The Secret to Relationships Nobody Talks About: Insights from Katarina Polonska

What if you could transform your relationships with the same success you achieve in your career?

Katarina Polonska, a high-performance relationship coach and gender-dynamic social scientist, joins us on the 2% Solution Podcast to share her incredible journey from uncertainty and dissatisfaction to contentment and lucky love.

Through Katarina's unique blend of personal growth, rigorous academic studies at the University of Oxford, and science-based strategies, she offers invaluable insights into achieving high-performance relationships, especially for successful executives and business directors.

Discover how Katarina navigated familial health concerns and a disheartening corporate life with mindfulness and reflective techniques, ultimately overcoming anxious attachment patterns to find genuine contentment.

Her story takes a surprising turn when her newfound self-assurance leads her to meet her husband at a music festival, a testament to the transformative power of inner work. Now, Katarina shares her methods, helping others follow a similar path to healthier relationships and new, meaningful connections.

Explore the pressures high achievers face in their relationships, the impact of modern dating culture, and the collective trauma from COVID-19 on our social interactions.

Katarina highlights the importance of authenticity, fostering a healthy relationship with oneself, and the need for genuine human connections. Get practical advice on cultivating mindfulness, inner inquiry, and effective communication to attract fulfilling relationships naturally.

This episode is a must-listen for anyone aiming to harmonize their professional success with personal fulfillment.

Connect with Katarina:

• Website
• LinkedIn
• Instagram
• YouTube

Chapters

• 0:07 High-Performance Relationship Coach Insights
• 11:32 Finding Love Through Inner Work
• 19:00 Navigating Society's Relationship Expectations
• 25:17 The Impact of Modern Dating Culture
• 34:10 The Impact of Collective Trauma
• 39:36 Developing a Healthy Relationship With Self

Transcript

Dai Manuel: 0:07

Welcome back to another episode of the 2% Solution Podcast. I'm your host, diamond Well, and today I'm thrilled to introduce a guest whose insights and expertise will truly elevate your understanding of high-performance relationships. She's a high-performance relationship coach, a gender-dynamic social scientist and someone whose journey and approach to personal development are as inspiring as they are effective. Our guest today is none other than Katarina Polunska. Katarina helps successful executives and business directors achieve the same level of success in their relationships as they do in their careers. From her studies at the University of Oxford to her extensive experience in behavioral science, she has crafted a unique methodology that blends personal growth, relationship building and science-based strategies. Today, we'll dive into Katarina's transformative journey the pivotal moments that shaped her path, but also the actionable steps you can take to transform your relationships, whether you're struggling with personal connections or just looking to deepen your relationship with yourself. This episode is packed with valuable insights, but before we jump in, make sure you subscribe to the podcast leave a review and share this episode with someone who might need a little inspiration today.

Dai Manuel: 1:24

Welcome back to the 2% Solution Podcast. I'm Di Manuel and, as you heard in the intro, today we've got an amazing guest, absolutely awesome. I connected with Katarina Gosh. It must be a couple months now, but it was a lasting impression after that first call and you're going to see why. She's got a great energy, very vibrant, beautiful smile. But for those that are listening, you have to wait for the video clip. Uh, but regardless, let me give it. Just remind you what I said in the intro high performance relationship coach, but also a a topic and I got a big question around this but a gender dynamics social scientist. I know it sounds like a mouthful, but it's so intriguing when I saw that I was like I gotta ask that. Um, she specializes in helping successful executives and business directors achieve the same level of success in the relationships that they experience in their careers and, what's really cool, we're going to dive into her journey of behavioral science background as well as personal development to becoming this amazing relationship coach. So welcome to the show today, katerine.

Katarina Polonska: 2:24

I'm stoked that you're here. Thank you so much for having me.

Dai Manuel: 2:27

Oh, you're welcome, man. It's me thanking you. You don't have to thank me, but I'll take it anyways. Thank you, listen. Let's just dive into this real quick. How does the journey unfold? Okay, to go from what you were in before right To now being a high-performance relationship coach, can you sort of just give us the snapshot of just your journey professionally, because you've touched on a couple of very different areas, but I can also see how they can complement and enhance each other, and so let's talk about your story.

Dai Manuel: 3:00

Like how the heck did you get?

Katarina Polonska: 3:01

to this position. Well, everything's lovely in retrospect, right when you look back or when I look back and I'm like, of course it all makes sense. All makes sense right from literally being in school and being obsessed with love and studying love and trying to understand that I love poetry and love short stories and blah, blah, blah, blah, and then going into my university. That actually no sidestep. I did my coaching qualifications before I even went to uni, so I'm really lucky that my father, a very high achieving father, himself also certified as a coach and you know he kind of dealt coaching on the side now and I grew up with the Tony Robbins. I grew up with all the personal development stuff and a lot of love development stuff. I had Susan Jeffers' book Field of Fear Guide to Long-Lasting Love, or something on my bookshelf when I was 11 years old.

Dai Manuel: 3:50

I think I was 11. I was obsessed with reading everything.

Katarina Polonska: 3:55

And so I'd pick up these books and be studying relationships. And then, yeah, when I was 17, I did my NLP and hypnotherapy, which really wasn't. There was no career plan at that point, it was purely I loved personal development. I was really into that world. I also had some of my own kind of teenage issues. You know, I had an eating disorder and I had insomnia, so I had like my own stuff. And my parents being very, I guess, traditional Eastern European parents, they didn't want to send me off to therapy. They were like no, no, we'll get you a coaching qualification, you can fix yourself. And so I trained. What a look of horror on your face set, but it was actually it's no.

Dai Manuel: 4:32

Like I'm actually, you know, as a father of two daughters, I really appreciate the way that they approach that. I think that's genius I think that's genius. Anyway, sorry, didn't mean to cut you off, I'm just like, as, as a father of two dogs, I'm like I'm taking notes here, okay, so you know what.

Katarina Polonska: 4:47

It didn't. It didn't cure the anorexia, to be clear. That came back later in life. That's a whole separate story. But it got me on the path of personal development and so it kind of normalized for me coaching questions. It normalized me working with my unconscious mind, limiting beliefs and all of these tools which really went on to serve me so well throughout my life. And so I did that, went to uni and took that kind of interest in love and relationships into my, bizarrely, my history, economics and philosophy degree, don't ask. And I was just studying, you know, gender dynamics and looking at like men and women and like femininity and like different roles and how they transpired over over history and um, and looking at like mental health and masculinity and where did that kind of go off the rails? And that was again interesting, that space.

Katarina Polonska: 5:35

Then I left uni and I had a little tiny coaching business at university. But I was like can't do this, I'm too young. And so I worked for a champagne company, super random. We was a global recession and I was like I don't think my plans on becoming, you know, whatever I wanted to become in the kind of health industry were ten, a black time. There was such unemployment. This is like in 2008. And so I remember thinking like what can I do that will earn money and be fun, but it will stay, you know, be kind of like a sabbatical I guess, even though I was freaking 21, but I was like wine. I mean, I like wine. You know I'm interested in wine and my ex-boyfriend's parents at the time took me to france, to the loire valley, and I did wine talk.

Katarina Polonska: 6:20

So, long story short, I trained, trained and did my WSCT, joined a really high-end luxury wine company which is a startup, and that's when I started working, funnily enough, with executives and entrepreneurs. So I was working under two insanely ambitious, incredible entrepreneurs who were young, who were fun, and we were building a champagne startup and supplying champagne to all the high-end folks and clubs and everything in London. And then I obviously loved that and that really inspired me to start my own business, which I then did doing a very similar work in a different market, and loved that, loved that, loved that. That then took me to go into Dubai, where I also did this, so kind of had this like jet setter lifestyle. But it was when I lived in Dubai that the kind of the glamour of it all wore away because I didn't love living there. I don't know if I'm allowed to say that on podcast. I didn't love living there, yeah it's fine, totally Listen.

Dai Manuel: 7:15

We all got places we don't like. But what was it about Dubai that wasn't resonating with you? What was it? No?

Katarina Polonska: 7:20

it wasn't, it wasn't, it wasn't it was. I struggled out there like, candidly, you know, I was a single female and I struggled, and so I then ended up deciding to switch gears completely. I'm like enough of the sabbatical that had actually turned into like an eight year trajectory and I'm going to actually go and do what I want to do with my life, which is I want to specialize in gender dynamics and really understand, especially after living in Dubai where there's so much stuff around masculinity and femininity and like all the gender, all about that. And I'd been single for a while at this point because my parents had got a very painful divorce and so that was honestly quite scarring and I'd helped them navigate their divorce. So it's kind of like world of love and relationships was suddenly very loaded and challenging for me. So I went back to uni, went to Oxford, did my master's in gender dynamics, loved it, absolutely loved it, used that time to actually clean up the remnants of that eating disorder. Because here I was, you know, studying essentially like studying femininity, and studying like why are women trying to be thin, what is that about? And all of this stuff is incredibly powerful and healing. And in that time I was lucky, I got a scholarship to Oxford, so I had some money and I started investing into coaching. I'd already done some coaching before as well.

Katarina Polonska: 8:34

I did the Hopin process when I was 23, which is incredibly powerful and changed my life, but I really began to take it more seriously and kind of recognize that I have, you know, tons of opportunity ahead of me. I cannot let my mind be bogged down by limiting beliefs, by all of these things, these narratives that aren't serving me, and so fast forward that I worked in behavioral science. So that kind of took me into the behavioral science career after a brief since Lansby, where I found my feet in the world of psychology and again kind of help people and helping them understand the dynamics between people, right, so I was working for a global behavioral science consultancy consulting different companies on their people dynamics, a lot of which was around gender, because at that point DE&I had come up as a thing and so and George Floyd, and, and so I loved it, I absolutely loved it. The one thing that I found really fascinating throughout all of this and this is kind of a two-pronged approach was just how much when I was on the calls with the people doing my self-calls and doing the kind of consulting, just how many of them would bring the conversation back to their own personal relationships and kind of relate right to whatever I was doing in a corporate space. They'd be like, oh, I wish my husband did that, or you know, and we'd end up having this kind of essentially gossiping. Yeah, well, I've got the thing with my clients, but a personal life, and I loved it.

Katarina Polonska: 9:53

And I, on the same vein, I was engaged at that time to my ex-fiancee and I wasn't, you know, having a great time at home either. Things are pretty challenging for me, and here I am studying all of the psychology and, you know, implementing it to fortune 100 500 companies. But it was very front of mind as well, and so I ended up kind of bonding with my clients over these essentially relational issues, which is hilarious, and I think my employer knew now they'd be like what was she doing? That's good, okay. But so when I left that and then I called off that first engagement for various reasons, that's when everything crumbled for me because I'd kind of I'd walked away from this wedding, this engagement, this relationship that on Instagram, you know, looks pretty perfect yeah.

Katarina Polonska: 10:42

Instagram perfect relationship, you know, looks pretty perfect. It was an Instagram perfect relationship and that was so humbling to do that in my early 30s. Well, you know, I had this lovely timeline of having kids and getting married and we just bought a house in Whistler in Canada. So I was like, can I go to Whistler? And I had the vision of becoming a mom and everything crumbled. And then I quit my job that I loved, moved back to the UK, took up another job with a big coaching company, hated it, absolutely hated it, and I was like what am I doing with my life? You know, everything that I had planned fell apart and so this is the story is ending here. I promise you Sorry.

Dai Manuel: 11:21

No, I love this. This is great. I mean, listen, I wanted the story. I love this. This is great.

Katarina Polonska: 11:26

I mean listen, I wanted the story, I love the story. Good, good, I gave you the long one, but but yes, I came back to England and I was like I'm lost.

Katarina Polonska: 11:32

You know, I was at this point I'm like I don't know how much time I have to have kids and because my mom and, you know, my people in my family got medical pretty early, so I don't know how much time I have to have kids, I don't really want to die alone, but I guess I should make my peace that could actually happen. And I don't really want to be in London, I don't really want to be doing the corporate job. I don't really know why I'm even here, and so that's when I decided to really really dig deep and do and kind of take that inner work and that coaching that I knew Again, I worked for a coaching company.

Dai Manuel: 12:05

Yes.

Katarina Polonska: 12:05

But take it and really embody and imply everything that I knew and read, if that makes sense. It's like I trained to be a mindfulness teacher prior, because my plan as a mother was actually to be a mindfulness teacher. So I did my MBSR and I trained and blah, blah, blah. So I love meditating, I love all that introspection, but I didn't really embody it and apply what I realized. I was kind of at that awareness level, which is where I see a lot of the people that I work with. They're kind of at that. I do therapy, I journal, I'm very aware, I'm very self-aware and it's like that's lovely, but what are you actually doing about it? Right, that's it right. And and that's, I think, where I realized it's like, yeah, I was aware that I had, you know, anxious attachment and I was aware that I had these patterns and I was aware about all these things. But like, but what now? What like? What actually now? And so I I was.

Katarina Polonska: 13:02

It was a horrible time. I was in london, I was in my apartment, apartment in Kensington, and I didn't want to go out. I didn't really want to socialize. I became a bit of a hermit and I just stayed in and cried a lot, but then also, you know, pulled out of my bag the different tools and techniques that I'd used to help me heal from anorexia, because they were pretty powerful, clearly. I mean they worked really well. Well that, all the twins and playthings that I knew and really began to take this inner work seriously with a vision of I do not want to end up here in another year from now like I want to be, whether I'm out the country, whether I'm in another job, whether I'm in another, I don't even know, but I don't want to be here. And what I did in those months eventually led me to my husband. I met him very, very, very serendipitously, but now I look back and I'm like it's actually not that serendipitous at all. How did you guys?

Dai Manuel: 13:51

meet. I want to hear this. I want to hear this how did you meet? How did you meet?

Katarina Polonska: 13:56

So everything I did in those months is now working with my program right, because I've replicated it with my clients and they also, lo and behold, either improve their relationships or find a life partner, or they actually exit a relationship and start dating better people. So the process worked and how we met was so unassuming for me. I was in a good place. Finally, I got to this place where I was like you know what, even if I die alone, I'll be fine. I love cats. I love cats. I love traveling. I'll travel lots. I love wine.

Katarina Polonska: 14:28

You know it was a nightmarish vision my future but I was like I don't care. I just don't care anymore. And I honestly felt good about it. I felt good about myself. I'd done so much of that inner work to clear out all of that junk in the past that had been shrouding my view and all of the you know, the screwed up belief systems that were keeping me dating people like my ex-fiancee, you know, and in the wrong relationship and and all of that. I'd cleared all of that out. I got really clear on what I want to need and one of the things that I really needed, that I knew that I really needed was good music like it sounds so silly, but what I realized was that and something I didn't have my first engagement with I really loved a certain genre of music and I didn't get enough of it and I love the feeling of being free and going to a festival and all of that, and so one of the little things I did to meet my needs was like I'm just going to go to more of these things. I didn't have friends to go with, I didn't necessarily even feel safe, but I was like what do I need to feel safe? You know kind of made my little plan and I took an hour train through London, went to this music festival on my own and there I was, you know, dancing away with my little cams and he tapped me on the shoulder and I remember when he turned around and I could I tell him all the time that I was convinced it was dark. Apparently it wasn't dark.

Katarina Polonska: 15:47

About like 4 pm in the afternoon he turned around. I couldn't even see his face because he had shades on and a hat, but I felt the energy. I, you know I swear I felt the energy. I heard him say that he was from Canada and I'd obviously just left Canada and some something intuitively pulled me to him to the point that I threw my arms around his neck, gave him a big hug, was so delighted to see him, and then we spent the whole rest of the evening. I tagged on with his friends, basically danced with them. He thought I was completely bananas.

Katarina Polonska: 16:19

Honestly, he was like who is this woman? What is wrong? What's the catch? What's the catch? What's the catch? She's very enthusiastic, but I had no agenda. I had no expectations. He was visiting from Canada, just transiting through London. I at no point was I thinking this is going to lead to anything. It's just the dude I met at a festival and he's got nice energy, I feel with him and I felt safer with him than I felt safer. You know, dance around on my own and I just kind of stuck to him. And then we texted all night and then, yeah, we had three dates that week that he was in London by the end of the third day.

Katarina Polonska: 16:55

I remember thinking like, holy moly, what have I done? I've done something. And I remember voicemailing my friend, being like I don't know how this is going to work. None of this makes any sense. From a background perspective, we're very different. From a family perspective, we're very different. From a cultural perspective, we're very different. Keep going back to Canada. But how's that going to work?

Katarina Polonska: 17:17

I live in London now. I just, you know, sold all my assets in Canada. I've never had to go back, and so I was like I don't know how this is going to work. But I think and these are my words, I think the universe sent him to me to show me that there are men like him out there and that there's a level of connection like this out there where I can feel so safe, so seen, so free to be myself. And I didn't have to pretend in the slightest, at no point in that week, in the relationship to this day, have I ever and touch wood honestly have I ever had to kind of stop and filter myself, question or second guess myself? Everything that I was doing previously, riddled with doubt, riddled with, you know, gaslighting myself, questioning myself, coercing myself, bending myself like a pretzel to fit into whatever you know shape I thought would fit. This was completely freeing and in the end, obviously it did work out and it was pretty, pretty seamless. I mean, the visa situation and trying to figure out what country to live in was not seamless, but everything else worked out and in the process.

Katarina Polonska: 18:22

Final thing I'll add is that you know we live in a beats in our. We live in in spain. I would dreamed of living in the beats. I didn't know how I'd make it work. But then I met this man who was like, yeah, let's make it happen, right. He didn't know how we'd figure it out here, like we'll just take a gamble and we'll figure it out, because we have each other, yeah, and none of the things that should have made sense did make sense, and the stuff that did make sense before that should have made sense, were the wrong things. That's a really ugly statement. But do you get what I'm trying to say? That it's like we have to get out of our own way.

Dai Manuel: 19:00

Well, I was going to say everything that you're really speaking to. You know, as much as we talk about relationships with others, it's first and foremost. It sounds like you had to fix the relationship with you first before you could create the space to even think about having a relationship with somebody else and it sounds like you did that work and then you got to a place where it's like, well, I could have a partner. I don't, I mean, I like me, I like hanging out with me. So I'm okay with the solo time, right?

Katarina Polonska: 19:22

Absolutely, and you, sorry, go on.

Dai Manuel: 19:25

Yeah, no, no, I know I was just going to say and I just think your story is a wonderful example of what's possible when that relationship with self does become whole again, Like it's just incredible yeah. But, sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off on your thought and it all flows from there.

Katarina Polonska: 19:38

It all flows from there, right? So at that point I was like, well, you know, we kind of both quit our jobs and started trying to figure out like where are we going to live and how are we going to make this work?

Katarina Polonska: 19:49

And I, personally, I tried to take sabbatical like an actual sabbatical. I couldn't do it. You know, I think I lasted three weeks not working and then I was like, oh, this is they like it? So I began to build a coaching business. I did my ICF and I just started building. And I started as an executive coach because I was like, well, that's my background, working with executives and founders, um, especially kind of in the, in the, you know all the behavioral science and the champagne work and in the philanthropy work that I did.

Katarina Polonska: 20:14

But it was as I started working with founders which is so funny again, because the universe, or whatever you want to call it, will always bring you to a place of authenticity if you're willing to listen. And I started working with founders and executives, thinking I'll do effective coaching. But as I worked with them over time, I began to notice a theme and that theme was well, everyone had anxiety and stress and people were a little bit depressed and I was like, yep, okay, sound pretty founder-ish. But then I drilled down deeper and that's when I realized, oh, there's a loneliness here, oh, there's self-doubt, oh there's, I don't know, not feeling good enough. And, as I drilled down into that, the way it manifested was both through a weak relationship with herself, but also in weak relationships with others, whether they were unhappily partnered.

Katarina Polonska: 21:04

I see that a lot. Probably 70% of my clients are actually in a relationship already, but they're not sure about it, right they, and they're not sure if it's them and they're self-sabotaging because of that full relationship with themselves or if it's actually the relationship. And then the other mostly 30 to 40 percent are single and they they're also like, well, previous partners haven't worked out whether it's, you know, divorces, the call of engagements or long-term relationships, and they're aware that they never want to go through that again and they're aware that they need to do that in a work piece to actually find that right partner. So that's really what made me pivot and recognize oh, my journey is not that unique, right, my journey is not that unique right, my journey is not unique at all. And, uh, this is a very common trajectory that especially a lot of high achievers go through, because we can high achieve our way into a bit of self-sabotage, I think, when it comes to relationships.

Dai Manuel: 21:58

I got to ask you this.

Katarina Polonska: 21:59

Okay.

Dai Manuel: 22:00

I think we're sort of skirting around this because, yeah, I mean that lack of connection. I mean, if we look at, like, the research of the blue zones, or there's the nine healing factors and radical remission. So these are, these are studies. That's Dr Kelly Turner and she found that there was nine habits that help people overcome various forms of cancer. You know, and getting from survival to thrival again.

Dai Manuel: 22:21

And and yet, on the flip side, we have people around the world living to be 100 plus thriving. You know, in these zones and it doesn't matter when you look at both of these, whether it's the nine healing factors, you know, whether it's the power nine around vitality and longevity community connection relationships are huge, yeah, you know, huge. So it connects us with longevity. It also connects with our health and our vitality. And yet, what is the deal with society and society's expectations around relationships? Because I imagine, in your studies, especially with the gender studies and seeing how society influences certain norms and expectations, and we try to you talked about this earlier you know this idea of trying to conform into a box, to tick all the boxes. You know it's sort of the curated instagram life. Right, like we, we have a certain idea and a vision yeah um, and why?

Dai Manuel: 23:13

I guess the question I want to ask you is you know, like, how do society's expectations differ from our own personal needs? Because I think that's got to be where there's a disconnect, because it's hard to reconcile. Do you know what I mean by that? Like, does that make sense? Do you have enough there to just dive into that? Okay, go ahead, dive in. Because I just I see this, and again being a father of two daughters that are at dating age, you know.

Katarina Polonska: 23:44

I like I want them to hear this, so please go ahead. Oh no, I love that you asked this question. I love that you asked this question because you know what's so funny. I was grappling for so long like do I become a relationship coach? What?

Dai Manuel: 23:50

will people think? What will people?

Katarina Polonska: 23:52

think they'll think that you know cat belongs over in freaking oxford and I locked their mind and blah, blah. I was so like initially ashamed because I was a this isn't professional, I can't be on LinkedIn. And now look whose inbox is filled with DMs of people on LinkedIn professionals who are like help me, because everyone's miserable out there. But there is actually a horrifying stat. Well, yeah, 58% of women have admit openly to being unhappy in their current relationship. Not admitting. I would have admitted if someone asked me back then. Right, I would have kept my mouth quiet and smiled.

Katarina Polonska: 24:29

But I think the question of why you said you know what's the disconnect between fighting our needs, I honestly think and I could go on a whole soapbox on this but I honestly think if people had asked us, if our parents, whoever it is had asked us at a younger age, even in our 20s, like, what is it that you need? And we've really sat and drilled down into our needs, we did. You know stage seven of my program, stage six, rather, of my program. I don't know anyone who would say I need to be in an office 9 to 5 pm sat on a chair. I need to be, you know, part of the corporate structure where I'm so disconnected from the output of my labor I'm just sending emails all day and I'm just sending emails. All we do is send emails or be in meetings. Like we are so disconnected from our needs because I think society makes us be disconnected from our needs, because I think society makes us be disconnected from money, because I think that's how society functions. And if we think about consumerism and you know I don't want to go into some kind of capitalist tirade, but there is truth in there how I was talking to a behavioral scientist, how there are more single people than ever right now, partly because of capitalism, because of people are able to get their dopamine hits really quickly by buying things. You don't have to go and find a partner and try and whatever, have sex with them or build a relationship with them to get their dopamine hit. You can just download it on the internet, you can just order it on Amazon, you can go on holiday.

Katarina Polonska: 25:59

So people are getting their needs met in a kind of very maladaptive ways or very superficial ways. And so we get into these cycles where we're so disconnected from what we really need, which is most likely going to be, you know, deep love and connection, a deep sense of safety, and we start a deep sense of community that we start solving for them in a very superficial way, in the most accessible ways that are available to us, and often these are very maladaptive, right, and so I think that's where we get stuck and no one ever taught us to really look at our needs. No one ever taught. I remember when I started diving into my needs I was like, oh, this is different to what I want, right?

Katarina Polonska: 26:39

Everyone when I work with clients, everyone knows what they want. I knew what I want, right? Everyone when I work with clients, everyone knows what they want. I knew what I wanted. I wanted like 6'4", you know, dark hair and like strapping. That's not what I need, that's nothing to do with what I need. His height is nothing to do with what I need. And we get caught up in that superficial narrative. I don't think it's our fault.

Dai Manuel: 26:59

I think society's kind of geared that way and I gotta ask you okay, and I didn't mean to cut you off because I, I just think this will actually just give a bit more direction to where this is going, where I think it's going, where you're leading us.

Dai Manuel: 27:12

Um, yeah, so we got these sort of society norms that we're trying to fit into and you know, keeping up with the joneses of the old cliche that you used to get all the time right, and I still see that. But I, I see, I feel, and based on the conversation they have, what I hear from people in the audience, you know, like it's just hard and it doesn't feel like it's getting any easier. Yeah, and we have to look at the influence of the algorithm, and when I say the, it's not like I'm talking about some big zeitgeist conspiracy here, but the algorithms are so sophisticated now, with the injection of AI and the proliferation of like dating apps, yes, yes, how is this affecting the new societal view on relationships? Because, I mean, I'm at my at my wife. You know we've been happily dating my wife, you know, for like going on almost 24 years now.

Dai Manuel: 28:05

But we didn't meet online you know, we met the old-fashioned way. My brother introduced me, they worked together in a restaurant and that's how I met her, and you know, the rest is history. But I know of a lot of people that have had successful connections and now are married with people that they've met in you know various dating apps, uh, but and I know this is becoming more norm but is this affecting just the way that we look at relationships, the way we interact?

Katarina Polonska: 28:29

or communicate, talk like how has that changed so much because, like I mean gonna say yeah, and the kind of the obvious one is that, um, the possibility of people, right, we in kind of normal quote unquote, because I do think dating apps are normal and, again, there's nothing wrong with dating apps. I think you just have to know how to use them. And and I do go woo-woo with my clients when I talk about dating apps I'm like there is an element of like your energy around this stuff, right, but the point is, when we were in the olden days, we would meet people in our community and there were stakes involved. You couldn't just ghost someone that you worked with or ghost someone that's your neighbor or that your family knows. You'd be humiliated. You couldn't do that. That was just insightful, right.

Katarina Polonska: 29:24

But then, and I remember when I started doing dating apps, which was in my like kind of mid to late 20s, but I was like this is really weird, I've met someone who's completely out of my circle. It's the equivalent of meeting someone, connections, and even then the bar might be, you know, miles and miles away from any bar I would normally go to, so they're really far removed. That we have the states are lower, there's more options. The world is our oyster, we can pick, and I think that does create this culture of thinking disposable. I will never forget being on a date in london, sitting in a park besotted by this guy, looking at him all bambi-eyed, thinking you know he's the one, and then him turning around and saying to me how he's really happy that we had this lovely date together and he's so excited for the week because there are so many qualified leads entering London every day from a dating perspective.

Dai Manuel: 30:16

Are you kidding me? He says that what? Oh my God, what a cheese ball. Oh the smoke.

Katarina Polonska: 30:22

Quantified meat, and I remember he was like that's crazy, isn't it? But he had a point right. For him it was like a playground. He had, you know, like 2,000 women a day that he could swipe with and connect with, and so I think that's a really, really tarnished thing because we've commodified people, right. And then you add that little dopamine hit of all the swipes and the lights and whatever you call them, and and that sense of kind of validation and people. Unfortunately again, not our fault, but I do think that society with all of its quick dopamine hits, with all of its disconnect from each other and the kind of digital world that we live in, I think it has caused a lot of unhealed people who are ultimately either feeling very disconnected right from themselves, from each other they're probably not feeling at all in any shape or form enough because everyone's competing and the standards are unattainable, especially we think about beauty, we think about wealth, from a man's perspective. These things are not attainable for the masses. So there's this kind of constant sense of I'm not enough.

Katarina Polonska: 31:31

There's something wrong with me I'm bad and so we're seeking this validation and this connection through these alter algorithms that are geared to keep us on the app. So, no, they're not going to work right, because they're trying to buy and sell the membership Like it's. Back to that modification and back to the dopamine hits, and so we're kind of chasing this like elusive algorithm.

Dai Manuel: 31:56

The dating apps and social media more generally are an abusive relationship that we're in right, unless you can reprogram those algorithms to feed you more of really the good stuff that's going to elevate and enhance life, rather than just simply make you question everything that you're doing.

Katarina Polonska: 32:11

You know, it's like constant comparison.

Dai Manuel: 32:14

Right, like you fall into that trap. It's like my time online and I let people know this because it's funny I network, I'll meet somebody at an event and they're like sure they might, we might be connected online. I don't go to people's profiles and look what they're doing like I don't like yes, I'm researching them for a conversation like this. Then it makes sense. But I my time is spent creating and engaging with those that engage, you know. I got yeah the consumption piece was really affecting my mental health, like my anxiety just went through the roof.

Dai Manuel: 32:45

It was just. It was incredible at just all these negative emotions that started to to just appear. And they weren't just appearing, they were. They were coming because I was just falling into these little traps of comparing and judging and that's just. It's wild what can happen. But the crazy thing is, the more you consume of that content, the more it feeds you. Yeah, it's like this. It feels like a black hole that it's really challenging to get out of.

Dai Manuel: 33:10

And and I guess you know to to sort of continue along this conversation or at least this topic that we're on the social media and the just the the influence of connecting with people online. How many of your clients or people that you've worked with are connected with over these years in this position, and do they struggle with just connecting with people when they finally meet them? Because I, I see a lot of people like I'll connect with somebody on Instagram, as an example, and have a great conversation through DMS. Then, all of a sudden, we'll meet in real life or on a zoom call and it feels like it's really forced conversation, like it just feels like there's like I'm like where did that connection go? That we had it on IG, yeah, and and I just don't feel the same energy or we're not connecting Like it. Just I'm just curious if other people are dealing with this inability to connect in real life because we're so accustomed to dealing through these short DM, quick, little hit messages, you know.

Katarina Polonska: 34:06

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's such a good point and it's something. It's funny. My mom complained about it all the time. My mom, because she's back to the office and she said people have changed. Going back to the office she's like people don't want to be in the office, people don't want to be around other people, they want to be back home where they can control their own space. I mean, in fairness, I don't really want to be in an office either, but I still connect with people every day. But the point is it has shifted and I think my cousin and I had this conversation actually when I was visiting her.

Katarina Polonska: 34:37

I do believe there's been a bit of a collective trauma after COVID. I think that has kind of ruptured our ability to be more spontaneous and able to connect. We spent so many years not connecting right or connecting digitally, and then people are able to hide and have a, I want to say, facade, but a lot of people don't really know who they are and a lot of people don't know what their their wounding is, what their programming is. They don't really know where to even start when it comes to connecting to themselves deeply, and so there's a lot of this kind of performativity, this I don't say people pleasing, but kind of on the c lot of this kind of performativity, this I don't want to say people pleasing, but kind of on the cusp of people pleasing, of showing up with. This is how I'm going to show up and that's very easy to deliver.

Katarina Polonska: 35:22

When it's online, right when you're behind a screen and no one can see you and you're in the DM, you can role play anyone you want to be. Even if you're introverted and shy, you can role play that you're not and there's nothing wrong with being that. So when it comes to being in person or you come to having a real-life connection, that authenticity piece of who you are, that's already kind of been put into question. You've already kind of been hiding that. I guess it's kind of hiding narrative, it is right. It's kind of almost like collective hiding since they're curated.

Dai Manuel: 35:55

Right, it's curated as well, like it's as people are very selective about what they share, how they share it. Yeah, it just feels like there's a lot of like anticipated judgment, so I'm going to just put this out there.

Dai Manuel: 36:06

Yeah, it's like we want to avoid any possible critique or judgment and we like to just paint these really pretty pictures yeah, I my wife and I, we lived in bali, you know, with our two daughters for two and a half years and while we were this is all pre-covid and um I just remember how many people I would meet that would come to bali, you know, obviously for various reasons. I mean, it's a nice place to be, it's a nice place to call home for a little time, similar to ibiza, a little bit more developed there and well, a lot more developed. But you know, regardless, when you live in a country like that, like you, just you meet people, travelers, nomadic people and people that are working online, and I just found that there's so many people that were hurting. Yeah, for sure.

Dai Manuel: 36:50

For sure, and it just it really shook me because I hadn't really experienced it, because, you know, we lived in Vancouver, we traveled around North America, we hadn't really experienced the kind of nomadic lifestyle until that point in time. Yeah, yeah, and I was just amazed at how many people were actually really hurting.

Katarina Polonska: 37:05

Yeah, yeah.

Dai Manuel: 37:07

And, but you would just never know.

Katarina Polonska: 37:10

Yeah.

Dai Manuel: 37:17

Like if you had to go off their socials.

Katarina Polonska: 37:18

You would just never know.

Dai Manuel: 37:18

Like, I mean dj twitch, I think he really brought this to the forefront. You know what was that last year? I believe two years ago. Yeah, it was a year and a half ago. You remember, like when he he took his own life and, uh, everybody, even ellen degenera, like what the hell happened there? You know, like nobody knew, no, and I think this mental health piece, yeah, yeah, yeah, right, exactly exactly, exactly.

Katarina Polonska: 37:34

I agree with you and I think, I think, because we're so, we're in such a culture, we can just kind of numb out, distract, hide, dopamine, hit again. It's very easy to not even be aware that you are hurting because it's painful, and so you turn on the tv, right there's um. There are studies that people have this kind of low-level stress because they're in pain because of their own kind of wounding, their childhood wounding and whatever's coming up for them. They're the ones who will typically be playing music to go to sleep or playing the TV and falling asleep to the TV, but it's like they have the constant distraction from just being with themselves and that is kind of the stuff that's fueling that hiding right. That's kind of showing up in a very curated way, that selective way, that people-pleasing way, as opposed to the all-frontal heros who I am.

Katarina Polonska: 38:23

I'm the same in my DMs as I am on camera, as I am in person. You know there's multiple versions of me showing up, but it's the same core of who I am.

Dai Manuel: 38:33

That's right, right, yeah, makes it a lot easier to show up too, though.

Katarina Polonska: 38:38

Oh, so much easier, so much more real estate in the brain.

Dai Manuel: 38:41

Totally, and it's less stressful you never have to second guess anything you're saying, it's just that's what was live and real for me at that moment when I made that post, and that's just the way it.

Dai Manuel: 38:49

You know, like, take with it what you want. Well, listen, katerina, I could talk to you all day, but the poor person of the show is also to instill some actionable steps that people can do, less than 30 minutes a day, to start achieving a little bit more, let's let's just say, a healthier relationship with self. That's probably a great place to begin. So, when you work with your clients, what, what is an exercise that you think would be most beneficial for people to embrace or try to do consistently for the next seven to 10 days? After listening to this, you know, and obviously I'm going to link them to your website.

Dai Manuel: 39:19

I know you got so many great resources online, so all that's gonna be linked in the show notes, everybody, along with all of katarina socials, um, also, she's got a couple quick announcements, but we're gonna save that before we leave. So don't let me forget, katarina, because I know you got a podcast coming out. So, um, by the time this is out, everybody, the podcast should already be live. But regardless, um, what would be an actionable item or an invitation to do an exercise to help people start to develop a healthier relationship with self? Like, and I I mean, where do you even begin with that? So if you could maybe just offer up what a good first step would be for those individuals, that'd be great yeah, absolutely, absolutely.

Katarina Polonska: 39:55

So. It's not going to sound like anything radical or super exciting, but it's probably the most powerful technique that you can take away and that's going to look like getting to know yourself through inner inquiry, which is really kind of a mindfulness practice. But the way that it looks like is when, as and when you start getting triggered or something happens or you feel sad or you notice anything, feel off or unpleasant or kind of negative, then just taking a pause, taking a moment to step outside of yourself and go inward, put your attention inward and start getting curious. Number one what is the sensation in my body? Where is it? Is it in your chest? Is it in your belly? Is it on your shoulders? How does it feel?

Katarina Polonska: 40:32

Just noting how it feels is already going to dissipate a lot of that pain that you're feeling and acknowledging it, right. And then the second piece is just getting curious like what is it that I'm feeling? Is it shame? Is it anger? Is it frustration? Is it grief? Like what is it? Getting curious about the emotion? There might be multiple emotions. And then the third piece is going to be what is it I need right now to feel better? Right, super simple, super simple simple.

Dai Manuel: 41:01

Yeah, doesn't mean it's easy, though, otherwise everybody would do it.

Katarina Polonska: 41:06

I know, I know, I know but, it's such a valuable little hack. I think to um yeah I think those are great.

Dai Manuel: 41:14

I mean that's fantastic and I think that's a wonderful way to invite people to start this introspective process. But also the mindfulness piece. I really do appreciate that. I find, when we start to tap into some of those things that we get very good at just ignoring, you can't turn it off, Like as soon as you get conditioned to noticing those things absolutely.

Dai Manuel: 41:37

It becomes easier to notice them right like it becomes just normal and uh and I think that's the biggest challenge is most people and I'm included in this you know, when we start to try to new things and I mean you being behavioral scientists, you know this more than anyone if we're not consistent and frequent enough with what we're trying to do. Yeah, yeah, we shouldn't be upsetting yourself that we didn't get the result that we did. We actually do the work well. No, we didn't.

Dai Manuel: 42:00

Yeah, you know, I'm so attractive, yeah, and yeah, so I I wanted to talk to you just real briefly before we we start to close today. Um, your coaching practice, I know you have a very unique, but it's also very well. But it also comes through your own life experience and work with different clients and different experiences.

Dai Manuel: 42:18

But I know you have a 12 step or 12 stage journey that you take people on. Can you quickly explain that and just how does that work for for those that might be interested in going the next step, to connect with you, to get some support with this?

Katarina Polonska: 42:32

What does?

Dai Manuel: 42:33

that sort of flow look like.

Katarina Polonska: 42:40

And how did you come up with it? Actually, they're actually. All of that flow is in the master class that I have on my website and high level, which I highly recommend watching high, high, high level. It is a three-phase process and, given that I'm from a corporate background, I like to call an end-to-end solution for every need when it comes to leveling up your relationship, whether that's finding love, deciding whether you should stay or go in your current relationship or improving it. And three phases.

Katarina Polonska: 43:04

Phase one is liberation the liberating yourself from the pain of the past and all of your self-sabotage. So that's looking at the internal programming, clearing it out and making sure that it's not shrouding your view. A lot of people do a bit of this in therapy, but they don't necessarily clear it. They get awareness, but they don't dig into the root causes, and that's what we want to do Get rid of it. It's gone for good.

Katarina Polonska: 43:23

Phase two is the behavioral science phase. So once you cleared that out, you can then see clearly what is it that you actually need in relation to be happy and in your life broadly. Most people jump to this, but they haven't cleared it. So what's blocking? It is going to block them from seeing this right. So you kind of have to do it in a kind of order. So, getting clear on what it is that you need.

Katarina Polonska: 43:42

Then I also talk about the behavioral science of a healthy relationship and dating and all of that. So that's really important too. And the gender dynamics piece is here as well. So is here as well. So getting curious about who you are and what is it that you need. And then phase three is the integrity piece. So how can we, now that you've cleared all the past, got clear on what it is that you want to need and who you are, get that into integrity with your lives, so that dating relationships aren't something that you have to kind of be on an app swiping for an hour a day, feeling awful, but it's something that you do very naturally, very organically, and comes to you when you're least expecting it, like obviously, like it happened to my clients, it happens when they're really not expecting at all. So that's the third phase, and there's also a bit of communication in there too, because we all need to learn how to communicate, no kidding.

Dai Manuel: 44:28

I mean, I just love how thorough, but also how complete.

Katarina Polonska: 44:32

Yes.

Dai Manuel: 44:33

You know and you described it, you said end to end and it really does sound comprehensive that way. And I love the fact that you're also really big on just it's implementation and doing the practice right, like I mean, that's where everything happens, yeah. I know people are probably sick of me saying this.

Dai Manuel: 44:49

You know over a hundred episodes now, and I think I've said it every freaking episode I'm like listen, you are a byproduct of what you do and what you do regularly. So you don't like the outcome, you got to change the input. That's scientific method 101, right, I mean it's a dumbed down version, but it really is that. And if we're aware of what we're putting in or the actions we're taking every day, it's pretty easy to correlate and be like oh, that's probably why.

Dai Manuel: 45:12

I'm getting this result, I'm doing this way 100%, and so I really appreciate how you've put this together. I think it's just so smart, okay, smart.

Dai Manuel: 45:19

And so you've got some exciting stuff coming up here. I do. I do Tell us about it, because I think this is only going to extend, because I want to invite everybody. If you've found some value in what we've been talking about today, you gotta go check out katarina's platform. That master class is available. It's linked in the show notes. Go, do yourself a favor and at least get some better awareness on everything we've been talking about today, because she goes way deeper in a lot of this.

Dai Manuel: 45:44

So we would have needed, you know, probably 12 hours to get through even the chunk of it. So, uh, we don't have the time, but you might, and you can get it on demand. So there you go. That's great, but what are some of the exciting projects that are coming to fruition in the?

Katarina Polonska: 45:58

next few months? Yeah, great question. So the masterclass is an amazing place to start. I literally walk through the entire methodology, what curriculum looks like and how. I talk about the common pitfalls as well that people fall into, which is a big one. So if you find yourself not feeling great in your love life, definitely check it out. So that's one of the things. I also have a PDF version of it because I know some people actually read and kind of analyze. So I've kind of walked through the methodology. As we download, as you go with it, you can find also on the website website, katrinabloggercom. Nothing comes like that. And then, yeah, I. And then, yeah, I have a podcast coming out in July.

Dai Manuel: 46:33

What's it called?

Katarina Polonska: 46:34

What's it called? It'll be called, like the name of my program, the Successfully in Love podcast. So yeah, yeah.

Dai Manuel: 46:42

Because it's very innovative as well. No, I love that it's like it's not success and love. No, it's successfully in love, Exactly, and I love that it's the active it's like. I like to tell people you know what Nike's good? Just do it. It's fine. But you know what's better? Just did it. That's way better. I'm done. I finished it. I did the thing.

Katarina Polonska: 47:14

I said I was going to do, and so I really appreciate your today that maybe I skirted over. I forgot to ask Is there anything that you know, I think you did yeah, yeah, yeah, because I think you did yeah Very good job.

Dai Manuel: 47:20

Yeah, I mean I do have other questions, but I'm just going to have you back again, so I would love to come back.

Dai Manuel: 47:25

Oh yeah, you all heard that I don't have you back, katerina, because I know there's going to be a lot of questions, there's going to be some commentary, we're going to get some feedback on this conversation and everyone that's listening. Is there questions that you have for Katerina? Really easy to do this you can go to my Buzzsprout. You can send me a direct text message from there, spotify, and comment on the episode directly, or just reach out on any social media platform and just let us know what you're thinking and what you'd love to hear from her on, and we'll have her back for another episode to dive deep on that subject and and listen.

Dai Manuel: 48:02

I, I, I want to just acknowledge you. Thank you, ken Arena, for being here today to share on these beautiful insights and just also some great overall perspective on some trends and where things are going, but also what we can do to start to intervene if we don't like where it's going, and I think that was just one of the most empowering things that you left us with today is that you know what. Start here.

Katarina Polonska: 48:27

Start with ourselves Right and just see what happens.

Dai Manuel: 48:32

And I'd like to give you last word. I always do that with my guests, so before we leave today, if there's somebody out there that's maybe thinking yeah, this sounded all good, I just don't know if I'm worth the effort. What would you say to them, or what words of advice would you like to offer up to them?

Katarina Polonska: 48:51

You're a thousand percent worth the effort and it's your birthright to have what you want and deserve in your relationships. Thousand percent worth the effort, not even in question oh, I love that you said birthright. I think that's so powerful I, I say the same thing.

Dai Manuel: 49:08

I mean it's your birthday to be happy, like, I think, everyone should be entitled to being happy, you know, and satisfied, and fulfilled and joyful and yeah. Oh well, said I was like drop my mic, but it's a little expensive. So, I won't, but uh, oh, you know what I did though. Oh, those that are watching this on video, you can see this.

Katarina Polonska: 49:27

I bought a toy mic just so I could do that.

Dai Manuel: 49:31

Drop the mic. That was Catherine. You are awesome. Thank you so much. Thank you so much for having me. This is such an inspiring conversation. So again, everybody, I'll see you in the outro. And katarina, again thanks for being here today. Good luck with the podcast launch. Let us know how we can support and, uh, excited to have you back for a future episode in the coming.

Katarina Polonska: 49:52

Yes, yeah, yeah, thank you so much for having me. Thank you.

Dai Manuel: 49:56

Absolute pleasure. Thank you All right. What did I tell you? I said it was epic, right, a completely enlightening conversation. Thank you to Katarina for joining us today and sharing her profound insights into high performance relationships, from her journey of overcoming challenges to our expert advice on building deeper connections. She's given us much to consider, as well as much to act upon Now.

Dai Manuel: 50:26

For those that were listening and paying attention, here's the main takeaways I took from today's conversation. I'd like to know if you felt the same. Number one is invest in yourself. Katerina emphasized the importance of personal development and how investing in yourself can lead to transformative changes in your life. Number two was understanding your needs. Discovering and understanding your actual needs beyond societal expectations, is crucial for building authentic relationships. And then, number three mindfulness and self-inquiry. Simple practices like mindfulness and self-inquiry can help you connect with your inner self and improve your relationships with others.

Dai Manuel: 51:05

Check out Katarina's website at KatarinaPolonskacom and follow her on Instagram, linkedin and YouTube for more valuable content. She's just a dynamo and just a pleasure not only to chat with but to listen to. I mean, you gotta love that accent, right? And also don't miss her upcoming podcast Successfully in Love that should be released by Q4 2024. I'll be double checking on that and, if it is live, I'll be including that in the show notes along with all of her contact details, because in her podcast Successfully in Love, she's going to be diving deeper into a lot of the content that she talked about today on the show, but also a whole pile more. If you found value in today's episode, please subscribe to the 2% Solution podcast, leave us a review and share it with your friends and family. Your support helps us continue bringing you inspiring content and incredible guests like Katarina. Thank you for tuning in. Remember, small changes can lead to significant transformations. Stay inspired, stay motivated and we'll see you in the next episode.