prior to his final admission to the VA in July of 1995, he had been admitted three times because of the sores on his feet had become unbearable. He suffered from non-insulin dependent diabetes and high blood pressure. He had enlarged heart ventricles and an irregular heartbeat. In his most recent admission in April 1995, after an ongoing infection, he had to have his right foot removed. Diabetes is no joke.

Speaker 3 18:07

No it's not. I'm type 1 diabetic, so Are you. But if this guy was non-insulin dependent, which means he could have controlled it all with diet Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2 18:18

Yeah.

Speaker 3 18:19

He just had problems, mm-hmm.

Speaker 2 18:22

Yep, and it talked about more about that in the book. I didn't think it was. I mean, I'm already at 12 pages, so I had to cuss him somewhere.

Speaker 2 18:31

But, they talked about his eating habits while in the hospital. So three months later, on July 17th, the infection had spread to his right leg and it was removed just above the knee. Ouch, wow, yeah, yummy. So this guy had his fair share of health problems, right Well, by August 21st 1995, 1995 things started to look up for stanley.

Speaker 2 18:56

He was not only feeling better but also looked healthier than he had in years, so that amputation seemed to have worked. He had been free of injectable medicines for the past week. So remember that part that's important free of injectable medicines Got it. At 7 pm that night Stanley received three puffs of albuterol and was reported to be alert. His breath sounds were clear, he was in no distress, his color was good and showed no adverse reactions to the respiratory treatment. When the nurses got him ready for bed they checked his IV. He had no body swelling or graying of the skin due to lack of oxygen and he was reported stable at 8.20 pm.

Speaker 2 19:38

So I'm just giving you this background to show what his status was before Kristen Gilbert entered the room. A short time later, kristen came down the hallway holding a syringe in one hand, alcohol swab in the other, heading to Stanley's room Once again, he was not supposed to be receiving any injectables. The other nurses that had been working with Stanley knew he wasn't supposed to be receiving meds, but sometimes doctors would order medication without letting the entire nursing staff know, so they just assumed Gilbert was on her way to give him a shot that had been ordered. However, less than a minute later, at 8 40, there was a piercing scream coming from Stanley's room Ouch, stop, stop, you're killing me.

Speaker 3 20:33

Ouch stop, stop. You're killing me. You don't like my, my dramatization. I'm just trying to. I'm sitting here thinking what is she injecting him with? We?

Speaker 2 20:39

will get there. Just then gilbert walked out of the room and made her way up the hallway in an uneventful manner, like nothing had happened, just nonchalant. The nurses rushed to his room to check on him and he said his arm hurt but that he was okay. So the nurses continued with their rounds. There was no reason for him to be on a heart monitor because he did not have any heart problems that would necessitate a monitor. But minutes later, at 8 43, stanley went into sudden cardiac arrest. Then his heart stopped. There was some miscommunication between nurses and kristin forgot in quotations to pass along the pager for codes to the nurse. That relieved her before she went into the icu. So it was a few minutes before anyone got to him. Oh shit, yeah. And they eventually were able to bring Stanley back to life and he was put on a ventilator and transferred to the ICU at 9pm and this is where his real troubles began Stanley coded again while in the ICU and, after coding a third time, died at 11.38pm.

Speaker 2 21:49

Poor Stanley, he's just gonna say the same thing, yeah, going to fight for his country, and then he comes home and dies at the hospital by the hands of a killer nurse.

Speaker 3 22:02

Anyway.

Speaker 2 22:04

Okay, kristen's next victim wasn't a veteran, but her husband, glenn.

Speaker 4 22:10

Oh, I never saw that one coming Never.

Speaker 2 22:13

No. So by November of 1995, spoiler alert he survives. But Kristen's marriage had been deteriorating and she'd been bumping uglies with one security guard Bumped, james Suck Never heard that term no.

Speaker 3 22:29

Bumping u Girl Never heard that term no.

Hospital Nurse's Suspicious Actions

Speaker 2 22:31

Bumpin' uglies. It just makes it so gross Kristen had. I know Well when thinking about them it can be gross. Yeah, kristen hadn't moved out of the house yet, and when Glenn came home from work on November 5th 1995, he felt sicker than he had in years. He had flu-like symptoms. He was sweaty, pale and nauseous, getting worse as the night went on. He called Kristen and she came home from work and took him to the ER. They drew blood and the doctors told him that his potassium level had dropped to a critically low level and that his heart was beating irregularly.

Speaker 1 23:12

So does that mean he just needs to eat more bananas?

Speaker 2 23:14

I guess, Exhibiting cardiac arrhythmias. Potassium is naturally found in the body and it is unheard of for a man of Glenn's age and shape to have that low of a potassium level. A person would have had to stop drinking water for days and even then the potassium level wouldn't have been as low as Glenn's was. He would soon be released with the hospital with a prescription of potassium and the following day Kristen said that she didn't like how the nurses treated him, so she wanted to take a sample of blood to work and get it tested, which, in case you were wondering, isn't a thing the VA or other hospitals don't do that.

Speaker 3 23:57

You can't just take blood from one place. Here's my blood. Test it for me. Yeah, will you guys?

Speaker 2 24:03

test this? Yeah, no. So she brought home some equipment from work and Glenn agreed to let her take his blood. Kristen hooked him up and put a clear liquid, which she said was saline, in the line because she needed to flush the lines. Also, that isn't the thing, because it will dilute the mess up the blood sample.

Speaker 3 24:25

You dilute it after you take the blood. Okay, yeah, you flush it after you take the blood. Yeah.

Speaker 2 24:31

I feel like that's just common sense, yeah, but I mean I wouldn't. I mean Glenn didn't know this, apparently, and I don't think I don't know. So Glenn's arm began to get cold and then started hurting and he tried to push her off of him. She pushed him against the wall and held him there with her hip until she was able to finish. Glenn ended up passing out and Kristen just left and went to work, leaving him passed out. She even told a co-worker what happened and was laughing about it, and the co-worker was confused. She's like why are you at work? Why don't you go home and help him? She's like oh no, he's fine. She was nonchalant about the whole thing creepy.

Speaker 3 25:16

So then he dies and then she's not even suspected of anything, probably for a really long time no, he actually survived.

Speaker 2 25:24

He woke up and was confused and when kristin came home he questioned her about it and she was like oh, it's no big deal, you just passed out. It happens all the time.

Speaker 2 25:34

And then they didn't talk about it after that, don't you think you'd be like, okay, listen here, bitch yeah, you're not touching me again no, and around that time is when he obviously and hopefully became a little weary of his wife, but he, he didn't really push it and they were headed towards divorce anyway. So yeah, that happened in November of 1995. And also in 1995, 35-year-old Henry Hudon was admitted to the VA. He was a frequent visitor to the VA psychiatric ward. He was an Air Force veteran and he was schizophrenic and had the tendency to leave the VA once he was admitted and his medication kicked in.

Speaker 2 26:19

So on that night, when his mom had received a call and this was in December she misunderstood what the doctor was telling her. When he said your son is gone, she wasn't alarmed and she had heard it all before, because you know this happened and all she said was fine, thank you for calling, and hung up the phone to get ready to go pick up her son because she would just pick them up down the road. So the doctor called her back and said don't hang up, and told her that her son was gone. And she said well, yeah, you said that already. I'll get him food, whatever he needs, I'll get him back to you guys, not that gone To which the doctor said no, I mean he's gone like dead. First of all, like bedside manner.

Speaker 3 27:08

Right right.

Speaker 2 27:09

I mean doctors suck at that.

Speaker 3 27:11

He tried, I mean he did she, just was not having it. No.

Speaker 2 27:16

You see, hudon was admitted, and this is what kills me. Hudon was admitted earlier that evening with the flu and he begged his mom not to be left in the ward. He feared that patients were being killed, which is sad, because he was probably dismissed because of his paranoid schizophrenia. Oh shit, that's crazy. Yeah, his sister in a 1998 news article said we just thought he was ranting and he was worried about staying there because people were getting killed. Oh, my god, I think he knew he knew. Yeah, authorities allege it was g was Gilbert who walked over to Henry's bed before 6 pm on December 8, 1995, and poisoned him with epinephrine. Epinephrine is the synthetic chemical twin to adrenaline, the bodily substance that produces the fight-or-flight mode. For patients suffering from cardiac arrest, epinephrine can be a lifesaver. However, injected into a healthy heart, it can cause anxiety, nervousness, a hike in blood pressure and cause your heart rate to skyrocket. Hudon went into cardiac arrest at 5.48 pm. He would suffer three more heart attacks before he died at 10 pm oh shit.

Speaker 3 28:34

So it wasn't quick and painless.

Speaker 2 28:36

It was suffering yeah and so sad he didn't have a history of heart problems at all. He actually had some traumatic brain injury from a fight that he got in when he was at a bar when he was stationed in London. That affected him and that's when he started hearing the voices too, which is interesting. But at the end of 1995, co-workers were starting to grow suspicious of Kristen and why so many patients of hers were dying. So now by December, the end of 95, kristen had moved out of her home and found an apartment close to James, and James was 25 at the time and was at her side during every cardiac emergency that she reported to in late 1995 and early 1996.

Speaker 2 29:30

Hospital regulations required security to perform CPR upon doctor's request. So security would have to respond to every code. Witnesses testified this is ridiculous, sorry. Witnesses testified that as her patients fought for their lives, kristen would glance at James smiling flirtatiously. One witness observed Kristen would glance at James smiling flirtatiously. One witness, yeah. One witness observed Kristen playing footsie, like you and Rob do during recordings like was killing people a turn on for her?

Speaker 2 30:11

you never know. Fair, that's what it sounds like. That's what it sounds like it kind of does, doesn't it? But I think it was like so gross the excitement of the situation, maybe that, and them experiencing it together I don't and it being a time where he could see her in action or something, I don't know. Some, some weird twisted.

Speaker 3 30:32

That's gross.

Speaker 2 30:33

I mean, I'm glad that we don't understand this, because then I would worry.

Speaker 3 30:39

Very true.

Speaker 2 30:41

And another witness testified that Gilbert had touched James affectionately during the middle of the code and there was one time he was giving CPR and she wiped the sweat from his forehead.

Speaker 4 30:53

Oh brother.

Speaker 2 30:54

That was nice of her. Yeah, but the worst one was she was talking to one of the other nurses about getting like some kind of fancy lacy underwear thing and the next time this nurse responded to a code, kristen was on top of the patient doing cpr like straddling them, oh my word. And you could see her sexy under panties because her pants this woman was a piece of work.

Speaker 3 31:26

I'm telling you, I'm telling you I really have no words for this no, no, there, there are none really.

Speaker 2 31:35

The next death that had been linked to kristin was 41 year old kenneth cutting, and he had ms and had been a patient for the va for 20 years. The army veteran was blind, but despite this he always greeted his visitors with a cheery salutation, remembered his father. He, he recalled, you'd always get a sorry, you'd always get a hello from him, even though he was blind. He'd say boy, you look good, isn't that cute? I can picture an old man doing that, but he oh my gosh, he's 41 years old, he's my age. Oh my gosh, he's 41 years old, he's my age. So it wasn't an old man.

Speaker 2 32:21

It was someone my age Until tomorrow, flag day. Kenneth had been admitted on January 26, 1996 for an obstructed bowel and a fever of 104. By February 2, 1996, he had been in ICU for five days. And guess who? Just happened to be assigned to the ICU that night. Kristen had a late Sorry. There's so many things about this case that I'm just like ugh. Kristen had a late date planned with her haughty police officer. Okay.

Speaker 4 32:58

He was a security guard.

Speaker 2 33:00

He wanted to be a police officer. Well, a rent-a-cop. Rent-a-cop with a gun.

Speaker 3 33:06

Maybe if he wouldn't date married psycho women.

Speaker 2 33:11

I don't know how she gets them, though. Seriously, maybe it's the panties, I guess. So when she went on break at 6 pm, she asked her supervisor that if cutting her only that night died, could she leave early what the fuck?

Speaker 4 33:34

who the hell does that? Oh, my word, that's a huge red flag. Yeah, yeah, yes, yes oh my lord this.

Speaker 2 33:46

the supervising nurse said oh yeah, of course, and miss angel of death didn't waste any time. You see, cutting's status hadn't changed. All afternoon he was stable, but at 7.10 that night, not even an hour after she came back from her break, cutting suffered a cardiac attack and died. The thing about Cutting and Kristen most likely knew this as she had been working with him for a couple days was that cutting had a DNR.

Speaker 3 34:17

Oh shit.

Speaker 2 34:18

Do not resuscitate. So to me that meant she had planned this whole thing. She told James before her shift started that she was going to be at his place by 10 pm, when she usually worked till midnight. Why would she say that if she didn't have a plan? Right? Isn't that fucked up?

Speaker 1 34:39

So fucked up.

Speaker 3 34:41

Did he know or have any suspicions that she was doing all this stuff?

Speaker 2 34:44

No, he didn't. And even for the longest time, when she was eventually caught and everyone was kind of turning against her, he stood by her for a while. Oh wow, maybe he just wanted that pussy, wanted the pussy.

Speaker 4 35:01

Wanted the kitty cat.

Speaker 1 35:03

Get that D.

Speaker 2 35:04

I mean, I don't know what 25-year-old men are like. I mean I do. That was a weird comment comment. What do you mean? 25 year old men? That's just when their prefrontal cortex is fully developed. Maybe his was a little late and he sucked at impulsivity and problem solving skills you're giving him too much credit, right.

Speaker 4 35:34

I mean, if the police academy didn't want him, then not yet. I don't know. Anyway, I got my baton. Baby, those hurt. Have you ever been hit by those?

Speaker 2 35:45

I don't know. Yeah, I have. I saw a cop in the military we had to train with him and I accidentally got hit.

Speaker 4 35:54

It fucking hurt okay, I Didn't know if it was some kind of foreplay thing.

Speaker 3 35:59

Anyways, keep going.

Speaker 2 36:03

That's for our other podcast.

Speaker 4 36:06

We have Wicked Wanderings after dark.

Speaker 2 36:11

They're never going to want to talk to us again.

Speaker 1 36:14

Bonus episode.

Speaker 2 36:19

Anyways on from the foreplay. There were a couple of nurses that had noticed the uptick in deaths during their shift with Kristen and they had actually noticed a couple of broken epinephrine ampoules in the rooms of previous patients when none had been ordered. One nurse noticed that there was also a discrepancy with the epinephrine inventory and was checking the stock before and after every shift. This nurse checked the inventory at the beginning of her shift on February 15, 1996, and there were three ampoules of epinephrine in the medicine cabinet. A new patient was transferred to Leeds VA on that day. Army veteran Ed Skira had developed a hearty taste for liquor after he was discharged from the Army. He was 68 years old when he arrived at the VA and after some treatment in Adcare Hospital in Worcester Did I say that right? Yes, you did, I've lived in Massachusetts long enough to know Worcester. Did I say that right?

Speaker 2 37:22

Yes, you did, I've lived in Massachusetts long enough to know Worcester, worcester For alcohol abuse Can't say Worcester and alcohol in the same sentence, apparently.

Speaker 1 37:31

Quick question for Dark Mysteries have you ever seen how Worcester is spelled?

Speaker 2 37:36

No.

Speaker 1 37:37

And then try to pronounce it.

Speaker 2 37:38

It's W-O-R-C-E-S-T-E-R.

Speaker 1 37:45

A lot of people that are not from the northeast, uh pronounce it worcester.

Speaker 2 37:49

Yeah, like worcester, I had to ask worcestershire sauce yeah I had to ask my husband when I moved here how to pronounce that, because I always called it worcestershire sauce.

Speaker 3 38:01

I think here everybody says it different yeah. Yeah, or it's you know that one stuff yeah.

Speaker 2 38:10

Worcestershire sauce. There we go. Not only had Mr Skira been drinking scotch on a daily basis for 50 years, but he was also suffering from diabetes, along with several other problems either directly or indirectly related to his years of alcohol use. When he arrived at the VA he wasn't feeling very well, and on the ride over he had experienced some mild chest pain which he had been experiencing on and off for years. After he was admitted at 2 pm, skira was mentally confused and appeared hypotensive. Doctors learned that he had developed some serious cardiovascular problems throughout the years. He suffered from hypertension, coronary artery disease and more so he had his fair share of heart problems. They were worried he was having a heart attack and apparently I was scared half to death. Just kidding, anyway, have you?

Speaker 2 39:11

guys seen that video with the little red-headed kid. No Okay, Google apparently kid after this.

Speaker 1 39:18

You were just talking about him earlier.

Speaker 2 39:19

I was Apparently Apparently. Heart attacks don't come on suddenly like they do in the movies, and sometimes it's days in the making and sometimes people didn't even know they have heart attacks.

Speaker 3 39:33

Yeah, I've heard that you start having symptoms several days beforehand. And you can prevent it if you know what to look for. And you can prevent it if you know what to look for.

Speaker 2 39:42

But you know, these men, especially these veterans, don't go to the hospital because they think, oh, I'm a man, I can survive this.

Speaker 1 39:49

I mean at least my husband Sounds like your husband.

Speaker 2 39:52

What? No, he is that way. He is that way. The doctors didn't want to take any chances and admitted Skira to the ICU at 2.30 pm, where he was sedated and resting comfortably. It was a precautionary measure, as his EKG readings were normal, but the doctor wanted to make sure nothing else was wrong. When Kristen arrived at 4 pm, she had to take Skira to the radiology for a chest x-ray and then he was returned to his room. The doctor reviewed the CAT scan and thought that there was a possibility of a tear in his aorta. He also noticed that Skira had a bubble in his chest, along with low blood pressure, and he was confused and he thought Skira had a dissecting aortic aneurysm and the VA wasn't equipped to handle open heart surgery. The doctor was confused that Skira wasn't reporting any pain because the tear in the aorta would have been extremely painful, but they still decided to have him transferred to Bay State Medical Center in Springfield. It was pushing 5 pm. State Medical Center in Springfield. It was pushing 5 pm, and keep in mind that he was oh. It didn't say when he oh, so he was admitted at 2 pm. So this is within three hours of being there and one hour of Kristen being there, so it was pushing 5 pm.

Speaker 2 41:16

Kristen had called the charge nurse asking him to call the doctor, as Skira was reporting chest pain. At 5.07, Kristen calleda code and began efforts to resuscitate him. In her notes of the incident Kristen wrote gone into sudden cardiac arrest for no apparent reason. Nowhere in the note had she written that he had been experiencing chest pain right before he coded. After he coded, the nurse who had been watching Kristen closely went to the medicine cabinet to see if the three ampules of epinephrine were still there. She was hoping that they were, but it was empty. Ed Skira died three days later at Bay State Medical Center, so the nurses that had been watching Kristen closely finally decided to go to their management with the information that they had been gathering and an investigation began. Kristen caught wind of it and claimed that a frail patient had grabbed her arm and twisted it behind her back, causing a shoulder injury, and began collecting workers' compensation.

Speaker 3 42:23

What the fuck? I don't think a frail patient, yeah.

Speaker 2 42:28

The thing about this is that Kristen was double-jointed According to the book Perfect Poison. Colleagues remember Kristen would pop her shoulder out of socket for a reaction until someone would tell her to pop it back in.

Speaker 3 42:45

That's disgusting.

Speaker 2 42:49

So either way, if she was faking it or it was a legit injury, she wasn't working and the death rate on the four to midnight shift dropped dramatically. That's not obvious. Yeah Right, the investigation made its way to Washington and not only was there a criminal investigation going on, but there was also an internal investigation exploring the policies and procedures at the VA, because at that time there was no accountability for the medication and there were. Well, I'll get into that part later. But while she was out, kristen kept tabs on the investigation through her boy toy, james, and would ask him who the investigators were talking to and how long and what was said. She also called her other co-workers to find out information and when she figured out that she was a target, she began to lash out at her co-workers and had a series of admissions to psychiatric hospitals.

Speaker 2 43:50

Now, I am not one to make light of hospitalizations. However, a few of the doctors so Kristen was evaluated during her hospitalizations and the investigation and a few of the doctors all questioned the honesty in what she was reporting and it was determined that she had suffered from three disorders narcissistic personality disorder, obsessive-compulsive personality traits and antisocial personality disorder, which is the one where a lot of the serial killers are diagnosed with. She lacks empathy and regret. So I mean to have two, three personality disorders.

Speaker 3 44:36

Yeah, that's. These poor patients didn't stand a chance then.

Speaker 2 44:40

No, they didn't, they really didn't. The first step in fixing any of these problems is for the patient to stop denying that there is a problem which Kristen will most likely never do. From one of her hospitalizations at the Holyoke Medical Center, she called James, who had been distancing himself from Kristen. I mean smart. Finally.

Speaker 3 45:05

Right.

Speaker 2 45:07

And she said you know I did it, I did it, you wanted to know. I killed those guys and then hung up. And then she called him back and took it back and was like, oh, you know I wasn't. Yeah, read the book, trust me, it's crazy. Or listen to it. It's free on Audible.

Speaker 3 45:27

Sounds interesting.

Speaker 2 45:29

Yes, so it is quite obvious that this woman was a little unhinged and, like I said earlier, I wish I could tell you all the crazy shit that she did during the investigation. But the craziest thing, like I said, was calling a bomb threat to the VA. Medical Center. Now, this wasn't just a bomb threat. This was a series of calls that went on for weeks, and it only happened when James Peralt was working.

Speaker 2 46:07

That's not suspicious. Yeah, the first time she called to see when he would be in the dispatch, and then the calls happened. Oh my lord, it was her attempt to derail the murder investigation. Or maybe it was just to fuck with james some more, I don't know. Take your pick. A little of those little balls probably. This bitch went to toys rs and bought a talk boy. So have you guys ever seen home alone too? Yeah when he's stuck in new york, that little toy that he was, yeah, changing his voice.

Speaker 1 46:41

Oh yeah, it was one of yeah it was what they were called a talk boy.

Uncovering Kristen Gilbert's Deadly Deception

Speaker 2 46:45

Yeah, there was a talk girl and she had actually bought a talk girl first, but it kept miss malfunctioning was it pink yeah, it was that's the problem, yeah, and then she went and back and bought a talk boy, which which was gray.

Speaker 2 47:02

Which was gray, and she used these to disguise her voice in the bomb threats. So not only and in the book it gets more in depth but not only did she make these calls, but she also would call James and say oh my gosh, james, I'm getting threatened by some guy on the phone. So she would then pretend that he was calling her to get attention from James.

Speaker 3 47:29

Oh my Lord.

Speaker 2 47:32

Your face.

Speaker 4 47:33

My face, yeah Cause I'm like what yeah?

Speaker 3 47:38

Yeah, like I said no words, yeah, no words, yeah.

Speaker 2 47:41

No words. They were able to identify her, that it was her by speeding the tape back up and it was her normal voice. So it would slow down her voice and make it sound like a man, and so then they would speed it up and you could hear her voice.

Speaker 3 47:58

I wonder if she sounded a little manly. Anyways, I don't know.

Speaker 2 48:06

But James actually was thinking it was her and glenn had heard the recordings because the same cadence of her voice and they're like oh, that sounds like kristen. She was arrested and charged with the for the false bomb threat and had to serve 18 months that's it for the bomb threat yes, um kristin's murder, she was eventually arrested or for the in charge with the murders.

Speaker 2 48:30

Her murder trial started on november of 2000 and she was found guilty of three counts of first degree murder, one count of second degree murder and two counts of attempted murder and the falsifying the bomb threat. What was interesting about this case is that massachusetts doesn't have the death penalty. But because these crimes were committed on federal property, it was a federal case and the death penalty was on the Shit yeah.

Speaker 3 49:00

However, I was wondering about that Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2 49:03

Yeah. However, the jury decided on life in prison and she was sentenced to four consecutive life terms plus 20 years on March 27, 2001. She now resides in the Federal Medical Center in Fort Worth, texas, which is a federal prison for female inmates. However, these are just cases that happened in 1995 and 1996. And after reviewing these ones, we need to go back to when she started at the VA in March of 1989. Like I said, she had built up a reputation as a great nurse, but a black cloud soon began to follow her, as if she was cursed. It seemed like she had the worst luck when it came to her patients. According to M William Phelps, her patients began to die at unprecedented rates, one after the other, as early as 1990.

Speaker 3 49:58

Oh, wow, so there's potentially dozens of victims. Yeah that, wow, so there's potentially dozens of victims.

Speaker 2 50:03

Yeah, that's insane. Keep in mind, like I said, the other cases were 95-96, but 51-year-old Louis Traynor could have been one of her first victims. Traynor was at the VA for long-term treatment. He had his share of mental health problems, but he was in good physical health. He was his share of mental health problems, but he was in good physical health. He was admitted to Ward C because he was having problems with his esophagus. Many years earlier he had swallowed Drano in an attempt to kill himself and, as we learned in our second episode, the Hi-Fi Killings.

Speaker 2 50:38

It doesn't kill you but causes a lot of damage. Trainer wasn't able to eat by himself because of the damage from the Drano, so he opted for a feeding tube instead of reconstruction surgery. His condition wasn't life-threatening and only came to the VA for a preventative IV antibiotic treatment. Trainer was schizophrenic and a bit on the irrational side, and he was assigned to Ward C. He began screaming at the top of his lungs oh God, just let me die, let me die, god, please let me die. But this was actually typical behavior for him. He was delusional and suffered from manic depression, but the nurses knew this about him and they paid little attention to him and would go check on him periodically. Then at one point, as one of the nurses was tending to another patient, she stopped what she was doing and realized that she hadn't heard trainer yell for some time. She went in to check on him and he was dead. She checked to see who the nurse was and it was Kristen. The nurse recalled it was weird because there wasn't any reason for him to have died he wasn't sick. And later she recalled it didn't dawn on me that night, but years later, after I got thinking about it, I knew Kristen had something to do with it. She was the only nurse around Crazy Right.

Speaker 2 52:08

Later that same year, a physician was studying the charts of his patients who had died during the night shifts. He realized that Kristen's name kept showing up repeatedly for a majority of the deaths. By itself it wouldn't be alarming, but Kristen was alone with the patients at the time of their deaths and, more importantly, most of them were making good progress and weren't expecting to die. After another patient of his died on Kristen's watch, he requested that she not take care of any more of his patients. By the winter of 1991, a clerical worker at the VA who was partly in charge of going through patient death records to ensure their integrity in signing off of their files, she also noticed Kristen's name as the sole nurse who had found a majority of the patients on Ward C in cardiac arrest or dead. In fact, between 1990 and 1991, kristen's shift alone there were 31 deaths, which was more than triple than any other shift, and Kristen found 22 herself.

Speaker 3 53:08

My question is if all these people are noticing this suspicious behavior, why didn't someone say something Right?

Speaker 2 53:16

Which is my question because it was brought up back in 1990 and 1991. Yeah, and I don't know what it is about the structure, the camaraderie between nurses, or whatever that it wasn't until these three nurses that came together and eventually felt like they had a duty for these patients and these victims. Right, and in the book mentioned a lot of the nurse like cohesiveness and how they would support each other. No matter, what?

Speaker 4 53:52

because you never want to think it's your co-worker doing that.

Speaker 3 53:55

Are you killing people, christine? No, I wouldn't say no.

Speaker 2 54:00

Last time I checked, but between the years of 1989 and 1996 there were 350 deaths reported at the va hospital on kristin's shift and she was present for half of them. The odds of this happening, according to the prosecution of the case by mere coincidence, were one in a hundred million.

Speaker 3 54:29

That's insane.

Speaker 2 54:31

One in a hundred million. So she could have killed 80 plus people. I don't know, and it frustrates me because you asked her name had come up before and nobody had said anything.

Speaker 3 54:46

I mean they were suspicious, but just said nothing.

Speaker 4 54:50

I mean how many lives could have been saved if just one of the many people had just said one thing Exactly, exactly, exactly, exactly, and that's, and that's what I was.

Speaker 2 55:03

I was thinking as well is not only these four that we mentioned, and there were some attempted murders that she had poisoned as well, but they survived.

Speaker 3 55:16

that I didn't mention what just makes me so sad for these people.

Speaker 2 55:20

Mm-hmm, yeah, yeah. And what eventually caught her was they exhumed the bodies and found one victim there was ketamine in their system, but the other ones were epinephrine. And what sucks is that the families of this case, of of these victims, were suing the va medical center, but by the time that they figured out that they had been murdered, the statue of limitations had that's horrible because, yeah, to get the the.

Speaker 2 56:00

It was something about the benefits, I can't remember. Hmm, so if Kristen had been killing people since she started in 1989, it would make her the most prolific serial killer in American history. Yeah, and that, my dear wanders, is the story of Duchette canoe, kristen Gilbert.

Speaker 4 56:24

That was a good one. It was really good wow wow yep, that's intense.

Speaker 2 56:31

Fuck that bitch, fuck that bitch exactly all right.

Speaker 1 56:37

so every episode, at the end of the episode, we do Massachusetts unsolved cases. We have a deck of cards, we go through it and we just read one card. So since it was Jess's turn, she gets to pick a card. Just tell me when to stop.

Speaker 2 56:50

Pick a card, any card. This is Nine of Clubs Jathian or J Amador. On September 3rd 2018, the victim was walking in the area of 17 Brook Street in Lawrence when he was shot and killed. Surveillance footage shows that shots were fired from a silver SUV, which fled the area. If you have any information regarding this case, please call 1-855-MA-SOLVE For Jay Amador.

Speaker 4 57:21

It's so sad that nowadays we still can't solve or find people that do these things Right. That's sad, that wasn't that long ago.

Speaker 2 57:30

I'm a big fan of the familial DNA.

Speaker 1 57:34

Definitely.

Speaker 2 57:35

Can you imagine having one on your case? Oh, yeah, having that on your case, or even like any dna testing from back in the day to see if those were connected.

Speaker 4 57:46

yeah, check out that wet towel you guys feel free, you guys, to give your spiel yeah, oh yes, where can we find you?

Speaker 1 58:03

yeah, when is it?

Speaker 3 58:04

we are dark mysteries. We're on spotify, amazon. We're on youtube. We're on a lot of different ones. We're not on apple. That's like the only one we're not on awesome so yeah check them out they're cool chicks.

Speaker 2 58:19

Yeah, they're our new friends.

Speaker 4 58:21

You're cool chicks, keep going Just kidding.

Speaker 2 58:28

Well, thanks for coming on the show. Yes, thanks for having us, of course, this was fun. I like it.

Speaker 3 58:34

We'll definitely have to do it again.

Speaker 2 58:35

Yes, maybe in two weeks.

Speaker 3 58:41

Or maybe you come here and we go to the stand.

Speaker 1 58:44

I'm down. I'm so down, we're down, that's great.

Speaker 3 58:49

Okay, I go to Estes Park a lot, so perfect.

Speaker 2 58:51

It's my favorite place ever. You'll just be our tour guide.

Speaker 3 58:53

I've just never stayed there. I've gone there I've, but I've never stayed there, and that's the best way.

Speaker 2 58:59

Oh, we're doing it.

Speaker 3 59:04

The best way to get any paranormal activity is don't do the ghost tour. Well, do the ghost tour, yes, but get a room, and when you're less people, you're more likely to get something oh, 100, I totally agree I just got chills.

Speaker 2 59:14

Let's do it. It'd be like going back home, but not going back home it's. I haven't been there in years. I moved in 2000.

Speaker 3 59:24

I was born and raised.

Speaker 2 59:26

here I was until I was 18. And then I graduated. Peace out, Cusco.

Speaker 1 59:33

Thanks everyone, Bye.

Speaker 2 59:34

Bye.

Speaker 4 59:36

Thanks for listening today, wicked Wanderings is hosted by Hannah Fitzpatrick and me, jess.

Speaker 2 59:41

Goonan.

Speaker 1 59:43

And it's produced by Rob Fitzpatrick.

Speaker 2 59:45

Music by Sasha End.

Speaker 4 59:47

If you enjoyed today's episode, don't forget to leave us a rating and review, and be sure to follow us on all our socials.

Speaker 2 59:53

You can find the links down in the show notes and, if you're looking for some Wicked Cozy t-shirts or hoodies?

Speaker 4 59:59

head over to our merch store.

Speaker 2 1:00:01

Thank you for being a part of the Wicked Wanderings community. We appreciate each and every one of you.

Speaker 4 1:00:07

Stay curious keep exploring and always remember to keep on wandering.